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I just gotta get some oppinions on this matchup

the stage is Gokentou (Akuma's island in Alpha 2), Both contenders at their max, and if where using the CPU to gauge this fight, consider them at their highest difficulty. Story arguments as usual, canon only.

I like the matchup, but at max power, this is rigged. Grant simply can't beat Gouki at his current max. He could beat him at SFA2-SFA3 maybe. SF2 is dicey. And even on SFA, it's still 50/50. Grant is powerful, but his heart condition means he's probably gonna lose.

grant can never beat gouki, people lets face it.

Why are we even comparing the two?

i think you're being a bit fanboyish/fangirlish.

you're not giving me any reason to prove your point, hence the above statement of mine.
why can't grant be like akuma?
grant storywise is so powerful that his body is literally falling apart as the power he has managed to develop is *cough* beyond human. its kinda like Rugal who seld destructed because of overload or like bison in SFa3 where he blew up as the power from the psychodrive became too much for a flesh and blood body to contain.
so the power is indeed way too much and godly.

now please don't tell me that gouki doesn't blow up because his power is natural. that's not true. grant's power is natural too but due to his dedication he's taken it off the charts...which has resulted in his body being destroyed slowly. not to mention how grant simple causes the earth to shake by SIMPLY POWERING UP.
does akuma do that?
no.
oh but the shungoukusatsu, right?
that is a killing move. its got nothing that much to do with power.
-oh but akuma split ayres rock, right?
yeah but grant just shakes the goddamn earth by just powering up. who knows what he's capable of doing if he actually hits something after that.
could it mean that he>Gouki?
from the above....very ****ing likely if not 50/50.

enough gouki fanboyism from the capcom fans please. its getting irritating. other guys out there can very well own him. oro stalemated against him. Gen beat him. Gouken beat him in his younger days. Rugal is even shown beating him and throwing his body away (while no such thing is shown for akuma) even in CvsSNK. no...gouki is not invincible.

~Sado.

Originally posted by Sado22
i think you're being a bit fanboyish/fangirlish.

you're not giving me any reason to prove your point, hence the above statement of mine.
why can't grant be like akuma?
grant storywise is so powerful that his body is literally falling apart as the power he has managed to develop is *cough* beyond human. its kinda like Rugal who seld destructed because of overload or like bison in SFa3 where he blew up as the power from the psychodrive became too much for a flesh and blood body to contain.
so the power is indeed way too much and godly.

Please, snk has a habit of making fad bosses that end up getting tooled by regular main characters on a regular basis. Never mind that they are not welll established nor do they ever have descent feats. . I choose gouki because he has solid feats, is well established, and a instant kill. And bisons body is breaking down because he force fed it with psycho energy at an unnatural rate. Which explins why he's the only boss character with that problem.

Originally posted by Sado22

now please don't tell me that gouki doesn't blow up because his power is natural. that's not true. grant's power is natural too but due to his dedication he's taken it off the charts...which has resulted in his body being destroyed slowly. not to mention how grant simple causes the earth to shake by SIMPLY POWERING UP.
does akuma do that?
no.

What are you talking about, who cares if he doesn't cause an earth quake by powering up. That isn't a measure of power it's just Flashy show of power, big difference. Gen does neither of that and look how strong he is, hell he's on par with urien. A guy who can create fissures which cause magma to burst out the earth. And last I checked, when gouki goes in his horse stance, the earth shakes.

Originally posted by Sado22

oh but the shungoukusatsu, right?
that is a killing move. its got nothing that much to do with power.
-oh but akuma split ayres rock, right?
yeah but grant just shakes the goddamn earth by just powering up. who knows what he's capable of doing if he actually hits something after that.
could it mean that he>Gouki?
from the above....very ****ing likely if not 50/50.

LOL, so, your whle argument is based on him shaking the earth?!

Before you accuse people of being fanboys, please have a better argument. Gouki shakes the earth when he punches whilst holding back, Never mind shin gouki.


Originally posted by Sado22

enough gouki fanboyism from the capcom fans please. its getting irritating. other guys out there can very well own him. oro stalemated against him. Gen beat him. Gouken beat him in his younger days. Rugal is even shown beating him and throwing his body away (while no such thing is shown for akuma) even in CvsSNK. no...gouki is not invincible.

~Sado.

I don't even like gouki as much as oro or gen, i think your voting for grant out of spite. Rugal beating him is non-canon, he would rape rugal as well.

I am in agreement with asthar, there is no notable demonstration of grants full power... Nor is there anything he's done thats even come close to Akuma...

Shaking the Earth? other than the screen shaking (Which might be enough to rock a city) do you have proof that ETHER character actualy SHAKES THE ENTIRE PLANET? No... didn't think so... those are incredibly cheap arguments.

Akuma shatters islands, Ayers rock... and if you want to go the full monty, a planet busting asteroid... (Non canon as that is.) Grant hasn't even demonstratedf the ability to shatter anything more than bricks, the floor and some flesh and bone.

His body is rotting away due to his power, therefore he must be stronger than Akuma? Hold up... last time I checked, Akuma's body wasn't rotting away becuase his body changed once he accepted the Dark Hadou (The sharklike teeth, the fiery hair, the glowing red eyes... not quite human anymore) No, Akuma's demonstrated levels of power beyond anything Grant or tha majority of SNK fighters now.

Gen never beat him in the story.. Alpha 2 was their only meeting, and akuma won that... they never met in Alpha 3, because if what you just said is true, Gouki would be dead. Oro drew with him, but you'd better think hard as to why, Oro is a 150 year old mystical hermit that knows some pretty powerful martial arts, heck man, he did it single handed.

Your using Rugal as an Example?! your soking something illegal now, and that comment just confirmed it... Regular Rugal gets thorouly owned by gouki, there's no denying this. Rugals power as a regular human is very good, but nowhere near Gouki's level.

Ahem. Grant's deterioration is from a bullet close to his heart, not his power. Rugal is comparable to SFA Gouki, with Omega Rugal being comparable to Current Gouki.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Ahem. Grant's deterioration is from a bullet close to his heart, not his power.

Tell that to Sado, he's implying something else entirely...

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Rugal is comparable to SFA Gouki, with Omega Rugal being comparable to Current Gouki.

No, Rugal was never a match for anything exept maybe pre SF1 Gouki, and Omega is closer to SFA Gouki, the difference in power is too great to compare in any other way, since Omega has no real control over his power and dies, whereas Akuma is capable of frightenlngly powerful attacks without the risk of killing himself. More like Goentiz

Yo

your point?
the bison bit is true though and i know it already.


define what you mean by "established".

Akuma's solid feets are...destroying an island. splitting ayres rock in half. kicking the shit out of the submarine. impressive, yes i know they are (and akuma is there on my favorite list and NOT grant. just so that you'd know).
Grant's solid feats are powering up to insane levels that cause his body to break down. which is exactly what the case is. i think that is pretty damn impressive since his powerlevel is so much that it destorys him. akuma's level is still not so much that he'd go to bits now is it?
i just think that makes grant pretty much "inhuman" too just like gouki.

terry beating may also mean that Terry has become really great over the years........but of course you won't be convinced now would you if hugo survives shinshoryuken doesn't mean that shinshoryuken is NOT that great as people said it was. it just means that Hugo is too strong, right? but grant losing to terry doesn't mean terry is a powerful mofo. it just means grant isn't that strong. Bravo.


you don't think it shows grant's power? get real mang. by merely powering up he shakes the ground (brings Fist of the northstar to mind). it DOES show his power. you just don't seem to get it. standing there and powering up enough for the earth to tremble is pretty impressive and shows his powerlevel.
his power is so much that his body is shattering. i think it makes all the sense in the world if you see how akuma doesn't do either of the above two. i think it at least makes Grant noteworthy as someone who can make akuma run for his money. besides i do recall mentioning even on my site that akuma WOULD BEAT GRANT. i just don't think the power level is as different as you guys claim it to be.
akuma stomps the ground and shakes it, you're right here. my bad.

Also Grant did get shot near the heart but that has nothing to do with his body shattering (this isn't gungrave and anti-orcman bullets). his body shatters because of the inhuman strain on it due to him practiscing dark arts.



OF COURSE i don't think he shakes the whole damn planet.....come to think of it maybe the tsunami was because of grant.


making the "GROUND" tremble by simply powering up doesn't count, i'm sure right?


it could be due to Capcom wanting to get across the whole "evil look thing" too, right?
just cuz Iori's face becomes darkened and his breath shaky and his skin purplish and his teeth sharper doesn't mean his body can take the inhuman strain since he's coughing up blood ever other minute. it just shows that the orochi has totally consumed him just the way the dark arts have consumed him which is exactly what the case is.


stop right there. SFA3 has these two wanting to fight each other. Gen is seeking him out and they do fight (both their endings). also Gen fought him but spared him since Akuma spared his life the last time (Gen never lost. akuma noticed that the old man was dying and so left him. Gen simply considersh him the victor since akuma "spared" him. SFA3, Gen spared Akuma to return the favor. Gen also forgot about the whole "death match" thing by SFA3 which is why gouki isn't dead. get your facts straight). the victor is not disclosed by capcom of their fight in SFA3 but they gave a hint that it was Gen who won and tiamat even mentions that gen DID win based on this. so...yes, akuma lost.


i don't get your point here, darkstorm.
Rugal was schooling teh whole KoF95 cast all by himself till he self destructed and Kagura also confirmed that next year.
in Capcom vs SNK, gouki and Rugal are shown butting heads. now consider this:
-we see Rugal carrying a lifeless Akuma by the throat. Rugal is practically scratchless while akuma was literally dangling from Rugal's arm. once GOd Rugal starts his fight, he tosses Akuma away like rag doll as is pre fight intro.
-in "orochi akuma" you see Rugal thrusting his hand inside akuma's heart. Rugal is by no means life less as AKuma was in rugal's ending. also "orochi akuma" or whatever you call him, doesn't have such a prefight intro like Rugal's.

IMO capcom seems to give some pretty obvious hints there. but of course this won't convince you. so for now just offer a rebuttle to my "Rugal cleaning home with the KoF95 cast" thing.

the only reason you say akuma is stronger than Rugal is......nothing. you have nothing to say aside from "i like akuma". it translates through well too. akuma has lost many times himself hasn't he? according to darkstorm ryu beat him too (which of course isn't canon). however, for some reason, Rugal>>the whole KoF cast doesn't seem to compare. so what now....ryu>>the KoF cast.
get real peeps.

Originally posted by Sado22
Yo

your point?
the bison bit is true though and i know it already.

My point is inconsistentency and fad bosses will always be ranked lower than real bosses that are esatblished and have feats. Versus a boss who gets jobbed by the main character via plot device after plot device and doesn't even have any solid feats.



Originally posted by Sado22

define what you mean by "established".
Esatblished means a boss who has a history and a solid back story. Not some flashy guy they put just to woo people and ends up losing to the main character when everyone else failed. Also, I means priority in terms of plot


Originally posted by Sado22

Akuma's solid feets are...destroying an island. splitting ayres rock in half. kicking the shit out of the submarine. impressive, yes i know they are (and akuma is there on my favorite list and NOT grant. just so that you'd know).
Grant's solid feats are powering up to insane levels that cause his body to break down. which is exactly what the case is. i think that is pretty damn impressive since his powerlevel is so much that it destorys him. akuma's level is still not so much that he'd go to bits now is it?
i just think that makes grant pretty much "inhuman" too just like gouki.

Okay sado, if your going to post arguments like that then I shouldn't bother. Have you ever thought it's because the nature of grants power or that his body isn't strong enough. If the only reason you have for believing grants on par with gouki is because ohim shaking a stage and his body breaking down then your wasting my time.


Originally posted by Sado22

terry beating may also mean that Terry has become really great over the years........but of course you won't be convinced now would you if hugo survives shinshoryuken doesn't mean that shinshoryuken is NOT that great as people said it was. it just means that Hugo is too strong, right? but grant losing to terry doesn't mean terry is a powerful mofo. it just means grant isn't that strong. Bravo.


Lol, now your taking this out of context. when have I downplayed terry. I acknowledge geese, yamakazi, and orochi as bosses. Becuse unlike grant they have feats. And also, unlike snk, capcom doesn't have a habit of jobbing bosses left and right or making weaker characters beat well established strong characters.

Originally posted by Sado22

you don't think it shows grant's power? get real mang. by merely powering up he shakes the ground (brings Fist of the northstar to mind). it DOES show his power. you just don't seem to get it. standing there and powering up enough for the earth to tremble is pretty impressive and shows his powerlevel.
his power is so much that his body is shattering. i think it makes all the sense in the world if you see how akuma doesn't do either of the above two. i think it at least makes Grant noteworthy as someone who can make akuma run for his money. besides i do recall mentioning even on my site that akuma WOULD BEAT GRANT. i just don't think the power level is as different as you guys claim it to be.
akuma stomps the ground and shakes it, you're right here. my bad.


All your basically saying is that you think grant is as strong as gouki because he's flashyer. Like I told you before and I even gave you an example with gen. Here's another example, Vega is one of the strongest street fighters, despite being a guy with a claw. Flashy tricks =/= Power. Otherwise gill would dominate oro and gouki.

Yo emperor

oversimplification.
you're saying that just cuz someone's been around for longer and happen to beat more guys up (due to their higher timeline) means that they are better than those bosses who happen to come only once or twice.
from that logic, akuma>>Orochi too then, right? but he doesn't.


fair enough


okay okay let me break it down since both of us are failing to see each other's point. you with me? here goes:
grant's power level goes beyond what human body can sustain, hence the break down of his body. similar to Bison and Rugal. the power was too much for a mere humanbody to handle hence why they both blew up. it was beyond human limitations.
needless to say, rugal was terribly powerful. like it or not, he's probably one guy who can take out akuma, as was evident in his pounding the whole KoF95 cast all on his own. Bison, too, would also be too powerful hadn't his body blown up. if his power was measured somehow right-before-he-blew-up he would most definitely be stronger than gouki too since he was absorbing everyone's -ve power from the world over.
so from that logic, grant's power too since it caused a break down of his body means beyond human limitations. and further using that logic it means that his strength is in parr with Gouki's cuz Bison and Rugal's sure as hell was (akuma only managed to kill SF2 bison).
you get it now?
again, i'm not saying grant>gouki. i plainly stated on my site that akuma>grant. i just think grant is one of those characters who'd give akuma a really tough time.


no not really. i was actually referring to darkstorm and brainchild. not you. should've made it more obvious. sorry about that.


what is to say that gill wont dominate gouki and oro? you don't know that now do you? its basic speculation on your part. the way i see it, resurrection will take care of most of the problem right? but keeping that side...
my logic as to why grant is in parr with gouki is above. lot of it was because of my not so clear stating and for that i apologize. but at least i think you can probably see it from my point of view.
empathy is the key to LOVE & PEACE

see ya around. don't get so worked up by the way. its just a videogame. no need to go all "shungoukusatsu" on me no matter how "weird" i may come across as


see ya around dude.
~Sado.
P.S. who is that girl in your signature?

Akuma beats him to death. Terry is said to have beaten Grant. Does Terry make the ground shake? Grant seems to have more power than HIS body can take. Also even though CVS2 ain't canon, I'll speak on it because it was mentioned. Rugal is revealed to be too weak to handle Akuma's power & his body is consumed by it. Akuma's body seems to be capable of handeling all types of s**t. Some people control power better than others. Grant seems to have a weak body for some reason, perhaps the shot.

Which Gouki are we using or is this Gouki in general? I wonder if a comet was coming toward the earth, what would Grant do to stop it or would he avoid it?

Originally posted by Sado22
Yo emperor

oversimplification.
you're saying that just cuz someone's been around for longer and happen to beat more guys up (due to their higher timeline) means that they are better than those bosses who happen to come only once or twice.
from that logic, akuma>>Orochi too then, right? but he doesn't.

No, I'm saying someone who's been around longer, has solid feats, A sold backstory, And more experience wins. The only argument you have so far is about grant being able to shake the ground




Originally posted by Sado22

okay okay let me break it down since both of us are failing to see each other's point. you with me? here goes:
grant's power level goes beyond what human body can sustain, hence the break down of his body. similar to Bison and Rugal. the power was too much for a mere humanbody to handle hence why they both blew up. it was beyond human limitations.
needless to say, rugal was terribly powerful. like it or not, he's probably one guy who can take out akuma, as was evident in his pounding the whole KoF95 cast all on his own. Bison, too, would also be too powerful hadn't his body blown up. if his power was measured somehow right-before-he-blew-up he would most definitely be stronger than gouki too since he was absorbing everyone's -ve power from the world over.
so from that logic, grant's power too since it caused a break down of his body means beyond human limitations. and further using that logic it means that his strength is in parr with Gouki's cuz Bison and Rugal's sure as hell was (akuma only managed to kill SF2 bison).
you get it now?
again, i'm not saying grant>gouki. i plainly stated on my site that akuma>grant. i just think grant is one of those characters who'd give akuma a really tough time.

I got the very first time you posted and again just because a character is flashy doesn't mean he's powerful. Your whole argument so far has been about grants body. I already gave you an example as to why your logic is flawed.When you start giving me reasons as to why grant will win other then how his body is falling apart then we can continue this.Using yyour logic, I guess grant is stronger than orochi because his body is falling apart?



Originally posted by Sado22

what is to say that gill wont dominate gouki and oro? you don't know that now do you? its basic speculation on your part. the way i see it, resurrection will take care of most of the problem right? but keeping that side...
my logic as to why grant is in parr with gouki is above. lot of it was because of my not so clear stating and for that i apologize. but at least i think you can probably see it from my point of view.
empathy is the key to LOVE & PEACE

see ya around. don't get so worked up by the way. its just a videogame. no need to go all "shungoukusatsu" on me no matter how "weird" i may come across as


see ya around dude.
~Sado.
P.S. who is that girl in your signature?

Speculation, Both oro and gouki hold back yet are top tier fighters . Once they release their full power it's easy to see who will dominate.
And ressurection isn't an attack, just becuase he can come back from the dead doesn't mean he will beat them.


The person on my sig is Ms.Josephine Baker,btw.

hmmm.....oh well whatever. you just getting it.
even using logic and comparing him rugal and bison isn't enough for you. so its best we leave it at that. after all that i just don't see why you don't understand...unless you don't want to, to begin with which i believe is the case. lets leave it at that.


so basically he can come back from anything akuma and onearmed freak are gonna throw at him.


orochi=divine creature
grant=normal human being
do the math, sherlock



doesn't that mean that MAYBE terry has gotten really strong since he's survived godtiers before too.
of course not.
but of course, hugo surviving shinshoryuken doesn't mean ryu's weak. it just means that hugo is too strong. so if terry beats someone....he just happens to be weak.
get real


okay *tosses cap* thanks for that.

well i'll see you guys around.
~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
hmmm.....oh well whatever. you just getting it.
even using logic and comparing him rugal and bison isn't enough for you. so its best we leave it at that. after all that i just don't see why you don't understand...unless you don't want to, to begin with which i believe is the case. lets leave it at that.


You don't get it, comparing characters based on looks, status, or tidbits isn't how we debate in game versus. Using your logic, I can say blanka is stronger than vega because he's green and can shocks people. It's a shallow way of debating characters.


Originally posted by Sado22

so basically he can come back from anything akuma and onearmed freak are gonna throw at him.
Just to get his ass handed to him again, andI don't think he can come back from decapitation or being split into tiny pieces.


Originally posted by Sado22

orochi=divine creature
grant=normal human being
do the math, sherlock


Right, divine creature who gets beaten by humans. A title doesn't mean much in battles.

Originally posted by Sado22

doesn't that mean that MAYBE terry has gotten really strong since he's survived godtiers before too.
of course not.
but of course, hugo surviving shinshoryuken doesn't mean ryu's weak. it just means that hugo is too strong. so if terry beats someone....he just happens to be weak.
get real

Or maybe snk made terry win because grant s nothing but a jobber boss which snk makes for the games convienence. Example: Igniz, defeats the entire kof cast, yet loses to kyo, iori, and K.

So, going by that kyo, iori, and K>Igniz>Kof 2001 cast.

And your example with ryu isn't helping, yes, hugo survived ryu's strongest attack (Despite that being unconfirmed) does that mean he was fine afterwards? The point is we don't know,hell that blow could have been the deciding factor in that fight.

Originally posted by Sado22
doesn't that mean that MAYBE terry has gotten really strong since he's survived godtiers before too.
of course not.
but of course, hugo surviving shinshoryuken doesn't mean ryu's weak. it just means that hugo is too strong. so if terry beats someone....he just happens to be weak.
get real Never miss an opportunity to trash Ryu huh man? Nobody's implying that Terry's weak or that he only can beat weak people. Do hardcore Terry fans have some sort of persecution complex or something? My post was trying to stress that ground shaking isn't as impressive to the rest of us. If ground shaking was all that tough how can Terry (who doesn't shake the ground) beat Grant(who obviously is the toughest guy ever because he makes the ground shake)?

don't forget grants mask, I'm sure that put s grant on par with shin gouki.

This could be a case similar to Gen. I'm going out on a limb with this, so bear with me. Grant has a bullet imbedded in his chest very close to his heart. He was shot defending Kain. The bullet affected his motor skills and abilities. And eventually, it will kill him. Soooo, how powerful would he be without that handicap?

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
This could be a case similar to Gen. I'm going out on a limb with this, so bear with me. Grant has a bullet imbedded in his chest very close to his heart. He was shot defending Kain. The bullet affected his motor skills and abilities. And eventually, it will kill him. Soooo, how powerful would he be without that handicap?

Yeah.But, he's not fighting with out it in this particular match.

back at you actually.
i am telling you that grant powering up to insane levels that causes his body to break down JUST LIKE BISON AND RUGAL. Those two were VERY powerful weren't they. according to you, bison owns Geese.
but all this is apparently not enough to convince you....why? cuz that's just part of some random flashiness. that never counts for some reason.
so from YOUR logic, akuma owns everyone cuz he has an instant kill move and has been around for longer.
ok so....
Iori owns everyone cuz he has a killing move (8 maiden shrine SDM) and has been around since KoF95. but does he. no. Orochi Iori was defeated by ash.
or
Akira from virtua fighters owns every one cuz HE has a killing move (whatever the hell that is called) and has been around since VF1. but does he. no. Akira was defeated by Kagemaru in VF1.

oh heck, Akuma was defeated by Gouken, Gen, stalemated with Oro (though oro has no instant kill moves). so from that logic, ryu will never be that great cuz he can't kill anyone....but maybe he has a chance cuz he was around since SF1.

instant kill doesn't mean he'll win a fight. cuz, oh wait, akuma has been defeated. and if he's been defeated by these fighters (who are beyond human limiations) then why is grant out of question....at least a tough fight?
oh wait. you don't have answer.
the only answers is: i like akuma. he's been around for longer and he can split ayres rock in half. he owns everyone SNK can produce because err...i like akuma, akuma can split ayres rock in half....oh oh oh and akuma has developed more because....i like akuma.

my answer is:
someone who's powered up to insane levels, just like Rugal and Bison, makes him like beyond human, and with accelerated motor skills to add to that which again makes him beyond human limitations (think mitsoumi from tenjou tenge). oh wait, akuma is beyond human too. so maybe.....just ****in maybe....akuma and grant can have a pretty good fight. BUT i think akuma>grant.

Do you get it now....or do i have to draw it out in crayons on a black board


of course not
besides isn't it always more entertaining to throw random jabs in an argument for the sake of fun.

kinda like you and how you dont get off my ass with the ground shake bit!
i didn't use that factor as THE REASON why grant could give akuma a run for his money. the factor however was the "body shattering" which you conviniently ignore. however you use it against me cuz its a jab
see...fun


can't say that now can you? cuz you don't know. none of us do. if you say he can't i could very well say he can.....you know why? its cuz we are speculating.
just like me "speculating" that with advanced power and motor skills and a body that is so powered up its actually shattering grant might give akuma a fight.


.........obviously cause kyo and iori's flames are DESIGNED to take him out, genius.

yagami flames=neutralize
kusanagi flames=seal
yata powers=lock away

makes sense to you? *crosses fingers*


ignitz didn't beat the entire cast.
K', Iori and K' took him out cuz they are powerful.
oh but its a redundant argument, ins't it?

so if i'm getting it, you're points are:

-akuma is powerful cuz he can do supernatural feets (needless to say powering up to inhuman levels and having your motor skills accerlated isn't part of being supernatural. that's just jobber status).
-rugal is not=akuma cuz rugal self destructed despite pounding the whole Kof cast.
-orochi is not=akuma cuz orochi happened to be sealed away by flames that are SPECIALLY designed to seal him. what a weakling.
-Ignitz isn't so strong cuz, oh wait, he lost to Kyo, Iori and k's flames which happened to be such that sealed away divine powers. oh right. perfect sense.
-resurrecting from the dead is not similar to resurrecting from being decapitated. that's totally different.
-ryu is powerful cuz he failed to KO midtier Hugo with his strongest move.


well, Orochi>>entire cast of 97
Iori and Kyo and Chizuru>>Orochi (with their respective specially designed powers) does not mean they own the entire cast. the only reason Orochi kicked the shit out of everyone else was because their powers werent designed for working on him with the effect that Iori and kYo and kagura have. plain and simple logic.


what is to say he got up and beat Ryu. you gonna convince me he didn't without any canon facst.
Canonwise, all capcom said was that hugo was not felled by a direct shinshoryuken.


funny
but of course we know that gouki>>everyone in the fightingworld universe cuz he has developed over the years.
oh and grant's mask is pretty badass. better than the "anal beads" akuma wears around his neck

to conclude.......we both have typed too much since yesterday
damn my fingers hurt like hell. i bet yours do too.

do ryu fans always think he is the strongest just cuz he couldn't KO someone who isn't even godtier? you answer that

Weird, but you should know the answer better than me. Ryu didn't even make my top ten I'll put my list up if I can ever get it 2 look right

look forward to that
so whos the top. Iori? Kyo? oh yeah, of course, TERRY!


if i knew the answer to the question i asked you i wouldn't be asking it now would i? i'm confused. people always seem to retort to my comment that ryu is THAT strong since he couldn't KO hugo. for some reason that always presses buttons and the reaction i get is the same from what i got from you, darkstrom, and emperor:
Hugo is very powerful.

however, if Ryu would've beaten akuma then that would mean that ryu is VERY powerful. But if Kyo and Iori beat Orochi...then Orochi is weak. that is the logic of SF fans that always pisses me off.

even though i've been playing street fighter since i was 6-7 years old and also say it was the one that started it i don't take its characters and call them godtiers while others from different videogames are barely able to compete with them.

another thing that pisses me off:

SF fanboy: man every videogame rips off street fighter. kazuya rips of Ryu with his EGWF and his rising sun (the spinning four jump kicks). Kyo rips off Ryu with the shoryuken. Ryo is a ryu wanna be. Akira wear clothes like Ryu.

Sado: hey wait! so if that is the case then Capcom rips off their own design more than anyone else! Sakura, ken, akuma, sagat, allen, kairi, sean, dan all do Ryu's moves or just vairiations of it. heck even Dante from DMC does the tatsumakisenpuukyaku.

Sf fanboy: err...um....err....um.....no but that's different. Sakura's moves have different priority. ken is not as strong. gouki sends him in the air.

Sado: yeah, but the move is still the same isn't it.

SF fanboy: no but the priority.

Sado: so how can you say Kazuya rips off Ryu then? his EGWF is totally different!

SF fanboy:...........*starts crying*

get my meaning? its irritating as hell.
SF fanboys are the most annoying thing on the face of this planet.

chao dude....and show me that list of your's once you actually get it up.
~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
back at you actually.
i am telling you that grant powering up to insane levels that causes his body to break down JUST LIKE BISON AND RUGAL. Those two were VERY powerful weren't they. according to you, bison owns Geese.
but all this is apparently not enough to convince you....why? cuz that's just part of some random flashiness. that never counts for some reason.
so from YOUR logic, akuma owns everyone cuz he has an instant kill move and has been around for longer.

No, he owns people because he has feats to compare, versus using your logic where grant's on par with gouki because he makes the earth shake.Daimon makes the earth shake, I guess he's god tier right.And bison own's geese because he has better feats.When you start debating uisng feats versus appearence, you will have a point.


Originally posted by Sado22

ok so....
Iori owns everyone cuz he has a killing move (8 maiden shrine SDM) and has been around since KoF95. but does he. no. Orochi Iori was defeated by ash.
or
Akira from virtua fighters owns every one cuz HE has a killing move (whatever the hell that is called) and has been around since VF1. but does he. no. Akira was defeated by Kagemaru in VF1.

Too bad that's not what I said, I said gouki wins because he has a move that can kill you instantly storyline wise, maiden masher does not do that.And Ash beat Orochi Iori because snk has a habit oif making weaker characters dominate stronger characters often or just because they are the main character.


Originally posted by Sado22

oh heck, Akuma was defeated by Gouken, Gen, stalemated with Oro (though oro has no instant kill moves). so from that logic, ryu will never be that great cuz he can't kill anyone....but maybe he has a chance cuz he was around since SF1.

LOL, first of all he could have killed gen but choose not to because gen was sick. He wasn't fighting at full power against oro, and he lost to gouken a long time ago.


Originally posted by Sado22

instant kill doesn't mean he'll win a fight. cuz, oh wait, akuma has been defeated. and if he's been defeated by these fighters (who are beyond human limiations) then why is grant out of question....at least a tough fight?
oh wait. you don't have answer.

Defeated by whom, who beat gouki? Gouken once, wwow. And he won't win just because he has an instant kill, he'll win because he has feats versus your nly argument that pertains to earth shaking. . .weak.

Originally posted by Sado22

the only answers is: i like akuma. he's been around for longer and he can split ayres rock in half. he owns everyone SNK can produce because err...i like akuma, akuma can split ayres rock in half....oh oh oh and akuma has developed more because....i like akuma.

He's more developed, has area effecting moves (Kongoukuretsuzan), Is more durable (Survived 300 meters underwater), Sunk and island with a punnch and has more experience bversus earth shaking.


Originally posted by Sado22

my answer is:
someone who's powered up to insane levels, just like Rugal and Bison, makes him like beyond human, and with accelerated motor skills to add to that which again makes him beyond human limitations (think mitsoumi from tenjou tenge). oh wait, akuma is beyond human too. so maybe.....just ****in maybe....akuma and grant can have a pretty good fight. BUT i think akuma>grant.

Do you get it now....or do i have to draw it out in crayons on a black board

Going by titles is your only argument, "Grantz beyond human so he's God" LOL. When you actually formulate an argument I'll be here, because You keep bringing bison into this and I told you before that the state his body doesn't mean he's god. Bison was a boss before the plot device known as the psycho drive came into exsistence.


of course not
besides isn't it always more entertaining to throw random jabs in an argument for the sake of fun.


Originally posted by Sado22

can't say that now can you? cuz you don't know. none of us do. if you say he can't i could very well say he can.....you know why? its cuz we are speculating.
just like me "speculating" that with advanced power and motor skills and a body that is so powered up its actually shattering grant might give akuma a fight.

So, your giving him an ability based on speculation, lol. And if gill could regenerate he would not need back up bodies.

Originally posted by Sado22

.........obviously cause kyo and iori's flames are DESIGNED to take him out, genius.

yagami flames=neutralize
kusanagi flames=seal
yata powers=lock away

makes sense to you? *crosses fingers*

Right, A plot device. Just like justice flame was able to jobb igniz.

Originally posted by Sado22

ignitz didn't beat the entire cast.
K', Iori and K' took him out cuz they are powerful.
oh but its a redundant argument, ins't it?

Yeah, he did beat the enitre cast, and k,kyo, and Iori beat him because igniz is a jobber. Prior to working together they were floored like everyone else before they got up and plot device.


Originally posted by Sado22

so if i'm getting it, you're points are:

-akuma is powerful cuz he can do supernatural feets (needless to say powering up to inhuman levels and having your motor skills accerlated isn't part of being supernatural. that's just jobber status).
-rugal is not=akuma cuz rugal self destructed despite pounding the whole Kof cast.
-orochi is not=akuma cuz orochi happened to be sealed away by flames that are SPECIALLY designed to seal him. what a weakling.
-Ignitz isn't so strong cuz, oh wait, he lost to Kyo, Iori and k's flames which happened to be such that sealed away divine powers. oh right. perfect sense.
-resurrecting from the dead is not similar to resurrecting from being decapitated. that's totally different.
-ryu is powerful cuz he failed to KO midtier Hugo with his strongest move.


No, more like:


-Gouki is powerful because he has feats to back up his actions, being beyond human has no merit here only his feats count. And the guy can sink islands, split ayers rock, and has an instant kill vs earth shaking.

-No, rugal is not = to gouki because he loses to kyo.

-Orochi is stronger thank gouki, he's a very well established character, solid feats, and back story.

-Actually it, was chizuru, kyo, and iori via plot device. And somehow orochi Iori who was able to choke orochi loses to ash crimson, LOL.


Originally posted by Sado22

well, Orochi>>entire cast of 97
Iori and Kyo and Chizuru>>Orochi (with their respective specially designed powers) does not mean they own the entire cast. the only reason Orochi kicked the shit out of everyone else was because their powers werent designed for working on him with the effect that Iori and kYo and kagura have. plain and simple logic.
And how does that explain igniz,rugal, and the other bosses? Bottom line is the bosses are jobbers with no feats except being beyond human and flashy powers.

Originally posted by Sado22

what is to say he got up and beat Ryu. you gonna convince me he didn't without any canon facst.
Canonwise, all capcom said was that hugo was not felled by a direct shinshoryuken.

Um, ryu was disqualified by oro. He beat hugo, I can link you to a plot guide which tellds you who fought who in sf3.

Originally posted by Sado22

funny
but of course we know that gouki>>everyone in the fightingworld universe cuz he has developed over the years.
oh and grant's mask is pretty badass. better than the "anal beads" akuma wears around his neck

Yeah, we all know snk and there well established god bosses who lose to kyo and iori can beat gouki, LOL.
Originally posted by Sado22

to conclude.......we both have typed too much since yesterday
damn my fingers hurt like hell. i bet yours do too.

do ryu fans always think he is the strongest just cuz he couldn't KO someone who isn't even godtier? you answer that

Ryu beat hugo, and the shin-shoryuken thing is unconfirmed.

Originally posted by Sado22
look forward to that
so whos the top. Iori? Kyo? oh yeah, of course, TERRY!


if i knew the answer to the question i asked you i wouldn't be asking it now would i? i'm confused. people always seem to retort to my comment that ryu is THAT strong since he couldn't KO hugo. for some reason that always presses buttons and the reaction i get is the same from what i got from you, darkstrom, and emperor:
Hugo is very powerful.

For the last time, Ryu beat hugo. He just didn't do it with one Shin-Shoryu-Ken.


Originally posted by Sado22

however, if Ryu would've beaten akuma then that would mean that ryu is VERY powerful. But if Kyo and Iori beat Orochi...then Orochi is weak. that is the logic of SF fans that always pisses me off.

Whoever told you orochi is weak is crazy, he's very overrated in this very board by the very people you call fannboys. Unlike the other bosses, orochi isn't a jobber that exsist to make Iori and kyo look COOL


Originally posted by Sado22

even though i've been playing street fighter since i was 6-7 years old and also say it was the one that started it i don't take its characters and call them godtiers while others from different videogames are barely able to compete with them.

That's hypocritical, your qucik to call grant,rugal, and igniz godtier despite them having zero feats. When snk starts maintaining there hieracrhy, you will have a point.


Originally posted by Sado22

another thing that pisses me off:

SF fanboy: man every videogame rips off street fighter. kazuya rips of Ryu with his EGWF and his rising sun (the spinning four jump kicks). Kyo rips off Ryu with the shoryuken. Ryo is a ryu wanna be. Akira wear clothes like Ryu.

Sado: hey wait! so if that is the case then Capcom rips off their own design more than anyone else! Sakura, ken, akuma, sagat, allen, kairi, sean, dan all do Ryu's moves or just vairiations of it. heck even Dante from DMC does the tatsumakisenpuukyaku.

Sf fanboy: err...um....err....um.....no but that's different. Sakura's moves have different priority. ken is not as strong. gouki sends him in the air.

Sado: yeah, but the move is still the same isn't it.

SF fanboy: no but the priority.

Sado: so how can you say Kazuya rips off Ryu then? his EGWF is totally different!

SF fanboy:...........*starts crying*

get my meaning? its irritating as hell.
SF fanboys are the most annoying thing on the face of this planet.

chao dude....and show me that list of your's once you actually get it up.
~Sado

LOL, Kairi and allen are not capcom characters. Street fighter EX was made by a company called "Akira". Those characters are not licensed by capcom.

And you can't rip off your own design, that makes no sense. The design is yours using it on different characters isn't ripping off it's more like recycling. Bottom line is Rising uppercuts, tornado kicks, and two handed fireballs being used by karate-ka's were made famous by capcom.

You have a gripe with street Fighter fans, But, like it or not they are pioneers.

Originally posted by Sado22

OF COURSE i don't think he shakes the whole damn planet.....come to think of it maybe the tsunami was because of grant.

then why are you using this as a point when Akuma does the exact same thing?

Originally posted by Sado22
making the "GROUND" tremble by simply powering up doesn't count, i'm sure right?

See above, your point is mute since Akuma does the same thing with a stomp, Power or not (Notice how soimetimes Akuma's horse stance has no energy around it? well the earth still shakes...)

Originally posted by Sado22
it could be due to Capcom wanting to get across the whole "evil look thing" too, right?
just cuz Iori's face becomes darkened and his breath shaky and his skin purplish and his teeth sharper doesn't mean his body can take the inhuman strain since he's coughing up blood ever other minute. it just shows that the orochi has totally consumed him just the way the dark arts have consumed him which is exactly what the case is.

Yes, but Akuma's not coughing up blood, weakening due to his own power, or decaying at an advanced rate, despite displaying much higher levels of power more regularly.

Originally posted by Sado22
stop right there. SFA3 has these two wanting to fight each other. Gen is seeking him out and they do fight (both their endings). also Gen fought him but spared him since Akuma spared his life the last time (Gen never lost. akuma noticed that the old man was dying and so left him. Gen simply considersh him the victor since akuma "spared" him. SFA3, Gen spared Akuma to return the favor. Gen also forgot about the whole "death match" thing by SFA3 which is why gouki isn't dead. get your facts straight). the victor is not disclosed by capcom of their fight in SFA3 but they gave a hint that it was Gen who won and tiamat even mentions that gen DID win based on this. so...yes, akuma lost.

So, the Alpha 3 fight is pure conjecture on Tiamats part? Why, yes it is... Even though these two probably would have fought, has it crossed your mind that Akuma may have won that fight, and spared Gen a second time? You have to PROVE CONCLUSIVELY that it happened the way you claim it happens for it to be accepted as fact.

Originally posted by Sado22
i don't get your point here, darkstorm.
Rugal was schooling teh whole KoF95 cast all by himself till he self destructed and Kagura also confirmed that next year.
in Capcom vs SNK, gouki and Rugal are shown butting heads. now consider this:
-we see Rugal carrying a lifeless Akuma by the throat. Rugal is practically scratchless while akuma was literally dangling from Rugal's arm. once GOd Rugal starts his fight, he tosses Akuma away like rag doll as is pre fight intro.
-in "orochi akuma" you see Rugal thrusting his hand inside akuma's heart. Rugal is by no means life less as AKuma was in rugal's ending. also "orochi akuma" or whatever you call him, doesn't have such a prefight intro like Rugal's.

Your debating solely Omega there, I said, Regular Rugal is about as strong as Pre SF1 Gouki, which is still pretty strong. while Omega is about as strong as Alpha 2 Akuma, Lets examine that, Rugal, while having absolutely no control over his power, self detonated, releasing all of his body's power at once in an omnidirectional attack, it was enough to blow up a base... Akuma, destroyed an island with a single focused punch, not quite everything, and he ws already beaten by Ryu, but it's still a little stronger than Omega's highest showing. God Rugal is about on par with current Akuma / Shin Akuma.

Ah, the interpretation of a non-canon games opening animations, read the damn story, Rugal was the only one planning to combine the two powers, Akuma only wanted to fight. God Rugals into sequence is only to show off his new powers (Freshly aquired from Akuma), and it shows his more vicious streak, that all, no greater power levels, AND, Akuma was shaking the place up in his transformatiuon sequence is that an excuse? no...

Originally posted by Sado22
IMO capcom seems to give some pretty obvious hints there. but of course this won't convince you. so for now just offer a rebuttle to my "Rugal cleaning home with the KoF95 cast" thing.

Already did, Rugals biggest feat was blowing himself up..... How powerful...

Originally posted by Sado22
the only reason you say akuma is stronger than Rugal is......nothing. you have nothing to say aside from "i like akuma". it translates through well too. akuma has lost many times himself hasn't he? according to darkstorm ryu beat him too (which of course isn't canon). however, for some reason, Rugal>>the whole KoF cast doesn't seem to compare. so what now....ryu>>the KoF cast.
get real peeps.

..... You just insulted me..... Ok, you've now struck a bad cord with me... This? This coming from the SNK Biased Sado... All you've offered in terms of a debate, is less than circumatancial evidence that isn't supported by anything official let alone fact. you've used Taimat's oppinion and conjecture, "Grant shakes the Earth by powering up, therefore he wins" and "Rugal had a better intro sequence, therefore he wins" are not debate winning arguments, in fact, they have no actual bareing on the case, since one is exactly the same as Akuma's demonstration, and the other is not based on anything concrete.

All you've said, basically amounts to you licking your keyboard and hoping words fall out... Your arguments are tactless, and reek of a Bias oppinion, and you have the gall to accuse me of being a Fanboy. Alpha 2 Ryu did beat him, that was one of the Alpha series major events, thats where he learns about the Dark Hadou, where,s your evidence to the contrary? and lets not forget that Akuma was holding back.

Oh and while we're on the subject, where has Akuma lost, besides your Gen theory?

And I never said Ryu>KOF95 on his own, no fighter owns any KOF on their own, not even the bosses, consdieringthey still get jobbed in the end, even Rugal.


One last thing, just because one character beats another in story, does not mean they can do it regularly or without PIS, and if all the chips are down, if both fighters arn't holding back, the results may have been very different that what trnaspires in a fighting game story most of the time. Alot of matches are rigged by the story to make the stronger characters lose, does this affect their strength? no... Ryu's lost a number of times, I admit this, Bison's lost his life twice, does that make him weak? No.... Hell man, Sagat lost to DAN for christ sake, does that mean Dan's stronger than Sagat? not a damn chance... Sado, W/L records do not accurately show a characters strength, Feats and demonstrated abilities do.

I hate arguing to the point of flaming, I really do, I do my best to defuse flames when I see them, but when someone insults me, I will let the instigator know it.

No need for apologies. It's obvious Sado was asking for it. Every Boss in the history of KOF has been absurdly powerful and beaten through both plot device and apparent PIS. I personally exclude the entire NESTS saga from that opinion, as I consider them losers and dirtying the name of KOF, but take what you will.

First off, who's to say Rugal self-destructing isn't PIS? Also, there's speculation that Rugal isn't dead.


2nd, NEVER compare any other boss in KOF with Orochi. Orochi is a full god and unkillable. He's completely invulnerable except for the fore-mentioned plot device. I agree that it doesn't show off how powerful Kyo&Iori are, because it's a plot device win.


3rd, I'll give you Sado, that Igniz got jobbed by the justice flame. But everyone hates Igniz anyway, so it's not as big a deal. IMO, almost nothing in the NESTS saga should count as canon.


4th, you are a complete idiot to compare Ryu and Sagat's style and call them similar. You had a case with Sean, Sakura and the shotokans, but putting Dan in that category? He was kicked out of Shotokan. And if alot of people use a style, I dunno, maybe it's because, IT WORKS?! Sagat and Ryu both have upper cuts, and fireballs. Ouuu, what a concept. Which is more rare in Street fighter, fighters with a projectile attack, or fighters without them? The latter.

5th, Gen is dead, canon-wise. So no more half-assed theories about Gouki losing. Gen still had his vendetta and death wish in SFA3, and if you're trying to cite Gen's ending as canon, then you lack comprehension of the term 'canon'.

6th, your arguements on Grant being among the top guys in the SNK fighting universe are insane. The only boss guy Grant could beat is Krizalid and maybe Clone Zero. You should have also stipulated that the bullet in his heart was out, then he might have a prayer in hell. And even then it would only be against SFA Gouki. Gouki has destroyed islands, killed Gill, killed Bison, smashed comets and drawn even with Oro.



Last thing. Rugal self-destructing was plot device/PIS IMO. Thus, I consider Rugal the strongest boss besides Goenitz and Orochi.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
First off, who's to say Rugal self-destructing isn't PIS? Also, there's speculation that Rugal isn't dead.

Last thing. Rugal self-destructing was plot device/PIS IMO. Thus, I consider Rugal the strongest boss besides Goenitz and Orochi.

Heh, I never said it wasn't PIS, if fact, other than the Kryptonite flames, thats probably the biggest case of PIS in all of KOF.

But, Sado used it as an example of Rugals power, so... he technically opened the door, PLUS, he used the CVS2 Boss intro screens as an argument, the worst Copout I have ever seen on these forums... That steamed me quite a bit, and not because Rugal looked better (I personally like Rugal a whole lot), but because it is an incredibly vague and inane argument that can never be taken literally, plus it's circumstantial.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
no fighter owns any KOF on their own, not even the bosses Pyron and Jedah can, they can pretty much destroy everybody in SF too.

They arn't Street Fighters Remo, their Dark Stalkers, big difference (Actually VERY big)

Pyron eats stars as his day job. No duh he pwns KOF and SF. Same problem with Jedah and more than half the DS cast.

Seriously, what are Grant's feats, besides living after being shot in the heart?

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
They arn't Street Fighters Remo, their Dark Stalkers, big difference (Actually VERY big) Yeah but you said, "no fighter owns any KOF on their own, not even the bosses". I thought you meant fighting game characters in general not being able to beat KOF on their own, not just SF. My bad.

Ryu never beat gouki, btw. And why are you using events from alpha 3 as conjecture sado. That game should never be taken seriously in terms of canon.

Heh, What I meant was either any single Street Fighter or KOF, unless it's a singles tournament.

If Darkstalkers where thrown into that equasion, then we've gotta deal with heaps of different characters like Red Arremer and Goddess Athena and all sorts of nasty stuff, we lose focus of the original meaning of the thread that way, heck we could even lose sight of the fighting game characters and focus on simply what we consider to be the most powerful, which could for all intents and purposes may be a version of a character thats not in a fighting game (Red Arremeer for example could simply single hit kill everything by flying into them like he did in the G&G sreies...

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
Ryu never beat goukibtw.

Gouki was holding back, but that doesn't make it any less of a victory for Ryu, unless your claiming that the Alpha 2 fight never happened, in which case I ask you to explain to me how such an important event is non canon, considering that at least 2 other Alpha 2 events are a direct result of that event, and the fact that Akuma's Island sinking is still canon.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Gouki was holding back, but that doesn't make it any less of a victory for Ryu, unless your claiming that the Alpha 2 fight never happened, in which case I ask you to explain to me how such an important event is non canon, considering that at least 2 other Alpha 2 events are a direct result of that event, and the fact that Akuma's Island sinking is still canon.

I'm not claiming alpha 2 endings are not canon, all the endings in alpha 2 are canon with the exception of charlie's. What happened was gouki, whilst holding back fought ryu. But, on his own will ended the fight because he sensed ryu had satsu no hadou. He told him to developed it and all his previous fights will seeem like childsplay, then sunk goukentou. there was no winner, gouki spared ryu actually.

http://www.vgmuseum.com/end/arcade/a/sfa2ryu.htm

I suppose thats a more logical interpretation, my thesis was due to the fact that Akuma had smoke coming out of his mouth, indicating some damage...

Of course this may just be a mis-interpretation.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
I suppose thats a more logical interpretation, my thesis was due to the fact that Akuma had smoke coming out of his mouth, indicating some damage...

Of course this may just be a mis-interpretation.

Gouki always has smoke coming out his mouth, the alpha 2 poster showed the same thing.

it was the only time you see it in the game though, and it looked like actual smoke rather than steam.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
it was the only time you see it in the game though, and it looked like actual smoke rather than steam.

I know, But iut seems more to show gouki's power than anything else. He does it in the poster for alpha 2

Yeah, I saw it, and it's Ironic, that Alpha 2 is also the only In Game smoke you see

On another note, I think I also saw that Gouki's blood is green, going by his SF3 2nd impact defeated shot.

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Yeah, I saw it, and it's Ironic, that Alpha 2 is also the only In Game smoke you see

On another note, I think I also saw that Gouki's blood is green, going by his SF3 2nd impact defeated shot.

I used to think that, it's a pallet swap though.

Oh, yeah, you mean like the white blood spurts you get in games like Metal Slug (I'm still trying to erase my memory of that.... it looked like sprays of something it shouldn't like spilled milk).

Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Oh, yeah, you mean like the white blood spurts you get in games like Metal Slug (I'm still trying to erase my memory of that.... it looked like sprays of something it shouldn't like spilled milk).


That game was fun, but, very difficult.

I now own 3 of the home games for PS2... they are cool. I wonder if MS6 is going to be released for PS2...

3-on-one....so i guess i'm ignitz here.
oh man in two days this damn thing has gotten pretty far. sheesh.
okay here we go...................againwallbash

Please answer one thing before i mention THREE MORE points later on.

Why does "advanced motor skills" and "shattering body due to over powering" not count as power? i really wanna know.

that said lets make it clear that i have no beef against any one of you three. if you think i've been rude at any point, my apologies, but know that it was not my intention.

now for the three things i mentioned.
first of all emperor: how about you actually reply to what i'm saying instead of repeating your stuff from the first day. that big ass reply to you was not beef or anything but just something that you could think over and reply. stop repeating......or i'll leave

second: all of you three! I NEVER SAID GRANT>AKUMA.

third, its really, really funny to see you guys reply to me ONLY regarding the ground shaking. kickass stuff here really. maybe you all should read what i said before again so you'd actually see what i'm saying. you guys are replying ONLY to the ground shaking bit. you all conveniently ignore my mentioning:
-advanced motor skills (which would technically mean beyond human)
-body shattering.
which i happen to emphasize the most.

but for some reason that just doesn't count. why?
okay wait i think i know:
because capcom bosses have established feets and snk bosses have been jobbers. perfect logic. and on top of all that, I am the biased one just cuz i don't think that Capcom bosses are the greatest bosses of videogame history

if i mention body shattering, and how bison and rugal too suffered from that, then you guys mention that i can't.
what's that a ground rule?
i don't recall you people being the judges to decide what should be brought in and what not. not to mention it does serve as a common example since Bison and Rugal too self destructed. but wait....i can't do that.

why don't you guys read over my posts and try to think about it instead of coming out here and trying to act too smart by using the ground shaking as a scape goat to rubb that in my face like you guys are really too smart. its ridiculous and bad comedy.
seeing you all team up together, act against me as if this is life and death, taking everything so seriously and personally and conveniently ignoring my main point is the hieght.



-stop referring ONLY to ground shaking. that's not my main point.

-stop right there. i never said grant beats akuma.

-SNK biased Sado? that's a laugh. i am not the one going around saying every snk boss is a jobber, the heroes of SNK win only by PIS and plot device, oh and Capcom bosses happen to be the only established bosses produced. apparently if someone doesn't put Capcom characters on the pedestral of holiness, then he's biased. you've got some nerve there, mang.

-the Rugal bit was something i took and said it looked like a hint to me. your putting words in my mouth again.

-i never said grant>akuma. in fact i clearly said, akuma>grant. stop putting words in my mouth...again.

-who'se insulting you? i'm not insulting anyone here...or atleast that is not my intention. if you guys are getting worked up over a debate about videogame characters to the extent that you are taking it personally is really....nevermind. don't wanna make it worse. okay, darkstorm, I'm sorry.
however, watching you come out here and purposely taking everyone's attention away from my main point, putting words in my mouth and using it against me IS insulting me too. just for the record to let you know. but you know what? I'm cool with it. I'm not coming out here and saying you and i are on bad terms and stuff like that. i personally think internet wars suck. they really do. and i'm looking at a 3page argument between what i assume are 4 grown ups, as proof.
Brainchild and i don't agree on anything. you don't see me and him hating each other's guts and insulting each other. i respect him for what he likes and thinks and i ASSUME he does too. i got no beef with you dude. no beef whatsoever. nor do i have it with emperor and trickster...though emperor seems to think that i do and so do you. for that i really got nothing to say excpet "lighten up, dudes, its a videogame" and apologize which i already did twice.

and for the record

in the japanese version its blood. regular red blood. probably capcom of US thought it looked too gory. kinda like Iori spitting out green blood as riot in US version of KoF97. pretty stupid really.


as i was saying....


it is canon, emperor. bison blowing up was canon. ryu forefeiting the dark hadou for ever was also canon. one last confrontation between gen and akuma was also canon. ALpha1 is the only one that wasn't canon. not to mention Chunli, Guile and Charlie taking out Bison and Ryu, sakura, ken and SAgat's confrontation with Bison.


i think so too. Jedah is one badass mofo.


i'll just point out something (and again this is no flame) that the way i look at it, if the companies making the game don't give a reason as to why one character lost then i'm given to assume that the fight was fair. just for the sake of example:
Sagat lost to dan cuz canonwise he purposely let dan hit him and pretended to be KO'd.
Ryu lost to Ken in SFA2 cuz canonwise he was upset about his confrontation with Bison and the darkhadou in his own body.
Ryu lost to Sakura on purpose.
however, yes, you are right in what you are saying...there are lots of factors that do count in a fight, not just win and loss.


shin akuma IS akuma. shin akuma is basically akuma fighting with his full power and not holding back.
your argument is logical and makes perfect sense too. however, rugal's power consumed him and wrecked the base cuz that was the only thing in the vicinity to be wrecked. water can't be destroyed or anything now can it. same goes for akuma. for all we know the island wasn't that big since it was only him living there. same with rugal's base. we don't know how big it was. also i'm not quite sure it was omnidirectional, i'll check once i go home. if i remember it was a straight beam....and if what i remember is true then i think it does give akuma a run for his money since you're comparing. lets wait and see.


now why couldn't you argue like that before. that's what i'm talking about. i assume akuma shaking the ground was capcom's way of showing off just a glimpse of his power was it not? nonetheless like you said we really can't argue about htis since its non-canon.

well see ya guys around and hopefully by the next posts you guys calm down a bit. big smile, folks, big smile!

~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
second: all of you three! I NEVER SAID GRANT>AKUMA.

Thats not the impression I got, from either thread...

Originally posted by Sado22
third, its really, really funny to see you guys reply to me ONLY regarding the ground shaking. kickass stuff here really. maybe you all should read what i said before again so you'd actually see what i'm saying. you guys are replying ONLY to the ground shaking bit. you all conveniently ignore my mentioning:
-advanced motor skills (which would technically mean beyond human)
-body shattering.
which i happen to emphasize the most.

but for some reason that just doesn't count. why?
okay wait i think i know:
because capcom bosses have established feets and snk bosses have been jobbers. perfect logic. and on top of all that, I am the biased one just cuz i don't think that Capcom bosses are the greatest bosses of videogame history

if i mention body shattering, and how bison and rugal too suffered from that, then you guys mention that i can't.
what's that a ground rule?
i don't recall you people being the judges to decide what should be brought in and what not. not to mention it does serve as a common example since Bison and Rugal too self destructed. but wait....i can't do that.

why don't you guys read over my posts and try to think about it instead of coming out here and trying to act too smart by using the ground shaking as a scape goat to rubb that in my face like you guys are really too smart. its ridiculous and bad comedy.
seeing you all team up together, act against me as if this is life and death, taking everything so seriously and personally and conveniently ignoring my main point is the hieght.

I didn't elaborate on the Body degeneration stuff because i was told it was due to a bullet to the heart, hardly a demonstration of power, that just shows endurance, if I am mistaken on this point, then tell me so I can argue it proper.

As for advanced motor skills, that really doesn't tell me much... focused senses? Akuma has those, he needs them for teleporting, pinpoint accuracy, got that too, because he moves pretty quickly, and all of his fights with gen means he needs incredible accuracy to block Gen's equally accureate and quick nerve strikes.

Originally posted by Sado22
-stop referring ONLY to ground shaking. that's not my main point.

-stop right there. i never said grant beats akuma.

I didn't see the overall relevance of the other two, since like the Shaking stuff, it's a moot point.

Originally posted by Sado22
-SNK biased Sado? that's a laugh. i am not the one going around saying every snk boss is a jobber, the heroes of SNK win only by PIS and plot device, oh and Capcom bosses happen to be the only established bosses produced. apparently if someone doesn't put Capcom characters on the pedestral of holiness, then he's biased. you've got some nerve there, mang.

I didn't call any SNK bosses Jobbers, I have alot of respect for SNK characters as a whole, and IU've defended them against Street Fighter Bias debaters numerous times... But so far, I havn't seen a positive Street fighter comment from you, hence....

Originally posted by Sado22
-the Rugal bit was something i took and said it looked like a hint to me. your putting words in my mouth again.

How else was that meant to be taken? you said Rugal IS more powerful based on that, rather than looking at the facts...

Originally posted by Sado22
-i never said grant>akuma. in fact i clearly said, akuma>grant. stop putting words in my mouth...again.

I didn't see that on this thread... Someone said grant = akuma, I intended to debunk that without running the other thread off topic.

Originally posted by Sado22
-who'se insulting you? i'm not insulting anyone here...or atleast that is not my intention. if you guys are getting worked up over a debate about videogame characters to the extent that you are taking it personally is really....nevermind. don't wanna make it worse. okay, darkstorm, I'm sorry.

It's not the debating stuff I'm getting insulted by... you pOriginally posted by Sado22
however, watching you come out here and purposely taking everyone's attention away from my main point, putting words in my mouth and using it against me IS insulting me too. just for the record to let you know. but you know what? I'm cool with it. I'm not coming out here and saying you and i are on bad terms and stuff like that. i personally think internet wars suck. they really do. and i'm looking at a 3page argument between what i assume are 4 grown ups, as proof.
Brainchild and i don't agree on anything. you don't see me and him hating each other's guts and insulting each other. i respect him for what he likes and thinks and i ASSUME he does too. i got no beef with you dude. no beef whatsoever. nor do i have it with emperor and trickster...though emperor seems to think that i do and so do you. for that i really got nothing to say excpet "lighten up, dudes, its a videogame" and apologize which i already did twice.

I didn't like saying what I said, especially to a new guy, but I have seen MANY posts by you devaluing Street Fighter in what appeared to be a belated attempt to boost SNK's image here... I have no actual beef youth you personally, I guess being sick for the past two weeks took it's toll on my patience, I normally don't flip like I did over a matter so small (You should see some of my earlier threads with Shin Remy... People think I had the patience of a Shaolin Monk...)

Anyways, it wasn't my intention to have a go at you either, nor was it to put words in your mouth, I guess it was just me assuming again, my apollogies.

Originally posted by Sado22
in the japanese version its blood. regular red blood. probably capcom of US thought it looked too gory. kinda like Iori spitting out green blood as riot in US version of KoF97. pretty stupid really.

I never got to see it! I beleive that would have looked cool...

Originally posted by Sado22
i'll just point out something (and again this is no flame) that the way i look at it, if the companies making the game don't give a reason as to why one character lost then i'm given to assume that the fight was fair. just for the sake of example:
Sagat lost to dan cuz canonwise he purposely let dan hit him and pretended to be KO'd.
Ryu lost to Ken in SFA2 cuz canonwise he was upset about his confrontation with Bison and the darkhadou in his own body.
Ryu lost to Sakura on purpose.
however, yes, you are right in what you are saying...there are lots of factors that do count in a fight, not just win and loss.

Like I said, alot of the fights that turn out to be Canon, have actually been cases of PIS and/or CIS, especially when it's a weaker character winning, or doing something outside of their normal capabilities...

Originally posted by Sado22
shin akuma IS akuma. shin akuma is basically akuma fighting with his full power and not holding back.
your argument is logical and makes perfect sense too. however, rugal's power consumed him and wrecked the base cuz that was the only thing in the vicinity to be wrecked. water can't be destroyed or anything now can it. same goes for akuma. for all we know the island wasn't that big since it was only him living there. same with rugal's base. we don't know how big it was. also i'm not quite sure it was omnidirectional, i'll check once i go home. if i remember it was a straight beam....and if what i remember is true then i think it does give akuma a run for his money since you're comparing. lets wait and see.

I know this... Implicitly... However in CVS2, they are infact separate characters, with Akuma "transforming" into Akuma.

Originally posted by Sado22
now why couldn't you argue like that before. that's what i'm talking about. i assume akuma shaking the ground was capcom's way of showing off just a glimpse of his power was it not? nonetheless like you said we really can't argue about htis since its non-canon.

well see ya guys around and hopefully by the next posts you guys calm down a bit. big smile, folks, big smile!

~Sado

Thats all for now, I'll post again later!

Originally posted by Sado22
3-on-one....so i guess i'm ignitz here.
oh man in two days this damn thing has gotten pretty far. sheesh.
okay here we go...................againwallbash

Please answer one thing before i mention THREE MORE points later on.

Why does "advanced motor skills" and "shattering body due to over powering" not count as power? i really wanna know.

Because they are analysis based on appearence and not performence. I swear I said this before three times nonetheless, that you cannot judge a chacters abilities by his appearence alone.


Originally posted by Sado22

that said lets make it clear that i have no beef against any one of you three. if you think i've been rude at any point, my apologies, but know that it was not my intention.

now for the three things i mentioned.
first of all emperor: how about you actually reply to what i'm saying instead of repeating your stuff from the first day. that big ass reply to you was not beef or anything but just something that you could think over and reply. stop repeating......or i'll leave

second: all of you three! I NEVER SAID GRANT>AKUMA.

third, its really, really funny to see you guys reply to me ONLY regarding the ground shaking. kickass stuff here really. maybe you all should read what i said before again so you'd actually see what i'm saying. you guys are replying ONLY to the ground shaking bit. you all conveniently ignore my mentioning:
-advanced motor skills (which would technically mean beyond human)
-body shattering.
which i happen to emphasize the most.


And those arguments are different from earth shaking how, and I answered your claim pertaining to "Body Shattering" right off the bat sado. I'll repeat myself again, Stop basing your arguments on a characters appearence. I don't care if grant farts angels, give me some feats or get out, straight up.


Originally posted by Sado22

but for some reason that just doesn't count. why?
okay wait i think i know:
because capcom bosses have established feets and snk bosses have been jobbers. perfect logic. and on top of all that, I am the biased one just cuz i don't think that Capcom bosses are the greatest bosses of videogame history

Where did I say that capcom bosses are the greates, man your coming off like a real fanboy. According to you, characters with No Feats who barely make multiple canon appearence's and get jobbed all time. Are stronger than bosses that have solid feats, Esatablished as god tier, and well explained abilities simply because they look like it?!


Originally posted by Sado22

if i mention body shattering, and how bison and rugal too suffered from that, then you guys mention that i can't.
what's that a ground rule?

Because none of that shit matters, screw his body breaking down because of the psycho drive. Focus on his feat, what can rugal do that makes him on par with bison.Die?

Originally posted by Sado22

i don't recall you people being the judges to decide what should be brought in and what not. not to mention it does serve as a common example since Bison and Rugal too self destructed. but wait....i can't do that.


Read the rules, it's the against the rules to argue a character is stronger than the other based on you thinking they are cooler in comparison. Not only that, it's fanboyish.


Originally posted by Sado22

why don't you guys read over my posts and try to think about it instead of coming out here and trying to act too smart by using the ground shaking as a scape goat to rubb that in my face like you guys are really too smart. its ridiculous and bad comedy.

Yeah, that argument is bad comedy, the fact you brought that up makes me laugh.

Originally posted by Sado22

seeing you all team up together, act against me as if this is life and death, taking everything so seriously and personally and conveniently ignoring my main point is the hieght.
I addressed your main point three times, I REPEAT,THREE TIMES.

I will post it again, basing characters soley on appearence and having similar back stories is not a valid argument. I don't care about earth shaking,body shattering, and motor skills (Whatever the hell that has to do with anything give me feats.



Originally posted by Sado22

-stop referring ONLY to ground shaking. that's not my main point.

-stop right there. i never said grant beats akuma.

-SNK biased Sado? that's a laugh. i am not the one going around saying every snk boss is a jobber, the heroes of SNK win only by PIS and plot device, oh and Capcom bosses happen to be the only established bosses produced. apparently if someone doesn't put Capcom characters on the pedestral of holiness, then he's biased. you've got some nerve there, mang.

So, snk bosses don't lose everygame to one team, please sado.



Originally posted by Sado22

-
in the japanese version its blood. regular red blood. probably capcom of US thought it looked too gory. kinda like Iori spitting out green blood as riot in US version of KoF97. pretty stupid really.


Actually, in the american version it's green as well. I owned the game.


Originally posted by Sado22

it is canon, emperor. bison blowing up was canon. ryu forefeiting the dark hadou for ever was also canon. one last confrontation between gen and akuma was also canon. ALpha1 is the only one that wasn't canon. not to mention Chunli, Guile and Charlie taking out Bison and Ryu, sakura, ken and SAgat's confrontation with Bison.


Wrong again, alpha 1 and street fighter new generation are not canon. And ryu never beat gouki, nowhere does it say that.



Originally posted by Sado22

i'll just point out something (and again this is no flame) that the way i look at it, if the companies making the game don't give a reason as to why one character lost then i'm given to assume that the fight was fair. just for the sake of example:
Sagat lost to dan cuz canonwise he purposely let dan hit him and pretended to be KO'd.
Ryu lost to Ken in SFA2 cuz canonwise he was upset about his confrontation with Bison and the darkhadou in his own body.
Ryu lost to Sakura on purpose.
however, yes, you are right in what you are saying...there are lots of factors that do count in a fight, not just win and loss.

All those fights that have weaker characters beating stronger characters in street fighter have detailed explanations. Versus snk who never provides one except one time, zero in kof 2000

Hey peeps!
now this is more like it. i come back from an oral presentation on Nathaniel Hawthorne infront of two girls who hate my guts for some reason and find you two here, talking without the anger. now that's cool! i'm still shuddering after all those blood curling stares i got from those chicks!boxed
now
first off, thanx for accepting my apologies and further more for putting up with a lot of this crap for the past 2-3 days. i guess its all taken a tole on us
glad we all settled this like grown up, non-fanboys/fangirls.


i clearly stated Akuma would beat Grant after a tough bout. the tough bout is all IMO. i could be wrong and i'm not barring that whatsoever. its just what i feel.


glad we're clear on that. the bullet to the heart, apparently advanced his motor skills cuz its lodged in such a way that has affected his heart (and apparently can't be taken out either). i don't know if you've seen this anime or read the manga called Tenjou tenge. the bad guy of that thing got this powerful beam attack on the chest that winded up with "accelerated motor abilities". the result was inhuman speed, strength and reflexes. Not to mention tons of power. see what i'm talking about now?


agreed.


it was in reference to you arguing with me about the whole akuma thing. like me sounding proSNK, i felt you were being proCapcom. i guess its both of us or just the over all "lost in translation" bit that exists in typing things instead of saying them.


the best thing to ask yourself would be: can akuma pound everyone in KoF's ass all by himself? depending on your answer it'll mark how relative my using Rugal was.
i personally think he can't and it would result in me assuming that Rugal>Akuma since Rugal did what IMO Akuma can't. again its my own thoughts and ideas. not forcing anyone to agree with me. as always I think i could be wrong but so far i don't think Akuma can do it.


i said it plenty of times.
Akuma>grant. happy now, lol.


sorry about that, once again


shin remy? oh well.
there are certain bits about ryu that i just feel are overrated. i like Ryu a lot too and he's sitting on my top 10 lists for a reason.
its just when i hear people say stuff like "ryu versus Iori? ha. one world. hadouken". that kind of talk irritates me cuz i feel they are taking away too much from other fighters and fighting games. for instance, to me Ryu wasn't too impressive in his fight with Hugo since Hugo is from all that SF3 has left to show us, a midtier character who's hardly relevant to the story. that's my opinion. some people just get too angry if i mention such things or if i claim that say, Kazuya can kick Ryu's ass. Its my opinion. i've never made fun of anyone on this forum or another if they thought that Terry'd lose to say Jin Kazama. its their opinion.
but nonetheless lets keep this thread relevant.


no harm done. so no need to apologize.


agreed again.


alucard

~Sado

Yo

.....oh well. i guess we both of to live with our "failure to get to other's point" then, huh?


don't use bold, dude. it hurts the eyes.
how about wearing anal beads around the neck?
lol
just playing with you. like i said before, i guess we'd have to learn how to live with each other. or do you wanna fight it out!
chair
come on mang...this world is made up of "LOVE&PEACE"
love and peace!
love and peace!
love and peace!
war


you said the f word!nono
did i say stronger....aside from me mentioning that Rugal>akuma.
if its any condolence, Rugal was in TWO KoF's. from SNk standards thats a lot. lol. as to why i think so, i mentioned to Darkstorm above. but its my opinon.....
and for the record, i'm not the one who got so pissed off and made a whole new seperate thread on "akuma vs grant" just cuz another person happen to think that akuma and grant would be a tough bout. so you wanna talk about "fanboyism"? whose thinkin like one now?
but you know what...lets drop it already . this shit's gotten too far too soon. **** it. you know what, you say grant'd lose. darkstorm thinks he'd lose. brainchild thinks he'd lose. I think he'd lose...but after a fight. so whats the ****ing difference, huh? oh yeah and trickster too.


err....annihilating the whole KoF casts until he happen to self destruct which later characters would call luck for themselves.


you said the f word again!nono
the only thing cooler about grant as opposed to akuma is that he doesn't wear anal beads around his neck
but me saying grant and akuma is a good fight has nothing to do with coolness. you think powering up to insane levels of body breaking isn't a feet. i think it is. period.
*vincent vega imitation*
"now you're telling me that don't mean shit and i'm tell you it does."
we cool?


what was bad comedy was having you all get steamed up and ignore my main points and you still ARE pretty steamed dude. chill. i've had you, darkstom, brainchild and trickster constantly after me and arguing and misunderstanding and misusing all my quotes and points for 2 days straight. all that with two midterm papers, an oral presentation AND hard ass finals coming up......you see me lose my cool. and look at you:
*licks finger and puts it on your head*
ssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
ow hot!


what i said before the preivous reply. its all opinion dude and what appeals to one. i think its a feat. i don't find one hits kills cool. i find them overrated. but i'm not stopping you from using it am I now?


huh?


SF3 2nd strike?
i just played it the other day and it was red. you probably have the fake hahahaha. just kidding.


that's exactly what i said. You said SFA3 was non canon and i replied that no, SFA1 was.
SF new generation is not exactly noncanon since it is the same as SF3 2nd impact, just with more characters in it. also the endings are the same too.

Be cool, bub. meeting people who don't see your point is also part of life. learn to live with it. See ya.

~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
Yo

.....oh well. i guess we both of to live with our "failure to get to other's point" then, huh?

I don't see what's so hard to understand, I've asked you so many times to name feats that put grant on par with gouki. Instead you just keep harping about 3 irrelevant things.

Ground Shaking: Alot of people can make the ground shake, including gouki. Making the ground shake doesn't mean he's on par with gouki because it doesn't tell me his fighting power. It just tells me that he can make the ground shake.So, can alot of non boss characters in street fighter.

Body Shattering: Have you ever though just maybe it's the nature of grant's power to destroy his body regardless of how powerful he is? You keep bringing up bison and rugal as an example, yet, explain to me this. Why do bosses who are stronger than rugal do not suffer the sme affliction?

Advance Motor skills: Should I address this?

Instead of focusing on: Experience, technique, ability, etc. You focus on three of the most unimportant things.




Originally posted by Sado22

you said the f word!nono
did i say stronger....aside from me mentioning that Rugal>akuma.
if its any condolence, Rugal was in TWO KoF's. from SNk standards thats a lot. lol. as to why i think so, i mentioned to Darkstorm above. but its my opinon.....
and for the record, i'm not the one who got so pissed off and made a whole new seperate thread on "akuma vs grant" just cuz another person happen to think that akuma and grant would be a tough bout. so you wanna talk about "fanboyism"? whose thinkin like one now?
but you know what...lets drop it already . this shit's gotten too far too soon. **** it. you know what, you say grant'd lose. darkstorm thinks he'd lose. brainchild thinks he'd lose. I think he'd lose...but after a fight. so whats the ****ing difference, huh? oh yeah and trickster too.

Um, I didn't make this thread, so, I dunno what the your talking about.
And pyou used the "F" word originally, stop the hypocritism.



Originally posted by Sado22

err....annihilating the whole KoF casts until he happen to self destruct which later characters would call luck for themselves.


you said the f word again!nono
the only thing cooler about grant as opposed to akuma is that he doesn't wear anal beads around his neck
but me saying grant and akuma is a good fight has nothing to do with coolness. you think powering up to insane levels of body breaking isn't a feet. i think it is. period.
*vincent vega imitation*
"now you're telling me that don't mean shit and i'm tell you it does."
we cool?

I explained 5 times why that shit isn't a feat, and your asking again. Your obviously ignoring my arguments. Again, that isn't a feat because it does not tell us grants abilities, experience, technique, etc.


Originally posted by Sado22

what was bad comedy was having you all get steamed up and ignore my main points and you still ARE pretty steamed dude. chill. i've had you, darkstom, brainchild and trickster constantly after me and arguing and misunderstanding and misusing all my quotes and points for 2 days straight. all that with two midterm papers, an oral presentation AND hard ass finals coming up......you see me lose my cool. and look at you:
*licks finger and puts it on your head*
ssssssssssssssssssssssssssss
ow hot!
Ignoring, So despite giving 5 responses to your weak arguments I'm ignoring them?!





Originally posted by Sado22

what i said before the preivous reply. its all opinion dude and what appeals to one. i think its a feat. i don't find one hits kills cool. i find them overrated. but i'm not stopping you from using it am I now?

And that's the problem, It isn't about what appeals to you. It's about what's relevant to this fight.




Originally posted by Sado22

SF3 2nd strike?
i just played it the other day and it was red. you probably have the fake hahahaha. just kidding.

2nd strike?


Originally posted by Sado22

that's exactly what i said. You said SFA3 was non canon and i replied that no, SFA1 was.
SF new generation is not exactly noncanon since it is the same as SF3 2nd impact, just with more characters in it. also the endings are the same too.

Be cool, bub. meeting people who don't see your point is also part of life. learn to live with it. See ya.

~Sado

New generation isn't canon just like alpha 1. And I never said alpha 3 wasn't canon, I said it's full of non canon endings, pay attention.

*puts on intense heat resistant body suit*
Hey!

gouki STOMPS the ground. Grant just freaking stands there. its similar to superduperorochiakuma/shiner akuma (or whatever he's called) does in CvsSNK2...its obviously suppossed to show how he's become stronger than before. THAT is what i meant by feet. to me someone who can shake the damn earth by simply powering up counts as a feet. to you it doesn't. to me instant kill isn't exactly a feet. its an example of over-rating someone (think Ryo for instance, and his "deadly one hit" super). wakarou ka?


Rugal's wasn't natural power doh which is even confirmed by Iori mocking Rugal by saying "only the ones with the blood can control such power. you never had a chance!"doh

Rugal "took" it from Geonitz. geonitz, Orochi 3 face team, Orochi and all have that power as NATURAL to them hence they don't break down. simple. in the nest Saga, those guys were genetically manufactured to hold that kind of power. simple again. now you know?
yes i have, for the record, but since its unconfirmed i don't go around making guesses. since SNK never expalined it and only said that his body detrioates cuz of it overpowering.


"here we are now...entertain us!"


Grant's been fighting since he was child and has been training in his "fist of transcedence" arts for a long time too. so that's experience.
techniques...well play the game.
ability..don't see the point to mention all of the previous bits. to me advanced motor skills just happens to be part of "ability". don't know about you.
so there you go.


dude calm down i was just joking around. sheesh.


...never mind.


not to flame you, bud, but NO ONE here decides what's relevant. its about time you understand that. its the way we see things. IMO maybe its time you cool down and try seeing what 'I' am trying to say.


street fighter3: giant attack (the new comers)
around here we call it second strike for the heck of it.


hmmmmmm....oh well.
SF3 is canon like i said its just that giant attack has the newer characters in it. the endings for ryu, ken etc are the same for the returning characters as in SF giant attack. hence its canon too (as opposed to SFA1 which had totally different and conflicting endings)

as for your comment on SFA3, well all games have some noncanon elements. but yes i get your meaning.

~Sado
p.s. at least this thing is more or less over. good.

Originally posted by Sado22
*puts on intense heat resistant body suit*
Hey!

gouki STOMPS the ground. Grant just freaking stands there. its similar to superduperorochiakuma/shiner akuma (or whatever he's called) does in CvsSNK2...its obviously suppossed to show how he's become stronger than before. THAT is what i meant by feet. to me someone who can shake the damn earth by simply powering up counts as a feet. to you it doesn't. to me instant kill isn't exactly a feet. its an example of over-rating someone (think Ryo for instance, and his "deadly one hit" super). wakarou ka?

I don't see how something that can decide a battle (An Instant Kill) not count as feat despite being completely relevant to a versus match. what does earth shaking during a power up give grant in terms of battle advantage.

Originally posted by Sado22

Rugal's wasn't natural power doh which is even confirmed by Iori mocking Rugal by saying "only the ones with the blood can control such power. you never had a chance!"doh
Is rugal grant?
Do they have the same power?
Is rugal even in this match?

Bottom line is just because grants body is shattering, doesn't mean he's god tier.


Originally posted by Sado22

Rugal "took" it from Geonitz. geonitz, Orochi 3 face team, Orochi and all have that power as NATURAL to them hence they don't break down. simple. in the nest Saga, those guys were genetically manufactured to hold that kind of power. simple again. now you know?
yes i have, for the record, but since its unconfirmed i don't go around making guesses. since SNK never expalined it and only said that his body detrioates cuz of it overpowering.]

Rugal got his ass whopped by goenitz and his eye gouged out. Goenitz gave him the power, he didn't take anything butt his ass on a platter.
And thinks for proving my point, Rugals body problems come from his lack of control and the nature of his power. He just also happens to be a boss.

Originally posted by Sado22




Grant's been fighting since he was child and has been training in his "fist of transcedence" arts for a long time too. so that's experience.
techniques...well play the game.
ability..don't see the point to mention all of the previous bits. to me advanced motor skills just happens to be part of "ability". don't know about you.
so there you go.

What the hell are advance motor skils!?

And why the hell didn't you mention his experience before?!





Originally posted by Sado22


not to flame you, bud, but NO ONE here decides what's relevant. its about time you understand that. its the way we see things. IMO maybe its time you cool down and try seeing what 'I' am trying to say.

Yeah, they do, If I start talking about how cool bisons hat is and that just because he wears one he would win whatever versus match he's in. Those that mean I have a solid argument just cause I Think So?



Originally posted by Sado22

street fighter3: giant attack (the new comers)
around here we call it second strike for the heck of it.

I have never seen anyone call double impct "Second Strike"

Originally posted by Sado22

hmmmmmm....oh well.
SF3 is canon like i said its just that giant attack has the newer characters in it. the endings for ryu, ken etc are the same for the returning characters as in SF giant attack. hence its canon too (as opposed to SFA1 which had totally different and conflicting endings)



No, it's not canon,

.....as i said i think instant kills are over-rated. that's all.


can't say.

will similar make you happy? what about my real idea=comparable?

...............


*don't see the point of reiterating over and over again*
never mind.


he took it on a silver platter actually (minues the eye gouging)


i thought they weren't the same like two minutes ago.


he's an excellent driver!


i was assuming you knew that already.


i never said something like that. it all boils down to one thing:
to me if someone can shake the earth by just powering (akuma STOMPS the ground. Grant just stands there) is pretty impressive. but whatever....nevermind all that.


which is exactly why i mentioned "around here we call it second strike for the heck of it".


which one? SF3 or SFa1?

see ya.
~Sado

Originally posted by Sado22
.....as i said i think instant kills are over-rated. that's all.

Good for you but, it has alot of relevance in this match.


Originally posted by Sado22

will similar make you happy? what about my real idea=comparable?

Comparable in what way, last I check grant is dying because he has a bullet in his heart and Not because he cannot control the growth of his power. Also, Bison's body (Since you brought him up also) is maxed out with psycho energy in alpha 3, since it's gatthering all the negative energy on the planet will do that to you and his body can't hold all that power. Now, how are they comparable, despite having completely different themes.

One has no control, the other no more spce, and the last a bullet in the heart. Any other comparison you want to make like favorite food or hobbies?


Originally posted by Sado22

*don't see the point of reiterating over and over again*
never mind.

you don't have to since I did it for ou several times.

Originally posted by Sado22

he took it on a silver platter actually (minues the eye gouging)

Sure...

Originally posted by Sado22

i thought they weren't the same like two minutes ago.
Just calling it how snk does, I don't see him as boss more like canon fodder.




Originally posted by Sado22

i was assuming you knew that already.

This is why we do not ASS-U-ME.

Originally posted by Sado22

i never said something like that. it all boils down to one thing:
to me if someone can shake the earth by just powering (akuma STOMPS the ground. Grant just stands there) is pretty impressive. but whatever....nevermind all that.

Yeah, I find it impressive too. I'm just wondering how it can have relevance to this battle versus a match ender I.E instant kill, which you feel doesn't.

So, basically it boils down to earth shaking being so cool that it places grant on par with gouki with nothing to show for it I.E basing a characters power tier on appearence alone. Not one thing you've said so far relates to grants abilit, skill, and fighting power. Just The fact you neglect match enders (Shungokusatsu) and repeat the same lame point over an over does not help. We get it, But, it's not good enough sado. otherwise characters like rose,and urien would be god tier.



Originally posted by Sado22

which is exactly why i mentioned "around here we call it second strike for the heck of it".

who's we, never seen anyone call the game second strike until now.

Originally posted by Sado22

which one? SF3 or SFa1?

Both

see ya.
~Sado

Originally posted by Emperor Ashtar
who's we, never seen anyone call the game second strike until now.

I thought it was called 2nd impact giant attack (Although I think the Giant Attack suffix was attached to a later version of the same game.)

Yeah, I was kind of confused about the 2nd Strike thing also, I've never heard or seen it been referred to as such. I just called it SF3: 2nd Impact.

Well, according to sado. "WE" call it second strike.

like i said, your body doesn't fall apart no matter where you get shot by a bullet. his body is falling apart because of the acclerated motor skills ( ) and the strain of his power. do some more checking.


one has no control and hence blew up.
one has no contol and hence got consumed and vapourized.
one is basically falling apart because of the power.
hmmmmmmm....


what bullshit?
i didn't say it does count. i said its over-rated.


*yawn*
like i said before. next point please.


actually Rose beat Bison in SFA2 days so...

you're rambling on about the ground shaking bit again.
As far as power, ability and skills go, how about you find out what "motor skills" are so that it'll be more clear to you. you do that, okay! *orders him around*

then come and talk.


"WE" as in...where i live, genius.

~Sado.

Originally posted by Sado22
like i said, your body doesn't fall apart no matter where you get shot by a bullet. his body is falling apart because of the acclerated motor skills ( ) and the strain of his power. do some more checking.
And how does any of that tell me how strong he is?
Because he strains so hard to control his power, you believe it's because his power is to great. backed up by the fact he shakes the earth, and you use bison and rugal as examples.(Nevermind that bison and rugal have completely different problems with their bodies)

Originally posted by Sado22

one has no control and hence blew up.
one has no contol and hence got consumed and vapourized.
one is basically falling apart because of the power.
hmmmmmmm....

Wrong, bison has completely control of his power. He just has no more space, and because he's a greedy mofo. He decide's to use a back up body ythat can hold more energy than him.blah,blah,blah, the psycho drive explodes and all the energy contained in it goes to bisons already full body casuing him to explode.

Originally posted by Sado22

what bullshit?
i didn't say it does count. i said its over-rated.

I don't care if you think it's overrated,it's relevant.




Originally posted by Sado22

actually Rose beat Bison in SFA2 days so...

you're rambling on about the ground shaking bit again.
As far as power, ability and skills go, how about you find out what "motor skills" are so that it'll be more clear to you. you do that, okay! *orders him around*

Bison wasn't god tier in alpha2 so, your point is moot.

And why do I have to elaborate on a point you made, if you canb't elaborate on it or won't then this debate is over because of lack of participation on your part.




Originally posted by Sado22

"WE" as in...where i live, genius.

~Sado.
Right, because you clearly elaborated thatt you mean't where you live when you said we

what i said was:
"down here we call it 2nd strike for the heck of it."
so yeah, i elaborated enough, sherlock.

~Sado