Mistress Death vs The Spectre

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norrinradd43
which one of these harbringers of doom would come out on top Happy Dance

Space M ummy
I assume you mean the Marvel Comics Death, and not "Lady Death?"

MC Death takes this. immortal, unkillable, does not actually have a physical form, essential force of the universe..yadda yadda etc.

norrinradd43
yes I do mean marvel death

King Kandy
Spectre, but it depends on what power he's functioning at.

batdude123
Originally posted by Space M ummy
I assume you mean the Marvel Comics Death, and not "Lady Death?"

MC Death takes this. immortal, unkillable, does not actually have a physical form, essential force of the universe..yadda yadda etc.

Death isn't beating Spectre.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by batdude123
Death isn't beating Spectre.

I'd disagree. Can spectre be killed at all? I think so.

Can death be killed? definitely not. It's death! Death can and has banned certain individuals (mr. immortal, thanos, all the elders) from dying. it can certainly do so to itself. It's ALSO granted the ability to kill anything to certain individuals- The Rot comes to mind here.

Spectre has no way to injure or hurt "death." how does he pull out a win?

batdude123
Originally posted by Space M ummy
I'd disagree. Can spectre be killed at all? I think so.

Can death be killed? definitely not. It's death! Death can and has banned certain individuals (mr. immortal, thanos, all the elders) from dying. it can certainly do so to itself. It's ALSO granted the ability to kill anything to certain individuals- The Rot comes to mind here.

Spectre has no way to injure or hurt "death." how does he pull out a win?

That's like saying the Living Tribunal has no way of hurting death or injuring her in any way.

Far more powerful beings than she can certainly beat her.... and Spectre is a lot more powerful than she is.

King Kandy
It's simple. Since this fight is with MISTRESS death, and not "Things Dieing", he just needs to destroy the M-Body.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by batdude123
That's like saying the Living Tribunal has no way of hurting death or injuring her in any way.

Far more powerful beings than she can certainly beat her.... and Spectre is a lot more powerful than she is.

The tribunal is judge, jury, and executioner of the marvel universe. Whatever it says simply IS. I have no doubt that the tribunal could override the power of death in certain circumstances, due do his role in the universe. Spectre, unfortunately does not have this ability.

but yet- the tribunal HAS been killed by thanos with the HOTU, meaning that even the tribunal is technically NOT above death completely.

Remember, Death is not just an entity- it's a concept as well. IF something can be killed, then it's subject to death's power.



the two are one and the same. I don't think you understand- death isn't strictly male or female- it appears as it wants to. The M-body isn't it's physical form. defeating it- even if that was possible- would in NO WAY defeat death. "Things dying" in the marvel universe only occurs because death wills it- its part of death's powerset.

King Kandy
That's what I'm saying. Death is neither male nor female, but the Entity known as mistress Death is a M-Body fasioned in the form of a woman. It's immensly powerful, having all the powers of Death...

But Ultimatly it's a fractyl, and it can be destroyed if you pump enough energy onto it. If you destroy an M-Body, it doesn't get rid of the concept (Usualy), but Destroying that M-Body still counts as a win, since that's the incarnation that is being used.

batdude123
Originally posted by Space M ummy
The tribunal is judge, jury, and executioner of the marvel universe. Whatever it says simply IS. I have no doubt that the tribunal could override the power of death in certain circumstances, due do his role in the universe. Spectre, unfortunately does not have this ability.

but yet- the tribunal HAS been killed by thanos with the HOTU, meaning that even the tribunal is technically NOT above death completely.

Remember, Death is not just an entity- it's a concept as well. IF something can be killed, then it's subject to death's power.

Spectre is God's Wrath. He, essentially, has the power of God. Death... doesn't. Death is someone who was defeated by Dr. Strange. When it comes to cosmic hierarchy, she's not that impressive at all. She's below Galactus. Spectre wins this one easily.

And the only reason Thanos w/ the HOTU beat LT is because he literally had the power of TOAA.

Mider999
LT sucks what great feats has he had for us lately, getting owned by reed richards, or having his powers copied by a mutant and having to get saved by a celestial, wow what a powerhouse.

Spectre seems to be able to draw on limitless power he has had to face nigh omnipatent beings and has won, he even shattered the source of all magic, he also froze hell over, he was beating heavens armies was he not sept micheal. Death cant even handle the elders she had to kick them out cause they took over, if they can do that then im thinking spectre can too, when she tried to take dr strange, he used all the power he could and she ran off.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by batdude123
Spectre is God's Wrath. He, essentially, has the power of God. Death... doesn't. Death is someone who was defeated by Dr. Strange. When it comes to cosmic hierarchy, she's not that impressive at all. She's below Galactus. Spectre wins this one easily.

And the only reason Thanos w/ the HOTU beat LT is because he literally had the power of TOAA.

Spectre is God's wrath but is NOT god/the presence itself. Without the full backing of the presence, he's only on par with eclipso who had the same role. He's been defeated before by beings FAR below "death itself."

Death DOES have rules it abides by- that is why strange was able to prevent death from taking him, but don't get confused. Strange is NOT capable of destroying death by a long shot.

Death is FAR above galactus. not only can Galactus be killed, but Galactus was unable to absorb the elders of the universe when death barred them from her realm. In fact, he nearly died from the attempt. Death > Galactus.

this particular discussion is actually quite fun.

King Kandy
Last Planet Standing isn't Canon. It never happened.

Superherovandal
The Spectre is a piece of God. Its been proven by Hal Jordan. The Logoz. Eclipso isn't that powerful. He gets weakened by freakin sunlight.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
Last Planet Standing isn't Canon. It never happened.

who were you referring to here? I didn't quote last planet standing.



I usually wouldnt even bother responding to this, but why not. Spectre seems to draw on limitless power, but death IS limitless by default.

If spectre shattered the source of all magic, why was there magic still around? Why was he getting into fistfights with captain marvel and shazam if he was all powerful?

Death barred the elders from her realm because death views their takeover attempt as an insult. since death views dying as a privelege ( the end of all suffering) barring a being from dying at all is far worse than killing them, in it's view. The elders did NOT "own death."



Eclipso was retconned into a previous version of God's wrath that "didn't work out." this is why the spectre is tied to mortal hosts now.

King Kandy
I was refering to Miders post.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
I was refering to Miders post.

oh ok. I thought so, but wasn't entirely sure.

King Kandy
Originally posted by King Kandy
That's what I'm saying. Death is neither male nor female, but the Entity known as mistress Death is a M-Body fasioned in the form of a woman. It's immensly powerful, having all the powers of Death...

But Ultimatly it's a fractyl, and it can be destroyed if you pump enough energy onto it. If you destroy an M-Body, it doesn't get rid of the concept (Usualy), but Destroying that M-Body still counts as a win, since that's the incarnation that is being used.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by King Kandy
That's what I'm saying. Death is neither male nor female, but the Entity known as mistress Death is a M-Body fasioned in the form of a woman. It's immensly powerful, having all the powers of Death...

But Ultimatly it's a fractyl, and it can be destroyed if you pump enough energy onto it. If you destroy an M-Body, it doesn't get rid of the concept (Usualy), but Destroying that M-Body still counts as a win, since that's the incarnation that is being used.

Of course death is sexless that's why it's an "abstract" Doh. smile It's a concept lol. Co you mean fractal? What's maths got to do with it?

smile

rock

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
That's what I'm saying. Death is neither male nor female, but the Entity known as mistress Death is a M-Body fasioned in the form of a woman. It's immensly powerful, having all the powers of Death...

But Ultimatly it's a fractyl, and it can be destroyed if you pump enough energy onto it. If you destroy an M-Body, it doesn't get rid of the concept (Usualy), but Destroying that M-Body still counts as a win, since that's the incarnation that is being used.
I disagree with you for a couple of reasons. There is NO evidence of an M body ever being destroyed by "pumping enough energy into it."

M bodies are as strong and durable as the abstract needs it to be. As this abstract in particular has infinite power...well...you get where I'm going here.

I also disagree that destroying an m-body counts as a win- they're only containers for an abstract's power. damaging it (if even possible..I don't think it's ever actually happened) would only allow the abstract to reform it, stronger than before.

batdude123
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Spectre is God's wrath but is NOT god/the presence itself. Without the full backing of the presence, he's only on par with eclipso who had the same role. He's been defeated before by beings FAR below "death itself."

Death DOES have rules it abides by- that is why strange was able to prevent death from taking him, but don't get confused. Strange is NOT capable of destroying death by a long shot.

Death is FAR above galactus. not only can Galactus be killed, but Galactus was unable to absorb the elders of the universe when death barred them from her realm. In fact, he nearly died from the attempt. Death > Galactus.

this particular discussion is actually quite fun.

I never said Spectre was God himself.... just that he's the wrath of God and when backed, has the Presence's power.

Really now? Even a completely rogue Spectre was able to leave Mr. Mxyzptlk completely powerless. Mxy>>>>MU's Death.

This thread is quite silly. In no way can Death defeat the Presence's wrath. Spectre 10/10.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
I disagree with you for a couple of reasons. There is NO evidence of an M body ever being destroyed by "pumping enough energy into it."

M bodies are as strong and durable as the abstract needs it to be. As this abstract in particular has infinite power...well...you get where I'm going here.

I also disagree that destroying an m-body counts as a win- they're only containers for an abstract's power. damaging it (if even possible..I don't think it's ever actually happened) would only allow the abstract to reform it, stronger than before.

Abstracts don't all have infinite power because some are stronger than others. In a closed system you can't get true infinity anyway you can only get virtual infinity. I.e. when you try and do calculations involving singularities everything goes infinite. This is an example of virtual infinity because the numbers are incalculable. True infinity has no number because it is infinite.

smile

rock

King Kandy
in making it "Mistress" Death it was shown that an M-Body would be used for the fight.

And By "Pumping enough energy", I mean you mearly need to be powerful enough. IG Thanos overpowered Mistress Death, death's power is by no means infinite.

Mider999
so what if spectre lost to people lower then death that is cause his power fluctuates but of course if your making this thread so that his power is lower then death then its a spite thread, when we know it can go ALOT higher.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
in making it "Mistress" Death it was shown that an M-Body would be used for the fight.

And By "Pumping enough energy", I mean you mearly need to be powerful enough. IG Thanos overpowered Mistress Death, death's power is by no means infinite.

I understand an M-body is being used for the fight, but what I don't think you get is that M-bodies don't have defined durability levels. you can't say "X has enough power to destroy an M-body" because there's no defined limit to how strong or durable an M-body is.



True, not all abstracts have infinite power- but there IS a heirarchy and Death is Top three. Tied with Eternity and Below the tribunal. Per marvel, death's power levels are "limitless" in all respects. if you have a problem with that, take it up with Joe Quesada, not me.

and please don't try to bring real world math into comic book concepts of infinity. you'll only make Mider's head hurt.



Until we see them go head to head, there's No evidence at all for your assertion that Mr. Mxy is "far above" MU death. MU Death has never been shown to have a limit outside of plot devices like the Infinity Gauntlet or the HOTU, both of which would totally, utterly, and completely rape Mxy.



That's the thing- for the spectre to accomplish ANYTHING on the level of MU Death, he needs the backing of the presence to do it. ANYONE could win with the full backing of the presence! Ambush Bug, Aunt May...etc. The problem here is that then this becomes a "presence vs. death" fight.

If we're debating "the spectre" vs. Death- we're looking at Day of Vengeance Spectre going ALL OUT without calling on the power of the presence to do it- in which case he loses, as this version of spectre has no real way to fight or injure MU Death.

King Kandy
In any case, Spectre is as powerful as LT, who is stronger then death.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy

True, not all abstracts have infinite power- but there IS a heirarchy and Death is Top three. Tied with Eternity and Below the tribunal. Per marvel, death's power levels are "limitless" in all respects. if you have a problem with that, take it up with Joe Quesada, not me.


So being below something deaths power obviously isn't infinite. Entrpy really should be above Death as in the end all things not just the living have to give in to Entropy.

smile

rock

King Kandy
Death isn't in the top three, by the way.

The Rot, Entropy, the Infinites, Entity, and Oblivion are all stronger then Death. And that's just counting beings, not artifacts.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
In any case, Spectre is as powerful as LT, who is stronger then death.

Not true at all. they're two completely different beings. the LT was meant to be the arbiter between marvel's cosmics. Of his three faces, one of them REPRESENTS death, and he can only take action if ALL THREE faces are in agreement.

That being said, the LT was meant to be judge and jury of the entire marvel universe. The spectre has a role in DC but it is not a 1/1 correspondence between the two. He is meant to serve as God's wrath but his word is NOT law, as the LT's is. the LT was able to nullify the Infinity gauntlet just by SAYING SO. no fight, no nothing.

Spectre is NOT this powerful without asking the presence for help, in which case it's the PRESENCE taking action, not the spectre.

King Kandy
Well, in that case, Spectre has no powers AT all, since the Presence provided his powers.

And if LT is all that, how come he got stalemated by Nebular?

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
Well, in that case, Spectre has no powers AT all, since the Presence provided his powers.

And if LT is all that, how come he got stalemated by Nebular?

Spectre DOES have powers of his own but he has a limit to what he can do. DOV spectre was spectre acting on his own without the backing of the presence. horrendously powerful, but NOT as strong as the LT has been shown to be on his own.

Nebular? I don't know a "nebular" but I DO know a nebula who had the infinity gauntlet for a very brief time. As it's already been shown that the power of the LT exceeds the infinity gauntlet- I don't see what you're trying to prove here.

funny how in this entire thread I've yet to see any arguments as to what spectre would do to defeat death, only assertions that it's so.

SO- what exactly woud spectre do to Death? he seemed to have his hands full with a weakened shazam, and THAT Shazam was <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< MU Death.

King Kandy
I was assuming you were talking about Spectre Backed by the Presence.

Now that I know it is not so, I agree.

Nebular wasn't very impressive, he was pretty much a floating upper-body with a staff that could absorb Magic, and he had Magnetic Powers.

He stalemated LT.

juggernaut66666
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Until we see them go head to head, there's No evidence at all for your assertion that Mr. Mxy is "far above" MU death. MU Death has never been shown to have a limit outside of plot devices like the Infinity Gauntlet or the HOTU, both of which would totally, utterly, and completely rape Mxy.


Maybe because Death didn't face any of those but if she would Death would be beaten unless you put her above Eternity or LT
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Spectre DOES have powers of his own but he has a limit to what he can do. DOV spectre was spectre acting on his own without the backing of the presence. horrendously powerful, but NOT as strong as the LT has been shown to be on his own.
Have you forgot that who handled Parallax or Antimonitor
those two were far above the Lords of Chaos and Order.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by juggernaut66666
Maybe because Death didn't face any of those but if she would Death would be beaten unless you put her above Eternity or LT
Have you forgot that who handled Parallax or Antimonitor
those two were far above the Lords of Chaos and Order.

the fact that you're comparing MU Death to parallax and antimonitor shows you have NO clue how powerful MU death is.

just to break it down for you-

MU Death >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Full power Antimonitor >>>>>>>>>>>>> Parallax >>>>>>>>>>>> Lords of Chaos and order.

those beings aren't even in the same league as MU Death. MU Death is as old as the universe and exists in all of them, has NO limits to it's power, has no true physical form, and thus is immortal and unkillable. As all of the beings you listed are mortal and have limits, MU Death owns them horribly.

hunbu04
In DOV spectre without presence backing killed almost every members of the Lords of order and chaos who themselves are cosmic beings with little effort. And another thing MXy is gerater than IG. He is multiversal remember in Emperor Joker saga prove that 99% Mxy was greater than the ALE which is an equavilent of the IG. Spectre is the judge,jury,and excutionary(spelling) of the entire DCU which includes multiples universes.AS was said in DOV if the spectre wants you dead thatn you are as good as dead
The female magician was giving CM the magical powers of every magical being in the universe inclusding those of the Phantom Stranger

King Kandy
Holy Shit, Antimoniter isn't that far below Death...

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
the fact that you're comparing MU Death to parallax and antimonitor shows you have NO clue how powerful MU death is.

just to break it down for you-

MU Death >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Full power Antimonitor >>>>>>>>>>>>> Parallax >>>>>>>>>>>> Lords of Chaos and order.

those beings aren't even in the same league as MU Death. MU Death is as old as the universe and exists in all of them, has NO limits to it's power, has no true physical form, and thus is immortal and unkillable. As all of the beings you listed are mortal and have limits, MU Death owns them horribly.

Actually death can only be slightly younger than life. smile The likes of the Runner etc are from a time before death that's why they are immortal. smile

MU Death you say is Universal smile The Antimoniter destroys Universes.

Here's a clue smile.

rock

pantysniffer
A perfect diagonal line of smilies smile Now that truly is Order out of Chaos, James Glick would be proud of me.

norrinradd43
this tread is interesting, im glad i created it lol

juggernaut66666
Originally posted by Space M ummy
the fact that you're comparing MU Death to parallax and antimonitor shows you have NO clue how powerful MU death is.

just to break it down for you-

MU Death >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Full power Antimonitor >>>>>>>>>>>>> Parallax >>>>>>>>>>>> Lords of Chaos and order.

those beings aren't even in the same league as MU Death. MU Death is as old as the universe and exists in all of them, has NO limits to it's power, has no true physical form, and thus is immortal and unkillable. As all of the beings you listed are mortal and have limits, MU Death owns them horribly.
Did she ever destroy the Universe?
Or what makes you think she is above them?

hunbu04
remember antimonitor is multiversal which is greater than 1 universe
for heaven sake they guy destroy infinite universes

norrinradd43
In all honesty the only time I have seen death use any power was against Thanos in IG #5 I think...I herd she fought strange but havent seen it and it was more a matter of strange being able to avoid dying as far as i know

pantysniffer
Originally posted by norrinradd43
this tread is interesting, im glad i created it lol

Ahh, bless you smile

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
Holy Shit, Antimoniter isn't that far below Death...

The antimonitor is very powerful, but was NOT immortal (as death is) has a finite physical form (as death does not) needed the assistance of machines to absorb universes to get to his strongest power level (death doesn't..it's infinite by default) and the antimonitor got busted up by the FLASH.

In contrast, MU death has the ability to kill anything with a touch. it's granted the ability to do this to Deadly Earnest and the Rot. It's just on another level than the antimonitor.



Death is an essential force of the universe and has no reason to want to destroy it. As I said in another thread, ROMA can destroy entire realities on her own. is she anywhere near the level of MU death? No.

Death is also multiversal- all of the abstracts are. they only manifest in 616 via M-bodies. they're not restricted here.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
The antimonitor is very powerful, but was NOT immortal (as death is) has a finite physical form (as death does not) needed the assistance of machines to absorb universes to get to his strongest power level (death doesn't..it's infinite by default) and the antimonitor got busted up by the FLASH.

In contrast, MU death has the ability to kill anything with a touch. it's granted the ability to do this to Deadly Earnest and the Rot. It's just on another level than the antimonitor.

Surely when no one is left to die then death becomes redundant. smile If Death only inhabits one Universe and that Universe dies then..............
The flash has outrun DC death himself so I wouldn't use him as a good example.

rock

hunbu04
maybe anyone below her level but not people who judges entire multiverses like the spectre of people who destoryed infinite universes like the antimonitor

guy222
Originally posted by norrinradd43
which one of these harbringers of doom would come out on top Happy Dance

Death. Eventually everyone dies

pantysniffer
Originally posted by guy222
Death. Eventually everyone dies

Except immortals or God him/herself or a part of god like gods wrath.

smile

rock

King Kandy
Death isn't infinite, Dammit!

It's universal! It's power Relates to the dominance of Death in the universe.

Rewmac
Originally posted by hunbu04
remember antimonitor is multiversal which is greater than 1 universe
for heaven sake they guy destroy infinite universes Spectre is far stronger than Parallax and Parallax created a universe for himself...He could recreate the universe.

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j105/Rewmac/Scans/Random/LZeroHour1-22.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j105/Rewmac/Scans/Random/LZeroHour1-23.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j105/Rewmac/Scans/Random/ZeroHour0-04.jpg

http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j105/Rewmac/Scans/Random/ZeroHour0-05.jpg

pantysniffer
Originally posted by King Kandy
Death isn't infinite, Dammit!

It's universal! It's power Relates to the dominance of Death in the universe.

Death only has any power over the mortal and/or living.

Death as a concept is present wherever anything can die, but you are right death in the marvel Universe only has power in that universe. Death has rules to follow in the MU as well. Whereas the Anitmoniter does not follow Universal Rules.

It's that simple smile

nvrbeenwthagirl
The Spectre has held and controlled the power of the Presence's multiverse in his hand. The Spectre even Found a way to fight MXy who is shown on panel to be more powerful than The PRe Retcon beyonder. WHo was able to kill Death. Miss Death Becomes the Spectre's *****.

King Kandy
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
The Spectre has held and controlled the power of the Presence's multiverse in his hand. The Spectre even Found a way to fight MXy who is shown on panel to be more powerful than The PRe Retcon beyonder. WHo was able to kill Death. Miss Death Becomes the Spectre's *****.
Mxy was Never shown on Panel to be Stronger then Pre-Retcon Beyonder...

That's a myth you continualy perpetuate.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by King Kandy
Mxy was Never shown on Panel to be Stronger then Pre-Retcon Beyonder...

That's a myth you continualy perpetuate.

In many ways Mxy is a lot like the beyonder coming from a dimension beyond. The idea for both of them comes from a concept in physics best explained in a book called "Adventures in Flatland".

Keep the Faith smile

rock

King Kandy
Mxy has five dimensions, and the Beyonder is said to have an infinite number.

Space M ummy
couple of things I'd like to address: (this is a GREAT thread BTW)

1.) Death is multiversal, not universal. the true forms of the abstracts exist OUTSIDE of 616, and death exists in EVERY one of the marvel universe's realities, without exception.

2.) Death's dominion is not strictly limited to mortals, as he/she/it is able to create IMMORTALS just by saying so. Even "truly immortal" beings in the Marvel U. like the olympians and Galactus will eventually succumb to death.

3.) regardless of how many universes or absorbed, or how many dimensions were created, Parallax and the antimonitor were BOTH mortal, and were BOTH killed by Mortal Beings. In contrast, death can render itself or anyone else it chooses COMPLETELY UNKILLABLE. The methods that destroyed Parallax and the antimonitor would be totally inneffective on MU Death. therefore, MU death is above beings like parallax and the antimonitor.

4.) Mxy is debatable. there's nothing to show he would be able to render death ineffective, and I don't know whether he can truly be "killed" either.

norrinradd43
Isnt the only thing that can really injur the spectre other than the presence the spear of destiny??

pantysniffer
Originally posted by King Kandy
Mxy has five dimensions, and the Beyonder is said to have an infinite number.

Do you understand though what that means in a Universe that is 3 dimensional?

Read Edwin Abbots Flatland, I know the creators of both Myx and the Beyonder will have. Within a Universe like ors having 5 or an infinite number of dimensions will not increase the power said individual has. It's because the extradimensional individual comes from above the "physical" dimensions in that Universe. Q in Star Trek is another example of this type of extra dimensional being.

smile

rock

King Kandy
Death isn't Myltiversal, there is one Death for Each universe. Each Abstract has multiple versions in different universes.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by King Kandy
Death isn't Myltiversal, there is one Death for Each universe. Each Abstract has multiple versions in different universes.

Only in Universes which follow our Universal Laws. I don't know if you noticed the timebroker in exiles state some didn't. smile

Reed has also stated something similar.

Space M ummy
Originally posted by King Kandy
Death isn't Myltiversal, there is one Death for Each universe. Each Abstract has multiple versions in different universes.

no, each "death" in each universe is only an M-body manifestation of the TRUE death which resides elsewhere in the multiverse.

It's the way all the abstracts are.

King Kandy
Dumb Dumb Dumb...

Ever heard of "Multi-Eternity"?

Space M ummy
Originally posted by pantysniffer
Only in Universes which follow our Universal Laws. I don't know if you noticed the timebroker in exiles state some didn't. smile

Reed has also stated something similar.

I'd LOVE to see the universe where Death has no dominion....

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
I'd LOVE to see the universe where Death has no dominion....

One with no life in it smile

It's that simple smile

or something like the Xeelee in a timeloop where noone can die due to the loop repeating forever.

It's that simple.

smile

Space M ummy
Originally posted by pantysniffer
One with no life in it smile

It's that simple smile

or something like the Xeelee in a timeloop where noone can die due to the loop repeating forever.

It's that simple.

smile

Bad argument! Earth-238 had not only no life, but no REALITY left after Roma's devices obliterated it.

The Fury was STILL able to take Jaspers there and kill him, proving that death DOES have dominion even where reality does not exist.

your timeloop example is also flawed. time repeating has nothing to do with whether or not death exists.

Also: another poster mentioned that the spear of destiny is capable of injuring and thus killing the spectre. Meaning the spectre IS indeed subject to and vulnerable to death.

in contrast, NOTHING can injure or kill death. Advantage: MU death.

King Kandy
Nothing can kill or injure Death?

The IG did.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Bad argument! Earth-238 had not only no life, but no REALITY left after Roma's devices obliterated it.

The Fury was STILL able to take Jaspers there and kill him, proving that death DOES have dominion even where reality does not exist.

your timeloop example is also flawed. time repeating has nothing to do with whether or not death exists.

Also: another poster mentioned that the spear of destiny is capable of injuring and thus killing the spectre. Meaning the spectre IS indeed subject to and vulnerable to death.

in contrast, NOTHING can injure or kill death. Advantage: MU death.

Actually it's not a question of existing or dominion. As soon as life was brought in that Universe Death had dominion over mortal life. If it had been someone unkillable like an elder that would have been a different matter.

The timeloop doesn't stop death existing it does stop it acting.

Think carefully about it and argue the point. They are not flawed examples your interpretatioin was simply different to what was stated. That doesn't reflect badly on you, relax.

smile

rock

batdude123
Death doesn't have shit on Spectre.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by batdude123
Death doesn't have shit on Spectre.

How True smile

batdude123
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Until we see them go head to head, there's No evidence at all for your assertion that Mr. Mxy is "far above" MU death. MU Death has never been shown to have a limit outside of plot devices like the Infinity Gauntlet or the HOTU, both of which would totally, utterly, and completely rape Mxy.

I'd love to see MU Death destroy and create a universe. Mxy can pretty much do whatever the hell he pleases, and DOV Spectre bitched him horrendously.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
That's the thing- for the spectre to accomplish ANYTHING on the level of MU Death, he needs the backing of the presence to do it. ANYONE could win with the full backing of the presence! Ambush Bug, Aunt May...etc. The problem here is that then this becomes a "presence vs. death" fight.

When a person creates a "Spectre" thread, it's understood that he means "the Wrath of God." It's only DOV Spectre if it's specified that way, considering Spectre is not normally portrayed as being seperate from the Presence. And even DOV Spectre had feats over MU Death.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
If we're debating "the spectre" vs. Death- we're looking at Day of Vengeance Spectre going ALL OUT without calling on the power of the presence to do it- in which case he loses, as this version of spectre has no real way to fight or injure MU Death.

See above. There's no way Death is defeating any version of Spectre anyway...

Space M ummy
Originally posted by pantysniffer
Actually it's not a question of existing or dominion. As soon as life was brought in that Universe Death had dominion over mortal life. If it had been someone unkillable like an elder that would have been a different matter.

The timeloop doesn't stop death existing it does stop it acting.

Think carefully about it and argue the point. They are not flawed examples your interpretatioin was simply different to what was stated. That doesn't reflect badly on you, relax.

smile

rock

re: point 1: death was shown to have dominion in a dimension where there was not only no previous life, but also no reality left. This is a zone that renders serious reality warpers like jaspers (and presumably, mxy, cube beings, the reality gem, etc) totally powerless, yet death was just as effective.

how would you test whether or not death had dominion in a dimension with no life? I could just as easily assert that a lifeless dimension is one where ONLY death exists.

the timeloop has nothing to do with death. Think of it this way. say we have a hour long timeloop in which Joe kills susan, then it resets.
Does this mean Susan never dies? no, it means that the event where susan is killed simply occurs repeatedly as time is reset. it doesn't stop the event, it simply repeats it.

Don't forget death's powerset includes not only the ability to terminate life, but ALSO to ressurrect it, and bar an individual from dying completely.

I agree, my interpretation of these examples is different than yours, but you've yet to prove yours is a superior interpretation than mine. just different. Relax, it doesn't necessarily reflect badly on you.

batdude123
Originally posted by pantysniffer
How True smile

Unless Crispus Allen is in to that kind of stuff... dodgy

juggernaut66666
Originally posted by batdude123
Unless Crispus Allen is in to that kind of stuff... dodgy
If he does that will feel God's Wrath.

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
re: point 1: death was shown to have dominion in a dimension where there was not only no previous life, but also no reality left. This is a zone that renders serious reality warpers like jaspers (and presumably, mxy, cube beings, the reality gem, etc) totally powerless, yet death was just as effective.

how would you test whether or not death had dominion in a dimension with no life? I could just as easily assert that a lifeless dimension is one where ONLY death exists.

the timeloop has nothing to do with death. Think of it this way. say we have a hour long timeloop in which Joe kills susan, then it resets.
Does this mean Susan never dies? no, it means that the event where susan is killed simply occurs repeatedly as time is reset. it doesn't stop the event, it simply repeats it.

I agree, my interpretation of these examples is different than yours, but you've yet to prove yours is a superior interpretation than mine. just different. Relax, it doesn't necessarily reflect badly on you.

Death can only exist in a dimension with mortal life, something finite has to be present. Of course a timeloop has to do with death. Death cannot get into a closed system if noone has died.

A lifeless dimension where nothing has lived has had no life therefore it cannot have any Death. Life has to have existed for death to take place.

smile

Relax nobody thinks you're stupid, it's cool.

smile

rock

Space M ummy
Originally posted by pantysniffer
Death can only exist in a dimension with mortal life, something finite has to be present. Of course a timeloop has to do with death. Death cannot get into a closed system if noone has died.

A lifeless dimension where nothing has lived has had no life therefore it cannot have any Death. Life has to have existed for death to take place.

smile

Relax nobody thinks you're stupid, it's cool.

smile

rock

Irrelevant in this forum battle. As spectre is present, life exists in the dimension by default. smile

nice try though!

hunbu04
you just proof the point there are multiple death in different universe but there is one spectre to judge infinite universes

pantysniffer
Originally posted by Space M ummy
Irrelevant in this forum battle. As spectre is present, life exists in the dimension by default. smile

nice try though!

No because the thread had deviated and we were discussing a dimension without death and the multiversal nature of death and you asked me what kind of Universe would not have deat. This is a different point.

It's O.K. though, it's hard to keep up sometimes.

Chill.

smile

rock

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