She-Hulk vs Wonder Woman

tkitna

Originally posted by HulkIsHulk
Instead of posting a compilation (which I can't see on mobile so I have to quote it to see the video lonk and then copy it to the browser so I can see which video ), could you tell me which feats of Jen you consider superior?

Sure

1. Destroying the wall of saw blades in the control room and then ripping off the door.

2. Chucking a boulder about 50 yards with no effort at all

3. Punching the ground and surrounding trees falling down

4. Thunderclaps that hurt the Hulk and effected the environment around her.

5. Wrestling with the Hulk and knocking trees over while rolling.

6. Stopping a moving car by just putting her leg out

7. Punching the ground of a parking lot and causing a large fault

8. Throwing a car for a large distance

9. Casually walking through a concrete wall

An old church falling on her would be nothing to her.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
She didn't obliterate it. She busted the tower and then it fell on her. Its not a great feat. Jen has done much more impressive things.

They are close, but I still give Jen the nod.

iw-hYiRzRrU

Jen did MUCH more impressive things? Notice the "Much".
None of those feats are greater. You mistake being impressive in comparison to what a human can do as being impressive relative to class 50-100 strength.

But you still fall for the who is stronger is the Victor trap.
Why? Aren't you smart?

She Hulk can be twice as strong (she's not) and will still get stomped.
1. The speed difference makes this a stomp.
2. Even with speed equalized, the WW is significantly more skilled in fighting and has a billion times more experience.

With both superior speed and skill, WW with only a fraction of She Hulk's strength would still stomp.

But i will argue that WW is equal or stronger than She Hulk. Not that it matters if she is in this fight.

TheVaultDweller

Originally posted by h1a8
Jen did MUCH more impressive things? Notice the "Much".
None of those feats are greater. You mistake being impressive in comparison to what a human can do as being impressive relative to class 50-100 strength.

But you still fall for the who is stronger is the Victor trap.
Why? Aren't you smart?

She Hulk can be twice as strong (she's not) and will still get stomped.
1. The speed difference makes this a stomp.
2. Even with speed equalized, the WW is significantly more skilled in fighting and has a billion times more experience.

With both superior speed and skill, WW with only a fraction of She Hulk's strength would still stomp.

But i will argue that WW is equal or stronger than She Hulk. Not that it matters if she is in this fight.

You might want to read through the whole thread next time. tkitna literally said Wonder Woman wins due to superior skill and speed in their very first post (see below or just look at the very first response to this thread). The post you responded to was specifically in the context of who he believes is stronger. And even then, tkitna said that he thinks they're close.

Now, whether you agree or disagree with that part about the strength is a different matter, but everyone so far, including tkitna, backs Diana for the win in a fight.

Originally posted by tkitna
WW wins. To fast and a much better fighter. I think Jen might be a little stronger though based off of showings.

On topic, Wonder Woman would wreck She-Hulk IMO.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
But i will argue that WW is equal or stronger than She Hulk. Not that it matters if she is in this fight.

You know what, go ahead. I'm open to it so give me your argument.

HulkIsHulk

Originally posted by tkitna
You know what, go ahead. I'm open to it so give me your argument.

Can I do it, after I am done with the unenviable task of watching WW 1984? Like the Namor vs Nam-ek thread, I find myself in the unenviable position of having a similar opinion as h1

Robtard

WW wins via vastly superior speed and fighting skills.

She-Hulk is stronger, anyone who says different has a teeny tiny penis.

tkitna

Originally posted by HulkIsHulk
Can I do it, after I am done with the unenviable task of watching WW 1984? Like the Namor vs Nam-ek thread, I find myself in the unenviable position of having a similar opinion as h1

Lol. Sure you can do it. Just please don't make me watch 1984 again. I can't stomach that. laughing out loud

Darth Thor

All we need to know from WW1984, is that she can fly.

h1a8

Originally posted by TheVaultDweller
You might want to read through the whole thread next time. tkitna literally said Wonder Woman wins due to superior skill and speed in their very first post (see below or just look at the very first response to this thread). The post you responded to was specifically in the context of who he believes is stronger. And even then, tkitna said that he thinks they're close.

Now, whether you agree or disagree with that part about the strength is a different matter, but everyone so far, including tkitna, backs Diana for the win in a fight.

On topic, Wonder Woman would wreck She-Hulk IMO.

I was commenting on his, "I give Jen the nod". Sounded like he changed his mind.

KingD19

Originally posted by h1a8
I was commenting on his, "I give Jen the nod". Sounded like he changed his mind.

No it didn't. He was obviously still commenting on strength v strength, not the rest of the fight. He said he gave Jen the nod meaning In Strength. And it was evident as he posted a compilation of all of Jen's strength feats in the same post challenging the strength feat of the church tower collapse. It's pretty obvious.

FrothByte

Originally posted by h1a8
I was commenting on his, "I give Jen the nod". Sounded like he changed his mind.

He didn't change his mind. He said WW wins right at the very start of his first post. He also considered She-Hulk stronger from the start.

So just admit that you were wrong and didn't read his post properly.

h1a8

Originally posted by KingD19
No it didn't. He was obviously still commenting on strength v strength, not the rest of the fight. He said he gave Jen the nod meaning In Strength. And it was evident as he posted a compilation of all of Jen's strength feats in the same post challenging the strength feat of the church tower collapse. It's pretty obvious.
Originally posted by FrothByte
He didn't change his mind. He said WW wins right at the very start of his first post. He also considered She-Hulk stronger from the start.

So just admit that you were wrong and didn't read his post properly.

I was completely wrong. I stand corrected.

NemeBro

Diana doesn't have many directly quantifiable strength feats but her fights with Doomsday, where she proved she can take his punches like a champ and even wound him with shield bashes, as well as her skirmish with Clark where she staggered him with a headbutt, and in general appearing in the same ballpark as Aquaman who is much stronger than Jen make her superior strength-wise.

tkitna

The tank tracks (which I believe Jen could break out of) isnt a great example. It seems like she tapped into some type of God force or something by the way she and everything was glowing. I'm not saying that for certain, but it's how I percieved it.

tkitna

Originally posted by NemeBro
Diana doesn't have many directly quantifiable strength feats but her fights with Doomsday, where she proved she can take his punches like a champ and even wound him with shield bashes, as well as her skirmish with Clark where she staggered him with a headbutt, and in general appearing in the same ballpark as Aquaman who is much stronger than Jen make her superior strength-wise.

The Doomsday fight is more about durability than strength. She also has her bracelets that take most of the brunt. Not sure about Arthur being much stronger than Jen either. He has the submarine feat which is awesome, but Jen never really showed any struggles in anything she did. Guess what i'm saying is we dont really know the upper tiers for any of these characters so its hard to say.

I just based my opinion on who seemed more impressive and I think its Jen. No big deal. I can see the other side of the argument and really can't argue because its all in how we perceive things (well except for H1 who constantly tries to put real world physics into his arguments in hopes of swaying people).

h1a8

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
To be honest without using physics and using perception I see both as near equals. I just had a problem with people thinking She Hulk is definitely stronger. That made me analyze the feats more (instead of rely on perception).

Its all good. I think they are close too and an argument can be made for either. Problem with Diana is she just doesn't have a ton of onscreen strength feats. We know she's strong, but the examples are limited. She's more about speed, skills, and her accessories.

Doesn't matter. We all agree WW wins in a fight.

NemeBro

Originally posted by tkitna
The Doomsday fight is more about durability than strength. She also has her bracelets that take most of the brunt. Not sure about Arthur being much stronger than Jen either. He has the submarine feat which is awesome, but Jen never really showed any struggles in anything she did. Guess what i'm saying is we dont really know the upper tiers for any of these characters so its hard to say.

I just based my opinion on who seemed more impressive and I think its Jen. No big deal. I can see the other side of the argument and really can't argue because its all in how we perceive things (well except for H1 who constantly tries to put real world physics into his arguments in hopes of swaying people). She took a punch directly to her chest from Doomsday like a champ.

And she was able to punch his legs out from under him with a shield bash and most importantly we know this actually hurt him because his calf was glowing red after impact indicating his healing was taking place. She was clearly weaker than Doomsday but had the strength to harm him even with blunt force.

Same with staggering Clark with a headbutt. She has the strength to get Kryptonians to at least notice or react to her, but not enough to actually compete. This is still better than anything Jen does.

The submarine feat is literally orders of magnitude better than anything Jen ever did. The Akula Class 3, apparently the sub he lifted, weighs over 13,000 tons. You'd be hard-pressed to wank any feat of Jen's to be in the 50 ton range.

Even Diana's quantifiable feat in lifting that tank is arguably better than Jen's boulder throw. And she did it before unlocking her full strength!

FrothByte

tkitna

Originally posted by NemeBro
She took a punch directly to her chest from Doomsday like a champ.

And she was able to punch his legs out from under him with a shield bash and most importantly we know this actually hurt him because his calf was glowing red after impact indicating his healing was taking place. She was clearly weaker than Doomsday but had the strength to harm him even with blunt force.

Same with staggering Clark with a headbutt. She has the strength to get Kryptonians to at least notice or react to her, but not enough to actually compete. This is still better than anything Jen does.

The submarine feat is literally orders of magnitude better than anything Jen ever did. The Akula Class 3, apparently the sub he lifted, weighs over 13,000 tons. You'd be hard-pressed to wank any feat of Jen's to be in the 50 ton range.

Even Diana's quantifiable feat in lifting that tank is arguably better than Jen's boulder throw. And she did it before unlocking her full strength!

Clark wasn't staggered, but his head did move so there's that I guess. Let's just be careful to not get strength and durability mixed up here.

The sub feat was good, but it doesn't mean other characters like Jen couldn't replicate something in the same weight range. She hurt the Hulk. The same Hulk that was supporting the weight of a whole hillside and building that was going to crush his friends.

Diana lifted and flipped a tank. She Hulk casually tossed a car a good distance. I don't see in any world where she couldn't duplicate the tank feat.

DarkSaint85

All powers and abilities on, Jen dominates when K.E.V.I.N. gets involved.

And if anyone says that's outside help, then WW has no outside help either (i.e. no god-blessed attributes). And if anyone says K.E.V.I.N. only works in the MCU, I assumed it is just as powerful in a neutral universe.

h1a8

Wonder Woman lifted the tank at a peculiar angle, grasping it by the corner, which meant the majority of the weight was away from her. This situation is similar to trying to lift a chair by one of its legs (as in the strength challenge) and holding it in that manner.

Additionally, Wonder Woman smiled while holding the tank (when thinking about Steve and love), indicating that this feat was casual for her.

To estimate a lower bound of Wonder Woman's lifting capability, we can use two factors:

1. **Factor A:** This accounts for the difficulty of lifting an object at a challenging angle. For example, a 10 lb chair can feel like lifting a 100 lb chair when lifted by one leg, suggesting A = 10.

2. **Factor B:** This accounts for the casual nature of her lift. When something is done effortlessly (with a natural smile), it's reasonable to assume one can apply more than 4 times the usual force, so B = 4.

Multiplying these factors together gives us a combined factor of A times B = 40. Therefore, Wonder Woman can potentially lift AT LEAST 40 times the weight of the tank.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
All powers and abilities on, Jen dominates when K.E.V.I.N. gets involved.

And if anyone says that's outside help, then WW has no outside help either (i.e. no god-blessed attributes). And if anyone says K.E.V.I.N. only works in the MCU, I assumed it is just as powerful in a neutral universe.

A character's inherent powers can never be considered outside help. These powers are intrinsic to them and are possessed from the start. Otherwise, the "no outside help" rule would be meaningless and inapplicable.

However, K.E.V.I.N. only works within the MCU and has no power over DCEU scripts.

It's difficult to equate Wonder Woman using her inherent powers to Jen seeking K.E.V.I.N.'s help to alter the script. They are fundamentally different scenarios.

KingD19

I'll rephrase for DarkSaint. Jen possesses the power to "Break the 4th Wall". It doesn't stop at K.E.V.I.N. as she literally came into the real world in the Marvel Offices, and it is supported by Deadpool & Wolverine with DP headbutting the camera and explaining how he breaks the 4th Wall. Breaking the 4th Wall is breaking the 4th wall and doesn't get nullified when she's somewhere else. If she felt like it, she could freeze time and complain about how Diana's hair stays so full of life in the middle of a brawl for example and then punch her silly and start time back up.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
Wonder Woman lifted the tank at a peculiar angle, grasping it by the corner, which meant the majority of the weight was away from her. This situation is similar to trying to lift a chair by one of its legs (as in the strength challenge) and holding it in that manner.

Additionally, Wonder Woman smiled while holding the tank (when thinking about Steve and love), indicating that this feat was casual for her.

To estimate a lower bound of Wonder Woman's lifting capability, we can use two factors:

1. **Factor A:** This accounts for the difficulty of lifting an object at a challenging angle. For example, a 10 lb chair can feel like lifting a 100 lb chair when lifted by one leg, suggesting A = 10.

2. **Factor B:** This accounts for the casual nature of her lift. When something is done effortlessly (with a natural smile), it's reasonable to assume one can apply more than 4 times the usual force, so B = 4.

Multiplying these factors together gives us a combined factor of A times B = 40. Therefore, Wonder Woman can potentially lift AT LEAST 40 times the weight of the tank.

Thats a long post for basically saying nothing. So you came up with a feat that she can potentially lift somthing at least 40 times the weight of the tank.

And,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,. What is this suppossed to prove?

Average weight of tanks around that period were about 30 tons, So you think WW is a 1200 tonner do you? laughing

DarkSaint85

FrothByte

Originally posted by tkitna
Clark wasn't staggered, but his head did move so there's that I guess. Let's just be careful to not get strength and durability mixed up here.

The sub feat was good, but it doesn't mean other characters like Jen couldn't replicate something in the same weight range. She hurt the Hulk. The same Hulk that was supporting the weight of a whole hillside and building that was going to crush his friends.

Diana lifted and flipped a tank. She Hulk casually tossed a car a good distance. I don't see in any world where she couldn't duplicate the tank feat.

I'd also like to add that there's no proof that Aquaman is as strong outside of water as he is in water. He has no feats outside of water to equal the submarine feat.

And the strength comparison is with WW to out-of-water Arthur, not in-water Arthur.

-Pr-

Originally posted by FrothByte
I'd also like to add that there's no proof that Aquaman is as strong outside of water as he is in water. He has no feats outside of water to equal the submarine feat.

And the strength comparison is with WW to out-of-water Arthur, not in-water Arthur.

It's literally a part of his powerset that he's stronger underwater, so you're not wrong. Astronomically so, if the submarine feat is any indication.

h1a8

Originally posted by KingD19
I'll rephrase for DarkSaint. Jen possesses the power to "Break the 4th Wall". It doesn't stop at K.E.V.I.N. as she literally came into the real world in the Marvel Offices, and it is supported by Deadpool & Wolverine with DP headbutting the camera and explaining how he breaks the 4th Wall. Breaking the 4th Wall is breaking the 4th wall and doesn't get nullified when she's somewhere else. If she felt like it, she could freeze time and complain about how Diana's hair stays so full of life in the middle of a brawl for example and then punch her silly and start time back up.

In a forum fight there is no such thing as breaking the 4th wall. Some idiot here made that shit up as a way for her to be powerful. Everyone joined the bandwagon. There is no 4th wall in a forum fight. This isn't a show or movie where there are cameras on the 4th wall.
Plus breaking the 4th wall acknowledges that everything is just pretend (actors, cameras, script, etc).

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
Thats a long post for basically saying nothing. So you came up with a feat that she can potentially lift somthing at least 40 times the weight of the tank.

And,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,. What is this suppossed to prove?

Average weight of tanks around that period were about 30 tons, So you think WW is a 1200 tonner do you? laughing

Well, A = 10 might be excessive. A person can struggle to lift a 20 lb chair at a bad angle even if they can lift 100 lb normally. So, A = 5 is more reasonable. WW can lift at least 600 tons.

Let me ask you a couple of questions:
1. If a character lifts something with a fraction of their strength, would you assume they can lift something several times heavier in a forum discussion?
2. If a character lifts something with poor leverage, would you assume they can lift something several times heavier with optimal leverage?

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
In a forum fight there is no such thing as breaking the 4th wall. Some idiot here made that shit up as a way for her to be powerful. Everyone joined the bandwagon. There is no 4th wall in a forum fight. This isn't a show or movie where there are cameras on the 4th wall.
Plus breaking the 4th wall acknowledges that everything is just pretend (actors, cameras, script, etc).

But.....it IS pretend.....
But if you have the forum ruling saying no 4th wall breaking, or that you need to remove one of She-Hulk's powers for WW to have a chance, go for it.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
In a forum fight there is no such thing as breaking the 4th wall. Some idiot here made that shit up as a way for her to be powerful. Everyone joined the bandwagon. There is no 4th wall in a forum fight. This isn't a show or movie where there are cameras on the 4th wall.
Plus breaking the 4th wall acknowledges that everything is just pretend (actors, cameras, script, etc).

It's an official part of her power set. Deal with it.

A better argument for you would be- we don't know she could convince K.E.V.I.N to have her win the fight. Ergo it's speculation what any outcome of that would be.

You could also argue that it's not in character for her to do this just because she's losing a fight.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
Let me ask you a couple of questions:
1. If a character lifts something with a fraction of their strength, would you assume they can lift something several times heavier in a forum discussion?
2. If a character lifts something with poor leverage, would you assume they can lift something several times heavier with optimal leverage?

1. How are we to know if its a fraction of their strength or an upper limit of their strength? By facial expressions and grunts? This is where your math equasions and assumptions have major flaws. Unless something is directly said or actual numbers are shown, there is no possible way to determine a characters limits.

Ex - How do we know WW wouldn't have struggled with a tank just 10 more tons heavier? How do we know She Hulk could or couldn't have thrown the car further? We don't know.

2. Sure, we can assume so, but we don't know how much more.

Ex - She Hulk threw a car. Can she throw the same car a couple of blocks? A couple of miles? Who knows? She threw a boulder a pretty good distance. Bruce threw the same boulder out of Earths atmosphere, but Jen still hurt him. So where do we draw the line?

You can't figure out strength limits to fictional characters like these. You can only guess and assume by what you see on film and to me Jen seemed a bit more impressive in the strength department. Just my opinion.

Once again, I feel they are pretty close in the strength department, but Diana would slaughter her in an actual fight. It wouldn't come down to strength. Jen has no answer for her speed, flight, fighting skills, and accessories.

tkitna

The 4th wall thing is an angle I never even thought about. Has she ever used it to actually change the outcome of any situation? I honestly can't remember.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by tkitna
The 4th wall thing is an angle I never even thought about. Has she ever used it to actually change the outcome of any situation? I honestly can't remember.

Yeah in the last episode she changed the ending.

tkitna

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Yeah in the last episode she changed the ending.

Crap, your right. So its a legitimate option.

Jen might be the most powerful character in all comic movies.

playa1258

She is definitely in contention. Mr Nobody is another one

DarkSaint85

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
1. How are we to know if its a fraction of their strength or an upper limit of their strength? By facial expressions and grunts? This is where your math equasions and assumptions have major flaws. Unless something is directly said or actual numbers are shown, there is no possible way to determine a characters limits.

Ex - How do we know WW wouldn't have struggled with a tank just 10 more tons heavier? How do we know She Hulk could or couldn't have thrown the car further? We don't know.

2. Sure, we can assume so, but we don't know how much more.

Ex - She Hulk threw a car. Can she throw the same car a couple of blocks? A couple of miles? Who knows? She threw a boulder a pretty good distance. Bruce threw the same boulder out of Earths atmosphere, but Jen still hurt him. So where do we draw the line?

You can't figure out strength limits to fictional characters like these. You can only guess and assume by what you see on film and to me Jen seemed a bit more impressive in the strength department. Just my opinion.

Once again, I feel they are pretty close in the strength department, but Diana would slaughter her in an actual fight. It wouldn't come down to strength. Jen has no answer for her speed, flight, fighting skills, and accessories.

1. Watch the scene where she thinks about Steve saying the he loves her. She is scene smiling and very happy. Therefore she is lifting the tank with only a fraction of her strength. It's about percentage. It's impossible to casually lift something and then struggle to lift something that's 10% heavier. That's the status quo. Therefore if you disagree then you have to provide significant evidence to overturn the status quo.

2. We don't need to know exactly how much more but a general low level average would suffice.

3. That's because you are not very familiar with physics. You think throwing a car a short distance is peers or greater than lifting a tank at a weird angle (lifting a chair with one left with little leverage).? Or breaking several layers of solid steel into millions of dust-like pieces is that same as just breaking it in half. Or busting 50-100 tons of concrete with a single blow is somehow equivalent to throwing a boulder a 100-200 feet or so.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
It's an official part of her power set. Deal with it.

A better argument for you would be- we don't know she could convince K.E.V.I.N to have her win the fight. Ergo it's speculation what any outcome of that would be.

You could also argue that it's not in character for her to do this just because she's losing a fight. It's not a power at all.
Breaking the 4th wall is a dramatic technique used in literature, film, television, and theater where characters show awareness that they are part of a WORK. It's not a superpower a character has.

If you disagree then prove it is.

There is no camera crew, television set, etc in a forum fight.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
She also does it when hiding her date's sweater so he can't wear it and stay in his vest.....

Lol she threw the sweater behind the couch. Whether or not she looks at us prior wouldn't have change that outcome.

h1a8

And when she talks to KEVIN he tells her that she is expensive and change to Jen when the camera is off her because the visual effects team is doing something else.

All she can really do is talk to the audience. Breaking the 4th wall only allows her access in the Disney plus Marvel menu system.
In a forum there is no show, visual effects team, disney plus app to navigate, etc.

tkitna

Breaking the 4th wall for the win.

FrothByte

Originally posted by tkitna
Crap, your right. So its a legitimate option.

Jen might be the most powerful character in all comic movies.

Yes. You need someone like time-master Loki to compete with her.

DarkSaint85

I'm glad I brought it up

DarkSaint85

I thought fights take place in a neutral universe where everyone's powers work as they would in their native universes.... otherwise someone might argue there are no Greek Gods like in the DCEU to bless WW in a forum fight, so she loses her abilities.

But again, if we are having to handicap one side to give WW a win, that speaks volumes.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
1. Watch the scene where she thinks about Steve saying the he loves her. She is scene smiling and very happy. Therefore she is lifting the tank with only a fraction of her strength. It's about percentage. It's impossible to casually lift something and then struggle to lift something that's 10% heavier. That's the status quo. Therefore if you disagree then you have to provide significant evidence to overturn the status quo.

2. We don't need to know exactly how much more but a general low level average would suffice.

3. That's because you are not very familiar with physics. You think throwing a car a short distance is peers or greater than lifting a tank at a weird angle (lifting a chair with one left with little leverage).? Or breaking several layers of solid steel into millions of dust-like pieces is that same as just breaking it in half. Or busting 50-100 tons of concrete with a single blow is somehow equivalent to throwing a boulder a 100-200 feet or so.

It's not a power at all.
Breaking the 4th wall is a dramatic technique used in literature, film, television, and theater where characters show awareness that they are part of a WORK. It's not a superpower a character has.

If you disagree then prove it is.

There is no camera crew, television set, etc in a forum fight.

1. So you know how much effort was put into something just by facial expressions, feelings, and noises. Lol ok.

2. Nobody needs to know physics at all when it comes to fictional characters like Superheros. Real world phyisics dont apply. The Hulk tossed a tank about 500 yards by its gun barrel. Are we to believe the gun barrel would stay intact and not bend or come apart supporting the weight of that tank? See, you can't apply physics to the imaginary.

3. Jen used breaking the 4th wall numerous times. Even changing the outcome of some scenarios. It's a legit option and it gives her a stomp win in this battle. There's nothing Diana can do about it.

There doesn't need to be cameras or television sets as long as their is some type of audience. We are the audience.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
It's not a power at all.
Breaking the 4th wall is a dramatic technique used in literature, film, television, and theater where characters show awareness that they are part of a WORK. It's not a superpower a character has.

If you disagree then prove it is.

There is no camera crew, television set, etc in a forum fight.

No look up her powers and abilities. Breaking 4th wall is legit one of her abilities. Same for Deadpool.

Remember even in their own shows/movies, other characters dont break the 4th wall unless they specifically have that ability. Like Nicepool in Deadpool and Wolverine can, but Wolverine cant in the same movie (and its half his film).

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
I'm glad I brought it up

laughing out loud

tkitna

Originally posted by Darth Thor
No look up her powers and abilities. Breaking 4th wall is legit one of her abilities. Same for Deadpool.
/B]

H1's in a full blown panic now knowing that Diana has no chance in this fight. laughing

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
H1's in a full blown panic now knowing that Diana has no chance in this fight. laughing

No chance to lose.
If Jen tries to talk to some audience (that don't exist) then she would get beaten faster. Talking to a non existent audience is a disadvantage, not an advantage.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
No look up her powers and abilities. Breaking 4th wall is legit one of her abilities. Same for Deadpool.

Remember even in their own shows/movies, other characters dont break the 4th wall unless they specifically have that ability. Like Nicepool in Deadpool and Wolverine can, but Wolverine cant in the same movie (and its half his film).

laughing out loud

She can break the 4th wall IF THERE EXISTS a 4th wall. 4th walls exists on television, etc not in forums. But guess what, anyone can. I can (if our audience is God and the angels) and you can.

Doesn't matter because talking to us during the fight would get her beat faster. It doesn't give her an advantage at all. Only a disadvantage.

Originally posted by tkitna
1. So you know how much effort was put into something just by facial expressions, feelings, and noises. Lol ok.

2. Nobody needs to know physics at all when it comes to fictional characters like Superheros. Real world phyisics dont apply. The Hulk tossed a tank about 500 yards by its gun barrel. Are we to believe the gun barrel would stay intact and not bend or come apart supporting the weight of that tank? See, you can't apply physics to the imaginary.

3. Jen used breaking the 4th wall numerous times. Even changing the outcome of some scenarios. It's a legit option and it gives her a stomp win in this battle. There's nothing Diana can do about it.

There doesn't need to be cameras or television sets as long as their is some type of audience. We are the audience.

1. Moving the goalposts. Lack of effort means you can apply multiple times more. Facial expressions in movies (storytelling) tells us a lot. Holding something up casually with a smile tells us a lot.

2. Then Daredevil is stronger than Hulk since math and physics does not apply. How else do we determine who is stronger? It's who we want to be stronger?

3. Well the moment she talks to us WW would be stomping her. Some advantage.

DarkSaint85

When she's breaking the 4th wall, nothing harms her as seen when she's able to cruise on the highway without needing to steer her car or pay attention to the road. Things just align for her.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
No chance to lose.
If Jen tries to talk to some audience (that don't exist) then she would get beaten faster. Talking to a non existent audience is a disadvantage, not an advantage.

She can break the 4th wall IF THERE EXISTS a 4th wall. 4th walls exists on television, etc not in forums. But guess what, anyone can. I can (if our audience is God and the angels) and you can.

Doesn't matter because talking to us during the fight would get her beat faster. It doesn't give her an advantage at all. Only a disadvantage.

laughing

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8

She can break the 4th wall IF THERE EXISTS a 4th wall. 4th walls exists on television, etc not in forums. But guess what, anyone can. I can (if our audience is God and the angels) and you can.

Doesn't matter because talking to us during the fight would get her beat faster. It doesn't give her an advantage at all. Only a disadvantage.

As expected, the route you've chosen to attack this line of argument is just terrible.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
When she's breaking the 4th wall, nothing harms her as seen when she's able to cruise on the highway without needing to steer her car or pay attention to the road. Things just align for her.

Premise : She drove a car for a short while without paying attention.

Conclusion: Nothing can harm her while she is talking to the audience.

I'm sorry but that conclusion doesn't follow from the premise.

Also I have had conversations with people in the car (looking at them) while driving. I even dozed off behind the wheel before. I guess that means I'm invincible too lol.

First, there is no audience her. This isn't a show.

Second, Talking to an audience has no bearing on preventing her from getting beat down. Things just align is fancy talk with no relevant meaning here.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
As expected, the route you've chosen to attack this line of argument is just terrible.

I still argue there is no 4th wall in a forum.
But even so, then it won't do her any good here.
I don't see how saying that is terrible.

Originally posted by tkitna
laughing

She is unaffected by the outside environment and can change outcomes of scenarios. There's no way for WW to win. This is a spite stomp.

Jen even breaks the 4th wall in her comics so its just not television. If there's an audience, she can break it.

Spite
Nice joke. Arguing against stupid arguments is better than no arguments at all. Keep this forum from being dead.

Stating things without proof is called making shit up.
She can be affected because that's the status quo and there is no proof to overturn it.
She only displayed communication with the audience (in which there isn't any here).

DarkSaint85

Show me the times the outside world affected her. And again, you ignored the last episode where she casually left (mind you, I see no forum rules about BFR or leaving the battlefield, so your argument there is moot) and could casually ignore whatever was happening in the episode.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8

First, there is no audience her. This isn't a show.

Nice joke. Arguing against stupid arguments is better than no arguments at all. Keep this forum from being dead.

Stating things without proof is called making shit up.
She can be affected because that's the status quo and there is no proof to overturn it.
She only displayed communication with the audience (in which there isn't any here).

Of course there is an audience. We are the audience. We're currently talking about it right now. Samething in comics. The people reading is the audience.

She literally left her own show once on the Disney channel screen to ***** at the writers. She also specifically stated she breaks 4th walls and changes bad endings.

SnLB_SY5HNo&t=454s

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by tkitna
Of course there is an audience. We are the audience. We're currently talking about it right now. Samething in comics. The people reading is the audience.

She literally left her own show once on the Disney channel screen to ***** at the writers.

SnLB_SY5HNo&t=454s

Which she can do here, as her powers/abilities work as they would in her native universe.

Of course, h1 is welcome to nerf her and argue that her 4th wall abilities that she uses in her series don#t translate over to a forum fight, but that would be nerfing one side on purpose to give his side a win, which is underhanded and sneaky.

tkitna

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Which she can do here, as her powers/abilities work as they would in her native universe.

Of course, h1 is welcome to nerf her and argue that her 4th wall abilities that she uses in her series don#t translate over to a forum fight, but that would be nerfing one side on purpose to give his side a win, which is underhanded and sneaky.

H1 isn't underhanded and sneaky. He's desperate. His character can't win this fight so he's just refusing the truth. It's like something a 2 year old would do.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
H1 isn't underhanded and sneaky. He's desperate. His character can't win this fight so he's just refusing the truth. It's like something a 2 year old would do.

So She Hulk wins by talking to the audience? That's desperate?
Navigating the Disney app (which a forum is not) doesn't somehow make her win.

Originally posted by tkitna
Of course there is an audience. We are the audience. We're currently talking about it right now. Samething in comics. The people reading is the audience.

She literally left her own show once on the Disney channel screen to ***** at the writers. She also specifically stated she breaks 4th walls and changes bad endings.

SnLB_SY5HNo&t=454s

We are not the audience because we will not ever see this fight happen. There is no audience.
And I've not only watched every episode of the show but I saw that YouTube video since the beginning of the thread. Again talking to the audience doesn't make her win.

The forum isn't a Disney app.
Leaving the app (if WW allows it) doesn't make her somehow win. She could barely navigate through app and she had no power. Kevin had the power.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Show me the times the outside world affected her. And again, you ignored the last episode where she casually left (mind you, I see no forum rules about BFR or leaving the battlefield, so your argument there is moot) and could casually ignore whatever was happening in the episode.

You claimed the outside world couldn't affect her. Now you turn it around and ask me to prove a negative?

I didn't ignore anything. Navigating through the Disney app (in a limited sense) to reach Kevin.
1. The forum is not a Disney app.
2. Leaving the battlefield has always been the rules.
3. Leaving the battlefield won't help her win. That's if WW allows her.

DarkSaint85

Quote the rule where leaving the battlefield loses you the battle.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
So She Hulk wins by talking to the audience? That's desperate?
Navigating the Disney app (which a forum is not) doesn't somehow make her win.

We are not the audience because we will not ever see this fight happen. There is no audience.
And I've not only watched every episode of the show but I saw that YouTube video since the beginning of the thread. Again talking to the audience doesn't make her win.

The forum isn't a Disney app.
Leaving the app (if WW allows it) doesn't make her somehow win. She could barely navigate through app and she had no power. Kevin had the power.

Your missing the big picture (not surprising). Leaving the Disney page is proof that she messes with reality. She is not tied down like other characters (WW). She has the ability to change what is going on around her. She certainly does win.

We are the audience. Debating on how the fight will play out. We've come to the conclusion that the 4th wall breaking is the Ace in the hole. Jen probably caused that by breaking the 4th wall and reminding us.

Barely navigate through? What? No power? What? She accomplished what she wanted to do. She manipulated Kevin. In Kevins own words, she obliterated the ending.

Jen wins in a shit stomp.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
Your missing the big picture (not surprising). Leaving the Disney page is proof that she messes with reality. She is not tied down like other characters (WW). She has the ability to change what is going on around her. She certainly does win.

We are the audience. Debating on how the fight will play out. We've come to the conclusion that the 4th wall breaking is the Ace in the hole. Jen probably caused that by breaking the 4th wall and reminding us.

Barely navigate through? What? No power? What? She accomplished what she wanted to do. She manipulated Kevin. In Kevins own words, she obliterated the ending.

Jen wins in a shit stomp.

Leaving the Disney show is only proof that she can leave the Disney show. Not anything else.
If it wasn't then she wouldnt need to leave to show to ask another entity to do something. She would have the ability herself as you are implying.

She has no power to change reality. Kevin has limited power to change things in her show or things he's contracted under. This is not her show but a forum fight. Kevin has no power to change anything because he doesn't write the script here.

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Quote the rule where leaving the battlefield loses you the battle.

You been here long enough to know this.

Plus leaving the battlefield will not make her win.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
Leaving the Disney show is only proof that she can leave the Disney show. Not anything else.
If it wasn't then she wouldnt need to leave to show to ask another entity to do something. She would have the ability herself as you are implying.

She does have the ability. She just got the results she wanted by manipulating Kevin. She could have just refused if she wanted.

She changed outcomes and left her own show. She has the power. She changed the minds of everybody here with her 4th wall breaking except for you because your upset thst your character can't win now.

There is no way for WW to win. Spite.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
She does have the ability. She just got the results she wanted by manipulating Kevin. She could have just refused if she wanted.

She changed outcomes and left her own show. She has the power. She changed the minds of everybody here with her 4th wall breaking except for you because your upset thst your character can't win now.

There is no way for WW to win. Spite.

So, essentially, you're saying that in a forum fight, the battlefield is within the Disney app, where She-Hulk can leave and go to Kevin to ask him to change something? That's how she wins? She has no other power to change the reality of the battle except through Kevin?

Is this correct? If so, then let's continue. If not, then please address the following points:

1. The forum is not a Disney app. She is not in the Disney app while fighting Wonder Woman. This negates that argument.

2. Kevin has no power over anything except things he is contracted for in Marvel. He can't change anything involving other characters from other companies or any battlefield that doesn't belong to him.

3. Kevin has his own autonomy. He can decide whatever he wants, and there is no guarantee that he would help her win a forum fight.

4. Seeking outside help is not allowed. Leaving the battlefield to get outside assistance violates the rules.

5. She-Hulk does not know Wonder Woman and, in character, would initially try to fight her, which could result in a quick loss.

6. She-Hulk doesn't have the inclination to leave the battlefield and seek Kevin's help to avoid being knocked out. She only sought out Kevin because the plot was nonsensical and ridiculous, not because she was losing a single fight.

You need to address and defeat all six of these arguments (not just five or fewer). Failure to do so results in a concession and the loss of the debate.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
Leaving the Disney show is only proof that she can leave the Disney show. Not anything else.
If it wasn't then she wouldnt need to leave to show to ask another entity to do something. She would have the ability herself as you are implying.

She has no power to change reality. Kevin has limited power to change things in her show or things he's contracted under. This is not her show but a forum fight. Kevin has no power to change anything because he doesn't write the script here.

You been here long enough to know this.

Plus leaving the battlefield will not make her win.

Wrong.

That's for the comic thread. This is the Movie Versus forum. Different rules.

So you have nothing there. Ok

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
So, essentially, you're saying that in a forum fight, the battlefield is within the Disney app, where She-Hulk can leave and go to Kevin to ask him to change something? That's how she wins? She has no other power to change the reality of the battle except through Kevin?

Is this correct? If so, then let's continue. If not, then please address the following points:

1. The forum is not a Disney app. She is not in the Disney app while fighting Wonder Woman. This negates that argument.

2. Kevin has no power over anything except things he is contracted for in Marvel. He can't change anything involving other characters from other companies or any battlefield that doesn't belong to him.

3. Kevin has his own autonomy. He can decide whatever he wants, and there is no guarantee that he would help her win a forum fight.

4. Seeking outside help is not allowed. Leaving the battlefield to get outside assistance violates the rules.

5. She-Hulk does not know Wonder Woman and, in character, would initially try to fight her, which could result in a quick loss.

6. She-Hulk doesn't have the inclination to leave the battlefield and seek Kevin's help to avoid being knocked out. She only sought out Kevin because the plot was nonsensical and ridiculous, not because she was losing a single fight.

You need to address and defeat all six of these arguments (not just five or fewer). Failure to do so results in a concession and the loss of the debate.

1. She-Hulk has broken the 4th wall in comics also. The Disney app is meaningless in this debate. It was just another example.

2. Kevin is meaningless in this debate.

3. Kevin is meaningless in this debate.

4. She doesn't need outside help.

5. Could is not would. Jen could break the 4th wall before the battle even begins.

6. Kevin is meaningless in this debate. She-Hulk broke the 4th wall numerous times proving that the outside environment and characters were oblvious to it.

There. All 6 addressed and defeated.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by tkitna
1. She-Hulk has broken the 4th wall in comics also. The Disney app is meaningless in this debate. It was just another example.

2. Kevin is meaningless in this debate.

3. Kevin is meaningless in this debate.

4. She doesn't need outside help.

5. Could is not would. Jen could break the 4th wall before the battle even begins.

6. Kevin is meaningless in this debate. She-Hulk broke the 4th wall numerous times proving that the outside environment and characters were oblvious to it.

There. All 6 addressed and defeated.

Moreover, his point number 4 is invalid, as he is using rules from the comic book forum.

We;re in the Movie Versus forum now:
https://www.killermovies.com/forums/f102/t543649.html

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Moreover, his point number 4 is invalid, as he is using rules from the comic book forum.

We;re in the Movie Versus forum now:
https://www.killermovies.com/forums/f102/t543649.html
In addition to the movie vs rules Impediment stated that we use the same rules as the comic vs forum (no leaving the battlefield to get outside help, etc). Number 4 is a typo. I meant to type She doesn't get outside help.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
1. She-Hulk has broken the 4th wall in comics also. The Disney app is meaningless in this debate. It was just another example.

2. Kevin is meaningless in this debate.

3. Kevin is meaningless in this debate.

4. She doesn't need outside help.

5. Could is not would. Jen could break the 4th wall before the battle even begins.

6. Kevin is meaningless in this debate. She-Hulk broke the 4th wall numerous times proving that the outside environment and characters were oblvious to it.

There. All 6 addressed and defeated.

1. This is not comic she hulk. This is a totally different character.
Also comic version only talks to the audience as well. Nothing more.

Why go to Kevin when she has the power to change things herself?

Anyway we use feats. Besides talk to the audience what can she hulk do here to gain an advantage or win. Be specific. Support the argument with feats and onscreen showings.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8

Why go to Kevin when she has the power to change things herself?

Kevin was the guy at the top who can change the story.

She can basically go to the real world in her She-Hulk form, and bully her way to the person in charge of plot development.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
1. This is not comic she hulk. This is a totally different character.
Also comic version only talks to the audience as well. Nothing more.

Your so dumb it hurts.

https://i.redd.it/gt6hxkt7zst91.jpg

https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/She-Hulk-breaking-through-the-fourth-wall-in-The-Sensational-She-Hulk-37-1992.jpg

Because she wanted to know why the ending was so stupid and she gave him a chance to change it. He wasn't going to so she had two options, manipulate himinto changing it or just refusing it. She got her desired results.

The outside envionment has no affect on her and characters and people are oblivious as to when she does it. She also affects outcomes.

Easy win for her.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
Your so dumb it hurts.

https://i.redd.it/gt6hxkt7zst91.jpg

https://static1.srcdn.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2022/07/She-Hulk-breaking-through-the-fourth-wall-in-The-Sensational-She-Hulk-37-1992.jpg

Because she wanted to know why the ending was so stupid and she gave him a chance to change it. He wasn't going to so she had two options, manipulate himinto changing it or just refusing it. She got her desired results.

The outside envionment has no affect on her and characters and people are oblivious as to when she does it. She also affects outcomes.

Easy win for her.
That's comic She Hulk, which is a different character.
She was only able to tear the page and attempt to talk to the writer.
She had no other power, other than communication with the outside world.

As far as MCU
You have no proof that the outside environment doesn't affect her when she talks to the audience. An outsider overheard her speaking to the audience and asked what she said, thinking she was talking to them. She simply replied, "nothing."

You have never proven or shown how she can affect outcomes without Kevin's help.

h1a8

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Kevin was the guy at the top who can change the story.

She can basically go to the real world in her She-Hulk form, and bully her way to the person in charge of plot development.

In a forum fight there is no one in charge of plot development. There is no show, movie, cameraman, cgi team, writer, producer, etc.

2nd, that would be leaving the battlefield to go get outside help (which isn't allowed).

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
That's comic She Hulk, which is a different character.
She was only able to tear the page and attempt to talk to the writer.
She had no other power, other than communication with the outside world.

You brought this up.

Originally posted by h1a8
1. Also comic version only talks to the audience as well. Nothing more.

I proved you wrong.

She let go of the wheel of a car she was driving for an extended period of time. The car kept driving along as if nothing was going on. She talked the entire time she was being escorted through the office building and the guy nor anybody else had any reactions. That happened on multiple occasions.

She affected the ending of her own show. Kevin didn't do anything.

You've lost the debate and are the only one arguing (shocking). Just stop already.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
You brought this up.

I proved you wrong.

She let go of the wheel of a car she was driving for an extended period of time. The car kept driving along as if nothing was going on. She talked the entire time she was being escorted through the office building and the guy nor anybody else had any reactions. That happened on multiple occasions.

She affected the ending of her own show. Kevin didn't do anything.

You've lost the debate and are the only one arguing (shocking). Just stop already.

She ripped the comic page, the same one where she's talking to the 4th wall.

She let go of the wheel for a few seconds. Did you even watch the show?

The fact that characters don't notice she's talking to the 4th wall doesn't prove anything (one character did notice, thinking she was talking to him).

You need to prove specifically how She-Hulk can win. Provide a specific example of how she could win.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
In a forum fight there is no one in charge of plot development. There is no show, movie, cameraman, cgi team, writer, producer, etc.

2nd, that would be leaving the battlefield to go get outside help (which isn't allowed).

I don't think forum rules aren't meant to take away legit abilities. Otherwise what you claiming Nightcrawler can't drop a bomb and teleport away for a few seconds before returning to see the outcome?

Either way sounds like you concede She-Hulk wins which is why you don't want to give her access to all her abilities.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
She ripped the comic page, the same one where she's talking to the 4th wall.

She literally carried John Byrne away breaking the 4th wall.

It was more than a few seconds. Did you even watch the show?

It proves the outside environment is unaware of it when it happens.

She changes the outcome to where she wins. Easy peasy.

Spite stomp

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
She literally carried John Byrne away breaking the 4th wall.

It was more than a few seconds. Did you even watch the show?

It proves the outside environment is unaware of it when it happens.

She changes the outcome to where she wins. Easy peasy.

Spite stomp

So far you haven't proven anything. I'm starting to think you are trolling me for fun.

She can only do what she was shown to do. Without an entity like Kevin then all she can do is fight or talk to the audience. Talking to the audience is not changing an outcome.
If she can change outcomes by reality manipulation then she wouldn't have needed to go to Kevin. She could have done it herself.

Lastly breaking the 4th wall is an admission to her not being real, not having superpowers (cgi team), etc. So she gets beat because she is a mere human actress. laughing

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
So far you haven't proven anything. I'm starting to think you are trolling me for fun.

I've proven everything. Your just to dumb to comprehend it.

She didn't need Kevin for anything. Why can't you understand that? She went to Kevin wondering why the ending was written so bad (an ending that haden't even happened yet mind you). She just basically outsmarted Kevin and tried to get him to do something she could have done. Kevin refused and then realized she changed the ending anyways. Said she ruined it. Try to keep up.

Breaking the 4th wall is an admission that she has superior abilities and options than almost no other characters have (deadpool, squireel girl, 5d imps, and a few others maybe).

She-Hulk wins in a spite stomp.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
I've proven everything. Your just to dumb to comprehend it.

She didn't need Kevin for anything. Why can't you understand that? She went to Kevin wondering why the ending was written so bad (an ending that haden't even happened yet mind you). She just basically outsmarted Kevin and tried to get him to do something she could have done. Kevin refused and then realized she changed the ending anyways. Said she ruined it. Try to keep up.

Breaking the 4th wall is an admission that she has superior abilities and options than almost no other characters have (deadpool, squireel girl, 5d imps, and a few others maybe).

She-Hulk wins in a spite stomp.

Saying you proved something does not make it true.

You haven't shown She Hulk changing outcomes by breaking the 4th wall, other than the Kevin scene.

You only shown her driving a few seconds without holding the wheel lmao.
You only shown her talking to the audience.
I even told you there was a time someone caught her talking to the audience (they thought she was talking to them). But you ignored that.

That's all. Nothing more. Everything else is you making stuff up.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
Saying you proved something does not make it true.

You haven't shown She Hulk changing outcomes by breaking the 4th wall, other than the Kevin scene.

You only shown her driving a few seconds without holding the wheel lmao.
You only shown her talking to the audience.
I even told you there was a time someone caught her talking to the audience (they thought she was talking to them). But you ignored that.

That's all. Nothing more. Everything else is you making stuff up.

Why is it in every single thread you are the only one arguing about something thats wrong? Has anybody ever agreed with you about anything?

Saying I haven't doesn't make it true either. Your the only person not understanding anything.

How many outcomes does she need to change for you to believe it? Wasn't one proof enough for you that she can do it?

She talked for about 15 seconds while the car was driving itself on a busy road or highway without a care in the world because she knew nothing was going to happen to her.

I gave examples of her breaking reality with the Disney page and the writers, a different outcome to the ending, and numerous times where the audience was oblivious to her breaking the 4th wall yet you are dead set about one person asking her what she said because she slipped back in.

Again, you need to stop this constant arguing in every thread just so you can hear yourself talk. Not one person ever sides with you. It's embarrassing.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
In addition to the movie vs rules Impediment stated that we use the same rules as the comic vs forum (no leaving the battlefield to get outside help, etc). Number 4 is a typo. I meant to type She doesn't get outside help.

No he doesn't. You are flat out wrong on this: he links to the generic rules which state no under 13s etc.

Not the comic book Vs rules. Feel free to show where he does what you claim.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
Why is it in every single thread you are the only one arguing about something thats wrong? Has anybody ever agreed with you about anything?

Saying I haven't doesn't make it true either. Your the only person not understanding anything.

How many outcomes does she need to change for you to believe it? Wasn't one proof enough for you that she can do it?

She talked for about 15 seconds while the car was driving itself on a busy road or highway without a care in the world because she knew nothing was going to happen to her.

I gave examples of her breaking reality with the Disney page and the writers, a different outcome to the ending, and numerous times where the audience was oblivious to her breaking the 4th wall yet you are dead set about one person asking her what she said because she slipped back in.

Again, you need to stop this constant arguing in every thread just so you can hear yourself talk. Not one person ever sides with you. It's embarrassing.

I drove sleeping in a car for more than 15 seconds. I survived.
That's not proof of anything.

There are 0 examples of her changing outcomes by breaking the 4th wall. The only example where the plot changed was through Kevin.
But you claimed that she doesn't need Kevin. But you showed no examples of her changing outcome due to breaking the 4th wall.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
I drove sleeping in a car for more than 15 seconds. I survived.
That's not proof of anything.

Firstly if you were asleep then you weren't counting the seconds.

Secondly you "surviving" is no where near the feat she had of her car just casually driving itself under full control without her steering.

I also fell asleep at the wheel once presumably for a few seconds and woke up in the other lane (dual carriageway so there weren't cars driving towards me). I also survived but that rightly scared the crud out of me.

You're being idiotic as usual.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
No he doesn't. You are flat out wrong on this: he links to the generic rules which state no under 13s etc.

Not the comic book Vs rules. Feel free to show where he does what you claim.

You can ask him.
In particular I remember years ago a mod (most likely him) stating such

Also i asked him the following :

He replied :

DarkSaint85

It's not in the rules thread. I can link you to it if you want? Until it's codified there, it's invalid. See I can do the same:

I asked him:

He replied:

Then there is the problematic nature of your personal list there:

Item #4 in your list means Thor doesn't get Mjolnir in threads. We know it's sentient as seen in Love and Thunder.

Item #3 necessitates a definition of what the battlefield is. Is it a boxing ring? The state of California? The Earth? Without one stated, in She-Hulk's case, all of fiction is her playground.

Same with item #2. No battlefield is stated here. If say, Flash fought Thor, merely throwing Flash 2 miles away does nothing to a guy who can run back in 0.0000001 seconds, for example. But if Flash carried Thor and deposited him 2 miles away, and he didn't have Mjolnir or Heimdall couldn't send the Bifrost to help him or he could use Stormbreaker, then that exact 2 miles is a BFR. Unless you defined earlier what the battlefield was (for example, 5 miles).

So no. It's not in the rules thread, so I reject it and at this point, you are still flat out wrong.

Even if you posted that list as is in the thread, it is still wrong as I can put one holes in it unless and until Imp sits down and writes a thorough and ironclad list of rules.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It's not in the rules thread. I can link you to it if you want? Until it's codified there, it's invalid. See I can do the same:

I asked him:

He replied:

Then there is the problematic nature of your personal list there:

Item #4 in your list means Thor doesn't get Mjolnir in threads. We know it's sentient as seen in Love and Thunder.

Item #3 necessitates a definition of what the battlefield is. Is it a boxing ring? The state of California? The Earth? Without one stated, in She-Hulk's case, all of fiction is her playground.

Same with item #2. No battlefield is stated here. If say, Flash fought Thor, merely throwing Flash 2 miles away does nothing to a guy who can run back in 0.0000001 seconds, for example. But if Flash carried Thor and deposited him 2 miles away, and he didn't have Mjolnir or Heimdall couldn't send the Bifrost to help him or he could use Stormbreaker, then that exact 2 miles is a BFR. Unless you defined earlier what the battlefield was (for example, 5 miles).

So no. It's not in the rules thread, so I reject it and at this point, you are still flat out wrong.

Even if you posted that list as is in the thread, it is still wrong as I can put one holes in it unless and until Imp sits down and writes a thorough and ironclad list of rules.

Mjolnir is standard equipment that Thor always has on him.
Sentient was only part of the stipulation. It in itself doesn't break the rules.
Leaving the battlefield to go get outside help violates the spirit of the debate. It's not character A vs character B anymore. It's character A and their team with outside resources against character B. That's stupid.

Horizon to horizon in a neutral universe is the battlefield unless stated otherwise.

Kevin doesn't exist in the neutral universe.

Plus Kevin only has power over CERTAIN aspects of the MCU. Plus in areas where he does have power invoking him only makes her powerless (just a human actress) as the things he mentions is that she is an actress, it's a show, cgi team, etc.

Lol at you poking holes. That's impossible. You are just reaching.

Since you think the comic vs rules aren't ironclad, I dare you go over there and argue that a character can leave the battlefield only to go get outside help.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
Mjolnir is standard equipment that Thor always has on him.
Sentient was only part of the stipulation. It in itself doesn't break the rules.
Leaving the battlefield to go get outside help violates the spirit of the debate. It's not character A vs character B anymore. It's character A and their team with outside resources against character B. That's stupid.

Horizon to horizon in a neutral universe is the battlefield unless stated otherwise.

Kevin doesn't exist in the neutral universe.

Plus Kevin only has power over CERTAIN aspects of the MCU. Plus in areas where he does have power invoking him only makes her powerless (just a human actress) as the things he mentions is that she is an actress, it's a show, cgi team, etc.

Lol at you poking holes. That's impossible. You are just reaching.

Since you think the comic vs rules aren't ironclad, I dare you go over there and argue that a character can leave the battlefield only to go get outside help.

Sure, am happy to argue their rules aren't ironclad. I havedone so many times.

But the main point remains, despite your shifting around. Movie VS forumrules do not, and never have, said anything about BFR or leaving the battlefield (despite your lies that they did). In future, who knows - Imp can add any rules he wants - but as of right now, rules around leaving the battlefield, the battlefield itself, is not defined. I know the rules sections well - several of the comic rules were put in thanks to myself (check the rules on superspeed and Hulk/Hercs as an example, or WWH /Hulk versions).

So you are flat out wrong. Movie Vs forum rules don't specify the battlefield, or BFR. Imp links only to generic general forum rules.

As for KEVIN being present or not, i already addressed this in my initial posts.

It being stupid or not is irrelevant. You brought rules into this, soI'm showing you that you are easily defeated on this.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Sure, am happy to argue their rules aren't ironclad. I havedone so many times.

But the main point remains, despite your shifting around. Movie VS forumrules do not, and never have, said anything about BFR or leaving the battlefield (despite your lies that they did). In future, who knows - Imp can add any rules he wants - but as of right now, rules around leaving the battlefield, the battlefield itself, is not defined. I know the rules sections well - several of the comic rules were put in thanks to myself (check the rules on superspeed and Hulk/Hercs as an example, or WWH /Hulk versions).

So you are flat out wrong. Movie Vs forum rules don't specify the battlefield, or BFR. Imp links only to generic general forum rules.

As for KEVIN being present or not, i already addressed this in my initial posts.

It being stupid or not is irrelevant. You brought rules into this, soI'm showing you that you are easily defeated on this.

I already told you that mods already stated that we use the same rules as the comic vs forum (no leaving the battlefield, no getting outside help, etc). They said this years ago and just recently.
I even quoted them. You are not above a mod.

Specifically, characters can not leave the battlefield to go get outside help from someone else.

Otherwise the thread isn't character A vs character B anymore.

Rules involving leaving the battlefield to go get outside help from another entity are ironclad.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
I already told you that mods already stated that we use the same rules as the comic vs forum (no leaving the battlefield, no getting outside help, etc). They said this years ago and just recently.
I even quoted them. You are not above a mod.

Specifically, characters can not leave the battlefield to go get outside help from someone else.

Otherwise the thread isn't character A vs character B anymore.

Rules involving leaving the battlefield to go get outside help from another entity are ironclad.

It's not in the rules thread. Anything else is just a mod making a post, same as anyone else.

If it's a rule, then have it in the rules thread. If it's not there, it's not. Simples.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
It's not in the rules thread. Anything else is just a mod making a post, same as anyone else.

If it's a rule, then have it in the rules thread. If it's not there, it's not. Simples.

There have been numerous instances where moderators have made rulings without officially updating the rule section.

But I digress.

We all have common sense. When you argue against it, you're essentially trolling.

Using common sense, it's clear that in a "Character A vs. Character B" thread, arguing that one character would leave the battlefield to seek outside help undermines the spirit of the debate and the original poster's intentions.

Furthermore, that's just one of many issues. Here are a few more:

1. She-Hulk doesn't know Wonder Woman or her power level. She-Hulk doesn't have a history of abandoning the battlefield before a fight or to avoid being knocked out.

2. KEVIN only has the power to alter scripts for movies or shows he's contracted under. For instance, in a forum fight where there's no script to change, he has no authority over scripts from other universes (like DC) or even parts of the MCU he's not involved with.

3. KEVIN exists solely within the MCU. He doesn't exist in other universes.

4. She-Hulk isn't in the MCU or the Disney+ app universe in this context.

5. KEVIN has his own agency. He's not obligated to alter any script to prevent She-Hulk from being knocked out in a forum fight.

etc.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
There have been numerous instances where moderators have made rulings without officially updating the rule section.

But I digress.

We all have common sense. When you argue against it, you're essentially trolling.

Using common sense, it's clear that in a "Character A vs. Character B" thread, arguing that one character would leave the battlefield to seek outside help undermines the spirit of the debate and the original poster's intentions.

Furthermore, that's just one of many issues. Here are a few more:

1. She-Hulk doesn't know Wonder Woman or her power level. She-Hulk doesn't have a history of abandoning the battlefield before a fight or to avoid being knocked out.

2. KEVIN only has the power to alter scripts for movies or shows he's contracted under. For instance, in a forum fight where there's no script to change, he has no authority over scripts from other universes (like DC) or even parts of the MCU he's not involved with.

3. KEVIN exists solely within the MCU. He doesn't exist in other universes.

4. She-Hulk isn't in the MCU or the Disney+ app universe in this context.

5. KEVIN has his own agency. He's not obligated to alter any script to prevent She-Hulk from being knocked out in a forum fight.

etc.
Again, you shifted your goalposts, originally claiming it was in the rule thread, then that it was in the generic forum rules thread, and now you're basing it on.....a private convo lmao.

Now after all that, you have nothing. As of my original post, and as of this post, it's not part of the rules. So no, she can freely leave the battlefield, as undefined as it is.

Come back when Imp changes something in the rules thread to something ironclad laughing out loud

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Again, you shifted your goalposts, originally claiming it was in the rule thread, then that it was in the generic forum rules thread, and now you're basing it on.....a private convo lmao.

Now after all that, you have nothing. As of my original post, and as of this post, it's not part of the rules. So no, she can freely leave the battlefield, as undefined as it is.

Come back when Imp changes something in the rules thread to something ironclad laughing out loud

Like I said, arguing against common sense and what a mod said is trolling.

With that said, You have to address all 6 of the problems. Addressing only one still loses for you.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
Like I said, arguing against common sense and what a mod said is trolling.

With that said, You have to address all 6 of the problems. Addressing only one still loses for you.

So ignoring the lying you did then?

Originally posted by h1a8

2. Leaving the battlefield has always been the rules.

And:
Originally posted by h1a8
In addition to the movie vs rules Impediment stated that we use the same rules as the comic vs forum (no leaving the battlefield to get outside help, etc).

This is just flat out wrong.

Arguing against a mod isn't trolling either, and never has been, unless you want to paint mods as intransigent walls who can't be talked to. I myself have argued against several mods, who are perfectly happy to defend their position and disagree with me. Doesn't make me a troll to debate on a debate site.

The battlefield isn't defined, so She-Hulk cannot be said to be leaving it. Even if it was defined, her leaving it isn't a loss as no rules state that it is, especially since she can easily come back. I will keep on this point, despite your attempts to wriggle out.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
So ignoring the lying you did then?

And:

This is just flat out wrong.

Arguing against a mod isn't trolling either, and never has been, unless you want to paint mods as intransigent walls who can't be talked to. I myself have argued against several mods, who are perfectly happy to defend their position and disagree with me. Doesn't make me a troll to debate on a debate site.

The battlefield spans from horizon to horizon within a neutral universe, meaning characters cannot go beyond the horizon to escape the fight or travel to other universes to seek outside help. This is a well-defined rule.

You seem to be the only one on KMC who believes that a character can leave the battlefield to get outside assistance without violating the debate's premise of Character A vs. Character B. In other words, you interpret a forum fight as allowing either character to leave and bring in others to secure a win.

Even though you're mistaken on this point, the debate was still lost due to the other five arguments presented.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
The battlefield spans from horizon to horizon within a neutral universe, meaning characters cannot go beyond the horizon to escape the fight or travel to other universes to seek outside help. This is a well-defined rule.

You seem to be the only one on KMC who believes that a character can leave the battlefield to get outside assistance without violating the debate's premise of Character A vs. Character B. In other words, you interpret a forum fight as allowing either character to leave and bring in others to secure a win.

Even though you're mistaken on this point, the debate was still lost due to the other five arguments presented.

Again, this is a rule only in the comic Vs forum. Not the movie Vs forum, which is where we are right now. Well-defined, yes - applicable here, no.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Again, this is a rule only in the comic Vs forum. Not the movie Vs forum, which is where we are right now. Well-defined, yes - applicable here, no.

Originally posted by h1a8

Even though you're mistaken on this point, the debate was still lost due to the other five arguments presented.

DarkSaint85

But I'm not addressing the entire thing (even though I already did on like page 2, preempting you) - I am pointing out that you are wrong on the forum rules here, and worse, have lied and are doubling down on it.

Which calls your position into question. It's easily verifiable - anyone can go to the Movie Versus rule thread to see which of us is correct.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
But I'm not addressing the entire thing (even though I already did on like page 2, preempting you) - I am pointing out that you are wrong on the forum rules here, and worse, have lied and are doubling down on it.

Which calls your position into question. It's easily verifiable - anyone can go to the Movie Versus rule thread to see which of us is correct.

You were informed of the moderator's stance, and it's clear that your approach goes against the spirit and intention of the debate. Therefore, there's no need to discuss that issue further. The other five points, which you haven't addressed, remain valid and make that option untenable. In essence, this means you've conceded the debate.

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
You were informed of the moderator's stance, and it's clear that your approach goes against the spirit and intention of the debate. Therefore, there's no need to discuss that issue further. The other five points, which you haven't addressed, remain valid and make that option untenable. In essence, this means you've conceded the debate.
The moderator's views remain just that - their views.
Until they are in the rules thread, they're just his opinions, nothing more.

Moreover, you specifically lied and doubled down on this lie. Nowhere in the rules say what you say, despite you explicitly trying to lie to us about it (and I knew this, when I asked).

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
The moderator's views remain just that - their views.
Until they are in the rules thread, they're just his opinions, nothing more.

Moreover, you specifically lied and doubled down on this lie. Nowhere in the rules say what you say, despite you explicitly trying to lie to us about it (and I knew this, when I asked).

A mod can make a ruling without it being in the rules. You should know that from the comic vs forum.
A mod made the ruling years ago. I don't remember the thread. When I asked IMP he said "YES" and "THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN THE NORM".
As in past tense. It's nothing new. Who lied?

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
A mod can make a ruling without it being in the rules. You should know that from the comic vs forum.
A mod made the ruling years ago. I don't remember the thread. When I asked IMP he said "YES" and "THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN THE NORM".
As in past tense. It's nothing new. Who lied?

Source: "trust me bro"

I think I vaguely remember what he's referring to, but without quoting it we can't confirm exactly what the mod said. And as DS has mentioned, even if it was said it was just a ruling at that time for that thread.

Having said that I don't buy for a second that characters can't use their main abilities to win a fight, just because it might mean leaving the battlefield for a second. I mean going by this Nightcrawler or Azazel can't drop people from the sky (like Azazel kept doing in First Class). Or Flash can't run around the world in a few seconds to do super punch like he did to Luthor-Braniac in JLU.

Robtard

KMC Mods are know-nothing-ass-clowns smile

So it'd still with onscreen feats and common sense thumb up

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
A mod can make a ruling without it being in the rules. You should know that from the comic vs forum.
A mod made the ruling years ago. I don't remember the thread. When I asked IMP he said "YES" and "THAT'S ALWAYS BEEN THE NORM".
As in past tense. It's nothing new. Who lied?

Nope, even in the comic forum, unless it's in the rules thread it's just their views. I know this because I had to go through these hoops to get my Hercs ruling codified, and my superspeed ruling, and my Hulk incarnations ruling, etc.

Mods have to make a ruling, and to do so it has to be in the stickied rules thread.

Until then, it is not a rule. It's just their opinion, their view. Much like Gala's view that all of DC is canon, or that there is only one Mxy. Much like -Pr-'s view that carver is an idiot and a troll, or that Superman has dynamic strength and speed - if all these posts that they've made are truly 'forum tules' just because a mod said them, most 'debates' would have been killed off on page 1.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Nope, even in the comic forum, unless it's in the rules thread it's just their views. I know this because I had to go through these hoops to get my Hercs ruling codified, and my superspeed ruling, and my Hulk incarnations ruling, etc.

Mods have to make a ruling, and to do so it has to be in the stickied rules thread.

Until then, it is not a rule. It's just their opinion, their view. Much like Gala's view that all of DC is canon, or that there is only one Mxy. Much like -Pr-'s view that carver is an idiot and a troll, or that Superman has dynamic strength and speed - if all these posts that they've made are truly 'forum tules' just because a mod said them, most 'debates' would have been killed off on page 1.

We disagree on that issue. Leaving the battlefield to seek outside help is generally a matter of common sense. No one argues that for a reason. However, this is not a viable option due to the other five issues, rendering the argument that 'anything goes if there's no official rule against it' moot.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Source: "trust me bro"

I think I vaguely remember what he's referring to, but without quoting it we can't confirm exactly what the mod said. And as DS has mentioned, even if it was said it was just a ruling at that time for that thread.

Having said that I don't buy for a second that characters can't use their main abilities to win a fight, just because it might mean leaving the battlefield for a second. I mean going by this Nightcrawler or Azazel can't drop people from the sky (like Azazel kept doing in First Class). Or Flash can't run around the world in a few seconds to do super punch like he did to Luthor-Braniac in JLU.

The argument isn't about leaving the battlefield.
It's about leaving the battlefield to specifically receive outside help from another.
Rules are irrelevant in that case, as it is a matter of common sense.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8

The argument isn't about leaving the battlefield.
It's about leaving the battlefield to specifically receive outside help from another.
Rules are irrelevant in that case, as it is a matter of common sense.

It's not outside help though. You seem to think KEVIN is a She-Hulk ally or something.

No She-Hulk goes into the real world in her She-Hulk form where she can bully whoever she needs to to change the plot until it goes the way she wants. It's her power to do this, and she can just go back as if she never left the battlefield.

h1a8

Originally posted by Darth Thor
It's not outside help though. You seem to think KEVIN is a She-Hulk ally or something.

No She-Hulk goes into the real world in her She-Hulk form where she can bully whoever she needs to to change the plot until it goes the way she wants. It's her power to do this, and she can just go back as if she never left the battlefield. That's called receiving outside help. It doesn't matter if she can mind control the person to achieve the help. It's still the principal of common sense.

But that is off the table anyway.So we are just debating for shuts and giggles

DarkSaint85

Originally posted by h1a8
We disagree on that issue. Leaving the battlefield to seek outside help is generally a matter of common sense. No one argues that for a reason. However, this is not a viable option due to the other five issues, rendering the argument that 'anything goes if there's no official rule against it' moot.

The argument isn't about leaving the battlefield.
It's about leaving the battlefield to specifically receive outside help from another.
Rules are irrelevant in that case, as it is a matter of common sense.

If you are only arguing about Kevin, that is a different matter

I am arguing about breaking the 4th wall and leaving the unspecified battlefield, which there isn't a rule against or defining.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
That's called receiving outside help. It doesn't matter if she can mind control the person to achieve the help. It's still the principal of common sense.

But that is off the table anyway.So we are just debating for shuts and giggles

It's not "help" when she's bullying them into it. This is also part of her power set. Like DS mentioned, Thor calling Mjolnir is outside help. But like you stated it's part of his abilities.

h1a8

Originally posted by Darth Thor
It's not "help" when she's bullying them into it. This is also part of her power set. Like DS mentioned, Thor calling Mjolnir is outside help. But like you stated it's part of his abilities.

Mind controlling is even more than bullying.

You keep separating the two. They go together. Leaving the battlefield + getting outside help is against common sense.

Thor has Mjolnir. He doesn't need to leave the battlefield to go get it.
Its called standard equipment.

h1a8

Originally posted by DarkSaint85
If you are only arguing about Kevin, that is a different matter

I am arguing about breaking the 4th wall and leaving the unspecified battlefield, which there isn't a rule against or defining.

Without Kevin, the discussion is moot. He's the key to all of this.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
Without Kevin, the discussion is moot. He's the key to all of this.

How and why? She has proven to be independent from Kevin.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
How and why? She has proven to be independent from Kevin.

What can she do to WW to help win the fight without Kevin's assistance?
She has to fight her normally.

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
Mind controlling is even more than bullying.

You keep separating the two. They go together. Leaving the battlefield + getting outside help is against common sense.

Thor has Mjolnir. He doesn't need to leave the battlefield to go get it.
Its called standard equipment.

Lol so if Professor X mind controls people to attack his opponent then that's outside help?

No he's using his own abilities to aid him in battle which you want to take away because you want your own character to win.

As far as the battle goes it won't seem/be like she left. From Wonder Woman's POV things will just go wrong for her in the fight.

Okay, so if Mjolnir is his standard weapon then if he calls Strombreaker then that's outside help?

Think carefully. Your problem is you decide who you want to win and then think in a linear plane where only that result is a possibility. You don't think first to decide who would win based on abilities.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
What can she do to WW to help win the fight without Kevin's assistance?
She has to fight her normally.

laughing out loud

She can break the 4th wall. She can change outcomes. She can't lose if she chooses to. Kevin has nothing to do with that.

h1a8

And this is all a moot discussion anyway. The Kevin thing is off the table for the 4-5 other reasons why I stated awhile ago.

KingD19

And we stated that breaking the 4th wall isn't relegated to just talking with Kevin. If you can break the 4th wall, that's your ability. Not whatever you do while breaking it. So she can do whatever she wants.

tkitna

Originally posted by KingD19
And we stated that breaking the 4th wall isn't relegated to just talking with Kevin. If you can break the 4th wall, that's your ability. Not whatever you do while breaking it. So she can do whatever she wants.

Exactly its just that H1 can't accept that.

tkitna

She didn't need Kevin's assistance. Why do you keep going back to that? She bullied the writers first by almost smashing their table and they pointed Kevin out to her. She manipulated Kevin instead of bullying him. The ending was already ruined by her doing that. If she chose, she could have just refused the ending.

Do you get it now?

tkitna

You still don't get it (purposely probably). She didn't need Kevin to change anything. She could have done that herself. She just manipulated him into doing it for her instead.

Try to keep up.

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
You still don't get it (purposely probably). She didn't need Kevin to change anything. She could have done that herself. She just manipulated him into doing it for her instead.

Try to keep up.

Prove it then. Prove she could have done what Kevin did without Kevin's assistance. On screen feats please. Then provide a logical reason why she chose not to do it on her own.

h1a8

Originally posted by Darth Thor
So if Prof X uses mind control to control others to fight for him, that doesnt count ?

DO YOU get it now ?

If Professor X can mind control others who are not on the battlefield while he remains on it, those mind-controlled individuals have access to the battlefield, and Professor X has the propensity to use such tactics, then it would be a viable strategy.

However, that's not what we're discussing. We're discussing Professor X leaving the battlefield first and then getting assistance from someone or something else.

Do you get it now?

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8
If Professor X can mind control others who are not on the battlefield while he remains on it, those mind-controlled individuals have access to the battlefield, and Professor X has the propensity to use such tactics, then it would be a viable strategy.

However, that's not what we're discussing. We're discussing Professor X leaving the battlefield first and then getting assistance from someone or something else.

Do you get it now?

Wrong. Try to keep up with your own claims.

You made 2 claims:

1) No leaving the battlefields.
2) No outside help.

As already mentioned you have conceded point 2 as long as it's done under the user's powers/abilities. Try to keep up and move on.

So back to point 1.

Can Azazel teleport people into the Sky to drop them like he does in First Class?

Can Hero teleport home for a second to grab his sword and thew teleport back?

Darth Thor

^ Hiro*

Originally posted by h1a8
Prove it then. Prove she could have done what Kevin did without Kevin's assistance. On screen feats please. Then provide a logical reason why she chose not to do it on her own.

Dude she's in her She-Hulk form. Wth could anyone do to stop her?

Logical reason? Urm the fact that it's simpler and less violent for everyone if KEVIN agrees? Jeez you're getting ridiculous.

tkitna

Originally posted by h1a8
Prove it then. Prove she could have done what Kevin did without Kevin's assistance. On screen feats please. Then provide a logical reason why she chose not to do it on her own.

laughing

h1a8

Originally posted by tkitna
laughing

Are you serious? What is there to prove that hasen't been already? She hated the ending and got it changed by a method that wasn't violent. She manipulated Kevin instead of refusing on her own or worse yet, destroying him. She left with the results she went for without altercation.

Don't forget also that she was ready to bully the writers if she had to. She almost destroyed their table before they pointed her to Kevin.

How does any of this prove the following claim?

Originally posted by h1a8
Prove it then. Prove she could have done what Kevin did without Kevin's assistance. On screen feats please.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
^ Hiro*

Dude she's in her She-Hulk form. Wth could anyone do to stop her?

Logical reason? Urm the fact that it's simpler and less violent for everyone if KEVIN agrees? Jeez you're getting ridiculous.

Ko her, kill her, etc

Makes 0 sense and therefore not logical.

Originally posted by Darth Thor
Wrong. Try to keep up with your own claims.

You made 2 claims:

1) No leaving the battlefields.
2) No outside help.

As already mentioned you have conceded point 2 as long as it's done under the user's powers/abilities. Try to keep up and move on.

So back to point 1.

Can Azazel teleport people into the Sky to drop them like he does in First Class?

Can Hero teleport home for a second to grab his sword and thew teleport back?
Glad you agree that no character is allowed to leave the battlefield specifically to obtain outside assistance. End of discussion

tkitna

What did Kevin do except talk and be bummed out because the ending was already ruined? Kevin didn't do anything and the ending was changed. What are you looking for here that isn't already obvious? *shrugs*

Darth Thor

Originally posted by h1a8

Ko her, kill her, etc

How the heck are people in the "real" world going to KO or kill She-Hulk? Are you for real.

Originally posted by h1a8
Makes 0 sense and therefore not logical.

It makes sense to everyone except you.

Originally posted by h1a8
Glad you agree that no character is allowed to leave the battlefield specifically to obtain outside assistance. End of discussion

I never agreed that. What are you reading exactly when you quote me?

You conceded on outside help as long as it was a natural/direct effect of their abilties/powers.

So we were ascertaining the same about leaving the battlefield for a split second (if even that), as another way to use one's natural powers/abilities.

So Ill ask again,

1) Can Azazel teleport his opponents into the Sky?

2) Can Hiro quickly teleport home to grab his sword?

h1a8

Originally posted by Darth Thor
How the heck are people in the "real" world going to KO or kill She-Hulk? Are you for real.

It makes sense to everyone except you.

I never agreed that. What are you reading exactly when you quote me?

You conceded on outside help as long as it was a natural/direct effect of their abilties/powers.

So we were ascertaining the same about leaving the battlefield for a split second (if even that), as another way to use one's natural powers/abilities.

So Ill ask again,

1) Can Azazel teleport his opponents into the Sky?

2) Can Hiro quickly teleport home to grab his sword?

She Hulk is fighting WW, not a real human.
Again, characters aren't allowed to leave the battlefield to obtain outside help from others.

Even if She Hulk was allowed to do so then it wouldn't work for the 4-5 reasons I named. So you are wasting your time with debating what a character is allowed to do by rules.