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Round 1 - in the Marvel Universe

Round 2 - in DC Universe

Round 3 - is a neutral universe created by both TOAA & The Presence, where neither has an advantage

GEB wins wherever.

Pre-Retcon Beyonder wins wherever.

That was easy.

IIRC GEB was never really defeated, right?

Pre-Rec Beyonder was, even if it was his fault.

GEB FTW

GEB for the win

Originally posted by Air Legend
Pre-Retcon Beyonder wins wherever.

That was easy. Agreed.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
IIRC GEB was never really defeated, right?

Pre-Rec Beyonder was, even if it was his fault.

GEB FTW The geb had an equal while the beyonder was more powerful than all the rest of the marvel universe after he weakened himself. Beyonder wins as no one even came close to him.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

IIRC GEB was never really defeated, right?

Pre-Rec Beyonder was, even if it was his fault.
Pre-retcon Beyonder was never defeated, not ever, he willed everything.

Any who, if the GEB is truly another supreme being, then it's a stalemate.
(although I never understood how there are two of them, or is it that both = one?)


Meh, Supreme being vs Supreme being = stalemate.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Agreed.

The geb had an equal while the beyonder was more powerful than all the rest of the marvel universe after he weakened himself. Beyonder wins as no one even came close to him.

Having an equal (ominipotent too) is now an low feat? Gimme a break, this logic is kind of funny .

The idea of the Beyonder being a supreme being is laughable.

Geb for the easy win.

Originally posted by llagrok
The idea of the GEB being a supreme being is laughable.
Fixed it for ya.

Never claimed that was true Air Legend.

But The Beyonder wasn't a supreme being and he never did anything on par with the supreme being.

Originally posted by Air Legend
No, he was never defeated. Did you even read Secret Wars 2? Acted like an idiot? What's your definition of idiot because the way the Beyonder acted made Secret Wars 2 an enjoyable read.

The Thing? This has turned into comedy.

It was an boxing match, Beyonder limited himself, that's what i call idiotic .

Originally posted by llagrok
The idea of the Beyonder being a supreme being is laughable.

I second that laugh.

Originally posted by llagrok
Never claimed that was true Air Legend.

But The Beyonder wasn't a supreme being and he never did anything on par with the supreme being.
The Beyonder erased the concept of Death itself. The Beyonder was shown on panel wiping out the entire Marvelverse. The Beyonder was millions of times more powerful than the rest of the enitre multiverse combined. The Beyonder created a universe (ocean) which the the Marvel Universe was a drop of water in comparison.

The Presence couldn't even contain one of his creations in his plan, got bitchslapped by one of his creations, showed lack of omniscience, had to ask one of his creations to share experiences so he could go into his final form but got rejected, thus showing lack of omnipotence.

Yea, I guess the Beyonder didn't do much.

Originally posted by fangirl101
I second that laugh.

He was more powerful than the LT, but that's a long way from being a supreme being. A supreme being wouldn't tax his power by erasing death.

Originally posted by llagrok
He was more powerful than the LT, but that's a long way from being a supreme being. A supreme being wouldn't tax his power by erasing death. Didn't he give half of his power over to rachel as well?

Originally posted by llagrok
He was more powerful than the LT, but that's a long way from being a supreme being. A supreme being wouldn't tax his power by erasing death.
A Beyonder who limited himself erased Death stating that he wouldn't be able to bring Death back after the procedure, yet he easily accomplishes this later on.

Originally posted by Air Legend
The Beyonder erased the concept of Death itself. The Beyonder was shown on panel wiping out the entire Marvelverse. The Beyonder was millions of times more powerful than the rest of the enitre multiverse combined. The Beyonder created a universe (ocean) which the the Marvel Universe was a drop of water in comparison.

The Presence couldn't even contain one of his creations in his plan, got bitchslapped by one of his creations, showed lack of omniscience, had to ask one of his creations to share experiences so he could go into his final form but got rejected, thus showing lack of omnipotence.

Yea, I guess the Beyonder didn't do much.

We talk about GEB not the presence, or am i missing something .

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
We talk about GEB not the presence, or am i missing something .
Are you the Judge?

Originally posted by Air Legend
Are you the Judge?

forget it

Originally posted by Air Legend
Are you the Judge? Are you? uhuh

This reminds me of V and Evey.

Originally posted by llagrok

The idea of the Beyonder being a supreme being is laughable.
Write Jim Shooter a letter and complain about that fact.

Originally posted by Mr Master
He was never defeated.



Seriously friend, go read Secret Wars again.



This wasn't in secret wars, (Phoenix) it was in an X-Men comic, I only had it as an TPB in german^^. Maybe I will go into the cellar an search for it, but I'm sure you know which scene i mean .

Originally posted by llagrok

But The Beyonder wasn't a supreme being
and he never did anything on par with the supreme being.
lla, you also need to go read Secret Wars again.
Originally posted by llagrok

A supreme being wouldn't tax his power by erasing death.

Originally posted by fangirl101

Didn't he give half of his power over to rachel as well?
Nah.

Beyonder gave Rachel the full power of the Phoenix Force.

That's it.

Originally posted by Mr Master

Beyonder gave Rachel the full power of the Phoenix Force.

That's it.

When we talk about the Beyonder you are the best informed, thats why I ask you.

Beyonder gave Rachel the full power of the PF. Wasn't there also an scene where he wanted it back?

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

This wasn't in secret wars, (Phoenix) it was in an X-Men comic,
I only had it as an TPB in german^^.
Maybe I will go into the cellar an search for it,
but I'm sure you know which scene i mean
I sure do, and it is a tie-in to Secret Wars II,
so indeed, it was part of the Secret Wars II saga.

The Facts:

======================================


While wielding the Full power of the PF,
Rachel had just touched the life of every common being in the universe,
their desires, their pains, their dreams ect.

When Beyonder took back the power he gave Rachel,
she threw back at him the experiences of every common being in the universe,
Beyonder was overwhelmed because he experienced every single individual life simultaneously,
he had no idea common folk could be so precious.

......................................................................................

The on panel proof:

......................................................................................


Rachel (Full PF) touches every common being in the Universe:

http://img177.imageshack.us/img177/4379/r1oa3.th.jpghttp://img443.imageshack.us/img443/8555/r2ci0.th.jpg


You can read them completely but this excerpt from those scans says it all:

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/1051/r3rd0.th.jpg

"She touches everyone, she experiences their dreams,
their yearnings, their terrors,
all they were and are and hope to be,
the totality of their beings"

......................................................................................


Rachel also freaks out from the experience, but Storm is there to console her:

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/9595/uxm203page15ju0.th.jpg

http://img137.imageshack.us/img137/562/r4qo4.th.jpg

......................................................................................


Rachel was never able to hurt Beyonder physically in any way shape or form:

http://img110.imageshack.us/img110/3906/r5cl9.th.jpg

"You are what you are solely because I will it"

......................................................................................


This is when Beyonder takes the Full power of the Phoenix Force back:

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/2682/r6jd1.th.jpg


What is it that Beyonder can't stop,
what is it that overwhelmed Beyonder?

What Rachel had just collected from every individual.

http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/6935/r7qd1.th.jpg

"He sought power --- but this is far more --
All that Phoenix experienced
the totality of Life, in all its forms"


Which is why Storm says,

"We each have our little lives, our destinies, our unique paths to walk"

......................................................................................


Beyonder even appreciated learning of the preciousness of individual life:

http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/1348/r8gq7.th.jpg

"Thank you for what you have shown me this night,
it is strange --- but I find myself envying your ... Humanity"

======================================


Did I mention?

This is all concerning Beyonder after he self-imposed limitations on himself,
to fit in with microbes that were the LT, Eternity, and all the rest of Marvel.

Originally posted by Mr Master

======================================


Did I mention?

This is all concerning Beyonder after he self-imposed limitations on himself,
to fit in with microbes that were the LT, Eternity, and all the rest of Marvel.

Thank you friend .

He is powerful but even he is afraid of the unknown, hm, omnipotent and yet limited by his own ominpotency. Surely he isn't omniscient else he wouldn't be overwhelmed.

He is like a Childgod.

I searched in my cellar and found the issue, you are faster though, I will scan now the fight "Thing vs Beyonder".

^^

Originally posted by Air Legend

The Thing? This has turned into comedy.

2nd

3rd

4th

5th

last one, sry but i don't know how to post all scans in one reply

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

Thank you friend
Anytime friend.
Originally posted by Batman-Prime

Surely he isn't omniscient else he wouldn't be overwhelmed.
Again, that's Beyonder while drastically limiting himself.

Btw. Beyonder was "omniscient" if he wanted to be.

But, being that he wanted to experience and learn life on his own,
that wouldn't be possible if he already knows everything off the bat.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

He is like a Childgod.
He was "God" before Genesis according to the Writer/Editor in-Chief of Marvel.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

I will scan now the fight "Thing vs Beyonder".
You forgot to post the stipulations behind that beating.

The fact is Beyonder didn't strike the Thing once,
in fact,
Beyonder wanted the Thing to beat him to death,
because the Beyonder was ashamed of what he had done within the Marvelverse:

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/3723/be1oa7.th.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/7299/be2xz9.th.jpg

http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/7243/be3fr4.th.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/9049/be4db6.th.jpg

Originally posted by Mr Master
You forgot to post the stipulations behind that beating.

The fact is Beyonder didn't strike the Thing once,
in fact,
Beyonder wanted the Thing to beat him to death,
because the Beyonder was ashamed of what he had done within the Marvelverse:


I didn't forgot it, I though that most readers wouldn't understand german and was to lazy to translate it , so i scanned only the action. Though, no one would believe that the Thing would last one milisecond against the Beyonder, without the Beyonder being generous, no one sane i mean .
It was only an reply to "The Thing? This has turned into comedy."

I like comedy

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

I didn't forgot it, I though that most readers wouldn't understand german and was to lazy to translate it, so i scanned only the action. Though, no one would believe that the Thing would last one milisecond against the Beyonder, without the Beyonder being generous, no one sane i mean.
It was only an reply to "The Thing? This has turned into comedy."

I like comedy
Oh, I didn't realize they were in german, that's actually funny.

Anyway, I believe we understand each other.

Originally posted by llagrok
The idea of the Beyonder being a supreme being is laughable. Which is one of the many reasons he was retconned.

Beyonder

Stalemate.

Originally posted by Mr Master
You forgot to post the stipulations behind that beating.

The fact is Beyonder didn't strike the Thing once,
in fact,
Beyonder wanted the Thing to beat him to death,
because the Beyonder was ashamed of what he had done within the Marvelverse:

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/3723/be1oa7.th.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/7299/be2xz9.th.jpg

http://img82.imageshack.us/img82/7243/be3fr4.th.jpg

http://img265.imageshack.us/img265/9049/be4db6.th.jpg The Beyonder is such an odd character is he not?

Originally posted by quanchi112

The Beyonder is such an odd character is he not?
Imo, Beyonder was Jim Shooter trying to place himself within comics.

In other words, like "God" (himself the writer) from another creation/reality, (Beyondrealm)
visiting a strange, separate and new creation (Marvelverse) which Shooter did not create,
then the drama of this "God" interacting with this Marvelverse. (the story)

Then again, perhaps not,
cause Shooter actually included himself amongst the microbes in the Marvelverse.

Which is just sick ... the retcon was a must,
simply too much of an exaggeration of power.

Beyonder was very limited in terms of intellect. Maybe he was strong but he did not seem at all intelligent.

GEB. Opposite of the Presence.

Beyonder gets stomped. Again.

Beyonder wins easily. Again.