Beast versus Daredevil

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masterbruce
Fight in Gotham City. No prep. Bloodlust on.

http://www.marvel.com/universe3zx/images/6/6b/Beast.jpgvshttp://www.marvel.com/universe3zx/images/7/7f/Daredevil.jpg

Alfheim
Daredevil wins. I dont care if Beast has had an upgrade there is no evidnece to say he is any faster and we have seen what Cap did to Beast. DD would probably do similar.

masterbruce
Originally posted by Alfheim
Daredevil wins. I dont care if Beast has had an upgrade there is no evidnece to say he is any faster and we have seen what Cap did to Beast. DD would probably do similar.

Cap is Cap. He is marvel's icon so he doesn't lose much, he even beat Spiderman. You can't use him to gauge DD's success.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Alfheim
Daredevil wins. I dont care if Beast has had an upgrade there is no evidnece to say he is any faster and we have seen what Cap did to Beast. DD would probably do similar.

QFT.

We've been through this. Beasts so called "upgrade" doesnt seem very much impressive imo. Who has Beast ever beat im combat? At least someone worth mentioning. And PLEASE noone bring up Danger, because he defeated her when she was severly powered down.

Also as already stated, Cap beat Beast and so has DD in the past.

Daredevil for the win.

Metalmanx
Beast for the win. Superhumanly fast, superhuman strong, superhuman agile, superhuman senses, superhuman durability, superhuman healing factor, superhuman reflexes, superhuman endurance/stamina, a VERY accomplished fighter, razar-sharp claws, high-genius intellect and tactical skills, etc., etc...

Did I forget anything?

masterbruce
Originally posted by Metalmanx


Did I forget anything?

yes, he has a layer of blue fur...making it hard for DD to do his nerve strikes.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Beast for the win. Superhumanly fast, superhuman strong, superhuman agile, superhuman senses, superhuman durability, superhuman healing factor, superhuman reflexes, superhuman endurance/stamina, a VERY accomplished fighter, razar-sharp claws, high-genius intellect and tactical skills, etc., etc...

Did I forget anything?

But Daredevil is a better fighter. Hes faced opponents like that before. Beast on the other hand.....

jrodslam
Originally posted by masterbruce
yes, he has a layer of blue fur...making it hard for DD to do his nerve strikes.

Would it? I doubt so. Even IF they didnt work, punches would do just fine.

masterbruce
Originally posted by jrodslam
Would it? I doubt so. Even IF they didnt work, punches would do just fine.

nerve shots have to be VERY accurate to work (I know). So with beast having a layer of fur covering his entire body, it would be VERY HARD (if not impossible) for DD to land a nerve shot.

jrodslam
Originally posted by masterbruce
nerve shots have to be VERY accurate to work (I know). So with beast having a layer of fur covering his entire body, it would be VERY HARD (if not impossible) for DD to land a nerve shot.

DD is probably the best in-fight nerve hitter in Marvel. Secondly, youre talking about a guy who can read just by touching the ink on a paper. I dont think hed have a problem getting through the fur at all.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by masterbruce
yes, he has a layer of blue fur...making it hard for DD to do his nerve strikes.

Actually...yea. You're right. He does have a protective layer that would give him natural resistances to nerve strikes. It won't stop them completely, but it will definitely give him a level of resistance to them.

Good call, MB. thumb up

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
But Daredevil is a better fighter. Hes faced opponents like that before. Beast on the other hand.....

That's just it. DD really hasn't fought anyone like Beast before, with all of his attributes in one character. If he has and I've forgotten, please correct me.

In my opinion, Beast definitely has what it takes to take out DD.

Soljer
Originally posted by Metalmanx
That's just it. DD really hasn't fought anyone like Beast before, with all of his attributes in one character. If he has and I've forgotten, please correct me.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Daredevil BEST Beast once?

Which would mean that he's fought someone EXACTLY like Beast before and come out on top?

jrodslam
Originally posted by Soljer
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Daredevil BEST Beast once?

Which would mean that he's fought someone EXACTLY like Beast before and come out on top?

Exactly.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by Soljer
Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't Daredevil BEST Beast once?

Which would mean that he's fought someone EXACTLY like Beast before and come out on top?

He did? When was this? What were the circumstances?

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
That's just it. DD really hasn't fought anyone like Beast before, with all of his attributes in one character. If he has and I've forgotten, please correct me.

In my opinion, Beast definitely has what it takes to take out DD.

Hes fought Sabertooth and Wolveirne. Hes fought Spiderman. All of who have better attributes than Beast. Hell, hes even fought Beast and beat him.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
He did? When was this? What were the circumstances?

Its in the Daredevil Respect Thread.yes

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
Its in the Daredevil Respect Thread.yes

http://img135.imageshack.us/my.php?image=daredevil155159xd.jpg

This?

Man. Usually I'm all for scans as evidence. But damn. I've seen random street thugs do better against DD. erm

What a horrid showing for Beast. It's like the writer forgot all about his superhuman senses. sad

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
http://img135.imageshack.us/my.php?image=daredevil155159xd.jpg

This?

Man. Usually I'm all for scans as evidence. But damn. I've seen random street thugs do better against DD. erm

What a horrid showing for Beast. It's like the writer forgot all about his superhuman senses. sad

Beast is on the jobber list with Tasky imo. Its been shown that he doesnt fare to well against someone with some skill and doesnt just beserk out.

ALso, i dont think his senses would have helped at all. It not like it would negate DD's.

Soljer
An in-character beast would get taken down by Daredevil, in my opinion.

If he were to go feral, he'd fare a lot better.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
Beast is on the jobber list with Tasky imo. Its been shown that he doesnt fare to well against someone with some skill and doesnt just beserk out.

ALso, i dont think his senses would have helped at all. It not like it would negate DD's.

I didn't say anything about negating DD's senses. Merely that he should've sensed him there a mile away. His superhuman hearing, his superhuman sense of smell...I mean, damn. It's like he closed off his ears and nose before-hand. erm

In my opinion, not just because it goes against my argument, that is a horrible jobbing for Beast. Hell, I wouldn't have even been too upset if DD did win the encounter. But the way it was portrayed right there? That's pathetic.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Soljer
An in-character beast would get taken down by Daredevil, in my opinion.

If he were to go feral, he'd fare a lot better.

Possibly. Hed also be much dumber in feral mode.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
I didn't say anything about negating DD's sensing. Merely that he should've sensed him there a mile away. His superhuman hearing, his superhuman sense of smell...I mean, damn. It's like he closed off his ears and nose before-hand. erm

In my opinion, not just because it goes against my argument, that is a horrible jobbing for Beast. Hell, I wouldn't have even been too upset if DD did win the encounter. But the way it was portrayed right there? That's pathetic.

laughing I hear you Metal. Les not forget that Daredevil is a ninja, so him sneaking up on Beast shouldnt be too out of the question.erm

Soljer
Originally posted by jrodslam
Possibly. Hed also be much dumber in feral mode.

Perhaps, but he's also a much better fighter. His quarrels with Wolverine and Sabretooth didn't make him look too bad...

But only when he was feral.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by Soljer
Perhaps, but he's also a much better fighter. His quarrels with Wolverine and Sabretooth didn't make him look too bad...

But only when he was feral.

I remember Beast pretty much handing it to Sabes while completely non-feral.

And he totally stalemated Wolverine in Astonishing, in my opinion.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
laughing I hear you Metal. Les not forget that Daredevil is a ninja, so him sneaking up on Beast shouldnt be too out of the question.erm

Well, yea. Believe me, I love DD. I'm not taking away from his abilities at all. But I mean, come on. Ninja or not, DD gives off a scent and has a heartbeat. Both of which should've been easily detectable by a non-jobbing Beast. Know what I'm saying?

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
But I mean, come on. Ninja or not, DD gives off a scent and has a heartbeat. Both of which should've been easily detectable by a non-jobbing Beast. Know what I'm saying?

I get you, but could Beast od that? Are his senses that good to be detecting heartbeats? Scents would be more like it for him however.erm

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
I remember Beast pretty much handing it to Sabes while completely non-feral.

Can you post scans of that? Id like to see it. Is it in his respect thread?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
And he totally stalemated Wolverine in Astonishing, in my opinion.

I agree.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
Can you post scans of that? Id like to see it. Is it in his respect thread?

Here a confrontation between Beast and Sabretooth. Now there's interference from Cyclops, but it should also be noted that Beast is trying to apprehend Sabretooth, not put him down. I'm not saying that Beast should take majority over Creed, but it does seem that he could have pulled a solid win in this particular instance if he were going all out.

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/6871/sabretoothredzonep16vw6.jpg
http://img481.imageshack.us/img481/4990/sabretoothredzonep17la1.jpg
http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/8436/sabretoothredzonep18xt0.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/6656/sabretoothredzonep19tk0.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1479/sabretoothredzonep20vk9.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1548/sabretoothredzonep38iw1.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/6487/sabretoothredzonep39nv8.jpg

I agree with how the Respect Thread worded it. He was basically trying to calm and incapacitate Creed throughout this fight. And even still, he appeared to have the upper hand.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Here a confrontation between Beast and Sabretooth. Now there's interference from Cyclops, but it should also be noted that Beast is trying to apprehend Sabretooth, not put him down. I'm not saying that Beast should take majority over Creed, but it does seem that he could have pulled a solid win in this particular instance if he were going all out.

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/6871/sabretoothredzonep16vw6.jpg
http://img481.imageshack.us/img481/4990/sabretoothredzonep17la1.jpg
http://img369.imageshack.us/img369/8436/sabretoothredzonep18xt0.jpg
http://img171.imageshack.us/img171/6656/sabretoothredzonep19tk0.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1479/sabretoothredzonep20vk9.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/1548/sabretoothredzonep38iw1.jpg
http://img170.imageshack.us/img170/6487/sabretoothredzonep39nv8.jpg

I agree with how the Respect Thread worded it. He was basically trying to calm and incapacitate Creed throughout this fight. And even still, he appeared to have the upper hand.

Sweet. Thanks. Now in all fairness, Sabes wasnt really trying to fight with Beast either. The whole thing was mostly running and dialogue.

Brutacus
Well iff you check the danger fight and other fights where beast is in, you can clearly see he goes all out he even bite's, fight's like real animal.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
Sweet. Thanks. Now in all fairness, Sabes wasnt really trying to fight with Beast either. The whole thing was mostly running and dialogue.

True, I'll give you that. Can't deny it. But again, in fairness, Sabes (even in this scenario) was still far more ruthless than Beast was.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Brutacus
Well iff you check the danger fight and other fights where beast is in, you can clearly see he goes all out he even bite's, fight's like real animal.

Well like i stated before, when Beast did the job on Danger, she was severly depowered. Downgraded in offense as well as defense. No much of a feat there.

Now when he was fighting her in the mansion, he did go for the wires, but to no avail he still got thrashed.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
True, I'll give you that. Can't deny it. But again, in fairness, Sabes (even in this scenario) was still far more ruthless than Beast was.

Ok, i can agree with that. Although from hearing the talk9nig between the two it appeared that Sabes didnt wasnt to be in his condition and was trying to fight it. Either way, youre right, Beast did seem like the aggressor.

Brutacus
Originally posted by jrodslam
Well like i stated before, when Beast did the job on Danger, she was severly depowered. Downgraded in offense as well as defense. No much of a feat there.

Now when he was fighting her in the mansion, he did go for the wires, but to no avail he still got thrashed.

I know she was downgraded, and also know it might not have been the greatest feat, but I was rather talking about the way he fought.
He fought her like a animal with the biting and the claws.
So this in my eye's is a better way to fight against DD, because like you said before DD is to skilled for beast to fight him in a normal h2h battle.
This way he could cut DD up pretty bad.
And with his feral side he won't hold back, or wouldn't feel the damage DD does to him.
And to come back at nerve striking, this is also a question iff this would work on beast since his body is not shaped like a normal humans body.

For example wenn beast fought kraven, kraven used some posion or venom on beast that would slow down a normal human yet on beast it had a totally diffrent effect.
Now I know nerve strike's and venom or two totally difrent things, yet this shows that his body is not like a human body.

But than again I'm not sure who would win this fight, yet I do know DD has to beat beast fast since I'm pretty sure beast should be able to outlast him.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Brutacus
I know she was downgraded, and also know it might not have been the greatest feat, but I was rather talking about the way he fought.
He fought her like a animal with the biting and the claws.
So this in my eye's is a better way to fight against DD, because like you said before DD is to skilled for beast to fight him in a normal h2h battle.
This way he could cut DD up pretty bad.
And with his feral side he won't hold back, or wouldn't feel the damage DD does to him.
And to come back at nerve striking, this is also a question iff this would work on beast since his body is not shaped like a normal humans body.

For example wenn beast fought kraven, kraven used some posion or venom on beast that would slow down a normal human yet on beast it had a totally diffrent effect.
Now I know nerve strike's and venom or two totally difrent things, yet this shows that his body is not like a human body.

But than again I'm not sure who would win this fight, yet I do know DD has to beat beast fast since I'm pretty sure beast should be able to outlast him.

Beast going feral on DD may or may not help him much. I say that because hes not thinking about what hes doing. Hes just leaping at DD and clawing. I personally think thats right up DD's alley. Im pretty sure hed much rather fight somene whos in a built up rage that doesnt think in battle.

I must admit that IF Beast feral/rage mode is like Wovies Beserk mode, it may be a bit harder for DD to read Beasts moves, but hed probably still be able to do it, only with more difficulty.

As far as nerve strikes go, i dont think because Beasts body is more cat-like, he wont be susceptible to the nerve hits. Because of the senses, hed know the right places to hit if they arent where a normal humans body nerves would be.

llagrok
DD was capable of beating Wolverine when he was under Hydra's control, so he could probably handle Beast.

Although Beasts sense makes it near impossible to sneak up, I have a feeling Daredevil could do it. The shi'ar guardsman who turned himself invisible wasn't able to, but Beast probably heard him.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by llagrok
DD was capable of beating Wolverine when he was under Hydra's control, so he could probably handle Beast.

Although Beasts sense makes it near impossible to sneak up, I have a feeling Daredevil could do it. The shi'ar guardsman who turned himself invisible wasn't able to, but Beast probably heard him.

Beast DID hear him. And I think smelled him, too. He sensed him just as good as if he could see him.

I still think Beast gets the majority here.

capt it up
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Well, yea. Believe me, I love DD. I'm not taking away from his abilities at all. But I mean, come on. Ninja or not, DD gives off a scent and has a heartbeat. Both of which should've been easily detectable by a non-jobbing Beast. Know what I'm saying?

wolverine also was not aiming to kill........


that not the best guage. also sabertooth has pwned beast before if I am not mistaken........

Metalmanx
Originally posted by capt it up
wolverine also was not aiming to kill........


that not the best guage. also sabertooth has pwned beast before if I am not mistaken........

Never said he was. But neither was Hank. erm

For what they were both giving to the fight, it was a stalemate. Wouldn't you agree?

capt it up
Originally posted by llagrok
DD was capable of beating Wolverine when he was under Hydra's control, so he could probably handle Beast.

Although Beasts sense makes it near impossible to sneak up, I have a feeling Daredevil could do it. The shi'ar guardsman who turned himself invisible wasn't able to, but Beast probably heard him.

logan fell on a sword.........


that hardly beating him.........


I think DD takes this none the less

capt it up
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Never said he was. But neither was Hank. erm

For what they were both giving to the fight, it was a stalemate. Wouldn't you agree?
actaully I think hank was going all out. He let into his feral side. Wolverine on the other hand was not he was aiming his shot so they would not injure beast. If he was fighting to injure beast his claws could have doen some major damage.

It was a feral all out beast stalemating wolverine who was holding back. Impressive though it is. It hard to guage that accuratly.

still an impressive feat though.

capt it up
Capt has pwned beast

DD has pwned beast

beast really has never shown the type of skill or feats that give him a win over DD. He lose for sure with out going feral.

He may take the win if it current beast vs DD, but even then it hard to say.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by capt it up
actaully I think hank was going all out. He let into his feral side. Wolverine on the other hand was not he was aiming his shot so they would not injure beast. If he was fighting to injure beast his claws could have doen some major damage.

It was a feral all out beast stalemating wolverine who was holding back. Impressive though it is. It hard to guage that accuratly.

still an impressive feat though.

No, he wasn't going feral at the time. He went feral during his fight with Danger. Compare the two? Not the same. Hank was just angry. As was Logan. No feral-ness on either side.

Of course it was Wolverine aiming his shots perfectly as to not injure Beast. It could never be because Hank avoided any critical strikes, right? roll eyes (sarcastic)

But you're right. Impressive stalemate.

capt it up
Originally posted by Metalmanx
No, he wasn't going feral at the time. He went feral during his fight with Danger. Compare the two? Not the same. Hank was just angry. As was Logan. No feral-ness on either side.

Of course it was Wolverine aiming his shots perfectly as to not injure Beast. It could never be because Hank avoided any critical strikes, right? roll eyes (sarcastic)

But you're right. Impressive stalemate.

really now hank looked pritty feral to me. Go take a look at the fight again. Logan wanted beast to get angry. I still hate astonishing they still right logan like crap most of the time, but any ways. beast did not look like he was showing any restraint. We do know logan was since he always shows restraint when fighting teamates he never aims shots that could kill. He aims for flesh wounds. Logan always aims his shots perfectly and it makes a lot more sense then beast dodging wolverines shots since from the look of the pictures logan never aimed at any thing, but flesh wounds. Also we know logan has no problems tagging beast and never has. We also have seen what happens to beast when he goes against wolverine that is not holding back and he simply gets stomped.

still impressive though .

OneDumbG0
I call this a stalemate. I liken this fight to when Daredevil fought his classic fight against Sabretooth many many comics ago. While I laughed out loud that Beast's fur would provide any protection against nerve strikes, Beast's physique and musculature is more cat-like. I've never seen Daredevil use nerve strikes on a non-human foe.

Beast when bloodlusted is essentially like classic Sabretooth. And classic Sabretooth gave Daredevil a run for his money. But seriously... lol at the "fur defense." That's really novel. I suppose next time Bullseye fights DD, he ought to wear a fur coat. XD

5/10 Split IMHO.

Symmetric Chaos
Fur can cushion the impact from a wide object in a manner similar to kevlar (not at the same level but with the same principle)

Try putting on a heavy coat or sweater and have someone hit you.

Tha C-Master
Logically there's no reason Beast can't hold his own and fare well against DD. Of course he'll never beat DD and Cap in a comic book, but that means nothing seeing as they won't even let Spiderman have a clear victory against them in most instances. Crossovers are crappy evidence in debates more often than not.

jasonk3
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Logically there's no reason Beast can't hold his own and fare well against DD. Of course he'll never beat DD and Cap in a comic book, but that means nothing seeing as they won't even let Spiderman have a clear victory against them in most instances. Crossovers are crappy evidence in debates more often than not.

Hasn't spiderman already beaten DD in comicbooks?

peejayd
* and DD has also beaten Spidey in some occasions... smile

phillipan
Beasts powerset alone should be enough to clear a victory over DD the majority of times but Ultimately it doesnt. Myabe because Daredevil gets his own book or because he's more popular he has had some very impressive showings against super powered heroes.

That said I think it could go either way in a comic book and realistically speaking. 5/10.

Brutacus
Well maybe they have beter victory's over beast, because wenn he fought them before without his feral side.
The are more brutal and more trained in a fight one on one alone, beast is a team player heck he must be one of the guy's in comics that has been on the most teams.
Avengers, defenders, X-men, X-factor.
And what might be the biggest reason for him not to go all out, because he's a doctor.
But these's day's with him going feral, he goes all out just acts on instinct and since a lion or a tiger does the same, and works for them.
It should work for beast.
Pretty sure his strenght and speed, are better this way and with his claws out he could deal some pretty nasty damage.
Atleast more than he was a talking intelligent ape, without claws.

rougeredmage
i think beast is going to win this one. i personaly think beast has alot better range of experience then DD. i hope people are not going to get too upset when i call DD a crime fighter, he is effectivley a street level vigilanttee. who fights criminal gangs on super crimminels. while i would say that beast is way above the street level stuff. he has battled people like apocalypse and magneto. he has battled in space he has been an avenger. i admit that i know very little about dd but surely he has better experience gives him alot more chance of beating DD

Alfheim
DD is gonna have no problem putting Beast down.

http://img84.imageshack.us/my.php?image=swork180zt.jpg

Thats Mr Hyde who can lift 80 tons.


Originally posted by OneDumbG0
While I laughed out loud that Beast's fur would provide any protection against nerve strikes,

Know what I mean. laughing out loud

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Logically there's no reason Beast can't hold his own and fare well against DD. Of course he'll never beat DD and Cap in a comic book, but that means nothing seeing as they won't even let Spiderman have a clear victory against them in most instances. Crossovers are crappy evidence in debates more often than not.


BOOOOOO!!!

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
DD is gonna have no problem putting Beast down.

http://img84.imageshack.us/my.php?image=swork180zt.jpg

Thats Mr Hyde who can lift 80 tons.




Know what I mean. laughing out loud




BOOOOOO!!!

Euh you compare beast with mister Hyde laughing out loud laughing out loud laughing out loud laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing .

Dude beast is not a real powerhouse sure he is far more stronger than DD. Still he is also as agile iff not more agile than DD.
He sure is faster than DD, has more stamina, he's more durable.
DD has more skills sure, he has better sense's, but beast night vision and smell and hearing ain't bad, sneaking up on beast is very hard.
And using skills against a all out feral beast might not work he sure won't have enough time to use pressure points on him, he might see the weak spots, but iff beast was all jumping around and striking at DD with his claws iff he hits one time not sure iff DD will still be focused iff he would lose a lot of blood, because a strike from beast with his claws will cause a lot of blood lose.
Throwing the billy club hmm beast might be able to catch it, he managed to catch cap's shield.

Metalmanx
Beast has every category over DD except for fighting skills and senses. And even then, the sense gap isn't giant.

Beast wins the majority. Not in a comic, of course. But since these are hypothetical matches based on their power-sets and abilities, Beast wins this.

jrodslam
If we base fights by powersets and abilities, then the obvious would always win. However thats why you have people with great powers/abilities, but cant fight or use those powers to the fullest.

Its easy to say Beast wins cause hes stronger than DD, but DD has faced many poeple who are stonger than him and Beast combined, yet hes able to roll with punches to either avoid being knocked out right away or avoid being knocked out at all.

Its easy to say Beast wins cause hes faster than DD, but DD has faced people faster than Beast as well, but due to his senses and reflexes, hes able to keep up with them speed wise and avoid being hit effectively.

Its also easy to say Beast wins cause hes more agile than DD but, well........ im sure everyone gets where im going with this.

We must look past the superior powersets cause thats the obvious. Daredevil has beter reflexes(due to senses) and is a better fighter with more skills. Thats why he wins imo.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
If we base fights by powersets and abilities, then the obvious would always win. However thats why you have people with great powers/abilities, but cant fight or use those powers to the fullest.

Its easy to say Beast wins cause hes stronger than DD, but DD has faced many poeple who are stonger than him and Beast combined, yet hes able to roll with punches to either avoid being knocked out right away or avoid being knocked out at all.

Its easy to say Beast wins cause hes faster than DD, but DD has faced people faster than Beast as well, but due to his senses and reflexes, hes able to keep up with them speed wise and avoid being hit effectively.

Its also easy to say Beast wins cause hes more agile than DD but, well........ im sure everyone gets where im going with this.

We must look past the superior powersets cause thats the obvious. Daredevil has beter reflexes(due to senses) and is a better fighter with more skills. Thats why he wins imo.

My previous post was not meant to be solely based on the powers, even though that's kinda how it came out. You know me better than that, jrod.

However, given his abilities, his long experience and intelligence (both academic and tactical), and his skill, I feel that Beast has the necessary advantages over DD to defeat him.

Also, I don't believe that DD has superior reflexes, even with his radar sense. Beast has shown amazingly superhuman reflexes even from his very beginning on the X-Men. At the most (or least, depending on how you look at it), their reflexes are roughly equal.

masterbruce
Originally posted by Metalmanx
M Beast has shown amazingly superhuman reflexes even from his very beginning on the X-Men. At the most (or least, depending on how you look at it), their reflexes are roughly equal.

Also, Beast can control his legs with the same amount of skill as his arms, which will help greatly in a fight.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by masterbruce
Also, Beast can control his legs with the same amount of skill as his arms, which will help greatly in a fight.

True. Very good point. I actually forgot all about that.

Kudos. thumb up

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
My previous post was not meant to be solely based on the powers, even though that's kinda how it came out. You know me better than that, jrod.

However, given his abilities, his long experience and intelligence (both academic and tactical), and his skill, I feel that Beast has the necessary advantages over DD to defeat him.

Also, I don't believe that DD has superior reflexes, even with his radar sense. Beast has shown amazingly superhuman reflexes even from his very beginning on the X-Men. At the most (or least, depending on how you look at it), their reflexes are roughly equal.

Yea, yall have to excuse me. It just seemed like everyone was saying that because Beast has better attributes, he wins.

Technically, if one were to think about it, thats how things should be, but as we all know in comics thats not the case. Some characters are beter fighters or tacticians in battle.

As far as reflexes go, naturally i do agree that Beast has better reflexes. However, i say DD's reflexes are better only due to the senses. Daredevil would be faster to react to something than Beast because hed be aware of it before Beast would. Thus, his reflexes would seem better. Like if a bomb was about to explode in 1 sec, Daredevil would already be making moves to get out and Beast would be there wondering why DD is leaving. I just say DD's reflexes are better only due to faster warning of things. Without the early warning, i do agree that Beasts reflexes are somewhat faster.

Daredevil1
DD wins. The guys skill gap defeats Beast stats advantage imo.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
Euh you compare beast with mister Hyde laughing out loud laughing out loud laughing out loud laughing laughing laughing laughing laughing .

Dude beast is not a real powerhouse sure he is far more stronger than DD. Still he is also as agile iff not more agile than DD.
He sure is faster than DD, has more stamina, he's more durable.
DD has more skills sure, he has better sense's, but beast night vision and smell and hearing ain't bad, sneaking up on beast is very hard.
And using skills against a all out feral beast might not work he sure won't have enough time to use pressure points on him, he might see the weak spots, but iff beast was all jumping around and striking at DD with his claws iff he hits one time not sure iff DD will still be focused iff he would lose a lot of blood, because a strike from beast with his claws will cause a lot of blood lose.
Throwing the billy club hmm beast might be able to catch it, he managed to catch cap's shield.

My post was really in response to somebody who said that Beast's fur would give him protection. The point was that Beats durability is not a factor.

As for everything else Beast doesnt seem to have the skills to keep up with DD.

Beast may have caught Caps shield in the past but the last time he fought Cap he got his ass handed to him. I dont think DD is that far behind Cap in skills. Beast didnt even lay a finger on Cap from what I remember I see DD vs Beast being similar.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
My post was really in response to somebody who said that Beast's fur would give him protection. The point was that Beats durability is not a factor.

As for everything else Beast doesnt seem to have the skills to keep up with DD.

Beast may have caught Caps shield in the past but the last time he fought Cap he got his ass handed to him. I dont think DD is that far behind Cap in skills. Beast didnt even lay a finger on Cap from what I remember I see DD vs Beast being similar.

Last beast fight against cap was the blue ape like beast without his feral side without the use of his claws and teeths.
Now I won't say he will beat cap, but he has a better chance this way than he had before.
And I don't understand why people compair cap with DD, because he got great skill???
Caps Stamina is like 100 time's better than DD.
Heck iff you use cap I will use Kraven a guy that got almost killed by beast
Kraven a guy that also used a serum that made him peak or beyond peak human ability's since some say he could lift 2 tons, got almost killed and kraven also used venom nerve strike's on beast, but guess what the other X-men came just in time to hold of beast, because that's the first time beast went in some feral rage.
And that was the human looking beast, he almost killed kraven in that rage.

This beast is way more powerful, since his sense's are also better, he's suppose to be stronger, faster.
This beast is like a real animal wenn he fights, and use pressure points on a guy that move's faster than you that's like a lucky shot.

The feral beast won't stand around talking like a big ape with a high IQ.
This beast will fight like he's going after a prey.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
Last beast fight against cap was the blue ape like beast without his feral side without the use of his claws and teeths.

Like that would have made a difference

Originally posted by Brutacus

Now I won't say he will beat cap, but he has a better chance this way than he had before.

No it will be business as usual.

Originally posted by Brutacus

And I don't understand why people compair cap with DD, because he got great skill???

DD isnt far behind, he does seem to be better at pressure points than Cap.

Originally posted by Brutacus

Caps Stamina is like 100 time's better than DD.


The fight wont last that long.


Originally posted by Brutacus

Heck iff you use cap I will use Kraven a guy that got almost killed by beast
Kraven a guy that also used a serum that made him peak or beyond peak human ability's since some say he could lift 2 tons, got almost killed and kraven also used venom nerve strike's on beast, but guess what the other X-men came just in time to hold of beast, because that's the first time beast went in some feral rage.
And that was the human looking beast, he almost killed kraven in that rage.

Dont know much about Kraven but cant have been that good at MA, and even if he goes feral that would probably be better for DD. DD has survived a pissed off Spiderman.

Originally posted by Brutacus

This beast is way more powerful,

That wont do **** at all.

Originally posted by Brutacus

since his sense's are also better,

Is that really gonna make that much difference?

Originally posted by Brutacus

he's suppose to be stronger,

Yeah and DD beats stronger people for breakfast.

Originally posted by Brutacus

faster.

I hope you can provide proof for this? As far as I can tell he is stronger but not faster and if hes not faster hes gonna get pawned.

Originally posted by Brutacus

This beast is like a real animal wenn he fights, and use pressure points on a guy that move's faster than you that's like a lucky shot.

The feral beast won't stand around talking like a big ape with a high IQ.
This beast will fight like he's going after a prey.

If the Beast goes nuts that will probably make it worse for himself. It will just leave him open for more shots from DD.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
Like that would have made a difference



No it will be business as usual.



DD isnt far behind, he does seem to be better at pressure points than Cap.



The fight wont last that long.




Dont know much about Kraven but cant have been that good at MA, and even if he goes feral that would probably be better for DD. DD has survived a pissed off Spiderman.



That wont do **** at all.



Is that really gonna make that much difference?



Yeah and DD beats stronger people for breakfast.



I hope you can provide proof for this? As far as I can tell he is stronger but not faster and if hes not faster hes gonna get pawned.



If the Beast goes nuts that will probably make it worse for himself. It will just leave him open for more shots from DD.

Ok I'm done debating with you man, first you should know the beast character, he can run on his four legs at 40 mph,
Provide the proof every idiot knows he can run that fast.
He has the body of a big cat these day's try read up on the x-men.

He has SUPERHUMAN agility, so against the Peak or enhanced from DD, so guess what that means.
Stop with the idiotic pressure points, it's like you use it like the perfect weapon or something while a real nerve strike would require aim precision, now against a guy that move's faster than you.
You won't be able to do that.
And since he doesn't have the body of a HUMAN it wouldn't work like that Kraven did the same in the fight did it stun him yes a bit, but it required a elbow punch from Kraven (strenght 2 ton) to feel it, and like I stated before that was the form that looked the most like a human so the human beast.
That is like 3 mutations ago.
Second Beast is a doctor so he should know his share of pressure points himself.
One hit with beast claws in DD's face and it's lights out.
Iff you check the danger fight, she put her metal finger in his eye.
Did that stop him no he kept going, so don't start with other weak points bullshit, you come up with.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
Ok I'm done debating with you man, first you should know the beast character, he can run on his four legs at 40 mph,
Provide the proof every idiot knows he can run that fast.
He has the body of a big cat these day's try read up on the x-men.

He has SUPERHUMAN agility, so against the Peak or enhanced from DD, so guess what that means.
Stop with the idiotic pressure points, it's like you use it like the perfect weapon or something while a real nerve strike would require aim precision, now against a guy that move's faster than you.
You won't be able to do that.
And since he doesn't have the body of a HUMAN it wouldn't work like that Kraven did the same in the fight did it stun him yes a bit, but it required a elbow punch from Kraven (strenght 2 ton) to feel it, and like I stated before that was the form that looked the most like a human so the human beast.
That is like 3 mutations ago.
Second Beast is a doctor so he should know his share of pressure points himself.
One hit with beast claws in DD's face and it's lights out.
Iff you check the danger fight, she put her metal finger in his eye.
Did that stop him no he kept going, so don't start with other weak points bullshit, you come up with.

Sort yourself out. I and others can easily refute what you have posted, but since you wanna be a jerk about it **** off.

I dont even know what you're problem is you've had it in for me since Luke Cage vs Wonder Man.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
Sort yourself out. I and others can easily refute what you have posted, but since you wanna be a jerk about it **** off.

Sort myself lol and that come's from a guy that thinks that cap with pressure points can hit or do the same damage as a 100 tonner???

Why you allway's have to talk about you and the others, what others you did the same with the cap punching as hard as a 100 tonner, you also said you and the others, what others??????
You can refute, dude the kraven vs beast fight happend so it's proof fact, danger poking beast eye out is a fact.
So you say because DD has skills like cap he can win, so I guess DD can stand up to the like's of hulk?
Iff you compare DD with Cap than I will compare him with Kraven.

You just piss me of with your pressure points, you throw it in every single topic.
You even know a little about pressure points???
Because to me you make it sound like you don't.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
Sort myself lol and that come's from a guy that thinks that cap with pressure points can hit or do the same damage as a 100 tonner???



Serioulsy you're acting a bit unstable I already explained that to you and in the end you started to agree with me.

Originally posted by Brutacus
Ok maybe I was abite to fast by saying he wouldn't hurt them, since your right we are debating comics, so I guess it's possible since you also provided with enough scans I can't ignore.



Serioulsy for some reason you just hate me.

Originally posted by Brutacus

So you say because DD has skills like cap he can win, so I guess DD can stand up to the like's of hulk?

Er did you know that the in the DD vs Hulk thread DD was given a 100 ton strength?

Originally posted by Brutacus

You can refute, dude the kraven vs beast fight happend so it's proof fact, danger poking beast eye out is a fact

So thats just one fight. Besides Kraven isnt even know for his mA skills. Thats why people like Cap can kick Beasts butt they may not be really strong but they are far more skillful.

I dunno man his bio says he is a master of MA skills but ive never really considerd him to be that good. If you give me more examples of Beast beating really skilled guys then i'll change my mind.

As far as I know Kraven isnt as skilled in H2H as DD or Cap.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
Serioulsy you're acting a bit unstable I already explained that to you and in the end you started to agree with me.



Serioulsy for some reason you just hate me.

I agreed that pressure points will do more damage than a normal punch.
Never said it does the same amount of damage that a 100 tonner would do, because that's not logical.
For example the nose or chin are also weak spot in the human body, and a 100 tonner while hitting the face has a good chance to hit one of those points, so it wouldn't matter much iff a good h2h fighter would hit some nerve in the upper arm.
The damage to the face would be much worse than the nerve strike.

Second I don't hate you, but it just looks like you ignore the fact that DD has to come in close to a character that has longer arms, so better reach combined with the claws that could deal great damage, and the fact is also that beast is faster and more agile or do to dd sense atleast at the same agile level.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
I agreed that pressure points will do more damage than a normal punch.
Never said it does the same amount of damage that a 100 tonner would do, because that's not logical.


Yeah well we already had that converasation why are you bringing up **** we already discussed like it never happened.

Originally posted by Brutacus

For example the nose or chin are also weak spot in the human body, and a 100 tonner while hitting the face has a good chance to hit one of those points, so it wouldn't matter much iff a good h2h fighter would hit some nerve in the upper arm.
The damage to the face would be much worse than the nerve strike.


Why are we having this conversation didnt I already explain this to you.

Originally posted by Brutacus

Second I don't hate you, but it just looks like you ignore the fact that DD has to come in close to a character that has longer arms, so better reach combined with the claws that could deal great damage, and the fact is also that beast is faster and more agile or do to dd sense atleast at the same agile level.

Could have fooled me. The fact of the matter is this I dont know of any showings were The beast has beaten really skilled heroes. I dont see why I cant compare DD to Cap..what are you saying that Cap is light years in front of DD, alot of people would agree that Cap is better but not by a huge a amount.

How is he faster? I know Beast has had an upgrade but nothing indicates he is any faster than his ape form.

Furthermore how do you think is more dangerous pissed off Spiderman or The Beast? Spiderman is defintely faster and DD has beaten (I need to verify this) or at laest survived a pissed off Spiderman

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah well we already had that converasation why are you bringing up **** we already discussed like it never happened.



Why are we having this conversation didnt I already explain this to you.



Could have fooled me. The fact of the matter is this I dont know of any showings were The beast has beaten really skilled heroes. I dont see why I cant compare DD to Cap..what are you saying that Cap is light years in front of DD, alot of people would agree that Cap is better but not by a huge a amount.

How is he faster? I know Beast has had an upgrade but nothing indicates he is any faster than his ape form.

Furthermore how do you think is more dangerous pissed off Spiderman or The Beast? Spiderman is defintely faster and DD has beaten (I need to verify this) or at laest survived a pissed off Spiderman

Spiderman is more dangerous sure, he's a bit above beast with his agility, speed, stamina, reaction.
He will beat beast, since he can keep away from the claws and the teeths
But beast with his claws his massive arms and his strenght, so to say DD will just use pressure points on beast, is like a little strange to me, beast has bigger arms than spiderman, so to reach a weak spot on beast would be harder and iff he would get close beast could just bite DD.
It might sound strange and all, but iff a character looks like someone or has better skill doesn't mean he would win in the same way.
I mean doesn't cap has a better showing against spiderman than let's say wolverine (this might piss off some people smile), but wolverine can hold his own and win against cap.
Now beast aint no mayor character in the comics, and it's very hard to find those fights.

Still beast should have just as much experience fighting mayor characters than DD he even been in to space fought the shi'ar guards, he got a lot of experience from fighting with diffrent teams and got also a lot of training from cap (than again what guy didn't recieve training from cap.)

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
Spiderman is more dangerous sure, he's a bit above beast with his agility, speed, stamina, reaction.


Well there you go.

Originally posted by Brutacus

He will beat beast, since he can keep away from the claws and the teeths
But beast with his claws his massive arms and his strenght,


I dont see how thats gonna make that much difference there still seems to be no proof that Beast is any faster in his upgrade. There could be one way to prove it though I think.

Originally posted by Brutacus

so to say DD will just use pressure points on beast, is like a little strange to me,

Well he can do it, but its going to be harder than doing it to Mr Hyde



Originally posted by Brutacus

beast has bigger arms than spiderman, so to reach a weak spot on beast would be harder and iff he would get close beast could just bite DD.

You know DD can pressur points arms as well. It could be argued that since his arms are bigger it will be easier.


Originally posted by Brutacus

It might sound strange and all, but iff a character looks like someone or has better skill doesn't mean he would win in the same way.
I mean doesn't cap has a better showing against spiderman than let's say wolverine (this might piss off some people smile), but wolverine can hold his own and win against cap.
Now beast aint no mayor character in the comics, and it's very hard to find those fights.

Thats true but Wolverine has some good shwoings against Spiderman actually, so in that repect my example still applies.

Originally posted by Brutacus

Still beast should have just as much experience fighting mayor characters than DD he even been in to space fought the shi'ar guards, he got a lot of experience from fighting with diffrent teams and got also a lot of training from cap (than again what guy didn't recieve training from cap.)

Yeah but not in pure MA fighting.

Brutacus
He doesn't need MA with his type of body claws teeth, strenght, stamina, speed, agility.
He just needs to fight like a big cat and that is just what he will do.
the arms wouldn't do much kraven used a pressure point on the arms allready.

Alfheim
Originally posted by Brutacus
He doesn't need MA with his type of body claws teeth, strenght, stamina, speed, agility.

Yes he does thats why Cap has good showings agsint Spiderman. Spiderman maybe stronger and faster but Cap is much more skillful than him.

Originally posted by Brutacus

He just needs to fight like a big cat and that is just what he will do.


Yeah and if he does that, thats going to make it worse. You said that The Beast is slower than Spiderman, if the Beast gets pissed DD will do to him what he did to Spiderman.

The Beast may have big arms but DD is compensated by the fact that the Beast is slower than Spiderman.

Originally posted by Brutacus

the arms wouldn't do much kraven used a pressure point on the arms allready.

Well yeah is Kraven as skilled as DD? DD has used pressure points on Mr Hyde who is alot more durable than The Beast, so DD's strikes will work on The Beast.

jrodslam
Like mentioned before, when it comes to fighting people with some skill, Beast doest fare to well. Going feral only makes his beating worse imo.

Alfheim
Originally posted by jrodslam
Like mentioned before, when it comes to fighting people with some skill, Beast doest fare to well. Going feral only makes his beating worse imo.

There you go.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Alfheim
There you go.


Use skill against a guy that is in some sort of rage.
In this rage he clearly doesn't show pain,(eye poke, from danger).
Meaning animal rage (fighting on instinct heck that's the way animals survive) vs skill would work great for a guy with the ability's beast has.

Also people believe here that Batman can beat DD but will lose against beast than how will DD be able to beat beast???

jrodslam
Originally posted by Brutacus
His opinion, doesn't mean squat to me.
Use skill against a guy that is in some sort of rage.
In this rage he clearly doesn't show pain,(eye poke, from danger).
Meaning animal rage (fighting on instinct heck that's the way animals survive) vs skill would work great for a guy with the ability's beast has.

Daredevil has used skills as well as smarts against someone in a rage. Sabertooth, Spiderman and Hyde are some examples.

jrodslam
And DD has fought Kraven before.

Brutacus
Originally posted by jrodslam
Daredevil has used skills as well as smarts against someone in a rage. Sabertooth, Spiderman and Hyde are some examples.

Than answer this why do people believe batman will lose against beast, but win against DD???

jrodslam
Originally posted by Brutacus
Than answer this why do people believe batman will lose against beast, but win against DD???

Because unlike Batman, Daredevil has super senses and better agility. Many people also think DD beats Bats too.

Brutacus
Originally posted by jrodslam
Because unlike Batman, Daredevil has super senses and better agility. Many people also think DD beats Bats too.

Looked to most the threads, people believe that bats will win against DD, yet he loses against beast, better agility, you say DD has better agility than beast or than batman?
Sure his sense's are better no question about that.

Metalmanx
Why does Beast need to go feral again? confused

He doesn't need to do that to win against DD. And I'm not knocking DD at all. Hell, I think he can take out Cap for the majority. But I also think Beast can as well, if he's not jobbing like a loser.

I miss the old days when Beast actually had some decent fights. Now the writers barely touch him. sad

tkitna
http://img135.imageshack.us/my.php?...vil155159xd.jpg

Can I ask what happened to the Beast in the next panel? If he was KO'd then I would say that its a good feat for DD. If not, who cares about this example? People get punched all the time and still dont lose the fight.

(Also, i'm sure the Beast just jumps headlong into a fight without some type of preperation. I'm pretty sure he could have smelled DD being there. You would think the years of training in the danger room and with the Avengers may have taught him something. Terrible writing.)

Beast slight majority 6/10.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Why does Beast need to go feral again? confused

He doesn't need to do that to win against DD. And I'm not knocking DD at all. Hell, I think he can take out Cap for the majority. But I also think Beast can as well, if he's not jobbing like a loser.

I miss the old days when Beast actually had some decent fights. Now the writers barely touch him. sad

Well because I believe he talks to much in his ape form, that might not be the best way to fight against DD, I don't think you can distract DD easy with talking.
So I believe that iff he would just go all out he has a better chance than wenn he try's to be the smart ass, that for some reason allway's come's back to haunt him.

KinkyJudge
Damn, i love the Daredevilcharacter and is not too fond of Beast, but if oyu is very good at fighting and have a billy club, cna you then defeat superpowered beasts who is so much stronger and faster than yourself its not even funny?sad

Beast for the win

Alfheim
Originally posted by Metalmanx


I miss the old days when Beast actually had some decent fights. Now the writers barely touch him. sad

Oh well. DD wins.

Martian_mind
Beast just wets himself.The smell alone scares of DD.

Daredevil1
In a in character battle. DD 6/10


Out of character blood lust DD 7-8/10 and here's why IMO. DD techniques are way to deadly.

DD death pressure-points.
http://img49.imageshack.us/my.php?image=daredevilv2006176ub.jpg

And this one is just insane like fist of the North Star anime.
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8787/dd84014nm5.jpg
http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/425/dd84015jo8.jpg

psy_blade
Beast's agility and speed is greater than DD's. Plus Beast is far stronger. The only advantage DD has is his 360 degree vision which is compensated by Beast's other superhuman senses.

Accel
Originally posted by Metalmanx
I miss the old days when Beast actually had some decent fights. Now the writers barely touch him. sad
Heh, yeah. Remember the old days when Beast could beat Juggernaut by just removing his helmet and making him turn old?

Daredevil1
You'd be surprised. Beast himself stated he thought he had the agility card until he met DD. Speed probably but not by much.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by Accel
Heh, yeah. Remember the old days when Beast could beat Juggernaut by just removing his helmet and making him turn old?

I don't recall that actually. When was this?

Edit: Oh wait, nevermind. It's coming back to me. I do miss those days, back when he was 1 of 5 team members. He actually had some sweet showings.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by Daredevil1
In a in character battle. DD 6/10


Out of character blood lust DD 7-8/10 and here's why IMO. DD techniques are way to deadly.

DD death pressure-points.
http://img49.imageshack.us/my.php?image=daredevilv2006176ub.jpg

And this one is just insane like fist of the North Star anime.
http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/8787/dd84014nm5.jpg
http://img92.imageshack.us/img92/425/dd84015jo8.jpg

No one's arguing DD's techniques here. We know he's superior in the fighting skill category.

However, Beast's other abilities far out-shine DD's. He's far too fast for DD to even land a decent blow. Hell, he's got feline-like qualities now, too. DD wouldn't even know where to land a decent nerve strike on Beast's cat-like physiology.

Beast should wreck him.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
No one's arguing DD's techniques here. We know he's superior in the fighting skill category.

However, Beast's other abilities far out-shine DD's. He's far too fast for DD to even land a decent blow. Hell, he's got feline-like qualities now, too. DD wouldn't even know where to land a decent nerve strike on Beast's cat-like physiology.

Beast should wreck him.

Dont you mean Beast's other abiities should out-shine DD's? Also, do you really think Beast would be to fast for DD to land a decent blow on him? Especially considering Thor, Spiderman and Wolverine commented on how fast DD was. Plus idont think hed have trouble locating the right nerves to hit on Beast's body. It may take a try or two if that, but i think he can get it.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
Dont you mean Beast's other abiities should out-shine DD's? Also, do you really think Beast would be to fast for DD to land a decent blow on him? Especially considering Thor, Spiderman and Wolverine commented on how fast DD was. Plus idont think hed have trouble locating the right nerves to hit on Beast's body. It may take a try or two if that, but i think he can get it.

My point is, by the time that DD figures out where to hit Beast, Hank would've just grabbed his hand (very easy for somone as fast as him) and then pretty much continue to break DD.

I'm not even trying to be mean, it just seems so feasible to me. DD strikes at Beast, Beast grabs his hand/arm and subsequently breaks DD. erm

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
My point is, by the time that DD figures out where to hit Beast, Hank would've just grabbed his hand (very easy for somone as fast as him) and then pretty much continue to break DD.

I'm not even trying to be mean, it just seems so feasible to me. DD strikes at Beast, Beast grabs his hand/arm and subsequently breaks DD. erm

You just make it seem so easy Metal, lol. Daredevil would be able to predict Beasts movements. Hed also hear his heartbeat and would probably go for that or the area considering it would be easier due to Beasts physique(sp?).

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
You just make it seem so easy Metal, lol. Daredevil would be able to predict Beasts movements. Hed also hear his heartbeat and would probably go for that or the area considering it would be easier due to Beasts physique(sp?).

Haha, I'm not trying to make it sound so easy really. It's just that, well, it should be, considering their skills and abilities.

Yes, I know that DD can, well, "educatedly-guess" as to what Beast will do. But at the same time, Beast is fast enough along with his faster reflexes to pretty much counter or grab DD without much trouble. I mena, this is the same guy that's snagged missiles out of the air with his feet. I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility to catch DD's arm/hand. Would you disagree?

Daredevil1
Disagree considering the skill gap. I'd say DD defeats Beast. He's not far to fast for DD to land a blow this is a guy that can play baseball with bullets by using his billy clubs. Daredevil has hit many speedsters, including Spiderman.

Beast stats are not sufficient enough to overwhelm DD. This was shown as well when Beast failed as well against Captain America. What you consider should is not supported by the books/feats.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
Haha, I'm not trying to make it sound so easy really. It's just that, well, it should be, considering their skills and abilities.

Yes, I know that DD can, well, "educatedly-guess" as to what Beast will do. But at the same time, Beast is fast enough along with his faster reflexes to pretty much counter or grab DD without much trouble. I mena, this is the same guy that's snagged missiles out of the air with his feet. I don't think it's outside the realm of possibility to catch DD's arm/hand. Would you disagree?

I dont hin think it should be that easy for Beast at all. By their skills and abilities, Daredevils' senses > Beast's abilities.

C'mon Metal. How can you say that Daredevil would make an educated guess. Its more like a mind-reading in its clarity. The person may as well say "Ok, Daredevil. Im about to throw a punch now!" Hed know Beasts moves by listening to the body muscles alone. Hes anticipated punches as well as leaps. I do agree that its not outside the realm of possibility, but then againin comics, nothing is. Its just not likely here.erm

willRules
Beast mutilates Daredevil, literally yes

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
I dont hin think it should be that easy for Beast at all. By their skills and abilities, Daredevils' senses > Beast's abilities.

C'mon Metal. How can you say that Daredevil would make an educated guess. Its more like a mind-reading in its clarity. The person may as well say "Ok, Daredevil. Im about to throw a punch now!" Hed know Beasts moves by listening to the body muscles alone. Hes anticipated punches as well as leaps. I do agree that its not outside the realm of possibility, but then againin comics, nothing is. Its just not likely here.erm

My apologies. "Educated guess" wasn't meant to be bad, merely another way of saying "predicting". But I do understand what you're saying. I just want you to understand what I'm saying, too, Jrod.

DD throws a punch, even IF Beast doesn't react in time to counter/block it, he'd still be able to react PLENTY fast enough to catch DD's arm/hand and proceed to break him from the arm up/down. Do you see what I'm saying? I know I'm pretty bad at articulating my thoughts at times.

masterbruce
How impressive is DD's radar in terms of dodging?

I'm kinda thinking of the fight he had with Punisher where they were pretty much trading blows...DD wasn't dodging much of anything.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
My apologies. "Educated guess" wasn't meant to be bad, merely another way of saying "predicting". But I do understand what you're saying. I just want you to understand what I'm saying, too, Jrod.

DD throws a punch, even IF Beast doesn't react in time to counter/block it, he'd still be able to react PLENTY fast enough to catch DD's arm/hand and proceed to break him from the arm up/down. Do you see what I'm saying? I know I'm pretty bad at articulating my thoughts at times.

I get you Metal. Given each of their abilities, Beast SHOULD be able to beat Matt for a clear majority. DD is simply outclassed in everything save for fighting skills.

Beast should be able to grab DD after a block or dodge. He sure has the speed and agility to make it happen. Theres no doubt that if DD was grabbed and immediately(i say that cause hes been grabed and got out of it) punished, then its a done deal for Matt. That muchis clear.

However DD if using his full abilities, should be able to see each move Beasts does before he actually completes it. Unless its a surprise counter of sorts. Matt should technically always be a step and a half ahead of Beast. Just like Kingpin/Wolvie he has to be sure he isnt grabbed or sliced.

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
I get you Metal. Given each of their abilities, Beast SHOULD be able to beat Matt for a clear majority. DD is simply outclassed in everything save for fighting skills.

Beast should be able to grab DD after a block or dodge. He sure has the speed and agility to make it happen. Theres no doubt that if DD was grabbed and immediately(i say that cause hes been grabed and got out of it) punished, then its a done deal for Matt. That muchis clear.

However DD if using his full abilities, should be able to see each move Beasts does before he actually completes it. Unless its a surprise counter of sorts. Matt should technically always be a step and a half ahead of Beast. Just like Kingpin/Wolvie he has to be sure he isnt grabbed or sliced.

It's funny, cuz we're on the same page here, but we're reading two different paragraphs. stick out tongue

If DD then sees each move that Beast will do, will he even attack him in the first place? It seems like, according to what you're saying, it would have to be a standstill. Because, regardless if Matt knows what Beast is going to do a split-second before Beast does it, if he still tries and attacks Beast, Hank can still move fast enough to counter and end DD.

But yea. For the most part, we're in agreement. thumb up

Beast wins for the majority.

jrodslam
Originally posted by masterbruce
How impressive is DD's radar in terms of dodging?

The radar helps him in regards to sneak attacks or from behind mainly. His boxing, martial arts and hearing are what helps him the most for dodging.

Originally posted by masterbruce
I'm kinda thinking of the fight he had with Punisher where they were pretty much trading blows...DD wasn't dodging much of anything.

Yea, Daredevil usually dumbs down his skills for Frank. Hes used his senses at times to predict Puns movements, but i usually slugs it out for the most part. sometimes hed throw in a kick or sweep.

When DD fights Spiderman or another hero vastly superior than him, he tends to use his radar/senses moreso and actualy skills secondary. That shows much more cleary than if he were to fight someone like Iron Fist, Punisher, Kingpin, Captain America, or Bullseye(if going h2h), whereas the skills are shown foremost and the radar/senses are secondary.

At least thats how i take it.erm

masterbruce
Originally posted by jrodslam


At least thats how i take it.erm

fair enough, I accept that explanation. It wouldn't be the first time a comic book character was vastly dumbed down to match against another opponent.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Metalmanx
It's funny, cuz we're on the same page here, but we're reading two different paragraphs. stick out tongue

If DD then sees each move that Beast will do, will he even attack him in the first place? It seems like, according to what you're saying, it would have to be a standstill. Because, regardless if Matt knows what Beast is going to do a split-second before Beast does it, if he still tries and attacks Beast, Hank can still move fast enough to counter and end DD.

But yea. For the most part, we're in agreement. thumb up

Beast wins for the majority.

Lol. Not really.

If DD knows what Beast is going to do, say leap towards him for example, Daredevil can just counter him while in mid leap and try to put him down. I dont think Beast would be able to counter as fast right after being countered himself. I think hed be to surprised that Daredevil countered his ass. Just like Spidey, Kraven(although not as fast or agile). His speed has been mentioned by those i just named as well as Namor and Thor among others.

I bet DD would get off more counters than Beast ever will. Thats IF Beast can get off a counter.

And DD still takes the majority, Metal.yes

jrodslam
What Beast needs are some fights with some street lvl characters. Or anyone with some skill for that matter. We dont have much to base him getting a victory off of.sad

Metalmanx
Originally posted by jrodslam
Lol. Not really.

If DD knows what Beast is going to do, say leap towards him for example, Daredevil can just counter him while in mid leap and try to put him down. I dont think Beast would be able to counter as fast right after being countered himself. I think hed be to surprised that Daredevil countered his ass. Just like Spidey, Kraven(although not as fast or agile). His speed has been mentioned by those i just named as well as Namor and Thor among others.

I bet DD would get off more counters than Beast ever will. Thats IF Beast can get off a counter.

And DD still takes the majority, Metal.yes

Well, seems this is going nowhere. stick out tongue

Agree to disagree?

willRules
Originally posted by jrodslam
Lol. Not really.

If DD knows what Beast is going to do, say leap towards him for example, Daredevil can just counter him while in mid leap and try to put him down. I dont think Beast would be able to counter as fast right after being countered himself. I think hed be to surprised that Daredevil countered his ass. Just like Spidey, Kraven(although not as fast or agile). His speed has been mentioned by those i just named as well as Namor and Thor among others.

I bet DD would get off more counters than Beast ever will. Thats IF Beast can get off a counter.

And DD still takes the majority, Metal.yes

Why is Daredevil fast enough to counter Beast but Beast isn't fast enough to counter Daredevil? confused

Beast is physically superior to DD in every and is mentally superior as well yes

IMO Beast wins 7 or 8/10 (Although it pains me to say it as both DD and Beast are favourite characters of mine)

jrodslam
Originally posted by willRules
Why is Daredevil fast enough to counter Beast but Beast isn't fast enough to counter Daredevil? confused

Beast is physically superior to DD in every and is mentally superior as well yes

IMO Beast wins 7 or 8/10 (Although it pains me to say it as both DD and Beast are favourite characters of mine)

No no. I didnt say Beast wasnt fast enough to counter Daredevil. I said he wouldnt be fast enough to counter Daredevil right after being contered himself.

Beasts physical stats dont help him much here. Its nothing Matt hasnt faced before. Beast on the other hand havent faced someone like DD before. At least not to my knowledge. Although whenBeast did face DD, he got ktfo. Also, DD's fighting smarts are superior to Beasts imo. I say that because of the countless opponents DD has faced at the spur of the moment who were superior to him, but yet thought of a way to come out on top. Beasts books smarts wont help him much against DD.

Brutacus
Originally posted by jrodslam
What Beast needs are some fights with some street lvl characters. Or anyone with some skill for that matter. We dont have much to base him getting a victory off of.sad

Well I guess that won't really happen I think, he's not the x-men's fighter, so even thow he has the stats of being superhuman in every physical way, atleast superhuman to normal humans, he's still the smart doctor of the group, but well he seems to start and show some kind of animal or dark side.
Can't seem to hold his temper very good, starts to turn feral or angry very fast in the astonishing X-men.

Going by his own training in x-men and avengers, and he keeps his training up in the danger room (atleast that's what they keep saying in the comic's).
He should be able to beat him, beast stats are all superhuman, while DD can't be more than peak maybe slight enhanced thanks to his sense's.

But untill beast starts to get some good showings again, I can't really proof much, heck he changed almost every diffrent serie in comics, wenn he first started to turn in to a real beast thanks to the potion he took he has been seen healing from gun fire in less than seconds, than he some how without any type of reason he lost it.
In X-Factor at the end of the comic he was going toe to toe against a 50 tonner with steel hard skin he Knocked her out cold in two blows while taking blows aswell (they wanted to make him a 70 tonner than).

Later wenn he joined the X-men again he was a lvl 2 maybe tops 10.

Now with this mutation they say he's even stronger than before, I mean does it sound like every writter make's his own powers for the beast or does he have some kind of unstable mutation?

Daredevil1
Yup. DD used the environment as the shadows since he can see easily in the night and probably Beast can't. If Beast can see good in the night then its even worser for Beast. Which matches Cap defeating Beast as well.


Point is Beast has struggled with martial art fighters and to my knowledge never has done to well against the two that he fought. On the other hand Daredevil has done great against superhumans like Tombstone, Beast, Nuke, Kingpin, the list goes on and on.

Brutacus
Originally posted by Daredevil1
Yup. DD used the environment as the shadows since he can see easily in the night and probably Beast can't. If Beast can see good in the night then its even worser for Beast. Which matches Cap defeating Beast as well.


Point is Beast has struggled with martial art fighters and to my knowledge never has done to well against the two that he fought. On the other hand Daredevil has done great against superhumans like Tombstone, Beast, Nuke, Kingpin, the list goes on and on.

Beast current cat form make's able to see in the night like a cat, he has some form of night vision, and his smell and hearing must be better aswell.

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