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Team 1:
Sin
z3Rguv_rwlU
Onimusha 3 Nobunaga
Soul Reaver 2 Raziel

vs.

Team 2:
Ganon at his strongest
KOS-MOS Ver. 4
OHkpob334p0
Seifer at his strongest
OoIUKzW5mMg


---------------------

Which trio wins?

Team 2.

I was surprised at first. Then I read who was on team 2 and I was like. heh.

Originally posted by Blax_Hydralisk
I was surprised at first. Then I read who was on team 2 and I was like. heh.

Yeah.

theyll all die, leave Raziel and Kos-mos, Kos-mos has no soul and would blast Raziel to bits constantly, forever onwards but Team 2 thx to Kosmos

Really? KOS-MOS makes it that uneven? She's fast and strong but if she's hit with any massive magic she has no real defense.

shes supposedly incredible powerful, and her weapons were not taken away so anyone with a debate can use that TWS that can destroy planets or suns i think it was, ime not expert on her but i know she is damned powerful and outmatches most of everyone in this matchup imo

I know her powerset perfectly. Her TWS are not standard equip. Her only other man qeapon is a little sci-fi blaster and her tiny Phase Transfer Cannon. Sure we're tol.d the things can destroy stars but we know for a fact their destructive output can be lowered so I see no reason KOS-MOS iwll be suddenly shooting starbusters here when she never did in the game.

Plus seriously speaking, look at the size ratio between Sin and Kossy. He might squish her.

Well thats not a good matchup then is it, if she never did in the game but her weapons can do so, if shes put to the test she may have to let rip, also most of the time in the game clips ive been shown, her allies are all around her, she has no reason to go all out, yet in this matchup, i doubt she will limit herself

if she can blow suns then Team 1 are nothing, none of their powers from what i know will save them, Raziel doesnt really have anything, he could take the other two no problem but Kosmos would have to be double teamed by Sin and whoever Nobunga is and hit with all their most powerful spells, ime not sure her durabiity is low either.

KOS-MOS can't blow up suns.
And Raziel could not beat Ganon and Seifer at the same time. Unless he plans to have his body destroyed five billion times.

you only just said you know her weapons well and that they can blow up stars

lawlz, both Ganon and Seifer would be easy meat, he would immediatley take one out of the fight with TK shackles, preferably one who cannot teleport or go ethereal, if both of them can then he can still use it to keep them away, at the same time as being an invisible annoying soul stealing bugger, their screwweeeddd

It's stated that the Phase Transfer Cannon can blow up stars but the one KOS-MOS uses never displayed this level of power. Since she can control the output of the weapon, it's very liikely her version is incapable of that level of destruction. The Phase Transfer Cannon that can supposedly destroy stars is massively bigger than the one strapped to Kossy's chest.



TK Shackles require focus. So, he can't just TK one up then turn his attention to another person and continue holding the other in the shackles.



That's if he can hit either of them which he probably can't.

Originally posted by Pyron_is_God
It's stated that the Phase Transfer Cannon can blow up stars but the one KOS-MOS uses never displayed this level of power. Since she can control the output of the weapon, it's very liikely her version is incapable of that level of destruction. The Phase Transfer Cannon that can supposedly destroy stars is massively bigger than the one strapped to Kossy's chest.



TK Shackles require focus. So, he can't just TK one up then turn his attention to another person and continue holding the other in the shackles.



That's if he can hit either of them which he probably can't.

well if the one that blows up stars is much larger, then maybe she cannot, either way, the blast from it is likely more than enough to destroy most of this opposition

no it doesnt, what makes you assume that? you just have to target, and in a split second the target is in TK shackles, and you can run around and fight other opponents

hitting them wont be the problem, he will just go spectoral and then appear material inside of them

Sure. If Sin doesn't just step on her first.



I've played Defiance. When you TK someone you can not do anything else. If you stop holding the button for TK ie. stop focusing on TK holding tha tperson, they drop to the ground and get up ready to attack.



Raziel never did this to anyone in any game.

Originally posted by Pyron_is_God
Sure. If Sin doesn't just step on her first.



I've played Defiance. When you TK someone you can not do anything else. If you stop holding the button for TK ie. stop focusing on TK holding tha tperson, they drop to the ground and get up ready to attack.



Raziel never did this to anyone in any game.

when did Sin step on anyone in the game?

Thats normal TK, ime talking about TK shackles which is the last TK move you get, you need to just press towards the opponent, tap the TK button and they are stuck in the air and you can do what you like after that to enemies around

no he did not...and? if this is just gameplay then Seifer better wait his turn, and Sin i belive. Their turn based characters

Originally posted by Burning thought
when did Sin step on anyone in the game?

Didn't he crush chappu, wakkas brother?

Anyways all i know is that kos mos is damm powerful, but her x buster attack is not instant as opposed to ordinary spells.

I dunno. When did Godzilla crush anyone in his movies?
Even if he didn't, are you saying Godzilla couldn't step on and crush someone?

Again, size ratio is important.
Unless you're Mario.



Ah. Do they just...stay there? Or fall down after a while?



You're the one using gameplay.

It also is a Gnosis-specific mov.e Sin ain't a Gnosis.

Originally posted by Pyron_is_God
I dunno. When did Godzilla crush anyone in his movies?
Even if he didn't, are you saying Godzilla couldn't step on and crush someone?

Again, size ratio is important.
Unless you're Mario.



Ah. Do they just...stay there? Or fall down after a while?



You're the one using gameplay.

exactley.....so the fact Raziel can go through material and physical means he could easily go spectoral, then into material with his wraith blade inside someone....

They stay there for a long while, ive never left it long enough tho for someone to fall out of the shackles

Ganon would crush Raziel. Stronger, faster, more durable, immortal, more powerful, more versatile, more skilled and more experienced, Ganon would crush Raziel with the utmost ease.

Go material in Ganon, that would only fvck up Raziel, as Ganon is invulnerable.

Prove he is invulerable to soul attacks, the ethereal reaver would spiritually go through Ganon and rip out his soul, unless you can prove he has soul protection?

stronger? not sure about that, Raziel has a good ton or two in his arms and his claws are powerful

your also overlooking Raziel has so many powerful elemental attacks as well as the Glyphs

Originally posted by Burning thought
Prove he is invulerable to soul attacks, the ethereal reaver would spiritually go through Ganon and rip out his soul, unless you can prove he has soul protection?

stronger? not sure about that, Raziel has a good ton or two in his arms and his claws are powerful

your also overlooking Raziel has so many powerful elemental attacks as well as the Glyphs 1. The fact that he is not turned into a harmless soul by the Twilight realm? Ganon did not create the Twilight realm, he is just able to merge it with the real world, he would be turned to a harmless soul, but he is not, he can resist soul attacks. Hell, he isn't even turned into an animal like Link, whose soul is only safe due to the Triforce of Courage. And slashing Ganon would only weaken Raziel, as slashing him while his invulnerability is on weakens the attacker, as shown in Windwaker.

2. And Ganon just leaps from under the weight of a castle that just collapsed on him while half dead. Compare.

3. Ganon has more power, like freezing a city, turning villages into spirits, and others. And Ganon is invulnerable, so...yeah.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. The fact that he is not turned into a harmless soul by the Twilight realm? Ganon did not create the Twilight realm, he is just able to merge it with the real world, he would be turned to a harmless soul, but he is not, he can resist soul attacks. Hell, he isn't even turned into an animal like Link, whose soul is only safe due to the Triforce of Courage. And slashing Ganon would only weaken Raziel, as slashing him while his invulnerability is on weakens the attacker, as shown in Windwaker.

2. And Ganon just leaps from under the weight of a castle that just collapsed on him while half dead. Compare.

3. Ganon has more power, like freezing a city, turning villages into spirits, and others. And Ganon is invulnerable, so...yeah.

1. you will have to show me this to debate it as an argument, show me the specifics, the twilight realm is not exactley a sword that hungers for the souls of others for example, that much sounds true even if i dont know the realm, so show me please

2. thats not strength if all he had was a few blocks on top of him, show me him crawling from his castle, if the whole castle was stacked on him which is impossible then it would be diffrent, but having your castle fall on your, would mean the debris is scattered, youll have to show me this as well

3. Raziel is just as invulerable, infact better so since if his body is destroyed he can come back somewhere else, constantly having time on his side, its near impossible to even defeat raziel because he could just go back to the spectoral plane if you try. Freezing a city wont help him if hes frozen in a block of ice, or frozen in TK

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. you will have to show me this to debate it as an argument, show me the specifics, the twilight realm is not exactley a sword that hungers for the souls of others for example, that much sounds true even if i dont know the realm, so show me please

2. thats not strength if all he had was a few blocks on top of him, show me him crawling from his castle, if the whole castle was stacked on him which is impossible then it would be diffrent, but having your castle fall on your, would mean the debris is scattered, youll have to show me this as well



3. Raziel is just as invulerable, infact better so since if his body is destroyed he can come back somewhere else, constantly having time on his side, its near impossible to even defeat raziel because he could just go back to the spectoral plane if you try. Freezing a city wont help him if hes frozen in a block of ice, or frozen in TK 1. I am not sure what vids I would have to look up to get this specific info to be honest...basically, it was HEAVILY implied Link in TP had the Triforce of Courage(the reason why the Twilight Realm couldn't touch his soul and he had extreme strength), and Ganon with his arcane mastery and Triforce of Power completely protected him. I have no idea which vid to look for, and I don't feel like playing the game all over again to find out lol.

2. No, he was buried. In this vid, he was buried under the largest piles of debris, and bursting out of debris that is crushing you while half dead>>>lifting a few tons, which I don't remember Raziel ever doing actually.

xgDmdh5RFyc

3. No, he is immortal, not invulnerable, he can be injured easily. Ganon froze an entire city...yet Raziel's ice powers>Ganon's? Riiiiiight...Also, Ice Arrows do not affect Ganon. Frozen in TK? Teleport or intangibility.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. I am not sure what vids I would have to look up to get this specific info to be honest...basically, it was HEAVILY implied Link in TP had the Triforce of Courage(the reason why the Twilight Realm couldn't touch his soul and he had extreme strength), and Ganon with his arcane mastery and Triforce of Power completely protected him. I have no idea which vid to look for, and I don't feel like playing the game all over again to find out lol.

2. No, he was buried. In this vid, he was buried under the largest piles of debris, and bursting out of debris that is crushing you while half dead>>>lifting a few tons, which I don't remember Raziel ever doing actually.

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3. No, he is immortal, not invulnerable, he can be injured easily. Ganon froze an entire city...yet Raziel's ice powers>Ganon's? Riiiiiight...Also, Ice Arrows do not affect Ganon. Frozen in TK? Teleport or intangibility.

1. "shrug"but anyway, their completly diffrent regardless, some realm does not= a ravenous soul reaver blade straight through your body draining at your soul

2. hm i dont see the vid, post the link plz and you dont remember raziel lifting tonnes? lol.....have you played any of the games? Raziel is constantly lifting tonnes of rock, large metal slabs, pillars, in Soul reaver 1 i can remmeber him lifting a block that has to be 2/3 tons in weight, then placing that block over another one and pulling them all, thats a good 6/7 tonnes in his arms already

3. easily lol? he tanks tonnes going into him by Kain and others, he is not done in "easily", especially not within Ganons power to do him in so "easily", not Raziels ice powers>Ganons, Raziels ice powers>Ganon, can i be shown this as well plz? the teleport and intangibility, to make sure if its a duration thing or takes a long time to do.

Just want to throw this scene out there for a Sin feat
SJp8f3GYqYU

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. "shrug"but anyway, their completly diffrent regardless, some realm does not= a ravenous soul reaver blade straight through your body draining at your soul

2. hm i dont see the vid, post the link plz

3. easily lol? he tanks tonnes going into him by Kain and others, he is not done in "easily", especially not within Ganons power to do him in so "easily", not Raziels ice powers>Ganons, Raziels ice powers>Ganon, can i be shown this as well plz? the teleport and intangibility, to make sure if its a duration thing or takes a long time to do. 1. It is still a soul attack. He was immune to it.

2. Fixed, and when has Raziel lifted tons?

3. Kain cannot output as much damage as say...castles falling on him(has happened twice actually), a giant dragon spirit flamethrowing him, among others. Ice Arrows>Raziel's freezing, or at least equals. I can't find a vid of his freezing the city, only its effects, but he has frozen Zelda instantly without even being present. The tele and intangibility? I have a vid both, of demon Ganon teleing in battle(demon Ganon<human in magic) and human Ganon intangibility. Once again, sorry for crap quality.

nFt_dN7pMR4

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. It is still a soul attack. He was immune to it.

2. Fixed, and when has Raziel lifted tons?

3. Kain cannot output as much damage as say...castles falling on him(has happened twice actually), a giant dragon spirit flamethrowing him, among others. Ice Arrows>Raziel's freezing, or at least equals. I can't find a vid of his freezing the city, only its effects, but he has frozen Zelda instantly without even being present. The tele and intangibility? I have a vid both, of demon Ganon teleing in battle(demon Ganon<human in magic) and human Ganon intangibility. Once again, sorry for crap quality.

nFt_dN7pMR4

1. but not really an attack, if its just a realm that takes souls, its not the same as an actual sword inside you that is draining you from within

2. ty, its difficult to see by that Vid how big the castle was and how much Ganon actually broke out of, he was still only breaking out of a section of the castle, so saying breaking out of his castle to me sounded better than breaking out of part of it, and i answered it in an edit above

3. oh i dont know, a castle falling on you is not hte same as being hit dead on by claws that slash through metal and conrete with the weight of tonnes behind them. I dont know the damage of this spirit, being burned in fire is the least of Raziels worries, hes already touched the waters and survived for a good thousands of years, that>Spirirt dragon fire for a moment. Can you please say the time when the events happen, i dont really see the tele/intang

Team 1 gets hurbed.

Originally posted by Burning thought
1. but not really an attack, if its just a realm that takes souls, its not the same as an actual sword inside you that is draining you from within

2. ty, its difficult to see by that Vid how big the castle was and how much Ganon actually broke out of, he was still only breaking out of a section of the castle, so saying breaking out of his castle to me sounded better than breaking out of part of it, and i answered it in an edit above

3. oh i dont know, a castle falling on you is not hte same as being hit dead on by claws that slash through metal and conrete with the weight of tonnes behind them. I dont know the damage of this spirit, being burned in fire is the least of Raziels worries, hes already touched the waters and survived for a good thousands of years, that>Spirirt dragon fire for a moment. Can you please say the time when the events happen, i dont really see the tele/intang 1. It takes souls, and on a greater range than Raziel's soul powers, who has to weaken an enemy before it will take a soul. You're just denying it because you need a way for Raz to win.

2. ...do you want to see how big it was before it fell? The majority of the rubble was on Ganon, in the middle. And that was still more weight than anything Raz has ever lifted. I thought he only pushed large blocks? And there is a HUGE difference between pushing and lifting 6 tons.

3. You're right, it's better. He has had castles fall on him, didn't die when stabbed in the head with the Master Sword when he did not have his Triforce, and Ganon hits harder than Raz ever will. And then there is the obvious fact that Ganondorf is not only immortal, but invulnerable as well.He survived in water because he had built up a resistance to water by that point. And Spirit Dragon fire combined with his castle crashing down at same time>>>water. You don't see the tele? He teles throughout the entire fight as beast Ganon, and right before he possesses Zelda, he becomes intangible to do it, and he does it right after being beaten as a demon.

Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
1. It takes souls, and on a greater range than Raziel's soul powers, who has to weaken an enemy before it will take a soul. You're just denying it because you need a way for Raz to win.

2. ...do you want to see how big it was before it fell? The majority of the rubble was on Ganon, in the middle. And that was still more weight than anything Raz has ever lifted. I thought he only pushed large blocks? And there is a HUGE difference between pushing and lifting 6 tons.

3. You're right, it's better. He has had castles fall on him, didn't die when stabbed in the head with the Master Sword when he did not have his Triforce, and Ganon hits harder than Raz ever will. And then there is the obvious fact that Ganondorf is not only immortal, but invulnerable as well.He survived in water because he had built up a resistance to water by that point. And Spirit Dragon fire combined with his castle crashing down at same time>>>water. You don't see the tele? He teles throughout the entire fight as beast Ganon, and right before he possesses Zelda, he becomes intangible to do it, and he does it right after being beaten as a demon.

1. He just has to impale them with the reaver.....ime denying it because i can see the obvious diffrent between some realm, and a fully agressive soul devouring entity

2. He lifts when he pulls them up and over eachother to get to higher locations, and yes, they are large blocks, big conrete blocks taller than he is, each one easily 3/4 tonnes but yeh id like to see teh size of the whole castle as well as how much actually fell on ganon

3. Ganon hits harder? lmao......how so? until you show me him lifting up to 6 tonnes ill not change my view, not to mention raziels claws are sharp blades and thats without the reaver. What? where did you get that from, prove this please, i dont remember anything saying Raziel had a resistence to it as he was thrown into the Abyss and no i disagree, water on Raziel swirling in the Abyss>>>>lame fire on ganon for what, how long? a few seconds or minutes, not thousands of years...