Aizen Sousuke vs. Superman

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Akuki
Post crisis Superman vs. Aizen Sousuke

the battle takes place in downtown Metropolis

Aizen Sousuke Bio:
Aizen's zanpakut? is Ky?ka Suigetsu (????, lit. Mirror Flower Water Moon). In its sealed form, it looks like a normal katana. Its shikai command is "shatter" (??? kudakero?). The name Ky?ka Suigetsu suggests its illusionary properties; the moon reflected in water and a flower in a mirror are things that can be seen but not held. It is a Chinese saying for seeing and desiring something that is a dream that cannot be easily grasped in hand, teaching people about temptations.

Ky?ka Suigetsu's shikai has the ability to place anyone who sees it under a state of complete hypnosis, after which Aizen can make them see whatever he wants. The hypnosis is unbreakable, even if the target is aware that they are hypnotized. The only way to avoid the effect is to not see Ky?ka Suigetsu's shikai, making the blind Kaname T?sen the only person in Soul Society completely immune to its effects. The effect seems to be permanent, or at the very least long-lasting, as Aizen uses it on nearly all of the lieutenants and captains in the Gotei 13 during a ceremonial release of his zanpakut? well before faking his own death. While the illusions Ky?ka Suigetsu creates are quite powerful, they are not perfect; Captain Retsu Unohana was able to detect something was amiss with Aizen's fake corpse, even though she did not realize what until seeing Aizen alive.
Ky?ka Suigetsu's hypnotic abilities make it a useful tool in combat as well, as Aizen can quickly create simple illusions to deceive opponents. By creating a decoy of himself, Aizen can hide his own movements and attack with impunity; his opponent, meanwhile, will remain focused on the illusion until it's too late to react. The most prominent example of this is his fight against Sajin Komamura, where an illusionary copy of Aizen is seen melting away after the real Aizen has moved close enough to use the devastating Black Coffin spell.

Aizen has also been said to have reached the maximum level of shinigami skills in all categories.

llagrok
Never really gotten to see any of Aizen's power, for all we know his feats could be illusions.

Skeets
Superman punches his head off.

Endless Mike
If you ignore the whole bullshit about how Bleach shinigami can't be seen by normal people (and even including that, Superman has some kind of wacky "soul vision" power), then Superman wins easily, since he can speedblitz him before he can even draw his sword, and he has strong mental resistance to illusions and such. There's nothing Aizen could really even do to hurt him, unless you want to make the argument that his powers count as magic and would affect Superman's vulnerability to it.

Akuki
Originally posted by llagrok
Never really gotten to see any of Aizen's power, for all we know his feats could be illusions.
we know quite a few of his battles aren't illusions, because in order to hypnotize someone he has to put his sword back in his basic form, and he never did that in front of Ichigo.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
we know quite a few of his battles aren't illusions, because in order to hypnotize someone he has to put his sword back in his basic form, and he never did that in front of Ichigo.

Actually they just have to see it once.

llagrok
Aizen needs more feats before he can hang with someone like Superman.

Akuki
Originally posted by Endless Mike
If you ignore the whole bullshit about how Bleach shinigami can't be seen by normal people (and even including that, Superman has some kind of wacky "soul vision" power), then Superman wins easily, since he can speedblitz him before he can even draw his sword, and he has strong mental resistance to illusions and such. There's nothing Aizen could really even do to hurt him, unless you want to make the argument that his powers count as magic and would affect Superman's vulnerability to it.

First of all there is the issue of whether or not Superman can actually touch Aizen, since Aizen is basically Intangible. Also there is a very simple way for Aizen to take down Superman in two strikes. He uses the soul ejection technique to get supermans soul out of his body, then he simply destroys his soul.

Also keep in mind whether or not Superman would immediately go for a speed blitz, since he usually challenges his opponent and urges them to surrender first so long as they haven't done anything horrific to the local population. As Aizen is extremely good at both stalling and is extremely fast himself (see his reaction to ichigo's speed blitz for more details) I think he could hold Supes off long enough to get the hypnosis on him. The hypnosis should be effective as it is basically magical attack, as are all of Aizen's other techniques.

illadelph12
It's a requisite that character bios be provided for all non-comic combatants.

Please review the rules and add a bio. Thanks.

llagrok
1. They've never measured bleach speed, so what's fast for Ichigo might be incredibly slow for Superman. Given the fact that Yoruichi had to exhaust herself in order to travel through Soul Society in minutes and Superman could do it in a second, I'd say that the Bleach characters are incredibly slow compared to Superman.

2. Soul ejection? I don't think you do that on Superman. That's like claiming that it's possible to drain a DC/Marvel character of all their chakra. Reiatsu and terms like that can't apply when you bring in cross-genre character. Superman's soul can not be ejected, nor can Aizen cut his soul sleep or get him with his reiatsu pressure.

3. Superman can both see and touch Aizen. Otherwise this thread is pointless.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
First of all there is the issue of whether or not Superman can actually touch Aizen, since Aizen is basically Intangible.

That's why Chad was able to whack a hollow with a telephone pole before he had any powers, right?



Except in Bleach, someone's soul has all of their physical stats and abilities. Oops.



At most Bleach speed feats put them several times the speed of sound. Superman is faster than light.



No, they're spiritual. Big difference. Superman has learned to resist such things anyway, besides he has T-Vo.

illadelph12
Superman doesn't have a soul?

llagrok
There's no contest.

As far as we know, there aren't any planet busters in Bleach.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by llagrok
There's no contest.

As far as we know, there aren't any planet busters in Bleach.

Not that this affects the outcome of the match, but those criteria are rather narrow - minded. Saint of Killers, for example, isn't a planet buster, but he could beat tons of characters that are.

llagrok
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Not that this affects the outcome of the match, but those criteria are rather narrow - minded. Saint of Killers, for example, isn't a planet buster, but he could beat tons of characters that are.

Trust me, I know Bleach. There aren't any characters capable of taking on Superman in the Bleach verse.

SOK is a poor example seeing as he is immortal.

Akuki
Originally posted by illadelph12
It's a requisite that character bios be provided for all non-comic combatants.

Please review the rules and add a bio. Thanks.
Sure here's part of one, I'll add some scans later.


Aizen Sousuke
Aizen's zanpakut? is Ky?ka Suigetsu (????, lit. Mirror Flower Water Moon). In its sealed form, it looks like a normal katana. Its shikai command is "shatter" (??? kudakero?). The name Ky?ka Suigetsu suggests its illusionary properties; the moon reflected in water and a flower in a mirror are things that can be seen but not held. It is a Chinese saying for seeing and desiring something that is a dream that cannot be easily grasped in hand, teaching people about temptations.
Ky?ka Suigetsu's shikai has the ability to place anyone who sees it under a state of complete hypnosis, after which Aizen can make them see whatever he wants. The hypnosis is unbreakable, even if the target is aware that they are hypnotized. The only way to avoid the effect is to not see Ky?ka Suigetsu's shikai, making the blind Kaname T?sen the only person in Soul Society completely immune to its effects. The effect seems to be permanent, or at the very least long-lasting, as Aizen uses it on nearly all of the lieutenants and captains in the Gotei 13 during a ceremonial release of his zanpakut? well before faking his own death. While the illusions Ky?ka Suigetsu creates are quite powerful, they are not perfect; Captain Retsu Unohana was able to detect something was amiss with Aizen's fake corpse, even though she did not realize what until seeing Aizen alive.
Ky?ka Suigetsu's hypnotic abilities make it a useful tool in combat as well, as Aizen can quickly create simple illusions to deceive opponents. By creating a decoy of himself, Aizen can hide his own movements and attack with impunity; his opponent, meanwhile, will remain focused on the illusion until it's too late to react. The most prominent example of this is his fight against Sajin Komamura, where an illusionary copy of Aizen is seen melting away after the real Aizen has moved close enough to use the devastating Black Coffin spell.
Aizen has also been said to have reached the maximum level of shinigami skills in all categories.


as to the response about about the soul ejection, I don't see why it wouldn't apply. It's a legitimate magical attack, and all characters have souls, and I haven't seen any sort of magical resistance on superman's part that could overcome that. barring that Aizen could simply use the reiatsu pinning which has been seen many times in bleach. This would be effective as the attack directly targets the soul of a person as opposed to their physical forms, thereby rendering Supermans strength useless against it.

llagrok
Once again, you are applying bleach terms to a DC character. Not going to work I'm afraid. Not that it makes much of a difference. Bleach characters are far behind in terms of strength and speed, which is why Superman wouldn't have any problems taking this.

Akuki
As for Bleach speed, its extremely difficult to calculate, but there are several context clues that we can use to figure out approximately what Aizen's speed is.
First of all, let's start with the first major use of superspeed in Bleach, when byakuya was able to unsheath his sword stab him twice in vital locations and then resheath it and be several hundred feet away by the time Ichigo could blink.
What sort of speed would you guys classify that as?
2. By the time Ichigo arrived in soul society and fights Byakuya again he is able to deal with that speed relatively comfortably in normal form, and it is known that Shinigami can only work at 1/8 power in the normal world, Although Aizen is an exception to this.
3. By the Ichigo vs. Byakuya main fight, Byakuya has approximately tripled his speed, and Ichigo goes far faster than Byakuya does even at full power, and has shown that he can move his sword at speeds that allow him to deflect thousands to millions of high speed projectiles.
4. Aizen is able to easily block Ichigo at top speed, and simply plays with him.
5. Ichigon recieves a major speed boost by going into vaizard form which appears to at least double his speed, and he is still easily matched in speed by one of aizen's mid level minions.

Any opinions on around what sort of speeds we can agree on for Bleach?
Personally i believe the major issue here is whether or not aizen can at least survive long enough to use kyouka suigetsu on Superman. I see absolutely no reason why it would not work on supes. After all this is the same attack that was able to function for centuries in an area controlled by high level magic or spiritualist users without any detection and worked on many extremely strong minds without any issue, such as head captain Yamamoto.

illadelph12
Do you have video clips as well?

Akuki
Originally posted by illadelph12
Do you have video clips as well?
I'm sure there are at least a couple on youtube, I'll go look. However some of the higher level fights are only in the manga currently.

illadelph12
Do you have a scanner? This could be good for a knowledge base at least.

Akuki
Originally posted by illadelph12
Do you have a scanner? This could be good for a knowledge base at least.
yeah, by that way are we allowed to make anime based respect threads? I tried to make one for aizen a while back, but it got deleted.
Damn photobucket isn't letting me in right now, so the pics will have to wait.
here's a couple of youtube links
Ichigo vs. Byakuya fight (very long)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3ySe6TD5O4
Aizen pwning Hitsugaya
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPni-qpKw00
Aizen explaining his attack
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wuQ05c5fGaw

illadelph12
Really? Hmm...

Send a PM to Digimark regarding that. He may be able to provide clarification on that. It could have simply been a mistake.

Akuki
Aizen vs. Ichigo and renji
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXCVzlGsZP4

Ichigo vs. grimmjow( note that Grimmjow is only a midlevel minion of Aizen)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqkbPMMOkKo&mode=related&search=

Endless Mike
You're forgetting the fact that Ichigo was severely wounded and weakened when he attacked Aizen, and even earlier in his fight with Byakuya his hollow side commented that his speed had decreased and his bones were broken. Not that it would make any difference, the gap in speed here is just too great.

Akuki
Originally posted by Endless Mike
You're forgetting the fact that Ichigo was severely wounded and weakened when he attacked Aizen, and even earlier in his fight with Byakuya his hollow side commented that his speed had decreased and his bones were broken. Not that it would make any difference, the gap in speed here is just too great.
The issue isn't whether on not Superman is faster, that isn't in dispute, the question is whether or not Aizen is strong and fast enough to survive that first initial moments of the fight so that he can get his sword out. Aizen certainly fast enough to unsheath his sword and say two words before Supes finish him off. Also keep in mind that he has several technical devices to help him out as well, such as the cube that he carries that when activated on a person causes them to be trapped in a miniature pocket dimension for eternity. If Aizen can survive the first inital moments in order to activate kyouka suigetsu, then this fight becomes a good deal fairer. Aizen can force Superman to slow down, by making the streets different and etc, so that Superman doesn't know if by going superspeed he will run over civilians and kill them.

Also just to note, Aizen was fighting Ichigo and renji with when in shikai.
Aizen has not used Bankai, which is ten times more powerful than shikai, Aizen also possesses the item to create vaizards, so it is highly likely that he will become one himself, and vaizard from is 10 times more powerful than bankai. therefore Aizen was probably playign around with them while using less than 1% of his full power.

Aizen chastising Grimmjow using Reiatsu alone(in order to do this you must be far far stronger than your opponent)
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e254/hitokiri7303/M7BleachCh24510.jpg
http://i41.photobucket.com/albums/e254/hitokiri7303/M7BleachCh24511.jpg

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
The issue isn't whether on not Superman is faster, that isn't in dispute, the question is whether or not Aizen is strong and fast enough to survive that first initial moments of the fight so that he can get his sword out. Aizen certainly fast enough to unsheath his sword and say two words before Supes finish him off.

I highly doubt that. If combatants start half a kilometer away from each other, then depending on what calcs you use, Superman can cross that distance in anywhere from 0.0000003 seconds to 0.0000000000000003 seconds. Aizen's got nothing on that.



That only works on Arrancar subordinates, and AFAIK only arrancar use it.



Standard assumption is there are no civilians to get in the way of a battle unless specified in the OP.



Since we've never seen his bankai, this line of reasoning only leads to pointless speculation.



More speculation. Try some actual facts. Besides, the Hougyoku has only been used to create Arrancars so far, not Vaizards.

Akuki
But how will Superman be able to cross that distance if he's being pinned by a supernatural force that pins him to the ground via is soul? Also I mentioned in the first post that this took place in downtown metropolis, so that was assuming a civilian presence. As for the cube, there was no mention that it only worked on specific individuals, simply that was why it was given to them. As for speed, first of all you're ignoring the traditional superman pysche. Show me one fight he's been in where he has immediately speedblitzed his opponent without at least exchanging one or two words first.
2. While Aizen may not appear to be extremely sturdy, he's taken some amazing hits. his barehanded blocks are extremely impressive. For example he's been shown taking everything from a punch from a creature that is the size of a 10 or 12 story building without any effect, blocking ichigo's fully upgraded bankai with his finger, and blocking renji's sword attack with his palm.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
But how will Superman be able to cross that distance if he's being pinned by a supernatural force that pins him to the ground via is soul?

He'll attack before Aizen can react. Besides, different energy sources like Bleach reiatsu, Naruto chakra, DBZ ki, Star Wars Force, etc. are usually assumed to be interchangeable for debate purposes, so it would only work on someone weaker than him, Superman could overcome it with his own power.



Then how come it's never been employed as a weapon, but only as a tool against their own subordinates? You would think they would have considered that. Besides, it wears off after a while.



Wonder Woman Sacrifice arc.



Yes, and this compares to someone who can smash moons with one punch. roll eyes (sarcastic)

superkronick92
Look, if all else fails, Supes could just lift up the contenent Aizen is standing on and chuck it into space

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
Look, if all else fails, Supes could just lift up the contenent Aizen is standing on and chuck it into space
Aizen can simply either teleport or go into the hueco mundo dimension to avoid that. In response to the point about energy sources, that really isn't an issue. The main issue is what they target, reiatsu is a magical type of attack that attacks a persons soul. This is simply a case where brute physical strength is not an issue, because the attack does not effect the actual body so much as the spirit within the body. Superman is a fighter whose powers are based entirely only physical strength, when it comes down to it reiatsu is a type of power that must be combatted through some sort of supernatural means.
I think the best way to think about this is like Dr. Strange's Astral form. That form is an embodiment of his soul, and if Aizen ejected his soul then it wouldn't do any good since all of strange's powers go with him. however in supermans case Aizen soul ejection would get his soul out, and since all of supermans powers are physical they would remain within his body.

lando005
Originally posted by Akuki
Aizen can simply either teleport or go into the hueco mundo dimension to avoid that. In response to the point about energy sources, that really isn't an issue. The main issue is what they target, reiatsu is a magical type of attack that attacks a persons soul. This is simply a case where brute physical strength is not an issue, because the attack does not effect the actual body so much as the spirit within the body. Superman is a fighter whose powers are based entirely only physical strength, when it comes down to it reiatsu is a type of power that must be combatted through some sort of supernatural means.
I think the best way to think about this is like Dr. Strange's Astral form. That form is an embodiment of his soul, and if Aizen ejected his soul then it wouldn't do any good since all of strange's powers go with him. however in supermans case Aizen soul ejection would get his soul out, and since all of supermans powers are physical they would remain within his body. you got a point there the only things sups has to combat Aizen is T-vo

Akuki
What is this T-vo you speak of?

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
Aizen can simply either teleport

Since when can he teleport?



Not if the world is crashing down around him. He'd be dead.



No it's not, it's just a type of spiritual energy.



No - limits fallacy.



So is that why Chad and Orihime went to Soul Society in their physical bodies and fought against Shinigami just fine? roll eyes (sarcastic)

Akuki
So is that why Chad and Orihime went to Soul Society in their physical bodies and fought against Shinigami just fine? roll eyes (sarcastic)
that's because the gate created by Urahara transformed their bodies into pure spirit particles, or basically the same things that Shinigami are composed of.


As for the teleportation that was shown in the Soul Society arc where Aizen and gin teleport over to the execution hill.
Also Aizen can just have one of his pet Meno's evacuate him via the light beam as was shown when he left soul society.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
that's because the gate created by Urahara transformed their bodies into pure spirit particles, or basically the same things that Shinigami are composed of.

I don't recall that being mentioned. Besides, Chad was fighting hollows back on earth before he got his powers.



They were there all the time, it was just an illusion that they weren't.



Which counts as a forfeit

lando005
Originally posted by Akuki
What is this T-vo you speak of? a type of telepathic ability he's acquired as of late, dc's covering all their bases with their number one now a days

Akuki
Originally posted by lando005
a type of telepathic ability he's acquired as of late, dc's covering all their bases with their number one now a days
What effect does it have?

lando005
Originally posted by Endless Mike
I don't recall that being mentioned. Besides, Chad was fighting hollows back on earth before he got his powers.



They were there all the time, it was just an illusion that they weren't.



Which counts as a forfeit acctually he's right they were converted to their spirit froms when they went to soul society, also chad and inoue were able to effect hollows do to their high spiritual energies

and no Aizen and Gin were not there the whole time they did indeed use a teleportation spell

and yes that would be a forfeit

lando005
Originally posted by Akuki
What effect does it have? in a sense he can pull his opponents into his own pocket astral plain in where he creates the rules of that reality and is nothing short of a god

Akuki
Originally posted by lando005
in a sense he can pull his opponents into his own pocket astral plain in where he creates the rules of that reality and is nothing short of a god
when the hell did he get that power? I've never seen it. If he's got that and he catches Aizen in it, then I agree Aizen is toast.

llagrok
This is just stupid.

Akui why did toy make this thread? You obviously had no intention of giving Superman a fair fight.

For some reason you seem to think that reiatsu pressure would affect a DC character, that's just a complete load of bull. Why does Bleach rules apply? Why not the DC rules. If you set this in the DC rules, Aizen would be dead. I'm sure you would deny that flash could steal all his speed and claim that Aizen didn't follow the rules of the speed force.

You have absolutely no idea how high Superman's reiatsu would be if he was a bleach character, which is why it's completely stupid to try and force these bleach terms on Superman.

lando005
Originally posted by llagrok
This is just stupid.

Akui why did toy make this thread? You obviously had no intention of giving Superman a fair fight.

For some reason you seem to think that reiatsu pressure would affect a DC character, that's just a complete load of bull. Why does Bleach rules apply? Why not the DC rules. If you set this in the DC rules, Aizen would be dead. I'm sure you would deny that flash could steal all his speed and claim that Aizen didn't follow the rules of the speed force.

You have absolutely no idea how high Superman's reiatsu would be if he was a bleach character, which is why it's completely stupid to try and force these bleach terms on Superman. to that same effect we cant force dc rules on bleach. However both rule sets apply in this match the point i believe he is making is although superman is by far Aizen's superior in the physical relm Azien is his in the spiritual world. Honestly I think sups spiritual power (while not as great as his physical) should atleast be that of a leutenat in bleach h's been through enough to build up his inner soul. It's thesame with marvel rules vs dc rules only thing is people more readily accept different comic rules because the general concept is almost the same. It has been stated that superman can see spirits that's not the problem the problem is Aizen's shikai which WOULD indeed work on sups, at the same note if sups uses t-vo Azien looses badly

llagrok
There are few Bleach characters that displayed any form of impressive speed. At least not comparable to Superman. Unless Aizen is capable of ejecting Superman's soul or keeping him in check with his reiatsu then he's losing 10/10.

Endless Mike
There is the point that Superman has vastly enhanced senses, so Aizen's illusions probably wouldn't be convincing enough to fool him (since in order to fool him Aizen would have to simulate things like what atoms and molecules looked like, and nonvisible spectra of light, background cosmic radiation, sounds from all over the planet, etc. and he has no idea or experience on how to replicate these things)

lando005
Originally posted by Endless Mike
There is the point that Superman has vastly enhanced senses, so Aizen's illusions probably wouldn't be convincing enough to fool him (since in order to fool him Aizen would have to simulate things like what atoms and molecules looked like, and nonvisible spectra of light, background cosmic radiation, sounds from all over the planet, etc. and he has no idea or experience on how to replicate these things) his illusionary powers are not scientific in nature it's the same as if doc strange were to cast an illusionary spell over him his senses may be great but the flow of magic does not apply to the laws of science even the other captains who are on par with Aizen fell under his spell it not only tricks your senses but your preception

Endless Mike
Originally posted by lando005
his illusionary powers are not scientific in nature it's the same as if doc strange were to cast an illusionary spell over him his senses may be great but the flow of magic does not apply to the laws of science even the other captains who are on par with Aizen fell under his spell it not only tricks your senses but your preception

The illusion is directed by his mind. He has to create it in his head, or else how does it know what he wants them to see?

lando005
Originally posted by Endless Mike
The illusion is directed by his mind. He has to create it in his head, or else how does it know what he wants them to see? it's more on the lines of he wills the illusions onto them for example if he wanted to cast an illusion on you and make you see a bear or something infront of you he does it and one pops up the minor details like smell and stuff like that acctually are being super imposed on your mind kind of like if you think something long enough it becomes the truth like if you think your freezing in the desert sun it's 120 degrees outside but your mind is telling you it's 20 below ofcouse this is after you've viewed his shikai release.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by lando005
it's more on the lines of he wills the illusions onto them for example if he wanted to cast an illusion on you and make you see a bear or something infront of you he does it and one pops up the minor details like smell and stuff like that acctually are being super imposed on your mind kind of like if you think something long enough it becomes the truth like if you think your freezing in the desert sun it's 120 degrees outside but your mind is telling you it's 20 below ofcouse this is after you've viewed his shikai release.

That's directly contradicted by the fact that Unohana realized that Aizen's illusionary corpse was not real because he didn't have the medical expertise she did.

lando005
Originally posted by Endless Mike
That's directly contradicted by the fact that Unohana realized that Aizen's illusionary corpse was not real because he didn't have the medical expertise she did. good point although she did not know exactly what was wrong with the corps except that something was off about it. i'll look into it some more but the closest thing i can compare it to is like a mystical version of the matrix

Akuki
Originally posted by lando005
good point although she did not know exactly what was wrong with the corps except that something was off about it. i'll look into it some more but the closest thing i can compare it to is like a mystical version of the matrix
I think that's a pretty fair analysis. Aizen illusion can't be broken out of even if you know it's there, just like the matrix, in both things, you can discover slight flaws, but that still won't allow you to see the big picture.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Endless Mike
If you ignore the whole bullshit about how Bleach shinigami can't be seen by normal people (and even including that, Superman has some kind of wacky "soul vision" power), then Superman wins easily, since he can speedblitz him before he can even draw his sword, and he has strong mental resistance to illusions and such. There's nothing Aizen could really even do to hurt him, unless you want to make the argument that his powers count as magic and would affect Superman's vulnerability to it.

Yeah, but Aizens illusions are supposed to be unbreakable. The only person that has ever broken them is Unohana Retsu and we do not know how she did it. I dunno if T-vo could help him break it.

Akuki
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Yeah, but Aizens illusions are supposed to be unbreakable. The only person that has ever broken them is Unohana Retsu and we do not know how she did it. I dunno if T-vo could help him break it.
She didn't break it, she simply was able to figure out something was wrong. If Aizen chose to simply shut off all of Superman's sense with Kyouka suigetsu, then Supe's wouldn't be able to counter it.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Akuki
She didn't break it, she simply was able to figure out something was wrong. If Aizen chose to simply shut off all of Superman's sense with Kyouka suigetsu, then Supe's wouldn't be able to counter it.

He'll find a way.

lando005
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
He'll find a way. no he really couldn't like i said it's like being stuck in the matrix even if you know something is wrong you cant "wake up" from his spell the will of the person is not a factor

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by lando005
no he really couldn't like i said it's like being stuck in the matrix even if you know something is wrong you cant "wake up" from his spell the will of the person is not a factor
But, this is superman were talking about. He always finds a way no matter what. Besides, how would Aizen even hurt him?

Akuki
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
But, this is superman were talking about. He always finds a way no matter what. Besides, how would Aizen even hurt him?
We actually went over this earlier in the thread. Aizen can eject supermans soul from his body and then destroy it.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Akuki
We actually went over this earlier in the thread. Aizen can eject supermans soul from his body and then destroy it.

But, in bleach your soul has the same properties as your human form.

lando005
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
But, this is superman were talking about. He always finds a way no matter what. Besides, how would Aizen even hurt him? simply put this isnt a superman comic he's not going to win out just cause he's superman

lando005
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
But, in bleach your soul has the same properties as your human form. not really it carries over your spiritual properties and spiritual energies superman's powers lay in his physical body granted he'ld have some power due to his experience his soul has probably built up a lot of energy but nothing compared to Aizen

chickenlover98
well seeing as this isnt by either comic or bleach rules, rather a mix of the two, we have a problem. first of all since t-vo isnt completely explained, such as how it is projected i.e. line of sight whatever the **** superman wants it to do or just an aura, there can be some debate if he can project that state ono aizen.

then there's the problem of aizen using riatsu. would it even affect superman? we dont know. thats the problem

Sandai Kitetsu
Superman, wtf

lando005
t vo is the only weapon sups has

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by lando005
t vo is the only weapon sups has laughing

Supes has a butt load of powers he could use to end this. What can Aizen do, to him?

lando005
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
laughing

Supes has a butt load of powers he could use to end this. What can Aizen do, to him? did you forget everything we discussed on the other page? sups aint winning

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by lando005
did you forget everything we discussed on the other page? sups aint winning

What can Aizen do to supes?

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Akuki
Aizen can simply either teleport or go into the hueco mundo dimension to avoid that.

Which wold be BFR

lando005
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
What can Aizen do to supes? mind rape him for one imprison his soul for another cant punch his way outta that

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by lando005
mind rape him for one imprison his soul for another cant punch his way outta that

Mind Rape will hurt him how?

Imprison his soul which has all his physical properties

lando005
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Mind Rape will hurt him how?

Imprison his soul which has all his physical properties mind rape would leave him open to all types of attacks

hsi soul does not have his physical propeties just spiritual ones

Akuki
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
Mind Rape will hurt him how?

Imprison his soul which has all his physical properties
His soul wouldn't have all his physical properties, in bleach the soul contains your spiritual power, such as soul reaper abilities and the like. Just because you may be amazingly buff in your human body doesn't mean that strength transfers over to your spiritual body. Ichigo's physical body isn't all that strudy, but his shinigami for is. In Bleach there is a clear disconnect between soul power and physical power. Just because you have one doesn't mean you have the other.

Symmetric Chaos
Give Aizen time to come up with a plan and he'll destroy Superman emotionally the moment the fight starts.

Otherwise I don't see him wining this until he catches Superman with his illusions.

Akuki
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Give Aizen time to come up with a plan and he'll destroy Superman emotionally the moment the fight starts.

Otherwise I don't see him wining this until he catches Superman with his illusions.
I'd have to agree with that, with prep though Aizen can beat Superman. He even has a pretty good way to defeat a speedblitz if he works with prep. He simply starts off the battle within the negation cero, and doesn't leave it until he's absolutely certain that Superman is caught by the illusion. Once that point is reached Aizen can rape Superman in just about a million possible ways. By the way what is Superman's general speed these days?

lando005
Originally posted by Akuki
I'd have to agree with that, with prep though Aizen can beat Superman. He even has a pretty good way to defeat a speedblitz if he works with prep. He simply starts off the battle within the negation cero, and doesn't leave it until he's absolutely certain that Superman is caught by the illusion. Once that point is reached Aizen can rape Superman in just about a million possible ways. By the way what is Superman's general speed these days? ftl like it really matters at that point

superkronick92
Originally posted by lando005
mind rape him for one imprison his soul for another cant punch his way outta that

Super-characters tend to be able to punch their way outta things that they shouldn't be able to, like The Limbo Dimension or The Phantom Zone.

lando005
Originally posted by superkronick92
Super-characters tend to be able to punch their way outta things that they shouldn't be able to, like The Limbo Dimension or The Phantom Zone. or respectable character build ups

vlaaad12345
I sincerely hope this is a joke....supes destroyes aizen along with all of bleach with ease,and bleach spiritual beings can be touched by physical means,chad has done it and rukia confirmed it.

lando005
Originally posted by vlaaad12345
I sincerely hope this is a joke....supes destroyes aizen along with all of bleach with ease,and bleach spiritual beings can be touched by physical means,chad has done it and rukia confirmed it. once again those were bings with high spiritual powers not like any joe blow can go around doing that

vlaaad12345
Originally posted by lando005
once again those were bings with high spiritual powers not like any joe blow can go around doing that
Chad had no spiritual powers at the time,and I have a scan of rukia saying any human can touch them so try again,http://manga.bleachexile.com/bleach/9/16/
superman punches aizen in the face and aizen dies.

Akuki
Keep in mind if there's one thing that Aizen excells at it's appearing harmless and stalling people until they've fallen into Kyouka suigetsu. After all is Superman really gonna speedblitz and knock out a guy who looks like a kindly old father-figure? He did it for over a thousand years in soul society without anyone suspecting a thing.

vlaaad12345
This is a fight they are put here to do battle,superman knows hes fighting and so does aizen,fight starts superman punches aizen in the face,aizen doesnt get back up.

Akuki
Originally posted by vlaaad12345
This is a fight they are put here to do battle,superman knows hes fighting and so does aizen,fight starts superman punches aizen in the face,aizen doesnt get back up.
IF Aizen is here without any prep time I will agree with you on that point.although to be honest I really can't think of a single superman fight where he's actually done that, after all he usually challenges his opponents, tells them to surrender etc. If Aizen has prep I think this is a different story. he can easily use a negation cero as cover in order to hold off Superman until Kyouka suigetsu takes effect.

lando005
Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Chad had no spiritual powers at the time,and I have a scan of rukia saying any human can touch them so try again,http://manga.bleachexile.com/bleach/9/16/
superman punches aizen in the face and aizen dies. ok your right it clearly states they can be touched

lando005
Originally posted by Akuki
IF Aizen is here without any prep time I will agree with you on that point.although to be honest I really can't think of a single superman fight where he's actually done that, after all he usually challenges his opponents, tells them to surrender etc. If Aizen has prep I think this is a different story. he can easily use a negation cero as cover in order to hold off Superman until Kyouka suigetsu takes effect. it all depends on if they are fighting in character for this match or not

Akuki
Originally posted by vlaaad12345
This is a fight they are put here to do battle,superman knows hes fighting and so does aizen,fight starts superman punches aizen in the face,aizen doesnt get back up.
Do you think supes would win without a speedblitz?

superkronick92
Originally posted by Akuki
IF Aizen is here without any prep time I will agree with you on that point.although to be honest I really can't think of a single superman fight where he's actually done that, after all he usually challenges his opponents, tells them to surrender etc. If Aizen has prep I think this is a different story. he can easily use a negation cero as cover in order to hold off Superman until Kyouka suigetsu takes effect.
http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=37424676oz2.jpg

If both character were fighting all out, to their full potentiel, I think Supes would win.

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=37424676oz2.jpg

If both character were fighting all out, to their full potentiel, I think Supes would win.
I've already stated that with speed blitz and no prep supes wins. Do you think Supes could still win with prep or with no speed blitz?

vlaaad12345
Yes,his heat vision could take aizen down,aizens illusions overpowering t-v0 isnt going to happen and even without t-vo superman has tons of mental resistance.

lando005
Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Yes,his heat vision could take aizen down,aizens illusions overpowering t-v0 isnt going to happen and even without t-vo superman has tons of mental resistance. it all depends if he cast his illusion on sups fist sups wouldnt know he's under a spell in the first place there are almost no clues that your under his spell

Akuki
Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Yes,his heat vision could take aizen down,aizens illusions overpowering t-v0 isnt going to happen and even without t-vo superman has tons of mental resistance.
Can you tell me where I could find some scans of t-vo in action, because so far I've heard a lot of conflicting things about it, one which was that it had a lot of difficult preconditions for use.

chickenlover98
im still confused on how t-vo is used how is it projected? through his eyes an aura or does he just make it happen by thinking of the person. if you can post a scan.

chickenlover98
well i have 1 other question. are we going with the assumption that aizen can eject his soul or not? because if he cant the he cant do jackshit. even if supes stayed in the illusion for forever

Charlotte DeBel
The only serious precondition I can remember is that Supes has to be allowed to come into contact with his opponent's mind. Whether it's 100% true or not is unclear to me, as I've already said and not once, I don't care much about Supes.

vlaaad12345
but even disregarding that supes has shown vast mental resistance,it took maxlord a preety powerful mind manipulator in his own right years to get into supes head i just dont see aizen doing it in seconds before he gets punched out heat visioned ect,i have the scans its saying im not allowed to post them till im more well known wtf,could pm them to ya or something i guess idk,not letting me pm them either gay.

chickenlover98
k well when ya can post em or pm me i dont care

vlaaad12345
about halfway down on page 17 of the superman respect thread you can find one of the instances of him using it.

superkronick92
Thanks.

llagrok
Superman couldn't resist ML's illusions. And Aizen is a million times faster than him.

superkronick92
Originally posted by llagrok
Superman couldn't resist ML's illusions. And Aizen is a million times faster than him.

One, ML was straight up mind control.
Two, He literally had been ebbing into Superman's mind for years.

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
One, ML was straight up mind control.
Two, He literally had been ebbing into Superman's mind for years.
Supe's has been mindcontrolled by plenty of people who are less adept than Aizen. For god's sakes he's been mind controlled by poison ivy.

superkronick92
Originally posted by Akuki
Supe's has been mindcontrolled by plenty of people who are less adept than Aizen. For god's sakes he's been mind controlled by poison ivy.

Poison Ivy had Kryptonite lipstick.

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
Poison Ivy had Kryptonite lipstick.
Really sad I wasn't under the impression that kryptonite did anything to supes willpower.

llagrok
Originally posted by superkronick92
One, ML was straight up mind control.
Two, He literally had been ebbing into Superman's mind for years.

Poor logic mate.

He did not control Superman by using commands, like a telepath does when they use "mind control" He used illusions to get the wanted effect. Hence why Superman thought he was fighting Doomsday and not Diana.

Akuki
Originally posted by llagrok
Poor logic mate.

He did not control Superman by using commands, like a telepath does when they use "mind control" He used illusions to get the wanted effect. Hence why Superman thought he was fighting Doomsday and not Diana.
And to be honest Aizen's illusions are far better than Lord's for a couple of reasons.
A) Lord's illusions weren't as good at blending into real life, he was showing dramatic events to make supes take action, Aizen is far more subtle with his illusions, allowing him to slowly change superman's perceptions over great periods of time without arousing Supe's suspicions. Aizen can make the illusions blend so well that the opponent doesn't eben think to fight them because they don't know they are there.
B) Lord's illusions take a lot of effort and therefore can't be sustained for a long period of time at once, Aizen's is permanent and keep going even without him having to exert effort on it.

superkronick92
Originally posted by llagrok
Poor logic mate.

He did not control Superman by using commands, like a telepath does when they use "mind control" He used illusions to get the wanted effect. Hence why Superman thought he was fighting Doomsday and not Diana.

I see you're point but ML still had to work at Supes mind for years before he could accomplish that.

lando005
Originally posted by superkronick92
I see you're point but ML still had to work at Supes mind for years before he could accomplish that. that could be because it was a more suddle approach than an out right attack

llagrok
Originally posted by superkronick92
I see you're point but ML still had to work at Supes mind for years before he could accomplish that.

Because that's the way he works. Aizen doesn't need to avoid his cover being blown here.

Charlotte DeBel
To all the speedblitz admirers:
1.The fight is in the inhabited area
2. The fight is in lower layers of atmosphere

That means Supes won't be travelling faster than Max10-12 there to avoid massive collateral damage.
That's still extremely fast, but not that unbearably fast.

I'm NOT claiming that Superman is slower than Aizen, he's definetely much more faster...just IC-speedblitz in said settings would be much more modest.

llagrok
Originally posted by Charlotte DeBel
To all the speedblitz admirers:
1.The fight is in the inhabited area
2. The fight is in lower layers of atmosphere

That means Supes won't be travelling faster than Max10-12 there to avoid massive collateral damage.
That's still extremely fast, but not that unbearably fast.

I'm NOT claiming that Superman is slower than Aizen, he's definetely much more faster...just IC-speedblitz in said settings would be much more modest.

I don't think we know how much faster Superman is. If he is faster at all. It's reasonable to assume that Aizen is one of the fastest characters in the Bleach verse.

chickenlover98
true im sure that would disrupt the world if this was in bleach or reality, but seeing as this is a comic they introduce retarded ways for no one else to be hurt. like he'll yell get out of the way or something.

point is he probably wouldnt hurt ne one

Akuki
Originally posted by llagrok
I don't think we know how much faster Superman is. If he is faster at all. It's reasonable to assume that Aizen is one of the fastest characters in the Bleach verse.
Ichigo can be calculated to move at about mach 35, and Aizen's faster than that. Check the respect thread in my sig if you want to see the math.

Soljer
Fastest in bleach verse?

Is that anywhere near the ballpark of being fast enough to cross some thirty lightyears in minutes?

Akuki
Originally posted by Soljer
Fastest in bleach verse?

Is that anywhere near the ballpark of being fast enough to cross some thirty lightyears in minutes?
No, but the settings make that sort of speed impossible if we're taking superman's character into account.

superkronick92
Supes could just HV the whole battlefield.

Soljer
Originally posted by Akuki
No, but the settings make that sort of speed impossible if we're taking superman's character into account.

I realize your stipulations, I was merely asking llagrok who claimed that we don't really know how much faster Superman is.

llagrok
Originally posted by Soljer
I realize your stipulations, I was merely asking llagrok who claimed that we don't really know how much faster Superman is.

We know that he's faster, just not how much.

Aizen doesn't fly in the same way that Superman does.

Soljer
Originally posted by llagrok
We know that he's faster, just not how much.

Aizen doesn't fly in the same way that Superman does.

Unless he has some claim to approaching C, the difference between mach 15 and mach 20 will be so infinitesimal as to not matter.

Akuki
Originally posted by llagrok
We know that he's faster, just not how much.

Aizen doesn't fly in the same way that Superman does.
Bleach doesn't really approach lightspeed, which is where Supes generally fights at in his in space battles. For now the only slightly lightspeed feat we have is Yoruichi and Soi fong dodging a lightspeed attack, however that's debatable since they appear to have started moving before the attack was launched.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Akuki
His soul wouldn't have all his physical properties, in bleach the soul contains your spiritual power, such as soul reaper abilities and the like. Just because you may be amazingly buff in your human body doesn't mean that strength transfers over to your spiritual body. Ichigo's physical body isn't all that strudy, but his shinigami for is. In Bleach there is a clear disconnect between soul power and physical power. Just because you have one doesn't mean you have the other.

That's because in bleach, the main energy manipulators operate outside physical boundaries. Even then, they still use physicall base attacks. If were going by one sided rules, then of course Aizen wins.

superkronick92
Quick Question, are Aizen's illusions in ones mind or do they manifest physically, like does only the person he's focusing on see the illusion or is it their for everyone to see? So, is it in the mind or physical?

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by superkronick92
Quick Question, are Aizen's illusions in ones mind or do they manifest physically, like does only the person he's focusing on see the illusion or is it their for everyone to see? So, is it in the mind or physical?

It's hypnotism, he makes your mind create illusions through his Kyoka Suigetsu. Which seems to have an indomitable power of suggestion.

llagrok
Originally posted by superkronick92
Quick Question, are Aizen's illusions in ones mind or do they manifest physically, like does only the person he's focusing on see the illusion or is it their for everyone to see? So, is it in the mind or physical?

Anyone who's seen his sword once are under his complete control I believe.

Akuki
As sandai said, it's a complete hypnosis effect that is triggered when the opponent sees the blade. It's permanent, and does not go away even if the opponent finds out that they are under the illusion, and affects all of the senses of the attacked person.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by superkronick92
Quick Question, are Aizen's illusions in ones mind or do they manifest physically, like does only the person he's focusing on see the illusion or is it their for everyone to see? So, is it in the mind or physical?

They're sufficiently powerful that it was possible to perform a medical examination on one without the examiner discovering it. They are not in fact physically real, however.

The effect is permanent after a person sees his blade even once.

superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?

llagrok
Originally posted by superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?

No, not really.

Aizen doesn't need to breathe, Superman won't necessarily see an illusionary world. He will seen one aizen, a fake one. Let's not forget that all Espada+ characters have at least durability comparable to Hercules, Namor and so on. Since Aizen is supposed to be the strongest one, we can only presume that one punch from Superman doesn't necessarily K.O him.

Aizen has MANY ways of harming Superman and seeing as he has mastered all kinds of kidou, no injury should be irreversible.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

He could but Aizen has used his illusions to make himself invisible and create a duplicate of himself immediately. So it would just be one seemingly invulnerable and impossibly fast target.

Since Superman gets basic knowledge however he'll know what Aizen's power is and could certainly try attacking a large area. If he doesn't start with that knowledge Aizen would have a sizable advantage since he's more than capable of hurtinging Superman.

Originally posted by superkronick92
BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?

Seems reasonable.

llagrok
Aizen must've went to sleep after he created the "dead body illusion" right?

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?
The thing about Aizen's illusions is that they blend in with real life. Aizen was using his illusions to manipulat people in soul society for over a thousand years, and no-one knew that he was doing anything. Aizen doesn't go for the crazy visions approach, he's far more subtle. His visions stand up to scrutiny too, he was able to make a doctor with hundreds of years of experience and future tech believe that his illusion was a human body even though that person has a couple weeks to examine it, and only was able to come up with a slight suspicion something was wrong. But I would say that the illusions would continue if he was knocked out, but not if he was killed. Also in case you missed the setting, the fight takes place in a populated Metropolis, so Supes can't just nuke everything with hv.

llagrok
If Aizen was speaking the truth, shouldn't he have access to ALL kidou there are? He can use level 90 kidou without saying the incantation, that is impressive :/

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by llagrok
Aizen must've went to sleep after he created the "dead body illusion" right?

Thats a good point.

Also shows he doesn't have to be anywhere nearby to use his power.

Sarutobi700
Aizen rapes supes again and again and again

superkronick92
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
He could but Aizen has used his illusions to make himself invisible and create a duplicate of himself immediately. So it would just be one seemingly invulnerable and impossibly fast target.

Since Superman gets basic knowledge however he'll know what Aizen's power is and could certainly try attacking a large area. If he doesn't start with that knowledge Aizen would have a sizable advantage since he's more than capable of hurtinging Superman.



Seems reasonable.

If Aizen does use the illusion that you suggested, Supes could just HV the entire field like he did an army of Doomsday clones.

What if Supes just welded Aizen's sword to its sheath the second the fight started. eek! since some people think a speedblitz would be out of charater, I don't think that would be since he does that sort of thing to people all the time, like superheating a criminals gun before they have the chance to shoot anyone.

llagrok
Originally posted by superkronick92
If Aizen does use the illusion that you suggested, Supes could just HV the entire field like he did an army of Doomsday clones.

Originally posted by Akuki
Also in case you missed the setting, the fight takes place in a populated Metropolis, so Supes can't just nuke everything with hv.

You're also seriously underestimating Aizen's durability, speed, reaction time and strength. I honestly doubt that Superman could one shot him, unless he put everything he had into that punch.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by superkronick92
If Aizen does use the illusion that you suggested, Supes could just HV the entire field like he did an army of Doomsday clones.

That's Aizen's general fighting style.

As for the DD clones. They were incredible weak compared to DD (Batman took one out with an axe). Not to mention that there are plenty of bystanders in Metropolis.

Originally posted by superkronick92
What if Supes just welded Aizen's sword to its sheath the second the fight started. eek! since some people think a speedblitz would be out of charater, I don't think that would be since he does that sort of thing to people all the time, like superheating a criminals gun before they have the chance to shoot anyone.

I don't actually have a response for that one.

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
If Aizen does use the illusion that you suggested, Supes could just HV the entire field like he did an army of Doomsday clones.

What if Supes just welded Aizen's sword to its sheath the second the fight started. eek! since some people think a speedblitz would be out of charater, I don't think that would be since he does that sort of thing to people all the time, like superheating a criminals gun before they have the chance to shoot anyone.


Well for one reason that would probably backfire, since it would probably just burn off the sheath and leave the sword, and aizen has more than enough strenght to free the sword almost instantly.

Actually I just thought of this, since Superman has x-ray vision wouldn't he see through the sheath thereby putting him under the illusion from the very initial beginning of the match? eek!

superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?

llagrok
Originally posted by superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?

Stop ignoring all our ****ing posts.

That's like the third time, geez.

Akuki
Originally posted by superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?
Didn't you already post this?

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by superkronick92
Thanks. So lets say, Aizen manages to get out his sword. Couldn't Supes be able to tell, with all the crazy "visions" has, even if he can't get out of the illusion, couldn't he just like, either freeze the entire area, heat vision the entire area, or even suck the oxygen out of the area so Aizen would pass out.

BTW would Aizen's illusions still last if he is KOed or killed?

All of that was answered by llgrok and Akuki.

Endless Mike
This is getting stupid. Superman's senses are so far beyond what Aizen is capable of fooling, if he couldn't fool ****ing Unohana, how the hell can he fool someone that can see in every frequency, hear things on other planets (which is physically impossible), see souls and practically be aware of everything on earth at once?

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Endless Mike
This is getting stupid. Superman's senses are so far beyond what Aizen is capable of fooling, if he couldn't fool ****ing Unohana, how the hell can he fool someone that can see in every frequency, hear things on other planets (which is physically impossible), see souls and practically be aware of everything on earth at once?

That's not how hypnosis works, though. But, this is stupid, even if supes see's illusions, Aizen cannot take advantage of it.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Sandai Kitetsu
That's not how hypnosis works, though. But, this is stupid, even if supes see's illusions, Aizen cannot take advantage of it.

Of course it is. He has to decide what he wants his opponent to experience, but he can only fool the 5 senses (and reiatsu sense) by creating an illusion based on his own experiences. If someone's senses are much sharper than his are, and/or they have more senses, they'll see through it easily.

How is he going to know, for example, to simulate what radio waves look like, when he can't see them?

Akuki
Originally posted by Endless Mike
This is getting stupid. Superman's senses are so far beyond what Aizen is capable of fooling, if he couldn't fool ****ing Unohana, how the hell can he fool someone that can see in every frequency, hear things on other planets (which is physically impossible), see souls and practically be aware of everything on earth at once?
Very simple, if that isn't working then he just shuts off all sensory input. Also keep in mind that hypnosis in more a matter of suggesting images to the mind, so Superman would basically see what he would expect to see, and his mind fills in all of the smaller details even if aizen doesn't specifically suggest it. after all it's not like Maxwell Lord was making perfect illusions down to the last atom.

Endless Mike
Originally posted by Akuki
Very simple, if that isn't working then he just shuts off all sensory input.

Since when can he do that?



Stop making things up.

superkronick92
Originally posted by llagrok
Stop ignoring all our ****ing posts.

That's like the third time, geez.

Dude, sorry, my computers connection got a little screwy, i didn't mean to

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Of course it is. He has to decide what he wants his opponent to experience, but he can only fool the 5 senses (and reiatsu sense) by creating an illusion based on his own experiences. If someone's senses are much sharper than his are, and/or they have more senses, they'll see through it easily.

How is he going to know, for example, to simulate what radio waves look like, when he can't see them?

I see what your saying, and it makes sense.

Akuki
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Of course it is. He has to decide what he wants his opponent to experience, but he can only fool the 5 senses (and reiatsu sense) by creating an illusion based on his own experiences. If someone's senses are much sharper than his are, and/or they have more senses, they'll see through it easily.

How is he going to know, for example, to simulate what radio waves look like, when he can't see them?
That argument is bs, and clearly contradicted by the ML experience. ML obviously can't see in radio waves, yet superman was taken in by the illusion.

Symmetric Chaos
Originally posted by Endless Mike
Stop making things up.

That is how hypnosis works though.

Sandai Kitetsu
Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
That is how hypnosis works though.

Well, the first half of Akuki's description.

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