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Who wins

Apocalypse- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse_%28comics%29

Horsemen
Exodus
Stryfe
Magneto
Mister Sinister
Classic Juggernaut
Cable
Aurora
Magik

vs

Justice League
Superman
Captain Marvel
Wonder Woman
Green Lantern(John)
Flash
Batman

How about bios for everybody?

9 vs 6 ( 5 and a half with batman lol)

I like numbers so I'll say Apoc and horseman win this fight.

None of those people have ever been Horsemen of Apocalypse.. ermm

Let's say JLA.

That team could whip the JLA without apocalypse. It's overkill.

Apocalypse- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Apocalypse_%28En_Sabah_Nur%29

Exodus- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Exodus

Stryfe- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Stryfe

Magneto- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Magneto_%28Magnus%29

Mister Sinister- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Mister_Sinister

Classic Juggernaut- http://www.marveldirectory.com/individuals/j/juggernaut.htm

Cable- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Cable_%28Nathan_Summers%29

Aurora- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Aurora

Magik- http://www.marveldatabase.com/Magik_%28Illyana_Rasputin%29

Superman- http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/Superman_%28Kal-El/Clark_Kent%29

Captain Marvel/No Shazam- http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/Captain_Marvel

Wonder Woman- http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/Wonder_Woman_%28Diana%29

Green Lantern(John Stewart)- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Stewart_%28comics%29

Flash- http://www.dcdatabaseproject.com/Wally_West

Green Lantern(Kyle)- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ Green_Lantern#Modern_Age_Green_Lantern:_Kyle_Rayne
r

I took out Batman and added Green Lantern Kyle to make up the number disadvantage

They still lose to your horsemen.

Mags
Stryfe
Exodus

They could do it on their own.

Thanks for the bios.

Apoc and the horseman 10/10.

Two GLs.
Homo sapiens superior devolved into Homo sapiens sapiens.

What are you talking about?

chatting aload of s**t

any how super overkill on jla

Originally posted by Starhawk
What are you talking about?

Surfer can turn off the mutant gene. A Lantern could do so just as easily.

You damn well better believe that Apocalype, Cable and Magneto are gonna be busted down to Batman's level REALLY quick.

Originally posted by Soljer
Surfer can turn off the mutant gene. A Lantern could do so just as easily.

You damn well better believe that Apocalype, Cable and Magneto are gonna be busted down to Batman's level REALLY quick.

Whoa whoa whoa...has a green lantern ever just "turned off" powers? What the surfer can or can't do is irrelevant...

Apoc and his horseman are boned.

So when did GL's powers mirror SS?

Originally posted by Soljer
Surfer can turn off the mutant gene. A Lantern could do so just as easily.

You damn well better believe that Apocalype, Cable and Magneto are gonna be busted down to Batman's level REALLY quick. That and going by forum rules it's current Captain Marvel.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Whoa whoa whoa...has a green lantern ever just "turned off" powers? What the surfer can or can't do is irrelevant...

He's turned of a Daxamite's power and he's turned off the psychic powers of Gorilla Grodd and the Shark by devolving them both back into a normal gorilla and a normal shark.

Mutants are no less. Humans have developed anti-mutagene weapons for decades. GL can do it seconds.....

Originally posted by Starhawk
So when did GL's powers mirror SS?

Since he had a weapon that can do ANYTHING.

What part of "the most powerful weapon in the universe that allows the bearer to do ANYTHING his/her imagination can muster" is so difficult to understand.

Why do people get so surprised when GL can do something other than make a green baseball bat....?

Originally posted by Draco69
Since he had a weapon that can do ANYTHING.

What part of "the most powerful weapon in the universe that allows the bearer to do ANYTHING his/her imagination can muster" is so difficult to understand.

Why do people get so surprised when GL can do something other than make a green baseball bat....?

because GL isn't the surfer. Surfer is thousands of years old by now and extremely experienced with his abilities. He also has a cosmic awareness that allows him to know his opponents weaknesses (when the writers remember to use it...)

GL, while posessed of the strongest weapon in the DC universe isn't as experienced in his abilities as surfer is. Would a green lantern who's had a ring for five minutes be as effective as a 50 year vet?

obviously not.

So: to recap to make this as simple as possible:

Surfer has fought tons of mutants and thus knows what a mutant gene is and how to turn it off.

Green Lantern: "What's a mutant gene?"

Also: there's a good chance that "devolving" apocalypse may not work, as his physiology was substantially altered by both celestial tech and a technorganic virus. I doubt his genes are anything close to human at this point.

When has he ever demonstrated that power in the past and considering he doesn't win every battle there is obviously some things it cannot do.

Originally posted by Starhawk
When has he ever demonstrated that power in the past and considering he doesn't win every battle there is obviously some things it cannot do.

Like I said, he's devolved the Shark and Gorilla Grodd who both possess mutagenic genes. He's also stripped people of their powers who got mutagenic super-gene therapy from Lex Luthor.

Green Lantern loses either to higher level cosmics or he jobs to Superman and the like.

Just like Surfer.....

Originally posted by Space M ummy
because GL isn't the surfer. Surfer is thousands of years old by now and extremely experienced with his abilities. He also has a cosmic awareness that allows him to know his opponents weaknesses (when the writers remember to use it...)

GL, while posessed of the strongest weapon in the DC universe isn't as experienced in his abilities as surfer is. Would a green lantern who's had a ring for five minutes be as effective as a 50 year vet?

obviously not.

So: to recap to make this as simple as possible:

Surfer has fought tons of mutants and thus knows what a mutant gene is and how to turn it off.

Green Lantern: "What's a mutant gene?"

Also: there's a good chance that "devolving" apocalypse may not work, as his physiology was substantially altered by both celestial tech and a technorganic virus. I doubt his genes are anything close to human at this point. John and Kyle are rookie GLs now?

But can he do that faster then Stryfe and Exodus can TK him into peices?

Also we don't really know what the current ring can really do.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
John and Kyle are rookie GLs now?

when compared to surfer, who's thousands of years old? Yes.

Surfer's experience >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> John and Kyle's.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
because GL isn't the surfer. Surfer is thousands of years old by now and extremely experienced with his abilities.

Kyle nor Gardner are rookies with their powers. A mutant with an easily exploitable weakness isn't beyond their "limited" experience.


Originally posted by Space M ummy
He also has a cosmic awareness that allows him to know his opponents weaknesses (when the writers remember to use it...)

Green Lanterns possess a supercomputer (similar to a Motherbox) that's connected to the Oan Battery that stores pretty much everything that there is to know in the DCU.

It would automatically scan the mutants and determine that their mutagenic genes can be turned off.

GL Supercomputer >>>>>>>>>>Buncha human scientists.....



Originally posted by Space M ummy
GL, while posessed of the strongest weapon in the DC universe isn't as experienced in his abilities as surfer is.

Based on what? You're saying that Kyle and Gardner have no idea how to use their rings?

And for your information, they've used it for thousands of years also if you count their various timeline travels, parallel dimension stays and the fact that Kyle had to fight for one million years in the 345rd Century against a horde of Neron demons locked in a time flux....

No experience my ass....





Originally posted by Space M ummy
Surfer has fought tons of mutants and thus knows what a mutant gene is and how to turn it off.

Green Lantern has also fought tons of mutants and thus knows what a mutant gene is and how to turn it off....

At least SIX of his rogue galleries are mutants....




Originally posted by Space M ummy
Green Lantern: "What's a mutant gene?"

GL Supercomputer: A genetic enyzme that grants the organism various paranormal abilities. It can be nullified. Commencing...




Originally posted by Space M ummy
Also: there's a good chance that "devolving" apocalypse may not work, as his physiology was substantially altered by both celestial tech and a technorganic virus. I doubt his genes are anything close to human at this point.

Too bad the GL ring has absorbed technology far beyond anything in Apoc's makeup....

Stryfe Apocalypse Cable and Exodus has telekinesis

DC has no magic or telepaths so how do they stop Juggs?

Originally posted by Starhawk
But can he do that faster then Stryfe and Exodus can TK him into peices?

Which Kyle or Guy can do. Do you REALLY think that TK is going to rip two beings that can survive a black hole as if it were a simple vacuum cleaner??

Originally posted by Starhawk
Also we don't really know what the current ring can really do.

Yeah. We do. If you've read the comics. Which you clearly don't. Hell, I doubt you read much DC at all.

This GL stuff I'm telling is as basic as it gets.

Originally posted by golem370
Stryfe Apocalypse Cable and Exodus has telekinesis

GL can give themselves telekinesis...or any other power they want.

It's not like it's gonna make a difference....

Originally posted by golem370
Stryfe Apocalypse Cable and Exodus has telekinesis Clever boy, you are. That they do. So?Originally posted by golem370
DC has no magic or telepaths so how do they stop Juggs? Throwing him away.

Originally posted by golem370
DC has no magic or telepaths so how do they stop Juggs?

GL gives himself telepathy as he has countless times when facing Hector Hammond.

Or he channels the mystical components of the Starheart.

Or he simply teleports Juggs away.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
when compared to surfer, who's thousands of years old? Yes.

Surfer's experience >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> John and Kyle's.

Kyle has relatively thousands of years of experience.

That point is moot.

Not If he has his force field on

Originally posted by golem370
Not If he has his force field on

How the hell is Jugg's forcefield gonna protect him from teleportation.
Or having his helmet teleported off?

Yeah sure they can.

Originally posted by golem370
Not If he has his force field on What exactly do you expect the Juggernaut to do to the 2 GLs, Superman, WW, Captain Marvel and Flash after his mutant teammates have all been made into ordinary humans? Advance on them?

Originally posted by golem370
Yeah sure they can.

Yep.

Glad you're not as stupid as we all think...

Although I'm being overly nice today.

Originally posted by golem370
Who wins

Apocalypse- http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apocalypse_%28comics%29

Horsemen
Exodus
Stryfe
Magneto
Mister Sinister
Classic Juggernaut
Cable
Aurora
Magik

vs

Justice League
Superman
Captain Marvel
Wonder Woman
Green Lantern(John)
Flash
Batman

2 uber tp's vs a team that has none makes life a little tough for the jla, but flash imp's stryfe or exodus before one forms a thought and gl takes out the other.

gl's have just a . . . little resistance to tp . . .

mags would cause some chaos but couldn't put cm out quick enough before flash joined him after flash helps gl ko exodus. with gl, mags is screwed.

interestingly enough, i think magik might be a real threat. even still, ww should be able to deal with her, or cm. juggs is a non-factor as he's far too slow and ground-bound to make any difference. aurora is trumped by superman. sinister is . . .

jla 7-8/10

So the anatomy of 616 Mutants is in a computer in the central OAN battery? Somehow I find this highly unlikely. The marvel U is NOT the DC U. and mutant powers aren't "easily turned off."

If Kyle and John had the ability to simply remove an individual's powers at will, they would have actually USED it against significant threats. As it is, the only examples you have of this actually happening are....well..never. Gorilla Grodd is not the same as a human mutant.




A horde of Neron demons still equals Zero 616 Mutants, and Zero 616 Mutant Genes. WHAT you spend your time doing is just as important as HOW LONG. Though I admit you do have a good point regarding comic book timelines.



Again, the genetic events that occurred to trigger mutations in 616 is NOT the same as that in the DCU. 616 Mutations occur as a result of celestial tampering at the dawn of man. As there are no celestials in the DCU, the gene structure is totally different.

Also- I'd like to see evidence of kyle "turning off" the powers of these mutants in his rogue's gallery.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not calling Kyle or John totally inexperienced or rookies. But compared to surfer, who has a LOT more experience with 616 mutants as well as gene tampering (surfer evolved an entire planet, FYI) they're just not in the same league. My comparison of a rookie GL and a vet is totally accurate. same power levels, but different worlds in terms of experience.

the turning off the powers angle is no where near a requisite need for a jla win . . .

and golem, what the heck are you talking about when you said the jla have 'no magic'?

cm and ww are, what, NON-MAGICAL?? c'mon bro, you're better than that . . . .

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Again, the genetic events that occurred to trigger mutations in 616 is NOT the same as that in the DCU. 616 Mutations occur as a result of celestial tampering at the dawn of man. As there are no celestials in the DCU, the gene structure is totally different.

Also- I'd like to see evidence of kyle "turning off" the powers of these mutants in his rogue's gallery.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not calling Kyle or John totally inexperienced or rookies. But compared to surfer, who has a LOT more experience with 616 mutants as well as gene tampering (surfer evolved an entire planet, FYI) they're just not in the same league. My comparison of a rookie GL and a vet is totally accurate. same power levels, but different worlds in terms of experience. Celestials experimented on protohumans resulting in humans, but H. superior still evolved from H. sapiens naturally.

Superman/Marvel/WW/Flash speedblitz the shit outta the muties....

While Kyle and John completely bone everybody else with raw power.

JLA ftw.

Originally posted by leonidas
the turning off the powers angle is no where near a requisite need for a jla win . . .

and golem, what the heck are you talking about when you said the jla have 'no magic'?

cm and ww are, what, NON-MAGICAL?? c'mon bro, you're better than that . . . . Really?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Celestials experimented on protohumans resulting in humans, but H. superior still evolved from H. sapiens naturally.

Not really. The celestials tampered with protohumans several times, creating deviants (with powers) eternals (with powers) and a few other races. Homo Sapiens Superior is the result of their most recent tampering, not an accident.

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Really?

well . . .

sometimes . . .?

maybe . . .?

Originally posted by Space M ummy
Not really. The celestials tampered with protohumans several times, creating deviants (with powers) eternals (with powers) and a few other races. Homo Sapiens Superior is the result of their most recent tampering, not an accident. The oldest known H. sapiens superior are Selene and Apocalypse. Where does it say on panel that mutants are a direct result of modification of humans by Celestials, and did not evolve from the rest of humanity by natural means?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
What exactly do you expect the Juggernaut to do to the 2 GLs, Superman, WW, Captain Marvel and Flash after his mutant teammates have all been made into ordinary humans? Advance on them?

Menacingly.

Originally posted by leonidas
the turning off the powers angle is no where near a requisite need for a jla win . . .

and golem, what the heck are you talking about when you said the jla have 'no magic'?

cm and ww are, what, NON-MAGICAL?? c'mon bro, you're better than that . . . .

Not to mention the Star Heart....

Anyways.

As for the fight?

There are certain members of the JLA that may be able to take this Solo....

i wouldn't quite go THAT far, and i CAN see the team maybe taking 2. if manhunter were added instead of bats, THEN it would truly be overkill . . .

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
The oldest known H. sapiens superior are Selene and Apocalypse. Where does it say on panel that mutants are a direct result of modification of humans by Celestials, and did not evolve from the rest of humanity by natural means?

it's funny, but i'd sort of had the same impression, for some reason. not sure where i heard or read this, but i was under the impression mutants (omegas in particular) had been the results of celestial experiments that would allow them to eventually supplant the abstracts of the universe.

not saying it is on-panel anywhere, just saying it's an impression i had and that i'm unsure where that impression came from . . .

I"m inclined to think Kyle and John can win this on thier own. Hell Kyle has created an army of Superbeings all of whom had individual thinking. WW kills the Telepaths as she is totally resistant to non Magical Telepathy. Superman picks Juggernaut up and hurls him into the sun. It wont' kill him, but the sun's gravity will soundly keep him in place forever. I dont' see how anyone could argue against the JLA. Especially with Two GL's and Flash. And Batman is the icing on the cake. He has all kinds of weapons for people in the DCU with powers mimmicking the Apoc team.

where do you get 2 gl's . . .?

Originally posted by leonidas
where do you get 2 gl's . . .? In the 5th post, Batman was replaced with Kyle Rayner.

Isn't current Captain Marvel akin to skyfather level or thereabouts?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
Isn't current Captain Marvel akin to skyfather level or thereabouts?

Yes, skyfather level, considering he's the new Shazam.

In which case why are people arguing for Apocalypse... who has always and will always be Marvel's perennial loser?

Originally posted by xmarksthespot
In which case why are people arguing for Apocalypse... who has always and will always be Marvel's perennial loser?

heheh.

the thread starter replaced bats with a second gl . . .?

yikes!! no wonder everyone was all over the jla so easily. criminy. how many ways can you spell curbstomp, anyway . . .?

Supes or Flash could solo that team with a speedblitz. Flash could take out most of that team in the first picosecond

The Hoursmen team have no prep?