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VS.


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From comics not movies.

Cm already beat beast didn't he? In one of the infinity books. Cap wins with great ease.

Originally posted by nvrbeenwthagirl
Cm already beat beast didn't he? In one of the infinity books. Cap wins with great ease.

Yeah, I have the scans somewhere.

But 10/10?

Originally posted by Inhuman
Yeah, I have the scans somewhere.

But 10/10?

Cap can hang with class 100's in some cases. What is beast going to do to him but get his fur knocked back.

http://img164.imagevenue.com/loc1183/th_48002_1_122_1183lo.jpghttp://img213.imagevenue.com/loc215/th_48011_2_122_215lo.jpghttp://img168.imagevenue.com/loc638/th_48012_3_122_638lo.jpghttp://img37.imagevenue.com/loc1184/th_48013_4_122_1184lo.jpg
http://img120.imagevenue.com/loc741/th_48020_5_122_741lo.jpg

Here we see capt and namor in a fight capts actually holding back as not to hurt namors feelings.

Beast wins.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Beast wins.


......you know whats next right?

Prove it.

Lol you comeback to KMC and nothings changed.

Beast can kick insanely hard, but I think Cap has the necessary agility to get the shield up.

Originally posted by Alfheim
......you know whats next right?

Prove it.

Lol you comeback to KMC and nothings changed.

Didn't feel the need for change. I mean, why fix something that ain't broken?

Proving it without a shadow of a doubt will be a challenge, simply because I don't believe the two have ever had a real, conclusive fight before. And, obviously, Beast has a fraction of the showings that Captain America does.

However. We do know that all this is true--> Beast is:

-Faster, superhuman-level
-More agile superhuman-level
-Superior, superhuman reflexes
-Superior, superhuman strength
-Superhuman flexibility, dexterity, coordination, senses, balance, and endurance
-Genius-level intelligence
-Razor-sharp claws
-An accelerated, superhuman healing factor
-And even a feral side that may prove useful
-Brilliant strategist (not above Cap, but still very useful)
-Highly-skilled, excellent hand-to-hand combatant, both from training from Captain America himself and DECADES of combat training he's received from being an X-Man, employing a unique style of acrobatic combat. While not better than Cap, Beast is obviously no slouch in the martial arts department.

Beast can obviously throw down and throw down extremely well when he has to.

All of these he has over Cap save for the last two. Not to mention that he knows Cap very well, and vice versa obviously.

I've given some of my reasons. Now, give me yours.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Beast wins.

I dont think that Cap wins as easily as most are agreeing too however, i still dont believe Beast can take a majority.

Cap 8/10

I mean he does handle much heavier hitters than Beast.

Originally posted by nimbus006
I dont think that Cap wins as easily as most are agreeing too however, i still dont believe Beast can take a majority.

Cap 8/10

I mean he does handle much heavier hitters than Beast.

That's just it. I don't disagree with you there. He has handled much heavier hitters in the past, albeit many times with a steaming plate of CIS thrown in the mix. However, has he handled anyone that can do everything that Beast can? And, you know, when Beast isn't jobbing/messing around/being written poorly?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
That's just it. I don't disagree with you there. He has handled much heavier hitters in the past, albeit many times with a steaming plate of CIS thrown in the mix. However, has he handled anyone that can do everything that Beast can? And, you know, when Beast isn't jobbing/messing around/being written poorly?

I know that Beast is physically and mentally superior, bar Captain America's martial arts skills. What I'm mainly worried about his Cap's aim when he throws the Shield and his ability to block almost anything. Is Beast fast enough to catch or dodge the shield?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Didn't feel the need for change. I mean, why fix something that ain't broken?

Proving it without a shadow of a doubt will be a challenge, simply because I don't believe the two have ever had a real, conclusive fight before. And, obviously, Beast has a fraction of the showings that Captain America does.

However. We do know that all this is true--> Beast is:

-Faster, superhuman-level
-More agile superhuman-level
-Superior, superhuman reflexes
-Superior, superhuman strength
-Superhuman flexibility, dexterity, coordination, senses, balance, and endurance
-Genius-level intelligence
-Razor-sharp claws
-An accelerated, superhuman healing factor
-And even a feral side that may prove useful
-Brilliant strategist (not above Cap, but still very useful)
-Highly-skilled, excellent hand-to-hand combatant, both from training from Captain America himself and DECADES of combat training he's received from being an X-Man, employing a unique style of acrobatic combat. While not better than Cap, Beast is obviously no slouch in the martial arts department.

Beast can obviously throw down and throw down extremely well when he has to.

All of these he has over Cap save for the last two. Not to mention that he knows Cap very well, and vice versa obviously.

I've given some of my reasons. Now, give me yours.

Very good points... but its still Cap, and they're really aren't any good points you can make except giving examples of other opponents (with better stats than himself) he's faced where he's found a way to either hang with or defeat... such as Spiderman, Namor, Wolverine, Ironman, etc...

Originally posted by Metalmanx
That's just it. I don't disagree with you there. He has handled much heavier hitters in the past, albeit many times with a steaming plate of CIS thrown in the mix.

Oh yeah like who?

Originally posted by Metalmanx


You're not going to give me the "It's Cap. He'll find a way" excuse, are you? The man is not undefeatable. Don't get me wrong, I love Cap. I think he's an awesome character who can kick most opponnents' asses.

But really. If some of his opponents were ACTUALLY fighting him to the fullest of thier abilities, do you still think Cap would win? Iron Man can't defeat Cap? Spider-Man can't defeat Cap? Namor?! Didn't Iron Fist punk him bad?

The thing is, Cap's usual set of enemies don't include people who have all the superhuman abilities, skills, experience, and know-how of Hank McCoy all wrapped into one.



No im not going to say that, but i will say that his skill level coupled with his will usually allow him to stay with characters that are FAR beyond him in most statistical areas.

Originally posted by nimbus006
No im not going to say that, but i will say that his skill level coupled with his will usually allow him to stay with characters that are FAR beyond him in most statistical areas.

And I agree with you, to an extent. An strong will can only get you so far when you're fighting against opponents who should be able to easily subdue you, however.

cap

Originally posted by SuperiorTech
http://img164.imagevenue.com/loc1183/th_48002_1_122_1183lo.jpghttp://img213.imagevenue.com/loc215/th_48011_2_122_215lo.jpghttp://img168.imagevenue.com/loc638/th_48012_3_122_638lo.jpghttp://img37.imagevenue.com/loc1184/th_48013_4_122_1184lo.jpg
http://img120.imagevenue.com/loc741/th_48020_5_122_741lo.jpg

Here we see capt and namor in a fight capts actually holding back as not to hurt namors feelings. Namor has dropped Cap pretty easily before.

Cap wins here though.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist


Cap wins here though.

You some sort of troll?

Originally posted by Alfheim
You some sort of troll? I do say, shut the f*ck up.

I can't see how personal opinion is me trolling.

Originally posted by Mr. Slippyfist
I do say, shut the f*ck up.

I can't see how personal opinion is me trolling.

Don't forget that you're talking to Alfheim

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Iron Man. Do you know all of his abilities? Do you not understand the meaning of CIS (Character-Induced-Stupidity)? Lemme ask you something. Why, oh why, does Iron Man ever fight Cap on the ground, hand-to-hand, on Cap's terms? I do hope you know that if Iron Man wanted to, he could easily destroy Cap in a fight. But for some reason, he always engages him in (rather slow) hand-to-hand combat, allowing Steve to bash him with the shield.


It would seem like CIS if you didn't look at the context of their relationship prior to Civil War. Its pretty simple, they were best freinds once upon a time. So, Ironman is not about to fly up 300 feet and blast him with repulsor rays until Cap is fried. If they were enemies then yea it would be logical for IM to do that, but they're not so he doesn't.

Originally posted by nimbus006
It would seem like CIS if you didn't look at the context of their relationship prior to Civil War. Its pretty simple, they were best freinds once upon a time. So, Ironman is not about to fly up 300 feet and blast him with repulsor rays until Cap is fried. If they were enemies then yea it would be logical for IM to do that, but they're not so he doesn't.

I know and realize that. That's why I made the distinction between a hypothetical fight and that of a comic book. Know what I mean?

Unless otherwise stated, on KMC forums each opponent fights to his/her fullest ability/potential. This means that friendships and personal morals do not get in the way of the fight.

So, yes. Iron Man would decimate Captain America. As would many of his more vastly super-powered opponents if they actually fought them to the best of their ability.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I know and realize that. That's why I made the distinction between a hypothetical fight and that of a comic book. Know what I mean?

Unless otherwise stated, on KMC forums each opponent fights to his/her fullest ability/potential. This means that friendships and personal morals do not get in the way of the fight.

So, yes. Iron Man would decimate Captain America. As would many of his more vastly super-powered opponents if they actually fought them to the best of their ability.

Of course he would, and i dont think anyone is arguing that fact, at least i hope not. But dont you think its still impressive that he can actually fight h2h to with an opponent who is faster and can attack with vastly superior force (like lift tanks and punch through steel walls), and is pretty skilled in h2h himself, and has a whole database on every move that Captain has ever used. Just because IM doesnt use his flight and ranged attacks when fighting Cap doesnt mean its not a tremendous feat.

Both Nimbus and metalix are seeing eye to eye here.

Just to note it, didn't Iron Man completely destroy Steve in Civil War?

Originally posted by llagrok
Both Nimbus and metalix are seeing eye to eye here.

Just to note it, didn't Iron Man completely destroy Steve in Civil War?

Yea, he wrecked him hard in their first Civil War confrontation.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Didn't feel the need for change. I mean, why fix something that ain't broken?

Proving it without a shadow of a doubt will be a challenge, simply because I don't believe the two have ever had a real, conclusive fight before. And, obviously, Beast has a fraction of the showings that Captain America does.

However. We do know that all this is true--> Beast is:

-Faster, superhuman-level
-More agile superhuman-level
-Superior, superhuman reflexes
-Superior, superhuman strength
-Superhuman flexibility, dexterity, coordination, senses, balance, and endurance
-Genius-level intelligence
-Razor-sharp claws
-An accelerated, superhuman healing factor
-And even a feral side that may prove useful
-Brilliant strategist (not above Cap, but still very useful)
-Highly-skilled, excellent hand-to-hand combatant, both from training from Captain America himself and DECADES of combat training he's received from being an X-Man, employing a unique style of acrobatic combat. While not better than Cap, Beast is obviously no slouch in the martial arts department.

Beast can obviously throw down and throw down extremely well when he has to.

All of these he has over Cap save for the last two. Not to mention that he knows Cap very well, and vice versa obviously.

I've given some of my reasons. Now, give me yours.

I agree with all of this. In a fair fight Beast wins 7-8/10.
It'll never happen in the comics though.

Originally posted by Batroc
I agree with all of this. In a fair fight Beast wins 7-8/10.
It'll never happen in the comics though.

Exactly.

Originally posted by Alfheim
You some sort of troll?

No that would be you.

Originally posted by llagrok
Both Nimbus and metalix are seeing eye to eye here.

Just to note it, didn't Iron Man completely destroy Steve in Civil War?

Yes he did, but it was b/c IM had been studying every move Cap had ever used in a fight. He also had that knowledge available to him through a database while he was fighting Cap. Still, Cap took that beating and was ready to keep going.

Note: Beast is nowhere near Ironman in strength or speed.

Originally posted by nimbus006
Yes he did, but it was b/c IM had been studying every move Cap had ever used in a fight. He also had that knowledge available to him through a database while he was fighting Cap. Still, Cap took that beating and was ready to keep going.

Note: Beast is nowhere near Ironman in strength or speed.

Like im saying the fact that IM had to keep a databaase on Caps moves shows you how complicated his MA is and also IM is a genuis. I can bet your bottom dollar if IM was gonna face Beast he most likely wouldnt keep a damn thing on a database.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Like im saying the fact that IM had to keep a databaase on Caps moves shows you how complicated his MA is and also IM is a genuis. I can bet your bottom dollar if IM was gonna face Beast he most likely wouldnt keep a damn thing on a database.

If he was going to fight him hand-to-hand I think that, yes, he very well might have one on Beast, actually, as Beast once thrashed Iron Man in a fight (and I think was on the brink of killing him, too).

He wouldn't even need a database on Steve if he just fought him with his actual abilities, aka: IRON MAN abilities.

Just saying.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
If he was going to fight him hand-to-hand I think that, yes, he very well might have one on Beast,

Yeah right he didnt have a database on Spiderman fighting style why would he have one on Beast?

Iron Spiderman >> Beast.

Originally posted by Metalmanx

actually, as Beast once thrashed Iron Man in a fight (and I think was on the brink of killing him, too).

Yeah and I bet that wasnt the latest version was it?

Originally posted by Metalmanx

He wouldn't even need a database on Steve if he just fought him with his actual abilities, aka: IRON MAN abilities.

Just saying.

First of all as I stated IM tried using his flight to get an davantage over Cap it didnt work. Secondly it depends on the cirucumstances when IM fights Cap sometimes its in an urban area, IM cant just fly off and blast Cap he has to engage him H2H, and if he trys to blast him Cap can dodge or block it with his shield.

However I think Cap ahs beatne the older version of IM once, but not the later version. Its not illogical for Cap to beat Classic IM.

By the way whats Beats strength level? His bio on marvel database says he can lift atleast 30 tons. Ive read some Astonshing Xmen and Ive seen nothing that would indicate this.

His bio states that he can punch through wall and twist barbells. If this is their justification for this its weak because Cap can do the same.

Originally posted by Alfheim
By the way whats Beats strength level? His bio on marvel database says he can lift atleast 30 tons. Ive read some Astonshing Xmen and Ive seen nothing that would indicate this.

His bio states that he can punch through wall and twist barbells. If this is their justification for this its weak because Cap can do the same.

Yea thirty tons seems excessive for anything Beast has been depicted doing.

Originally posted by nimbus006
Yea thirty tons seems excessive for anything Beast has been depicted doing.

Yeah and they said at least 30 tons! I think their justification is that he can bend barbells. Cap has bent jail bars and he wasnt really trying.

Originally posted by Alfheim
Yeah and they said at least 30 tons! I think their justification is that he can bend barbells. Cap has bent jail bars and he wasnt really trying.

In the Worlds strongest man competition there's an event in which they have to bend a barbell (or some sort of bar) over their head. lol

Originally posted by nimbus006
In the Worlds strongest man competition there's an event in which they have to bend a barbell (or some sort of bar) over their head. lol

It will be the first time bios have exaggerated a persons strength level, usually its the over way round.


I watch that havenet seen that event. (not saying your a liar just havent seen it)

Originally posted by Alfheim
It will be the first time bios have exaggerated a persons strength level, usually its the over way round.


I watch that havenet seen that event. (not saying your a liar just havent seen it)

They might of taken it out b/c alot of the guys were hurting themselves in that particluar event. Look it up though it was pretty funny. Im pretty sure they change the events from time to time as well.

Originally posted by nimbus006
They might of taken it out b/c alot of the guys were hurting themselves in that particluar event. Look it up though it was pretty funny. Im pretty sure they change the events from time to time as well.

Oh ok.

Captain America wins. Beast is a dollar-store version of Spiderman minus the webbing, and without comparable experience.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Yes. Beast is easily fast enough to catch Cap's shield. In fact, I believe he's done it before. And it would be even easier for him to dodge it.



Beast also has superior speed, reflexes, dexterity, balance, flexibility, coordination, healing factor, etc.

While Beast has not studied Cap's fighting style, he's still been an Avenger with him for a great deal of time. Don't write him off as stupid/ignorant. I think he'll have some idea of what to expect. On the other hand, Beast utilizes a unique fighting style based on his abilities, something that Cap could not anticipate very well in a fight since he cannot replicate the same moves himself, therefore not knowing too well how to counter it.
Officailly, Cap does not have superhuman durability. He has peak human durability. If anything, though, according to his numerous showings that have him doing the impossible, he has very low-level superhuman durability, which I'll concede to. But mostly, he merely has an indomitable will that keeps him going. That doesn't mean it's not a useful tool, however.



You're not going to give me the "It's Cap. He'll find a way" excuse, are you? The man is not undefeatable. Don't get me wrong, I love Cap. I think he's an awesome character who can kick most opponnents' asses.

But really. If some of his opponents were ACTUALLY fighting him to the fullest of thier abilities, do you still think Cap would win? Iron Man can't defeat Cap? Spider-Man can't defeat Cap? Namor?! Didn't Iron Fist punk him bad?

The thing is, Cap's usual set of enemies don't include people who have all the superhuman abilities, skills, experience, and know-how of Hank McCoy all wrapped into one.



doh

IRON MAN, of all people
Spider-Man
Namor
Etc.

I'm sure there are many, many more than I forgetting (I've got a horrible memory most of the time). before i go any further into reading on this thread i would like to correct you on one statement. I have highlighted the part in question. I will have to disagree with you there. While beast is indeed more agile than cap i do not think cap will have a problem with beast's fighting style. Beast fights very much like spider-man infact the two almost parallel each other in that regard, both are very unorthodox fighting styles which comfuse all but the best fighters. Cap has continuously shown that he is able keep up with and adapt to their style of fighting, as evident in cap's last fight with spider-man he was even able to predict his movements and manipulate him to a position that was favorable to him.

Originally posted by nimbus006
Yes he did, but it was b/c IM had been studying every move Cap had ever used in a fight. He also had that knowledge available to him through a database while he was fighting Cap. Still, Cap took that beating and was ready to keep going.

Note: Beast is nowhere near Ironman in strength or speed.

No, Cap was dying actually.

Cap IS a better H2H fighter and he does have his shield.

Beast IS stronger,has a BETTER healing factor and can pick his nose with his toes.

With jobbing factor out the window this fight goes 50/50.

Originally posted by yugotank
Cap IS a better H2H fighter and he does have his shield.

Beast IS stronger,has a BETTER healing factor and can pick his nose with his toes.

With jobbing factor out the window this fight goes 50/50.

Agreed!!

Cap for the majority.

Cap for the majority. Beast gives him problems but Cap is too skilled.

In reality I think Beast would stomp him, but in comics I think Cap would pull off a win.

I like to think Beast wins more times than not. Cap SSS gives him peak human stats wheras Beast is superhuman. Cap can get a few wins due to his Shield and superior fighting skills. But Beast is no pushover, he's a veteran with the X-Men and is alot more intelligent.

Btw this has been done a few times.

Speed is only a factor when one can't respond to it.
Since Cap can respond the beast's speed then it is to no advantage to beast. Now skill here will win for Cap.
This is because an attempted strike from Beast will instantly result in a counter strike with the shield from Cap. At full strength a shield strike has took out beings much stronger and more durable than Beast. And I've even seen the shield slice through metal like butter before.

They ovverate Cap in the comics really. But who isn't. I agree with hugekent.

Btw try using the search engine.

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=365799& amp;highlight=title%3A%28Captain+America+vs+Beast%
29+forumid%3A77
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=316190& amp;highlight=title%3A%28Captain+America+vs+Beast%
29+forumid%3A77
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=6537832& amp;highlight=title%3A%28Captain+America+vs+Beast%
29+forumid%3A77#post6537832

Originally posted by h1a8
Speed is only a factor when one can't respond to it.
Since Cap can respond the beast's speed then it is to no advantage to beast. Now skill here will win for Cap.
This is because an attempted strike from Beast will instantly result in a counter strike with the shield from Cap. At full strength a shield strike has took out beings much stronger and more durable than Beast. And I've even seen the shield slice through metal like butter before.

Beast isn't just faster; he's a lot more agile, has better reflexes, is more durable, has a longer reach, has razor sharp claws and teeth, and is at least 15 times as strong as Cap. And he can easily dodge or catch the shield (he's caught it twice before).

Originally posted by Batroc
Beast isn't just faster; he's a lot more agile, has better reflexes, is more durable, has a longer reach, has razor sharp claws and teeth, and is at least 15 times as strong as Cap. And he can easily dodge or catch the shield (he's caught it twice before).

Originally posted by Batroc
Beast isn't just faster; he's a lot more agile, has better reflexes, is more durable, has a longer reach, has razor sharp claws and teeth, and is at least 15 times as strong as Cap. And he can easily dodge or catch the shield (he's caught it twice before).

I doubt that he's more agile. There's a scan here that shows they have exactly the same agility. I doubt he has better reflexes too. Cap's reflexes are as good as the best of the street levelers are. And whoever actually has the better reflexes is not important anyway because neither of these combatants can move faster than the other can perceive and respond to. So countering becomes of utmost importance (reflexes can't save you here). And by Cap being a martial arts master who has mastered the counter attack, who's to say that he doesn't counter one of Beast's strikes with a shield to the skull?

Originally posted by h1a8
I doubt that he's more agile. There's a scan here that shows they have exactly the same agility. I doubt he has better reflexes too. Cap's reflexes are as good as the best of the street levelers are. And whoever actually has the better reflexes is not important anyway because neither of these combatants can move faster than the other can perceive and respond to. So countering becomes of utmost importance (reflexes can't save you here). And by Cap being a martial arts master who has mastered the counter attack, who's to say that he doesn't counter one of Beast's strikes with a shield to the skull?

There's a good way to compare Cap and Beasts agility, and that's to see how their creator Jack Kirby portrayed the characters in action. Kirby shows Beast doing incredible, Spidey level agility feats, but he only shows Cap doing the type of acrobatics you'd expect to see from Daredevil or Black Panther. Beast is significantly more agile than Cap, maybe as agile as Spiderman.

If the scan you are refering to is the one of Cap and Beast training together at Avengers Mansion, then that panel simply showed they had a training session together. They weren't competing with each other, and there's nothing there to show either was more, less or equally agile.

Originally posted by Batroc
There's a good way to compare Cap and Beasts agility, and that's to see how their creator Jack Kirby portrayed the characters in action. Kirby shows Beast doing incredible, Spidey level agility feats, but he only shows Cap doing the type of acrobatics you'd expect to see from Daredevil or Black Panther. Beast is significantly more agile than Cap, maybe as agile as Spiderman.

If the scan you are refering to is the one of Cap and Beast training together at Avengers Mansion, then that panel simply showed they had a training session together. They weren't competing with each other, and there's nothing there to show either was more, less or equally agile.

You're right-in terms of pure agility Beast, like Spiderman, is Cap's superior-like Spiderman he is less refined than Cap

Originally posted by BUSTER1
You're right-in terms of pure agility Beast, like Spiderman, is Cap's superior-like Spiderman he is less refined than Cap Some people on here think Cap>Beast in agility.

Originally posted by Batroc
There's a good way to compare Cap and Beasts agility, and that's to see how their creator Jack Kirby portrayed the characters in action. Kirby shows Beast doing incredible, Spidey level agility feats, but he only shows Cap doing the type of acrobatics you'd expect to see from Daredevil or Black Panther. Beast is significantly more agile than Cap, maybe as agile as Spiderman.

If the scan you are refering to is the one of Cap and Beast training together at Avengers Mansion, then that panel simply showed they had a training session together. They weren't competing with each other, and there's nothing there to show either was more, less or equally agile.

Well theres the fact that Beast said that Cap was alamost as agile as him, almost is marginal. Also during a training session Beast was not fast enough to stop Cap from falling. (Beast thought Cap was in toruble but he wasnt).

Gotta bump this thread for the sheer hell of it.

Cap pretty much curb stomped Beast.

Daredevil defeated Beast.

Black Panther defeated Beast.

Beast just doesn't bode well against the elite in fighting.

Is that why he held his own against Wolverine? Why he held his own and had the slight advantage for most his fight with Sabretooth?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Is that why he held his own against Wolverine?

Read the fight again Wolverine wasnt fighting him at full ability he was trying get Beast riled up because Beast was thinking of getting rid of his mutant gene.

Originally posted by Metalmanx

Why he held his own and had the slight advantage for most his fight with Sabretooth?



How many times has he done stuff like that? Thats just a one-off. Hell hes been beaten by 3 street levelers none of them could beat Sabretooth.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Is that why he held his own against Wolverine? Why he held his own and had the slight advantage for most his fight with Sabretooth?





They've all held there own against Wolverine.

Daredevil held his own against Wolverine.


In the "end" both Logan/Sabretooth would also defeat Beast so thats a moot point.

Unless your trying to imply Beast beats Logan. Which is not happening either.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
They've all held there own against Wolverine.

Daredevil held his own against Wolverine.

In the "end" both Logan/Sabretooth would also defeat Beast so thats a moot point.

Unless your trying to imply Beast beats Logan. Which is not happening either.

Well, obviously. Superior healing factors go a LOOOONG way towards victory for Logan and Victor.

Beast doesn't have the feats to warrent a sensible argument in his favour

he IS stronger/more durable and has greater agility, he ISNT better fighter but what this argument will come down to is feats - Cap has more

imo Beast could get a couple'a'wins in his greater agility might (just might) catch Cap off guard.

Its not a stomp by any means though, and to all the numbskulls that are gonna state Caps (CISsy) throw downs against class 100's. then meh! may your ignorance be truly blissfull.

Cap - 8/10 because i cant prove/scan otherwise

-2 cents-

Originally posted by Juk3n
Beast doesn't have the feats to warrent a sensible argument in his favour

he IS stronger/more durable and has greater agility, he ISNT better fighter but what this argument will come down to is feats - Cap has more

imo Beast could get a couple'a'wins in his greater agility might (just might) catch Cap off guard.

Its not a stomp by any means though, and to all the numbskulls that are gonna state Caps (CISsy) throw downs against class 100's. then meh! may your ignorance be truly blissfull.

Cap - 8/10 because i cant prove/scan otherwise

-2 cents-

Ah...it's been awhile since I've met another rational debator. Good to have you along, Juk.

However, I do disagree with you on some things.

Along with the superior strength, agility, and durability, Beast also has Cap in the speed department, dexterity, balance, coordination, endurance, senses, and equilibrium, too. And arguably reflexes. And let's not forget his razor-sharp claws and teeth. They could become quite useful in this fight.

Oh yea. And then there's the healing factor.

Yes, Cap is the far superior martial artist. No one's denying that. But Beast is no slouch, not by a long shot. He's an excellent hand-to-hand combatant, using a unique fighting style that utilizes his speed, quickness, reflexes, and agility (all things in which he is superior to Cap). He has trained for almost his entire life with the X-Men and has received coaching from Captain America himself. Just something to keep in mind, Beast isn't going to be a push-over in the hand-to-hand department.

But yes, you are correct when you say that Cap has more feats. That's just the unfortunate way these things sometimes work in comics. It's all about the feats and who has more of them and who's are better. That happens a lot in the Colossus vs. Thing thread, since Thing has ridiculously more showings than Colossus. But Colossus would, too, if he was one of a four-member superhero team that has hardly ever changed it's roster.

How will skill help when Cap is inferior in the speed, agility and reflex department?

Originally posted by llagrok
How will skill help when Cap is inferior in the speed, agility and reflex department?

Because the difference in speed is marginal.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Well, obviously. Superior healing factors go a LOOOONG way towards victory for Logan and Victor.


And obviously Beast doing well against Logan speaks nothing for his fights against Daredevil, Cap, and Blackpanther.

Since Beast looks to fail against the likes of them.

Originally posted by llagrok
How will skill help when Cap is inferior in the speed, agility and reflex department?


This shows you know nothing on Cap's skill and his feats in speed, agility, and reflex.


In one of Cap's fights with Beast were Cap was "holding back" as shown in that fight. Beast did his standard leap at you type attack as Cap was already away from that.

As Beast then said "Where'd he go" or something to that extent. As even Beast himself was awwed at Cap's speed.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
This shows you know nothing on Cap's skill and his feats in speed, agility, and reflex.


In one of Cap's fights with Beast were Cap was "holding back" as shown in that fight. Beast did his standard leap at you type attack as Cap was already away from that.

As Beast then said "Where'd he go" or something to that extent. As even Beast himself was awwed at Cap's speed.

Just shows you know nothing about Beast's history :/

Since his Avengers days, Beast has received a substantial upgrade in speed, agility and reflexes. Not to mention the offensive department. Cap, for all his skills, is a mere peak human in every category.

Originally posted by llagrok


Since his Avengers days, Beast has received a substantial upgrade in speed, agility and reflexes.

Can your prove that?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Can your prove that?

His mutation

Originally posted by llagrok
His mutation

LOL yeah he got bigger so im assuming hes stronger that dont mean hes faster though.

Wow talk about speculation.

Originally posted by llagrok
Just shows you know nothing about Beast's history :/

Since his Avengers days, Beast has received a substantial upgrade in speed, agility and reflexes. Not to mention the offensive department. Cap, for all his skills, is a mere peak human in every category.


And yet that peak-human with skills defeats Beast.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
LOL yeah he got bigger so im assuming hes stronger that dont mean hes faster though.

Wow talk about speculation.

No, Phantom. He is right. It's stated pretty much everywhere now. With his recent (as of a couple years ago) further mutation, he is now even stronger, even faster, even more agile, has even better balance, more enhanced senses than before, razor sharp claws and fangs, an even better healing factor, improved stamina/endurance, coordination, equilibrium, and now he's gained a more improved, deadlier feral mode.

He's not making it up. It's pretty well documented.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
No, Phantom. He is right. It's stated pretty much everywhere now. With his recent (as of a couple years ago) further mutation, he is now even stronger, even faster, even more agile, has even better balance, more enhanced senses than before, razor sharp claws and fangs, an even better healing factor, improved stamina/endurance, coordination, equilibrium, and now he's gained a more improved, deadlier feral mode.

He's not making it up. It's pretty well documented.



Then site a source because you might just be referring to Dark Beast and thats not the one being presented in this thread. If its so well documented it should be rather easy to give a title/number.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
No, Phantom. He is right. It's stated pretty much everywhere now. With his recent (as of a couple years ago) further mutation, he is now even stronger, even faster, even more agile, has even better balance, more enhanced senses than before, razor sharp claws and fangs, an even better healing factor, improved stamina/endurance, coordination, equilibrium, and now he's gained a more improved, deadlier feral mode.

He's not making it up. It's pretty well documented.

Is this on panel or marvel universe? If its marvel universe or a bio im going to take it with a pinch of salt.

I wish I could, but I don't believe any one issue has gone ahead and just stated all of this stuff on-panel. It's just been seen throughout the recent comics. I think there was some mention of it in an earlier book, if I recall. Probably close to the time when the secondary mutation occurred. I believe it's in the handbooks, too.

And no, I'm not referring to Dark Beast. I'm well aware as to who he is.

And I apologize for saying that it's "pretty well documented". I can see where that would lead to confusion. What I meant to say was that it's been shown several times throughout the recent comics that all of Beast's abilities/attributes have been upgraded, as well as some handbooks. My fault for the wrong choice of words.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I wish I could, but I don't believe any one issue has gone ahead and just stated all of this stuff on-panel. It's just been seen throughout the recent comics. I think there was some mention of it in an earlier book, if I recall. Probably close to the time when the secondary mutation occurred. I believe it's in the handbooks, too.

And no, I'm not referring to Dark Beast. I'm well aware as to who he is.


Ok I really really hope that its just not you assuming that Beast is faster. Well since you cant provide anything Beast still loses.

Anything from the handbooks will be treated with a pinch of salt.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Ok I really really hope that its just not you assuming that Beast is faster. Well since you cant provide anything Beast still loses.

Anything from the handbooks will be treated with a pinch of salt.

...Wait. Because I can't provide any particular scan, Beast loses?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
...Wait. Because I can't provide any particular scan, Beast loses?

Well you havent given us any reasons so far why he should win. You dont have any proof that hes fatser so he still loses just like before.

Haha, fanboyism.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well you havent given us any reasons so far why he should win. You dont have any proof that hes fatser so he still loses just like before.

And when was he already losing? This whole "you lose because I think your wrong and I'm right" thing is really getting old.

Read X-Men comics from his secondary mutation and on. Sorry I can't provide a particular issue number, but it's there.

Also, bringing in secondary Beast is not even necessary. Pre-secondary Beast could still win this.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
And when was he already losing? This whole "you lose because I think your wrong and I'm right" thing is really getting old.


What the great big massive post where I explained in detail why he loses.

Originally posted by Metalmanx

Read X-Men comics from his secondary mutation and on. Sorry I can't provide a particular issue number, but it's there.

Also, bringing in secondary Beast is not even necessary.

Pre-secondary Beast could still win this.

Ive seen Beast in Astonishing X-men. What is this hypnosis? Am I supposed to just read the comic and suddenly come to the conclusion that Beast beats Cap?

Great big fat zero, im still waiting for a reason why he wins the majority.

Originally posted by Metalmanx

Pre-secondary Beast could still win this.

Which one is that? shifty

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I wish I could, but I don't believe any one issue has gone ahead and just stated all of this stuff on-panel. It's just been seen throughout the recent comics. I think there was some mention of it in an earlier book, if I recall. Probably close to the time when the secondary mutation occurred. I believe it's in the handbooks, too.

And no, I'm not referring to Dark Beast. I'm well aware as to who he is.

And I apologize for saying that it's "pretty well documented". I can see where that would lead to confusion. What I meant to say was that it's been shown several times throughout the recent comics that all of Beast's abilities/attributes have been upgraded, as well as some handbooks. My fault for the wrong choice of words.


Handbooks are worthless if they don't match the source the "stories".

Shown several times in the recent comics. The what title/number are these recent stories again you avoid the question and not give a title/number.

Originally posted by Daredevil1
Handbooks are worthless if they don't match the source the "stories".

Shown several times in the recent comics. The what title/number are these recent stories again you avoid the question and not give a title/number.

I dunno I guess he saw Beast dodging lasers and bullets and just assumed that Beast was faster.

Cap for a solid majority.

Cap all day. Just because you are an incredible athlete (Like Beast) doesn't mean that you can necessarily fight.

Originally posted by Caps Conscience
Cap all day. Just because you are an incredible athlete (Like Beast) doesn't mean that you can necessarily fight.

...But he can though. He's a highly skilled martial artist, trained both by various X-Men along with the multitude of training programs from the Danger Room as well as Captain America, who personally coached him in the ways of fighting.

And Beast isn't just an "athlete" either. He's superhuman.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
...But he can though. He's a highly skilled martial artist, trained both by various X-Men along with the multitude of training programs from the Danger Room as well as Captain America, who personally coached him in the ways of fighting.

And Beast isn't just an "athlete" either. He's superhuman.

He obviously isn't that skilled of a fighter because he has a losing record against most Marvel's fighting elite despite his physical advantages. He is just not as good as the Captain America's, Wolverines, BPs etc.

Originally posted by Caps Conscience
He obviously isn't that skilled of a fighter because he has a losing record against most Marvel's fighting elite despite his physical advantages. He is just not as good as the Captain America's, Wolverines, BPs etc.

No, he's not. And I never said he was. Obviously, Wolverine/Cap/Black Panther/Iron Fist/Shang Chi/Daredevil/etc.>>>>>>>>>>Beast in terms of martial arts ability. Never denied that. My only point from my previous post was to show that Beast will not be a pushover when it comes to martial arts. He knows how to handle himself and has been doing it for decades. Combined with his own superhuman attributes, his fighting ability is something with which to be reckoned. And they used to show his fighting ability in the comics all the time. Then, bit by bit, he was just cast further back in the background, given a lesser role, and is no longer the threat that he used to be. And he's more powerful now, which is just unfortunate.

Originally posted by Metalmanx


And Beast isn't just an "athlete" either. He's superhuman.

I've come to realize Superhuman is such a vague term its easy for people to throw around and claim a huge physical superiority in vs matches. But being Superhuman is not a massive advantage as most would believe.

Look at it like this....what is the difference between having World Class speed and Olympic class speed in the 100 meter dash? I'll tell you, .01 seconds.

Olympic Class speed is considered by most (but not all) to be 10.14 seconds; If you, at some point in your life have ran at least a 10.14 or below, you have Olympic Class speed. Funny thing is, even if you ran a 10.15, you are NOT Olympic level yet, you are still considered World Class.

My point is, the difference is so marginal is hardly noticeable, and from the naked eye, you would think the 10.15 guy is on the same level as the 10.14 guys (unless their name is Usain Bolt, Asafa Powell or Tyson Gay).

That's what Peak Human is; its that 10.15 guy That's so close the difference isn't even noticeable.

Same thing applies to this thread, Beast is Superhuman, but how far, I mean, is he quicksilver level? No he is not, so comics must decide. And comics have decided that his superhuman abilities are nothing that our top Peak Humans can't handle.

10.14.....10.15.

What makes Beast faster anyways?

I'd like to see these feats that put him above Cap.

Originally posted by Apolloknight
I've come to realize Superhuman is such a vague term its easy for people to throw around and claim a huge physical superiority in vs matches. But being Superhuman is not a massive advantage as most would believe.

Look at it like this....what is the difference between having World Class speed and Olympic class speed in the 100 meter dash? I'll tell you, .01 seconds.

Olympic Class speed is considered by most (but not all) to be 10.14 seconds; If you, at some point in your life have ran at least a 10.14 or below, you have Olympic Class speed. Funny thing is, even if you ran a 10.15, you are NOT Olympic level yet, you are still considered World Class.

That's what Peak Human is; its that 10.15 guy That's so close the difference isn't even noticeable.

Same thing applies to this thread, Beast is Superhuman, but how far, I mean, is he quicksilver level? No he is not, so comics must decide. And comics have decided that his superhuman abilities are nothing that our top Peak Humans can't handle.

10.14.....10.15.

I can see your point, and you make a good good thorough point.
It's just in this case, the difference is about 20x the pressing strength -
if this is Current beast, How much STRONGER does someone have to be to stand a chance against Caps Skill? non-jobbing He would be One shotted by class 100's 2 shotted by class 50's..and so on(not really 1 shotted but u see wht i mean) This is peak human Martial artist vs Class 20 Wild animal...WITH Training FROM the Martial artist and other sources, WITH genius level Interlect. Close if u ask me.

Originally posted by Juk3n
I can see your point, and you make a good good thorough point.
It's just in this case, the difference is about 20x the pressing strength -
if this is Current beast, How much STRONGER does someone have to be to stand a chance against Caps Skill? non-jobbing He would be One shotted by class 100's 2 shotted by class 50's..and so on(not really 1 shotted but u see wht i mean) This is peak human Martial artist vs Class 20 Wild animal...WITH Training FROM the Martial artist and other sources, WITH genius level Interlect. Close if u ask me.

There isn't a single on panel example that would suggest that Beast is anything more then class 2 in strength. NOT A SINGLE ONE. Claiming that he is class 20 is just a wild claim with no basis what-so-ever.

In fact... using on panel examples of strength I'm sure a more compelling arguement could be made for Captain America being stronger the Beast then vice versa.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
There isn't a single on panel example that would suggest that Beast is anything more then class 2 in strength. NOT A SINGLE ONE. Claiming that he is class 20 is just a wild claim with no basis what-so-ever.

In fact... using on panel examples of strength I'm sure a more compelling arguement could be made for Captain America being stronger the Beast then vice versa.

Cap > Beast in Strength?

YOU put Peak Human ABOVE SUPERHUMAN? - look u also make another good point about nothing on paper (yet) about Beasts new Form, but saying Cap > beast in strength JUST because of some poor writing (in some cases) is actually insane, (im not insulting you).

For example .. Everyone remember Bats going toe to toe with Supes for 30 mins while Supes was Hallucinating? Lets give Supes a number - just for this example, lets put him at the 100,000 tonne range, now Bats stood toe to toe with Him for half an hour..does that mean he's even 1/1000 of Supes str and durability? No.

Anyway, like i said in a previous post we're all going by feats so in that respect, Hank has no chance.

For all the fanboys out there .OMG CAP WTFPWNS HIM IN 10.14 SECONDS, TOTALZ FROG STOMPED! 100/10 (im not calling you a fan boy)

-no more money-

According to Beasts latest handbook entry he can lift 10 tons.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
According to Beasts latest handbook entry he can lift 10 tons.

You sir, Win this thread - now pls scan and, we can remove all fan boy posts by default.

Originally posted by Juk3n
Cap > Beast in Strength?

YOU put Peak Human ABOVE SUPERHUMAN? - look u also make another good point about nothing on paper (yet) about Beasts new Form, but saying Cap > beast in strength JUST because of some poor writing (in some cases) is actually insane, (im not insulting you).

For example .. Everyone remember Bats going toe to toe with Supes for 30 mins while Supes was Hallucinating? Lets give Supes a number - just for this example, lets put him at the 100,000 tonne range, now Bats stood toe to toe with Him for half an hour..does that mean he's even 1/1000 of Supes str and durability? No.

Anyway, like i said in a previous post we're all going by feats so in that respect, Hank has no chance.

For all the fanboys out there .OMG CAP WTFPWNS HIM IN 10.14 SECONDS, TOTALZ FROG STOMPED! 100/10 (im not calling you a fan boy)

-no more money-

Captain America is low level superhuman in strength - He has been described numerous times on panel as superhuman AND (unlike Beast) has strength feats that back those statements.

Aside from random handbook entries, I certainly think the argument for Captain America being stronger than Beast, is stronger then anything suggesting the opposite. There has to be some on panel evidence to substantiate the claims that hand books make; in this case there isn't any and I'm not comfortable give Beast the benifit of the doubt.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Captain America is low level superhuman in strength - He has been described numerous times on panel as superhuman AND (unlike Beast) has strength feats that back those statements.

Aside from random handbook entries, I certainly think the argument for Captain America being stronger than Beast, is stronger then anything suggesting the opposite. There has to be some on panel evidence to substantiate the claims that hand books make; in this case there isn't any and I'm not comfortable give Beast the benifit of the doubt. Sorry dude. But that goes against everything the character stands for. Cap. is suppose to be peak human.

Originally posted by Juk3n
You sir, Win this thread - now pls scan and, we can remove all fan boy posts by default.

One thing that is hard to do and that's to go up against the Cap, Logan, and Spidey, supporters.

Originally posted by Juk3n
You sir, Win this thread - now pls scan and, we can remove all fan boy posts by default.



If I got a news letter published that says that I am baseball hat, would you ignore the documented evidence that proves that I am, in fact, not a baseball hat and just assume I really was a baseball hat?

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Sorry dude. But that goes against everything the character stands for. Cap. is suppose to be peak human.

Says who? A hand book... a hand book published years after Captain America's first appearance? There are more instances of Captain America being called superhuman on panel then there are of him being called "peak human."

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Sorry dude. But that goes against everything the character stands for. Cap. is suppose to be peak human.

You said it "Supposed to be peak human", but if we go by on panel and most importantly canon feats, Cap clearly isn't just peak human.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Says who? A hand book... a hand book published years after Captain America's first appearance? There are more instances of Captain America being called superhuman on panel then there are of him being called "peak human." His latest handbook entry from April of 2008 says he's peak human and can lift 800lbs. Beasts handbook entry from February 2008 says he can lift 10 tons. Hanbooks are 'official' and your and my opinion on this matter is not.

Originally posted by Caps Conscience
You said it "Supposed to be peak human", but if we go by on panel and most importantly canon feats, Cap clearly isn't just peak human. So is Cap a superhuman in your view also?

Handbooks are secondary canon (that is being generous) and are intended as companion pieces for collectors, not as works that over ride the primary canon. Nuff' Said?

Originally posted by snoopdogg
His latest handbook entry from April of 2008 says he's peak human and can lift 800lbs. Beasts handbook entry from February 2008 says he can lift 10 tons. Hanbooks are 'official and your and my opinion on this matter is not. Being called "official" is really a moot point as comic book writers and characters don't define actions and limits on past handbook entries, where as they DO consult past showings when writing.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
So is Cap a superhuman in your view also?

I wouldn't put him at super human but he is definitely above peak human. Peak humans don't bust out iron chains and jump from five story buildings without getting hurt. You just can't ignore feats like that just because of where the character started.

Originally posted by Caps Conscience
I wouldn't put him at super human but he is definitely above peak human. Peak humans don't bust out iron chains and jump from five story buildings without getting hurt. You just can't ignore feats like that just because of where the character started. Alot of things that happen in comics don't happen in the real world.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Alot of things that happen in comics don't happen in the real world.

No Sh#t, Dick Tracey! That point is so moot and irrelevant to the topic it's not even funny.

Originally posted by Caps Conscience
No Sh#t, Dick Tracey! That point is so moot and irrelevant to the topic it's not even funny. So do you see Cap as being stronger than Beast?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Says who? A hand book... a hand book published years after Captain America's first appearance? There are more instances of Captain America being called superhuman on panel then there are of him being called "peak human." I might as well ask you also. Is Captain American superhuman?

Marvel assumes you are reading the comic books, they want you to read the Handbooks BUT they aren't going to publish something in their that you need to read to understand what is happening in the actual comic books. If you can't read an issue of x-men and come to the conclusion that Beast has class 10 strength without having been previously influence then what was written in a hand book... then the hand book isn't accurate.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
I might as well ask you also. Is Captain American superhuman?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Captain America is low level superhuman in strength - He has been described numerous times on panel as superhuman AND (unlike Beast) has strength feats that back those statements.


?

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Marvel assumes you are reading the comic books, they want you to read the Handbooks BUT they aren't going to publish something in their that you need to read to understand what is happening in the actual comic books. If you can't read an issue of x-men and come to the conclusion that Beast has class 10 strength without having been previously influence then what was written in a hand book... then the hand book isn't accurate.

- End of the Page -

So you also think Cap is stronger than Beast?

Originally posted by snoopdogg
So you also think Cap is stronger than Beast?

Until I see evidence to contrary.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Until I see evidence to contrary. The handbook writers must have saw something. That's wierd.

Keep in mind - as a Canadian - I find Captain America about as appealing a power tool boring into my brain... but that doesn't change the fact that in spite of being an X-Men fanatic who has read virtually every issue with a even a slight connection to the team (that's a lot of Beast experience), Captain America has more impressive feats of strength.

I mean: what sort of conclusion should I draw form the fact that I have much more experience with the Beast... yet Captain America has consistently shown himself to be stronger?

Originally posted by snoopdogg
The handbook writers must have saw something. That's wierd.

I imagine a strength upgrade was originally part of the "Beast turns feral and more cat like in appearance" pitch... but no one ever actual solidified it in the actual comics. Some editor likely has it in writing on his desk, but it never made into the comics. /shrug

For sh!ts and giggles here's Beasts bio:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Beast1.jpg

I'd scans Cap's but it's too big to get a good scan in my scanner.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
So do you see Cap as being stronger than Beast?

No, but he is definitely stronger than a peak human even in the Comic world. Example Cap is stronger then Batman.

I never thought most "peak humans" in DC and Marvel could really be peak human. They're just as "peak" as someone can get with training. Captain America should be the only real peak human because of the Super Soldier Serum. And if you can become a real peak human by exercising then there's no big deal about the serum anyways. IMO Captain America should have "Conan the Barbarian" stats, like strangling a prehistoric gorilla-man and throwing stuff so heavy that legendary strongmen can barely lift it, or killing a guy with one punch. Very nearly superhuman. While Batman, Daredevil and other guys who got into shape by lifting weights should just be superior to Olympic athletes, but never genuinely Captain America level. "Peak human" should mean something, and not every comic book character who works out a lot should be considerable peak human.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Keep in mind - as a Canadian - I find Captain America about as appealing a power tool boring into my brain...

Im from the UK.




Originally posted by snoopdogg
For sh!ts and giggles here's Beasts bio:
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Beast1.jpg

I'd scans Cap's but it's too big to get a good scan in my scanner.

Well thats great according to that bio Cap is faster than Beat. Cap can run at 60 mph, Beast can run at 40mph, cant be bothered to analyse the rest Beast loses.

Hell its says he has the agility of an ape. What that peak human? Hes also compared to a circus performer, no evidence from his bio proves that he has superhuman agility.

In the books I've read, Beast has always been described as having superhuman agility, and shown as highly agile. Reflexes wise though I don't think he is anything special, And Cap I reckon has him beat in this department

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Im from the UK.






Well thats great according to that bio Cap is faster than Beat. Cap can run at 60 mph, Beast can run at 40mph, cant be bothered to analyse the rest Beast loses.

Cap can run 60 mph? Where was this referenced?

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Cap can run 60 mph? Where was this referenced?


Cap anniversary by Ed Brubaker.

Is that a comic?

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Is that a comic?


Of course. It ties in with his Winter Soldier.

Originally posted by Juk3n
I can see your point, and you make a good good thorough point.
It's just in this case, the difference is about 20x the pressing strength -

I'm not arguing strength, I know beast is stronger, its speed and reflexes that matter, beast could end or severely hinder caps chances of a win, as could cap end beast's chances of a win with a pressure point. Who's gonna get the first attack is what matters.

Originally posted by Juk3n
if this is Current beast, How much STRONGER does someone have to be to stand a chance against Caps Skill?

Again, strength is not a major issue here.

Originally posted by Juk3n
This is peak human Martial artist vs Class 20 Wild animal...

Class 20 is very debatable, and beast is far from a wild animal, this ain't sabretooth.

Originally posted by Juk3n
WITH Training FROM the Martial artist and other sources,

His training in martial arts doesn't even scratch the surface of what cap is capable of.

Seriously.

Originally posted by Juk3n
WITH genius level Interlect

Beast is a genius, just not in tactics. Both men are genius in their own fields, but its caps genius level intellect that will matter more in this fight.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Im from the UK.






Well thats great according to that bio Cap is faster than Beat. Cap can run at 60 mph, Beast can run at 40mph, cant be bothered to analyse the rest Beast loses.

Hell its says he has the agility of an ape. What that peak human? Hes also compared to a circus performer, no evidence from his bio proves that he has superhuman agility. Read it again. It says he has superhuman agility, speed, & endurance.

Originally posted by snoopdogg
Read it again. It says he has superhuman agility, speed, & endurance.

Yeah well like ive been saying peak human and superhuman can mean the same thing the term is often abused when dealing with street level characters. He has superhuman speed but his top speed is 40 mph, thats peak human. But quite frankly peak human, enhanced and superhuman can all be samething when dealing with bios.

Didnt' Beast get his ass kicked by US Agent? A lessor Cap?

Originally posted by fangirl101
Didnt' Beast get his ass kicked by US Agent? A lessor Cap?

When was that?

And by the way, don't knock US Agent. He's not as less of a Cap as you might think.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
When was that?

And by the way, don't knock US Agent. He's not as less of a Cap as you might think.

The infinity crusade I think. Been years.

Originally posted by fangirl101
The infinity crusade I think. Been years.

What he lost to both Cap and US Agent?

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
What he lost to both Cap and US Agent?
us agent is below cap in overall fighting prowess but his strength and durability is superhuman since his augmentation by the power broker.he can lift ten tons, he is no slouch.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
us agent is below cap in overall fighting prowess but his strength and durability is superhuman since his augmentation by the power broker.he can lift ten tons, he is no slouch.

Hes still not as good as Cap.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Hes still not as good as Cap. of coarse, just stating that beating him isn't a walk in the park.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Hes still not as good as Cap.


Indeed. Now a days Cap looks superior in there fights. Not there strength stats of course but there fights Cap really makes him look like a rookie.

Which speaks volume on Cap's skills considering USagent is a veteran in the field and has even received training from Taskmaster.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
of coarse, just stating that beating him isn't a walk in the park.


Your right in the beginning Cap did indeed struggle with him now adays not so much and I think this has to do with Cap's ability to adapt to the opponents that he fights.

Well thats it then Beast loses the majority.....if he has lost to US Agent. Hes lost to Cap and a lesser Cap.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Well thats it then Beast loses the majority.....if he has lost to US Agent. Hes lost to Cap and a lesser Cap.


To be fair unlike these Beast supporters. In that fight USAgent sneak attacked Beast IIRC.

But no matter as Cap did dominate Beast in there fight anyhow.