Superman vs Lucifer Morningstar

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Entity
Lucifer Morningstar has taken on the challenge of finally defeating Superman completely and once and for all. However since it would be to easy to simply use his powers to end him, he's vowed to do it without his abilities and using only his cunning and deceptive skills to any means he see fit.

Can he break the icon without the direct use of his power?

Tyrant
He manipulates every demon in hell, to kill everyone who is/or has ever been close to Superman.
Starting at Jimmy Olsen, and ending at Lois.

No power involved, since everyone fears, and respects Lucifer there. Why question him?

TricksterPriest
Originally posted by Entity
Lucifer Morningstar has taken on the challenge of finally defeating Superman completely and once and for all. However since it would be to easy to simply use his powers to end him, he's vowed to do it without his abilities and using only his cunning and deceptive skills to any means he see fit.

Can he break the icon without the direct use of his power?

Supes is going to wish he was dead several times over before Lucifer gets through with him.

hang

Astner
Depends on the writer shifty

Soops220
Originally posted by Astner
Depends on the writer shifty

not an argument. everything depends on the writer, its a given.

Soljer
Lucifer. Easy.

nvrbeenwthagirl
Lucifer is beyond the Source and even challenges the Presence if he so chooses. He would kill Superman by setting up a chain of events that would lead to his death, at the end of a very long and tortured path.

Entity
This is a story I would love to read. Not just because I hate Superman but because I'd love to see how he would fight someone he couldn't beat that isn't really attacking him physically in anyway. Actually I love seeing this kind of story with any hero. Its a big part of why I loved Identity Crisis so much.

Also I think its a big part of why I love Slade so much. I like villains that are allot more mind games than brute fighting.

nvrbeenwthagirl
Originally posted by Entity
This is a story I would love to read. Not just because I hate Superman but because I'd love to see how he would fight someone he couldn't beat that isn't really attacking him physically in anyway. Actually I love seeing this kind of story with any hero. Its a big part of why I loved Identity Crisis so much.

Mxy coudl do this if a writer with a clue wrote him. Joker did this to batman when he had mxy's power. It was insane what he put him thru.

Entity
Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Mxy coudl do this if a writer with a clue wrote him. Joker did this to batman when he had mxy's power. It was insane what he put him thru. Yea but I don't want someone rewriting reallity or warping it in any way. Just someone royally screwing with him with nothing but planing. Like Luther SHOULD be doing instead of constintly being made to look like a goof by Supes at the end.

BobbyD
Archangel Michael steps in and says "Clark, I'll take this one for you-you're too important in the grand scheme."

Astner
Presence steps in*
- If Superman dies, DC dies, if DC dies I die.
- You shall not pass!

Supreme being
Originally posted by Astner
Presence steps in*
- If Superman dies, DC dies, if DC dies I die.
- You shall not pass! laughing laughing laughing rolling on floor laughing

Superherovandal
Naw. Excluding divine intervention Supes is royally screwed. Lucifers on the pedestal when it comes to this.

Galan007
Originally posted by Entity
Can he break the icon without the direct use of his power? Unquestionably.

Endless Mike
He could probably manipulate tons of gods and cosmic entities to kill him

Entity
Originally posted by Endless Mike
He could probably manipulate tons of gods and cosmic entities to kill him Actually I was just meaning screwing with his life by planing and such. Not using powers like that in anyway.

Endless Mike
I didn't mean with any kind of powers, just by tricking them or negotiating with them. He has lots of connections.

Superboy Prime
Joker almost broke Supes. Imagine what Lucifer will do. Poor Kal-El.

Entity
Well I really don't want him to use any powers. Especially godly ones. Not even by just manipulating others to use them for him. I want to know if he can screw up Clark's life with only human means and his skill.

Superboy Prime
He can do it. Joker almost broke Superman's will in Action Comics. He fooled Kal-El into thinking the only means of saving a poisoned Lois would be to kill him(joker) so he can find out the cure. Had Batman not convinced Supes; Clark would have killed the Joker out of desperation. Had Supes done it he would have broken his oath of not taking another life and Supes' would have been broken. They found out it was all a farce after Lois made a complete recovery after Supes decided he would not kill Joker.

Entity
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
He can do it. Joker almost broke Superman's will in Action Comics. He fooled Kal-El into thinking the only means of saving a poisoned Lois would be to kill him(joker) so he can find out the cure. Had Batman not convinced Supes; Clark would have killed the Joker out of desperation. Had Supes done it he would have broken his oath of not taking another life and Supes' would have been broken. They found out it was all a farce after Lois made a complete recovery after Supes decided he would not kill Joker. See now why didn't Joker just really do it?

Superboy Prime
Kill Lois?

What Joker was trying to do is have Superman kill him for nothing since Lois was going to be ok anyway. Therefor the impact such a selfish act would have on Supes would have been unbearable.

Soljer
Lucifer chats up superman and convinces him that it'd be in everyone's best interest if he just comitted suicide.

Piece of cake.

Big Sexy
Originally posted by Entity
See now why didn't Joker just really do it? By killing Lois, he makes her a Martyr but by breaking Superman he takes down one of earths greatest heroes plus the obvious joke of irony.

Superboy Prime
Originally posted by Big Sexy
By killing Lois, he makes her a Martyr but by breaking Superman he takes down one of earths greatest heroes plus the obvious joke of irony.

yes

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