Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

Is there any power in comic history greater than The Brothers? These were the two entities that battled during the Marvel vs DC cross.

Jack Kirby and Stan Lee ftw.

The Living Tribunal is way above them.

Originally posted by Silent Master
The Living Tribunal is way above them.


They dwarf they Living Tribunal in power.

Originally posted by Madvillain
They dwarf they Living Tribunal in power.

Try again

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/55/120965052_0cf1dd12f0_o.jpg

Originally posted by Silent Master
Try again

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/55/120965052_0cf1dd12f0_o.jpg

Do you even understand the context of that scan?

They aren't really in the palm of his hand. In this panel he's actually contemplating on what he and Spectre must do to thwart the brothers. They are the sum total of both DC and Marvel. They easily dwarf LT.

http://img143.imageshack.us/img143/162/bro2xa7.th.jpg


Try again kiddo.

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/4651/bro19mk1.th.jpg

You are wrong young man.

You are the one that isn't understanding the scan.

Originally posted by Silent Master
You are the one that isn't understanding the scan.

Explain the scan please, young man.

You seem not to even understand a scan you posted yourself.

I understand it just fine, you on the other hand have proven that you dont.

You probably don't even know where the scan if from.

Originally posted by Silent Master
I understand it just fine, you on the other hand have proven that you dont.

You probably don't even know where the scan if from.


See how he skates around the question. You fool noone young man.



Atleast understand a scan before you post it.

I understand it just fine, I just don't feel like holding the hand of obvious mental inferior.

BTW, do you know where the scan is from?

LT and the Spectre are below the brothers.

Even the guy that started their respect thread acknowledges there was a retcon

Originally posted by Galan007
Retcon simply means that Marvel or DC published comics after ones' that were already published, that changed the outcome of the story. Or they made a certain comic no longer cannon.

For example:
Before their retcon, the Brothers were the most powerful beings to ever exist, they were the Gods', and LT/Spectre had no clue that they existed.

After the Brothers retcon, Marvel published comics that made it seem as though LT/Spectre were responsible for them the entire time, thus changing the story at a much later date.

The most powerful being in the mainstream Marvel universe is LT.

Originally posted by Madvillain

They aren't really in the palm of his hand.
In this panel
he's actually contemplating on what he and Spectre must do to thwart the brothers.
I have to disagree there good friend.

That's the LT holding the power of Two Marvel MegaverseS in one hand,
it has nothing to do with the Spectre btw.
Although yes, it's obviously an allusion to "Spectre"
that's because the Brothers were Retconned in that issue
only 3 months after DC vs Marvel.

I always figured Marvel just wanted to ease their transition from embodiments of Marvel/DC,
to just representing Two Marvel MegaverseS: (in the LT's 2006 bio)

http://img102.imageshack.us/img102/1328/omniis2yp2.th.jpg

Also notice, any allusion to the "consultant's" identity is ignored this time.

Originally posted by Madvillain
They are the sum total of both DC and Marvel. They easily dwarf LT.
During your scans they were the sum total,
but not during his scan where the LT holds them in his hand.

Btw.

During Marvel vs DC, the LT & Spectre nearly obliterated both Brothers,
by merging them, and keeping them merged ... forcibly.

(the writers forgot about that when they made Access say they were insects to them)

... Company Cross-overs.

I also believe all the beings that have erased the totality of their respective verses
can take out the Brothers.

That I know of from DC - Mxy/Parallax/classic AM yall fill in the rest, I'm sure Mike can.

Marvel - Alien Entity/Wanda/Sise-neg/THOTI/Genis&Entropy/Beyonders to name a few.

LT > *brothers*

This is ridiculous. It took the combined might of both specter and lt to slow them down. They are not above them.

I've just created a character with the power set of being more powerful than them.

Originally posted by Sirius77
It took the combined might of both specter and lt to slow them down.
Actually LT & Spectre merged the Brothers by force,
this nearly obliterated both Brothers.

Luckily for the Brothers,
Access who had harnessed some of their power,
helped LT & Spectre separate them properly,
otherwise, the Brothers would've been stomped inadvertantly.

in my opinion, pre retcon Beyonder .

http://www.marveldirectory.com/pictures/individuals/b_1d/beyonder.gif
Although not native to this dimension, the Beyonder the most powerful being ever to exist in the Marvel Universe. In the original Secret Wars storyline, he was the be-all and end-all of his universe that took corporeal form to better understand the nature of human beings.

Originally posted by Sirius77
This is ridiculous. It took the combined might of both specter and lt to slow them down. They are not above them.

That's why they call it a retcon.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually LT & Spectre merged the Brothers by force,
this nearly obliterated both Brothers.

Luckily for the Brothers,
Access who had harnessed some of their power,
helped LT & Spectre separate them properly,
otherwise, the Brothers would've been stomped inadvertantly.

After the retcon perhaps. But not originally.

Originally posted by Sirius77
After the retcon perhaps. But not originally.
Originally, the Brothers were nearly obliterated by Spectre/LT.

In fact, the LT/Spectre momentarily owned the original Brothers.

^^ no origionally the Spectre and the Living Tribunal were bairly able to seperate the brothers, they were absolutly inafective, and thats why they had to let (help) Batman and Captian America save the 2 universes.

The Quiz.


Okay, the thread is over, I won. Just end it now.

If you are going to make an idiotic thread for pointless, retconned characters, then, hell, I'm going to answer with a character who, if I want to, can beat, literally, anyone. What a stupid idea for a verses battle.

Originally posted by tjcoady
The Quiz.


Okay, the thread is over, I won. Just end it now.

If you are going to make an idiotic thread for pointless, retconned characters, then, hell, I'm going to answer with a character who, if I want to, can beat, literally, anyone. What a stupid idea for a verses battle.


So don't respond to it, and go sit in a corner and suck your thumb!

IMO you have to go above LT and Spectre in power to bring the pre retcon Brothers (I assume it's them the thread is concerning) down.

Yes it is the Pre-Retconned versions as I was unaware that they were depowered.

ON PANEL,

LT and Spectre,

completely Remaking the Totality of the PRE-Retcon Brothers:

............................................................................................

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/1752/one262ai.th.jpg

"The Brothers are MERGING Realities, combining Universes"


(Actually we find out in the Next Issue, that the Living Tribunal and Spectre were the ones that MERGED the TWO Universes BY FORCE!)

............................................................................................


When LT and Spectre MERGED the TWO Universes/Brothers, (by Force)

the Brothers became ONE Universe called the Amalgam Universe

(basically a Mixture of BOTH)

http://img300.imageshack.us/img300/2343/br1bn2.th.jpg

............................................................................................

http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/2453/br2sj1.th.jpg

"He had thought the MERGING was the DOING of the Brothers, it was NOT"

"because of the War, ONE of the Universes faced being hurled INTO OBLIVION"

............................................................................................

http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/7877/dcvsmarvel2au6.th.jpg

"And the Cosmic Guardians ... the Living Tribunal and Spectre,

are HOLDING it ALL TOGETHER" (by Force)

"Their effort Created a Amalgam Universe ... the Brother aren't Happy about it"

............................................................................................


This can't be denied. swank

Bah,

the LT & Spectre nearly Obliterated these overhyped Brothers:

.................................................................................


The above scans are right before the LT & Spectre released the Brothers with Access' help.

This is the aftermath:

.................................................................................


"We're using it to Restore the Universes"

http://img105.imageshack.us/img105/1585/86596412tv2.th.jpg


After the separation was exactly One split down the middle of Two Realities. (Brothers)

http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/1273/91283493rx4.th.jpg

.................................................................................


Immediately afterwards:

http://img476.imageshack.us/img476/1773/85611252wt1.th.jpg

"The Universe that was an Amalgam of Two Others blows apart"

"We're back to the Universes co-existing"

.................................................................................

This is further proof,
that these Pre-Retcon Brothers not only got owned by LT & Spectre,
but were nearly Obliterated in the process by LT & Spectre:

........................................................................................

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/731/b1ll3.th.jpg

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated,
then the BUM helped me Jump someplace IN-BETWEEN"

"Someplace where NO Aspect of the Brothers existed"

"We're still here indicates our Universes coexisting rather than smashed together"

........................................................................................


When DID it LOOK like the Universes would be Obliterated?

So we can make sure it was the Brothers themselves, about to be destroyed:

http://img106.imageshack.us/img106/5885/22723872nt9.th.jpg

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/731/b1ll3.th.jpg

Right there,

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated,
then the BUM helped me Jump someplace IN-BETWEEN"


I think we can agree "The Universes" were the Brothers ey?

........................................................................................

http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/8396/50880268al7.th.jpg

And there is the "BUM, (future self of Access)
that helped him Jump someplace IN-BETWEEN,
when the Universes were about to be Obliterated.

When did this happen?


When the Brothers were MERGED by LT & Spectre, it's all clear On Panel.


........................................................................................


........................................................................................


Let's make sure we understand!


The Living Tribunal and Spectre nearly Obliterated the Brothers:

........................................................................................


LT and Spectre even say,

http://img118.imageshack.us/img118/6078/b2ze1.th.jpg

The Universes are momentarily safe"

"It is nothing short of miraculous they exist at all"

........................................................................................


Catch LT and Spectre trying to do this to TOAA or the Presence

Who ever these Brothers were supposed to be, they sure weren't "Supreme."

I sure hope you aren't implying that Spectre and LT>The Brothers...

Originally posted by King Kandy
I sure hope you aren't implying that Spectre and LT>The Brothers...

I think he is and with good reason. Mr Master may be correct, and saw something that I didn't, when I read the cross over. It doesn't make sense as the were the Avatars of both DC and Marvel though.

Right but it's flat out stated that the borthers are more powerful then them.

Only one problem with your scans master, it says universes repeatedly and we know that what was merged was the DC and Marvel Universe to create the Amalgam Universe, it was nothing short of a Miracle that the Universes (DC and Marvel) survived like you say. However the effort that Spectre and LT made, was to make sure that one of the universes (dc ore Marvel) wouldn't have been destroyed by the brothers in there little contest.

And why would LT and Spectre need Access help if they truly had the power to force them together then they should also have the power to separate them again but they haven't. That's right they couldn't stop the brothers from separating and in that way one of the universes would have been destroyed. Access LT and Spectre needed batman and Captain America to separate the universes and prevent momentarily Armageddon. And why would they find it a miracle that the universes existed if it was them performing the Merging and separating.

http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro13cj6.jpg

Also as the LT says in this scan
http://img118.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b2ze1.jpg

"We have only delayed the Inevitable"

Also LT accepted fairly earlier in the comic that he couldn't right the wrong that was been done.
http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro1uh2.jpg
http://img143.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro2xa7.jpg

Hell they where powerless to do anything, by there own accounts.

Also two Omniscient beings realize in the battle between the Brothers that powers are unleashed that none have ever witnessed before and the Living Tribunal and Spectre is Awed.

http://img89.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro15qz2.jpg
http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro16bi3.jpg

Also the brothers completely redo the damage

http://img244.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro24xy4.jpg

Marvel appendix on the matter notice there powerlevel.

http://www.marvunapp.com/Appendix/brothers.htm

Originally posted by King Kandy
Right but it's flat out stated that the borthers are more powerful then them.
True,
but what would you prefer as evidence to prove something?

A statement? ... or a visual display of one's statement?

The fact is,
that the LT & Spectre nearly obliterated both Brothers,
AFTER,
owning both Brothers by completely Remaking/restructuring them by force.

(whether or not the Bros were more powerful is inconsequential)

The fact is,
that the LT & Spectre could've wiped them out.


So Protege can copy the Brothers' powers and stalemate them,
and Scathan can probably take them out even quicker.

I'm figuring Miky/Lucy and others above Spectre can do the same.

stoned

Originally posted by Utrigita
Only one problem with your scans master,
it says universes repeatedly
and we know that what was merged was the DC and Marvel Universe
to create the Amalgam Universe,
it was nothing short of a Miracle that the Universes (DC and Marvel) survived like you say.
However the effort that Spectre and LT made,
was to make sure that one of the universes (dc ore Marvel)
wouldn't have been destroyed by the brothers in there little contest.
How does this change the fact that LT & Spectre DID merge the Brothers by force,
and nearly obliterated Both Brothers in the process?
Originally posted by Utrigita
And why would LT and Spectre need Access help if they truly had the power to force them together
then they should also have the power to separate them again but they haven't. That's right they couldn't stop the brothers from separating
and in that way one of the universes would have been destroyed.
So, you're gonna try and dismiss that the LT & Spectre merged the Brothers?

It's on panel dude, you just saw it.

On the other hand,
who told you the LT & Spectre couldn't separate the Brothers?

LT & Spectre only needed Access' help to separate the Brothers SAFELY.
cause otherwise,
the separation by LT & Spectre alone would've cause their obliteration.

As also stated On Panel.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Access LT and Spectre needed batman and Captain America to separate the universes
and prevent momentarily Armageddon.
Actually the Brothers had been separated by LT/Spectre and Access,
before Cap and Bats play their parts in the end.

(they were overlapping ... but separated)
Originally posted by Utrigita
And why would they find it a miracle that the universes existed
if it was them performing the Merging and separating.

http://img148.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro13cj6.jpg
Again, as you can see in the scan,
Access is helping them separate the Brothers safely.

LT & Spectre said it was a miracle,
because BOTH BrotherS were literally on their death bed
due to LT & Spectre's merger.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Also as the LT says in this scan
http://img118.imageshack.us/my.php?image=b2ze1.jpg

"We have only delayed the Inevitable"
Ok,
this only continues to prove how intense the hurting LT & Spectre put on the Brothers was.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Also LT accepted fairly earlier in the comic that he couldn't right the wrong that was been done.
http://img440.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro1uh2.jpg
http://img143.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro2xa7.jpg
Statements vs action ... Evidently he was wrong wasn't he?

Proved when Spectre and himself Remade both Brothers.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Hell they where powerless to do anything, by there own accounts.
So let's take into consideration what they said,
not what they did.

I can't agree with that logic friend.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Also two Omniscient beings realize in the battle between the Brothers that powers are unleashed that none have ever witnessed before and the Living Tribunal and Spectre is Awed.

http://img89.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro15qz2.jpg
http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro16bi3.jpg
Nice.

I wonder how much "awe" they had when they realized they were able to
not only force merge BOTH Brothers, thus restructuring them entirely,
and afterwards further realizing
they also had the power to Obliterate Both Brothers via said forced merger.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Also the brothers completely redo the damage
http://img244.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro24xy4.jpg
That's at the end,
the merger was gone by then,
and the LT & Spectre were not trying to keep them merged either at this point.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Marvel appendix on the matter notice there powerlevel.

On Panel >>> Bios ... you know that.

Bios are meaningless if they contradict On Panel depictions.

A discussion we will never agree on.

Originally posted by Mr Master
How does this change the fact that LT & Spectre DID merge the Brothers by force,
and nearly obliterated Both Brothers in the process?

The brothers wasn't near anything that shows them being obliterated, the universe that was about to destroyed was Marvel so in a last ditch effort they merged the brothers, then with the help of Access the Brothers was separated again, All the work Spectre and LT accomplished was only to delay the brothers, so that marvel wouldn't be wiped from existance.

http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro11tr3.jpg


So, you're gonna try and dismiss that the LT & Spectre merged the Brothers?

Not really No, I'm trying to show that because LT and Spectre momentially can merge the brothers, they still couldn't separate them, they couldn't directly confront them and only delay them from destroying the Marvel Universe, they would not for long have been capable of holding the brothers together, they couldn't separate the brothers by themselves. Merged them sure, but alot of other things are imo left out, and this in no way point to LT and Spectre being capable of defeating the Brothers

It's on panel dude, you just saw it.

I did yes.

On the other hand,
who told you the LT & Spectre couldn't separate the Brothers?

Who told you they could, because on Panel they needed Access.

LT & Spectre only needed Access' help to separate the Brothers SAFELY.
cause otherwise,
the separation by LT & Spectre alone would've cause their obliteration.

Not exactly the Brothers would have survived but the Marvel universe would have been history since marvel was the loser of the internal fight between the brothers.

As also stated On Panel.

Actually the Brothers had been separated by LT/Spectre and Access,
before Cap and Bats play their parts in the end.

(they were overlapping ... but separated)

I must disagree Access himself stats that the power Captain America and Batman had was required to separate the brothers.

http://img105.imageshack.us/my.php?image=86596412tv2.jpg

Also you stats so yourself on the previous page.

The above scans are right before the LT & Spectre released the Brothers with Access' help. And whos help did Access require...

Again, as you can see in the scan,
Access is helping them separate the Brothers safely.

Surely to make sure that marvel isn't obliterated, The brothers isn't mentioned in a single of your scans, expect the instance where they isn't happy, els it's strictly universes that is refered to in all the scans it's the universes that is in danger it's not the brothers.

LT & Spectre said it was a miracle,
because BOTH BrotherS were literally on their death bed
due to LT & Spectre's merger.

No it was a miracle that the universes (DC Marvel) survived not the brothers.

http://img470.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro14in8.jpg

Universes again.

Ok,
this only continues to prove how intense the hurting LT & Spectre put on the Brothers was.

Actually no, The Inevitable is the destruction of either the DC ore Marvel. And why would LT and Spectre consider making the brothers accept to coexist if they could destroy them, the only simply explanation for this turn they couldn't destroy them.

http://img137.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro11tr3.jpg

Statements vs action ... Evidently he was wrong wasn't he?

Not from my point of view they was still like dust specs in the battle where the brothers was actually serious.

Proved when Spectre and himself Remade both Brothers.

With help from Access and again again Universes.

So let's take into consideration what they said,
not what they did.

Yes lets I guess that is why they couldn't stop the brothers from fighting.

I can't agree with that logic friend.

It's okay.

Nice.

I wonder how much "awe" they had when they realized they were able to
not only force merge BOTH Brothers, thus restructuring them entirely,
and afterwards further realizing
they also had the power to Obliterate Both Brothers via said forced merger.

Most of what you are saying here I have already disproved Master the main point is that every time universes are brought up by the narrator you think that it means the brothers, we know that isn't the case since it is a strictly reference to the DC and Marvel Universe the Brothers are always mentioned by name not as universes.

That's at the end,
the merger was gone by then,
and the LT & Spectre were not trying to keep them merged either at this point.

Because the Brothers had conciled on there own without the help from LT and Spectre.

On Panel >>> Bios ... you know that.

Bios are meaningless if they contradict On Panel depictions.

Which it IMO doesn't.

The questions are, why, in the first panel, were the Spectre and the Livinging Tribunal capable of merging the Brothers, while in the other they were as insects trying to stop the Brothers's sword from colliding.

There wasnt a whole lot about that crossover that made sense.
The brother's power were supposed to be greater than LT and Spectre, but LT and Spectres actions almost killed them.
And......

Spiderman beating Superboy

Wolverine beating Lobo

Storm beating Wonder Woman

I mean......come on lol

Originally posted by Unnatural-POWER
There wasnt a whole lot about that crossover that made sense.
The brother's power were supposed to be greater than LT and Spectre, but LT and Spectres actions almost killed them.
And......
No action almost killed the Brothers, it was the universe was about to end. And the Brothers existed before creation.

Anyone from Anywhere?

Then I pick "The Guy who can beat the Brothers" from a story I just made up.

Originally posted by Endless Mike
Anyone from Anywhere?

Then I pick "The Guy who can beat the Brothers" from a story I just made up.
We have a winner.

Actually SC beat him to it.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I've just created a character with the power set of being more powerful than them.

Originally posted by Utrigita
A discussion we will never agree on.
I'm not debating this though,
it's quite simple,
the Brothers got owned & nearly obliterated by the LT & Spectre,
thus,
the Brothers were not "supreme beings" (as in Toaa/Presence or THOTI) ...
Originally posted by Utrigita
The brothers wasn't near anything that shows them being obliterated,
Really? We must be reading different arcs then.
Originally posted by Utrigita
the universe that was about to destroyed was Marvel
so in a last ditch effort they merged the brothers,
Yea,

that's when the LT & Spectre owned the Brothers by Remaking them entirely.
Originally posted by Utrigita
then with the help of Access the Brothers was separated again,

All the work Spectre and LT accomplished was only to delay the brothers,
so that marvel wouldn't be wiped from existance.
Nah, actually both UniverseS (Brothers)
were going to be obliterated after the merger:

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/731/b1ll3.th.jpg

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

Originally posted by Utrigita
I'm trying to show that because LT and Spectre momentially can merge the brothers,
they still couldn't separate them
SAFELY you mean? ... I agree.

But all the LT & Spectre needed to do was let go of each others' arms,
and both Brothers would've been Obliterated via the merger.
Originally posted by Utrigita
they couldn't directly confront them
Yea, but they can warp their totality, and nearly Obliterate them both in the process.
Originally posted by Utrigita
and only delay them from destroying the Marvel Universe,
Again, after the merger,
BOTH UniverseS (Brothers) were in danger of being Obliterated.

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/731/b1ll3.th.jpg

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated"

..........................................................................................................

You do know the embodiment of both Universes were the Brothers right?

The Brothers ARE the personification of the Universes Access is talking about.

Originally posted by Utrigita
they would not for long have been capable of holding the brothers together
Where is it stated that LT & Spectre were not able to hold the Brothers for long?
Originally posted by Utrigita
they couldn't separate the brothers by themselves.
SAFELY? ... I agree.

Otherwise, the LT & Spectre only had to let go.

(of course, this would've caused the Brothers to be Obliterated)
Originally posted by Utrigita
Merged them sure,
and this in no way
point to LT and Spectre being capable of defeating the Brothers
The LT & Spectre may not be able to defeat the Brothers,

but the LT & Spectre sure can warp the shit out of the Brothers,
and nearly Obliterate them in the process.

But defeat? ... Never.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Who told you they could, because on Panel they needed Access.
To do it SAFELY? ... I agree. ... No other reason.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Not exactly the Brothers would have survived
but the Marvel universe would have been history
since marvel was the loser of the internal fight between the brothers.
I disagree.

Access said ... "When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

Not when it looked like one Universe would be obliterated.

..........................................................................................................

And again,
the Brothers ARE the embodiment/personification/totality of the Universes.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Surely to make sure that marvel isn't obliterated
"Marvel?"

Again, BOTH Brothers were merged together,
BOTH Brothers were about to be Obliterated.

Only one Universe (Marvel) was in danger before the merger,
the whole point of the merger was to save Marvel,
but instead, ... the merger nearly Obliterated BOTH Brothers.
Originally posted by Utrigita
The brothers isn't mentioned in a single of your scans,
expect the instance where they isn't happy,
els it's strictly universes that is refered to in all the scans
it's the universes that is in danger it's not the brothers.
Ut. ... The Brothers ARE the Universes:

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/2107/one15qh5.th.jpg

"There's Our Universe and there's this Other ONE, like Ours but different"

..........................................................................................................

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/3535/one17lg8.th.jpg

"There are these TWO gods, Entities, ONE in each Universe ... BROTHERS"

"They're the Embodiment of Everything in their Universe"

..........................................................................................................

Originally posted by Utrigita
No it was a miracle that the universes (DC Marvel) survived not the brothers.

Universes again.
The Brothers ARE the Universes ... again.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Actually no, The Inevitable is the destruction of either the DC ore Marvel.
Which are the Brothers, since they embody DC/Marvel.

Read the scans right above, there's no getting around that fact.
Originally posted by Utrigita
And why would LT and Spectre consider making the brothers accept to coexist
if they could destroy them,
the only simply explanation for this turn they couldn't destroy them.
Why would the LT & Spectre want to destroy them though?

The LT & Spectre are the respective "guardians" of their company in this story.

The LT & Spectre want the Brothers (Two Universes = DC/Marvel) to survive, not die.
..........................................................................................................

"Couldn't destroy them?"

On Panel the Brothers were nearly Obliterated by them,
so I don't understand how you came to that conclusion.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Not from my point of view
they was still like dust specs
in the battle where the brothers was actually serious.
So where is it stated
that the Brothers were joking
or letting themselves get completely warped by LT & Spectre
which nearly lead to their Obliteration?

Actually,
that scenario that depicts LT/Spectre as insects
just goes to show how absurd This cross-over is.

1. The LT & Spectre act as if there's nothing they can do.
2. The LT & Spectre merge the Brothers by force, and nearly Obliterate Both Brothers.
3. The LT & Spectre are insects.

... No wonder this garbage was retconned.

Originally posted by Utrigita
With help from Access and again again Universes.
The LT & Spectre didn't need Access at all to merge the Brothers,
so you should recant that statement.

And again, again, the Brothers ARE the Universes.
Originally posted by Utrigita
Yes lets I guess that is why they couldn't stop the brothers from fighting.
Right, but they were able to merge them,
and nearly Obliterate them both via the merger.

Which is why the story is garbage, it contradicts itself.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Most of what you are saying here I have already disproved Master
dontgetit
Originally posted by Utrigita
the main point is that every time universes are brought up by the narrator
you think that it means the brothers,

we know that isn't the case since
it is a strictly reference to the DC and Marvel Universe
the Brothers are always mentioned by name not as universes.
AGAIN!

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/2802/one205vn.th.jpg

"TWO Whole Universes EMBODIED in these BROTHERS"

..........................................................................................................

Let's not tread this part of the debate anymore,
otherwise you're willingly ignoring on panel art/character/narrator statements.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Because the Brothers had conciled on there own without the help from LT and Spectre.
The Brothers were only in existence at that point
because of the LT/Spectre and Access' help.

When Thanos took control over the Heart of the Universe, universal control was also stated on panel.

Originally posted by Astner
When Thanos took control over the Heart of the Universe,
universal control was also stated on panel.

When dealing with everything (Omniverse)
"The" Universe, refers to the Marvel Universe (everything Marvel)

This is why Thanos became one with the Omniverse (Marvel Universe)

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/4411/th10kz1.th.jpg

"I was Everything ... bonded to Omni-Reality"


Thanos also states he was "an Asteroid in the Void, shortly after the Big Bang"

This clearly tells us he's dealing with all of Marvel's historical Time.

.........................................................................................

This is why Marvel tells us,
Thanos erased the Marvel Universe, then re-created it.

Towards the bottom under (The Ends of The Universe)

http://www.marvel.com/universe/Marvel_Universe

Originally posted by Mr Master
Access said ... "When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

Not when it looked like one Universe would be obliterated.
Are you sure the universes aren't just the alternate universes associated with marvel?

Originally posted by King Kandy
Are you sure the universes aren't just the alternate universes associated with marvel?
Impossible.
There was never any other Universe
ever referenced/mentioned or even alluded to in This story.
Just Two Universes as you already saw in the scans I posted above.
Those Two Universes were the Brothers.
(you must know this, unless you skipped my above post)

I'm absolutely certain Access is talking about Two Universes (Brother Red & Blue)

After all, that's when it seemed like the Universes would be Obliterated,
when the Brothers were merged by LT & Spectre.

Why would only Marvel suffer if BOTH Brothers have been warped completely.

Again,

Marvel was in danger alone BEFORE the warp/merger,
that was the purpose of the merger, (to save Marvel)
instead,
the merger ended up nearly Obliterating them Both.

.....................................................................................

This is why Access associates the UniverseS with the Brothers in the SAME panel:

http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/548/ac1ce4.th.jpg

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

The bum helped me jump someplace ... in-between

Someplace where no Aspect of the Brothers existed"

.....................................................................................

Right there, we see Access had to enter a place
where, "no Aspect of the Brothers existed"
Interesting,
this happened exactly when it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

Why?

Because the "Universes" means Both Brothers, which means everything.

This is Why Access went were?

"Where no Aspect of the Brothers existed"

.....................................................................................

On top of this, in the bottom of that same page,
we have Batman:

http://img176.imageshack.us/img176/5121/ac2im7.th.jpg

"The Fact that WE'RE still Here
indicates our rather odd status quo has been restored ...
OUR Universes coexisting rather than mashed together."

.....................................................................................

Batman is referring to His Universe being Obliterated aswell,
again, this is obvious, I mean ... it was Both Brothers that were warped entirely.

Now we know Batman's Universe
is Not one of Marvel's associated alternate universes.

So I guess we agree, ey K.

For Thanos, omnireality is a fleeting term. As he had no control what so ever over Atzera's dimension, hence he was limited.

As for the universes ending and Brothers almost dying.

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/3149/brocs3.jpg

Now this indicates that the Brothers's battle have destroyed all creation before. And appearently it did not kill them, and Access specificly said the universes, and not the Brothers, don't twist the facts.

I do not know everything, the series is quite blurry, but as I've comperhend it.

The place inbetween (the Brothers) where no aspect of the Brothers existed were the Amalgam, the reality of the fused Brothers.

Access is known in Amalgam as a dimension/time travler.
The bum, was his future self and it was he, who have experienced the event that helped him reach the powers of the Amalgam universe. That was enough to separate the Brothers without causing any damage to the surrounding enviorment.

Neither LT, nor Spectre, would beat the 'pre-retcon' Brothers.

Only a God > God could do that.

Originally posted by Galan007
Neither LT, nor Spectre, would beat the 'pre-retcon' Brothers.

Only a God > God could do that.
Yeah like Son-Goku from Dragonball or something.

Originally posted by Astner
Yeah like Son-Goku from Dragonball or something. Precisely!

Originally posted by Mr Master
I'm not debating this though,
it's quite simple,
the Brothers got owned & nearly obliterated by the LT & Spectre,
thus,
the Brothers were not "supreme beings" (as in Toaa/Presence or THOTI) ...

Then why is LT and Spectre there Guardians???

http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro7pm7.jpg

Really what was they then a cheap version of eternity because that is what you make them look like.

Really? We must be reading different arcs then.

I Don't think so but never mind.

Yea,

that's when the LT & Spectre owned the Brothers by Remaking them entirely.

So fusing them together is to remake them completely and owned isn't exactly what happend "a last ditch effort" is normally used in the military to explain either a last desperate attempt ore a final stand. Imo it was a last desparate attempt made by the LT and the Spectre to try and stop marvel from being removed.

Nah, actually both UniverseS (Brothers)
were going to be obliterated after the merger:

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/731/b1ll3.th.jpg

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

Where is it said that if the Universes was destroyed, the Brothers would die as well, Please show me such a Scan where it clearly stats that Destruction of the universes = Destruction of the brothers.

SAFELY you mean? ... I agree.

But all the LT & Spectre needed to do was let go of each others' arms,
and both Brothers would've been Obliterated via the merger.

No, one of the universes again, where does it say that if you destroy both universes you automaticly destroy the brothers???

Yea, but they can warp their totality, and nearly Obliterate them both in the process.

Again what can I say Universes.

Again, after the merger,
BOTH UniverseS (Brothers) were in danger of being Obliterated.

http://img75.imageshack.us/img75/731/b1ll3.th.jpg

"When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated"

..........................................................................................................

Actually the brothers have survived the previous destruction of there Universe.
http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro5vc5.jpg
http://img207.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bro6dw0.jpg

There is no reason to believe that they wouldn't survive another destruction, and why would they throw in a battle between the two realms if they knew that it would lead to the death of one of them??

You do know the embodiment of both Universes were the Brothers right?

So in your openion they are nothing then Eternity and Kismet???

The Brothers ARE the personification of the Universes Access is talking about.

Then I wonder why it is constantly Universes that is brought up instead of Brothers.

Where is it stated that LT & Spectre were not able to hold the Brothers for long?

If they could hold the brothers for all eternity would you then care to tell me why they separated them???

SAFELY? ... I agree.



Otherwise, the LT & Spectre only had to let go.

(of course, this would've caused the Brothers to be Obliterated)

Safely to ensure that either universe (Marvel ore DC) wouldn't go down the drain. And why would it concern LT and Spectre that it would destroy the brothers if they let go since there prime objective was to stop them?

The LT & Spectre may not be able to defeat the Brothers,

Which speak for the brothers being above them when they are actually going to take the battle serious LT and Spectre couldn't do a single thing to oppose them.

but the LT & Spectre sure can warp the shit out of the Brothers,
and nearly Obliterate them in the process.

In a last ditch effort they warped them to delay the destruction of the marvel Universe.

But defeat? ... Never.

So you agree that Spectre and LT couldn't defeat the Brothers in a straight up match, then why are we even debating this

To do it SAFELY? ... I agree. ... No other reason.

Again Same question why would LT and Spectre have any interest in saving the brothers?

I disagree.

Access said ... "When it looked like the Universes would be Obliterated

Not when it looked like one Universe would be obliterated.

..........................................................................................................

Bad frash my bad, if LT and Spectre would just have let go then both Universes would have been destroyed hence LT and Spectres reason for saying that they had only delayed the brothers, and it was a miracle that the Universes not the brothers existed.

And again,
the Brothers ARE the embodiment/personification/totality of the Universes.

Of there company. Not there universes.

Classic Beyonder
Thanos HOTI
Infinity Being
Presence
Classic Molecule Man.

Originally posted by Mr Master
"Marvel?"

Again, BOTH Brothers were merged together,
BOTH Brothers were about to be Obliterated.

Only one Universe (Marvel) was in danger before the merger,
the whole point of the merger was to save Marvel,
but instead, ... the merger nearly Obliterated BOTH Brothers.

All I read it that both universes is about to be destroyed, ever the brothers, when the universes is merged, the narrator stats that the Brothers isn't happy about it because that wasn't the outcome they had expected, I don't read them being scared afraid ore in any other way fearing Obliviration do you???

Ut. ... The Brothers ARE the Universes:

http://img255.imageshack.us/img255/2107/one15qh5.th.jpg

"There's Our Universe and there's this Other ONE, like Ours but different"

..........................................................................................................

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/3535/one17lg8.th.jpg

"There are these TWO gods, Entities, ONE in each Universe ... BROTHERS"

"They're the Embodiment of Everything in their Universe"

..........................................................................................................

Sorry master but I have always found that second scan you posted rather funny allow me to quote it in it's totality.

"There are these two um gods, ore whatever you want to call them one in each universe Brothers I guess they are like the embodiment of everything in there universe."

Not to bring your scan down ore anyhing but I have just always found it funny...

The Brothers ARE the Universes ... again.

Which are the Brothers, since they embody DC/Marvel.

Marvel and DC thats certainly better, because they represent the companies that is what they embodiment, eternity doesn't to my knowlegde embody the Marvel company does he...

Read the scans right above, there's no getting around that fact.

Again show me a Clear scan that says "when the Universes dies so does the Brothers" ore something along the line.

Why would the LT & Spectre want to destroy them though?

my question is why wouldn't they??? Spectre and LT is made to protect there universe and to stop this sort of confrontation fact is they couldn't stop it, they could stop it momentially but completely

The LT & Spectre are the respective "guardians" of their company in this story.

Yes the Brothers (companies) guardiens as shown in a scan above somewhere.

The LT & Spectre want the Brothers (Two Universes = DC/Marvel) to survive, not die.
..........................................................................................................

"Couldn't destroy them?"

On Panel the Brothers were nearly Obliterated by them,
so I don't understand how you came to that conclusion.

I don't quiet understand how you came to your own either, again as said before this is something that we shouldn't begin discuss because I wouldn't back down I think the scans clearly speaks for LT and Spectre acting to save the Universes not the brothers because the Brothers is about to destroy the Marvel Universe because it lost the fight. You think that the brothers are equal to the Universes that is mentioned several times I disagree always have and always will simply because I read it entirely differently then you do.

So where is it stated
that the Brothers were joking
or letting themselves get completely warped by LT & Spectre
which nearly lead to their Obliteration?

No where, it that stated that the brothers was joking all that is stated is that the Brothers wasn't happy about the merging nothing more nothing less.

Actually,
that scenario that depicts LT/Spectre as insects
just goes to show how absurd This cross-over is.

Well it is absurb but it also shows that LT and Spectre couldn't stop the brothers from fighting when they decided to settle the battle there own way.

1. The LT & Spectre act as if there's nothing they can do.
2. The LT & Spectre merge the Brothers by force, and nearly Obliterate Both Brothers.
3. The LT & Spectre are insects.

2>1.

... No wonder this garbage was retconned.

More likely because Marvel didn't like TOAA's Second being treated like a insect.

The LT & Spectre didn't need Access at all to merge the Brothers,
so you should recant that statement.

I was taking seperation not merging.

And again, again, the Brothers ARE the Universes.

again again show me where it stats that if the universes die the Brothers die, That is all I ask master there is no doubt that the universes are the Brothers but Please show me where is stats that if one of the Universes is destroyed The Brothers dies too, it shouldn't be a problem

Right, but they were able to merge them,
and nearly Obliterate them both via the merger.

Which is why the story is garbage, it contradicts itself.

Completely.

dontgetit

Ditto.

AGAIN!

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/2802/one205vn.th.jpg

"TWO Whole Universes EMBODIED in these BROTHERS"

..........................................................................................................

Let's not tread this part of the debate anymore,
otherwise you're willingly ignoring on panel art/character/narrator statements.

I isn't the only one that is ignoring what the narrator/Character/panel art stats master.

The Brothers were only in existence at that point
because of the LT/Spectre and Access' help.

Again not from my point of view and from the way I read the story.

Originally posted by Air Legend
Classic Beyonder
Thanos HOTI
Infinity Being
Presence
Classic Molecule Man.

As a Team ore by themselves???

Originally posted by Utrigita
As a Team ore by themselves???
Each one can solo.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Sorry master but I have always found that second scan you posted rather funny allow me to quote it in it's totality.

"There are these two um gods, ore whatever you want to call them one in each universe Brothers I guess they are like the embodiment of everything in there universe."

Not to bring your scan down ore anyhing but I have just always found it funny...

I didn't see you laughing when you saw Access saying the SAME thing:

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/2802/one205vn.th.jpg

"TWO Whole Universes EMBODIED in these BROTHERS"

..........................................................................

You did ignore it though.

..........................................................................

Where are the Universes?

They are EMBODIED in these Universes (that's plain english)

So if one destroyes the Universes, one is destroying the Brothers,
because the Brothers are the sum of Universes, they ARE the Universes.

(it should end here)
.............................................................................

But I gots more my friend.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Marvel and DC thats certainly better, because they represent the companies that is what they embodiment, eternity doesn't to my knowlegde embody the Marvel company does he...
Again show me a Clear scan that says "when the Universes dies so does the Brothers" ore something along the line.
my question is why wouldn't they??? Spectre and LT is made to protect there universe and to stop this sort of confrontation fact is they couldn't stop it, they could stop it momentially but completely

Yes the Brothers (companies) guardiens as shown in a scan above somewhere.
I don't quiet understand how you came to your own either, again as said before this is something that we shouldn't begin discuss because I wouldn't back down I think the scans clearly speaks for LT and Spectre acting to save the Universes not the brothers because the Brothers is about to destroy the Marvel Universe because it lost the fight. You think that the brothers are equal to the Universes that is mentioned several times I disagree always have and always will simply because I read it entirely differently then you do.

No where, it that stated that the brothers was joking all that is stated is that the Brothers wasn't happy about the merging nothing more nothing less.

Well it is absurb but it also shows that LT and Spectre couldn't stop the brothers from fighting when they decided to settle the battle there own way.

More likely because Marvel didn't like TOAA's Second being treated like a insect.

I was taking seperation not merging.

again again show me where it stats that if the universes die the Brothers die, That is all I ask master there is no doubt that the universes are the Brothers but Please show me where is stats that if one of the Universes is destroyed The Brothers dies too, it shouldn't be a problem
Your whole argument is founded on,
you believing the Brothers would not be harmed, only the Universes,
even though the Universes ARE the Brothers.

Ok,

let me end this:
.............................................................................

When the brothers fought the first time around,
they Killed each other and were Born again,
this cause "Shards" (fragments of the Brothers themselves) to be displaced:

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/9484/one56ox.th.jpg

"Fragments of their Essence blew in all directions,
and as the Universe spread so did the Brothers"


Of course they spread with the Universe, they ARE the Universe.

.............................................................................

Here Access clearly states,
that the "Shards" are Part of the Brothers:

http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1976/one109hv.th.jpg

"Remember the Brothers LOST Parts of themselves in the Big Bang "SHARDS"

"These "SHARDS" take different Forms"


http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4816/one117hq.th.jpg

"Other "SHARDS" become Parts of living Beings, Souls if you will"

"ever so often , One or Two become aware, like me and you"

.............................................................................

In fact,
some each Brother ended up withIN the each other:

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/161/one73vj.th.jpg

"in their Battle, some of each ended up in each OTHER'S Universe"

.............................................................................


Here Access's Future-self clearly states:

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7995/one214ix.th.jpg

"I'm a "SHARD" of the Brothers, just like you"

"I've been the Keeper of the Gateway between TWO Universes"


--------------- Two Universes - Two Brothers ------------------------


http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/8246/one221dg.th.jpg

"It falls to You to preserve the Balance between the TWO Universes"

--------------------- Brother Red - Brother Blue -----------------------




======== Right here is where the deal is sealed ============



Access clearly states, that the "Shards" that are a Fragment of the Brothers,

are ... are ... ARE ALSO .......... say it with me now:

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5138/br8qc7.th.jpg

"I wield a Portion, a Fragment of the Core Power OF THE Universes"


PROOF! ...

Access directly associates the "Shards" as being 'Fragments" of the Brothers,

of the Universes.


Therefore, the Brothers ARE the Universes ... swank

.............................................................................


I think we're done ey.


Even though it should've ended here in all honesty:

.............................................................................


I can't believe with THIS scan being posted ... there's any doubt:

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/1752/one262ai.th.jpg

"The Brothers are MERGING Realities, combining Universes"

"They're Creating a Single Universe out of Two"


Am I on buggin? ... Or didn't the Brothers just become One, when they were Two?

.............................................................................

I'm done with this debate,
any further disagreements .. as you wish.

Originally posted by Astner
For Thanos, omnireality is a fleeting term.
As he had no control what so ever over Atzera's dimension, hence he was limited.
Show me where it's stated Thanos had no influence over Atleza's realm.

So limited absorbs the LT, and erases all of Time/Space, got it.

Originally posted by Astner
As for the universes ending and Brothers almost dying.

http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/3149/brocs3.jpg

Now this indicates that the Brothers's battle have destroyed all creation before. And appearently it did not kill them, a
nd Access specificly said the universes, and not the Brothers
This is why I always read comics before posting my friend.

The full version of that scan now:

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5534/brokj3.th.jpg

Evidently the Brothers were destroyed and re-born,
in fact, they were blasted apart, (a piece of each other even ended up within each other)
they even fractured the Universe they embodied into a Multiverse.

You also missed the part where it states,
"They encompass the Whole of Everything" (what do you think That means)

Meaning, They WERE Creation, they WERE the Universe that got fractured.

That's Why "fragments of their essence blew in all directions"

Because obviously they were the ones affected!
Originally posted by Astner
don't twist the facts.
Read the comic fully, before accusing me of such.

Thanos with THOTU statlemate the Brother of Marvel

Originally posted by Mr Master
Show me where it's stated Thanos had no influence over Atleza's realm.

So limited absorbs the LT, and erases all of Time/Space, got it.
Mr Master, you agree that Thanos was one with everything in omnireality.
A old woman's last breath, a feather on a pidgeon and so forth.
Now Thanos was suprised when Warlock entered the 616th universe/multiverse (inrelevant)
Anyhow, he was not Adam Warlock or anything in Atzela's realm.

Now, he's everything in all realities, but he was unaware of that Adam still lived, this puts a limit to his omniscience, which is essential for omnipotence.


I have, I bought the same comic book (Marvel vs DC 1-4) as Galan777 did.l


The explanation of Access, yes.


You're right, they encompass all of creation, they are the universes. But that doesn't mean that if the universes are destroyed they die.
Again, all creation ended and begun in the previous encounter of the Brothers.

Originally posted by Mr Master
I didn't see you laughing when you saw Access saying the SAME thing:

http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/2802/one205vn.th.jpg

"TWO Whole Universes EMBODIED in these BROTHERS"

..........................................................................

You did ignore it though.

..........................................................................

Where are the Universes?

They are EMBODIED in these Universes (that's plain english)

So if one destroyes the Universes, one is destroying the Brothers,
because the Brothers are the sum of Universes, they ARE the Universes.

(it should end here)
.............................................................................

But I gots more my friend.


Your whole argument is founded on,
you believing the Brothers would not be harmed, only the Universes,
even though the Universes ARE the Brothers.

Ok,

let me end this:
.............................................................................

When the brothers fought the first time around,
they Killed each other and were Born again,
this cause "Shards" (fragments of the Brothers themselves) to be displaced:

http://img403.imageshack.us/img403/9484/one56ox.th.jpg

"Fragments of their Essence blew in all directions,
and as the Universe spread so did the Brothers"


Of course they spread with the Universe, they ARE the Universe.

.............................................................................

Here Access clearly states,
that the "Shards" are Part of the Brothers:

http://img242.imageshack.us/img242/1976/one109hv.th.jpg

"Remember the Brothers LOST Parts of themselves in the Big Bang "SHARDS"

"These "SHARDS" take different Forms"


http://img413.imageshack.us/img413/4816/one117hq.th.jpg

"Other "SHARDS" become Parts of living Beings, Souls if you will"

"ever so often , One or Two become aware, like me and you"

.............................................................................

In fact,
some each Brother ended up withIN the each other:

http://img251.imageshack.us/img251/161/one73vj.th.jpg

"in their Battle, some of each ended up in each OTHER'S Universe"

.............................................................................


Here Access's Future-self clearly states:

http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/7995/one214ix.th.jpg

"I'm a "SHARD" of the Brothers, just like you"

"I've been the Keeper of the Gateway between TWO Universes"


--------------- Two Universes - Two Brothers ------------------------


http://img145.imageshack.us/img145/8246/one221dg.th.jpg

"It falls to You to preserve the Balance between the TWO Universes"

--------------------- Brother Red - Brother Blue -----------------------




======== Right here is where the deal is sealed ============



Access clearly states, that the "Shards" that are a Fragment of the Brothers,

are ... are ... ARE ALSO .......... say it with me now:

http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/5138/br8qc7.th.jpg

"I wield a Portion, a Fragment of the Core Power OF THE Universes"


PROOF! ...

Access directly associates the "Shards" as being 'Fragments" of the Brothers,

of the Universes.


Therefore, the Brothers ARE the Universes ... swank

.............................................................................


I think we're done ey.


Even though it should've ended here in all honesty:

.............................................................................


I can't believe with THIS scan being posted ... there's any doubt:

http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/1752/one262ai.th.jpg

"The Brothers are MERGING Realities, combining Universes"

"They're Creating a Single Universe out of Two"


Am I on buggin? ... Or didn't the Brothers just become One, when they were Two?

.............................................................................

I'm done with this debate,
any further disagreements .. as you wish.
Edit

very Nice scans Master, yet you missed the most of my post,

w-h-e-r-e i-s t-h-e o-n P-a-n-e-l s-c-a-n t-h-a-t s-a-y-s t-h-a-t G-o-e-s t-h-e U-n-i-v-e-r-s-e-s s-o d-o-e-s t-h-e B-r-o-t-h-e-r-s?

Because Eternity dies and the universe along with him it doesn't mean that because Kismet dies in the DC then the DC universe will stop function, also that would mean that the UN ore any single universal destroyer would be capable of destroying the brothers that sounds far off imo.

You can destroy Eternity sure and then destroy the 616 reality but we know that the brothers is like you said previously embodiment of both Companies, so LT and Spectre suddenly have the power to destroy the embodiment of both companies well...

And I agree no reason to continue this, it would be rather pointless.

Originally posted by Utrigita
very Nice scans Master, yet you missed the most of my post,

w-h-e-r-e i-s t-h-e o-n P-a-n-e-l s-c-a-n t-h-a-t s-a-y-s t-h-a-t G-o-e-s t-h-e U-n-i-v-e-r-s-e-s s-o d-o-e-s t-h-e B-r-o-t-h-e-r-s?
Holy shit, read the last scan he posted, then read it over and over and over again until you finally comprehend it and realize that the Brothers are the universes.

Originally posted by Air Legend
Holy shit, read the last scan he posted, then read it over and over and over again until you finally comprehend it and realize that the Brothers are the universes.

Please highlight where is says that if the Universes dies so does the Brothers, can you provide me with such a scan Air Legend if you cannot then well...

shut it

Btw Master I agree that the LT merged the Brothers I agree that the Universes is the Brothers, what I lack is concrete proof that:

1. The same would happend to the brothers as would to eternity since they are from my point of view foundamential different. One is the Universe the Other part is also the universe but at the same time a representative of the Company.
2. Why in a a number of scans LT and Spectre is either stated to be powerless ore shown to be it, and then others where they apparently warp them with no effort???

I will happily Agree with you Master that it is Garbage when concerning Marvel cosmotology.

Originally posted by Utrigita
Please highlight where is says that if the Universes dies so does the Brothers, can you provide me with such a scan Air Legend if you cannot then well...

shut it
What part of the Brothers ARE the Universes don't you understand?

Since the Brothers ARE the Universes, then if it states the Universes would be destroyed, that means the Brothers would be destroyed.

Originally posted by Air Legend
What part of the Brothers ARE the Universes don't you understand?

Since the Brothers ARE the Universes, then if it states the Universes would be destroyed, that means the Brothers would be destroyed.

That is the way it works with Eternity thats correct but in DC Kismet holds the same role as eternity (as shown in JLA/Avengers), and if I remember correctly she died but the universe didn't go down the drain along with her.

And again they are far more then the Universe, each of them represent the Company respective Marvel and DC and a On Panel Clearly stats that LT and Spectre is The Brothers Cosmic Guardiens so suddenly we have the creations about to destroy there Creators even though we have instance where LT and Spectre stats they are powerless and shown to be powerless.

But I will discuss this no further until I have heard from Ron Marz

And still no concrete Scan I see.

Originally posted by Astner
Mr Master, you agree that Thanos was one with everything in omnireality.
A old woman's last breath, a feather on a pidgeon and so forth.
Correct.

Thanos was also an "asteroid shortly after the Big Bang"

Meaning Thanos was one with the history of the Marvel Universe.
Originally posted by Astner
Now Thanos was suprised when Warlock entered the 616th universe/multiverse (inrelevant)
Anyhow, he was not Adam Warlock or anything in Atzela's realm.
He alos instantly knew where Warlock was,
and what Warlock was doing there:

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/9448/allhecould5ip7.th.jpg

Omniscience? srugdoped

Again, imo, Thanos wanted Warlock to survive,
cause according to Warlock,
Thanos wanted someone to "witness his grand gesture"

........................................................................................................

If Thanos wanted, he could've absorbed Death too,
and Atleza's realm.

Isn't it a coincidence though,
that Thanos only left (as far as anyone knows) Two realities behind,
Death (his life-time infatuation) and ...
Atlea's realm which contained Warlock.
Warlock, I remember Thanos saying he saw no reason not to erase Warlock aswell,
You know what Warlock responded with:

http://img296.imageshack.us/img296/9291/15027108kd0.th.jpg

"Except then no one would witness your grand gesture"

Thanos replies, "I was not aware that I had one planned"

Warlock responds, "The security of the Void is not your way Titan"
......................................................................................................

BAMMM!!!

What do yall think that means?

Warlock knew Thanos would end up Re-Creating everything (his grand gesture)
because like he told Thanos:

"I understand you, better than, perhaps, you do yourself,
why I have trusted you so many times in the past"

"The security of the Void is not your way Titan"

Precisely, Thanos doesn't wanna rule over nothing, a Void.
......................................................................................................

IMO,
it's quite conceivable
that Thanos (subconsciously) allowed Death and Warlock to survive for said reasons.

Death for love ...

and Warlock for This .. to witness This:

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/1706/mute0619xx9.th.jpg


The "grand gesture"

Originally posted by Astner
Now, he's everything in all realities, but he was unaware of that Adam still lived,
this puts a limit to his omniscience, which is essential for omnipotence.
Again, the allusion leads to Thanos allowing that to happen.

Originally posted by Astner
The explanation of Access, yes.
Is that a dismiss or an acceptance?
Originally posted by Astner
You're right, they encompass all of creation, they are the universes.
But that doesn't mean that if the universes are destroyed they die.
Then your statement contradicts itself.
Originally posted by Astner
Again,
all creation ended and begun in the previous encounter of the Brothers.
Again,

the Brothers DIED, and were REBORN with Creation,
because they WERE Creation.

http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/5534/brokj3.th.jpg

"They encompassed the Whole of Everything"

"In the explosion of Death and Re-Birth the Brothers were blasted apart"

......................................................................................................

The Brothers were so severely affected by their "Death and Re-Birth"
that they fractured the Universe they encompassed,
and they became a Multiverse.

......................................................................................................

Did you bother to read this T?

I know you saw it cause you said,
"the explanation of Access, yes"

The explotion of death and re-birth the Brothers were blasted apart.
It's more likely that it was the universe, or its population that died and was reborn.
I mean if they died and they were blasted apart it would mean that their bodies were intact, how else could they blast apart?
Which can't be because the fragments of the universes were blasted apart.

Originally posted by Utrigita
That is the way it works with Eternity thats correct but in DC Kismet holds the same role as eternity (as shown in JLA/Avengers), and if I remember correctly she died but the universe didn't go down the drain along with her.
That's not accurate Ut.

Kismet never died in that arc, neither did Eternity.
Originally posted by Utrigita
And again they are far more then the Universe,
each of them represent the Company respective Marvel and DC
Yea, those companies are one infinite Universe each.

The Marvel Omniverse is one infinite Universe,
broken into segments to differentiate one from another.

Hence, the infinite multiplicity of Universes.
Originally posted by Utrigita
and a On Panel Clearly stats that LT and Spectre is The Brothers Cosmic Guardiens
so suddenly we have the creations about to destroy there Creators even though we have instance where LT and Spectre stats they are powerless and shown to be powerless.
That's why the arc is garbage.
Originally posted by Utrigita
But I will discuss this no further until I have heard from Ron Marz
Cool.
Originally posted by Utrigita
And still no concrete Scan I see.
Well, if the "shard" relation (aside from the rest) didn't do it for ya.

Originally posted by Astner
The explotion of death and re-birth the Brothers were blasted apart.
It's more likely that it was the universe, or its population that died and was reborn.
I mean if they died and they were blasted apart it would mean that their bodies were intact, how else could they blast apart?
I sense circles, so ... As you wish.
Originally posted by Astner
Which can't be because the fragments of the universes were blasted apart.
Interesting, even though fragments of their "Essence" also blew in all directions.

Look, at this point, after all the evidence,
who doesn't get it, will have to stay suffering, I'm done.

Still waiting.... not for the scan but a comment from the writer to sort (imo) this mess out.

Originally posted by Mr Master
stoned I can't begin to tell you how stupid you look with those smiley faces.

Originally posted by Peek
I can't begin to tell you how stupid you look with those smiley faces.
If you're gonna condemn me for using smilies,
you might aswell call everyone "stupid" fella,
cause everyone uses them.

Anywho, you got something of significance to contribute to the debate?
Otherwise your comment is off-topic, inconsequential and literally meaningless.

Oh and ... stoned