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if C-3PO was made by anakin when he was 10, then wouldn't he be like, 50 years old by the time Luke got him? and by then wouldn't he be obsolete? i mean, that would be like using one of those gigantic room-sized computers instead of a laptop today, wouldn't it? And R2D2 was even older than 3PO!
Also, why didn't R2 have anti-gravity boosters in ep 4-6 when he had them in ep 1-3? Lucas shouldn't have even added them to R2 if the droid didn't have them in the other movies.

its not certain that r2 is older than 3p0. for all we know in ep1 artoo might have just came off the assembly line....not to be anal...but....yeah

also, its clear in ep4 & 5 that 3p0 is not obsolete considering that we see brand new shiny version of him on board the corellian corvette as well as bespin.

r2's gravity boots? perhaps they just stopped working? i dont know.

well keep in mind Lucas made 4,5 and 6 before 1,2 and 3 so not everything will be in place

yeah i know that he made 4 5 and 6 before 1 2 and 3, but he should not have added the antigrav boosters in the 1 2 and 3 because it did not fit with the original story displayed in 4 5 and 6. it did not contribute to the plot of the first three, either.

i completley agree, Lucas has done things like that quite often the question is why? The Obi/Darth talk in ep.4 "when I left you I was but the learner,now I am the master" made no sense in when he watched how it unfolded in ep.3

Originally posted by zhellblah
yeah i know that he made 4 5 and 6 before 1 2 and 3, but he should not have added the antigrav boosters in the 1 2 and 3 because it did not fit with the original story displayed in 4 5 and 6. it did not contribute to the plot of the first three, either.

i didnt mind the boosters as much as when he's rolling around on the ship in ep1. so....what happens when a ship has a sharp contour or dropoff? it makes little sense since the only ship on which they could possibly do this was on amidala's ship. look at all the other ships and try to picture artoo making his way around with the same efficiency.

i was happy just knowing that his sole purpose was to sit in the middle of an engine and fix it when need be.

lol yes but none of these posts answers my other question though. wouln't the droid duo be insanely obsolete?
also, how does artoo fix ships when he's glued to one stationary spot? that doesn't make much sense either.

it makes perfect sense. it wasnt his job to fix the wing on an xwing.
their purpose in the OT was to, as i said, sit in the middle of a ship's engine and fix/maintain it as well as being the ship's computer and even autopilot. thats plenty of validation for r2's viability.
it also makes perfect sense that the c3p0 model protocol remained universal (on screen) for the entire saga, PT and OT. there was nothing to upgrade imho

meh... but you'd think that there would be better models of droids that would come out. if you've seen the movie "I, Robot" you'd know that NSR came out with upgraded robots every so often, thus resulting in the newest robot, the NS-5. Shouldn't it be similar? C3PO was fluent in over 6,000 forms of communication. Shouldn't newer versions of droids have like, 12,000 forms of communication? It's like IPODS. They're always coming out with new things for them. like video capability and bigger space. Shouldn't the droids be similar to that?
Also, on another point, how in the world would a 10 year old kid create such a complex device? wouldnt that be like me (14 yrs old) creating a nuclear weapon? a droid should be insanely complex to create by oneself! especialy when you're a poor slave boy with no money to get the parts.
Also, how could anakin teach 3PO 6,000 forms of communication without knowinng them himself? unless he had some special software, which would cost a fortune, it seems impossible to me

Originally posted by sheastation
i completley agree, Lucas has done things like that quite often the question is why? The Obi/Darth talk in ep.4 "when I left you I was but the learner,now I am the master" made no sense in when he watched how it unfolded in ep.3

... Yes it does. wtf. When they last saw each other, they were fighting and Anakin was the inexperienced one compared to Obi-Wan. While they were both Knights, Anakin was clearly still learning much from Obi-Wan.

I agree about the model advancement. If you see how everything changed between AOTC and ROTS: the ships, the fighters etc. Obviously new technology developed at a staggering rate.
And then, the change from ROTS to ANH: everything has changed, the ships, the fighters etc. etc. And then there is the 50 year old Astromech, still doing it's usual business. It's like now having a Commodore 64 running these boards.

The explanation is easy: Lucas is an idiot.

Ah, yes...

The boosters looked cool on screen though. Nuff said!

queeq, its a completely flawed connection. first off, its clear that one general blueprint is followed in making ALL astromech droids, thus the one-size-fits-all r2-unit seat in every naboo/jedi/rebel ship. and though there are technological advances, those advances have purpose, for example anakins and lukes prosthetic hands. anakin's was flawed in that it was blatantly not real and also (from what can only be assumed) anakin had no artificial nerves/impulses/feeling whereas luke's new hand did. there was room for a significant overhaul is what i am saying. a practical reason to throw out the old design and start anew.


instead of thinking of artoo as an old computer, think of him as an old tractor.
engineered to ideal practicallity. old and worn yet perfectly suiting the purpose he was built for. brand new shiney tractors are basically the same ones from 50 years ago, except more streamlined and a couple of extra bells and whistles and an almost identical yet more efficient engine, etc.

your assumption is that significant technological advances would have made artoo obsolete. my assumption (which the films seem to support) is that just like in this reality, for the SW universe the saying goes "if it aint broke, dont fix it".

That is a lame argument. I'm not talking about R2 in particular, in the OT the astromech is still the going model. Within the OT tehre's no problem, but in the scope of all technological advances it's pretty odd that the astromech model has been out there for at least 50 years. It just doesn't make sense. Farmers nowdays don't generally drive 50 year old tractors, do they?

Originally posted by queeq
That is a lame argument. I'm not talking about R2 in particular, in the OT the astromech is still the going model. Within the OT tehre's no problem, but in the scope of all technological advances it's pretty odd that the astromech model has been out there for at least 50 years. It just doesn't make sense. Farmers nowdays don't generally drive 50 year old tractors, do they?


farmers will drive a tractor till it dies utterly.
and as i said there needs to be a practical reason to scrap/overhaul any
design for anything engineered, especially for a universal piece of equipment which an r2 unit clearly is.

They won't because old tractor require a lot of maintenaince, spare parts and fuel. It's a lot cheaper to update it from time to time.

Originally posted by queeq
They won't because old tractor require a lot of maintenaince, spare parts and fuel. It's a lot cheaper to update it from time to time.

i've lived by plenty of farms and have yet to see a brand new tracor. but we digress into irrelevance.

Where I live farmers update to keep up with the low pricing of farm goods. They have to save money where they can.

well where you live is silly



maybe its less practical over there to repair as opposed to replace?

anyway, artoo was the droid of choice by luke in all 3 films. what more proof do you need that he was at the top of his game? and dont tell me it was just sentimental of him, since to pick a crappy artoo unit for battle would be incredibly stupid of him.

Oh no, I always felt that R2 was top notch, don't get me wrong. I think it's just silly having them in the PT because, like Vader, that trilogy degrades them. R2 was a top notch uberclever droid, now he's an old bucket of bolts.

what if droids become wiser with age? after all they exhibit emotions and are capable of learning. what if thats part of why artoo was so clever?

Originally posted by Schecter
what if droids become wiser with age? after all they exhibit emotions and are capable of learning. what if thats part of why artoo was so clever?



a stupid point. if robots get wiser with age, then why did 3PO switch off his communicator thing in ANH? he could have gotten our heroes killed!!! also, in ROTJ, 3PO wouldn't pretend he was a god to save the very life of his master, Luke!!! He said "it was against his programming" but in the given situation it was the right thing to do! a robot that "gets wiser over time" would never switch his stupid communicator off or not do anything to save his master....

3PO had an excuse, his memory got wiped.

memory has nothing to do with sheer stupidity and lack of judgement

Originally posted by zhellblah
if C-3PO was made by anakin when he was 10, then wouldn't he be like, 50 years old by the time Luke got him? and by then wouldn't he be obsolete? i mean, that would be like using one of those gigantic room-sized computers instead of a laptop today, wouldn't it? And R2D2 was even older than 3PO!
Also, why didn't R2 have anti-gravity boosters in ep 4-6 when he had them in ep 1-3? Lucas shouldn't have even added them to R2 if the droid didn't have them in the other movies. My car is from 1994, still good though. Gets me around, rarely breaks down.

Understand my implication?

Originally posted by zhellblah
a stupid point. if robots get wiser with age, then why did 3PO switch off his communicator thing in ANH? he could have gotten our heroes killed!!! also, in ROTJ, 3PO wouldn't pretend he was a god to save the very life of his master, Luke!!! He said "it was against his programming" but in the given situation it was the right thing to do! a robot that "gets wiser over time" would never switch his stupid communicator off or not do anything to save his master....

r2's disobeyance of orders for a greater good exhibits far more intelligence, wit, and depth than their intended purpose of following orders with "yes master" and nothing more.
and 3p0 is an idiot, correct, what does this prove. i was primarily discussing artoo since he's the one with the brains and the cahones.

Originally posted by Schecter
i've lived by plenty of farms

Wasnt aware that there are that many farms in Jersey?

At any rate, in Kansas where its pretty much 80% farmland, you'd both be right. Some farmers literally drive the wheels off of them while others switch to newer models. Most times its a matter of having the money to upgrade or not.

2/3 of the world's eggplant is grown in jersey, as well as the best corn you can buy. it doesnt all look like the soprano's opening theme i assure you.

Hmm learn something new everyday still. I had no idea, thought it was mainly urban area.

still, if some people buy new tractors and some buy old ones, shoudn't we at least see some new models of droid at least? or at least some that look different and newer? For instance, when the jawa transport was sellin droids to Luke, he was about to take the r-4 unit which looked like a garbage can with some paint on it. However, we never saw any new models of droid...

*sigh* the point is its the same tractor, but newer. there was no need to re-engineer the thing. even if farmer bob buys a new tractor its simply a shiney unused version of what he had before. that was the point in bringing agriculture into this

ye but there were definite diffferences between r2d2 and that red r4 unit in ANH tho. does that mean that there are definite differences between a 50-year-old tractor and a 75-year-old tractor?

Originally posted by zhellblah
ye but there were definite diffferences between r2d2 and that red r4 unit in ANH tho. does that mean that there are definite differences between a 50-year-old tractor and a 75-year-old tractor?

only on the surface. remember that artoo is also pretty much a fitted tool to a small craft engine. its also presubable that all an r2 unit's tools would be in the same compartments as they are performing the exact same task. whatever differences there were between the r2 units were superficial. just as superficial as different fender on a brand new tractor

i actually find it annoying that fighter ships were designed around esthetic preferences in the PT. i always assumed that however any of the ships looked, it was practical that they were built that way. not to be pretty like they're selling them at some car lot, in other words. i think queeq brought this up somewhere. these are warships, not cadillacs

Exaclty. And these droids are also supposed to help them win a war. I doubt a revolutionary army would attack the USA with 50 year old tractors.

hold on, you canot directly compare this to real warfare.
first off, some firearms/munitions/various weapons when were used 50 years ago are still used today. why? no room for improvement.
example: see the colt 45 sidarm for reference.

lol nice point, queeq. it's not like you see old A-Bombs anymore. it's all hydrogen bombs now. same principle, however, it's about 100 times more effective. there should be more effective droids... i dunno. i talked to my friends at school about this subject and we all came to the consensus that, because of the war and the empire, th galaxy went into a sort of dark age. that's why all of the ships and guns looked like crappy old stuff in the OT when everything looked so cool shiny and new in the PT


EXAMPLE: the republic and the CIS both had automatic blasters while in OT they didn't

anybody wanna add anything to support/discredit this theory plz say so

Originally posted by zhellblah
lol nice point, queeq. it's not like you see old A-Bombs anymore.


thats because a more powerful bomb was made, rendering the old one obsolete. you ignored a complete valid point btw regarding certain weapons. as i said, research the colt 45 pistol. im not saying it makes me automatically right about the topic, but its silly to do that regardless

what about me and my friends' new theory tho? has it been thought of before?

fine, your theory is seriously flawed. (notice i didnt say 'stupid')

luke's hand vs. anakin's hand. luke's is obviously leaps and bounds beyond anakin's regarding technology.

also war stimulates research into new technologies, whether they be blasters or planet-destroying death beams. its sad, but probably the greatest motivation for invention and new technology is warfare.

you're completley right.... wow...

Originally posted by zhellblah
lol nice point, queeq. it's not like you see old A-Bombs anymore. it's all hydrogen bombs now. same principle, however, it's about 100 times more effective. there should be more effective droids... i dunno. i talked to my friends at school about this subject and we all came to the consensus that, because of the war and the empire, th galaxy went into a sort of dark age. that's why all of the ships and guns looked like crappy old stuff in the OT when everything looked so cool shiny and new in the PT


EXAMPLE: the republic and the CIS both had automatic blasters while in OT they didn't

anybody wanna add anything to support/discredit this theory plz say so

Droids are mechanics and software. It's pretty clear there were advances on both areas, so why not in droid. Look at ourselves: we put people on the moon in 1969 with 16K (or something) computer memory. We woulnd't dream of doing that today.

And for the Dark Ages: that is such a lame excuse. Being a bit of a layman expert on ancient near eastern history: historians often use that lame lame excuse to make up for cultures they can't directly explain. And that's the only reasons dark ages exist: thet can't explain it. Same here with R2 and 3PO. But that's rather stupid for a made-up world.

There is a feeling of economic stagnation within the Star Wars universe, especially when you compare say, Corellia to Lok.

Where's the feeling coming from: EU?

What about my other question of "How could young Anakin build such a complex device as C3PO?" I mean, think of the complicated software required to run AI, not to mention being fluent in 6 million forms of communication. How could a slave boy with absolutely no money afford such equipment?

a slave boy that works in a junk yard/parts dealer? ... think that's saying enough already

Yeah but Watto only sold ship parts. And why would Watto allow Anikan to take software that had 6 million forms of communication built into it?

as far as I know the movie and novel never said he sold exclusively ship parts, I think they even call him a "junk dealer" in the movie once...
and why let Anakin have it? 'cause he had a lot perhaps and as 3PO made clear to Owen Lars in A New Hope: he doesn't has a need for protocol droids, "especially in an environment like this", so why would Watto keep such things than if he can't sell it to anyone?

Originally posted by zhellblah
Yeah but Watto only sold ship parts. And why would Watto allow Anikan to take software that had 6 million forms of communication built into it?

I remember in this EU book Anakin hid C3P0 from Watto, and in this EU comic he found C3P0 in large chunks so it didn't require extensive assembly.

The above is EU so its like it never happened. So who knows.

Originally posted by Jovan
as far as I know the movie and novel never said he sold exclusively ship parts, I think they even call him a "junk dealer" in the movie once...
and why let Anakin have it? 'cause he had a lot perhaps and as 3PO made clear to Owen Lars in A New Hope: he doesn't has a need for protocol droids, "especially in an environment like this", so why would Watto keep such things than if he can't sell it to anyone?

If this is true, then why do the Hutts need protocol droids?

cause they drink to damn much...noone can understand em...lol...one of the languages is drunk talk...drunk

Originally posted by zhellblah
Yeah but Watto only sold ship parts. And why would Watto allow Anikan to take software that had 6 million forms of communication built into it?

Whos ays Watto ONLY sells ship parts???? I definately saw some defect droids in his shop.

Originally posted by queeq
Whos ays Watto ONLY sells ship parts???? I definately saw some defect droids in his shop.
'cause of the Jar Jar scene with the kick in the nuts, I'm sure many try to forget that

Originally posted by Jovan
'cause of the Jar Jar scene with the kick in the nuts, I'm sure many try to forget that

Due to Jar Jar's lack of a typical male reaction in that instance we must question if he even has nuts. Take his high voice into consideration.

Good point.

Originally posted by queeq
Good point.

Thanks, I have been pondering it for years...

You ponder a lot about Gungan genitals eh? Disturbing.

Originally posted by queeq
You ponder a lot about Gungan genitals eh? Disturbing.

Somebody has to do it. Do you recall seeing any female Gungans? Maybe they are unisexual. Which is why Jar Jar had little to no reaction.

Errm... mayb you should start a thread for just yourself, dude.

Originally posted by queeq
Errm... mayb you should start a thread for just yourself, dude.

haha Im suprised theres not one...I never did think about it till now...lol..there werent any female gungans huh...lol...pretty wierd

Originally posted by Jack Daniels
haha Im suprised theres not one...I never did think about it till now...lol..there werent any female gungans huh...lol...pretty wierd

I will get to the bottom of this.

Don't use dirty words in here.

Originally posted by queeq
Don't use dirty words in here.

Who?

You said bottom.

Looks like it is a time out for me.

Sounds like it

Originally posted by zhellblah
if C-3PO was made by anakin when he was 10, then wouldn't he be like, 50 years old by the time Luke got him? and by then wouldn't he be obsolete? i mean, that would be like using one of those gigantic room-sized computers instead of a laptop today, wouldn't it? And R2D2 was even older than 3PO!
Also, why didn't R2 have anti-gravity boosters in ep 4-6 when he had them in ep 1-3? Lucas shouldn't have even added them to R2 if the droid didn't have them in the other movies.

Yea, and the Technology appears far less advanced in the sequels. GL and his crazy contradictions.

Indeed.... an old matter adressed many times before.

Originally posted by sweersa
Looks like it is a time out for me. Shadow Master?

Originally posted by Jedireaper
Shadow Master?

Uh oh...