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Papa Smurph



vs

King Kandy



Area

fdog

Just a quick summary here:

Papa Smurph has an amalgam of Dr. Fate, Sonia Sato (a fighter), and World War Hulk. He also has 36 hours of prep time in a mystic sanctum.

King Kandy has a two person amalgam of Dr. Strange and Professor Zoom. He has 1 hour in mystic Sanctum. But King Kandy also purchased knowledge of names and power, but not level of power. He also has purchased BFR.

I must remind everyone of rule #7:


You can't extend your prep through super speed and make a 1 hour prep appear to last hours and days. 1 hour is still 1 hour and time will pass normally despite yor enhanced perception.

For emphasis:

"Originally posted by Evangel94

...I am going to clarify power boosting since some of you (i won't name who) are asking me some pretty weird things.

Examples of Power Boosting.

1. An electric character becomes more powerful if they have more electricity. You buy 36 hours of prep, and draft Storm. During the entire prep you hit that character with lightning bolts from the sky using storm in order to boost that characters power.

2. You draft Hercules, the Hulk, and a Nurse. You buy 36 hours prep as well. During the prep, you give Hulk's blood via a transfusion to Hercules in order to make Hercules into Hulk Hercules which makes him extra strong.

3. You draft Silver Surfer and 2 other Heralds of Galactus and 2 hours of Prep and power boosting. You have Silver Surfer drain the other Heralds of Galactus and add their power to Silver Surfers own Power Cosmic to Super Charge Silver Surfer with lots of Power Cosmic.

Note: Building tech from scratch doesn't count as power boosting, unless that tech is used to increase a characters regular native power. Building suits of Armor ala Iron Man or Dr. Doom is not considered amping.

Examples of Not Power Boosting:

1. You draft Hulk, Hulk's Wife from Planet Hulk(Cairea?), and an Amalgam of Superman and Joker and 15 minutes of Battlefield Prep. 30 seconds before your prep is up, you have SuperJoker kill Hulk's wife in front of him making Hulk really mad. You then unleash Hulk on the other team.

2. You draft Hulk, Doctor Doom, 36 hours of prep in a science lab. You tie down hulk with adamantium restraints, and poke hulk with a 100,00 Volt Cattleprod for 36 hours making him mad then unleash Hulk on the other team.

3. Drafting Black Canary for 2 points, 36 hours of Prep (5 Points), and 18 construction works to build a giant 1000 foot tall megaphone on half the side of the battlefield. Which you then use black Canary to scream in the megaphone at the other team.

-Evangel94"

King Kandy has 1 hour prep in a mystic sanctum, not 36 hours.

Just thought I should chime in on some misconceptions.

I imagine it'd be tough to invoke spells going faster then sound, wouldn't it and

17 – Power Nullification: Nullify super-powers (only applicable to characters who have the ability to nullify super-powers)

you didn't purchase the ability to remove powers so how are you going to take away my strength and durability?

One hell of a plan you've got there. I would have a lot of trouble taking it out, except it's ILLEGAL. On numerous levels. I will prove it now:

First off, you have purchased neither knowledge of the opposition, nor spying on your opponent. "Detecting" who your opponent is during prep with a spell is illegal. I'm sure Evangel and Digi would both agree, you can't get the benefits of those purchases without purchasing them. Just how I could not mind control someone just because Strange doesn't technically use telepathy, or hypnotize someone and call it something other then mind control. It's illegal.

Second, you did not purchase mind control, and thus Nabu CANNOT take over your mind. But you didn't even DRAFT NABU IN THE FIRST PLACE. You cannot call on outside help during Prep, Evangel has said this NUMEROUS TIMES. If you wanted Nabu, you should draft him. That's the legal way of doing it. The way you're doing it is just drafting two characters for the price of one, and is i-l-l-e-g-a-l.

Third, what's this with you "expanding the forcefield"? It's not legal. The force field would be GENERALLY larger in Mogo's case because he's ALWAYS that large. The force-field isn't putty, you can't just reshape it to suit your purpose. That's also illegal.

BTW it's good to know that I intentionally was missing your character and only hitting with the blast radius.

Next your flawed logic regarding Hulk's stamina. Magic uses a different sort of Stamina then your physical body does. Show me a scan saying that physical stamina is an indicator for how much magic you can do. I bet you can't, you are just inventing shit. If that were true then the universes strongest magicians would all be big brawny guys. Not so. I challenge you to provide the scan.

So okay, the battle will still go the way I want since 99% of what he said is bullshit. He already admitted that without Nabu, he loses, and since he will not be getting Nabu I guess he will have to concede my victory.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I imagine it'd be tough to invoke spells going faster then sound, wouldn't it and

17 – Power Nullification: Nullify super-powers (only applicable to characters who have the ability to nullify super-powers)

you didn't purchase the ability to remove powers so how are you going to take away my strength and durability?
No not at all, Strange has done it before. I can get you some scans but he often has conversations in space and the like. And anyway, I don't need to hear the spell as long as I say it.

I have not removed any powers, you still have those powers. Hulk has a weak side and a strong side, it's not like everytime he turns into banner everyone says "OMG, the Hulk has LOST HIS POWERS" no, Banner just plain doesn't HAVE those powers.

Originally posted by King Kandy

-Prep-

Okay. I start by doing the stuff I did last match, which is gathering all my artifacts and summoning an army of demons.

http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=strangearmy11dn.jpg
http://img140.imageshack.us/my.php?image=strangearmy28pl.jpg

Originally posted by King Kandy
You cannot call on outside help during Prep, Evangel has said this NUMEROUS TIMES.

It is against the rules to summon additional characters from other dimensions whether it be prep or battle; Just making sure everyone follows the rules.

Nabu isn't taking over anything, he's switching places with Hector.

I'm detecting a powerful mage, that's about it.

I didn't draft Nabu, I drafted Fate, who's helmet houses the previous Fate's who, btw, are all extensions of Hector's power and Nabu, who gives Hector advice from time to time. If you had a problem with this, you should have voiced it instead of waiting to bring up a non problem in the match.

I've already said if I can't be planet sized I'm battlefield size, which means a lot.

Why are you asking me to prove a negative? Mage's get tired through casting magic and Hulk doesn't get tired........ever. Try proving that magic stamina somehow tires you in different ways first.

And you do realise that the most powerful mage's like Cytorrak, Dormammu, Spectre and such become huge in their true forms, correct?

Originally posted by Evangel94
It is against the rules to summon additional characters from other dimensions. Just making sure everyone follows the rules.
Oh i'm sorry I didn't say that right but like I said last match Strange will CREATE the demons not summon them.

Originally posted by King Kandy
No not at all, Strange has done it before. I can get you some scans but he often has conversations in space and the like. And anyway, I don't need to hear the spell as long as I say it.

I have not removed any powers, you still have those powers. Hulk has a weak side and a strong side, it's not like everytime he turns into banner everyone says "OMG, the Hulk has LOST HIS POWERS" no, Banner just plain doesn't HAVE those powers.


Strange having conversations in space is cool, but how does he invoke mystical beings going faster then sound?

Yeah and I didn't draft Banner, I drafted Hulk, who's super powers are Strength, Durability, and his healing factor, powers you are removing.

Match won't go your way for the simple purpose that I'm huge as all hell and your 'argument' is bringing up issues that should have been brought up in the draft or even in my previous match and your power removal spell which will backfire in your face.

.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Nabu isn't taking over anything, he's switching places with Hector.
You didn't draft him though, you can't get him on your team.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I'm detecting a powerful mage, that's about it.
Which is illegal, you can't detect ANYTHING without spying, and you can't know anything without knowledge... this is a real slippery slope you're on.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I didn't draft Nabu, I drafted Fate, who's helmet houses the previous Fate's who, btw, are all extensions of Hector's power and Nabu, who gives Hector advice from time to time. If you had a problem with this, you should have voiced it instead of waiting to bring up a non problem in the match.
So you drafted multiple characters in the place of one? Illegal. If you're drafting multiple people, you have to pay for them. This is an insult to me and all tourney members who paid for the things they use.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I've already said if I can't be planet sized I'm battlefield size, which means a lot.
Okay, sure.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Why are you asking me to prove a negative? Mage's get tired through casting magic and Hulk doesn't get tired........ever. Try proving that magic stamina somehow tires you in different ways first.
Dude, you're asking ME to prove a negative.

You have to prove that magic uses physical stamina.

I have to prove that magic DOESN'T use physical stamina.

Which one of these sounds negative to you?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
And you do realise that the most powerful mage's like Cytorrak, Dormammu, Spectre and such become huge in their true forms, correct?
Okay, what's that got to do with anything?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Strange having conversations in space is cool, but how does he invoke mystical beings going faster then sound?
Um dude I already said he has cast super-speed spells before, but anyway the speed of sound is a measurement of how fast the vibrations in the air will move to create sound. Now, if he can talk in space and cast spells clearly his spells aren't dependent on Air vibrations, now are they?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah and I didn't draft Banner, I drafted Hulk, who's super powers are Strength, Durability, and his healing factor, powers you are removing.
Dude Banner and Hulk are the SAME PERSON. OMG that's like saying you drafted Spider-Man without Peter Parker.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Match won't go your way for the simple purpose that I'm huge as all hell and your 'argument' is bringing up issues that should have been brought up in the draft or even in my previous match and your power removal spell which will backfire in your face.
Remember how back in drafting, Evangel said if you sneaked a character in past draft, and then it was proved illegal in a match, it would still be removed? Anyway, being huge won't stop me from blowing you to atoms by smashing you against a wall.

Originally posted by King Kandy
You didn't draft him though, you can't get him on your team.

Yeah I did, I drafted Dr. Fate Hector Hall similar to someone drafting Hulk and having Banner do most of the prepping. Nabu lives in Fate's helmet, gives him advice and has even taken control of him and sided with Black Adam for believing heroes are too soft nowadays for not killing.


Which is illegal, you can't detect ANYTHING without spying

I'm not spying, I'm detecting a high level mage is my next opponent. Don't know your name, your magical speciality, any of your weaknesses or limitations, just that you are a stupidly strong mage.

So you drafted multiple characters in the place of one? Illegal.

I'm not drafting multiple people, hence you only being attacked by one person. I'm drafting Fate and his standard equipment. Of which is a helmet with people who live in it and routinely give him advice all of the people, however, are extensions of Fate's power.

This is an insult to me and all tourney members who paid for the things they use.

Not really, I put Hector Hall out there, even looking at his wiki would tell you that Nabu is a part of his helmet, much like cosmic awareness was to Quasar at a point.

Dude, you're asking ME to prove a negative.

A negative which you brought up.

You have to prove that magic uses physical stamina.


Okay, when Mages cast spells they become physically drained, like how Strange was PHYSICALLY exhausted from casting low level teleportation spells


Okay, what's that got to do with anything?

You saying something about powerful mages not being huge like World War Fate

Originally posted by King Kandy
Okay I admit that if you had Nabu, it would be legal to let him possess you. But anyway, Aggamoto has helped in all of Strange's fights, and you don't see me trying to argue he gets drafted along with Strange.

I don't really know much about Aggamoto and Strange's relationship but does he live in a piece of Strange's standard equipment and give him advice in EVERY fight he gets in whether he asks for it or not and has he opperated at herald levels (like Nabu has when he was with Kent)?

Kandy instead of bringing up non issues you should be trying to counter a 5 mile tall World Breaker Fate.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah I did, I drafted Dr. Fate Hector Hall similar to someone drafting Hulk and having Banner do most of the prepping. Nabu lives in Fate's helmet, gives him advice and has even taken control of him and sided with Black Adam for believing heroes are too soft nowadays for not killing.
Well Banner is the same character as Hulk. Nabu=A different guy from Hector.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I'm not spying, I'm detecting a high level mage is my next opponent. Don't know your name, your magical speciality, any of your weaknesses or limitations, just that you are a stupidly strong mage.
Dude, that's pretty much what you would have gotten with Level 2 knowledge of the opposition, and you are attempting to get this for free. You are insulting all competitors with these attempted loopholes.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I'm not drafting multiple people, hence you only being attacked by one person. I'm drafting Fate and his standard equipment. Of which is a helmet with people who live in it and routinely give him advice all of the people, however, are extensions of Fate's power.
If someone's standard equipment is another person, you don't get him. You are getting outside help during prep. Stop this sham, you are mocking my intelligence.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Not really, I put Hector Hall out there, even looking at his wiki would tell you that Nabu is a part of his helmet, much like cosmic awareness was to Quasar at a point.
Cosmic awareness ain't a separate character, bub.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Okay, when Mages cast spells they become physically drained, like how Strange was PHYSICALLY exhausted from casting low level teleportation spells
Oy, where do I start? Okay, first off you may want to show me a big brawny guy doing any better. Second, how is it low-level? Even in the 70's Dr. Strange mentioned that teleportation is an extremely difficult form of magic.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
You saying something about powerful mages not being huge like World War Fate
I don't mean they aren't big, I mean they don't tend to have a high degree of physical strength relative to their size. You are making it sound like you think Hank Pym would be a better magician after he grows.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
I don't really know much about Aggamoto and Strange's relationship but does he live in a piece of Strange's standard equipment and give him advice in EVERY fight he gets in whether he asks for it or not and has he opperated at herald levels (like Nabu has when he was with Kent)?
Funny thing is, he lives inside the orb of Aggamoto, and Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight. He's also a match for Galactus. Under YOUR rules, he would be perfectly legal for me to summon. Under Evangel's rules, not so much. Come on, she specifically stated no outside help during prep, which is what you're trying to get.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Kandy instead of bringing up non issues you should be trying to counter a 5 mile tall World Breaker Fate.
Okay. I slam him into the forcefield at 1,000,000x lightspeed like was always my plan.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Well Banner is the same character as Hulk. Nabu=A different guy from Hector.

No Banner and Hulk are different characters, they've had various conversations with each other and IIRC are even legally acknowledged as different people (hence Banner's immunity to the death penalty).

What I'm doing is no different then having Insane Genis talk to Rick Jones about life during his prep.


I don't mean they aren't big, I mean they don't tend to have a high degree of physical strength relative to their size. You are making it sound like you think Hank Pym would be a better magician after he grows.

Oh that's not it, I'm saying because I'm in Hulk's body now I'm not going to be drained using big time spells like I normally would in Hector Hall's body, essentially making any big time feat that might have killed Fate if he even tried a low level magic spell after casting it a legit weapon to be used in my arsenal with ease.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Okay. I slam him into the forcefield at 1,000,000x lightspeed like was always my plan.

That's going to be pretty hard to do given me being as big and wide as the battlefield. You could hurt yourself, literally.

I have to vote now because I have to turn a work for tomorrow, sorry if its too early.

I vote for Kandy.

I agree that some of the prep is illegal and the shield is not deflecting a wide range attack that Strange can provide. Taking it from there I see that Kandy's strategy is more likely to succeed, even if he has only one hour of prep and I'm kind of hazy about him doing that many things.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Funny thing is, he lives inside the orb of Aggamoto, and Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight. He's also a match for Galactus. Under YOUR rules, he would be perfectly legal for me to summon. Under Evangel's rules, not so much. Come on, she specifically stated no outside help during prep, which is what you're trying to get.

Not at all, Nabu isn't outside help, he's a part of Hector Hall's equipment, much like his helmet. Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight, Nabu lives there even outside of battle. That's his home. Literally, they've had conversations in coffee shops (don't have access to the issues right now but it's in Fate volume 3 issue 3). When Hector Hall was killed by Curse, Nabu was there to taunt him and remind him that he's going to be alright.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Um dude I already said he has cast super-speed spells before, but anyway the speed of sound is a measurement of how fast the vibrations in the air will move to create sound.

Yeah but when has he cast super speed spells while moving greater then the sound barrier? How will his mind even adjust to going that fast?

Now, if he can talk in space and cast spells clearly his spells aren't dependent on Air vibrations, now are they?

Considering him talking is space was due to previous spells themselves (like in IG when he casted that breathing spell on the heroes) and various heroes have talked in space seemingly ignoring all logic, I seriously doubt it.


Dude Banner and Hulk are the SAME PERSON. OMG that's like saying you drafted Spider-Man without Peter Parker.

No it isn't, this just shows your lack of knowledge on the Hulk. Banner and Hulk are entirely different persona's, like Nabu and Hector Hall.


Remember how back in drafting, Evangel said if you sneaked a character in past draft, and then it was proved illegal in a match, it
would still be removed?

Yeah and you haven't proven anything illegal so.....

Anyway, being huge won't stop me from blowing you to atoms by smashing you against a wall.

Considering the spell you invoke will have to be battlefield size (which means yourself will be caught in it) and it's highly out of character for Strange to go in for the kill, it pretty much will.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
No Banner and Hulk are different characters, they've had various conversations with each other and IIRC are even legally acknowledged as different people (hence Banner's immunity to the death penalty).

What I'm doing is no different then having Insane Genis talk to Rick Jones about life during his prep.
Uh huh, what ever happened to Banner and Hulk changing back and forth? There was no Hulk before Banner started changing into him.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Oh that's not it, I'm saying because I'm in Hulk's body now I'm not going to be drained using big time spells like I normally would in Hector Hall's body, essentially making any big time feat that might have killed Fate if he even tried a low level magic spell after casting it a legit weapon to be used in my arsenal with ease.
So basically, you are claiming that if you turn into a big strong guy, you will be able to perform greater feats of magic. I hope you and everyone else can see how stupid that sounds. But w/e, you aren't even Hulk anymore.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Not at all, Nabu isn't outside help, he's a part of Hector Hall's equipment, much like his helmet. Strange calls on his power via invocation almost every fight, Nabu lives there even outside of battle. That's his home. Literally, they've had conversations in coffee shops (don't have access to the issues right now but it's in Fate volume 3 issue 3). When Hector Hall was killed by Curse, Nabu was there to taunt him and remind him that he's going to be alright.
Yeah, also Eternity can be accessed through the Eye of Aggamoto and Dr. Strange uses that ALL THE TIME. So am I allowed to summon Eternity to fight you now?

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah but when has he cast super speed spells while moving greater then the sound barrier? How will his mind even adjust to going that fast?
He will adjust to being that fast because I have an hour of prep for him to practice, and practiced last match as well, both on and off the battlefield. Also, while in Astral Form Strange has casually gone a near-lightspeed without any problems, so he is well practiced with those speeds.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Considering him talking is space was due to previous spells themselves (like in IG when he casted that breathing spell on the heroes) and various heroes have talked in space seemingly ignoring all logic, I seriously doubt it.
No, he goes into space without the aid of breathing spells all the time. In fact i've never actually read a comic where he needed to cast a specific spell before going into space. And like you said, heroes often go and speak in space, Strange is no different. This is a non-issue, he is casting a spell regardless of whether or not it is heard.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
No it isn't, this just shows your lack of knowledge on the Hulk. Banner and Hulk are entirely different persona's, like Nabu and Hector Hall.
They occupy the same body, have been revealed as multiple facets of Banner's personality, and have shared the same mind numerous times. They are different forms/personalities of the same entity.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah and you haven't proven anything illegal so.....
I have been doing it the whole match, the voters we've had so far agree with me.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Considering the spell you invoke will have to be battlefield size (which means yourself will be caught in it) and it's highly out of character for Strange to go in for the kill, it pretty much will.
In the VERY SAME Warlock fight he cast it, they were larger then planets. And actually Strange kills his enemies a lot, like Dracula for instance.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Uh huh, what ever happened to Banner and Hulk changing back and forth?

Hulk and Banner had an AGREEMENT to allow Hulk to stay in the mortal world no matter what. Explain to me how Banner can make an agreement with himself to stay un-powered? Explain to me why Banner would make an agreement with himself?

What I'm doing with my prep is no more then me using Banner to plan when I drafted World War Hulk who doesn't have 1/1000th of the intelligence of Banner.

So basically, you are claiming that if you turn into a big strong guy, you will be able to perform greater feats of magic.

No, I'm claiming that it growing to that size will increase my durability and strength so I can tank whatever little magic spells you put on me and will increase the blast radius of my spells, Hulk's body will allow for greater magic spells because it can take more damage and has much more stamina then a human body.

I hope you and everyone else can see how stupid that sounds. But w/e, you aren't even Hulk anymore.

Duh it sounds stupid, you don't even get the point.

Yeah, also Eternity can be accessed through the Eye of Aggamoto and Dr. Strange uses that ALL THE TIME. So am I allowed to summon Eternity to fight you now?

Um, no, using the stunt I pulled in Hector's body only means a more brutal Hector (as Nabu was overpowered by Hector himself in JSA 58) and the feat in question is a Kent Nelson (which means Dr. Strange) level feat. It's the overall amalgam that puts him over the top. If I were to grow that big in Hector's body like that panel I'd only be able to maintain it for a few seconds

However using this stunt with Strange by himself makes Strange a 20 pointer.

Originally posted by King Kandy
He will adjust to being that fast because I have an hour of prep for him to practice, and practiced last match as well, both on and off the battlefield.

You do not carry knowledge or experience from previous battles.

Originally posted by Bentley
I have to vote now because I have to turn a work for tomorrow, sorry if its too early.

I vote for Kandy.

I agree that some of the prep is illegal and the shield is not deflecting a wide range attack that Strange can provide. Taking it from there I see that Kandy's strategy is more likely to succeed, even if he has only one hour of prep and I'm kind of hazy about him doing that many things.

Sorry, but it is too early to vote. The first twelve (12) hours are reserved for the competitors to debate.

Originally posted by King Kandy
He will adjust to being that fast because I have an hour of prep for him to practice, and practiced last match as well, both on and off the battlefield. Also, while in Astral Form Strange has casually gone a near-lightspeed without any problems, so he is well practiced with those speeds.

And your superspeed is banned from prep as those reflexes allow you to increase the hour. He went near light in astral form probably to travel in a straight line, show instances where he's pulling off multiple spells and reacting in battle at near light.


And like you said, heroes often go and speak in space, Strange is no different.


Yeah which goes to show comic books selective logic in applying sound, how does Strange invoke spells going faster then sound?


They occupy the same body, have been revealed as multiple facets of Banner's personality, and have shared the same mind numerous times. They are different forms/personalities of the same entity.

Exactly different forms and different personalities of the same entity like how Nabu and Hector Hall are different forms of Dr. Fate. They both have access to the same spell bank, but Nabu doesn't need to ask Hector which spell to cast in this situation and Nabu actively participates in ALL of Hector's battles.



I have been doing it the whole match, the voters we've had so far agree with me.

Only thing you've proven that might be illegal is me being able to sense another magician, big whup. Everything else, perfectly within reason.

In the VERY SAME Warlock fight he cast it, they were larger then planets.

What do you mean they were larger then planets? In the VERY SAME Warlock fight they weren't restricted to a shielded arena with a combatant the same size as the arena. You cast your wind spell you will envelop the whole arena, I'm wagering on my odds of surviving being slammed against the wall much better then your odds.

And actually Strange kills his enemies a lot, like Dracula for instance.

Yeah, he kills demons and abominations, not sentient people like the Hulk, Nabu and Hall.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Hulk and Banner had an AGREEMENT to allow Hulk to stay in the mortal world no matter what. Explain to me how Banner can make an agreement with himself to stay un-powered? Explain to me why Banner would make an agreement with himself?
Because Banner has multiple personalities. You know, the personalities he FUSED to become "merged" Hulk? He fused personalities, not actual separate entities.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
What I'm doing with my prep is no more then me using Banner to plan when I drafted World War Hulk who doesn't have 1/1000th of the intelligence of Banner.
Well yeah it is different since Nabu is actually a separate person from Fate.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
No, I'm claiming that it growing to that size will increase my durability and strength so I can tank whatever little magic spells you put on me and will increase the blast radius of my spells, Hulk's body will allow for greater magic spells because it can take more damage and has much more stamina then a human body.
Yeah well it doesn't work like that, bub. Your magic depends solely on your magical powers, not your physical powers.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Um, no, using the stunt I pulled in Hector's body only means a more brutal Hector (as Nabu was overpowered by Hector himself in JSA 58) and the feat in question is a Kent Nelson (which means Dr. Strange) level feat. It's the overall amalgam that puts him over the top. If I were to grow that big in Hector's body like that panel I'd only be able to maintain it for a few seconds
So you can achieve greater levels of magic, not because of any increase in your magically prowess, but because your BODY IS STRONGER? This is a ridiculous insult to my intelligence. So if Dr. Strange took over Thing's body, he would be twice as powerful? You are unbelievable.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
And your superspeed is banned from prep as those reflexes allow you to increase the hour. He went near light in astral form probably to travel in a straight line, show instances where he's pulling off multiple spells and reacting in battle at near light.
No one ever said Superspeed was banned, only that the hour did not increase any. It could be that your time decreases so that it balances out. All that matters is that from your perspective, you get no more then one hour.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah which goes to show comic books selective logic in applying sound, how does Strange invoke spells going faster then sound?
I don't know how he does it, but he does it. He's never had any trouble casting spells no matter what the air condition.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Exactly different forms and different personalities of the same entity like how Nabu and Hector Hall are different forms of Dr. Fate. They both have access to the same spell bank, but Nabu doesn't need to ask Hector which spell to cast in this situation and Nabu actively participates in ALL of Hector's battles.
Well the thing is, Nabu was a separate entity who is inside the helmet, he's not just an alternate personality of Hector, he's a different being.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Only thing you've proven that might be illegal is me being able to sense another magician, big whup. Everything else, perfectly within reason.
Well for one, that's a big deal since you have no reason to prep the way you did. In fact in Psycho's match you immediately went to a slugfest, why aren't you doing it this time considering you don't know you are facing a magician. I've taken steps to insure you think you're fighting Sentry.


Originally posted by Papa Smurph
What do you mean they were larger then planets? In the VERY SAME Warlock fight they weren't restricted to a shielded arena with a combatant the same size as the arena. You cast your wind spell you will envelop the whole arena, I'm wagering on my odds of surviving being slammed against the wall much better then your odds.
Well, i'll be staying on Earth, then cast the spell on everything that ISN'T on the Earth.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
Yeah, he kills demons and abominations, not sentient people like the Hulk, Nabu and Hall.
No, he kills/brutalizes humans all the time as well, like for instance he tried to blow Stygyro to pieces even though he was human.

Vote for Kandy.

The Nabu situation was completely overlooked by Papa, and now it looks like he's trying to use semantics, wordplay and such to cover his own ass.

Not to mention no spying, etc.

Kandy wins because his amalgam is better and because his prep is much closer to feasible.

Thank you.

Voting for Kandy.

Joey's strategy seemed exploitative and I felt much of it lacked logical standing.

This battle was posted on 12:41 PM Central Standard Time. No votes until 12:41 AM Central Standard Time. The 12 hour debate limit is not up. There is still roughly 1 hour and 30 minutes left. If you wish to vote for King Kandy after the debate period is up, then you are free to do so.

With the remaining time left, do either of the competitors wish to make any closing summary statements?

Originally posted by Evangel94
This battle was posted on 12:41 PM Central Standard Time. No votes until 12:41 AM Central Standard Time. The 12 hour debate limit is not up. There is still roughly 1 hour and 30 minutes left. If you wish to vote for King Kandy after the debate period is up, then you are free to do so.

Problem. Most people work tomorrow and won't be able to vote before 12:41 PM. So that was their only time, likely right before bed. I think the match should be extended until maybe 4 CST in order to accommodate those people, because otherwise we'll end up with 4-5 votes max.

Originally posted by Evangel94
This battle was posted on 12:41 PM Central Standard Time. No votes until 12:41 AM Central Standard Time. The 12 hour debate limit is not up. There is still roughly 1 hour and 30 minutes left. If you wish to vote for King Kandy after the debate period is up, then you are free to do so.
If people only have this time to vote, then by all means let them; I have no further arguments to make.

Note to Kandy: A scan of Strange riding a dragonfly probably isn't the best way to start a match of Skyfather-level amalgams.



That said, voting for Kandy. Less to feel iffy about, and Stacks grasping at straws with "sensing" instead of spying kinda turned me off. I didn't see Evangel make an official ruling about the Nabu thing, but as I see it, the ban is on "outside help." Nabu is a separate person from Hector, and if Nabu had been drafted it wouldn't have been at 6 pts. Stacks tried to say he's a part of Hector, which is false. He's a part of Dr. Fate, but Stacks drafted "Dr. Fate (Hector Hall)." It would be like drafting Adam Warlock and having access to all of his different incarnations. Or Cpt. Mar-vell and getting anyone to ever share the title.

If Stacks had stayed away from such conjectures, he would've had a great shot at winning imo. There's a lot to like in both of these amalgams.

Hmm....maybe I will reduce the debating period then.

.

This is the only time I have to vote and yes its right before bed, and yes I won't get home til 5pm mountain time tomorrow.

Voting for kandy his was less iffy.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
but as I see it, the ban is on "outside help." Nabu is a separate person from Hector, and if Nabu had been drafted it wouldn't have been at 6 pts. Stacks tried to say he's a part of Hector, which is false.


Untrue, Nabu is a part of Hector's equipment.

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/Nabustillgotit.jpg

"The Helmet of Nabu whispers to its new wearer.....and the man behind the helmet does simply what is told"

"The Helmet is informing me of the spell"

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/Nabuisit.jpg

"The helmet has told me of Black Adam"

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/StillinHelmet.jpg

"Maybe he's just gone further into the Helmet.....He's made the place his own"

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/WereInsidetheHelm.jpg

"We're inside the Helm"

Hay look, family reunion

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/Familyreunion.jpg

A more accurate analogy would be drafting Insane Genis and talking to Rick Jones about stuff, which I'm sure nobody would have had a problem with or even better, drafting Venom (Eddie Brock) and getting the sentient symbiote

I am extending the voting period of this match until 5PM Central Standard Time.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Note to Kandy: A scan of Strange riding a dragonfly probably isn't the best way to start a match of Skyfather-level amalgams.



That said, voting for Kandy. Less to feel iffy about, and Stacks grasping at straws with "sensing" instead of spying kinda turned me off. I didn't see Evangel make an official ruling about the Nabu thing, but as I see it, the ban is on "outside help." Nabu is a separate person from Hector, and if Nabu had been drafted it wouldn't have been at 6 pts. Stacks tried to say he's a part of Hector, which is false. He's a part of Dr. Fate, but Stacks drafted "Dr. Fate (Hector Hall)." It would be like drafting Adam Warlock and having access to all of his different incarnations. Or Cpt. Mar-vell and getting anyone to ever share the title.

If Stacks had stayed away from such conjectures, he would've had a great shot at winning imo. There's a lot to like in both of these amalgams.

Pretty much the reason for me voting for Kandy as well, oh, and Papa's ridiculous attempt to state that physical and mental stamina are the same thing.

King Kandy was much more plausible with his strategy...

nobody was "more plausible", both write ups were strange as hell.

I sort of hope that smurph doesn't get in trouble for the nabu thing cause it's sort of late now for that, we had a lot of time and dc know it alls for that to slip by.

back to re-reading this convoluted mess.........uugggg!

for the next tournament, no mages or sorcerers cause they are too hard to judge and write for.

Joey, don't play with semantics. In the post above where you responded to me it's "The Helmet of Nabu" which is a far cry from "Nabu." But multiple times in your posts you specifically stated that Hector was "gone" and Nabu had taken his place. If it was only the helmet, I wouldn't have had a problem with it, but you actually replaced the people in your amalgam.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Joey, don't play with semantics. In the post above where you responded to me it's "The Helmet of Nabu" which is a far cry from "Nabu." But multiple times in your posts you specifically stated that Hector was "gone" and Nabu had taken his place. If it was only the helmet, I wouldn't have had a problem with it, but you actually replaced the people in your amalgam.

That's because it is Nabu, Jesus.

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/Ohlooknabu.jpg

"My helmet, the voice of Nabu is silenced"

Only person playing semantics is yourself, I have no problem being voted against, I do have a problem with you disregarding legal manuevers because you don't like them.

Hell look at the quote taken directly from the wiki article which was in clear view for any contestants who had a problem with Fate

"Hall had operated as Doctor Fate from Salem since then, with Nabu - again inhabiting the helm, but no longer controlling Fate - advising him. The Nelsons' souls still resided within the amulet, and they were occasionally able to contact the outside world (including Kent once having encountered the 1990s Starman). Hall's identity is known to a clever few who have figured it out, and in his secret identity, he socialized with some of the inhabitants of Salem, being on the whole more gregarious than his predecessors"

"Nabu had been verbally abusing Hector ever since the latter had taken on the mantle"

Oh my gosh it's Nabu talking to Hector for one last scan

http://i245.photobucket.com/albums/gg68/Brobinson06/OmygoshNabu.jpg

It has nothing to do with me "liking them" or not, and I'm insulted at the implication. I, like others, made an objective assessment about the match, and felt that you lost. Don't make it personal, because it isn't.

And just as a word of advice, maybe you're right even despite the votes so far. But statements like "Nabu replaces the completely GONE Hector" don't help your cause, nor does trying to use feats from non-Hector Fate. It's stuff like that which has you down in the voting, not helmet's whispering to Hector.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
It has nothing to do with me "liking them" or not, and I'm insulted at the implication. I, like others, made an objective assessment about the match, and felt that you lost. Don't make it personal, because it isn't.

Then maybe you should recant your stance?

"Nabu replaces the completely GONE Hector" don't help your cause

Why? Hector is gone because he's at a level of pissed where he cannot control himself.

, nor does trying to use feats from non-Hector Fate.

Which are spells Nabu has access to.


It's stuff like that which has you down in the voting, not helmet's whispering to Hector.

No, it's pretty much Nabu talking to Hector.

Your argument in a nutshell is Nabu doesn't replace Hector because I don't like it.

I'm able to use Hector feats that stem from Nabu being in his helmet telling him how to incant such and such, but I can't use Nabu, somehow.

I don't care about being voted against or losing, I do care that your reasoning is unfound and has zero backing and selective reasoning applied to it.

Voting for Kandy

Originally posted by Devil Lance
Voting for Kandy

If you don't mind, could you include a brief sentence or two as to why? Your vote still counts, but saying why you voted that way could help the participants improve themselves.

Voting for Kandy in case my last one didn't count or something.

Vote for Kandy

voting for papa smurph.

I scraped the ludicrous write ups and looked at the bios and feats of the characters picked, I had no choice.

the aversion field although unexplained really
it provides more than enough protection from most of the attacks kandy can muster. strange nullifies hector hall but the aversion field nullifies speed blitz + hulk powers i summarize a win for smurph

Originally posted by id369
Vote for Kandy

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
Voting for Kandy in case my last one didn't count or something.

Could both of you please give reasons why?

Originally posted by Evangel94
Could both of you please give reasons why?

I listed them before.

Originally posted by Symmetric Chaos
I listed them before.

I just wanted to make sure that your opinion didn't change in past 12 hours or so. Has it changed in anyway shape or form now that the debate period is over?

Originally posted by Evangel94
I just wanted to make sure that your opinion didn't change in past 12 hours or so. Has it changed in anyway shape or form now that the debate period is over?

Nope.

Revote for Kandy.

I just want to take this opportunity to tell everyone how glad I am you voted for me. This is my best showing in a tourney so far.

Kandy.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I just want to take this opportunity to tell everyone how glad I am you voted for me. This is my best showing in a tourney so far. You're welcome.

^7 posts doesn't permit you to say that.

Neither does socking illegally, but as usual we can just ignore him.

Is there such a thing as socking legally?

Originally posted by Bentley
Is there such a thing as socking legally?

Technically, yes, if there's a lost password or something similar. Generally people contact us about that stuff rather than trying to hide a sock, which is dealt with more harshly. But one or the other has to be banned eventually anyway in such cases, but no disciplinary action comes against them.

Match over. At first glance it appears King Kandy wins. I'll calculate the definite votes momentarily.

Originally posted by Evangel94
Match over. At first glance it appears King Kandy wins. I'll calculate the definite votes momentarily.
Sorry if I missed the cut off, but my vote's for Kandy if it matters...

Originally posted by psycho gundam
^7 posts doesn't permit you to say that. I edited his post because he was bashing KK.

What did he say?

I agreed with what he said. >_>

Originally posted by King Kandy
What did he say? He's going around telling people they fail. Originally posted by id369
I agreed with what he said. >_> durfist

Originally posted by Badabing
He's going around telling people they fail. durfist
OMG how horrible!

Originally posted by Badabing
I edited his post because he was bashing KK.

Perhaps it would have been better to let Psycho Gundam say what he wanted to say this one time, then give him a very stern warning, instead of outright editing his post. Editing his post may just make him mad and give him the urge to post it outright again.

However this is only my thoughts on the matter, as I too am curious to what he said since he is a tournament participant.

Originally posted by Evangel94
Perhaps it would have been better to let Psycho Gundam say what he wanted to say this one time, then give him a very stern warning, instead of outright editing his post. That may just make him mad and make him post again.

However this is only my thoughts on the matter, as I too am curious to what he said since he is a tournament participant. I edited Sleek's post.

Originally posted by Badabing
I edited Sleek's post.

Oh sorry. I was confused since you quoted Psycho Gundam. Go ahead and do whatever you want to do when it comes to that useless sad sock.

Final Thoughts?

Originally posted by Evangel94
Oh sorry. I was confused since you quoted Psycho Gundam. Go ahead and do whatever you want to do when it comes to that useless sad sock. lulz


No problem Evangel94.

Originally posted by Badabing
I edited his post because he was bashing KK. .

Originally posted by Evangel94
Oh sorry. I was confused since you quoted Psycho Gundam. Go ahead and do whatever you want to do when it comes to that useless sad sock. .

Originally posted by Sleek
. Silence whore.

Votes for King Kandy: 10
Zeitgeist
Symmetric Chaos
DigiMark007
Creshosk
Charlotte DeBel
Devil Lance
Symmetric Chaos
id369
Bentley
darthgoober


Votes for Papa Smurph: 1
psycho gundam

I don't have a problem with the helmet giving advice to Hector if there is an entity inside. However, possession? You'd have to provide proof that Nabu does that, and two that it is feasible for him to do so in this match with Hector.

So Kandy's entire argument about Nabu and the living entities inside of the Helmet being outside interference was null like I said it was.

O well.

Originally posted by Papa Smurph
So Kandy's entire argument about Nabu and the living entities inside of the Helmet being outside interference was null like I said it was.

O well.

I don't mind advisement, but the possession seems like mind control to me.

Oh it's a thing Nabu has done in the past when he got annoyed with Hector's incompetence.

Final Thoughts: Some of the weirdest tactics I've seen using magic users. Dr. Strange riding giant insects into battle, and Dr. Fate growing to humongous proportions and becoming a giant. Personally, I would like to have seen more time invested in showing more actual spells that both characters have done instead of all this theoretical craziness. Bands of Cytorak, Mystic Energy Bolts, etc. Staying true to what the comic has actually shown is more solid in my book, and gives you a more solid foundation to work with.

The initial strategy of nabu possessing Hall put voters off, and clinched this match for Kandy. However, all is not lost, and Papa Smurph can make some minor tweaks to his prep for a better strategy.

King Kandy goes to the fourth round with 2 straight victories, while Papa Smurph goes to the third round with all those that have a 1-1 record.