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And you know, i don't really give a flying fart if this has been covered already in this here forum, because I don't have the time any more to just sit around reading this crap all day every day like I used to. So don't give me any grief, because if you do, it will be ignored, or I may just give you the old generic flame form

So, here's what I think:

I think George Lucas made a big old shite-eating mistake when he DIDN'T make Palpatine the apprentice who killed Darth Plagueis (I don't know how it's really spelled, and this is how I'm spelling it). He also made the stupidest goofiest mistake in the history of Star Wars movies (and there are lots of them to compare to) by making Palpatine's massively aged appearance a result of his using his lightning force power for a long time on Mace Windu. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

Let's face it here, Lucas missed a once-in-a-lifetime chance to write this story the way it should have been written. It is SOOOO PAINFULLY obvious how it should have happened. Let me elaborate:

Palpy is at that weird space water show with Anakin. He's stroking his ego and telling him about the sith. Then he goes into the story about Darth Plagueis and how he had the power to save lives, create life, and bring people back from the dead. He tells him how this was 1000 years ago. He tells him about how Plagueis was so short-sighted and stupid that he didn't realize that his apprentice was plotting to kill him in his sleep. Anakin's like "hmmm".

Ok, so we advance a bit and we're at the part where Windu is confronting Palpy. Palpy reveals to them that he is a sith and attacks them (we'll not mention what a LAME looking fight that was and how nobody in the production of the film seemed to care that McDiarmid looke completely stiff and nonconvincing in this fight). Anakin walks in and is all like "Hey, WTF? What's goin' on, yo?". And here's what SHOULD have happened:

Palpatine is on the floor, succumbed to Windu's superior light-saber skills, when we see Palpy suddenly grunting and groaning in horrible pain as he lets go of the control he has on his own body (using his very powerful control of the dark side of the force) which has been maintaining his body to give the illusion that he is a man in his 50's, when in fact he is over 1000 years old, frail, wrinkled, and hideous. THIS is when he would release his lightning force on Windu, hurling him out the window to his death, as the sight of Palpy transforming into this old man causes him to lose track of what he is doing.

So, it would turn out that Palpy was in fact the apprentice that killed Plagueis, and has spent all this time hiding his true self, waiting for the perfect time to use the dark side to take control of the galaxy. He also would have become so powerful in the dark side that he would have developed the ability to "create life" with the dark side of the force, and would have been the one who created Anakin from the force inside Anakin's mother, as a means to his control of the galaxy.

It's all so simple. It should have been this way. This would have been perfect. Anybody who really thinks about it knows that this is the way things should have turned out.

Ummmm...when did Palpy say it was 1000 years ago that Plagueis did that?

i don't know. Maybe he didn't. That's just what was in my head. That's what i thought it was. If it wasn't, I don't care.

Good thought.

Still, I can do without Palpy fathering Anakin, the wrinkled face and the prophecy anyway. I think they are all needless and daft details that bear no relevance to the story. It feels like a feeble attempt to make it all very epic and mythological.

I'd have preferred Lucas had focused a bit more on the Greek tragedy side of Anakin, Padme, OB1 and Palpy.

I see the Roman references to Star Wars...but where is the Greek?

Originally posted by cornponious
i don't know. Maybe he didn't. That's just what was in my head. That's what i thought it was. If it wasn't, I don't care.



He didn't

The Greek???? Come on, G... Lucas based all of SW on mythology and the greatest supplyer of mythology are the ancient Greeks (quantity wise). The Romans adopted most of that.

Sometimes G, I wonder if you actually read into SW... or even watch the films.

That's mythology though!!!! I thought you meant there were references to Greek society like there is to Romans!!!!!

I HAVE SEEN THE FILMS MANY TIMES AND READ INTO THEM!!!! grrrrrrr

Society??? It's not meant to be that literal. Greek thought, culture, tradition, comedies, tragedies, mythology... *sigh*

And yet there is Roman reference to their society, so from that, I had thought you were referring to more than Greek mythology.

Is tehre anything more?

Not that I can pull out of what I have learned...except that the Empire lasted less then a generation...and the Greek golden age lasted less then a generation...

Empire was based on Nazi Germany.

Yes, I am aware...I was telling you similarities between Greece though.

Originally posted by General G


That's mythology though!!!! I thought you meant there were references to Greek society like there is to Romans!!!!!

I HAVE SEEN THE FILMS MANY TIMES AND READ INTO THEM!!!! grrrrrrr

lol meltdown

They harder he screams... the less we believe him.

Originally posted by smoker4
lol meltdown

You would too if he bothered you about it all the time too.

Queeq 1 - General G 0.

My two pounds!

you suck...

i dont know...i never cared for the immaculate conception bit in the first place.

though i hated the nonsensical way which lucas explains palp's transformation.
"d'oh i zapped myself with my own lightning...ill just keep on doing it and weakening myself...duuuuuh *fart*"

and anakin's turn to the darkside. instead of a mighty roar of rage and fury we pictured, we get a whining and crying emo bitchbaby who's only evil tasks seem to have been killing babies and strangling his wife.

it was all just a stupid story and while i still watch ep3 every now and again, i disaknowledge it as part of the saga. my mindset while i watch the PT, (while fast forwarding through the jabba's palace musical number) is the same as it was when i first saw them. which is likely pretty damn close to what lucas had REALLY intended before he got one too many whiffs of his own bullshit. (of course validated by his team of yes-men which have convinced him that its not all bullshit, but actually the smell of sweet roses).

palps didnt zap himself with lightning, he was just really really old and "unnatural". vader gave in to his hatred and anger when he turned, the same as luke almost did. there is no such ****ing thing as midichlorians. anakin had a father, and a grandfather, etc. the jedi are just normal people with extraordinary powers, and not sexless buddhist monks. anakin didnt build 3p0, his mom was not a mail-order bride. i refuse to digest garbage.

thats MY starwars. **** george lucas.

Good post!

Originally posted by cornponious
And you know, i don't really give a flying fart if this has been covered already in this here forum, because I don't have the time any more to just sit around reading this crap all day every day like I used to. So don't give me any grief, because if you do, it will be ignored, or I may just give you the old generic flame form

So, here's what I think:

I think George Lucas made a big old shite-eating mistake when he DIDN'T make Palpatine the apprentice who killed Darth Plagueis (I don't know how it's really spelled, and this is how I'm spelling it). He also made the stupidest goofiest mistake in the history of Star Wars movies (and there are lots of them to compare to) by making Palpatine's massively aged appearance a result of his using his lightning force power for a long time on Mace Windu. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

Let's face it here, Lucas missed a once-in-a-lifetime chance to write this story the way it should have been written. It is SOOOO PAINFULLY obvious how it should have happened. Let me elaborate:

Palpy is at that weird space water show with Anakin. He's stroking his ego and telling him about the sith. Then he goes into the story about Darth Plagueis and how he had the power to save lives, create life, and bring people back from the dead. He tells him how this was 1000 years ago. He tells him about how Plagueis was so short-sighted and stupid that he didn't realize that his apprentice was plotting to kill him in his sleep. Anakin's like "hmmm".

Ok, so we advance a bit and we're at the part where Windu is confronting Palpy. Palpy reveals to them that he is a sith and attacks them (we'll not mention what a LAME looking fight that was and how nobody in the production of the film seemed to care that McDiarmid looke completely stiff and nonconvincing in this fight). Anakin walks in and is all like "Hey, WTF? What's goin' on, yo?". And here's what SHOULD have happened:

Palpatine is on the floor, succumbed to Windu's superior light-saber skills, when we see Palpy suddenly grunting and groaning in horrible pain as he lets go of the control he has on his own body (using his very powerful control of the dark side of the force) which has been maintaining his body to give the illusion that he is a man in his 50's, when in fact he is over 1000 years old, frail, wrinkled, and hideous. THIS is when he would release his lightning force on Windu, hurling him out the window to his death, as the sight of Palpy transforming into this old man causes him to lose track of what he is doing.

So, it would turn out that Palpy was in fact the apprentice that killed Plagueis, and has spent all this time hiding his true self, waiting for the perfect time to use the dark side to take control of the galaxy. He also would have become so powerful in the dark side that he would have developed the ability to "create life" with the dark side of the force, and would have been the one who created Anakin from the force inside Anakin's mother, as a means to his control of the galaxy.

It's all so simple. It should have been this way. This would have been perfect. Anybody who really thinks about it knows that this is the way things should have turned out. i think your a tool. plagus (or however the hell you spell it) wasnt 1000 years ago. palpatine wanted to be in the losing position for when anakin came to save him. palps used the whole fight to his advantage, and if you knew anything about star wars you'd know that theres many theories about exactly what happened to palps face, a few of which being, 1. he called upon so much dark side energy it rapidly decayed/aged his body 2. it was his real face and he was using the force to mask it (not the first time used) and decided that a scared looking face will be a tool to help him 3. same as 2 except he lost focus of the force trick used to keep himself like that and decided to leave it. palps also did kill plagus and palp's true strength is in manipulating others, thats why he took over the galaxy and killed the jedi, if you actually pay attention to the movies you'll notice he does almost nothing himself, he even manipulated yoda to a certain degree.

In other words: the whole face melting business was a bad move.

Not entirely...it created sympathy for him in the senate.

But not with us.

No, but he doesn't know we are here.

Lucas does, he makes it for us.

Originally posted by General G
you suck...



Dear:

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"Me too" er
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Flame bait
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Smartass

You Are Being Flamed Because:
You obviously don't know anything about the topic at hand
You said "X rules, Y sucks" and gave no support for your lame statement
You posted a blatantly obvious troll.
All you ever do is try to insult people, but you only end up insulting yourself.
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(Mark only if checked above)
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YOU POSTED ALL YOUR ARTICLE IN CAPITALS
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Your post was:
Lame.
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Longer than any worthwhile thought you could ever be capable of.
Incomprehensible.
Incoherent.
A load of crap.
All of the above.

Please note that:
Your post was apparently written in your second language (English) which you have learned by reading subtitles of American television programs broadcast in your country.
What you posted/said has been posted/said before.
- and it was done better the last time.
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___________________.(net.personality)
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Your post originated
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And:
You seem to feel this gave you
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Your post contained commercial advertising.
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You must also:
Refrain from posting until you have a vague idea what you're doing
READ every post in this group for two weeks so you can get some idea about what is discussed here
Read every newsgroup you posted to for a week
Give up your AOL/Web TV account.
Bust up your modem with a hammer and eat it
Turn your computer into an aquarium.
Stop masturbating for a
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Actually post something relevant.
Post to alt.test
Be the guest of honor in alt.flame for a month.
Amputate your penis/breasts with a hack saw.
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Give your father/mother a vasectomy/hysterectomy.
OD on laxatives just before you go to work/school/church.
Pack your computer and send it to me
All of the above.
Nothing, we'll let you go this time or your posting privileges will be canceled.

Furthermore:

You have apparently misunderstood the purpose of Usenet.
You have obviously misunderstood the purpose of the Internet.
You are a loser.
I pity your dog/cat/significant other.
You must have spent your entire life on the floor to be this
clueless.
*plonk*
- Again
This has been pointed out to you before.

It is recommended that you:
stick to AOL/Web TV and come back when you've grown up.
find a volcano and throw yourself in.
get a gun and shoot yourself.
stop reading Usenet news and get a life.
GET A LIFE!
pawn your computer and lose the claim ticket.
FOAD.
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Jump into a bathtub while holding your monitor
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go to hell
- and stay there.
tell yer momma she's so fat/stupid/ugly that etc..
teach her how to perform an effective abortion.
All of the above.

In Closing, I'd Like to Say:
Get a clue
Get a life
Go away
Grow up
Never post again
You need to seek psychiatric help
Like a neutered dog, you just don't get it
Blow me
Don't do it ever again please
Do it again and I'll axe you to death
Never post again
Age 10 more years before you post again
I pity your
- dog
- cat
- spouse
Yer momma's so fat/stupid/ugly that etc...
Take your *waste* somewhere else
Get *Mate*ed, you pathetic loser
Go back to school and actually learn something
Learn how to post or get off the usenet
Don't take offense at this, I just like to use this form
All of the above

END OF FLAME


--------------------

PWNED again!

Ah. I see.

LOCK THIS SHIT!

j/k

looking at all the closed threads made me lol, that's what I think
<3 Queeq

???

You actually got that?

Originally posted by cornponious
And you know, i don't really give a flying fart if this has been covered already in this here forum, because I don't have the time any more to just sit around reading this crap all day every day like I used to. So don't give me any grief, because if you do, it will be ignored, or I may just give you the old generic flame form

So, here's what I think:

I think George Lucas made a big old shite-eating mistake when he DIDN'T make Palpatine the apprentice who killed Darth Plagueis (I don't know how it's really spelled, and this is how I'm spelling it). He also made the stupidest goofiest mistake in the history of Star Wars movies (and there are lots of them to compare to) by making Palpatine's massively aged appearance a result of his using his lightning force power for a long time on Mace Windu. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

Let's face it here, Lucas missed a once-in-a-lifetime chance to write this story the way it should have been written. It is SOOOO PAINFULLY obvious how it should have happened. Let me elaborate:

Palpy is at that weird space water show with Anakin. He's stroking his ego and telling him about the sith. Then he goes into the story about Darth Plagueis and how he had the power to save lives, create life, and bring people back from the dead. He tells him how this was 1000 years ago. He tells him about how Plagueis was so short-sighted and stupid that he didn't realize that his apprentice was plotting to kill him in his sleep. Anakin's like "hmmm".

Ok, so we advance a bit and we're at the part where Windu is confronting Palpy. Palpy reveals to them that he is a sith and attacks them (we'll not mention what a LAME looking fight that was and how nobody in the production of the film seemed to care that McDiarmid looke completely stiff and nonconvincing in this fight). Anakin walks in and is all like "Hey, WTF? What's goin' on, yo?". And here's what SHOULD have happened:

Palpatine is on the floor, succumbed to Windu's superior light-saber skills, when we see Palpy suddenly grunting and groaning in horrible pain as he lets go of the control he has on his own body (using his very powerful control of the dark side of the force) which has been maintaining his body to give the illusion that he is a man in his 50's, when in fact he is over 1000 years old, frail, wrinkled, and hideous. THIS is when he would release his lightning force on Windu, hurling him out the window to his death, as the sight of Palpy transforming into this old man causes him to lose track of what he is doing.

So, it would turn out that Palpy was in fact the apprentice that killed Plagueis, and has spent all this time hiding his true self, waiting for the perfect time to use the dark side to take control of the galaxy. He also would have become so powerful in the dark side that he would have developed the ability to "create life" with the dark side of the force, and would have been the one who created Anakin from the force inside Anakin's mother, as a means to his control of the galaxy.

It's all so simple. It should have been this way. This would have been perfect. Anybody who really thinks about it knows that this is the way things should have turned out. Except for the error is dates, well said.

It was.

Originally posted by cornponious
And you know, i don't really give a flying fart if this has been covered already in this here forum, because I don't have the time any more to just sit around reading this crap all day every day like I used to. So don't give me any grief, because if you do, it will be ignored, or I may just give you the old generic flame form

So, here's what I think:

I think George Lucas made a big old shite-eating mistake when he DIDN'T make Palpatine the apprentice who killed Darth Plagueis (I don't know how it's really spelled, and this is how I'm spelling it). He also made the stupidest goofiest mistake in the history of Star Wars movies (and there are lots of them to compare to) by making Palpatine's massively aged appearance a result of his using his lightning force power for a long time on Mace Windu. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

Let's face it here, Lucas missed a once-in-a-lifetime chance to write this story the way it should have been written. It is SOOOO PAINFULLY obvious how it should have happened. Let me elaborate:

Palpy is at that weird space water show with Anakin. He's stroking his ego and telling him about the sith. Then he goes into the story about Darth Plagueis and how he had the power to save lives, create life, and bring people back from the dead. He tells him how this was 1000 years ago. He tells him about how Plagueis was so short-sighted and stupid that he didn't realize that his apprentice was plotting to kill him in his sleep. Anakin's like "hmmm".

Ok, so we advance a bit and we're at the part where Windu is confronting Palpy. Palpy reveals to them that he is a sith and attacks them (we'll not mention what a LAME looking fight that was and how nobody in the production of the film seemed to care that McDiarmid looke completely stiff and nonconvincing in this fight). Anakin walks in and is all like "Hey, WTF? What's goin' on, yo?". And here's what SHOULD have happened:

Palpatine is on the floor, succumbed to Windu's superior light-saber skills, when we see Palpy suddenly grunting and groaning in horrible pain as he lets go of the control he has on his own body (using his very powerful control of the dark side of the force) which has been maintaining his body to give the illusion that he is a man in his 50's, when in fact he is over 1000 years old, frail, wrinkled, and hideous. THIS is when he would release his lightning force on Windu, hurling him out the window to his death, as the sight of Palpy transforming into this old man causes him to lose track of what he is doing.

So, it would turn out that Palpy was in fact the apprentice that killed Plagueis, and has spent all this time hiding his true self, waiting for the perfect time to use the dark side to take control of the galaxy. He also would have become so powerful in the dark side that he would have developed the ability to "create life" with the dark side of the force, and would have been the one who created Anakin from the force inside Anakin's mother, as a means to his control of the galaxy.

It's all so simple. It should have been this way. This would have been perfect. Anybody who really thinks about it knows that this is the way things should have turned out.

Funny, Palps rather cryptic story always lead me to assume that what you posted is the way it went down.

Especially the little smile he has when talking of the apprentice killing Plagieus, I thought it was commonly assumed that Palps was this apprentice.

That's what I've always put forth in the threads about Plagueis and Anakin. I always felt that the Emporer was way older than everybody, and had been biding his time.

I don't even think that in the film he's necessarily "zapped" into looking old, I think he just lets go of the mask at that moment to trick Anakin into thinking that he's getting fried to death. (he is getting fried, but only a little. He can take it.)


Did GL or anybody else actually say that the lightning injuries are what cause his face to look old and withered?

If not, I'd say that my theory (and Corn's preference) stands.

As far as I know GL only said that the lightning caused his face to change. What lis at the base of that mechanism... i dunno if GL ever said anything about that. It's still a weird scene.

while you point out a logical loophole, its very doubtful that it wasnt caused by his own lightning, as in he was normal before and deformed after, as opposed to the lightning causing him to drop his facade. its not even worth pondering imho.

*edit* in fact i think it hurt the plot in 3 ways.

1-anakin felt no pity for palpatine and would have cut him down or arrested him without a second thought if it wasnt for the padme issue. so to introduce that element was irrelevant and nonsensical.

2-it would have worked better for the plot if palpatine's sympathy from the senate was based on a pure fabrication. instead, he is telling a half-truth, since it was maces reflecting as opposed to deflecting of his force lightning that deformed him. i would have rather seen a flatout lie.

3-his own purposeful deformation expresses a willingness to sacrifice and risk his own life for his principles...a level of dedication which seems to equal that of the jedi. i think he would have come off as more cowardly and deceitful if this wasnt the case.

I agree.

Although I'm still not sure if the lightning actually touched his face. And the facial deformity doesn't explain how his eyes turned yellow all of a sudden. Anakin was suddenly able to have yellow eyes without a melted face. I think GL really didn't work out how a Senator from Ep1 could turn into Prune Face from ROTJ. And that's pretty sad.

my interpretation is that their eyes turn yellow when their hatered is unrestrained, like when his eyes morph just before screaming "I HATE YOU" to kenobi. then again im trying to make sense of the nonsensical, since maul's eyes are yellow even when he's chilled out and mellow when talking with palpatine, anakins eyes are normal when he slaughters the younglings, and palps' eyes are normal when screaming "no...NO!!! YOU WILL DIE!!!" it would have hammered the point home if their eyes would have morphed at the appropriate times, but hey....thats all superficial. as long as we know that the force is actually a biological reaction and padme died of a broken heart. *vomits*

I'm with ya, Paul.

Originally posted by queeq
As far as I know GL only said that the lightning caused his face to change. What lis at the base of that mechanism... i dunno if GL ever said anything about that. It's still a weird scene.

I think he drained himself. Lightning has never done that to anyone in these movies before....

Ha, last post before mine was on my Birthday

Originally posted by queeq
I agree.

Although I'm still not sure if the lightning actually touched his face. And the facial deformity doesn't explain how his eyes turned yellow all of a sudden. Anakin was suddenly able to have yellow eyes without a melted face. I think GL really didn't work out how a Senator from Ep1 could turn into Prune Face from ROTJ. And that's pretty sad.

Schecter is correct on the eyes. The Dark Side does that when they are in rage or whatever, Anakin was uber pissed to that how he got them, plus they look cool no? Maul must have always been pissed in the Dark Side, and same with Palpatine usually.

The Force lightning seemed concentrated on Palpatine's upper body including his face which is why he was deformed and Luke wasn't in ROTJ (or very noticabally) becuase it was being exerted all over his body. Perhaps Mace somehow directed the lightning either by saber or Force (maybe both) into Palatine's face to try to kill him faster.

edit: wow, I didn't realise I was replying to such old posts! lol