Who do you think is the top videogame villain?

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Violent2Dope
Not talkin about who's strongest, this is mostly about stuff like effectiveness as a villain, coolness, and badassness. I have a list of choices, but feel free to add to it.

1. Ganon from Zelda

2. Bowser from Mario

3. Akuma/Gouki from SF

4. Dr. Robotnik from Sonic

5. Ridley from Metroid

6. Liquid from MGS

7. Solidus from MGS

8. Volgin from MGS(I've got it on my brain right now)

9. Jedah from Darkstalkers

10. Pyron from Darkstalkers

11. Sephiroth from FFVII.

Mine is Ganon with Gouki, Volgin, Seph, and Pyron tied for second.

Victor Von Doom
Wesker.

AstroFan
Sam Jackson was good in GTA San Andreas, but I gotta say Ganon.

Violent2Dope
YAY! Ganon ftw! Btw, if you feel the need to senselessly bash a villain I listed, please do so.

Superboy Prime
They are not in the list, but IMO the best villain ever is Krelian from Xenogears.

Ridley_Prime
Hmm. Nice top 11 list.

In addition to Bowser, Ganon, Ridley, Liquid, and Akuma/Gouki, another all-time fav of mine would probably have to be Wolf O' Donnel from Star Fox. I realize he's actually just more of a rival, but still pretty awesome in my book. yes

BackFire
Kefka

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by BackFire
Kefka X3_fL9oBk84
LOL

From that list I'm going to pick Sephiroth. If Xemnas was on that list then I'd pick him first.

SpadeKing
Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Hmm. Nice top 11 list.

In addition to Bowser, Ganon, Ridley, Liquid, and Akuma/Gouki, another all-time fav of mine would probably have to be Wolf O' Donnel from Star Fox. I realize he's actually just more of a rival, but still pretty awesome in my book. yes

i hate star wolf it took my 3 hours to finally kill him disgust

DarkC
Probably Akuma.

Slay
SHODAN from System Shock and LeChuck from Monkey Island.

From that list: Sephiroth.

Guilty Gear
KEFKA

WTF

InnerRise
"Team Rocket."

Anata wa wakarimasu ka.....

Ushgarak
Originally posted by BackFire
Kefka

You know, I am going to start talking about Clovis from Blade Runner again, except that I am having terrible deja vu here... we've done this before, yes?

Lana
Probably, because it sounds familiar to me.

Superboy Prime
KRELIAN.

BackFire
Originally posted by Ushgarak
You know, I am going to start talking about Clovis from Blade Runner again, except that I am having terrible deja vu here... we've done this before, yes?

I have never seen blade runner sad

Violent2Dope
Give reasons for why. My reason I choose Ganon is:
A. He's very intelligent, unlike that joke villain Bowser.

B. He's an efficient villain with an actual plan in games, once again unlike Bowser.

C. He has style, that organ playing/cape flapping combo before the fight in OoT was priceless.

BackFire
Reasons for Kefka --

Most purely hateable and vicious villain I've seen in a video game.

Developed better than many of the main heroes of the story, and most heroes of other video games.

His laugh is legend.

Violent2Dope
Thanks for remindin me of some reasons I like Ganon Backfire, another reason Ganon is my fave is cause of his slow, rough laugh. Wow, that sounded less gay in my head. Ganon also has a better story than simply "LAWLZ I WANNA TAKE OVER THE WORLD!"

Superboy Prime
Krelian is best developed villain in Video Games history. If anyone has played Xenogears you will know this. Not only does he have a stylish look; but he is also wise and smart. Quite in fact he is the guy pulling the strings over the dozens of powerful villains in the Xenogears world. His story is tragic. He was once a noble man in love with Sophia. When Sophia sacrificed herself to save his life a well as Lacan. He began to develop sorrow. Krelian wondered why "God" would allow something like that happen to Sofia. He then came to the conclusion that he would find God...and that if there was no God he would create God. In the end...he actually accomplishes his goal.

One of those villains that you completely understand why he went nuts. Makes you hate him because of the way he manipulates everything and everyone: including powerhouses such as Grahf & Miang. And at the end of the game he actually gets what he wants. Not many villains can put "Winning against PIS/Jobber Aura/CIS" in their resume.

Krelian is the best. But sadly only those who have played and understood Xenogears deep story will aknowledge what I'm talking about.

Kero_Co
I would say Bowser, but he isn't effective, badass, or cool. He is immensly entertaining though and I like the way they've developed his character.

Badass, cool, effective? Sounds like Kefka to me.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
4. Dr. Robotnik from Sonic

He's no longer a villain. Sonic Team made him more of a hero/neutral guy like Shadow is rather than a villain. But Metal Sonic would be one of the coolest Sonic villains.



Sephiroth has to be up there as one of the biggest villains ever. Not only is he one of the most popular but he also has one of the most well known songs (One Winged Angel). Sephiroth was a first class member of SOLDIER and life was going great. Suddenly he figured out he was some experiment used for Hojo's twisted mind to create the perfect soldier. Sephiroth went berserk and wanted to become "god" and his angellic form at the end (Safer Sephiroth) gives way that he may have succeed in rising to an angelic being.

Ganon is one of the best. He was like one of the first big time baddies in video games. Not only that but we see him use others as pawns throughout Zelda games (Vaati is one of them) so he can gain what he desires. Even in death Ganon is still a terrible force to be reckon with.

Bowser has to be one just because he was like THE first video game villain. Bowser conquered the Mushroom Kingdom and turned everyone into stone. Bowser deserves some credit even though most games he appears in (Sports mostly) make him seem soft and funny where as we use to see him as this terrible monster like in Super Mario Bros 3 who wants nothing more than to rule the Mushroom Kingdom.

And of course Kefka:

_c6EkWp79co

This guy does Kefka's voice perfectly. If 6 ever has voice overs he needs to be Kefka. And I actually lost all respect for Sephiroth when he yelled out MAMA'S BOY!

kKFAbxuxfVM
The chicks playing Tifa and Aerith looks like dudes.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Krelian is best developed villain in Video Games history. If anyone has played Xenogears you will know this. Not only does he have a stylish look; but he is also wise and smart. Quite in fact he is the guy pulling the strings over the dozens of powerful villains in the Xenogears world. His story is tragic. He was once a noble man in love with Sophia. When Sophia sacrificed herself to save his life a well as Lacan. He began to develop sorrow. Krelian wondered why "God" would allow something like that happen to Sofia. He then came to the conclusion that he would find God...and that if there was no God he would create God. In the end...he actually accomplishes his goal.

One of those villains that you completely understand why he went nuts. Makes you hate him because of the way he manipulates everything and everyone: including powerhouses such as Grahf & Miang. And at the end of the game he actually gets what he wants. Not many villains can put "Winning against PIS/Jobber Aura/CIS" in their resume.

Krelian is the best. But sadly only those who have played and understood Xenogears deep story will aknowledge what I'm talking about. Don't state your opinion as fact, especially since Ganon has done his own version of all but one of those things mentioned, which is survive against PIS, but then again how was it PIS if he survived? PIS is Sephiroth always goin easy on Cloud despite the fact he's beaten him before, so explain how this guy "survives against PIS" as you put it.

Kenshinswife
To me it would be a tie between ganon/gandorf from the zelda Seymour from final fantasy ten. No doubt about it.

Dont really think i need reasons for listing ganon. Buy Seymour, absoultely smooth and deceptive. Geez you loved him and hated all at the same time the true qualities of a villian.

Darth Jello
Ganon simply because he seems like the most truely despicable character nintendo has ever created. I don't think even Ridley or Andross really hold much of a candle to a guy that I can only describe as a power hungry, genocidal maniac.

Slay
SHODAN, because wherever you went, she was there. Controlling everything on the space station or starship to do as she saw fit, while ridiculing your insignificance. Plus, everytime I heard ''H-h-h-acker...'' it creeped me out.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Kenshinswife
Buy Seymour, absoultely smooth and deceptive. Geez you loved him and hated all at the same time the true qualities of a villian.

He wasn't evil just horny for Yuna.

Lana
Originally posted by ESB -1138
He wasn't evil just horny for Yuna.

No, he was evil and trying to take over the world. He didn't actually care about Yuna either way, he just wanted to use her.

Originally posted by Slay
SHODAN, because wherever you went, she was there. Controlling everything on the space station or starship to do as she saw fit, while ridiculing your insignificance. Plus, everytime I heard ''H-h-h-acker...'' it creeped me out.

Creeped me out as well.

InnerRise
Originally posted by Slay
SHODAN, because wherever you went, she was there. Controlling everything on the space station or starship to do as she saw fit, while ridiculing your insignificance. Plus, everytime I heard ''H-h-h-acker...'' it creeped me out. Which game is that from?

anata wa wakarimasu ka.....

Superboy Prime
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Don't state your opinion as fact, especially since Ganon has done his own version of all but one of those things mentioned, which is survive against PIS, but then again how was it PIS if he survived? PIS is Sephiroth always goin easy on Cloud despite the fact he's beaten him before, so explain how this guy "survives against PIS" as you put it.

Cry me a river V2D. You love Ganon, whoop de ****ing do. I don't feel like explaining Xenogears' massive, complicated and controversial plot. You're better of buying the game and playing it. You won't regret it.

Ushgarak
Originally posted by BackFire
I have never seen blade runner sad

Well, you should, so you can then play the game and appreciate what an awesomely mature and well realised villain Clovis was!

Incidentally, villains that are simply behind everything in games, I tend to find are rather rubbish. There is this kind of hard-on for manipulation in videogaming that I don't get. Plotwise, 'he was behind it all along' is one of the laziest things you can do, especially in the way it tends to get applied.

Slay
Originally posted by InnerRise
Which game is that from?

anata wa wakarimasu ka.....
System Shock 1 and 2.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Cry me a river V2D. You love Ganon, whoop de ****ing do. I don't feel like explaining Xenogears' massive, complicated and controversial plot. You're better of buying the game and playing it. You won't regret it. Just so you know, I don't hate Xenosaga, only KOSMOS. I just want to know how you can "survive" PIS. You can't, you can survive plot devices, but not PIS.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
He wasn't evil just horny for Yuna. No, he was completely insane. He wanted to be married to Yuna so she would turn him into the Final Aeon to destroy Sin, which would then make him Sin, and then destroy all of Spira and kill it's people, or liberate them from their miserable lives as he put it. Sorry bout the double post.

Superboy Prime
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Just so you know, I don't hate Xenosaga, only KOSMOS. I just want to know how you can "survive" PIS. You can't, you can survive plot devices, but not PIS.

Krelian is not a character from Xenosaga, yo. He is from Xenogears...Xenosaga's grandaddy. Xenogears is an awesome game, and has an even better story than Saga. If you still have a PSX I highly recommend it. The gameplay, music, story is top notch. Only real problem is the outdated graphics, but everything else is just top notch.

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by ESB -1138
And of course Kefka:

_c6EkWp79co

This guy does Kefka's voice perfectly. If 6 ever has voice overs he needs to be Kefka. And I actually lost all respect for Sephiroth when he yelled out MAMA'S BOY!

kKFAbxuxfVM
The chicks playing Tifa and Aerith looks like dudes. WTF!? rofl

BlaxicanHydra
I never liked any of the Xeno stuff to begin with..

So Bowser ftw.

SpadeKing
What about the thing from Ski-free?

or

Hitler and his army from countless videogames ermm

Superboy Prime
Shame.

BlaxicanHydra
My favorite video is Super Boy Prime.

SpadeKing
hey the thing from ski-free was diabolical mhm

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Krelian is not a character from Xenosaga, yo. He is from Xenogears...Xenosaga's grandaddy. Xenogears is an awesome game, and has an even better story than Saga. If you still have a PSX I highly recommend it. The gameplay, music, story is top notch. Only real problem is the outdated graphics, but everything else is just top notch. Oh. Well you still can't survive PIS, only plot devices.

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
My favorite video is Super Boy Prime. lol

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Krelian is not a character from Xenosaga, yo. He is from Xenogears...Xenosaga's grandaddy. Xenogears is an awesome game, and has an even better story than Saga. If you still have a PSX I highly recommend it. The gameplay, music, story is top notch. Only real problem is the outdated graphics, but everything else is just top notch.

Ridley_Prime
Ridley owns.

Here's part of my tribute to him. The Super Metroid manga.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/3931/npcomics14ye7.jpg

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/3788/npcomics15ri7.jpg

http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/4602/npcomics36jr2.jpg

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/8287/npcomics45kj1.jpg

http://img181.imageshack.us/img181/8128/npcomics52rg7.jpg

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4956/npcomics53pk4.jpg

Woot! clap

That's right. Metroid's favorite flying lizard creature is capable of human speech. He just tends to not display it in the games.

More to come later.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
No, he was completely insane. He wanted to be married to Yuna so she would turn him into the Final Aeon to destroy Sin, which would then make him Sin, and then destroy all of Spira and kill it's people, or liberate them from their miserable lives as he put it. Sorry bout the double post.

That's what he said but come on, he was horny for Yuna.


Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Cry me a river V2D. You love Ganon, whoop de ****ing do. I don't feel like explaining Xenogears' massive, complicated and controversial plot. You're better of buying the game and playing it. You won't regret it.

Umm no. You are stating your opinion like it is fact. And you are attacking his opinion of him saying Ganondorf is a top notch villain. Sounds like you're a fanboy. Your opinion is that Krelian is this well developed villain because someone he loved died, he decided there is no God and so he wanted to make God himself.

I played Xenogears and that game wasn't all that fun. Waaaaaaay too many cutscenes and very linear gameplay. Good night their are even more cutscenes in the second disk. I swear the game is so in love with its story it won't even let me play.

I found Sephiroth had more reasons to become evil. He thought he was just a normal guy who made it to first class SOLDIER then he finds out he's the end result of some horrible experiment and went insane and begun to hate Shin-RA and soon the world.



Mithos was a pretty cool villain. His sister Martel told him to make a world without hate and so Mithos went to try that; just not the way Martel intended. Mithos was willing to force everyone and everything into becoming the same mindless zombie angels and no one was going to get in his way.

Violent2Dope
Mithos was a good villain, it's just...when I look at him, I just can't take him seriously.

Ridley_Prime
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Mithos was a good villain, it's just...when I look at him, I just can't take him seriously.
Same here, even for a Tales character.

Now Van (from Tales of the Abyss) I can take seriously.

Superboy Prime
I attacked his ganon love because that's just the way we go. It wasn't serious and he knows it.

Kazenji
Originally posted by ESB -1138

I found Sephiroth had more reasons to become evil. He thought he was just a normal guy who made it to first class SOLDIER then he finds out he's the end result of some horrible experiment and went insane and begun to hate Shin-RA and soon the world.

What a bloody emo laughing


As for top villain

Kefka takes first place

Violent2Dope
He's not as emo as that dude Prime mentioned who got upset because someone he loved died and decided there was no God.

apoc001
These are all good villains. Others include M. Bison, Sigma, Lavos, Nightmare, and Thanatos for those who remember Secret of Mana.

Violent2Dope
Oh crap how could I forget my homie Sigma?

Guilty Gear
Orochi.

Impediment
I was always partial to Umbrella, myself.

A company that causes nothing but suffering and ruin, yet has a public image of trust and care.

Superboy Prime
Sad sad V2D are you angry because my fav. villain actually accomplished his goal and yours does nothing but get owned by a fairy boy in thighs? durlaugh

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
Sad sad V2D are you angry because my fav. villain actually accomplished his goal and yours does nothing but get owned by a fairy boy in thighs? durlaugh Ganon has accomplished his goal, in OoT he got the ToP and ruled Hyrule unopposed for 7 years. And dude you know that everytime Ganon loses it involves PIS and/or plot devices, in that Link has the MS, gets outside help alot, and realistically should not be able to even compete against Ganon's superior strength, speed(anyone say he's slow and I'll crush that argument like I always do), and power.

InnerRise
Ganon is SSSSSSSLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWW.

Anata wa wakarimasu ka.....

Superboy Prime
Originally posted by ESB -1138

I played Xenogears and that game wasn't all that fun. Waaaaaaay too many cutscenes and very linear gameplay. Good night their are even more cutscenes in the second disk. I swear the game is so in love with its story it won't even let me play.


No offense but it sounds to me like you just didn't grasp the story. I said he went on to create god to make it simple and not go in-depth explaining how he attained power, manipulated everyone etc. Because the story is very complicated and he will not understand it until he experiences it by himself. I had to play the game 3 times to fully understand every single symbolism in the game.

But hey I'm a fanboy. I don't care. It's not a sin.

You think Sephiroth is an awesome villain. I disagree with that and yet I do not call you a fanboy.

Guilty Gear
Kratos is a Sony fanboy.

FortressXRuler
And Link?

Kenshinswife
A nintendo legacy.

FortressXRuler
Iori?

Superboy Prime
Iori is a Kyo fangirl.

Guilty Gear
Yaoi?

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by InnerRise
Ganon is SSSSSSSLLLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOWWWWWWWW.

Anata wa wakarimasu ka..... I know you're just eggin me on but okay. In WW before the fight with him, Ganon runs about 30-40 feet to Link and knocks him out, showing great acceleration and speed. In TP when breaking off the wall, the instant he breaks his chains he is already in front of the Sage and kills him with a punch. Show me Link moving at speeds that fast.

Guilty Gear
Ganon makes the Flash look slow.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
I know you're just eggin me on but okay. In WW before the fight with him, Ganon runs about 30-40 feet to Link and knocks him out, showing great acceleration and speed. In TP when breaking off the wall, the instant he breaks his chains he is already in front of the Sage and kills him with a punch. Show me Link moving at speeds that fast.

Originally posted by ESB -1138
Wanna bet that's he's slower? I'll prove you wrong.

EU35sFsDwPo

The first thing Ganondorf does is charge Link. You may claim that's gameplay but the AI isn't bound to such things as the player is. The AI can do things in actually gameplay a player can never do. Now we see that Link is more than able to overpower Ganondorf when they lock swords.

Now you may try to disprove this with this:

ciTG9m2CuF4
Sorry for the length, only one I could find with Ganondorf beating the crap out of Link. Skip to like 5 minutes to see what I'm talking about.
KMzV8teMA-g

Okay (A) we clearly see that both cases he's flying. Flying doesn't mean you can wield a sword faster then someone and (B) both cases he had the Triforce of Power. Notice in Twilight Princess that the Triforce of Power was giving Ganondorf increased power. Wouldn't that increased power also mean increased speed? His strength was increased. So is there anyway to prove my words? YES! The same video I showed before in Wind Waker.

Now go way down near the end of the video to see what I am talking about. And I do mean near the end. Notice the DRAMATIC speed drop from when he KOed Link to when he KOed Zelda.

Guilty Gear
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!

Violent2Dope
And what was that post supposed to prove? Yes, Ganon is restricted in gameplay, sure he can do things the player can't, but that really proves nothing. Link in TP showed some feats of strength to be sure, but really, since we know Ganon can increase his strength with ToP, why did he not do it then when it really counted? I dare you to tell me that Link can output more strength than Ganon when amped by ToP, which is the power of a God. Also, in the WW vid, you really can't prove he was flying, we could not see if his feet touched the ground or not, and also Ganon's lower body is MUCH smaller than his upper body in WW due to it's graphics(his feet are as small as Links!). I never claimed he can wield a sword faster than Link, which would be hard considering how Ganon's swords are friggin huge and Link's is not, but even if he was flying it's still faster than Link has ever been. As for Ganon's slow speed while knocking out Zelda, this isn't the first time the Zelda series has contradicted itself(in OoT when Megaton Hammer hurts Ganon but in WW nuthin but MS will) and just because he moved slower in that scene doesn't mean the events when he has shown great speed never occured. And yes, maybe he used the ToP to increase his speed, but guess what? He has it, and always will have it til he dies, which is impossible as ToP makes him immortal. Also, you can't prove Ganon was using ToP to increase his speed or strength, if you think it was because it was glowing, it was only glowing because it just revived him, tho it doesn't matter either way.

Superboy Prime
[email protected]

I always loved Wind Waker. Especially the way Link totally owned Ganon's ass. Shame non-believers dismissed the game because of the "childish" graphics.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
[email protected]

I always loved Wind Waker. Especially the way Link totally owned Ganon's ass. Shame non-believers dismissed the game because of the "childish" graphics. I liked WW, hell I liked it more than TP. Why are you LOLing at me? Oh and Link in no way "owned" Ganon, if your remember Ganon was double teamed, and also there was no possible way they could lose. King Hyrule wished on the Triforce to give Link and Tetra a future, so there was no way they could have died.

Superboy Prime
I LOL because it's impossible for you to admit anything negative about Ganon.

Yes I would call Ownage evading 2 sword slashes and then jumping several into the air to come down and slam a sword in my opponent's forhead.

That's pawnage. Not as bad as Cloud's AC pawnage of Seph, but pawnage never the less.

Violent2Dope
Everything I posted was true. I may be a fanboy but I still use logic and reason in my posts.

Superboy Prime
You use excuses to try and make a point defending Ganon. That's all you do.

There's no way to deny Link owned Ganon when he impaled the Master Sword on his head. It does not matter if Link and Zelda were immortal or not because newsflash; Ganon didn't get to fatally wound either of them.

I won't argue with you on the matter though because I don't care about it 1/4 as much as you do.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Superboy Prime
You use excuses to try and make a point defending Ganon. That's all you do.

There's no way to deny Link owned Ganon when he impaled the Master Sword on his head. It does not matter if Link and Zelda were immortal or not because newsflash; Ganon didn't get to fatally wound either of them.

I won't argue with you on the matter though because I don't care about it 1/4 as much as you do. I know Ganon lost, due to plot devices. The most obvious one is the MS, then theres the fact he was double teamed, and also the Triforce wish King made. And my argument with ESB was primarily on Ganon's speed. And Ganon was defeated, not owned, owned would be if he was curbstomped with little effort by Link.

Superboy Prime
To me getting impaled on my forhead is getting pawned. Just like the way Sephiroth was pawned by Cloud at the end of AC. However we have our different opinions.

Nikkolas
Krelian....

Yu see, Elly forgave him. And he was only trying to help humanity.

Then you remember going through his Lab and the Wels and the horrors he created. People who can only live by killing and having blood to try and relieve the agony of their existence.

Then you also remember he orchestrated the murder of the Emperor who was doing his absolute best to repent for his sins and help humanity. Manipulating a thoroughly broken and desperate man into commiting murder against the Emperor, plotting to fill the murderer's mind and life with the idea of being absolute nothing and trash.

I HATE KRELIAN.

But I hate him 'cause he's a good villain.

Unlike Sephiroth.

Violent2Dope
Ganon is still definately the most efficient, serious, and hateful Nintendo villain. He's the only one I know who's not a joke.

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Why are you LOLing at me?weep

Guilty Gear
Who do I think is the top videogame villain? That'd have to be a wuss named after a bison.

BlaxicanHydra
What's the Bisons name?

Guilty Gear
http://www.leverguns.com/outdoors/images/dart_buff.JPG

Ridley_Prime
Meh. All I can say is, I'm glad you guys aren't like that with Ridley against me like ya'll are with Ganon/Ganondorf against V2D. Poor guy...

Then again, I can accept/admit negative things being said about my favorite game character (except for when it comes to BS excuses on why he shouldn't be in Brawl, like him being too big or something), so I guess that's a big difference right there. >.> I don't like to think of myself as a fanboy. It's just a character...

Superboy Prime
Poor Bison man...got shot to death.

Guilty you are MEAN

Nikkolas
Wait....


Effective, cool villains.

AND HE LISTS VOLGIN.

And Liquid...............

Ocelot is easily 10x smarter AND cooler than either of those losers could ever hope to be.

Violent2Dope
Well Volgin is cool IMO, but you're right, I can't believe I forgot Ocelot.

BlaxicanHydra
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Why are you LOLing at me?


'cause your a fatass a lameass a dumbass and you have no friends.

THAT'S why we're LOL'ing @ you. Nyukka.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
'cause your a fatass a lameass a dumbass and you have no friends.

THAT'S why we're LOL'ing @ you. Nyukka. And you phailed at checkin out a chick and she thinks you're a loser. You just a stupid phuckin cracka.

BlaxicanHydra
You spelled "cracker" wrong 313

Superboy Prime
Hey Liquid is ****ing awesome.

Heck who else could manage to overtake Ocelot's mind with a rotten arm?

That's right...Liquid! tongue

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by BlaxicanHydra
You spelled "cracker" wrong 313 laughing

Nikkolas
Liquid took over Ocelot's mind through unknown means.

But if the revelation of Ocelot's father plays a part, it means Liquid only succeeded because of Ocelot's own abilities.

Violent2Dope
Liquid was able to take over Ocelots mind because not only did Ocelot have Liquid's arm, Ocelot inherited some of his father, The Sorrow's, medium powers.

Nikkolas
That's not confirmed.

There are various theories on how Liquid took over Ocelot.

It's simply not a spiritual connection from Liquid's soul through the arm.

Kinda proof: when you use the Mic on Ocelot right before Ames dies iN MGS2, you can hear 2 heartbeats.

Unless they meant it in a strictly metaphorical foreshadowing sense.

Violent2Dope
...........Yeah dude it was metaphorical. I think my theory is much better than Liquid's arm contains his heart. And remember, Olga was also nearby him, it could of been hers.

Nikkolas
I didn't say Liquid's arm contained his heart.

It's making a new heart inside Ocelot.

Believe me, stranger things have happened in MGS.

ie. The Fury can be a giant flaming head after death.

Revan paralyzing Snake with a bird.

Also, Vamp has no heartbeat at all.

Etc.

Like I said, there's several theories on how Liquid controls Ocelot. The arm is the key but how the arm takes him over is not confirmed.

Violent2Dope
My theory is still most likely.big grin

Nikkolas
Not if I get to Kojima first.

I declare a race around the world to Japan.

First one there gets to ask Kojima which is right.

Ready. Set. Go.

*trips and gets a concussion*

Violent2Dope
I'll just ask Samuel L. Jackson. There is nothing he does not know.

Vinny Valentine
Seph.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
I'll just ask Chuck Norris. There is nothing he does not know.

True dat!

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
True dat! .....You sonova b*tch.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
.....You sonova b*tch.

laughing laughing out loud laughing laughing out loud laughing out loud laughing laughing out loud laughing

Violent2Dope
Samuel L. Jackson would erase Norris, and as his Herald so could I.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Samuel L. Jackson would erase Norris, and as his Herald so could I.

Chuck Norris would win by pointing his finger at Jackson and yelling, "BANG!"

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
Chuck Norris would win by pointing his finger at Jackson and yelling, "BANG!" You already told that joke, but I REALLY am not getting into this old ass debate again.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
You already told that joke, but I REALLY am not getting into this old ass debate again.

Actually I just learned that joke not to long ago from Chuck Norris himself when he was reading some of his favorite Chuck Norris Facts.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
Actually I just learned that joke not to long ago from Chuck Norris himself when he was reading some of his favorite Chuck Norris Facts. Oh, I guess it was Cooples that told it.

Ridley_Prime
Originally posted by ESB -1138
True dat!
Buddy. You just won a lot of respect from me. cool

ESB -1138

Violent2Dope

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
I read the same thing, but didn't Omega seem more powerful to you?


Sephiroth's true strength is still unknown. It's stated in the official book "Reunion Files" the Sephiroth we see in the movie "ascended to a new level of existence" and is much stronger than before. But the book states that he never exerted himself in the final fight against Cloud, and because of that we still don't know his true potential.

Vincent in Chaos form was able to take down Omega. Are you saying that Vincent > Sephiroth?

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
Sephiroth's true strength is still unknown. It's stated in the official book "Reunion Files" the Sephiroth we see in the movie "ascended to a new level of existence" and is much stronger than before. But the book states that he never exerted himself in the final fight against Cloud, and because of that we still don't know his true potential.

Vincent in Chaos form was able to take down Omega. Are you saying that Vincent > Sephiroth? Well, Vincent didn't really take down Big Bad Muthaf*cker Omega, he entered it's mind/body or some shit and fought it, then destroyed it when weakened on the outside.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Well, Vincent didn't really take down Big Bad Muthaf*cker Omega, he entered it's mind/body or some shit and fought it, then destroyed it when weakened on the outside.

And Sephiroth would just pwn it straight out. According to the creators of FF7: Sephiroth >>> Everything in the FF7 Universe

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
And Sephiroth would just pwn it straight out. According to the creators of FF7: Sephiroth >>> Everything in the FF7 Universe I don't know about pwn, tho he would defeat him. I want to see Seph's true power.

ESB -1138
I doubt we ever will.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by ESB -1138
I doubt we ever will. They'll probably make more FFVII stuff, there's too many unexplained things, like Seph's true power and who is Genesis?

Nikkolas
The user Erik-Lensherr PM'ed me and said Sephiroth has unlimited strength and durability and the only reason Cloud can beat him is because he has a piece of Sephiroth in him that allows him to tap into Seph's infinite power. All according to the creators.....

lol

Infinite strength and durability...I guess if Silver Surfer wandered by, he'd be totally doomed. He doesn't have "infinite" strength!!

Nevermind the concept of Seph having infinite anything is fallible. He didn't even control the whole planet so there's no unlimited power source for him.

And Cloud tapping into Sephiroth's power........................that is just stupid. Th eonly link they had was the Jenova Cells. The rest is purely psychological.

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Nikkolas
The user Erik-Lensherr PM'ed me and said Sephiroth has unlimited strength and durability and the only reason Cloud can beat him is because he has a piece of Sephiroth in him that allows him to tap into Seph's infinite power. All according to the creators.....

lol

Infinite strength and durability...I guess if Silver Surfer wandered by, he'd be totally doomed. He doesn't have "infinite" strength!!

Nevermind the concept of Seph having infinite anything is fallible. He didn't even control the whole planet so there's no unlimited power source for him.

And Cloud tapping into Sephiroth's power........................that is just stupid. Th eonly link they had was the Jenova Cells. The rest is purely psychological. Wow, that kid makes Terry not look like a fanboy.

Nikkolas
But the good thing is.

Akuma beats him.

SaTsuJiN
By popularity, I think Sephiroth takes it

my personal choice, aside from kefka (as awesome as he is), would be Sin (FFX)

http://www.rpgsite.net/images/screens/6/sin.jpg

I like how he was sortof protected by religion indirectly

Burning thought
he looks cute in that picture, big old whale

Violent2Dope
Sin isn't really a villain, the villain of FFX was Seymour.

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by Nikkolas
The user Erik-Lensherr PM'ed me and said Sephiroth has unlimited strength and durability and the only reason Cloud can beat him is because he has a piece of Sephiroth in him that allows him to tap into Seph's infinite power. All according to the creators.....

lol

Infinite strength and durability...I guess if Silver Surfer wandered by, he'd be totally doomed. He doesn't have "infinite" strength!!

Nevermind the concept of Seph having infinite anything is fallible. He didn't even control the whole planet so there's no unlimited power source for him.

And Cloud tapping into Sephiroth's power........................that is just stupid. Th eonly link they had was the Jenova Cells. The rest is purely psychological. He controlled the lifestream...but infinite power and durability is not at all correct. Cloud has Jenova cells and not a link to Sephiroth's power..
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Wow, that kid makes Terry not look like a fanboy. A matter of opinion. He doesn't seem like a fanboy to me at all.
Originally posted by Nikkolas
But the good thing is.

Akuma beats him. Sure. roll eyes (sarcastic)
Originally posted by SaTsuJiN
By popularity, I think Sephiroth takes it

my personal choice, aside from kefka (as awesome as he is), would be Sin (FFX)

http://www.rpgsite.net/images/screens/6/sin.jpg

I like how he was sortof protected by religion indirectly You're my new best friend.
Originally posted by Burning thought
he looks cute in that picture, big old whale I lol'd.
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Sin isn't really a villain, the villain of FFX was Seymour. There were many villains. The DOMINANT villain was Yu Yevon.

Nikkolas
Yu Yevon isn't a villain.

Yu Yevon isn't even conscious of what he is doing anymore. He's no more than a machine, mindlessly carrying out a task.

So don't think you can call him a villain.

Guilty Gear
...Yu Yevon isn't a machine nor does he lack consciousness. He's in fact the main villain as he can take possession of any being and turn it evil. He possessed the Aeons and turned them against the party, and created the magical Zanarkand and Sin itself.

His consciousness is the direct cause of most of the chaos in Spira.

Nikkolas
Fayth
"Yu Yevon was once a summoner, long ago. He was peerless. Yet now he lives for one purpose: only to summon. He is neither good, nor evil. He is awake, yet he dreams."


"On the eve of Zanarkand's destruction, Lady Yunalesca...had fled to safety with her husband, Zaon. Later, the two used the Final Summoning to defeat Sin. Yet the people of Bevelle still feared Yu Yevon. It was to quell his wrath that they revered him, and first spread his teachings. And so were born the temples of Yevon.
I suppose it's possible Yunalesca had planned it that way from the start!A fair trade, she defeats Sin in exchange for her lord father's honor. Of course, there's no proof. No, the facts are lost in the mists of time."

So, Yevon has devolved into a mechanical force that simply summons with no will of its own.

And the whole Yevon religion was hypothetically planned out by Yunalesca, not Yevon. It was brought into being by the superstitious fears of the leaders of Bevelle.

Also, might I remind you all, Sin was around for 1000 years. If each Calm is 10 years and I believe a total of Five people defeated Sin, it was still active for over 900 years. And it can't do more than destroy a few towns.

It's more the fault of the Yevon religion than Yu Yevon himself.

Guilty Gear
Where'd you get this information?

Regardless of what you may think, Yu Yevon IS the main villain of FFX. Hell, he's even the last boss you fight and is the one who CREATED Dream Zanarkand and Sin. Yu Yevon is the reason Spira was in chaos for 1000 years. Sin destroys cities by simply coming to them and/or shooting out a few beams that demolish them. His Terra Graviton dispersed and made several tunnels in the planet causing a vast amount of land to explode from underneath. Had that attack not dispersed and kept getting larger it would've created a huge-ass hole in the planet or probably have destroyed it even. The sheer magnitude of said attack took the moon out of orbit. Also its offensive attacks are not its strongest points; it's defense is remarkable. Its barrier can withstand incredible damage and still be unnaffected.

Nikkolas
I heard it all in the game but I found the exact quotes in this script.

http://www.ffwa.org/ff10/script.php



Necron was the main villain of FFIX then/

He created Dream Zanarkand...so what?



No it's not. The Yevon Religion and Yunalesca are the reasons. They spread the "false hope" of the Final Summoning which lead to 1000 years of Sin returning. Sin might have been defeated if not for their lies.

Yevon had nothing to do with any of that.



Sin's been around for 1000 years. If each Calm lasts ten years and about five people defeated Sin in history, that means for over 900 years Sin caused less damage to the planet than most any FF Viilain in less than a single year.



It took that one blast from that weapon but we don't know how powerful that weapon was.

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by Nikkolas
Necron was the main villain of FFIX then/

He created Dream Zanarkand...so what?Dream Zanarkand is how the fayth even exists, and how Sin exists. If it wasn't for Yu Yevon, there would be absolutely no chaos in Spira. Who do you think then is the main villain? Jecht? He's a good guy possessed by Sin, which is controlled by Yu Yevon, or is possessed by Yu Yevon himself. Seymour is at best a secondary boss. He became a part of Sin to gain a more powerful state. It isn't Yunalesca for a fact. Who else would be left to choose from?
Originally posted by Nikkolas
No it's not. The Yevon Religion and Yunalesca are the reasons. They spread the "false hope" of the Final Summoning which lead to 1000 years of Sin returning. Sin might have been defeated if not for their lies.And, if it wasn't for Yu Yevon, there would be no chaos in Spira, as he's the reason why Sin even exists. Sin exists because he and the fayth dream of it.
Originally posted by Nikkolas
Yevon had nothing to do with any of that.Yu Yevon had everything to do with the fact that Sin existed for 1000 years causing destruction in Spira.
Originally posted by Nikkolas
Sin's been around for 1000 years. If each Calm lasts ten years and about five people defeated Sin in history, that means for over 900 years Sin caused less damage to the planet than most any FF Viilain in less than a single year.That hardly makes any sense, and what's the point of saying this, considering everything I just said was true anyway?
Originally posted by Nikkolas
It took that one blast from that weapon but we don't know how powerful that weapon was. Actually, it didn't take one blast from that weapon, if you mean the one that failed to breach Sin's barrier in the same scene where Yuna's in dismay. If you mean the aircraft that zapped Sin in the air, it was because Sin was weakened vastly due to everyone in Spira singing the Hymn of the Fayth, which greatly calms Sin down. Also notice its barrier wasn't up for that same reason.

Violent2Dope
Yu Yevon created Sin, but he did it to stop the people attacking Zanarkand or some shit, did he not?

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Nikkolas

Necron was the main villain of FFIX then/


No, Necron is the TRUE villain not the main. Kuja keeps the role of main but the true villain goes to Necron.


And I would like to say Wizeman from NiGHTS into Dreams as a top villain.

Nikkolas
No, Necron was a side-villain at the end. He had no role at all in the story except another being trying to destroy everything.

Guilty Gear
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Yu Yevon created Sin, but he did it to stop the people attacking Zanarkand or some shit, did he not? No, he did it to preserve the memories of the people that existed in Zanarkand 1000 years in the past, creating Dream Zanarkand and Sin, who would bring chaos to Spira and make the people atone for using machina in the first place.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Nikkolas
No, Necron was a side-villain at the end. He had no role at all in the story except another being trying to destroy everything.

Nope, Necron was the TRUE villain.

You stand before the final dimension, and I am the
darkness of eternity...

I exist for one purpose... To return everything back to
the zero world, where there is no life and no crystal to give life. In
a world of nothing, fear does not exist. This is the world that all
life desires.

Foolish creature... Your fears have already deluded you.
One day, you will choose destruction over existence, as Kuja did. When
he sought to destroy the crystal, the purpose of life ended. Now, come...
Enter the zero world that you desire.

This is not the end. I am eternal... ...as long as there is life
and death...

Guilty Gear
That babe on the left of your sig is nicez.

ESB -1138
...Rouge?

Nikkolas
Originally posted by ESB -1138
Nope, Necron was the TRUE villain.

You stand before the final dimension, and I am the
darkness of eternity...

I exist for one purpose... To return everything back to
the zero world, where there is no life and no crystal to give life. In
a world of nothing, fear does not exist. This is the world that all
life desires.

Foolish creature... Your fears have already deluded you.
One day, you will choose destruction over existence, as Kuja did. When
he sought to destroy the crystal, the purpose of life ended. Now, come...
Enter the zero world that you desire.

This is not the end. I am eternal... ...as long as there is life
and death...

Okay...i knew all that.

He's just another villain trying to kill everything.

He wasn't controlling anyone or anything...so how is he the TRUE villain?

Violent2Dope
Originally posted by Guilty Gear
No, he did it to preserve the memories of the people that existed in Zanarkand 1000 years in the past, creating Dream Zanarkand and Sin, who would bring chaos to Spira and make the people atone for using machina in the first place. Oh, well anyway even so Yu Yevon could not really be considered evil, whereas Seymour was, so he fits the term villain better. And GG...You think Rouge is hot? LOL FURRY!

Guilty Gear
I just want to point out that I didn't technically say Yu Yevon was evil. However his main purpose is that he could keep summoning Dream Zanarkand, and to do so he needs to keep Sin and the Fayth from dying permanently. This also means that he would possess any Aeon and use it as a last resort against anyone or anything against Sin, hence the reason he possessed the Final Aeon as well as the rest of the Aeons near the end. Technically, HE isn't evil, but the things that he does for the sake of his dream are considered evil, and despite that he was the largest threat, as he maintained Sin devastating Spira for many years.

I want to think of the "main villain" as the biggest threat in a game and not the most malicious person.

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Violent2Dope
Oh, well anyway even so Yu Yevon could not really be considered evil, whereas Seymour was, so he fits the term villain better. And GG...You think Rouge is hot? LOL FURRY!

I'd hit that furry tail! (...sorry. I've been watching Scrubs and had to do a the Todd moment)

Guilty Gear
http://resistharder.ytmnd.com/

ESB -1138
Originally posted by Guilty Gear
http://resistharder.ytmnd.com/

I'm afraid to click on that site.

Violent2Dope
So am I, ytmnd.com is the bane of all existence.

Guilty Gear
I think it's kind of lame. It's just words with 3D effects and a tile of pictures and a song.

ESB -1138
You posted the link!! What are you complaining about?

Guilty Gear
I'm just saying it's lame. Why'd you change your sig?! mad

ESB -1138
I want to use my other sig only for the Judgment Hall.

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