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Here is the scenerio:

The X-Men are iin a fortress. JLA, 10 miles away, are coming to the fortress to overrun it and destroy the X-Men. The X-Men know that they JLA are coming so there is no advantage of surprise or time to set traps or anything. Both teams must rely on their powers alone in this fight. However, the teams can begin their attack while far away.

X-Men:

Xavier (with powers obviously)
Storm
Jean Grey (No Phoenix Force)
White Queen
Rogue (with absorption powers and
Magma
Cyclops
Nightcrawler
Wolverine
Iceman

JLA:

Superman
Wonder Woman
Flash
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

Superman heat visions their fortress to slag. Unless the Iceman is the Blair Wind Iceman half the JLA members can do this solo.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Here is the scenerio:

The X-Men are iin a fortress. JLA, 10 miles away, are coming to the fortress to overrun it and destroy the X-Men. The X-Men know that they JLA are coming so there is no advantage of surprise or time to set traps or anything. Both teams must rely on their powers alone in this fight. However, the teams can begin their attack while far away.

X-Men:

Xavier (with powers obviously)
Storm
Jean Grey (No Phoenix Force)
White Queen
Rogue (with absorption powers and
Magma
Cyclops
Nightcrawler
Wolverine
Iceman

JLA:

Superman
Wonder Woman
--**Flash**--
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

doh

LOL poor rutog is so stupid.

Originally posted by What If...
LOL poor rutog is so stupid.

You must be one of the guys I kicked butt on in the Storm vs. Jean thread. lol.

Anywho, ignoring you, I would like to see what some people can come up with in this fight.

Alright, dude. You want something? Okay.

Flash beats the X-Men. By himself. In about 1 full second at the MOST.

Green Lantern devolves them into humans.

Cool. Everyone agrees with this? I've seen some furious debate on the internet before on match-ups like these. The PF was not involved in some of them and still there were very strong arguments on both sides.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Cool. Everyone agrees with this? I've seen some furious debate on the internet before on match-ups like these. The PF was not involved in some of them and still there were very strong arguments on both sides.

That's cool that you're trying to make fair fights. But this really is a curbstomp, and anyone who tries to make a case for the X-Men (w/o pheonix) either knows very little about comics or is biased toward Marvel so much that they can't be trusted.

Okay. How would you balance the team out to make it fair without the PF?

You'd have to put beings like the Silver Surfer and Thor to the X-Men team to even come close to balancing it out. Oh, and removing Flash. I love the Flash, but he's just unfair in most battles.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Okay. How would you balance the team out to make it fair without the PF?

They're just different-level teams. JLA are cosmic. X-Men are earth-based. It would be very difficult to make a fair fight if you wanted to keep a full roster for the JLA.

Any two of those on the JLA roster (except maybe Batman) could probably take out that team. They'd have to be well-written, but even some like Flash, MM, GL, etc. could probably solo them and telepaths are the only reason Supes couldn't.

P.S. Yeah, what Metalmanx said works too.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
That's cool that you're trying to make fair fights. But this really is a curbstomp, and anyone who tries to make a case for the X-Men (w/o pheonix) either knows very little about comics or is biased toward Marvel so much that they can't be trusted.



I could make a case for them. Yes its a small case, and you all know what it would be, but hey its there!

lol. Okay. So lets make this Marvel vs. DC:

Xavier
Storm
Sersi
Photon
Iceman
Hulk
Iron Man
White Queen
Invisible Woman

vs.

Superman
Wonder Woman
Flash
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

I'd say Flash would have his hands full with Photon. I don't like Thor as I think he's boring, so I added Sersi. Hulk is now on the team as well as Iron Man.

Originally posted by Rutog98
lol. Okay. So lets make this Marvel vs. DC:

Xavier
Storm
Sersi
Photon
Iceman
Hulk
Iron Man
White Queen
Invisible Woman

vs.

Superman
Wonder Woman
Flash
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

I'd say Flash would have his hands full with Photon. I don't like Thor as I think he's boring, so I added Sersi. Hulk is now on the team as well as Iron Man.

Actually, the addition of Photon does help the Marvel team, but not against Flash. He's still far too fast to be stalemated by her. The Flash can still take out every single member of the Marvel team by himself.

Now, if you take the Flash out, then you have a very good match-up here, I think.

Flash really needs to leave. Otherwise, at least a few are dead in the opening seconds of the fight.

Closer though....

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Actually, the addition of Photon does help the Marvel team, but not against Flash. He's still far too fast to be stalemated by her. The Flash can still take out every single member of the Marvel team by himself.

Now, if you take the Flash out, then you have a very good match-up here, I think.

Okay. Minus the Flash and minus Hulk to keep the team membership balanced.

Xavier
Storm
Sersi
Photon
Iceman
Iron Man
White Queen
Invisible Woman

vs.

Superman
Wonder Woman
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

Now you could definitely make a case for Marvel. Without analyzing it too much, I'd still give the edge to the JLA here because they still have the top 1-2 overall people in this fight (except maybe Photon)....but it's a close fight now and you'd probably get some decent discussion.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Okay. Minus the Flash and minus Hulk to keep the team membership balanced.

Xavier
Storm
Sersi
Photon
Iceman
Iron Man
White Queen
Invisible Woman

vs.

Superman
Wonder Woman
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

Now the only problem is that besides Iron Man, you've got no brawler on the Marvel side. Not that a brawler is necessary, but when you're up against Superman, Wonder Woman, Martian Manhunter, and Barda, well, you might need it. And well, Iron Man might as well be tickling them if he tries to actually confront any of them physically.

But yes, this is a much closer fight now. Photon could potentially do a lot of damage to the DC side. Iceman has more of a chance now, too, now that Flash is gone.

I correct myself. The SECOND problem with this is that the DC still GREATLY overpowers the Marvel team in terms of speed. If everyone is fighting to the best of their ability here, then DC still wins it. Flash may have been the fastest, but the others are still HELLA fast.

Kudos on the effort though.

Sue, Xavier, Emma and Storm still get speedblitzed. Batman dies. JLA still win.

^^ What he said, you're lacking a solid herald-level brawler to legitimately take on a Supes or GL.

Well, I see the Marvel team working together. STorm can use her elemental powers to blind the JLA team with fog and batter them with elemental assaults of apacolyptic proportions. Emma Frost keeps the team in TP communication with each other so they can see through the weather via Ororo's vision and know where to use their powers. The JLA will be fighting blind.

(Aside from that Storm and Emma are dead or unconscious from being speedblitzed) Aquaman and Martian Manhunter both have telepathy to tell them and the rest of the JLA where people are.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Here is the scenerio:

The X-Men are iin a fortress. JLA, 10 miles away, are coming to the fortress to overrun it and destroy the X-Men. The X-Men know that they JLA are coming so there is no advantage of surprise or time to set traps or anything. Both teams must rely on their powers alone in this fight. However, the teams can begin their attack while far away.

X-Men:

Xavier (with powers obviously)
Storm
Jean Grey (No Phoenix Force)
White Queen
Rogue (with absorption powers and
Magma
Cyclops
Nightcrawler
Wolverine
Iceman

JLA:

Superman
Wonder Woman
Flash
Green Lantern
Batman
Martain Manhunter
Aquaman
Barda
Plastic Man

I like your team member selection, particularly the diversity of the X-men team. Good array of different power sets.

The only issue is the actual teams facing off. The JLA is, simply put, on a whole different plateau from any of the X-men teams (unless one starts adding the Phoenix). Succinctly put, it would be impossible (without PIS/CIS) for the X-men to defeat the JLA in a KMC-style matchup (where both sides are doing their utmost to win).

For that matter around 5 of the JLA members listed above (WonderWoman, Superman, Green Lantern, Martian Manhunter, and the Flash) could defeat the X-men team SOLO. And they could do so with abundant ease, and in different ways (eg take MM and GL ....those two would have so many ways of taking down the X-men team that it would start looking silly).

Which is the thing about the JLA .....the setup and orientation of the team is very different from that of nigh any X-men team.

Think of it this way ....the X-men are a team comprised of individual members who bring some aspect or attribute to the team. Generally speaking each member of the X-men brings in one power or ability, and brings it at a certain level of intensity. If we were to use an analogy of a soccer team, there would be two strikers, a goalkeeper, a defender, etc etc etc.

The JLA on the other hand is more akin to a team made up of individuals who are teams AS OF THEMSELVES. Basically a team made up of people who really do not need to be in a team since they pack enough power to be a team all by themselves. By this I mean that arouond half the characters in the JLA bring so much diversity of power, and at such great intensity levels, that they are simply teams of one! Take MM, or GL, or Superman, or WW (and if I wanted to I could add more characters from the expanded JLA, some like Animal Man who are TRULY powerful). Any of those characters are simply teams of one. Take Superman .....he has top-tier strength, top-tier speed, heat powers, wind powers, ice powers, sonic powers, durability that is basically akin to invulnerability (unless you have Kryptonite, magic, or amazing strength and speed to wear down his solar reserves) ....godness, can even turn invisible by rapidly vibrating. Martian Manhunter has all of the above plus more (eg telepathy, phasing, etc).
Green Lantern is a walking plot device (properly written a GL can do nigh anything with that Oan ring). Now that guy would be a beast.

Hence matching up an X-men team with the JLA, and making the bout be under KMC rules, is in essence a mismatch.

The two teams have different orientations.

A crude analogy would be like comparing a cop car to a Main Battle Tank.
Both are used to get 'bad guys,' and both are made specifically for those objectives (eg the cop car is suped up with better suspension and a potent engine, while the tank is ....well ....a tank).
However, putting the cop car against the tank, and telling the two to do battle would be a mismatch. Because they have different orientations.
It would be more of a mismatch if the tank also has near-light speeds, can shoot laser beams from its main gun, can fly, can phase, create anything based on the tank driver's will power, has the powers of the gods and magically bestowed weapons, is telepathic, etc etc.

All the same, that was one of the best picked X-men teams I've seen in a while.

Anyway to close this thread and start a new one with the new team-ups? People will read the first team-up and go from there.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Well, I see the Marvel team working together. STorm can use her elemental powers to blind the JLA team with fog and batter them with elemental assaults of apacolyptic proportions. Emma Frost keeps the team in TP communication with each other so they can see through the weather via Ororo's vision and know where to use their powers. The JLA will be fighting blind.

The JLA team would also be working together.

Storm has elemental powers, but Superman, MartianManhunter and GL can also whip up a very strong wind. And anyways, there is no way Storm can bring up cold/wind strong enough to affect the JLA (apart from folks like Batman) without long ago affecting the X-men.

Emma Frost can use TP. As can Xavier and JG. However look at the JLA team .....Martian Manhunter is an extremely powerful telepath (some of his telepathic feats are legendary), Aquaman is also a very good telepath, and GLs can use their rings for high-level telepathy. Thus the Marvellites do not have a TP advantage.

The JLA wouldn't be fighting blind. To be honest they wouldn't even be fighting. They would be beating the X-men. The two teams are on different levels.

spetznaz hit it right on the money. I have nothing more to say.

Originally posted by Rutog98
Anyway to close this thread and start a new one with the new team-ups? People will read the first team-up and go from there.

Cool. I'll close it. Feel free to make the new one (you might add one more for the X-Men though).