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* peak Krayt
** novel Vitiate

Setting: Tatooine desert

Starting distance: 100 feet


Who wins?

Vitiate.

Krayt

Vitiate, no contest.

Vitiate destroys.

Krayt.

Honestly, Krayt got dis. No matter who you think is more powerful, Vitiate is too inept to win here.

Tell that to Revan.

BTW No nexus or prep time for Vitiate here

He's already pumping out Nihilus tier power a thousand years earlier, I doubt he needs it.

Krayt wins.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Tell that to Revan. Nexus-weakened Revan who put Vitiate on his ass?

Originally posted by Stigma
BTW No nexus or prep time for Vitiate here

Originally posted by AncientPower
He's already pumping out Nihilus tier power a thousand years earlier, I doubt he needs it.

On a nexus, with aid, and prep

Yeah, because a nexus he caused as a side effect of his power expressions is relevant to his personal power growth.

Originally posted by ILS
Nexus-weakened Revan who put Vitiate on his ass?

The only reason Revan ever managed that is because Vitiate tried to TP him, unaware that Revan could counter him.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Yeah, because a nexus he caused as a side effect of his power expressions is relevant to his personal power growth.



The only reason Revan ever managed that is because Vitiate tried to TP him, unaware that Revan could counter him.

Then he was completely unaware that Revan could redirect his lightning bolt, back at him knocking him down.

It's not helping your case.

Where on earth is this mans Precog, when he needs it.

He wasn't unaware, he just didn't erect strong enough barriers in time. You might want to remember that the Daughter did exactly the same thing with the Son's lightning and he didn't react fast enough either.

The Daughter and Son are meant to be equals, not so much the case with weakened Revan vs amped Vitiate.

Originally posted by AncientPower
He wasn't unaware, he just didn't erect strong enough barriers in time. You might want to remember that the Daughter did exactly the same thing with the Son's lightning and he didn't react fast enough either.

I like that answer.

Originally posted by ILS
The Daughter and Son are meant to be equals, not so much the case with weakened Revan vs amped Vitiate.

That might be a good point if Revan wasn't using a lightsaber to do the reflecting. Nor would reaction times count here when they're doing this in less than a second.

Krayt vs Revan is a better fight.

Krayt still loses though, to be honest.

There is a particular line of scaling that would heavily suggest SF Malak > Peak Krayt.

Pretty much.

Originally posted by AncientPower
That might be a good point if Revan wasn't using a lightsaber to do the reflecting. Nor would reaction times count here when they're doing this in less than a second.

Wut? That second sentence literally makes no sense lmao

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ


There is a particular line of scaling that would heavily suggest SF Malak > Peak Krayt.
Could you elaborate on that?

Vitiate solidly.

Originally posted by ILS
Honestly, Krayt got dis. No matter who you think is more powerful, Vitiate is too inept to win here.
How is Vitiate inept? He defeated Revan and T3-M4 in the same fight.

Plot twist: after Krayt dies; he is going to inhabit Vitiate's body and become at last a True Sith.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
How is Vitiate inept? He defeated Revan and T3-M4 in the same fight.

Originally posted by Stigma
Could you elaborate on that?

Essentially, there's a degree of relativity between Muur and Reborn Krayt, then there's quotes putting peak Kun massively above Muur, and a quote that puts SF Malak far above Kun. There's also a pretty solid implication that Malak shits on Muur that isn't dependent on the Kun quote.

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
How is Vitiate inept? He defeated Revan and T3-M4 in the same fight. This is my new favourite quote.

^^^

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
How is Vitiate inept? He defeated Revan and T3-M4 in the same fight.

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/AmpleHugeAbalone-max-1mb.gif

Originally posted by S_W_LeGenD
How is Vitiate inept? He defeated Revan and T3-M4 in the same fight.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Essentially, there's a degree of relativity between Muur and Reborn Krayt, then there's quotes putting peak Kun massively above Muur, and a quote that puts SF Malak far above Kun. There's also a pretty solid implication that Malak shits on Muur that isn't dependent on the Kun quote.

FFS Skillz, don't use the Kun quote. The guy who wrote it even admitted to bias for Malak.

I dont recall him admitting bias for Malak, just saying he stood by the quote.

He put his personal opinion in a blog. One I'm not inclined to entertain unless the Star Forge amp suddenly makes Malak Sheev tier.

It's published.

Which is great, unfortunately you need to put SF!Malak > Vitiate too if you want to play it that way.

Nah. Revan says he's never felt a being as powerful as Vitiate. Also, blurb on the back of the Novel.

Are you guys talking about the quote that suggests Malaks cybernetic jaw made him far more powerful than Kun?

The quote is legit. There was a huge debate about it.

And the quote is clearly hinting that the Star Forge is what made Malak far more powerful than Kun.

I know, and you were one of the people saying it isn't legit, lol.

No it isn't. Not sure what you think could possibly be hinting at that. Its posed in the form of a question at any rate, so we can pretty easily just say "no, it didn't give him those powers" and be done with it.

Yeah, I don't like the quote, but it's still a line of scaling that exists.

And no. The question/statement in and of itself is saying that Malak is far more powerful than Kun, the question is towards WHY is Malak far more powerful than Kun: cybernetics or something more sinister?



So the ambiguity isn't in whether or not Malak is far more powerful than Kun, but rather the source of that power.

No one has to take that quote seriously by the way. When Chee said that blurbs were licence to subjectivity, it gave a nice basis to throw out similar hypes that were "out of universe" despite their canonicity.

If you had an opinion of Kun or malak, and that opinion has been altered because Cory Hendon once wrote on his Wizard of the Coast blog that Malak was stronger, it tells me more about your own handling of source material than it does the two characters.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Nah. Revan says he's never felt a being as powerful as Vitiate. Also, blurb on the back of the Novel.

Kun > Vitiate is a thing in numerous higher sources though. Not to mention Kun stomps in any feats comparison whatsoever.

I guess Vitiate grew immensely from TOTJ to when Revan first confronted him.

In a span of fifty years, where we both know Vitiate went and split himself between his true body on Dromund Kaas and Valkorion on Zakuul. Given his millennia scale of power growth, I don't see Vitiate's growth surpassing the power Kun had over him, especially after Kun grew even more powerful through the most powerful Sith holocron in the mythos.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
I guess Vitiate grew immensely from TOTJ to when Revan first confronted him.

Or Skillz, the Wizards of the Coast author didn't factor in the possible implications of the SF Malak quote, due to his own poor analysis of the source material. Please remember this is the same person who claims that Malak's jaw cybernetic, a respiratory system, is a simple explanation for Malak's enhanced "powers" - what a retard.

Remind me again why we're clinging to this quote from a source that doesn't even exist in it's domain name anymore and could only be found in internet archives. Do you also have Bane > Vitiate ?

Well the evidence would be the quotes themselves.

Technically, Novel Vitiate > Revan Reborn > KOTOR Revan > SF Malak >> Kun >> earlier Kun > TOTJ Vitiate >>> Muur isn't explicitly contradicted. Incredulity has to set in at that point, though.

Originally posted by Conty
Do you also have Bane > Vitiate ?

No.

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
No.

Do you have TPM Mace Windu > Revan?

It was once written that Mace was the most powerful Jedi Master to walk the halls of the Jedi temple. It must be true right?

No.

All I said was that there is a line of scaling that would indicate SF Malak > Peak Krayt. It is a line of scaling that exists. Whether or not I actually buy it is another thing. Hence:

Originally posted by XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Incredulity has to set in at that point, though.

I don't buy it either, most people in this thread probably don't buy it. And that's all that need to be said about the matter. Krayt stomps.

Krayt gets stomped*

Vitiate > Nihilus > Krayt.

If he ain't stomping Wyyrlok or Muur, he ain't stomping Vitiate.

truth be told i'm undecided on the matter. Krayt's massive respect seems to come solely from the dubious events of apocalypse. If we're looking at feats during the Legacy time period, I don't put him much above Maul and maybe on par with Dooku.

Krayt's showings in Apocalypse aren't that groundbreaking. Basically he's shown that he can hurt a fraction of Abeloth with Luke's aid.

I do like that he made Jacen brown his shorts though.

Originally posted by AncientPower
Krayt gets stomped*

Vitiate > Nihilus > Krayt.

Didn't Nihilus eat more planets than Vitiate?

Shouldn't you have them at least equal?

Vitiate was confirmed to have been made more powerful than Meetra could imagine by the Ritual of Nathema. Then Vitiate grows more powerful for a thousand years.

Sure because of a few accolades.
*cough, cough*
Sheev logic.

I could see it going either way, though I lean Krayt.

mmm

Originally posted by AncientPower
Vitiate was confirmed to have been made more powerful than Meetra could imagine by the Ritual of Nathema.

Can you summarize your criteria for accepting some of these accolades and not others, assuming it isn't just "if it benefits the character I'm trying to wank"?

1.Authorial intent.
2.Consistency throughout source material.
3.Respective showings reflecting the claims.

It's rare for me to actually not abide by accolades, but things like Revan > Nihilus obviously are exempt.