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It all boils down to this...

GOWII Kratos v.s. AC Seph

Who wins?

Seph is much faster, but Kratos is MUCH stronger, and has many powers...idk really. I would say Seph for now due to speed.

I vote for Sephiroth.

Seph speedblitzes Kratos.

I think Sephiroth can defeat Kratos

By no means would this fight be quick, but GoWII Kratos takes the win here. Sephiroth in AC was close to a God-level being. IMO, Kratos was closer with his weapons, spells, and overall abilities. I actually was not as impressed with Sephiroth's speed in AC as I was with someone like Dante's. The Masamune is known for being an unnaturally long sword, but Kratos undeniably still has a range advantage with his Athena's Blades (they're practically twice the length), and he wields them with alot more speed than he's given credit for.

Sephiroth has jumping ability that can pretty much be called flying--Kratos fought at least three things that were in midair in God of War 2 (Icarus, Lahkesis, and Atropos), all of whom he owned in verying amounts of time all three of which was while he was in midair. Besides, there was at least one occasion where Kratos performed a pretty impressive leap himself in GoW2 (when he was escaping the Colossus of Rhodes' body after absorbing all of its power with the BoO, he jumped out of it's mouth and leapt a big distance off of its arm). But if Kratos needed to fly or jump massive heights with finesse to stand a cahnce against what he'd defeated, then he'd've been mincemeat on his journey after three minutes on the Pegasus.

Kratos' spells in God of War 2 are also enough to at least equally counter Sephiroth's assault in almost any proximity. Too close, Cronos' Rage (almost undodgeable up close, and can last a long enough time to give Kratos). Too far, Typhon's Bane (rapid blasts which can home in on Sephiroth, and don't forget the whirlwind). All over Kratos, Atlas Quake (dozens upon dozens of boulders flying off in every direction should at least throw off Sephiroth a little bit, I don't see it finishing him off though).

Sephiroth

I thin k kratos can take it, hes far more aggressive and proably has more brute power

Sephiroth wins, far more faster, far more powerful.

Faster? Sure. More powerful? Not a chance. Kratos has more power in one hand than Seph does in his whole body.

Power isn't limited to just physical strength, and we have yet to see the limits of Sephiroths physical strength anyway. When Kratos has the ability to stop a planet threatening attack with his mind power alone, then he can be considered competition to Sephiroth in terms of power.

Originally posted by Terryc250
Power isn't limited to just physical strength, and we have yet to see the limits of Sephiroths physical strength anyway. When Kratos has the ability to stop a planet threatening attack with his mind power alone, then he can be considered competition to Sephiroth in terms of power. That was with his willpower sir, and is not a battle feat.

It is a feat in terms of power, it is something he accomplished as it was part of the story, just like how Pyron has absorbed a planet, its not a "battle" feat, because we don't see him doing it in battle, but its still a feat of power itself..

His willpower is his power, his magic is his power, the negative lifestream is his power, its his abilities which make him "powerful" thus making him more "powerful" then Kratos.

Sephiroth's physical strength makes Kratos look like a little girl. He's the strongest being in FF VII, which includes people like Azul the Cerulean, who is stronger than Kratos as well.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Sephiroth's physical strength makes Kratos look like a little girl. He's the strongest being in FF VII, which includes people like Azul the Cerulean, who is stronger than Kratos as well. I will get to your post later Terry, cause it is late and I am tired, but FC...Shut the fvck up.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Sephiroth's physical strength makes Kratos look like a little girl. He's the strongest being in FF VII, which includes people like Azul the Cerulean, who is stronger than Kratos as well.

Until I see Sephiroth or Azul the Cerulean pull the main head of the Hydra onto a mast or toss the Colossus of Rhodes on its ass with their bare hands, I'm not gonn a say that they're strength is at the level of Kratos'. Sure, we can presume Sephiroth has superhuman strength, but every feat of physical strength in FFVII is nothing Kratos can't/hasn't done or surpassed. Yes, Sephrith can summon the lifestream with a gesutre of his hand, but the Blade of Olympus can summon a mushroom-cloud that spans throughout the entire landscape that will banish any of its targets t othe darkes pits of the underworld, by being struck into the ground. Need I say who has the Blade of Olympus?

Sephiroth is FFVII's most powerful being in the series, a series that involves a stylistic emphasis on combat with plateus of power that in all reality don't reach towards the levels beyond its own planet. In God of War, we have a series where the main character, though presented more grisly, is a man whose overall power rivals that of the rulers of that entire universe, and is currently on the verge of overthrowing said rulers.

Two words: Midgar Zolom



Rulers of a planet whose leader can be killed by simple impaling. Sephiroth at his weakest, before Nibelheim, suffered the same wound as Athena and was fine.

Technically, we never saw what he did to it. That, and the Midgar Zolom was barely half the size of the Hydra, who Kratos did the exact same thing to.





You mean the leader that endured about FIVE impalings after a battle at the world's summit, and the Athena who was killed with one stab by a weapon that's actually more powerful than just a five-foot hunk of steel? That, and Sephiroth was hardly "fine" in the technical sense, he may have been alive, but barely and probably wasn't gonna last much longer had he not been thrown into the life-stream. Besides, it doesn't speak well for his awareness levels (at his weakest state), having been snuck up on by a 16 year-old Shinra grunt.

Sephiroth owned the Zolom in a body that was weaker than his own without any problems. He'd wtfpwn the hydra.

And Athena was still killed by a big sword, meaning pre Nibel Sephiroth > GoW "gods." AC Seph would solo all of Olympus.

I still don't see how Kratos would beable to escape Sephiroths willpower, as it did hold immobile a power that is powerful enough to threaten the entire planet, Sephiroth is also much faster, and even if Kratos can simply summon the Cloud, he has to strike it into the ground, Sephiroths willpower TK works on a thought, which is faster, and with a simple gesture his NL is summoned as well.

Originally posted by Terryc250
Power isn't limited to just physical strength, and we have yet to see the limits of Sephiroths physical strength anyway. When Kratos has the ability to stop a planet threatening attack with his mind power alone, then he can be considered competition to Sephiroth in terms of power.

When has Sephiroth stopped a planet threatening attack with his mind?

ridiculous...solo Olympus lol.....no..

but pesonally Sephiroth prob would take on GOW 2 kratos with difficulty, the guy would be hard to put down, if this is God mode near invulerable and near unbeatable, a couple of sword slashes from Blade of Olympus would put Sephiroth out of action, but overall I think Sephiroth has an advantage in flight

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Sephiroth owned the Zolom in a body that was weaker than his own without any problems. He'd wtfpwn the hydra.

And Athena was still killed by a big sword, meaning pre Nibel Sephiroth > GoW "gods." AC Seph would solo all of Olympus.

Just as Kratos would WTFpwn the Midar Zolom with one tree less than Sephiroth.

And that big sword that killed Athena was still more powerful than any weapon or being in FFVII, Sephiroth included. AC Seph, any Seph, would have his body caught fire the moment he looked at Zeus the wrong way.



Kratos has the Blade of Olympus as of now and is out of his God form (such powers are in the BoO as of now). He doesn't need that form to wield it. I'm not sure if that's what you were getting at though, so you'll have to forgive me if you weren't.

I was simply saying if were using the God version from the beginning of GoW 2, the large one, but any Kratos would be a difficult fight for Sephiroth, the guy has so many instant kills, insane strength etc etc

Originally posted by ESB -1138
When has Sephiroth stopped a planet threatening attack with his mind?
Holy, the antithesis of Meteor, the only thing that can destroy meteor and was stated to be powerful enough to destroy everything on Gaia, Sephiroth stopped it with his will.

In his weaker form he did this to the serpent:

http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/5086/ff7zolom3yd7.jpg

I can't see Kratos winning against someone who can go intangeable, who can go far faster then him, teleporting, and powers greater then him.

Originally posted by Terryc250
Holy, the antithesis of Meteor, the only thing that can destroy meteor and was stated to be powerful enough to destroy everything on Gaia, Sephiroth stopped it with his will.

Oh yeah; Holy was going to destroy everything it deemed bad for the planet; yeah.

Originally posted by Terryc250
Holy, the antithesis of Meteor, the only thing that can destroy meteor and was stated to be powerful enough to destroy everything on Gaia, Sephiroth stopped it with his will.

In his weaker form he did this to the serpent:

http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/5086/ff7zolom3yd7.jpg

I can't see Kratos winning against someone who can go intangeable, who can go far faster then him, teleporting, and powers greater then him. 1. It was stated powerful enough to destroy anything, and only would destroy the bad things. And who stated that btw? I can't remember.

Kay. Kratos in Chains Of Olympus could have done that with one hand.

Intangible? Seph has never gone intangible. Faster? True, but Kratos is not slow and is stronger and more durable. Teleporting? Never happened. Powers greater? The Blade of Olympus in one move ended the Great Titan War.

It was stated that it could destroy everything by Bugenhagon, everything, WEAPONs, Meteor, possibly even themselves would all come to an end he said. Also its fact that white materia is the antithesis of black materia, and is the only thing powerful enough to stop it, so Holy is ATLEAST as powerful as Meteor.

Why are you spouting false statements? Sephiroth even in his weaker form can go intangeable, or else I wouldn't have said he can. We don't know how durable Sephiroth is because he only lost to a PIS move omnislash which we don't know the power of omnislash is anyway, his weak remnants took a huge TNT blast and survived it. Teleporting never happened? Yes he has teleported quite a bit, or else i wouldn't have said he did.

Sephiroth stopped a power strong enough to destroy everything, with his willpower, he infected the lifestream and created his own negative lifestream which means he has access to life,magic,power,energy, we've still yet to see the true powers of Sephiroth as well.

Also might I add, the Blade of Olympus is Zeus' weapon and not necessarily Kratos own personal power

Originally posted by Terryc250
Also might I add, the Blade of Olympus is Zeus' weapon and not necessarily Kratos own personal power

Zeus just forged it (from "the heavens and the earth", there's nothing implying Kratos can't use it the same way. Not to mention that Kratos drained all of his own power into the blade at the start of the game. It really doesn't matter whether it was once Zeus' weapon, it's Kratos' now; The Buster sword was once Angeal's (though he rarely used it), but it ultimately became a gravestone.

What I meant was, its the power of the sword, not the power of Kratos.

I know, but what I'm saying is that it's not what in an "overall" case (especially since the power of Kratos is held WITHIN the sword). What matters is that he wields the power.

Is it stated that the sword can only be used by Kratos' alone? What if the sword was taken from him?

Where did you get that implication out of what I said? First off, there hasn't shown to be any particular restriction as to who can use it (Kratos and Zeus are the only ones who've been shown to wield it). Secondly, the sword WAS taken from him once (through Zeus' plans), but he got it back at the end of GoWII through some pretty in-depth means (adn the final fight with Zeus was basically a tug-o'-war for the sword).

Originally posted by Terryc250
It was stated that it could destroy everything by Bugenhagon, everything, WEAPONs, Meteor, possibly even themselves would all come to an end he said. Also its fact that white materia is the antithesis of black materia, and is the only thing powerful enough to stop it, so Holy is ATLEAST as powerful as Meteor.

But it didn't stop Meteor; it was the Lifestream.

sephiroth can manipulate weather, cut the giant steel with little effort, can levitate, and he can summon a meteor. kratos can't win this.

Originally posted by kenshirou
sephiroth can manipulate weather, cut the giant steel with little effort, can levitate, and he can summon a meteor. kratos can't win this.

Kratos has herculean strength, can unleash a divine lighting storm, summon a team of immortal souls of the Underworld for battle, imbue his body with the power of the Gods/Titans, and can control and manipulate time and fate. Just because a FFVII character's name was in this thread doesn't mean I didn't think twice.

Besides, Zeus, the Sisters of Fate, and Persephone (among) could levitate to, and Kratos still fought them par-for-par agianst the ones he didn't just plain destroy.

Originally posted by kenshirou
and he can summon a meteor.

With only the use of Black Materia; without it he was powerless to do so.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Where did you get that implication out of what I said? First off, there hasn't shown to be any particular restriction as to who can use it (Kratos and Zeus are the only ones who've been shown to wield it). Secondly, the sword WAS taken from him once (through Zeus' plans), but he got it back at the end of GoWII through some pretty in-depth means (adn the final fight with Zeus was basically a tug-o'-war for the sword).

I didn't imply anything, it was just a normal question. So basically the sword is NOT Kratos' power, its a powerful weapon, but it is not his own power, just like the Infinity Gauntlet from Marvel , unless the thread states "Thanos /w IG" there is no reason to assume that Thanos has it. Same thing with this thread, if it just states Kratos, we are normally to assume Kratos the being himself, under his own powers vs Sephiroth himself.


That is because Holy was released from Sephiroth way too late after the Meteor was basically about to hit anyway, thats why it needed the lifestreams help. If Holy was never stopped by Sephiroth in the first place, it would have destroyed Meteor long before it was even close to the surface.

Originally posted by Terryc250
I didn't imply anything, it was just a normal question. So basically the sword is NOT Kratos' power, its a powerful weapon, but it is not his own power, just like the Infinity Gauntlet from Marvel , unless the thread states "Thanos /w IG" there is no reason to assume that Thanos has it. Same thing with this thread, if it just states Kratos, we are normally to assume Kratos the being himself, under his own powers vs Sephiroth himself.

It's a slightly different case with this, there's no reason to assume why one wouldn't be given it should it be a commonplace attribute. What's to be assumed is any form of power that's canonically appliable in battle unless stated otherwise, that they've canonically used before, and in this sense, Kratos has used the Blade of Olympus in canon, and has ultimately come into permanent possession of it, which is why I view it as applicable. Not only that, but the OP clearly states it's GoWII's version of Kratos, in which he has the Blade of Olympus, which has HIS powers as the God of War. Take the Prince of Persia for example: an almost primary attribute to his fighting prowess is the use of the Sands of Time, to the point that it may as well be included into a debate unless stated otherwise. Depending on the character he's against, it may be cancelled out or stalemated, but otherwise, it's to be taken into account.

The same can be said for just about anything Kratos has gained except for probably Pandora's Box or his God powers, as those were forms Kratos had achieved through plot moreso than gameplay, and are better left for a debate which involves something along the lines of an "everything taken into account" debate. But again, this is God of War II Kratos that's being used, and again, he has the Blade of Olympus, a weapon not a form or temporary plot-based enhancement canonically, and there's no implication as of now that it's leaving his hands anytime soon.

The difference is, those are abilities he learns, it becomes HIS power, the blade of olypus isn't kratos' power, and it can be used by other people. If the thread stated its GoWII's Kratos which means its Kratos /w the blade of olympus then fine, it can be used in the debate. Either way AC Sephiroth would win the fight.

Originally posted by Terryc250
The difference is, those are abilities he learns, it becomes HIS power, the blade of olypus isn't kratos' power, and it can be used by other people. If the thread stated its GoWII's Kratos which means its Kratos /w the blade of olympus then fine, it can be used in the debate. Either way AC Sephiroth would win the fight.

The same can be said for Sephiroth's sword. It's his weapon, not his "power". That's the logic that involves the Blade of Olympus as well, it's just that it's only one of Kratos' weapons (arguably his most powerful weapon yet) and happens to have more to it than being a piece of sharpened steel. Kratos owns the weapon, he utilizes the weapon's power, and with such power (in addition to all his others), he's just plain victorious.

I vote on the guy who can regenerate/recreate his entire body in seconds from a few cells in a box.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
The same can be said for Sephiroth's sword. It's his weapon, not his "power". That's the logic that involves the Blade of Olympus as well, it's just that it's only one of Kratos' weapons (arguably his most powerful weapon yet) and happens to have more to it than being a piece of sharpened steel. Kratos owns the weapon, he utilizes the weapon's power, and with such power (in addition to all his others), he's just plain victorious.

No.. Sephiroths masamune is a sword thats always been with him from the beginning, and only he is skilled enough to use it, but that was Pre-Nibelheim Sephiroth, in AC he most likely doesn't even need the sword.. when you first see him in AC, he doesn't even have the sword, he just creates it out of the negative lifestream, and it appears out of thin air. Sephiroth traps him with his willpower ftw.

In FFVII canon, yes Sephiroth was the only member of SOLDIER who had the capacity to wield it (kind of irrelevant in this case, because I don't we're introduced as to what it took to wield the Masamune, because if it were just raw strength to lift it, then Kratos more than likely has that covered). But again, it's his sole weapon, which he uses AS a weapon, which is the point I'm getting at (of course, BoO isn't Kratos' primary weapon, but it's still his most powerful). And also, Kratos was trapped in a surreal plane of existance of Ares' willpower before, and he ovecame it.



Along with the need for a larval remnant of his being as a host body, otherwise being unable to return to physical form.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Along with the need for a larval remnant of his being as a host body, otherwise being unable to return to physical form.

And...? This is a thread about AC Sephiroth dude. That means he doesn't need Kadaj anymore, because he is already there.

And my point was that he can regenerate his entire body in seconds. Kratos can't kill him because of his insane regeneration(and intangibility too, but that's another point).

Originally posted by SHM
And...? This is a thread about AC Sephiroth dude. That means he doesn't need Kadaj anymore, because he is already there.

And my point was that he can regenerate his entire body in seconds. Kratos can't kill him because of his insane regeneration(and intangibility too, but that's another point).

I've don't recall his intangiblitiy (and I've played FFVII, am in the early stages of Crisis Core, and have seen Last Order and own Advent Children), and his regeneration is not what I'd deem as insane from what I've recalled, at least not in this head to head situation. Again, Kratos has fought things with higher durability before (and semi-intangibility on one occasion I can remember), and he's still killed them thanks to what resources he has. Seph wouldn't be different.

He has gone through walls and flown through physical objects before during FF7, I don't see how Kratos can escape Sephiroths TK, if even Holy couldn't, Holy is more powerful then Kratos. Sephiroth is also much more faster, and has the NL.

And realistically, with Sephiroths speed, TK, he should beable to disarm Kratos' weapon.

And the Olympic pantheon (which Kratos is on the vere of wiping out) is more powerful than Sephiroth. Given Kratos' AoE esque magical abilities, speed would not present too much for Kratos to handle in most situations I can think of. Sephiroth may have control over Negative Lifestream (which he made himself, IIRC), but Kratos has control over time and fate having taken within him the powers of the Sisters of Fate.

Seph would be stoned and then shattered, simple

Yeah, like, he would stand still all DBZ style and let Kratos attack him. <_<

As powerful as Sephiroth is. I wouldn't compare him to Zeus. Kratos showed great power and skill when he fought Zeus in GOW 2. Kratos takes this 7-8/10.

seph had the potential to go planet busting...that puts him above zeus

not really, because potential isnt what he really is, is it, so what he really is, is a quick dude who has very few spells he could cast in a battle where the enemy is going to hit you etc etc

although ive asked so many times for speed feats ive got none from Sephiroth, nothing to show he can blitz anyone. This is full powered kratos with BoO were talking about I assume so this means Kratos is going to be near unbeatable.

Originally posted by MadMel
seph had the potential to go planet busting...that puts him above zeus

No, the only potential there was with the Black Materia. In Advent Chilren, he was intending to USE the planet as a sort of ship to find a new planet to make an empire for Jenova. Zeus, in his time, was one of three primary rulers of the universe (the most powerful one of the three I might add), and though God of War doesn't follow the EXACT happenings of Greek Mytholgy (for example, Zeus defeated the Titans through different means than what was in the actual Titanomachy in ways that, in fact, make ihm seem more powerful), but you can tell they're trying to have it take place in the actual universe of said mythological times instead of just putting in a bunch of references while in their own made-up universe.

I'm sure something like Omnislash Version 5 could do in Kratos in just as easily as it did Sephiroth in (even with Kratos' resources, he's still mortal for any outward knowledge), but there were reasons Cloud actually managed to land that move in the first place, and ultimately, it was Sephiroth's own fault.

Originally posted by Burning thought
not really, because potential isnt what he really is, is it, so what he really is, is a quick dude who has very few spells he could cast in a battle where the enemy is going to hit you etc etc

although ive asked so many times for speed feats ive got none from Sephiroth, nothing to show he can blitz anyone. This is full powered kratos with BoO were talking about I assume so this means Kratos is going to be near unbeatable.

Very few spells? He had power over the negative lifestream, the regular lifestream is the power of EVERY single spell on the planet, from Meteor, to Holy, to Ultima, to all the summons, by using logic, since Kadaj is the most skilled of the 3, if he represented the skill, and Loz represented the speed, Sephiroth dwarfs Kadaj in skill, he most likely is ATLEAST much faster then Loz,, keep in mind he also has teleporting powers.


Yes because at the time he was infecting/corrupting the lifestream which means he could do anything he pleases to the planet, his willpower alone was able to halt a planet threatening force, his speed dwarfs kratos, his teleportation puts him at a far advantage over kratos, his intageability makes it very hard for kratos to even hit him, all in all, his speed/teleportation, powerful willpower/TK, should be enough to stop Kratos before he can even use his BoO, and most likely even disarm him from the BoO, keep in mind that Sephiroths strength is no joke either.

Originally posted by Terryc250
Yes because at the time he was infecting/corrupting the lifestream which means he could do anything he pleases to the planet, his willpower alone was able to halt a planet threatening force, his speed dwarfs kratos, his teleportation puts him at a far advantage over kratos, his intageability makes it very hard for kratos to even hit him, all in all, his speed/teleportation, powerful willpower/TK, should be enough to stop Kratos before he can even use his BoO, and most likely even disarm him from the BoO, keep in mind that Sephiroths strength is no joke either.

Yeah, the planet not the universe. If he could've sed the lifestream like that, he wouldn't have needed Meteor to destroy it. As I said before, Kratos' enemies had all the same advantages Sephiroth does statistically, but none of them had prevailed against him. He had either recovered quickly enough, or weakened them to an extent that lead to their defeat. Sephiroth's speed and teleportation is nothing Kratos hasn't fought against before, and what you call intangibility is what I call limited hardware for presentation. "All in all" Kratos would just set Sephiroth on fire with his mind assuming he doesn't just use his powers over time and fate to erase Sephiroth from existance.

........... he gained power over the lifestream AFTER ff7, hence AC Sephiroth is the most powerful version of Sephiroth, show me one of Kratos' opponents that have TK strong enough to hold a planet threatening attack, thats as fast as Sephiroth, that has power over the main source of energy, life, power, magic, and a willpower that basically makes him immortal.

Also, show me Kratos simply erasing any of his opponents from existence with his mind.

Kratos' powers is a subject of knowing, not showing. What we know, is that the Gods are the rulers of the series' universe, forged the mortal world in their battles with the Titans, HAVE shown teleportation in their battles with Kratos (at least Ares and Zeus have, Persephone showed it outside of battle once), and a fraction of their TK abilities, and there are beings in GoW with enough PHYSICAL strength to hold up the entire world. Kratos, as of God of War II, possesses the magic of the Titans, the weapon powerful enough to banish them to the underworld and kill a God, his own Godly power held within said weapon, the ability to imbue his body with the power of the Titans, the power to control time itself as described by Gaia, and right now has the Titans by his side thanks to this power. Putting two and two together, Kratos isn't even taking the easiest route in his vengance.

And I said his mind would be used to "set Sephiroth on fire". Because at full power, Kratos is a God of War more powerful than Ares ever was, and a fraction of Ares' power reduced an army to a pile of mutilated men. That's another subject of putting two and two together. We haven't seen Seph's full effort, but we've seen what Kratos can acheive when he puts in an effort.

If this is full strength Kratos from GOW 2 then what can Sephiroth do to even hurt Kratos?

This would be a good fight, but i have to definitely give this to kratos. ive played both games, so i would know who will win. ofcourse, sephiroth is faster than kratos, but kratos is much stronger than seph. i mean he lifted atlas' hand from crushing him, and im guessing the weight hes pushing on him is many tons. also, kratos has the golden fleece, which deflects and counters pretty much anything. also, kratos more aggresseve than him, and has too much powerful magic to actually lose. and if seph does end up getting close, kratos can activate rage of the titans, which makes his defence go up a lot, and he can unleash a ton of combo attacks.

Sephiroth disentegrates him with the Nega-Lifestream

Kratos blows his head off with his mind.

Or swings his sword and causes a giant tornado which sends Sephiroth to Hades.

Or Sephiroth stops time and stabs Kratos through the eye ballz.

Stops time on Kratos? Who now has the power of the Sisters of Fate themselves?

Think before you post.

Originally posted by Solid Durandal
Or Sephiroth stops time and stabs Kratos through the eye ballz.

When has Sephiroth ever stopped time?

Yea, kratos takes this. and dont be saying anything about time, because kratos killed sisters of fate and he nows controls time. also, as a mortal, kratos lifted atlas' hand from crushing him, which was probably somewher in the millons(pounds). and kratos is way to aggressive, and his magic is too powerful.

Yeah, Kratos is MUCH stronger than Sephiroth, Kratos has more strength in one hand than Seph has in his whole body.

Originally posted by Solid Durandal
Or Sephiroth stops time and stabs Kratos through the eye ballz.

Which he can't do. Kratos on the other hand, can also teleport through time to manipulate the timeline in his favor (as he did when taking the Titans back to the present from the Great War WITHOUT the Loom Chamber).

That Sephiroth intangible bullshit needs to stop.

Jenova =/= Sephiroth

P.S. What good his intangibility did him against Cloud, eh?

The intangibility shit was just the beginning.

He can heal his body from a few cells now.

Originally posted by Keollyn
That Sephiroth intangible bullshit needs to stop.

Jenova =/= Sephiroth

P.S. What good his intangibility did him against Cloud, eh?

Actually Sephiroth = Jenova

Sephiroth, the New Evolution of Jenova
Sephiroth became the newest stage of evolution for Jenova, and anything "Jenova" does in the game's present day is simply Sephiroth invoking his new powers(UOG - "the will of Jenova as a human is the result of it consuming Sephiroth's spirit". When Sephiroth came into the picture, the minds of the two joined, and Sephiroth made himself the core of the viral entity that Jenova was, with his ambitions being fueled by his desire to destroy all the humans he despised. Thus, his will manifested through Jenova's extensive psionic powers.

AC Sephiroth is 100% Jenova

Cloud caught him off-guard, as Sephiroth wasn't serious or had his guard up, RF stated Omnislash' speed is blink of an eye that with the help of PIS landed.

Why do you think Batman can hit Superman often? Superman is capable of beyond lightspeed.

Batman only hits Superman when Superman wants him to.

Why dodge something that won't hurt you?

the only intangibility Seph showed was SLOW.

Besides, Kratos can just kill baby Seph in Lucretia ftw.

No superman doesn't "let" batman hit him, batman just manages due to CIS Superman, and yes it does hurt him

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j241/Badabing_2006/Untitled-Scanned-01-37.jpg

Batman was possessed by Blackrock in that comic.

Context is a b!tch.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
The intangibility shit was just the beginning.

He can heal his body from a few cells now.

Sephiroth has powers on this forum he doesn't have in his own series.

Yeah.

Like the power to obliterate anyone with the Nega Lifestream despite the fact that he never did.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Yeah.

Like the power to obliterate anyone with the Nega Lifestream despite the fact that he never did.

Pyron can't punch through worlds. He never showed it, so that means he can't do it.


C wat I did thar?

Only Pyron can punch.

Pyron is bigger than a planet.

So why can he not?

Sephiroth never used the Negative Lifestream to oblitewratew anything.

But yet he can use it to do so?

Nega-Lifestream is the exact same thing as the lifestream.

Lifestream has shown feats of being able to disentegrate and kill things.

Put two and two together.

Wheh has lifestream disintegrated shit?

End of FF7 and ummmmmm, I think it killed Denzel's mom.

Oh and Sephiroth. It disentegrated Sephiroth's entire body when he jumped in.

It only did that to Sephiroth because he is a frail pussy though.

Whereas Kratos is not.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
It only did that to Sephiroth because he is a frail pussy though.

Whereas Kratos is not.

You mean like when Sephiroth was stabbed through the spine by Cloud, and Sephiroth still got up and kicked his ass


It still disentegrated Meteor.

Originally posted by Solid Durandal
You mean like when Sephiroth was stabbed through the spine by Cloud, and Sephiroth still got up and kicked his ass


It still disentegrated Meteor. Funny, I seem to recall Sephiroth being the one who lost that fight.

Holy did. NOT the Lifestream.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Funny, I seem to recall Sephiroth being the one who lost that fight.

Holy did. NOT the Lifestream.

PIS.

Then what the fvck was the lifestream there for anyway? IT was stated that Holy couldn't destroy Meteor fast enough, so the Lifestream had to help it.

Since I'm bored and lazy I will drop all previous points and simply say Kratos kills baby Seph in Lucretia's womb.

Not before he has sex with her 313

Nah.

He would stab Baby Seph and then fvck the wound on Lucretia's womb.

Sephiroth, all the way. Heartless Angel #1!!!!

Heartless Angel?

Euryale's Head ftw.

Go back in time and kill Lucretia ftw.

Rip Sephiroth in half ftw.

I doesn't matter if he can go back in time. The results will remain the same. Kratos has a two disadvantages:

1.Speed
2.Sephiroth absorbs magic(If you have played KH1, and KH2, you know what I mean.)

Originally posted by Wil7
I doesn't matter if he can go back in time. The results will remain the same. Kratos has a two disadvantages:

1.Speed
2.Sephiroth absorbs magic(If you have played KH1, and KH2, you know what I mean.) 1. Not really. Kratos can block and deflect lightning, which is much faster than Sephiroth.

2. Kingdom Hearts is noncanon and as such does not count.

1.Sephiroth could probably block and deflect lightning as well.

2.Sephiroth absorbs magic in Crisis Core as well.

Originally posted by Wil7
1.Sephiroth could probably block and deflect lightning as well.

2.Sephiroth absorbs magic in Crisis Core as well. 1. Prove it.

2. When?

1. I couldn't prove it.
2. You fight Sephiroth in Crisis Core 2 or 3 times.

Originally posted by Wil7
1. I couldn't prove it.
2. You fight Sephiroth in Crisis Core 2 or 3 times. 1. Awesome. Concession accepted.

2. He absorbed your magic?

Mine he did. If he didnt absorb yours, then you had it at a really high level.

So he can only absorb magic from beings below a certain power level then.

Originally posted by Wil7
Mine he did. If he didnt absorb yours, then you had it at a really high level. ...Kratos>>>>Zack at any level.

Originally posted by C. C. Cowgirl!
So he can only absorb magic from beings below a certain power level then.

No, but in the Kingdom Hearts games, it didn't matter what level you are, he absorbs it.

And KH is noncanon.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
And KH is noncanon.

I do know that, but he can still absorb magic.

We haven't even seen his full power. He has toyed with everyone he has fought. You can't compare Kratos with Sephiroth, who only shows less than 10% of his strength.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Heartless Angel?

Euryale's Head ftw.

Go back in time and kill Lucretia ftw.

Rip Sephiroth in half ftw.

lol too funny... yea but kratos slaughters, and wil7 your points are all messed up. Also wut does noncannon mean?

Originally posted by Wil7
I do know that, but he can still absorb magic.

We haven't even seen his full power. He has toyed with everyone he has fought. You can't compare Kratos with Sephiroth, who only shows less than 10% of his strength. From a lower level Zack.

He toyed with everyone...Yet was unable to dodge Cloud's Omnislash V. 5.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
From a lower level Zack.

He toyed with everyone...Yet was unable to dodge Cloud's Omnislash V. 5.

If Sephiroth was using swinging as fast as he can, Kratos couldn't keep up. Sephiroth should use his Omnislask continuosly as well.

kratos is screwed without his time travel powers. with them, he takes this like a breeze.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
kratos is screwed without his time travel powers. with them, he takes this like a breeze.

wut is up with you bagging on kratos for his time conrtolling powers??? have you not seen him without them?? please, tell me how kratos would lose to this kid, because i really would like to know.

easy, sephiroth's power works on a much greater scale, than any of the creatures in god of war. time is the only technicality as its universal. otherwise, even the powers of gaea and zeus in olympia wasnt any bigger than a small country. even though to the game, that was the "whole world".

The entire God of War series is on a higher scale of power than FFVII. You may refer to the premise as a small country, but the premis of Greek mythology, which God of War takes place, was the universe in general; The skies, the seas, and the underworld. Kratos has on his side, the former rulers of this universe, and is one the verge of a new war wit hthe current ones. In God of War, characters can destroy cities worth of soldiers with a swing of a sword, it took Sephiroth an extraterrestrial, the loss of his sanity, and the planet's life energy, to be come as powerful as he did. It doesn't take a bunch of flashy eye-candy and mile-high leaps into the air to reach a verdict.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
easy, sephiroth's power works on a much greater scale, than any of the creatures in god of war. time is the only technicality as its universal. otherwise, even the powers of gaea and zeus in olympia wasnt any bigger than a small country. even though to the game, that was the "whole world". Bullshit.

Originally posted by leonheartmm
easy, sephiroth's power works on a much greater scale, than any of the creatures in god of war. time is the only technicality as its universal. otherwise, even the powers of gaea and zeus in olympia wasnt any bigger than a small country. even though to the game, that was the "whole world".

Your joking right?? this is a joke??? please tell me this is a joke.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
And Athena was still killed by a big sword, meaning pre Nibel Sephiroth > GoW "gods." AC Seph would solo all of Olympus.

Solo all of Olympus? Please, tell you mean not at 1 time if so, that's just BS. Not even 1 Titan could do that.

Originally posted by Burning thought
ridiculous...solo Olympus lol.....no..

but pesonally Sephiroth prob would take on GOW 2 kratos with difficulty, the guy would be hard to put down, if this is God mode near invulerable and near unbeatable, a couple of sword slashes from Blade of Olympus would put Sephiroth out of action, but overall I think Sephiroth has an advantage in flight

You think Dante>Seph, Seph>Kratos, but Kratos>Dante.

sephiroth won't even get pass the hydra

Originally posted by Gumachi




You think Dante>Seph, Seph>Kratos, but Kratos>Dante.

Yeh, they have diffrent powers that are useful against eachother, indefinite flight is one of Sephiroths powers that would help him as is the negative lifestream, ime not sure Kratos has anything that can hit Sephiroth from range.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Yeh, they have diffrent powers that are useful against eachother, indefinite flight is one of Sephiroths powers that would help him as is the negative lifestream, ime not sure Kratos has anything that can hit Sephiroth from range. blade of the olympus anyone? or perhaps some magic for your troubles?

Seph has no strength feat to suggest he can harm Kratos.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
Seph has no strength feat to suggest he can harm Kratos.

Indeed, so he wont use strength.

Originally posted by Phanteros
blade of the olympus anyone? or perhaps some magic for your troubles?

What magic? most of it is pretty weak, the only ones close ot be useful could be Hades souls, I think the blade of Olmypus is too slow as well. All Sephiroth has to do really is bathe the area in negative lifestream and disintegrate Kratos.

Only thing Kratos could do with The Blade to Seph is impale him, he couldn'tto do what Zeus did, Besides, if Kratos did seal him in Tartarus, who's to say Seph couldn't escape?

Originally posted by Burning thought
Indeed, so he wont use strength.



What magic? most of it is pretty weak, the only ones close ot be useful could be Hades souls, I think the blade of Olmypus is too slow as well. All Sephiroth has to do really is bathe the area in negative lifestream and disintegrate Kratos. most of his magic Weak? did you play the game? kratos can do more than impaling people with the blade. he can shoot energy out of it. then there's the djinn fire which keeps attacking the opponent.

I know what he can do, ive played the game, but he shoots beams in mostly straight lines and looking at Sephiroths speed, thats not going to be enough especially since he could be out of Kratos' range AND let loose his Negative lifestream. Although ive not heard of djinn fire, wheres that from? doesnt sound like a GOW 1 and 2 spell to me?

Originally posted by Burning thought
I know what he can do, ive played the game, but he shoots beams in mostly straight lines and looking at Sephiroths speed, thats not going to be enough especially since he could be out of Kratos' range AND let loose his Negative lifestream. Although ive not heard of djinn fire, wheres that from? doesnt sound like a GOW 1 and 2 spell to me? chain of olympus and seph's speed is all that impressive considering that Kratos can catch lightning and such and what you said about Kratos not able to do what Zeus can do i can say the same as sephiroth not doing what regular life stream can do.

negative lifestream is just the regulour one with Jenova cells in it according to Terry.

Catch lightning? in what form? ive not seen him catch lightning myself, if you mean in gameplay, or if you mean lighting balls or something then perhaps....

Hes still not fast enough imo, even Sephiroths quickness in AC should be enough, especially at long range to escape blade of Olmypus beams.

Originally posted by Burning thought
negative lifestream is just the regulour one with Jenova cells in it according to Terry.

Catch lightning? in what form? ive not seen him catch lightning myself, if you mean in gameplay, or if you mean lighting balls or something then perhaps....

Hes still not fast enough imo, even Sephiroths quickness in AC should be enough, especially at long range to escape blade of Olmypus beams. in god of war 2 he can catch lightning. could it be that the meteor was still apart of the same life stream which is why it deteriorated. and yes he can react to anything seph can dish out. he makes that up with Euryle's head.

Can you show me him catching lightning? I dont remember it..... and I cant see how, its a meteor that was falling from another planet, the lifestream is only present in the FF7 afaik, its not a universal force.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Can you show me him catching lightning? I dont remember it..... and I cant see how, its a meteor that was falling from another planet, the lifestream is only present in the FF7 afaik, its not a universal force. fight zeus

He doesnt catch it, if you mean in gameplay then thats not a real speed feat. It comes under the gameplay mechanic of "fairness/balance" and is even less of a feat considering its "fairness/balance" against a player.

And Zeus tosses bolts that are not as fast as regulour lightning anyway.

Originally posted by Burning thought
He doesnt catch it, if you mean in gameplay then thats not a real speed feat. It comes under the gameplay mechanic of "fairness/balance" and is even less of a feat considering its "fairness/balance" against a player.

And Zeus tosses bolts that are not as fast as regulour lightning anyway. my god.... so you are saying that the thunder god isn't good at what he does. plus they slow things down so that the player could even see the bolts.

god i love you logic.

gameplay is acceptable as long as it doesn't plot holed the story.

Obviously not in the fiction that is God of war. Can you prove this? your assuming that Kratos who is never a speedster in character anyway and has never done a speed feat is appently quick enough to react to full speed lightning from close range. Your the one whos logic a littel flawed mr, not everything with "lightning" in its name means that it moves as quick as our Earthly lightning under our rules. Especialyl when magic and gods is concerned.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Obviously not in the fiction that is God of war. Can you prove this? your assuming that Kratos who is never a speedster in character anyway and has never done a speed feat is appently quick enough to react to full speed lightning from close range. Your the one whos logic a littel flawed mr, not everything with "lightning" in its name means that it moves as quick as our Earthly lightning under our rules. Especialyl when magic and gods is concerned. they slowed down the lightning so the viewer can see. next thing you know you going to say that Raiden from Mk's lightning is slow right. he Zeus being a thunder god Governs all Lightning.

Youve not got evidence for any of this so ill just ignore you until you can display it. And Raidens would be equelly slow if its in the form of a little bolt perhaps? or if his only lightning feat is balls that he throws? personalyl I think ive seen Raiden do beams of lightning outside of the gameplay and I dont even play MK.

Originally posted by Burning thought
Youve not got evidence for any of this so ill just ignore you until you can display it. And Raidens would be equelly slow if its in the form of a little bolt perhaps? or if his only lightning feat is balls that he throws? personalyl I think ive seen Raiden do beams of lightning outside of the gameplay and I dont even play MK. nice to know you can't consider standards as reasons, BT.

or consider the facts that are staring you in the face either

Originally posted by Phanteros
or consider the facts that are staring you in the face either

The facts are that Zeus' lightning(at least the bolts) aren't as fast as RL lightning.

Originally posted by ArtificialGlory
The facts are that Zeus' lightning(at least the bolts) aren't as fast as RL lightning. they slowed them down in gameplay so that you can see them.

yeh well...maybe they slowed down all characters in gaming, everyone in gaming actually moves at lightspeed!

Originally posted by Burning thought
yeh well...maybe they slowed down all characters in gaming, everyone in gaming actually moves at lightspeed! animation could be a possible reason

He's fast enough to dodge bolts, but wasn't fast enough to react when Charon swung his scythe at him or when Ares throwed the pillar at him.

Originally posted by Gumachi
He's fast enough to dodge bolts, but wasn't fast enough to react when Charon swung his scythe at him or when Ares throwed the pillar at him. that was in previous titles

Point being? He still didn't dodge it. If his reaction skills were that good.

Previos titles, same character, he never got a speed boost.

So your bascially saying he's slow?

Certainly not fast enough to react to a RL lighting bolt.

RL=Real life? Finally, someone who understands me lol.

yh

Nevermind...

And if you look in the background of when you fight Zeus, you see actual lighting. Which Kratos couldn't dodge. You see dodging bolts from a large immortal, is entirely different, than dodging ACTUAL lighting out of the sky.

Originally posted by Phanteros
then there's the djinn fire which keeps attacking the opponent.

Originally posted by Phanteros
chain of olympus.

Originally posted by Phanteros
that was in previous titles

djinn fire=Efreet.

Arabian Mythology: "The Efreet was a demonic fire spirit from Arabian mythology. It's classified as being an evil type of Djinn or Genie. "

In God of War: Chains of Olympus: "The Persian King apparently has the ability to summon the Efreet. This makes sense being that both are from the land of Persia/Arabia. Kratos however then gains the power after defeating the king at Attica. When used, it unleashes the fire spirit which attacks all surrounding enemies. It can also be leveled up, to increase the damage it does, and to receive new abilities. "

http://godofwar.wikia.com/wiki/Efreet

Fire doesn't hurt Sephiroth i'm afraid =( I proved it in some other thread. You can see Sephiroth standing in flames and he doesn't react to it at all.

Fire res: http://www.tao.cx/tos/flame2.jpg (Original game pic)

There are other things but that is all I shall bring to your attention for now.

I don't know much about the Negative Lifestream, but I do know that since Sephiroth held back Holy and let it go late, that action made it mix with Meteor and to make an even more destructive force. (i.e Holy + Meteor was about to destroy the planet) Aeris brought out the lifestream and fought them both off.

Also, in the FF: VII universe each planet has a lifestream, does each persons universe rules follow them? Or?

I would like to point out the body Sephiroth used to kill the Midgar Zolom was done by a body much weaker(In every way) than his own.

AC Sephiroth can fly not just 'jump high' as said by someone early on, and he does fly fairly fast. Sephiroths combat speed is also incredibly fast. He can also go intangible and I don't know where this thing is about him only moving slow when intangible, you see him fly up pretty fast while intangible in the original game.

Fire spirit