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Post-suit Vader. Vitiate, unamped, as he appears in Revan.

Starting distance is 20 feet; who wins and why?

Vader stomps yea, valk has a better shot

Vit, obviously.

Vitiate stomps.

Vader pretty easily

Vitiate destroys Vader.

Vitiate was going to lose to a shit team of Meetra/Scourge

Vader TKED Palpatine, forced him to defend hmself, and withstood his lightning

Vitiate gets blitzed

Legends or Canon?

Anyway, Vitiate beats Legends Vader in a decent fight, but it's not a stomp.

Vader wins, and it's not that close.

Originally posted by carthage
Vitiate gets blitzed

canon vader would destroy vitiate.

You already voiced your opinion in the second post of the thread. I don't think anyone asked for a clarification.

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
canon vader would destroy vitiate.

*shrugs*

@Rocky: Please don't quote this sentence by sentence as a response. I'm not debating. This isn't aimed particularly at you - just my overall thoughts to everyone, really.

Should be noted that, if we are doing Canon vs Legends, characters in Canon are generally far less powerful than their Legends counterparts. The only two exceptions would be Yoda and Darth Vader, but that's simply because they are portrayed in a comic medium, if you ask me. I wonder if their feats would transfer fluidity into a TV or film setting, or if they are exaggerated like the microseries was in the eyes of Canon creators like Dave Filoni. I'm inclined to believe the latter, since we know from the TV series that a character of Dooku's power would be unable to shield himself or telekinetically dominate thirty pirates trying to attack him without a lightsaber.

In regards to Canon Darth Vader, he's blatantly not as powerful as his The Force Unleashed incarnation, but he is better than all his other ones. His confrontations with the cyborgs in the first season of his comics was not impressive, however. His telekinetic feats were great, but I also wonder if telekinesis is being used as a great indicator of Force power like it was in Legends. For example, Darth Vader's telekinesis might be the greatest of the Canon Sith Lords, but Darth Sidious would still be more powerful than him with the Force, which would then be explicitly demonstrated with his Force lightning that is capable of matching Yoda. It seems that the Sith Lords are a lot more specialized than generalized, if you get what I mean. Anyway, I repeat that Darth Vader surviving Malachor is not a feat because we do not know the circumstances behind it. Attributing it as a feat is ridiculous, since you could easily write that feat off as better than probably anyone has ever did ever. The reality is we don't know what happened, but Filoni has commented that a lot went down. It's just as possible Ahsoka Tano helped shield Vader as a final sacrificial act.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Anyway, I repeat that Darth Vader surviving Malachor is not a feat because we do not know the circumstances behind it. Attributing it as a feat is ridiculous, since you could easily write that feat off as better than probably anyone has ever did ever. The reality is we don't know what happened, but Filoni has commented that a lot went down. It's just as possible Ahsoka Tano helped shield Vader as a final sacrificial act.

That is why we go with Occam's Razor. The temple blew up with Vader right in the middle of the blast. Later on Vader is seen walking out of the ruins, injured but very much alive. The conclusion to draw from that is painfully obvious; anything else is baseless speculation.

Legends Vader has arguably better feats anyway.

There's no painfully obvious answer when we see what appears to be Ahsoka also descending down into the temple that was supposed to just have been destroyed by the giant explosion.

Surprised and saddened to see you're still on KMC, though.

Ant still struggling to come to terms with the facts, sad.

even if it was ahsoka+vader, the feat would still be vastly beyond vitiate's paygrade.

Originally posted by Azronger
is painfully obvious; anything else is baseless speculation.

Legends Vader has arguably better feats anyway.
Such as?

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
I wonder if their feats would transfer fluidity into a TV or film setting, or if they are exaggerated like the microseries was in the eyes of Canon creators like Dave Filoni. I'm inclined to believe the latter, since we know from the TV series that a character of Dooku's power would be unable to shield himself or telekinetically dominate thirty pirates trying to attack him without a lightsaber.

Probably considering Dark Jedi Lycan killed a casino full of about 30+ beings without even making a gesture and there's instances of guys taking on near or greater than 30 people in Legends.

Ya know the thing that gets me the most is....of all things, why pirates?.

I'm more confused than mad about it, though it still bothers me.

They could have done that a little better, mercenaries would have made a little more sense and would been better.

Vitiate beat Revan who is > Vader. Therefore Vitiate wins.

care to explain what revan's done on par with putting up a barrier capable of withstanding an explosion capable of dissolving ships

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
care to explain what revan's done on par with putting up a barrier capable of withstanding an explosion capable of dissolving ships
Tanking the full force of an attack capable of destroying anything and everything within a one-kilometre radius, and putting up a barrier to prevent himself from being harmed by the likes of Nox and the Wrath while he did it.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
There's no painfully obvious answer when we see what appears to be Ahsoka also descending down into the temple that was supposed to just have been destroyed by the giant explosion.

And that contradicts the notion of Vader tanking the blast how?



Poor Ant is sad

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Such as?

http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=16181170#post16181170

yea I think the malachor exploion's better tbh

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
even if it was ahsoka+vader, the feat would still be vastly beyond vitiate's paygrade.
facepalm

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
yea I think the malachor exploion's better tbh
No, it is overblown. It was a conventional explosion of energy

Superweapon was not activated in that.

Well this should be interesting.

Originally posted by Azronger
And that contradicts the notion of Vader tanking the blast how?
Because it suggests that the blast wasn't what it's implied to be if the temple was still intact.

Seems like a pretty ****ing weak blast.

Remember tho, ancient sith superweapons including the Malachor thing were powered by kyber crystals and 1 kyber crystal completely disintegrated an Imperial convoy!

So clearly, Vader has more durability than star cruisers. ...

Frankly, it seems to me this whole kyber crystal thing is just more a plot thing, it works as powerful as the story wants it to.

Either that or the sith superweapon was degraded and it wasn't as powerful as it once was.

-

Originally posted by Zenwolf
Remember tho, ancient sith superweapons including the Malachor thing were powered by kyber crystals and 1 kyber crystal completely disintegrated an Imperial convoy!

So clearly, Vader has more durability than star cruisers. ...

Frankly, it seems to me this whole kyber crystal thing is just more a plot thing, it works as powerful as the story wants it to.

Either that or the sith superweapon was degraded and it wasn't as powerful as it once was.
It seems to me the whole draining the planet of ziost was more a plot thing.

It seems to me Revan holding his own against the strike team was a plot thing.

It seems to me crying pis when we don't like how powerful someone isn't a valid argument

Damn you edit time limit.

But to add, Dave has also said he doesn't want Force Users being Superhero like or whatever like they were in Legends, so if that instance is true, then well...he just completely screwed over his own words on that.

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
It seems to me the whole draining the planet of ziost was more a plot thing.

It seems to me Revan holding his own against the strike team was a plot thing.

It seems to me crying pis when we don't like how powerful someone isn't a valid argument

Those 2 instances make at least some sense.

The draining of Ziost, draining planets wasn't anything new, Nihilus done it, Sidious done it, that one Sith Socreress with that ancient relic she built done it.

Plus Vitiate/Valk/Whoever he wants to be called, had prep work done. It didn't just happen on a whim.

Revan, we literally have no details on anything, other than a fight happened and ended, because game stuff. Games work differently than the lore paints it.

I actually could care less frankly, but hey if Vader has this kind of durability...then why the hell does anything less affect him?

I mean if he's having this kind of durability, nothing should really be harming him at all.

Plus again Dave has said, he doesn't view Force Users as these Superhero like people like they were in Legends or whatever, that instance would completely disregard that statement.

its not durability, its Vader putting up a defensive force barrier

I don't really feel like addressing appeals to incredulity.

Vader has demonstrated vastly greater power than vitiate and accordingly stomps

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
its not durability, its Vader putting up a defensive force barrier

I don't really feel like addressing appeals to incredulity.

Vader has demonstrated vastly greater power than vitiate and accordingly stomps

So then I guess Dave just changes things on a whim and nothing he says or does can ever be taken seriously, good to know there.

Cause he's said he doesn't want any superhero like things coming from Force Users, but I guess making these strong ass Force Barriers that are greater than a convoy worth of Imperial ships doesn't fall there.

Even though he had Dooku surrendering to some 30 pirates and he being one of the most powerful Sith Lords in Canon.

Viti spites lol

Vader withstood the explosion of Cymoon 1, Palpatine's lightning, the explosion of the Sith superweapon, fire from AT-ATS

Vitiate's lightning isn't doing shit.

Originally posted by Zenwolf
So then I guess Dave just changes things on a whim and nothing he says or does can ever be taken seriously, good to know there.

Cause he's said he doesn't want any superhero like things coming from Force Users, but I guess making these strong ass Force Barriers that are greater than a convoy worth of Imperial ships doesn't fall there.

Even though he had Dooku surrendering to some 30 pirates and he being one of the most powerful Sith Lords in Canon.
1. Feloni oversaw the episode where Vader was uber powerful showing he intended for vader to be uber powerful. Feloni shows vader to be powerful and so he is.

2. Dooku isn't Vader.

If anything, Vader performing a feat vastly above vitiate's paygrade despite being in a medium wher eforce users are lowballed should be a pretty clear indication who's better here.

Originally posted by carthage
Vader withstood the explosion of Cymoon 1, Palpatine's lightning, the explosion of the Sith superweapon, fire from AT-ATS

Vitiate's lightning isn't doing shit.
Zen's excuses are irrelevant

Originally posted by Rockydonovang
Zen's excuses are irrelevant

Not really excusing it, other mediums I don't really mind it because Dave doesn't have control over those.

But when he says that he doesn't want Force Users being superhero like and then turns right around with Vader withstanding a huge superweapon explosion apparently....well then you see where there's confusion.

I mean he is helming the Rebels show after all, so...consistency with his words and what is on screen would be nice. Are Force Users superhero like now or are they not?

Which is it Dave? I'm more questioning his stance on things, than the feat itself.

feloni works in mysterious ways

Originally posted by Zenwolf
But when he says that he doesn't want Force Users being superhero like and then turns right around with Vader withstanding a huge superweapon explosion apparently....well then you see where there's confusion.
Or could it be he didn't resist it. mmm

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Or could it be he didn't resist it. mmm

Why I said apparently, frankly there's not much to see what actually went on. We just get the explosion and then the aftermath, nothing inbetween.

I'm sure it'll be elaborated on somewhere...at some point. But I mean since people wanna believe this, well...for now.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Or could it be he didn't resist it. mmm
an interesting fan fic, maybe you should write it

Originally posted by Zenwolf
Why I said apparently, frankly there's not much to see what actually went on. We just get the explosion and then the aftermath, nothing inbetween.

I'm sure it'll be elaborated on somewhere...at some point. But I mean since people wanna believe this, well...for now.
It was not a superweapon explosion; people are misinterpreting it as such.

That obelisk was certainly a triggering mechanism for the superweapon (i.e. the Dark Temple itself) but it could only be activated through the holocron (in possession of Ezra) and she removed it on time after learning that something was off.

Abrupt removal of holocron destabilized the triggering mechanism (however) and the obelisk in question exploded consequently. And we see that it did not cause much damage since much of the Temple was intact and Darth Vader and Ahsoka Tano walked out from it.

Originally posted by carthage
Vader withstood the explosion of Cymoon 1,
Becoming a cheap feature.

Originally posted by carthage
Palpatine's lightning,
Palpatine wasn't trying to kill Darth Vader.

Originally posted by carthage
the explosion of the Sith superweapon, fire from AT-ATS
See above.

Originally posted by carthage
Vitiate's lightning isn't doing shit.


Revan - a peer of Darth Nihilus in strength - and capable of countering Darth Nihilus's powers without breaking a sweat who in turn overwhelmed Lord Scourge and Meetra Surik simultaneously among which Surik was able to tackle Darth Traya who in turn destroyed 3 of the renowned Jedi Masters of her time in a fight - was not able to withstand Vitiate's powers and would have been reduced to a pile of ash if T3-M4 had not intervened.

A single bolt of Vitiate is potent enough to instantly disable/fry a military-grade aircraft. His charged attack would be relatively much more potent.

Sorry my friend, Darth Vader doesn't stands a chance here.

And tanking conventional explosions is an entirely different kind of feat than tanking Force lightning with entirely different set of defenses coming into play in both cases.

Originally posted by DarthAnt66
Because it suggests that the blast wasn't what it's implied to be if the temple was still intact.

Seems like a pretty ****ing weak blast.

Or the temple was really durable