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Savage Hulk

vs

Captain America-in Batman's suit from 'Dark Knight Returns'


Cap gets all the time he needs to become proficient in the suit, but he doesn't get the shock out of it that Bats used on Supes at the start of the fight.

Who takes it?

hulk captain sucks

Maybe I'm the only one that needs this, but can we get some more information on the suit?

Originally posted by MightyEInherjar
Maybe I'm the only one that needs this, but can we get some more information on the suit?
It was basically an exoskeleton that allowed Bats to hang with Supes physically(at least strength wise, I don't think Supes used any speed). But it didn't provide complete protection or anything, Supes DID manage to break a couple of Batman's ribs despite the suit. So I think that this could actually be pretty close.

Well, without superspeed to end him quickly, I give it to Hulk. Hulk does great against guys he can slug with and not get overwhelmed by speed, that's kind of his niche. Soooo, unless there's gadgets that I don't know about (and I'm sure there's probably tons), IMO Hulk 9/10, 9 because Steve is always resourceful.

Hulk..10/10

That suit was pretty cool, but Cap doesn't really use tech well. When his original super soldier serum was fading, he kept complaining about his new armor. When he used a replacement viranium matrix shield from Sharon Carter, he also complained about it.


Hulk 9/10.

Cap is pretty resourceful though. If he can do this without the suit, I'm sure he can pull out one win somehow:

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
That suit was pretty cool, but Cap doesn't really use tech well. When his original super soldier serum was fading, he kept complaining about his new armor. When he used a replacement viranium matrix shield from Sharon Carter, he also complained about it.


Hulk 9/10.

Cap is pretty resourceful though. If he can do this without the suit, I'm sure he can pull out one win somehow:

Yeah but if he can piss off the hulk without a suit he could probably end the fight with hulk pretty soon with the exoskeleton.

Bare in mind Superman was not at his strongest when he fought Batman. In saying that I think Cap could beat the Hulk with 25 tons but he would have to end it before the Hulk got really, really mad.

Cap loses. He has a better chance against Grey Hulk, but he still loses the majority.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Cap loses. He has a better chance against Grey Hulk, but he still loses the majority.

You would say that. Why would he lose against the Hulk when he can annoy the Hulk without any equipment?

Originally posted by Alfheim
You would say that. Why would he lose against the Hulk when he can annoy the Hulk without any equipment?

Well, annoying him is not the same as beating him. One non-jobbing Thunderclap should take the fight out of regular Cap any time. Besides that, he has nothing that can hurt him.

The skeleton is a differnt matter, but I still have no reason to believe that Hulk would lose to him. The fight lasts longer, I guess.

Seriously Hulk 10/10.

The only things Cap can do is knock him down or slightly stun him. And use pressure-points. In the end all that does is just annoy hulk.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Well, annoying him is not the same as beating him. One non-jobbing Thunderclap should take the fight out of regular Cap any time. Besides that, he has nothing that can hurt him.

Well the thing is Hulk would not use the thunderclap in that situation, because he is in a crowded area. Furthermore he didn't think he needed to use it which is feasible. All the Hulk tried to do was grab him and punch him if that had not worked the Hulk would have just said "**** it" and thunderclapped him.

I know annoying is not the same as beating but what im saying the fact that Cap was able to surveve that long shows you how good he is.

Originally posted by Dinalfos

The skeleton is a differnt matter, but I still have no reason to believe that Hulk would lose to him. The fight lasts longer, I guess.

Im sorry the Hulk is going down. Cap can stun 70 toners with one ton strength. That Bat suit was probably at least 25 ton strength and Cap has his shield.

Thing is 85 tons and has a hard time hurting Hulk. Hurting him with attacks just makes him angrier, and thus, stronger and more durable, etc.

Cap is boned.

Originally posted by Accel
Thing is 85 tons and has a hard time hurting Hulk. Hurting him with attacks just makes him angrier, and thus, stronger and more durable, etc.

Cap is boned.

The Thing is not a martial arts expert. If Cap with one ton strength can stun a 70 toners whats he gonna do with at least 25 tons, Hulk is going down.

Hercules is also an experienced fighter with Class 100 strength. Guess what? He's never beaten Hulk before.

25 tons won't mean any thing here.

Originally posted by Accel
Thing is 85 tons and has a hard time hurting Hulk. Hurting him with attacks just makes him angrier, and thus, stronger and more durable, etc.

Cap is boned.

Correction

Ben is 90-95 tons

Originally posted by Grimm22
Correction

Ben is 90-95 tons
Well, there ya go.

Originally posted by Accel
Well, there ya go.

There you go nothing.


Originally posted by Alfheim
The Thing is not a martial arts expert. If Cap with one ton strength can stun a 70 toners whats he gonna do with at least 25 tons, Hulk is going down.

Skill combined with 25-ton strength isn't enough. He'll irritate Hulk. That is all.

The result? Hulk will become madder and we all know what happens next.

Originally posted by Accel
Skill combined with 25-ton strength isn't enough. He'll irritate Hulk. That is all.

No he won't. You're not getting it.....


Originally posted by Alfheim
The Thing is not a martial arts expert. If Cap with one ton strength can stun a 70 toners whats he gonna do with at least 25 tons, Hulk is going down.

Originally posted by Accel

The result? Hulk will become madder and we all know what happens next.

Yeah but he doesnt get to class 100 straight away.....I dont think. Hulk starts at 70 tons then increases. C'mon man Cap knocked out a 10 toner on his normal strength level. At 25 tons the Hulk isn't 10 times Cap strength only 3 times. Hulk is going down he wont get the chance to get mad.

Forest = a bunch of trees

(well, at least 50 of them)

Oh not you lol....sorry just kidding *gets ready for a cap bashing*

I'm not gonna bash Cap.

Well you can if you want....I was only joking........sort of

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Forest = a bunch of trees

(well, at least 50 of them)

Anyway if this is the sort of forest Accel is talking about it doesn't count a rainforest is ****ing HUGE!!!

Well, he didn't even say rainforest. He said forest.

But regardless, it wasn't a whole forest, of course. But it did equate to, what, 1000 tons of wood?

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well the thing is Hulk would not use the thunderclap in that situation, because he is in a crowded area. Furthermore he didn't think he needed to use it which is feasible. All the Hulk tried to do was grab him and punch him if that had not worked the Hulk would have just said "**** it" and thunderclapped him.

I know annoying is not the same as beating but what im saying the fact that Cap was able to surveve that long shows you how good he is.



Im sorry the Hulk is going down. Cap can stun 70 toners with one ton strength. That Bat suit was probably at least 25 ton strength and Cap has his shield.
These threads are in bloodlust unless otherwise noted. Thunderclap and ground stomp are both applicable.

Originally posted by Badabing
These threads are in bloodlust unless otherwise noted. Thunderclap and ground stomp are both applicable.

Yeah and...

Originally posted by Alfheim
Well the thing is Hulk would not use the thunderclap in that situation, because he is in a crowded area. Originally posted by Badabing
These threads are in bloodlust unless otherwise noted. Thunderclap and ground stomp are both applicable. Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah and...

Originally posted by Badabing


Bruv the first quote is refering to a fight that Cap had without any armour, you are taking my quote out of context. There is alot of stuff I have said after that. It seems you have not read it.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Ok
So it means nothing to compare them.
Originally posted by Alfheim
C'mon man you know what I mean. I dont mean mosquito bite. Cap fought My Hyde who can lift 50 tons and basically he beat the crap out of him and he also beat the 70-75 ton strength Mister Hyde
Daredevil also beat Hyde. Hulk beat the guy when he was dying. Hell, Thor beat him just by letting the guy run into him and knock himself out. They guy's nothing to Hulk.
Originally posted by Alfheim
he blew down a rainforest??? A rainforest????
No, just a forest. But then again, Cap's suit isn't an entire rainforest is it?

His thunderclaps have put hurricanes to shame. Good luck standing up to that.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Yes it does he could possibly lift 90 tons now. If he can beat people up in the 70 tons range when he can lift one ton, that means if he can lift 90 tons you multiply it by 70.
He doesn't beat up people in that range, he hurts them, mostly annoying them. According to your calculations, this means he can now hurt people who can lift 6300 tons.

Even if that's true, whoopty doo. Hulk's far above that range. Like I said before, the best Cap can hope for is hurting Hulk, which in turn is going to make him angrier, stronger, and more durable.

Originally posted by Accel
So it means nothing to compare them.

If you say so.

Originally posted by Accel

Daredevil also beat Hyde. Hulk beat the guy when he was dying. Hell, Thor beat him just by letting the guy run into him and knock himself out. They guy's nothing to Hulk.
.

You missed the point. 50X90

Originally posted by Accel

No, just a forest. But then again, Cap's suit isn't an entire rainforest is it?
.

Missed the point again, it was used to fight someone who was powered by a rainforest. I had to come up with anb estimation.


Originally posted by Accel

His thunderclaps have put hurricanes to shame. Good luck standing up to that.
.

Well that would be a problem but im not sure if thats something that he would use straight away.

Originally posted by Accel

He doesn't beat up people in that range, he hurts them, mostly annoying them. .

No he did not he beat Mr Hyde up and with his upgrade as well.

Originally posted by Accel

According to your calculations, this means he can now hurt people who can lift 6300 tons. .

Yeah basically.

Originally posted by Accel

Even if that's true, whoopty doo. Hulk's far above that range. Like I said before, the best Cap can hope for is hurting Hulk, which in turn is going to make him angrier, stronger, and more durable.

Er Hulks above 6300 tons at his base level? The fact of the matter is that if Cap can do that much damage at 90 tons he could take Hulk out even before he claps his hands with one blow, since Cap can be considered to have enhanced reflexes and the Hulk doesn't.

Cap doesn't stand a chance.

A few thunderclaps and he goes down, with the suit or without it.

Originally posted by H. S. 6
Cap doesn't stand a chance.

A few thunderclaps and he goes down, with the suit or without it.

Cap can knock him out even before he gets a chance to do it he is alot faster.

Cap cant beat Namor but if he can do this without armour the Hulk is going down.

http://img234.imageshack.us/my.php?image=141ta.jpg

Originally posted by Alfheim
You missed the point. 50X90
As did you. That will just be a nuisance to Hulk, nothing major.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Missed the point again, it was used to fight someone who was powered by a rainforest. I had to come up with anb estimation.
And the power of a rainforest doesn't mean any thing to some one like Savage Hulk.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Well that would be a problem but im not sure if thats something that he would use straight away.
I'd say he's far more likely to use it than Cap is going to try pressure points.
Originally posted by Alfheim
No he did not he beat Mr Hyde up and with his upgrade as well.
I'm not sure if you meant to put the "not" in that post or not, but Cap beating up Hyde doesn't mean any thing. That's why I brought in the fact that even Daredevil beat him. They guy just lives to be owned.

This doesn't mean Cap's capable of physically beating the crap out of the heavy-hitters Hulk always stands up to, such as Drax, Juggernaut, Hercules, etc.
Originally posted by Alfheim
Er Hulks above 6300 tons at his base level?
Very possible, considering he's moved tectonic plates at his base.
Originally posted by Alfheim
The fact of the matter is that if Cap can do that much damage at 90 tons he could take Hulk out even before he claps his hands with one blow, since Cap can be considered to have enhanced reflexes and the Hulk doesn't.
So you're saying Cap (who is now as strong as the Thing) should be able to speedblitz and one-shot Hulk in less than the amount of time it takes for him to clap his hands together?

Hulk, Superman was severely weakened when fighting Batman in TDKR.

Originally posted by darthgoober
It was basically an exoskeleton that allowed Bats to hang with Supes physically(at least strength wise, I don't think Supes used any speed). But it didn't provide complete protection or anything, Supes DID manage to break a couple of Batman's ribs despite the suit. So I think that this could actually be pretty close. The suit allowed him to hang with Superman on a physical level? Superman was weakened and still held back a lot during that fight. He broke three ribs and tore the helmet off with minimal effort. Batman's attacks didn't do much of anything until after the Green K exploded in Superman's face.

A Savage Hulk will not be holding back in any way. I doubt that suit could save Captain America from even 1 direct hit from Green Genes.

Originally posted by Shinkuu
The suit allowed him to hang with Superman on a physical level? Superman was weakened


Yeah but Superman had the power of a rainforest. The amazon rainforest is half the size of the US its not illogical that the power of a rainforest converted into strength could used to lift millions of tons.

Originally posted by Shinkuu

and still held back a lot during that fight. He broke three ribs


Yeah but the suit had to be pretty powerful even to survive a pulled punch from Superman.

Originally posted by Shinkuu

and tore the helmet off with minimal effort.


Well he didn't use his little finger or one hand, he had to use both hands. It wasn't difficult but he had to use some effort, the suit still had to be pretty tough again. Also the suit was powerful enough to pass the whole of Gotham's electricity through it. Eventhought the suit isn't as strong as Superman the suit must have given him Class 100 strength.

Originally posted by Shinkuu

Batman's attacks didn't do much of anything until after the Green K exploded in Superman's face.


Stll that suit had to be Class 100 to even last that long.

Originally posted by Shinkuu

A Savage Hulk will not be holding back in any way. I doubt that suit could save Captain America from even 1 direct hit from Green Genes.

Cap has an indestructible shield as well and enhanced reflexes. The Hulk is not slow but he does not have even peak human reflexes.



Originally posted by Accel
As did you. That will just be a nuisance to Hulk, nothing major.


And the power of a rainforest doesn't mean any thing to some one like Savage Hulk.

The amazon rainforest is half the size of the US.....that much power converted into strength is nothing to the Hulk. I dont think so somehow.


Originally posted by Accel

I'd say he's far more likely to use it than Cap is going to try pressure points..

Well its likely that it wont be his first form of attack.

Originally posted by Accel

I'm not sure if you meant to put the "not" in that post or not, but Cap beating up Hyde doesn't mean any thing. That's why I brought in the fact that even Daredevil beat him. They guy just lives to be owned.
.

So Cap has also knocked out the Wrecker but im not sure if the Wrecker was class 10 or 40 strength

Originally posted by Accel

This doesn't mean Cap's capable of physically beating the crap out of the heavy-hitters Hulk always stands up to, such as Drax, Juggernaut, Hercules, etc..

None of these people use pressure points.

Originally posted by Accel

Very possible, considering he's moved tectonic plates at his base.
.

Well lets put it this way. The batsuit was used to fight somebody who had the strength of a rainforest possibly half the size of the US. Which means that Superman could probably lift millions of tons. Somehow I dont think his base strength is in the milion. Eventhough the batsuit was not as strong as Superman it still had to be pretty tough and was used to channel Gotham's electricity. That suit had to be in the Class 100 range and im not even going to bother to do any calcualtions. What you need to consider isi that Cap was able to knock Thuderball out stonecold. Thunderball is 10 or 12 times stronger than Cap. I have heard that he knocked out The Wrecker but im not sure wether he was class 40. So in the batsuit Cap is most likely to be class 100, times his strength by ten and this is the strength level that he will be able to one shot an opponent.

Originally posted by Accel

So you're saying Cap (who is now as strong as the Thing) should be able to speedblitz and one-shot Hulk in less than the amount of time it takes for him to clap his hands together?

Well actually looking at the evidence he will be in class 100 range. Yeah he can speedblitz him. The Hulk does not even have peak human reflexes. If Cap is good enough to give Iron Spidey trouble, he will be fast enough to throw his shield between The Hulks hands and then rush him for a one shot.

Actually, the Hulk is possibly beyond peak human reflexes. He has cought speeding planes, speedsters and the Silver Surfer flying at TSOL. Among others.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Actually, the Hulk is possibly beyond peak human reflexes. He has cought speeding planes, speedsters and the Silver Surfer flying at TSOL. Among others.

Isn't that PIS, his bio doesnt say anything about having peak human reflexes. I mean Cap has tagged Quicksilver with his shield.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Isn't that PIS, his bio doesnt say anything about having peak human reflexes. I mean Cap has tagged Quicksilver with his shield.

Well, Cap's bio doesn't say anything about having superhuman reflexes, strength and speed. But I think Hulk's speed feats are also related to his sense of aiming, timing and direction, which is supernatural.

And everyone has "tagged" quicksilver

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Well, Cap's bio doesn't say anything about having superhuman reflexes, strength and speed. But I think Hulk's speed feats are also related to his sense of aiming, timing and direction, which is supernatural.

And everyone has "tagged" quicksilver

It does actually. Superhuman can be considered to be an actual level rather than a term described in the dictionary. Therefore Cap can be considered to be enhanced, because it is below Superhuman. Kang's bio indirectly says that Cap is enhanced too.

I hope this makes sense when you say Superhuman you mean in the broad sense of the word not the actual MU level.

Hulks speed feats are bad writing. People like Cap and Spiderman have been able to dodge him on numerous occassions. More often than not Hulk's reflex showings tend to be slower than Cap and Spiderman.

I think everyone would agree that Iron Spidey has better reflexes than the Hulk, fact is if Cap can give Iron Spidey a spot of bother he should be able blitz the Hulk.

Originally posted by Alfheim
It does actually. Superhuman can be considered to be an actual level rather than a term described in the dictionary. Therefore Cap can be considered to be enhanced, because it is below Superhuman. Kang's bio indirectly says that Cap is enhanced too.

I hope this makes sense when you say Superhuman you mean in the broad sense of the word not the actual MU level.

Hulks speed feats are bad writing. People like Cap and Spiderman have been able to dodge him on numerous occassions. More often than not Hulk's reflex showings tend to be slower than Cap and Spiderman.

I think everyone would agree that Iron Spidey has better reflexes than the Hulk, fact is if Cap can give Iron Spidey a spot of bother he should be able blitz the Hulk.

No, Cap is a peak human who was scientifically enhanced to operate at that level. And actually, Hulk's numerous speed feats aren't nearly as bad as some of Cap's feats, such as being able to hold his own against Spiderman. Or throwing his shield at mach speed.

His raging fury makes him slow and careless, but when he really wants to, he can be very, very swift. People keep underestimating him in the speed department. Ofcourse, he ain't no Spiderman.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
No, Cap is a peak human who was scientifically enhanced to operate at that level.


So what hes enhanced.

Originally posted by Dinalfos

And actually, Hulk's numerous speed feats aren't nearly as bad as some of Cap's feats, such as being able to hold his own against Spiderman.


Well im sorry as I have said to you before Cap's skills are equivalent to super powers in the sense that he can take on superhumans. His bio says so in black and white. Furthermore Mantis can stun people in Thor's strength range and she isn't even as strong as cap. Sorry thats just the way it goes. Cap is not a Mantis but if she can do it, I dont see why Cap cant do it on a lesser level. Thats the way the cookie crumbles. I dont like Wolverine having more fighting experience than Cap, it stinks but thats just how it is.

Originally posted by Dinalfos

Or throwing his shield at mach speed.


Can we forget about that?

Originally posted by Dinalfos

His raging fury makes him slow and careless, but when he really wants to, he can be very, very swift. People keep underestimating him in the speed department. Ofcourse, he ain't no Spiderman.

Or Cap.

That suit is not Hulkbuster quality, and Bruce had kryptonite gas in the end to turn the tide against Clark. And it will just compromise Steve's mobility, and he needs it.
No winning against the Hulk here, unless Bat-Kicks count.

Originally posted by roughrider
That suit is not Hulkbuster quality, and Bruce had kryptonite gas in the end to turn the tide against Clark. And it will just compromise Steve's mobility, and he needs it.
No winning against the Hulk here, unless Bat-Kicks count.

Bruv have you read what I said in the previous posts? iF you had you would not say that. How do you know his speed is going to be compromised thats just speculation.

Hulk 10/10

Yeah thank you for that in-depth analysis

Originally posted by Alfheim
Bruv have you read what I said in the previous posts? iF you had you would not say that. How do you know his speed is going to be compromised thats just speculation.

I write what I write because I am a well-informed, fully rounded human being. Not a raging fanboy.

Originally posted by roughrider
I write what I write because I am a well-informed, fully rounded human being. Not a raging fanboy.

*sigh* Have you read my posts concerning the batsuit? Well what you have to ask yourself is a the power of a rainforest half the size of the US, stronger than the Hulk's base strength.

cap would die no pis hulk can punch him into the sun and yes hulk is faster way FASTER he can run 300mph sorry but there is no way for cap to win

Originally posted by mighty adam
cap would die no pis hulk can punch him into the sun and yes hulk is faster way FASTER he can run 300mph sorry but there is no way for cap to win


Im too tired to respond, you have to do better than that. Running speed is not equivalent to reflexes.

Originally posted by Alfheim
So what hes enhanced.

Yes. And?



Alright, let's not go through this all over again. Agree to this agree on thise one?

Btw, this has nothing to do with like or dislike.




Well, yes. But I only brought it up as a comparison.





Cap is more agile and a better fighter with a great "eye". And yes, he's quick on his feet and has well developed reflexes. But not necessarily better than Hulk's. But like I said, Hulk is helped a great deal by his supernatural sense of accuracy/timing/direction.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah thank you for that in-depth analysis
Hulk 20/10.

Because he's the friggin' Hulk. No analysis necessary.

Originally posted by riceroost
Hulk 20/10.

Because he's the friggin' Hulk. No analysis necessary.

Yeah there is actually. You obvoulsy didn't bother to read it.

I believe cap can win this fight sometimes.
First of all, cap has hurt Hulk with a shield throw before. Had it been a shield attack of the non throwing kind (like a shield punch) then it would have hurt even worse. This is because there is more force and mass behind the attack than a simple throw. Now add 90times the force. Then the shield, due to its sharp edge, will most likely penetrate Hulk's skull either killing him or knocking him out. With normal strength, cap has pentrated through solid steel and hurt Hulk with just shield throws. Add the fact of a shield punch attack (which is a lot stronger than a shield throw) with 90 times more force and with the possibility that cap can strike first then cap now has a chance.

Originally posted by h1a8
I believe cap can win this fight sometimes.
First of all, cap has hurt Hulk with a shield throw before. Had it been a shield attack of the non throwing kind (like a shield punch) then it would have hurt even worse. This is because there is more force and mass behind the attack than a simple throw. Now add 90times the force. Then the shield, due to its sharp edge, will most likely penetrate Hulk's skull either killing him or knocking him out. With normal strength, cap has pentrated through solid steel and hurt Hulk with just shield throws. Add the fact of a shield punch attack (which is a lot stronger than a shield throw) with 90 times more force and with the possibility that cap can strike first then cap now has a chance.

Exactly! That suit he is wearing is probably class 100

Originally posted by bear_champion
hulk captain sucks

translating from hulk language (i.e. hulk smash), hulk will suck captain? why? lols

Originally posted by h1a8
I believe cap can win this fight sometimes.
First of all, cap has hurt Hulk with a shield throw before. Had it been a shield attack of the non throwing kind (like a shield punch) then it would have hurt even worse. This is because there is more force and mass behind the attack than a simple throw. Now add 90times the force. Then the shield, due to its sharp edge, will most likely penetrate Hulk's skull either killing him or knocking him out. With normal strength, cap has pentrated through solid steel and hurt Hulk with just shield throws. Add the fact of a shield punch attack (which is a lot stronger than a shield throw) with 90 times more force and with the possibility that cap can strike first then cap now has a chance.

Speculative bullshit. He has survived much, much worse.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Speculative bullshit. He has survived much, much worse.

Hulk has never survived (unconscienceness or death) anything of the magnitude of getting his head rammed by an unbreakable sharp edge powered by a class 100 being. Remember Hulk's head is not his body. This is his weakess part. Hulk has been knocked out many many times just by the blunt fist force (not sharp either) of many super strong foes.
Add in the sharp edge of the shield supplied by class 100 power and Hulk is a gonner (or at least unconscience).

Originally posted by h1a8
Hulk has never survived (unconscienceness or death) anything of the magnitude of getting his head rammed by an unbreakable sharp edge powered by a class 100 being.
He's taken blows from Mjolnir (an indestructible object) wielded by Thor (a Class 100 character) to the head before.
Originally posted by h1a8
Remember Hulk's head is not his body. This is his weakess part.
Not really.
Originally posted by h1a8
Hulk has been knocked out many many times just by the blunt fist force (not sharp either) of many super strong foes.
Add in the sharp edge of the shield supplied by class 100 power and Hulk is a gonner (or at least unconscience).
He's taken punishment from some fo the strongest characters around with faltering much more than he's been knocked unconscious.

Originally posted by Accel
He's taken blows from Mjolnir (an indestructible object) wielded by Thor (a Class 100 character) to the head before.

And yet, Iron Man has knocked him out with one punch before.

Sorry.

Originally posted by batdude123
And yet, Iron Man has knocked him out with one punch before.

Sorry.
Well, he was dazed and blinded by an explosion at the time.

Not as bad as the dump truck incident though...

Originally posted by Accel
He's taken blows from Mjolnir (an indestructible object) wielded by Thor (a Class 100 character) to the head before.

Not really.

He's taken punishment from some fo the strongest characters around with faltering much more than he's been knocked unconscious.

Mjolnir isn't sharp like cap's shield. So that point is invalid.

Yes really, how many times has hulk been beaten by hits to the head?
How many times have he been beaten by hits to the body? I rest my case.

Again, you are comparing blunt force with sharp edge force. A huge difference. No comparison. Why take a good look at wolverine for example. Not to say that cap's shield is as sharp. But you get the point.

note: the last part is meant to be a joke

Captain America will lose this one horribly.

Originally posted by Grinning Goku
Captain America will lose this one horribly.

Not if he rams that shield up hulk's head killing him.

Originally posted by h1a8
Not if he rams that shield up hulk's head killing him.

The Hulk has survived worse.

I love Cap. But lets face it, that suit is not enough of an edge to knock Hulk unconscious at all. Superman was indeed weakened in his fight with Batman. Rainforest is a great amount of energy, but Batman explicitly observes that he is not at full power and that he isn't even strong enough to dodge stinger missiles. Normal Superman would just go at supersonic speeds and outrun em. Batman says this in a thought caption.

Even if Hulk were at a calm 70-100 ton strength capacity and Cap had one shot of MAYBE knocking him unconscious, that suit does not give him enough power to do so. A one in a million chance, Cap would maybe have enough sense to overload the arm and hip servos with enough energy feed from the city and chuck that shield at hypervelocity levels and hope to split open Hulk's skull. Afterwards, maybe Cap would dig into his brains and match would be over, since Hulk would have to take a few minutes sprawled on the ground twitching, to heal himself. I'd call that a win for Cap. But it's a longshot at best.

Again, Hulk 9/10.

Cap's shield has hurt Hulk with just a throw. It has sliced all the way through thick steel several times with just plain throws. A double armed shield ram is at least a 100times stronger than a shield throw. If normal cap uses all his might and doublearm rams that shield in Hulk's head then Hulk's skull is going be cut while the shield being stuck. If 100x stronger batsuit cap rams the shield into Hulk's head with all his might then possibly Hulk's head with be split in two.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Yes. And?

I forgot my point I think it was that the Hulk does not have enhanced reflexes.


Originally posted by Dinalfos

Alright, let's not go through this all over again. Agree to this agree on thise one?

Hell no! Everytime you bring this point up "I will bring you down, I will bring you down to Chinatown." You keep complaining about how Cap has the ability to fight superhumans when:

1. He is prescribed to do this:

Cap wiki
He is extremely skilled in hand-to-hand combat, sometimes taking on and defeating foes whose strength, size, or superpowers greatly exceed his. In the comics, he is regarded by other skilled fighters as one of the best hand-to-hand combatants in the Marvel Universe.

2. As mentioned before martial arts is a skill that humans can learn that can give them the equivalent of super powers. Others skills are tech know how and magic. What was you're response? Its taken for granted that supernatural world exists? So ok if everybody had weak magic would there be a supernatural world? No.

We can also say that there is sci-fi world. Why is that? Again the skill level for technology is increased.

There is a martial arts world in the sense that you have a whole host of characters that can do things far beyond the real world.

3. If Mantis can knockout Thor, Cap can damn well fight Spiderman and fight 75 toners. Do you also realise the significance of this is? This means that a human being with enough training can beat a god. The question you have to ask yourself is have they had enough training.

I dont care you can ignore me, but if you bring it up again i'll keep saying the same stuff.

Originally posted by Dinalfos

Btw, this has nothing to do with like or dislike.


Yes it is. You keep complaing about Cap's jobber aura when its the rules for human beings to be able to fight superhumans. I dont like the fact that they have made Wolverine 200 years old but its fact.


Originally posted by Dinalfos

Well, yes. But I only brought it up as a comparison.


Well ok i'll forget that.


Originally posted by Dinalfos

Cap is more agile and a better fighter with a great "eye". And yes, he's quick on his feet and has well developed reflexes. But not necessarily better than Hulk's. But like I said, Hulk is helped a great deal by his supernatural sense of accuracy/timing/direction.

Not having it. Hulk is not prescribed to have peak human or enhanced reflexes. Im aware that the comics can contradict the bio like classic powerman having 3ton strength, but the Hulk does not have enough showings to say he has peak, enhanced or superhuman reflexes. More often than not he is shown to be slower then Cap and Cap has fought the Hulk before in both cases Cap was able to use his agility to dodge him.

Its bad writing Cap is not prescribed to have the ability to catch a missle with his shield but sometimes you see him doing stuff like that.
The Hulk is not prescribed to have superhuman reflexes but sometimes you see him catching a plane its PIS. Cap can blitz the Hulk.

Originally posted by Dinalfos
Speculative bullshit. He has survived much, much worse.

Originally posted by Accel
He's taken blows from Mjolnir (an indestructible object) wielded by Thor (a Class 100 character) to the head before.

Not really.

He's taken punishment from some fo the strongest characters around with faltering much more than he's been knocked unconscious.

So when he survived this punishment he was mad right? How long had he been fighting for? The fact of the matter is when the bell rings Cap will be able to hit the Hulk before the Hulk can hit him. That can be in less than a second. The Hulk needs time to get mad and something tells me that on base level The Hulk does not have strength of a rainforest half the size of the US.

Furthermore that suit Cap is wearing was able to channel the whole of Gotham's electricity. That suit is class 100 and not a low one either.

Originally posted by Alfheim
I forgot my point I think it was that the Hulk does not have enhanced reflexes.


Which he arguably does.



I already told you why that doesn't count. It's always been Marvel's intention to mimic the real worlds physics as much as possible. Also, technology ain't physics. Cap can hang with non-speedsters. He can hang with Hulk as long as he avoids getting hit and comes up with a thorough plan to defeat him. However, Spiderman(to name someone) is an entirely different matter. Captain cannot hang Spiderman if the latter doesn't job for the sake of the plot. I know he can in the Marvel world, I never denied this. But you know, that's EXACTLY the problem. Marvel didn't think this through. They are writing stories with the characters and their status in mind, not their actual abilities.

I would also like to remind you that forum fights aren't quite the same as comic fights.



That's ridiculous. First of all, there's absolutely no telling which one of them is right, since comic books are so widely inconsistent(different writers, different interpretations, commercial pressure, image etc.). No ABC-logic, please! And no, Marvel humans cannot train themselves enough to beat gods. It may seem that way because of the virtually uncontrollable and inconsistent writing of hundreds of writers over the years, but if you actually were to ask Marvel directly, they'd most likely agree with me. The notion of a normal human beating a god(hyperbole or not) is just plain idiotic. It doesn't work that way, not even in the Marvel world. But yes, after all these years of comics and countless plots with various outcomes, your theory holds as much Merritt as any other. It just doesn't make sense.

I'd have to say, though, that magic is a different beast. Since magic actually exists in the Marvel universe, it can be taught and learned. In our world, real magic doesn't exist. Well, at least I don't actively believe it does. The point I (and others!) have been trying to make is that there would be no point in maintaining the physical hierarchy of the real world if humans could somehow become superhuman just by training. I mean, what would supernatural powers even mean if there's no frame of reference from the real world? What would, for example, Spidey's abilities even mean in a comic world that doesn't have its base in real physics? Nobody would be impressed, which was the point of it all: to impress the reader by making direct comparisons to reality.

Suspension of disbelief allows us to swallow the stuff you're talking about in a comic or two, but not consistently. That's why this has always annoyed me.




No. I didn't say they can't fight Superhumans at all. A plodding Powerhouse can be beaten with tactics strategy. But that's not quite the same as beating him physically, which shouldn't be possible.

And yes, Cap has a jobber aura.






I'm saying it may not necessarily be his speed alone, but his sense of timing, direction and aim. That's a pretty deadly combination. Which is undeniably superhuman. But yes, the Hulk has proved himself to be very swift and quick.

Btw, the Hulk catching a plane(or Silver Surfer and Quicksilver) isn't any more PISy than most of Captain's outrageous feats. Heck, for all we know the Hulk is actually underwritten when facing characters like Captain. Probably not, though. But still, Cap's feats are crippled by the fact that they are performed by someone who's supposed to lack true superhuman powers. Imo, that makes it worse.