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Fights in the city, Wrecker has his crowbar...

Wrecker beats his ass, have you seen that thing?

Hasn't Captain America taken down the Wrecker? Spiderman would have no trouble dodging and staying away from him.

Though, I dunno if he'd be able to damage him in return, .

Originally posted by Soljer
Hasn't Captain America taken down the Wrecker? Spiderman would have no trouble dodging and staying away from him.

Though, I dunno if he'd be able to damage him in return, . Spidey can always web the heck, out of that crowbar. Thus eliminating the crowbar threat.

Originally posted by Faceman
Spidey can always web the heck, out of that crowbar. Thus eliminating the crowbar threat.

Wrecker is plenty strong enough to break out of the web.

Spiderman wins. Thunderball is WAY more powerful than Wrecker, and Spidey found away around him.

Wrecker and the Wrecking Crew can grow stronger, which people don't know. Also Wrecker was dominating the New Avengers recently

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Wrecker and the Wrecking Crew can grow stronger, which people don't know. Also Wrecker was dominating the New Avengers recently Yeah, if theirs a thunderstorm..

Originally posted by Soljer
Hasn't Captain America taken down the Wrecker? Spiderman would have no trouble dodging and staying away from him.

Though, I dunno if he'd be able to damage him in return, . Wrecker has shown to fight Thor hasn't he?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Wrecker has shown to fight Thor hasn't he?

Thor isn't exactly the speediest combatant.

I'm still maintaining that Spidey could likely outdodge the wrecker. However, I am still unsure as to whether Parker would be able to damage him in return.

You're calling it a stalemate?

Well did Wreckers bio say his strength doubled increasing his strength from 40 to 80 tons?

Hell, Rhino's 80 tons.

Spidey's built to take down slow-ass losers like Wrecker. I don't see how this is any different than when he completely owned, say, Titania.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
You're calling it a stalemate?

Unless I see some evidence of the Wrecker dealing with foes as speedy as spidey, or Spiderman damaging foes as tough as the Wrecker.

Wrecker was handling Wolverine, Spider-Man and Luke Cage easily enough until Spider-Woman distracted him when he fought the Avengers.

Can he avoid Wrecker sure, can he *beat* Wrecker, no.

Wrecker wins 10/10 with Crowbar

Spidey wins 8-9/10 with no Crowbar

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Wrecker has shown to fight Thor hasn't he?


no.... well, kind of. if thor LETS HIM. thor more often than not fights on his opponents level of skill. thor when he is pissed off or fighting a cosmic being (such as thanos with the infinity gems) does a hell of a lot better.

thor wrecked the wrecking crew in about 30 seconds when he was pissed off. i can check the exact issue number but i dont recall off hand.

I think Loki had taken half of Thors powers away via magic. Thats why Wrecker looked so good in the showing.

Didn't it take the combined might of Spider-woman distracting him, Logan slashing him, Luke Cage stealing his Crow bar and Spider-man webbing him up to take him down last time? I hardly think Spidey is gonna beat this guy by himself.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Hell, Rhino's 80 tons.

Spidey's built to take down slow-ass losers like Wrecker. I don't see how this is any different than when he completely owned, say, Titania.

Agreed.

Originally posted by Soljer
Unless I see some evidence of the Wrecker dealing with foes as speedy as spidey, or Spiderman damaging foes as tough as the Wrecker.

Titania, Rhino, Firelord (yeah, dumb fight, but he legitimately took him out), Hulk (again, possibly bad writing, but it has happened). There's probably others I'm forgetting too.

Hell, he briefly punked Masterson-Thor once, and Thor couldn't touch him.

Wrecker wouldn't touch him. Ever. He'd get in a bunch of good one-liners, then mop the floor with him and go home to MJ.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Titania, Rhino, Firelord (yeah, dumb fight, but he legitimately took him out), Hulk (again, possibly bad writing, but it has happened). There's probably others I'm forgetting too.

Hell, he briefly punked Masterson-Thor once, and Thor couldn't touch him.

Wrecker wouldn't touch him. Ever. He'd get in a bunch of good one-liners, then mop the floor with him and go home to MJ.

Meh, of the ones you listed the only SLIGHTLY legit one would be Titania.

Rhino is...well...Rhino.

Firelord, a herald who can withstand the temperatures and pressures associated with space travel should NEVER have been PHASED by class 10-15 punches. Same goes for the Hulk.

I can't speak on the Masterson Thor case, I haven't read it myself. .

Wrecker 8-9/10

The thing with titania though is the fact he kept getting hits in while she got none weaking her enough so throwing her out a window would be effective,, and she is only class 50 I belive. Wrecker is stronger I'm pretty sure more durable and there won't be any tall buildings for Spidey to throw him out of....

Originally posted by Faceman
Yeah, if theirs a thunderstorm..

Not necessairly when the Wrecking Crew were fighting Alpha Flight each second they grew stronger and there was no thunderstorm.

Wrecker isn't exactly the brightest guy around.Spider-Man will make him look like a fool

Originally posted by Soljer
Meh, of the ones you listed the only SLIGHTLY legit one would be Titania.

Rhino is...well...Rhino.

Firelord, a herald who can withstand the temperatures and pressures associated with space travel should NEVER have been PHASED by class 10-15 punches. Same goes for the Hulk.

I can't speak on the Masterson Thor case, I haven't read it myself. .

So Titania is legitimate. You're just ignoring Rhino by writing him off as a jobber rather than giving any credit, and your comments tell me you didn't even read the Firelord fight. Pete puts him through a ton of stuff, most of it well beyond class 10-15 punches. Point-blank city-block-destroying explosions,getting leveled by a speeding subway car, etc. The punches just finished him off.

Seems to me like no one is offering anything resembling proof other than the fact that Wrecker is stronger. Like I said, slow morons like this are what Spider-Man is built for, regardless of who they've fought in the past or how much stronger they are.

So no, a few punches won't do a whole lot. But dozens and hundreds will. And, presuming this isn't in a desert or something, cars smashing into him with a ton of force (and similar forces) will be par for the course as well. And Wrecker will never touch him....any of the fights I've mentioned (and many others I didn't) are more than ample proof of this.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
So Titania is legitimate. You're just ignoring Rhino by writing him off as a jobber rather than giving any credit, and your comments tell me you didn't even read the Firelord fight. Pete puts him through a ton of stuff, most of it well beyond class 10-15 punches. Point-blank city-block-destroying explosions,getting leveled by a speeding subway car, etc. The punches just finished him off.

Seems to me like no one is offering anything resembling proof other than the fact that Wrecker is stronger. Like I said, slow morons like this are what Spider-Man is built for, regardless of who they've fought in the past or how much stronger they are.
I love how wolverine taking down hulk is PIS but when spiderman does it it OK even though spiderman has no way of hurting hulk.





logan heals from a skeleton before does that make it ok? You trying to say a Guy who was said to have beat thor ass he has the power of a god will lose to spiderman? did you see how easily he hit spiderman? also you keep assuem the enw and aproved wrecker is some slow poke.

Originally posted by capt it up
I love how wolverine taking down hulk is PIS but when spiderman does it it OK even though spiderman has no way of hurting hulk.





logan heals from a skeleton before does that make it ok? You trying to say a Guy who was said to have beat thor ass he has the power of a god will lose to spiderman? did you see how easily he hit spiderman? also you keep assuem the enw and aproved wrecker is some slow poke.

When did Wolverine enter the fight?

And I never said it wasn't PIS. Spidey beating Hulk was as much bad writing as Logan beating him.

So please don't put words in my mouth to make yourself seem like some enlightened sufferer for your character.

And we established Wrecker at under class 100 a while back. If you want to try and prove that wrong, fine...I have no problem conceding the point if other evidence is presented. And yes, he's lots slower than Spidey.

In all fairness, Wrecker should never have been an actual challenge for Thor.

And well, Wrecker is some slow poke. Improved or not.

And Titania was only class 50, not Hulk-strong. Nor did she have an insane healing factor.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
When did Wolverine enter the fight?

And I never said it wasn't PIS. Spidey beating Hulk was as much bad writing as Logan beating him.

So please don't put words in my mouth to make yourself seem like some enlightened sufferer for your character.

And we established Wrecker at under class 100 a while back. If you want to try and prove that wrong, fine...I have no problem conceding the point if other evidence is presented. And yes, he's lots slower than Spidey.
Why are you using PIS examples? If there PIS wwhy bring them up?



also did not the wrecker recently thrash thor before he fought the new avengers? also did not the wrecker thrash the new avengers? was not spiderman on the team? does not the wrecker have god level powers?

spidy takes this easy wrecker while strong as hell isnt much of a threat to the web slinger

Originally posted by capt it up
Why are you using PIS examples? If there PIS wwhy bring them up?



also did not the wrecker recently thrash thor before he fought the new avengers? also did not the wrecker thrash the new avengers? was not spiderman on the team? does not the wrecker have god level powers?

Well, you're the one asking the questions....why not tell me rather than present it as a needless rhetorical?

And contrary to widely held belief, I don't consider Titania, Rhino, or even the Firelord fight to be PIS.

Firelord, you say? Blasphemy! Yeah, I know, but stay with me. First, read the issue if you haven't (full scans in the respect thread). 2nd, the only PIS is that Firelord didn't use the Nova-blast to destroy the entire city. He wanted to just beat SM, not everyone. The entire fight other than that is legitimate.

Spidey not getting hit by people isn't PIS. It's happened a laughable number of times, even with much faster opponents than Wrecker. Much faster.

Maybe I'm underestimating Wrecker's durability, so it might just be a big fat stalemate. I'm not an expert on him, and have only seen a few showings. I haven't presented this as a black-and-white argument, I've just defended Pete against posters who seem to think that anyone above him in strength or durability automatically gets the win against him, since I'm better qualified than most to do so.

Originally posted by capt it up
I love how wolverine taking down hulk is PIS but when spiderman does it it OK even though spiderman has no way of hurting hulk.





logan heals from a skeleton before does that make it ok? You trying to say a Guy who was said to have beat thor ass he has the power of a god will lose to spiderman? did you see how easily he hit spiderman? also you keep assuem the enw and aproved wrecker is some slow poke.
see now you sound down right spiteful, spider-man takes down people like the wrecker, hyde, and titanina with out much difficulty plenty of times in the past... you know why? versitility and resourcefulness logan doesnt play that game not all the time he's a straight up toe to toe kinda guy that's why it's hard to belive him takeing out class 100s with just his bare hands and claws..

spider-man knows he cant outslug guys like this so quite simply he outsmarts them plays on their weaknesses and plays on their vanity versitility beats raw power 9/10 that's how he's able to get the job done not by outfighting them by by outsmarting them

Calm down lads, or ill have to close this thread. Make your arguments with evidence that can back it up.

Isnt Titania Class 85?
She was once stated as strongest woman on earth.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
In all fairness, Wrecker should never have been an actual challenge for Thor.

And well, Wrecker is some slow poke. Improved or not.

And Titania was only class 50, not Hulk-strong. Nor did she have an insane healing factor.

Technically Wrecker stands no chance against Thor.

Especially considering that Thing usually kicks his ass

Originally posted by Grimm22
Technically Wrecker stands no chance against Thor.

Especially considering that Thing usually kicks his ass

My point exactly, no offense to Thing at all.

Originally posted by Arahan
Isnt Titania Class 85?
She was once stated as strongest woman on earth.

She very well could've been. I don't recall her strength level exactly. I just know that it was definitely above class 50.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
My point exactly, no offense to Thing at all.

None taken

Its just that....

Wrecker/Thing's leauge <<<< Thor's league

Originally posted by Soljer
Wrecker is plenty strong enough to break out of the web. I don't know about that. Rougue who is class 50 could not break out of Spidermans webbing. And Wrecker is class 40 at full power I think.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
I don't know about that. Rougue who is class 50 could not break out of Spidermans webbing. And Wrecker is class 40 at full power I think.
full power wrecker is like 100 class.



also rouge not beeing able to break spidy webbing was PIS

Originally posted by capt it up
full power wrecker is like 100 class.



also rouge not beeing able to break spidy webbing was PIS Where does it say full power he's cl 100? He's cl. 40 at full power unless he's sharing with the crew then he drops to like cl . 10. Unless that's changed.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Where does it say full power he's cl 100? He's cl. 40 at full power unless he's sharing with the crew then he drops to like cl . 10. Unless that's changed.
well full power he 100 class. hell did he recently bragg about kicking the crap out of thor when he faced the new avengers

Originally posted by capt it up
well full power he 100 class. hell did he recently bragg about kicking the crap out of thor when he faced the new avengers Come on dude. I need better proof than that. I just looked at his two entries in the handbooks and one said 40 tons and the Master edition put him at CL 50 which is 25-50 tons.

That means nothing. Hyde bragged about the same thing and he knocked himself out once just by running into Thor.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Where does it say full power he's cl 100? He's cl. 40 at full power unless he's sharing with the crew then he drops to like cl . 10. Unless that's changed. your way off he's class 100 his strenght is almost equal to thor


and the rogue thing is not pis

Originally posted by lando005
your way off he's class 100 his strenght is almost equal to thor


and the rogue thing is not pis Where can this be proven? I can show you his bio from the Master Edition Handbook and it says CL 50.

It turns out I was close in my numbers. Here is his bio from Marveldirectory. And as far as I know Wrecker has not been upgraded.

Strength Level: The Wrecker possesses superhuman strength that enables him to lift (press) about 40 tons. Previously, when sharing his superhuman power with the other three members of the Wrecking Crew, the Wrecker could lift (press) about 10 tons.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Where can this be proven? I can show you his bio from the Master Edition Handbook and it says CL 50. what gods do you know that are class 40 or 50? he was enchanted with the streght of a god his power only drops when he's shareing it with the wrecking crew or if he's away from his wrecking bar show me this bio cause i wanna see it

Originally posted by lando005
what gods do you know that are class 40 or 50? he was enchanted with the streght of a god his power only drops when he's shareing it with the wrecking crew or if he's away from his wrecking bar show me this bio cause i wanna see it He's not a god. He's a god wannabe. He's CL 50 which is anywhere from 25 to 50 tons.(40tons)

http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/tf_wreckerback.jpg

That's weird........you can hear a pin drop in here now.

Meh! I have actually seen the Wrecking Crew amp themselves past class 40 when they battled Alpha Flight. They were tapping into this weird dimensional thing, that each second they got stronger

Current Wrecker is probably 70 or 80 tons

Well they may have had a few good showings and all. But I have seen nothing that makes Wrecker CL 100. It's hard to say how strong somebody is by fighting. We need lifting feats or a bio or something. If I see that then so be it then.

Originally posted by Grimm22
Current Wrecker is probably 70 or 80 tons He must have got a upgrade then. It's possible but I never heard about it.

Well their absorbing energy increasing their powers was from a Thor issue, forget what # though. However, and this is a big however, I don't believe they can do this anymore.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
He must have got a upgrade then. It's possible but I never heard about it.

Kind of

Back before the wrecking crew he was around 50 tons.

However his power got divided with the crew around

Current Wrecker though is always at full power even with his crew.

Originally posted by Grimm22
Kind of

Back before the wrecking crew he was around 50 tons.

However his power got divided with the crew around

Current Wrecker though is always at full power even with his crew. Which is about 40 tons. Unless somebody knows something else I think it's safe to say he's a 40 tonner. Still stronger than Luke Cage.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Which is about 40 tons. Unless somebody knows something else I think it's safe to say he's a 40 tonner. Still stronger than Luke Cage.

He's at least 50 tons right now


and he did nearly kill Colossus back in Secret Wars

ok you win on the strenght class issue

Originally posted by Grimm22
He's at least 50 tons right now


and he did nearly kill Colossus back in Secret Wars Yea he did. But Colossus beat up him and his crew plus Doc Ock. And oh yea best of all it was a cheap shot. Wrecker thought Colossus was gonna kill them.

Originally posted by DigiMark007

Firelord, you say? Blasphemy! Yeah, I know, but stay with me. First, read the issue if you haven't (full scans in the respect thread). 2nd, the only PIS is that Firelord didn't use the Nova-blast to destroy the entire city. He wanted to just beat SM, not everyone. The entire fight other than that is legitimate.
So, let me get this straight:
a person right under Surfer, gets taken down by the things Spidey's threw at him?
You do realize that a couple heralds have went through planets, Surfer has went through suns, Surfer has suvived a planetary explosion unscathed, etc.
Firelord has fought Surfer outright quite a few time.
Firelord has fought Morg, pretty well too.
All of those he had to take some blasts.
I bet this is more than a rock being thrown, a gas station explosion, and a couple class 10 punches.

Also, Firelord is a lightspeed character, and he didn't hit Spiderman once...hmmm.
Spiderman while webslinging, was even going fast enough to avoid Firelord chasing him in a straight line.

This is just the basics right now.

Originally posted by bigbran
So, let me get this straight:
a person right under Surfer, gets taken down by the things Spidey's threw at him?
You do realize that a couple heralds have went through planets, Surfer has went through suns, Surfer has suvived a planetary explosion unscathed, etc.
Firelord has fought Surfer outright quite a few time.
Firelord has fought Morg, pretty well too.
All of those he had to take some blasts.
I bet this is more than a rock being thrown, a gas station explosion, and a couple class 10 punches.

Also, Firelord is a lightspeed character, and he didn't hit Spiderman once...hmmm.
Spiderman while webslinging, was even going fast enough to avoid Firelord chasing him in a straight line.

This is just the basics right now.

Thank Christ.

what does this have to do with the wrecker?

Originally posted by lando005
what gods do you know that are class 40 or 50? he was enchanted with the streght of a god his power only drops when he's shareing it with the wrecking crew or if he's away from his wrecking bar show me this bio cause i wanna see it The average Asgardian God is class 25- 35 . Wrecker is class 50 at best.

Rhino is stronger than Wrecker.

Spiderman wins.

Too fast.
too smart.
bangs hot redhead upside suspended from ceiling.

fight over.

Sorry, guys, I want to know can armor piercing bullets penetrate Wrecker's skin? How tough is the Wrecker? I would like to learn more about Wrecker's invulnerability... Does it work like Superman's aura or he just has tough flesh like Thor? Please advise, thanks!

Originally posted by MadMadTitan
Sorry, guys, I want to know can armor piercing bullets penetrate Wrecker's skin? How tough is the Wrecker? I would like to learn more about Wrecker's invulnerability... Does it work like Superman's aura or he just has tough flesh like Thor? Please advise, thanks!

He has exra dense bone and muscle tissue, like Thor, hes pretty durable to blunt force trauma, Hawkeye once pierced Piledrivers skin with a standard arrow.

They can stand up to .45 caliber bullets and keep coming but if the bullets were armour piercing then I would think its fair to say they would pierce his skin.

Oh and Titania is a confirmed Class 85, she was stronger than She Hulk when she first apeared in Secret Wars who was around a class 70 at the time.

And when she and Mr Hyde broke out of the vault and D man tackled her he stated that when last tested he could press 15 tons, she grabbed him and threw him off a cliff and as she did it said "well last time I was tested I pressed 85!".

I hardly call this a fight. spidy can easily handle guys like the wrecker for warm up practice

with crowbar spidy 10/10
without spidy 10/10

Originally posted by Hercules
He has exra dense bone and muscle tissue, like Thor, hes pretty durable to blunt force trauma, Hawkeye once pierced Piledrivers skin with a standard arrow.

In Omega Flight their shown to be completly bullet proof.

Spiderman easily

Errrr? why easily considering Wrecker was swating New Avengers around like toys not to long ago.

Im not sure if this was mentioned before but the Wrecker already but a beating on Spiderman Cage and Wolverine in one of the eariler New Avengers.
edit: Mungi already mentioned it.

If this is the Wrecker with his power split with the other members of the Wrecking Crew he may win.

If this is Wrecker with all the power he will kill Spiderman. In Peter Parker the Spectaculr Spiderman #126 he almost killed Spiderman and Spiderwoman. No joke He could have killed them. Hell He almost broke Spiderwoman's psychic web causing her to almost pass out.

Remember kids comics were printed before 2000


http://www.spiderfan.org/comics/images/spiderman_spectacular/126.jpg

Even when he split the powers the Crew were beasts, hell Piledriver literally laughed at a full blow from Thor. Actually laughed at him and shrugged it off.

Originally posted by Hyperion Prime
If this is the Wrecker with his power split with the other members of the Wrecking Crew he may win.

If this is Wrecker with all the power he will kill Spiderman. In Peter Parker the Spectaculr Spiderman #126 he almost killed Spiderman and Spiderwoman. No joke He could have killed them. Hell He almost broke Spiderwoman's psychic web causing her to almost pass out.

Remember kids comics were printed before 2000


http://www.spiderfan.org/comics/images/spiderman_spectacular/126.jpg

Actually, the split doesn't affect his powers. Ulik taught him how to master his powers and abilities. So he and the others are all at their full power. 2nd, Wrecker can make forcefields and use the crowbar as a boomerang, much like what Thor can do when he throws Mjolnir.

Now, I'm not sure if the split was hindering his powers at the time, but Iron Fist did smash the entire wrecking crew, including destroying Thunderball's wrecking ball. So there's a precedent for Spidey being able to win. But like I said, if Wrecker doesn't fight like a retard and uses his crowbar creatively (btw, disarming him from the crowbar doesn't work nowadays, he can recall it to him), he'll destroy Spiderman.

I don't need to comment on SM vs. FL, since Bran did an excellent job. Seems Digi didn't read the forum rules on using feats like that.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
In Omega Flight their shown to be completly bullet proof.

Yeah, I read Omega Flight 1 and 2 today. Great stuff! There was a showing that Mr Bulldozer took a shotgun fire at his stomach point blank. CRAZy

Bump.

Wrecker wins.

Originally posted by jasonk3
Wrecker wins.

Spidey FTW

Originally posted by guy222
Spidey FTW

Wrecker destroyed the NA by himself...Spidey wouldn't be much of a threat.

I'll say it again, Wrecker got written UP to fight the NA.... Everyone fighting at their normal capacity on that team could have taken Wreck down on their own.

Originally posted by jinzin
I'll say it again, Wrecker got written UP to fight the NA.... Everyone fighting at their normal capacity on that team could have taken Wreck down on their own.

yeah...well...no, just no..................I got nothin

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Well, you're the one asking the questions....why not tell me rather than present it as a needless rhetorical?

And contrary to widely held belief, I don't consider Titania, Rhino, or even the Firelord fight to be PIS.

Firelord, you say? Blasphemy! Yeah, I know, but stay with me. First, read the issue if you haven't (full scans in the respect thread). 2nd, the only PIS is that Firelord didn't use the Nova-blast to destroy the entire city. He wanted to just beat SM, not everyone. The entire fight other than that is legitimate.

Spidey not getting hit by people isn't PIS. It's happened a laughable number of times, even with much faster opponents than Wrecker. Much faster.

Maybe I'm underestimating Wrecker's durability, so it might just be a big fat stalemate. I'm not an expert on him, and have only seen a few showings. I haven't presented this as a black-and-white argument, I've just defended Pete against posters who seem to think that anyone above him in strength or durability automatically gets the win against him, since I'm better qualified than most to do so.

He's nowhere NEAR outside of spiderman's ability to take down.
Thing has one shotted him.
Toxin one shotted him.
Captain America humiliated him while bouncing around a bunch of other attackers at the same time.
Iron Fist took him out on one occasion without even resorting to using the iron fist. and stalemated him on another.
I seem to remember Colossus handling him pretty solidly as well...

Not to mention the fact that Spiderman alongside Spiderwoman ALREADY BEAT the ENTIRE CREW by themselves as it is..

Wrecker got written up for New Avengers while every hero there got written down, plain and simple..

Doesn't change the fact that by and large Wrecker doesn't on average have good showings against people with decent speed and agility.
and on average it takes someone with a lot more sheer speed or skill than wrecker to catch spidey off guard much less toss him aside like garbage... that fight in New Avengers isn't the rule, it's the exception.

Originally posted by jinzin
He's nowhere NEAR outside of spiderman's ability to take down.
Thing has one shotted him.
Toxin one shotted him.
Captain America humiliated him while bouncing around a bunch of other attackers at the same time.
Iron Fist took him out on one occasion without even resorting to using the iron fist. and stalemated him on another.
I seem to remember Colossus handling him pretty solidly as well...

Not to mention the fact that Spiderman alongside Spiderwoman ALREADY BEAT the ENTIRE CREW by themselves as it is..

Wrecker got written up for New Avengers while every hero there got written down, plain and simple..

Doesn't change the fact that by and large Wrecker doesn't on average have good showings against people with decent speed and agility.
and on average it takes someone with a lot more sheer speed or skill than wrecker to catch spidey off guard much less toss him aside like garbage... that fight in New Avengers isn't the rule, it's the exception.

Well look at you ...thinking you're all cool with your facts. My opinions remains the same...Wrecker Wins !!!!

pissed

Originally posted by jinzin
pissed

Spiderman owns him hahaha muahahahaa!!!

Originally posted by Arctic
Spiderman owns him hahaha muahahahaa!!!

Spidey is too agile. Spidey's webs wins this

Wrecker was beating the crap outta Spidey, Spider-Woman and Wolvie like nothing.He takes this by far.

No he doesnt.

Spidey got some upgrades in speed and strength.
Even without them he could beat Wrecker.
With them he has much better chances to win.

And i am curious can spidermans stingers penetrate his skin?

Lol it's funny how K3VIL just completely ignored the post that stated that he had already beaten the ENTIRE CREW along with spiderwoman. Spidermans takes this 9/10. Not to mention his speed and strength upgrades...

No more lame web shooters! Wasn't a good idea to begin with, organics are much better, hahahaha!!!

Originally posted by Arahan
No he doesnt.

Spidey got some upgrades in speed and strength.
Even without them he could beat Wrecker.
With them he has much better chances to win.

And i am curious can spidermans stingers penetrate his skin?

Wrecker just beat Beta Ray Bill.

Originally posted by Estacado

Wrecker just beat Beta Ray Bill.

Has he ever beaten Spiderman? Yeah thats what I though. When he beats someone who is Spiderman then he might have a chance.

Originally posted by Estacado

Wrecker just beat Beta Ray Bill.

wtf, how the hell did he beat Beta Ray Bill?

Originally posted by Arctic
Lol it's funny how K3VIL just completely ignored the post that stated that he had already beaten the ENTIRE CREW along with spiderwoman. Spidermans takes this 9/10. Not to mention his speed and strength upgrades...

No more lame web shooters! Wasn't a good idea to begin with, organics are much better, hahahaha!!!

Actually I was wrong I just read back through it and Spiderman only stalled Wrecker for a while, Wrecker was at full power and Spiderman wasn't doing much....

With Spiderman's increased speed, reflexes, and strength it might be enough to make the difference... I still stand by what I said earlier though... Anyone on the New Avengers should be able to solo Wrecker.

Originally posted by jinzin
Anyone on the New Avengers should be able to solo Wrecker.

LukeCage is on the NA right now isn't he?

Yup, And I think he should be able to solo wrecker.

At LEAST regular Wrecker.. from the rumors I've been hearing he's been upgraded or something?

Originally posted by jinzin
Yup, And I think he should be able to solo wrecker.

At LEAST regular Wrecker.. from the rumors I've been hearing he's been upgraded or something?

Yeah. He destroyed BRB recently.

Of yeah you think Echo would solo him too?

If Wrecker plays smart he wins.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Yeah. He destroyed BRB recently.

Of yeah you think Echo would solo him too?

Forgot about echo.. I don't know enough about her honestly.

a lot of those feats his opponents are weakened or he's is enhanced.. but damn I got a bit more respect for him now.

Originally posted by jinzin
a lot of those feats his opponents are weakened or he's is enhanced.. but damn I got a bit more respect for him now.

http://img25.imagevenue.com/loc794/th_42454_Avengers_Annual_05_119729_-_30_122_794lo.jpghttp://img169.imagevenue.com/loc372/th_42460_Avengers_Annual_05_119728_-_31_122_372lo.jpghttp://img137.imagevenue.com/loc489/th_42462_Avengers_Annual_05_819721_-_32_122_489lo.jpghttp://img183.imagevenue.com/loc437/th_42468_Avengers_Annual_05_219727_-_33_122_437lo.jpg
http://img148.imagevenue.com/loc712/th_42469_Avengers_Annual_05_719728_-_34_122_712lo.jpg

Spidey pawned some Avengers. He easily beats Wrecker. IMO

http://img137.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=42462_Avengers_Annual_05_819721_-_32_122_489lo.jpg
This feat is pure BS

Originally posted by guy222
http://img25.imagevenue.com/loc794/th_42454_Avengers_Annual_05_119729_-_30_122_794lo.jpghttp://img169.imagevenue.com/loc372/th_42460_Avengers_Annual_05_119728_-_31_122_372lo.jpghttp://img137.imagevenue.com/loc489/th_42462_Avengers_Annual_05_819721_-_32_122_489lo.jpghttp://img183.imagevenue.com/loc437/th_42468_Avengers_Annual_05_219727_-_33_122_437lo.jpg
http://img148.imagevenue.com/loc712/th_42469_Avengers_Annual_05_719728_-_34_122_712lo.jpg

Spidey pawned some Avengers. He easily beats Wrecker. IMO

That's not Spider-Man. That's a Spider-Man copy made by Kang.

Spider-Man beat the copy later all by himself though, and the copy possessed the exact same abilities as Spidey did.

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
http://img137.imagevenue.com/img.php?image=42462_Avengers_Annual_05_819721_-_32_122_489lo.jpg
This feat is pure BS

I liked when he socked CA

I liked how he knocked Thor down.

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
I liked how he knocked Thor down.

I did also

Originally posted by jinzin
a lot of those feats his opponents are weakened or he's is enhanced.. but damn I got a bit more respect for him now.

Majority time he isn't, classic Wrecker and classic Wrecking Crew were beasts that nearly killed Hercules and Thor at the same time.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Majority time he isn't, classic Wrecker and classic Wrecking Crew were beasts that nearly killed Hercules and Thor at the same time.



Thor most likely was not using his hammer properly, but they are beast none the less.

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
Thor most likely was not using his hammer properly, but they are beast none the less.

Which time? Basically the crowbar he uses is an equal to Thor's hammer as noted.

Originally posted by jinzin
Anyone on the New Avengers should be able to solo Wrecker.

Definetly not.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Which time?
The time you just stated:
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Wrecking Crew were beasts that nearly killed Hercules and Thor at the same time.


Originally posted by King_Mungi

Basically the crowbar he uses is an equal to Thor's hammer as noted.



I agree that the Crow-Bar as powerful, But equal to Mjolnir? no

^^ Definitely not.

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
The time you just stated:

I agree that the Crow-Bar as powerful, But equal to Mjolnir? no

How could he have used it differently? as the Crew were all over him

It's stated to be as such in the actual comics.

What's Wrecker's origin? I mean did he just find the crowbar lying around or something?

Originally posted by King_Mungi


It's stated to be as such in the actual comics.

Sounds like some writer was being stupid, fact is Wrecker's crowbar lacks on panel feats to put him on par with Mjolnir.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
What's Wrecker's origin? I mean did he just find the crowbar lying around or something?

Nope, he stole power that was suppose to be given to Loki. The crowbar doesn't give him power he gives the crowbar power. I'll put up his origins shortly in the respect thread

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/Thor_1990_418_07.jpg

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
Sounds like some writer was being stupid, fact is Wrecker's crowbar lacks on panel feats to put him on par with Mjolnir.

Not just one writer said it, but at least three

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Nope, he stole power that was suppose to be given to Loki. The crowbar doesn't give him power he gives the crowbar power. I'll put up his origins shortly in the respect thread

http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/Thor_1990_418_07.jpg



Not just one writer said it, but at least three
On-panel feats>>>Dumb Writers.

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
On-panel feats>>>Dumb Writers.

Hardly, just because Wrecker was not put in the same situation as Thor to use his weapon in the same manner does not make the writers dumb.

Wrecker will WRECK spiderman








































FAILED

Originally posted by jasonk3
Wrecker will WRECK spiderman




http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/Defenders_019_04.jpg
==
Also if he can tag Northstar, why would Spider-Man be more diffucult?

1. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/AlphaFlight119-10.jpg
2. http://i158.photobucket.com/albums/t105/DC_CaptainComet/AlphaFlight119-11.jpg

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Majority time he isn't, classic Wrecker and classic Wrecking Crew were beasts that nearly killed Hercules and Thor at the same time.



Oh BULLSHIT.

What? the time that they AMBUSHED Herc? While he was doubting himself for what happened to him in Avengers 274? The time that he admitted that it was his own CIS that was allowing them to even get an upper hand on him... the time that he easily started to manhandle all of them when he got pissed off? When Thor decided to take a beating to save Herc's pride?

You're honestly trying to pass that off as if the Wrecking Crew are capible of doing that in a straight fight?... wow....

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Definetly not. I disagree...

Originally posted by jinzin
Oh BULLSHIT.

What? the time that they AMBUSHED Herc? While he was doubting himself for what happened to him in Avengers 274? The time that he admitted that it was his own CIS that was allowing them to even get an upper hand on him... the time that he easily started to manhandle all of them when he got pissed off? When Thor decided to take a beating to save Herc's pride?

You're honestly trying to pass that off as if the Wrecking Crew are capible of doing that in a straight fight?... wow....

Not really the reason he doubted himself the first time was because the Crew nearly killed him and that put him in that state of mind. No he knocked out two who wern't even fighting him, they were just holding him while Wrecker was pounding on Thor nearly killing him. Wrecker alone nearly killed Thor even Hela was going to take his soul way back when. Even classic Wrecker one-shooted the Hulk

Yes, as they have done so in the past. Have you seen Wrecker's fight with Beta Ray Bill?

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Not really the reason he doubted himself the first time was because the Crew nearly killed him and that put him in that state of mind. No he knocked out two who wern't even fighting him, they were just holding him while Wrecker was pounding on Thor nearly killing him. Wrecker alone nearly killed Thor even Hela was going to take his soul way back when. Even classic Wrecker one-shooted the Hulk

Yes, as they have done so in the past. Have you seen Wrecker's fight with Beta Ray Bill? Thor was WEAK.... END.... there's nothing hard to understand about that.. there's no reason a guy who trades blows with someone who can lift manhatten would otherwise be impressed with Wrecker lifting a forklift.. that's ridiculous to compare him that way.

And uh NO the wrecking crew only beat herc and put him in that "state of mind" after he fought tiger shark, got blind sided by Hyde, and then cheap shotted and basically owned by Goliath, The wrecking crew had nothing to do with that until Herc was already practically beaten.. and frankly, HE WAS DRUNK anyways... Goliath even stated that it was inhibiting Herc as well as his two previous assailants... plain and simple when the Wrecking crew isn't working with upgrades, overwhelming numbers, and/or their opponents downgrading, they get punked more often than not..

I can't believe you honestly just tried to sell the wrecker single handingly taken down Thor and Herc in a legit fight... I've seen some of your skewed perceptions on feats and comics before but this is damned insanely ridiculous.

P.S. They have NEVER done so in the past, not in a legit fight.
I haven't seen the BRB fight but I'm going to assume that Wrecker got enhanced beyond his own physical and magical limitations in some way...
and
And one shotting Hulk is some MAJJJOR PIS, lest you want to argue that Wolverine has better durability than Hulk.

Originally posted by jinzin
And one shotting Hulk is some MAJJJOR PIS, lest you want to argue that Wolverine has better durability than Hulk. Did Wrecker actually punch Wolverine, beside a backhand?

Originally posted by Jebus reborn
Did Wrecker actually punch Wolverine, beside a backhand?

He hit him with the crowbar..

Originally posted by jinzin
He hit him with the crowbar..

There's a great response to this I found:

Originally posted by jinzin
point is it didn't do the damage a straight shot would inflict..

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
There's a great response to this I found: Why would wrecker try to stab wolverine with a crowbar?

Originally posted by jinzin
Why would wrecker try to stab wolverine with a crowbar?

A glancing blow by any weapon is nothing compared to a solid hit.

The fact that you would say that a glancing blow is the same as a direct hit and at the same time be typing the exact opposite opinion is just . . .

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
A glancing blow by any weapon is nothing compared to a solid hit.

The fact that you would say that a glancing blow is the same as a direct hit and at the same time be typing the exact opposite opinion is just . . .

I'm not even sure what you're rambling about now.. Wrecker hit Wolverine full on with his Crowbar.. the Crowbar COULD be used to impale Wolverine I suppose, but the Wrecker just uses it like a baseball bat for all intents and purposes, and frankly there was nothing glancing about the hit, he nailed Logan dead on.

Logan on the other hand was only landing glacning cuts on Wreckers hit trying to slice at him instead of severing his limbs or going for a stab.

This has been demonstrated before against Rogue, Wolverine blasted her with his claws extended and there wasn't any apparent damage, he said that the next time he was going to attack her he would use a straight shot, and he proved the difference when he attacked Warbird in Wolverine 134 and again when Rogue absorbed Wolverine's claws and they pierced through her skin, and kept cutting up the insides of her arms to the point that the pain was nearly unbearable to her...

The point? Wolverine's claws were doing damage, but not to the extent of the damage he was capible of delivering. If he wanted more damage, lethal damage... to be done, he could have and would have done it plain and simple.

For example, you're not likely to cut someone up very well by slicing at em with a butter knife, but stabbing em will do just fine...

How you're even comparing an edged weapon used for puncturing and slicing as opposed to a blunt force weapon used for batting is what's really: here.

Whether he hits Wolverine or Spidey with the crowbar, it should knock them out.

Plus his non physical feats like magnetism, energy absorption, earth control and blasts should give him an easy victory. He's at least as powerful as ironman, maybe a bit more.

Originally posted by jinzin
Thor was WEAK.... END.... there's nothing hard to understand about that.. there's no reason a guy who trades blows with someone who can lift manhatten would otherwise be impressed with Wrecker lifting a forklift.. that's ridiculous to compare him that way.

And uh NO the wrecking crew only beat herc and put him in that "state of mind" after he fought tiger shark, got blind sided by Hyde, and then cheap shotted and basically owned by Goliath, The wrecking crew had nothing to do with that until Herc was already practically beaten.. and frankly, HE WAS DRUNK anyways... Goliath even stated that it was inhibiting Herc as well as his two previous assailants... plain and simple when the Wrecking crew isn't working with upgrades, overwhelming numbers, and/or their opponents downgrading, they get punked more often than not..

I can't believe you honestly just tried to sell the wrecker single handingly taken down Thor and Herc in a legit fight... I've seen some of your skewed perceptions on feats and comics before but this is damned insanely ridiculous.

P.S. They have NEVER done so in the past, not in a legit fight.
I haven't seen the BRB fight but I'm going to assume that Wrecker got enhanced beyond his own physical and magical limitations in some way...
and
And one shotting Hulk is some MAJJJOR PIS, lest you want to argue that Wolverine has better durability than Hulk.

If you read the issue it stated Thor HAD his strength, it stated several times he still had his incalcuable strength what he didn't have was his god-like abilities, but still possessed everything that was natural to him as noted.

Except Hercules stated it was THEIR doing that put fear into his mind, it was THEIR doing that nearly killed him. Then later on they nearly killed him again until basically Thor was willingly to sacrifice so Hercules could snap out of it. No they don't, I have even posted feats before their upgrades and their beasts.

Skewed perspection? I posted the entire fights from start to finish in the respect thread. I don't just post scans that make them solely look good in the fight, I post the whole thing. I know what I'm talking about and back it up and you know it.

He has constantly been upgraded throughout his carrer, even the Crew were upgraded and took on Alpha Flight and were basically steam rolling them. That's who they are, does that dimise their power? no. because those upgrades have become their powers

Or PIS that Wolverine can take shots that have leveled Thor, Beta Ray Bill, Hulk, etc.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
If you read the issue it stated Thor HAD his strength, it stated several times he still had his incalcuable strength what he didn't have was his god-like abilities, but still possessed everything that was natural to him as noted.

HE was depowered and fighting out of his element simple as, besides I seem to recall him stating something along the lines of wrecker being physically more powerful than him. Of course, I'm also drunk at the moments.. so ..

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Except Hercules stated it was THEIR doing that put fear into his mind, it was THEIR doing that nearly killed him. Then later on they nearly killed him again until basically Thor was willingly to sacrifice so Hercules could snap out of it. No they don't, I have even posted feats before their upgrades and their beasts.

Dude, that has NOTHING to do with a legit fight, they JUMPED Herc after he had already been beaten down, and I REFUSE to argue with you on this point as there is literally nothing to debate, sure they may have put some fear into him, but it wasn't due to a legit fight the way you're portraying.

No one said they're not tough ( i don't know about beasts) but yes they do...

Wrecker's been one shotted by Thor, THing, Toxin, and Hulk... he's not above Thor and Herc combined BY ANY MEANS and that's certainly the picture you're trying to paint here.
Skewed perspection? I posted the entire fights from start to finish in the respect thread. I don't just post scans that make them solely look good in the fight, I post the whole thing. I know what I'm talking about and back it up and you know it.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
He has constantly been upgraded throughout his carrer, even the Crew were upgraded and took on Alpha Flight and were basically steam rolling them. That's who they are, does that dimise their power? no. because those upgrades have become their powers
And yet when they get one shotted by the previously mentioned characters, or when they get beaten down by Cap, Wasp, Giant man, Iron Fist, When they have a hard time with Wild Heart, Nemisis, Spiderman, When Thunderball (a guy who's been KOed by Cap and stalemated by Venom) puts up a good tussle with Wrecker It's PIS? See I don't think that their upgrades are EVER consistent, Almost every damn time they're on panal they fluctuate, at one moment being able to take down Hulk at another not strong enough to list a bus? The hell?

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Or PIS that Wolverine can take shots that have leveled Thor, Beta Ray Bill, Hulk, etc.

Thor: Weakened, BRB: upgraded ( I took a gander through your thread and you admitted it yourself dolt!), Hulk, PIS, plain and simple. The guy's gotten up from hitting Earth from space, taken shots from Drax and Thano's, took a Moljnir shot to the face without so much as budging, took a number of nukes... Wrecker one shotting him is PIS, and I didn't see you argue that point until I brought it up.. you certainly didn't have a problem when other people where calling it such, but go figure, whatever it takes to win one of these crap ass argument heh?
psshhhhh



I don't even care any more.

Originally posted by jinzin
HE was depowered and fighting out of his element simple as, besides I seem to recall him stating something along the lines of wrecker being physically more powerful than him. Of course, I'm also drunk at the moments.. so ..

No, he was still fighting as is but he didn;t have was his magical protection that allowed Wrecker to take his shots, but didn't allow Wrecker to take his. Loki was suppose to get Wrecker's power from the Norn Queen and was said to be multiple times stronger than Thor. Wrecker is suppose to be stronger than him.

Originally posted by jinzin

Dude, that has NOTHING to do with a legit fight, they JUMPED Herc after he had already been beaten down, and I REFUSE to argue with you on this point as there is literally nothing to debate, sure they may have put some fear into him, but it wasn't due to a legit fight the way you're portraying.

No one said they're not tough ( i don't know about beasts) but yes they do...

Wrecker's been one shotted by Thor, THing, Toxin, and Hulk... he's not above Thor and Herc combined BY ANY MEANS and that's certainly the picture you're trying to paint here.

Skewed perspection? I posted the entire fights from start to finish in the respect thread. I don't just post scans that make them solely look good in the fight, I post the whole thing. I know what I'm talking about and back it up and you know it.

I know that, but Hercules has said out of everyone it was them who did the worse damage and it was them who made him lost his confidence. I never EVER said they didn't get a cheap shot in as it was Atlas who even put him on the floor for them to pound.

Actually yeah not just in this thread but many on this board they have said they are weak. Once again the respect threads shows that their on a far higher level then SPider-Man. He doesn't just have physical strength he has so much more.

Thor has never one shooted him or Hulk, and yes Thing and Toxin has beaten him AND the Crew and you don't think that's PIS when they have shown to take on Thor, Alpha Flight, etc? The Crew have taken blows from Thor and literally laughed at him, but Thing? errr? It's like when Hulk got beat by a snake or Wolverine with an elk, it's PIS. Yet, you always seem to simply look the other way if it's a bad showing for Wolverine but god forbid it happens to someone else you jump all over it.

And yet when they get one shotted by the previously mentioned characters, or when they get beaten down by Cap, Wasp, Giant man, Iron Fist, When they have a hard time with Wild Heart, Nemisis, Spiderman, When Thunderball (a guy who's been KOed by Cap and stalemated by Venom) puts up a good tussle with Wrecker It's PIS? See I don't think that their upgrades are EVER consistent, Almost every damn time they're on panal they fluctuate, at one moment being able to take down Hulk at another not strong enough to list a bus? The hell?


Originally posted by jinzin

Thor: Weakened, BRB: upgraded ( I took a gander through your thread and you admitted it yourself dolt!), Hulk, PIS, plain and simple. The guy's gotten up from hitting Earth from space, taken shots from Drax and Thano's, took a Moljnir shot to the face without so much as budging, took a number of nukes... Wrecker one shotting him is PIS, and I didn't see you argue that point until I brought it up.. you certainly didn't have a problem when other people where calling it such, but go figure, whatever it takes to win one of these crap ass argument heh?
psshhhhh

Yeah but not seriously weakened, and yes the upgrade is now his powerset. Of course I admited it, I tell every time there is an upgrade or downgrade and show the whole fight. I cover everything not just scans that will make him look good. Well considering all those times Hulk was in a pissed off mood and in mid-fight and when Wrecker hit him he was listening to Thundeball's speech and then he attacked him. Did you see the scan at all? It wasn't a truely pissed off Hulk who is in battle mode and that's a HUGE difference. So when other people do PIS events it's garbage, but when Wolverine does it it's legit? hmmmm...

so we agree that Captain Universe Spiderman wins.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
No, he was still fighting as is but he didn;t have was his magical protection that allowed Wrecker to take his shots, but didn't allow Wrecker to take his. Loki was suppose to get Wrecker's power from the Norn Queen and was said to be multiple times stronger than Thor. Wrecker is suppose to be stronger than him.

Wrecker, the guy who's been one shotted by Thing, Toxin, and Thor himself is supposed to be stronger than Thor? Uh huh...

Thor's the only one who thought he had "strength imeasurable", It's no different than Spiderman saying he's got 40X human speed and reflexes, and Wolverine saying he can cut through ANYTHING, it's just a speculative self analyzation without proof, and STILL: He was impressed by Wrecker lifting a crane? He had to strain himself completely to push aside a bulldozer?

He had been stripped of his powers.. he had mortal strength.. Strong? Sure. Thor strong? HELLLLL NO... that's not even up for debate.
Loki got KOed by a regular guy with a crowbar for god sakes... They were no where NEAR the same incarnations. as they're normal selves...

Originally posted by King_Mungi
I know that, but Hercules has said out of everyone it was them who did the worse damage and it was them who made him lost his confidence. I never EVER said they didn't get a cheap shot in as it was Atlas who even put him on the floor for them to pound.

SO WHAT?
It's like if you just got the crap kicked out of you by a heavyweight boxer and then a street gang came and started beating you with chains and uh crowbars, OF COURSE that you make you feel violated and helpless.. but it wouldn't be due to a straight fight, and while you never said that you back tracking dunce, you DID imply that they could, or rather that Wrecker could... TWICE....

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Majority time he isn't, classic Wrecker and classic Wrecking Crew were beasts that nearly killed Hercules and Thor at the same time.

Originally posted by jinzin
You're honestly trying to pass that off as if the Wrecking Crew are capible of doing that in a straight fight?... wow....
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yes, as they have done so in the past.


Originally posted by King_Mungi
Actually yeah not just in this thread but many on this board they have said they are weak. Once again the respect threads shows that their on a far higher level then SPider-Man. He doesn't just have physical strength he has so much more.

No said otherwise, stop trying to strawman.

Originally posted by King_Mungi
Thor has never one shooted him or Hulk, and yes Thing and Toxin has beaten him AND the Crew and you don't think that's PIS when they have shown to take on Thor, Alpha Flight, etc? The Crew have taken blows from Thor and literally laughed at him, but Thing? errr? It's like when Hulk got beat by a snake or Wolverine with an elk, it's PIS. Yet, you always seem to simply look the other way if it's a bad showing for Wolverine but god forbid it happens to someone else you jump all over it.
OMG, Here's the thing, Hulk HAS one shotted him, Thor HAS one shotted him, and infact called him a petty annoyance when he did it, A PETTY ANNOYANCE is all the respect Wrecker gets from Thor when he's not getting cheap shots, using overwhelming numbers and/or attacking Thor when he's been made mortal.
The thing about your claim to PIS is that it hinges on Wrecker being at a consistent level above characters like Herc and Thor in spite of more showings to the contrary.. He laughed at a weakened Thor in a classic state that he was relenquished of... when he attacked a normal Thor, Thor schooled him hard.

Again there's far more showings to the contrary... he's lost easily TWICE to a full powered Thor, been beaten down hard a couple more times, got Koed by cap and wasp, got beaten by cap and wasp AGAIN, got Koed by Thunderball's ball in a fight with Iron Fist, Humiliated by Cap's speed and agility, One shotted by thing, one shotted by Toxin, stalemated by Iron Fist, stalemated by Thunderball (who's bean beaten by cap, stalemated by venom, and schooled by spidey)
hell even in the new avengers bit which wrote him up just to be competive while writing all the other heroes down, he got Koed after four or five blows from high end streeters.

The good feats he does have have him temporarily powered up, heroes temporarily powered down, getting cheap shots, using overwhelming numbers and any of a number of ridiculous things that he doesn't have or use as a standard.
Originally posted by King_Mungi
Yeah but not seriously weakened, and yes the upgrade is now his powerset. Of course I admited it, I tell every time there is an upgrade or downgrade and show the whole fight. I cover everything not just scans that will make him look good. Well considering all those times Hulk was in a pissed off mood and in mid-fight and when Wrecker hit him he was listening to Thundeball's speech and then he attacked him. Did you see the scan at all? It wasn't a truely pissed off Hulk who is in battle mode and that's a HUGE difference. So when other people do PIS events it's garbage, but when Wolverine does it it's legit? hmmmm... When have I ever argued that Wolverine has LEGIT PIS events? I'm fairly confident that I've readily admitted that Wolverine's PIS isn't legit, just that it did indeed happen...

The difference here is that Wrecker can't one shot a mortal Thor, or a drunken and beaten Herc, He's failed to one shot Wolverine, He failed to one shot Spiderman, he failed to one shot a low powered Thunderball.
Hulk NOT IN PISSED OFF MODE has stood up from hitting Earth from orbit, stood up to everything the UFOES could dish out, stood up to a straight Moljnir cheap shot, stood up an A bomb at ground zero etc etc... but wrecker KO's Hulk once and that's his standard? That's like saying Iron Man's going to one punch Hulk as HIS standard...
The contradition there is absurd.

Wrecker is tough, but Spiderman would beat him on average IMO... maybe not BRB wrecking wrecker but regs wrecker gets beaten IMO.

Originally posted by jinzin
Wrecker, the guy who's been one shotted by Thing, Toxin, and Thor himself is supposed to be stronger than Thor? Uh huh...

Thor's the only one who thought he had "strength imeasurable", It's no different than Spiderman saying he's got 40X human speed and reflexes, and Wolverine saying he can cut through ANYTHING, it's just a speculative self analyzation without proof, and STILL: He was impressed by Wrecker lifting a crane? He had to strain himself completely to push aside a bulldozer?

He had been stripped of his powers.. he had mortal strength.. Strong? Sure. Thor strong? HELLLLL NO... that's not even up for debate.
Loki got KOed by a regular guy with a crowbar for god sakes... They were no where NEAR the same incarnations. as they're normal selves...

Yes, that's why Loki wanted the powers from the Norm Queen in the first place. Then after his first apperance they mentioned it again the Wrecker was stronger. Hulk has gotten beat by a snake, and Thor has gotten beat by Spider-Man before. People job, does that mean you should take away what level their suppose to be at?

Nope in his first apperance the Writer , Loki and Thor both made comment about his strength. Errr? he has lifted an apartment building too in the same issue and was physically manhandling Thor. Look at Wendigo we know he super stronger, but does he have any lifting feats? None what's so ever, only direct comments from Hulk, captions, etc.

Once again if you read the issue, it directly states 3 seperate times Thor possssed his incalcuable strength, and yes Loki was powerless as he does not have his natural strength he had to learn how to be a mystic and Odin took his enchanment away. Yeah that was Wrecker who did it and shortly after and before that they make mention Thor STILL possessed his incalcuable strength. That's not up for debate that's a fact.

Originally posted by jinzin

SO WHAT?
It's like if you just got the crap kicked out of you by a heavyweight boxer and then a street gang came and started beating you with chains and uh crowbars, OF COURSE that you make you feel violated and helpless.. but it wouldn't be due to a straight fight, and while you never said that you back tracking dunce, you DID imply that they could, or rather that Wrecker could... TWICE....

What? no it's not the same, and he wasn't getting kick the shit out of the other people. It's when the Crew started to attack him he made comment with each hit they broke his bones. My god he has stated it was the Crew that did all the damage and that it was the Crew that put the fear into him. No one else, and no one else did the damage they did. So if you want to simply ignore that, go right ahead you have been ignoring every other Crew high showing. Actually no, your using out of context quotes where the Crew have shown they can be a physical match for Thor or Hercules.

Originally posted by jinzin

No said otherwise, stop trying to strawman.

haha are you kidding me? you said characters like Luke Cage could beat him.

Originally posted by jinzin
OMG, Here's the thing, Hulk HAS one shotted him, Thor HAS one shotted him, and infact called him a petty annoyance when he did it, A PETTY ANNOYANCE is all the respect Wrecker gets from Thor when he's not getting cheap shots, using overwhelming numbers and/or attacking Thor when he's been made mortal.

The thing about your claim to PIS is that it hinges on Wrecker being at a consistent level above characters like Herc and Thor in spite of more showings to the contrary.. He laughed at a weakened Thor in a classic state that he was relenquished of... when he attacked a normal Thor, Thor schooled him hard.

Again there's far more showings to the contrary... he's lost easily TWICE to a full powered Thor, been beaten down hard a couple more times, got Koed by cap and wasp, got beaten by cap and wasp AGAIN, got Koed by Thunderball's ball in a fight with Iron Fist, Humiliated by Cap's speed and agility, One shotted by thing, one shotted by Toxin, stalemated by Iron Fist, stalemated by Thunderball (who's bean beaten by cap, stalemated by venom, and schooled by spidey)
hell even in the new avengers bit which wrote him up just to be competive while writing all the other heroes down, he got Koed after four or five blows from high end streeters.

The good feats he does have have him temporarily powered up, heroes temporarily powered down, getting cheap shots, using overwhelming numbers and any of a number of ridiculous things that he doesn't have or use as a standard.

I don't think you get Wrecker's level when he got one-shooted back in the past is when he divided his power with the Crew and got weaker, then when he found Ulik he was able to retain his strength while giving his power to the rest. Context is everything, and Wrecker has SHOWN not once, but many times to be able to hang with Thor, Hercules, Hulk, Sasquatch, etc.

Where did he relenquish that? you have no proof it's writers who made the Crew and him job. Such as Piledriver got beat by Hawkeye with arrows yet how many times have we seen him to be bulletproof? Wow so basically you look at ONE apperance and that determines his comic base? hmmm.....yes, let's ignore all the times where he said Wrecker was his equal and a fearsome foe. Yes, lets.

Actually there isn't, and uuuuuuh once again PIS. Wrecker has shown to tag Northstar with ease, but Cap to fast? Hell Captain America even schooled King Thor in hand to hand, so might as well take that as legit. Also the fact we have seen Thunderball trie to overthrow Wrecker and each time he was put into his place as he was the stronger one. I love the fact you so stead fast by PIS, low-showings yet rules of the board contradict what your saying. Hell Spider-Man has ko'ed Thor, Quicksilver, Invisible Woman in one attack do we take that as legit too?

NO! those were temporary powerups they are suppose to be their actual powerset. Just like how Spider-Man got powered up in the Others, it's his power now for good. No where was it ever stated their powerups were only temporay, or do you have proof?

Originally posted by jinzin

When have I ever argued that Wolverine has LEGIT PIS events? I'm fairly confident that I've readily admitted that Wolverine's PIS isn't legit, just that it did indeed happen...

The difference here is that Wrecker can't one shot a mortal Thor, or a drunken and beaten Herc, He's failed to one shot Wolverine, He failed to one shot Spiderman, he failed to one shot a low powered Thunderball.
Hulk NOT IN PISSED OFF MODE has stood up from hitting Earth from orbit, stood up to everything the UFOES could dish out, stood up to a straight Moljnir cheap shot, stood up an A bomb at ground zero etc etc... but wrecker KO's Hulk once and that's his standard? That's like saying Iron Man's going to one punch Hulk as HIS standard...
The contradition there is absurd.

Wrecker is tough, but Spiderman would beat him on average IMO... maybe not BRB wrecking wrecker but regs wrecker gets beaten IMO.

Quite a few times actually, you say his high showings have happened and that people shouldn't simply ignore them. You have said that several times, even though

Thor/Hercules starts out at a higher level than a calm Thor so don't even compare the two. Yet, they showed Wrecker easily break Thunderball's arm with just a handshake. That was Professor Hulk and he used his smarts to beat them and didn't rely on strength and durability, in Heroes for Hire they knocked the Hulk out with ease. Wrecker has withstood a shot from Thor and he wasn't even phazed, but as a mentioned before as noted Wrecker is suppose to be stronger then Thor. I love you will take everyone else's high-showings, but will only use Wrecker's lows. Quite fair.

Regular Wrecker is a Thor buster, heck did you see what he even did to Alpha Flight and New Avengers?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/454209_1-Thor-Hercules-Vs-Wrecking-Crew

Anyway... Wrecker beats Spider-Man, handily.

Average Wrecker.. I disagree.

personally, i think it depends largely on the setting. in a city, with room to roam and a chance to out-think him, spidey could definitely take him. lock both in a small ring, spidey's going down, i think. at least for a good majority.

i'd like to see what a truly po'd spidey would do to the wrecker though, if he went completely ballistic, into that blurred-punching-and-dodging- mode. he might have enough to take out the wrecker a couple times, even at close quarters.

Originally posted by leonidas
personally, i think it depends largely on the setting. in a city, with room to roam and a chance to out-think him, spidey could definitely take him. lock both in a small ring, spidey's going down, i think. at least for a good majority.

i'd like to see what a truly po'd spidey would do to the wrecker though, if he went completely ballistic, into that blurred-punching-and-dodging- mode. he might have enough to take out the wrecker a couple times, even at close quarters. I'm sure Firlord could vouch for that...

Originally posted by Faceman
I'm sure Firlord could vouch for that...

That's what you think...

Originally posted by jasonk3
That's what you think... Address me as sir, when thou speaks to me..

Originally posted by Faceman
Address me as sir, when thou speaks to me..

Sir, Yes Sir.