Cyborg Raiden v.s Ryu Hayabusa

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Papa Borzarou
Guess I'm in a Metal Gear mood right now!

Csdabest
Hayabusa. Raiden's biggest issue is his Durability and slightly unorthadox style.

Dark-Jaxx
Raiden is stronger as well, but Ryu wins.

Csdabest
I dont know about the strength at all. But I have seen the vids of Raiden from MGS4 and all that. But im not sure about the strength feat. Though id give him up. I would probably put ryu Strength around Captain Americas. Seeing as ryu is beyond human capabilities and body structure.

Superboy Prime
What about Raiden's strength feats? The guy can juggle Metal Gear Gekkos with his feet and he was able to stop Arsenal from crushing Old Snake with just one arm. Cyborg Raiden's strength can not be put in doubt. I'd say he is Class 100 from his Arsenal stopping feat. However that may have been a one time "must save Snake's ass" performance...but even then he did so with one arm. It is not a stretch to think he would have had a much easier time with both.

Dark-Jaxx
Well actually Raiden used his whole mass and leverage with his sword and the dock itself, still impressive though.

Superboy Prime
Same as Hulk using his entire mass to stop a mountain from crushing the marvel heroes, so I don't see anything wrong with that.

In what strength class would you put Cyborg Raiden?

Dark-Jaxx
Don't really know...Arsenal Gear was also moving pretty fvcking slow.

I would say at least class 60 when he has an adreneline rush(which he did).

Csdabest
Can someone show me what these classes equal. hahahaha

Dark-Jaxx
Class 60 means he can lift around 60 tons.

Csdabest
so he can lift 120,000 pounds o_O?

Dark-Jaxx
When in an adrenaline rush.

Csdabest
Can i have footage or statement to justify this point.

Dark-Jaxx
Nah. I don't really care enough about it. Ask SBP.

Superboy Prime
We don't know as a fact if that is the limit to Cyborg Raiden's strength. We are just wondering since no specific info has been given by Konami as far as I can tell. About the class system...its just the marvel way of saying how strong their characters are. They can go from human to up to Class 100 which is the ability to lift 100 tons or more.

StyleTime
Originally posted by Csdabest
Can i have footage or statement to justify this point. If Superboy Prime doesn't get it before me I'll get it. I can't search for footage now because I have to go, but I will tell you this.

Raiden swung around giant robots that were a couple of stories tall with his feet.

Also, what's up Superboy Prime? Long time no see.

Menetnashté
Here's a feat of Raiden's strength, unfortunately getting the scene where he stops arsenal will be a pain, most vids of it on youtube have been deleted. Here's him fighting Gekkos though.
hETGsD4riw8

fascistcrusader
Hayabusa slaughters him.

Csdabest
Are you talking about whyen he fighting a Gekkos...I still dont see anything showing him having that "class" of strength.

Superboy Prime
Hayabusa won't slaughtering Raiden. He can win, but it will not be an easy fight.

Csdabest
Yeah i seen that video. That doesnt justify 60 tons Those Gekkos dont have good balance at all. With the velocity of weight and pulling and tugging. Just about anyone with athletic ability and the balls could do that. He used leverage. Nothing in that video showed or justifies 60 tons. I give him a ton at the most. Im starting to doubt that yall know what a ton is. Most cars dont weigh a more than a ton. I bench around 450, squat 725 and deadlift 800 and i can rock a 1985 pickup druck on its side with 5 rocks.

Csdabest
I give it to Ryu 7 to 8 out of ten. Id definetly say that Cyborg Raiden looks to be stronger and most likely is stronger than raiden. Raiden has the agility, strength, and an unorthodox style to give Ryu trouble. Thing is. Ryu is extremely fast normaly. But with his speeddash and being able to teleport and speed dash in conjuction with combinating blows is speed is almost godlike.(well not that haha but crazy fast.)

Superboy Prime
Problem is that it is hard to find the video of Raiden's high end feat. I'll keep looking though.

ThoraxeRMG
Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Hayabusa slaughters him.

Your fanboyism is amusing.
It won't be easy.

Csdabest
Actually with Ryu's speed he could pretty much speedblitz Raiden. Ryu speedash and teleport conjuction with his deadly combos is deadly.

ThoraxeRMG
Raiden's durability and endurance is still amazing (EX: Being crushed by the Arsenal Gear Class "Outer Haven" and he still lives.) and his speed is great as well.

Csdabest
But he is not on the level of speed that Ryu can admit to. Play NGII. And sit back about a good five yards. Youll give yourself a ceisure at the speed he moves. He teleports slashed teleporst speed dash slash, slashm speed dash slash, teleport, speeddash. Its insane. And with TDS. He should have any trouble slicing Raiden apart limb from limb

Dark-Jaxx
I am playing NG2, and just beat Act 6. Do these Godly speed feats happen later or sumthin?

ThoraxeRMG
Originally posted by Csdabest
But he is not on the level of speed that Ryu can admit to.

I know that.

Originally posted by Csdabest
Play NGII. And sit back about a good five yards. Youll give yourself a ceisure at the speed he moves.

I watched someone played it.
NG2 gets repetitive as hell, it bores me.

Originally posted by Csdabest
He should have any trouble slicing Raiden apart limb from limb

You're right, he would have trouble. Listen, I'm not saying Raiden would win. I'm just saying it's gonna be hard for Ryu to kill him.

Dark-Jaxx
Seriously, where are all the uber speed feats? I ain't seen nuthin NG1 didn't have.

ThoraxeRMG
Same gameplay, and overrated as hell.

Csdabest
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Seriously, where are all the uber speed feats? I ain't seen nuthin NG1 didn't have.


Upgrade you weapons and use different combos and manuveres. If you still dont notice your being ignorant.

ThoraxeRMG
Originally posted by Csdabest
Upgrade you weapons and use different combos and manuveres. If you still dont notice your being ignorant.

That's a ironic sentence. laughing

Csdabest
I dont see how thats being ignorant. He can just as well look up some vets of the game.

Shinobier
XNinjaredX
Chaosdigital
Chokaunmiwang

ThoraxeRMG
Originally posted by Csdabest
I dont see how thats being ignorant. He can just as well look up some vets of the game.

You call him ignorant yet you use sentence that can be used as an example of ignorance.





Bolded the errors.

Csdabest
And I have three words for you.


WASTE OF INTELLIGENCE. If the only way you can debate in argument is worrying about the mistakes and grammer.....Then thats sad.

Let me rephrase my statement then.

DJ

If you still dont see the speed feats or how fast Ryu is after you have upgraded your weapons. Then you lacking the knowlege of other speed feats and how they are performed and the surrounding factors. Other words lacking outside information. Then you are blatantly ignoring the fact of Ryu having amazing speed in conjuction with speed dash that is greatly similiar to Loz that it basically can be called the same. In conjuction of teleportationg and stringing combo's. Make it that ryu is capable of blinding speed and combat movements. Or you just fail at playing the game

Thor stop thinking narrowed minded. There are other unique ways of using words. Thats how language, speech, writing, and communication evovles and progresses. Expanding the uses of words and communicating with one another.

Menetnashté
Originally posted by Csdabest
And I have three words for you.


WASTE OF INTELLIGENCE. If the only way you can debate in argument is worrying about the mistakes and grammer.....Then thats sad.

Let me rephrase my statement then.

DJ

If you still dont see the speed feats or how fast Ryu is after you have upgraded your weapons. Then you lacking the knowlege of other speed feats and how they are performed and the surrounding factors. Other words lacking outside information. Then you are blatantly ignoring the fact of Ryu having amazing speed in conjuction with speed dash that is greatly similiar to Loz that it basically can be called the same. In conjuction of teleportationg and stringing combo's. Make it that ryu is capable of blinding speed and combat movements. Or you just fail at playing the game

Thor stop thinking narrowed minded. There are other unique ways of using words. Thats how language, speech, writing, and communication evovles and progresses. Expanding the uses of words and communicating with one another.
You're making some awfully bold statements for someone who hasn't even played MGS4

edit: replying to earlier, I'm not sure how your argument was Gekkos have poor balance. Trust me they don't, but when you have a powerhouse like Raiden weighing down on you, you're going to fall.

ThoraxeRMG
Originally posted by Csdabest
If the only way you can debate in argument is worrying about the mistakes and grammer.....

No, it's so that a person and fully understand what you are talking about. :/

Originally posted by Csdabest
Then thats sad.

I find your lack of Grammar disturbing.

Damn, I'm like a broken record sometimes. big grin

Originally posted by Csdabest
Thor

I am Thoraxe R.M.G. The Impaler!

Originally posted by Csdabest
stop thinking narrowed minded.

I smell a hint of contradiction and irony mixing together.

Originally posted by Csdabest
There are other unique ways of using words.

Yeah, there is.
Sadly you're not using them. :/

Originally posted by Csdabest
Thats how language, speech, writing, and communication evovles and progresses.

On spelling mistakes and poor grammar? Nigga, please..... big grin

Originally posted by Csdabest
Expanding the uses of words and communicating with one another.

Yeah I'm communicating to you that your grammar is slightly poor and you have spelling mistakes. Happy Dance

Csdabest
Raiden Doesnt have the speed to compete with Ryu Hayabusa. He is strong but Ryu is strong enough but not in the degree as Raiden. Aswell As Raiden can only shoot and swing swords. Jaiden has Ninpo and spiritial attacks which greatly tips things in his favor.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Csdabest
Upgrade you weapons and use different combos and manuveres. If you still dont notice your being ignorant. So you are basing this all on gameplay? I have the TDS, and my dual Katana, Scythe, staff, and Vigoor Flail are all haxxed.

Csdabest
Not a gameplay mechanic. So i see no reason why it can't be used.The user wouldnt give a character multiple moves and weapons he cant use.

Dark-Jaxx
Well going by what I saw in gameplay, Raiden is faster then.

Csdabest
Thats a joke. But thats your opinion.

ThoraxeRMG
So you're saying his opinion is a joke?
Real nice comment, bucko.

Terryc250
I'd say Ryu wins

Nemesis X
I'm not much of a street fighter fan because the game blows hard. I'd go with Raiden.

GenomeFrozener
This Ryu is from Ninja Gaidena and Dead Or Alive.:/

Remi8193
I have to go with ryu hayabusa cause i dont know who cyborg raiden is

Nemesis X
Originally posted by GenomeFrozener
This Ryu is from Ninja Gaidena and Dead Or Alive.:/

Raiden still wins

Obsidian Fury
Originally posted by Nemesis X
Raiden still wins

Care to tell us how?

Nemesis X
Dude, have you played MGS4?

GenomeFrozener
I did, and it's badass.

Kirikaze Fuuma
Originally posted by Remi8193
I have to go with ryu hayabusa cause i dont know who cyborg raiden is

you said that without knowing raiden's power?

Remi8193
OK

Remi8193
Oh Raiden of Metal Gears Solid
hmm i think it would be a draw cause they both have the same speed cause there like ninja well ryu is a ninja

Raiden was on wez and larry's he was one off the worst characters on that show

Nemesis X
Raiden is more skilled and tougher than Ryu. Raiden stopped a massive ship with just him and his sword. Can Ryu do that? No.

Dark-Jaxx
No, Ryu would have cut it in half. 131

GenomeFrozener
Originally posted by Nemesis X
Raiden is more skilled and tougher than Ryu. Raiden stopped a massive ship with just him and his sword. Can Ryu do that? No.

Oh my god, yes!

Dark-Jaxx
In all seriousness, Ryu's feats are mostly taken from gameplay from what I have seen.

Although in a cutscene he showed some seriously impressive durability, after you beat Vazdah.

Obsidian Fury
Originally posted by Nemesis X
Dude, have you played MGS4?

I have.

Dude, have you played NG? (No, you haven't)

Remi8193
i think Ryu and Raiden r just equally match

Csdabest
Originally posted by Nemesis X
Raiden is more skilled and tougher than Ryu. Raiden stopped a massive ship with just him and his sword. Can Ryu do that? No.

1. More skilled Thats highly iffy as I put his skill way above Raiden because he has mastered not only sword arts but almost everystyle of weapon to perfection.

2. Raiden SLOWED down a ship with the help of his cyborg body, sword, the dock, the actual SOLID rock and concrete from the cliff that the ship was smashing into, also slowing it down. He also had leverage. Even after all that Raiden was still being pushed forward and got his ass ran over. But with all that Said......Raiden stopped the ship with a sword big grin . Ryu most likely would have obliterated it with his TDS ability to extend the blade. Or with some other ninpo or blown it up with a miniture black hole of black matter.

StyleTime
You guys put too much weight on our combatants' swordplay. Fighting an unhandicapped Hayabusa involves far more than that. Hayabusa triumphs in these matches because of his versatility. With ninpo abilities, such as freezing or electrocuting his opponents, Hayabusa can dominate in ranged combat. Hayabusa's skill, physical attributes, and wide array of weaponry make him a hard fight in melee combat as well. To top it off, teleportation allows him to evade attacks or switch between ranged and melee combat at will. Hayabusa simply has too many options for most characters in his tier. Unfortunately, Raiden is pretty much just another guy with a sword.

I'm not trying to overrate Ryu or underrate Raiden, but Hayabusa is a hard match up for most people at this level. Raiden, like many of his video game peers, is capable of taken some wins, but will get edged out by Hayabusa's slew of battle options.

Dark-Jaxx
That friggin Art of the Piercing Void is THE most friggin overrated move of Hayabusa's.

When I see Ryu destroy something anywhere near as big as Arsenal Gear, come back to me.

Csdabest
http://youtube.com/watch?v=suBFY39P4Ps
Not as big or close but still pretty powerful

http://youtube.com/watch?v=lT7wjjQ3obo&feature=related
Art of the Peircing void would simply tear through the whole ship as it seems not to stop for some time.

GenomeFrozener
Wasn't really much in size....

StyleTime
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
That friggin Art of the Piercing Void is THE most friggin overrated move of Hayabusa's.

When I see Ryu destroy something anywhere near as big as Arsenal Gear, come back to me.
I wasn't really talking about Art of the Piercing Void. That may have not been directed at me though.

Rewmac
Raiden can dodge the ninpo techniques so we are down to weapons fight. Raiden got stabbed, cut etc. He stopped x hundred ton ship in weakened state. He only had one arm and a couple minutes before he stopped he was climbing out of a huge amount of rock which fell on him. Ryu on the otherhand is fast, agile, but only human. Raiden can take more hits than Ryu. The real question here is who is better with the sword which is the hardest question.

StyleTime
He may dodge the fireball, but ninpo like the ice and lightning are area of effect. I don't see him winning the majority if Hayabusa is allowed all of his abilities.

Csdabest
He Can Dodge Lightning Bolts? He Can dodge practically invisible Wind Blades? He Can Dodge fast multiple homing fireballs That come from multiple directions. Even then Art of the peircing void and the two ninpo seen in DOA clips seem to travel pretty fast maybe at the speed of sound but i doubt.

GenomeFrozener
Calm down your site comments please. big grin

Csdabest
People put too much Hype on Raiden Arsenal Gear feat. Before i got to the point. People made it sound like he place his hand on the ship and actually moved it aginst its course of direction, He didnt even stop the ship fully. And even then it was already stopping cuz of the hard concreate dock.

GenomeFrozener
Your comments of spite aren't gonna make it any better... :/

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Csdabest
People put too much Hype on Raiden Arsenal Gear feat. Before i got to the point. People made it sound like he place his hand on the ship and actually moved it aginst its course of direction, He didnt even stop the ship fully. And even then it was already stopping cuz of the hard concreate dock. And that strength feat along with many others are still far better than any of Ryu's so your point is really irrelevant.

Darkstorm Zero
Oh boy, if W Flame where still here... I an imagine what this can of worms would be like...

Incidentally, I don't think Raiden can match Ryu....

Purely physically speaking, yeah, he could overwhelm him with sheer brute power... But ryu's magics, experience, better training and more highly developed fighting skills I beleive secure him the victory more often than not.

Csdabest
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
And that strength feat along with many others are still far better than any of Ryu's so your point is really irrelevant.

Far from irrelevent. Im stating that the strength feat was greatly over exaggerated. Raiden his strong but people was classifying him lifting 100tons with one arm. Which is rediculous,. Yes he is stronger than Ryu. But just about every category probably except durability and thats an if Hayabusa is superior.

StyleTime
Originally posted by Darkstorm Zero
Oh boy, if W Flame where still here... I an imagine what this can of worms would be like...

Incidentally, I don't think Raiden can match Ryu....

Purely physically speaking, yeah, he could overwhelm him with sheer brute power... But ryu's magics, experience, better training and more highly developed fighting skills I beleive secure him the victory more often than not.
What did he get banned for exactly?

I agree. It's Hayabusa's extra abilities that give him the edge here.

Dark-Jaxx
Originally posted by Csdabest
Far from irrelevent. Im stating that the strength feat was greatly over exaggerated. Raiden his strong but people was classifying him lifting 100tons with one arm. Which is rediculous,. Yes he is stronger than Ryu. But just about every category probably except durability and thats an if Hayabusa is superior. I think they are about as fast.

Ryu showed some serious durability after killing Vazdah, I say he takes that category.

But Ryu wins due to his versatility.

Csdabest
Instant teleportation + Speed Dash that rivals Loz leads me to beleive he is much faster than Raiden. And Ryu Spams it in the latest game.

Dark-Jaxx
Ryu rivals Loz in speed? When?

And I played the latest game.

StyleTime
I don't think we should count teleportation as speed.

Csdabest
The Way Ryu uses it it kind of does. He combines Instant teleportation with speed Dash for high speed attacking. Either way Raiden will get torn up by it.

Csdabest
Originally posted by Dark-Jaxx
Ryu rivals Loz in speed? When?

And I played the latest game.

His Blue speed dash. Mostly noticble in UT and high string combo's.

Csdabest
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwTHbbQ9rDk
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4FbyZ6Z-dak&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_50PB-vmoNE&feature=related

Darkstorm Zero
Originally posted by StyleTime
What did he get banned for exactly?

I agree. It's Hayabusa's extra abilities that give him the edge here.

I wasn't here when he was banned, but looking at the threads where it happened, he got banned for ignoring Moderators, and hassling them...

Truth be told, I never got along with Flame at all....

Dark-Jaxx
Flame sounds sexy.

Superboy Prime
To be honest I belive this is Hayabusa's battle to win.

Rewmac
Originally posted by Csdabest
He Can Dodge Lightning Bolts? He Can dodge practically invisible Wind Blades? He Can Dodge fast multiple homing fireballs That come from multiple directions. Even then Art of the peircing void and the two ninpo seen in DOA clips seem to travel pretty fast maybe at the speed of sound but i doubt. Well he practically can dodge nearly anything if he isn't weakened. But yeah, areal effects aren't there to dodge.

Csdabest
Im sorry. I seriously doubt he is dodging ninpo attacks thatmove at the speed alightning. And mpost at the speed of sound.

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