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Gambit has standard gear and a full deck, peak versions of both...who wins?

Shiva gets Nuked, for Gumbo is the Master Exploder!!!

prolly gambit

You hate Lady Shiva or something?

Originally posted by Juk3n
Shiva gets Nuked

This is too onesided.

It's like Comparing Shiva vs Shiva, cept one has extra mutant powers to boot! Same with Batman Thread O_o

shiva is a beast.maybe even better than bats h2h,and faster.


shiva FTW

Why would you use peak version of Gambit, he wins 11/10.

^ lol, I don't think he meant "PEAK" or maybe he did.

w/e the case, Gambo takes this.

Originally posted by namorsubby
shiva is a beast.maybe even better than bats h2h,and faster.


shiva FTW

Please be serious, it doesn't matter if she's faster than Batman, Gambit is still faster and more agile, batman and Shiva are just varying levels of slow, to him.

you know gambit isn't superhumanly fast right(probably not)? he has to charge himself with his power to even get up to peak human.batman and shiva are both in that peak human speed range with gambit.shiva is just as fast, if not fast.and she could put him done in one move.and she's not batman........she'll kill with a first or second thought.

Originally posted by namorsubby
you know gambit isn't superhumanly fast right(probably not)? he has to charge himself with his power to even get up to peak human.batman and shiva are both in that peak human speed range with gambit.shiva is just as fast, if not fast.and she could put him done in one move.and she's not batman........she'll kill with a first or second thought.
Gambit is a bullet timer. Batman sure as hell isn't. Shiva MIGHT be up there.

She would wreck him if this was just H2H. However this is not H2H.Shiva would be killed before she got near him. This is a spite methinks.

Originally posted by namorsubby
he has to charge himself with his power to even get up to peak human.
No, he doesn't. He's caught bullets at "base level" before.

Originally posted by StyleTime
No, he doesn't. He's caught bullets at "base level" before. contradicts his stats.

gambit: human speed until he charges up, then peak human speed.

shiva: peak human speed.

Originally posted by Jugglenaut
Gambit is a bullet timer. Batman sure as hell isn't. Shiva MIGHT be up there. batman and shiva are both considered peak human. gambit is only peak human when he charges up.i'm just stating what's fact. batman and shiva dodge bullets all the time. bats has dodged a sniper bullet off of the sound of a bullet ripping through the night sky.he's pretty fast,shiva's probably faster.

Originally posted by namorsubby
batman and shiva are both considered peak human. gambit is only peak human when he charges up.i'm just stating what's fact.


how can it be FACT if it's wrong?

Exact same thing as the Batman thread.

Oh, and Lady Shiva is NOT faster than Batman. What makes you claim that?

Originally posted by namorsubby
contradicts his stats.

gambit: human speed until he charges up, then peak human speed.

shiva: peak human speed. You realize comic feats contradict supposed stats all the time, right?

That's why we take what happens in comics over what is written in databooks, because they have been wrong multiple times.

Originally posted by namorsubby
contradicts his stats.

gambit: human speed until he charges up, then peak human speed.

shiva: peak human speed.
No, what you say contradicts his showings.
Originally posted by namorsubby
batman and shiva are both considered peak human. gambit is only peak human when he charges up.i'm just stating what's fact.
No, you're stating what's convenient for your argument. The fact is this:
Originally posted by StyleTime
He's caught bullets at "base level" before.

Gumbo.

Originally posted by namorsubby
you know gambit isn't superhumanly fast right(probably not)? he has to charge himself with his power to even get up to peak human.batman and shiva are both in that peak human speed range with gambit.shiva is just as fast, if not fast.and she could put him done in one move.and she's not batman........she'll kill with a first or second thought.


Please check out his respect thread before you fill up this thread with such crap again.

Thanks.

Originally posted by namorsubby
batman and shiva are both considered peak human. gambit is only peak human when he charges up.i'm just stating what's fact. batman and shiva dodge bullets all the time. bats has dodged a sniper bullet off of the sound of a bullet ripping through the night sky.he's pretty fast,shiva's probably faster.

Shiva and Bruce are street level, they approach peak human powers but are overall only street level. Gambit at his base is already peak human, with the bio-kinetic amp he becomes meta-human.

Originally posted by Endrict Nuul
Please check out his respect thread before you fill up this thread with such crap again.

Thanks. i know you weren't trying to be funny.........but man that was funny.


gambit isn't peak human at base level,and he's only peak human when charged.check any stats page,i'm sure they'll agree(well at least most,some a fan-made,which always leaves room for doubt)

Originally posted by StyleTime
No, what you say contradicts his showings.

No, you're stating what's convenient for your argument. The fact is this: i'd rather stick to stats then showings.you wanna know why? because sometimes authors go insane and display a character completely wrong(bat-god would be an example).sure some argue that if the character is written in a way that contradicts his stats regularly,then that should count,but there are some characters who are(like bat-god),and still people want to ignore that.they usually have a good reason(like the feats being completely ridiculous),but i'd just prefer to avoid all that interpertation by sticking to the facts.i'm sorry if it was convinent for me to do so this time,but "that's the way the cookie crumbles",as they say.

Originally posted by Juk3n
how can it be FACT if it's wrong? don't any of you have access to wikipedia? or marvel? etc,etc?


i should've known not to post an opinion opposite of what ecryone else was saying.anyway,what's done is done.i'll post from some sites that have his stats to put an end to this(why do i feel that that won't put na end to this?)

Originally posted by Master Crimzon
Exact same thing as the Batman thread.

Oh, and Lady Shiva is NOT faster than Batman. What makes you claim that? whoa,one at a time people.


anyway i believe shiva to be faster because that is what she appears to be most often whenever they fight.i believe batman has even said she was once(but you don't have to acknowledge that,because i'm not shufflin' around to get a scan for it)


anyway(again),here's what marvel's stat page on gambit has to say about his speed:

"Gambit's ability to tap energy also grants him near-superhuman agility and dexterity"


here's what wikipedia says:


"peak human speed, stamina, agility, and reflexes
Skilled hand-to-hand combatant, strategist, and thief"

and:
"Gambit's body, as a living generator of bio-kinetic energies, possesses physiological attributes adapted for constant motion. As a result, his mutation has increased his body's innate physical qualities ( such as speed, reflexes/reactions, stamina, agility, flexibility, dexterity, coordination, balance, and endurance) to the very limit of natural human capability."


in other words,GAMBIT IS PEAK HUMAN WHEN CHARGED.booyah

You realize anyone can edit wikipedia don't you?

And the amount of errors on Marvel.com is hilarious.


If you wanna go by Marvel.com, Gambit has the same energy projection level as LT and can fight as well as Wolverine.

dagnabbit. i knew that was pointless but i still posted all that. namorsubby why do you choose to go that extra mile?


yes,i am talking to myself,what of it.


anyway i just think shiva takes the majority because she's just as fast IMO,but she a much better h2h fighter and isn't afraid to kill.also because i'm sure whatever gambit is throwing(especially cards),shiva can dodge.all that is,of course, just my opinion.and if anyone thinks different,i respectfully disagree. no harm no foul

Originally posted by namorsubby
dagnabbit. i knew that was pointless but i still posted all that. namorsubby why do you choose to go that extra mile?


yes,i am talking to myself,what of it.


anyway i just think shiva takes the majority because she's just as fast IMO,but she a much better h2h fighter and isn't afraid to kill.also because i'm sure whatever gambit is throwing(especially cards),shiva can dodge.all that is,of course, just my opinion.and if anyone thinks different,i respectfully disagree. no harm no foul

You keep saying Shiva isn't afraid to kill? Gambit is ?

The goal is beat/kill your oppenent. CIS less with your char

She can dodge the cards, but can she dodge the explosion?

I don't care if you disagree, that's fine, it'd be pointless if everyone thought the same. Everyone is just saying their opinion, how you back it up is what matters.

Can you say actual words for me please.



I know.

Originally posted by namorsubby
Can you say actual words for me please.

Just saying why would Gambit be afraid to kill Shiva?

This is verse Thread. Were putting them in battle to see who wins in a fight. Seem by adding that statement she not afraid to kill increase her power or something

lol.i guess i shoud've said, "SHE IS RUTHLESS". like wolverine or deadshot or thanos etc etc. gambit isn't know for his lack of concern for human life.i don't just assume that both opponents are bloodthirsty when they're placed in a match. i consider their character.


countless characters have lost battles/been killed because their opponent was willing to what was needed while they weren't.so yeah, in a way, ruthlessness does add to one's power.and it is a significant factor in a fight.

Gambit is willing to kill if the person is trying to kill him.

i doubt he'd have a chance to kill if shiva goes for the kill.still just IMO though

Gambit loses. he fights by throwing/charging cards with a swing of the arm

If gambit sticks to defense: charging his staff and his body with kinetic energy he can give Shiva a light workout.

Gambit with Kinetic amping matches Shiva in speed agility and Reflexes.
Shiva has the edge in hitting power, and *precog* to clarify one of her abilities is future knowledge of a person's actions through body reading. With Shiva's prowess as a fighter such knowledge is Power. Too much Power for Gambit to contain.

Gambit 1/10

The 1 is for -The Gambit Gets a rush of blood to the Head Scenario.-

Originally posted by namorsubby
whoa,one at a time people.


anyway i believe shiva to be faster because that is what she appears to be most often whenever they fight.i believe batman has even said she was once(but you don't have to acknowledge that,because i'm not shufflin' around to get a scan for it)

I wasn't disagreeing with you. Well, sort've, actually, because I think Gambit will take a close majority; like in the Batman fight, if they close in, one strike is enough to kill Gambit.

I don't think Shiva is faster than Batman. Perhaps she relies more on agility in her fights, but FASTER? Nah. They're both absolute peak human.

Originally posted by Master Crimzon
I wasn't disagreeing with you. Well, sort've, actually, because I think Gambit will take a close majority; like in the Batman fight, if they close in, one strike is enough to kill Gambit.

I don't think Shiva is faster than Batman. Perhaps she relies more on agility in her fights, but FASTER? Nah. They're both absolute peak human.

Man is always faster proven fact!

Gambit is enhanced thanks to his power anyways. I still can't believe Shiva has chance against his speed/strenght/explosion power touches... or staff to poke her

Originally posted by namorsubby
i'd rather stick to stats then showings.you wanna know why? because sometimes authors go insane and display a character completely wrong(bat-god would be an example).sure some argue that if the character is written in a way that contradicts his stats regularly,then that should count,but there are some characters who are(like bat-god),and still people want to ignore that.they usually have a good reason(like the feats being completely ridiculous),but i'd just prefer to avoid all that interpertation by sticking to the facts.i'm sorry if it was convinent for me to do so this time,but "that's the way the cookie crumbles",as they say.
The difference is, you're using an outlandish showing from a character who has typical showings far under "BatGod" mode. Everything we've brought up here are well within Gambit's physical abilities as he's shown us.
Originally posted by namorsubby
don't any of you have access to wikipedia? or marvel? etc,etc?

i should've known not to post an opinion opposite of what ecryone else was saying.anyway,what's done is done.i'll post from some sites that have his stats to put an end to this(why do i feel that that won't put na end to this?)
Don't you have access to a comic?

Come now, you're not being persecuted. Everyone so far has read your argument.
Originally posted by namorsubby
in other words,GAMBIT IS PEAK HUMAN WHEN CHARGED.booyah
No. If we go by the sources you use, Gambit has a 7 in energy projection and fighting skills, a 6 in strength, and a 6 in speed. That literally means he has the energy projection of Living Tribunal ,as someone pointed out, is as strong as Wonder Man, and is as fast Quicksilver. Throw in the fighting skills of Wolverine/Captain America/Iron Fist ,which according to your sources, Gambit has, and this fight quickly changes into spite Gambit absolutely curbstomps Shiva without her having any way to defend herself going by your sources.

Do you not see how useless just pure stats/bios can be?

i have lost the energy for this,but i'll post once more.

gambit isn't peak human because i want him to be.he's peak human because that's just what his stats say.those number ratings you said are fan voted,meaning they're irrelevant.so yeah forget about it.every bio-site i've seen has put gambit at peak human when charged.you guys coming at me for it doesn't change anything.and some comic showings that seem to say the opposite don't change anything either


what do you mean everything you guys have brought up? the only thing i'm arguing against is the fact that you guys say he has superhuman speed,which is false.nothing else


and as for the comic crack.i've been to the respect thread.i've been to pretty much every respect thread,way before i posted here. no feat of speed or agility shown there is out of shiva's league,period.some(like the scene with blade), are a little shaky to me.seeing as blade has superhuman speed and gambit doesn't,but everyone has those showings.

i never claimed to be being persecuted. honestly,i don't care either way.

Originally posted by namorsubby
"Gambit's body, as a living generator of bio-kinetic energies, possesses physiological attributes adapted for constant motion. As a result, his mutation has increased his body's INNATE physical qualities ( such as speed, reflexes/reactions, stamina, agility, flexibility, dexterity, coordination, balance, and endurance) to the very limit of natural human capability."


in other words,GAMBIT IS PEAK HUMAN WHEN CHARGED.booyah

It doesn't say anything about having to charge to boost his speed anywhere in that paragraph. On the contrary, it mentions his speed is innate, as in, you know.... born with it. Mutation just boosted it to what it is now.

Gambit ftw.

.you guys use the stats when it's convient to you.

i could post like 5 more sites who say he has to charge for peak human status,but seeing as posting those ones didn't do much for my argument,i think i'll just pass.


shiva wins because she's just as fast,far more skilled,and ruthless.close-quarters,she'd kill him before he could do much of anything.not so close quarters,gambit has a chance,but she'll most likely just evade him,maybe get him worked up till he slips up,and then do what she does best,assasinate.she is said to be dc's best assasin you know.you don't just get that title for no reason.

It doesn't matter if she's DC's best assassin. Titles usually mean very little in VS. matches. She's outclassed in speed, range, and energy projection.

and how do you know she's outclassed in speed? i doubt you've even read a shiva bio. she's peak human,gambit is only peak human when charged.

of course he outclasses her and range and energy projection(range is debatable depending on her weapon set).did that really need to be said?

They are equal in range
Shiva having the edge in accuracy with a projectile weapon.

A Shuriken necklace will slow down a Kinetic Amped Gambit long enough for Shiva to punch him in the Brain.

Gambit wins again.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Gambit wins again.

you're thinking about blackjack Metalman

...Schwa?

Originally posted by Metalmanx
...Schwa?

Gambit wins

Shiva do well for against humans, but still die to Gambit 8/10

Shiva is toast, hell if she had some throwing stars that would help.

Originally posted by namorsubby
i have lost the energy for this,but i'll post once more.

gambit isn't peak human because i want him to be.he's peak human because that's just what his stats say.those number ratings you said are fan voted,meaning they're irrelevant.so yeah forget about it.every bio-site i've seen has put gambit at peak human when charged.you guys coming at me for it doesn't change anything.and some comic showings that seem to say the opposite don't change anything either

Actually those stats are fan vote and official marvel rating, that's why there are 2 different bars.

In Gambit's solo title Bullseye pwns Gambit in h2h with ease, and Remy resorts to bribing Deadpool to spare his life after Wade engages him to fulfill a contract.

Shiva 9/10

Originally posted by namorsubby
gambit isn't peak human because i want him to be.he's peak human because that's just what his stats say.those number ratings you said are fan voted,meaning they're irrelevant.so yeah forget about it.every bio-site i've seen has put gambit at peak human when charged.you guys coming at me for it doesn't change anything.and some comic showings that seem to say the opposite don't change anything either

what do you mean everything you guys have brought up? the only thing i'm arguing against is the fact that you guys say he has superhuman speed,which is false.nothing else

and as for the comic crack.i've been to the respect thread.i've been to pretty much every respect thread,way before i posted here. no feat of speed or agility shown there is out of shiva's league,period.some(like the scene with blade), are a little shaky to me.seeing as blade has superhuman speed and gambit doesn't,but everyone has those showings.

i never claimed to be being persecuted. honestly,i don't care either way.
Firstly, those were the "official" ratings. Secondly, you can't complain about fan voted stats anyway when you recommended we use wikipedia as a source. You claim otherwise, but it really seems like you're just switching stances depending on what is convenient for your argument. I really hoped my last post would help you see why bios should not be used as primary sources. You obviously recognize how ridiculous bios can be. You just objected to my use of the very same one you introduced...

You likened Gambit's superhuman feats to "Batgod". That is why I said everything we brought up is well within Gambit's abilities. "Batgod's" feats are so outlandish that he is virtually treated as a separate character from Batman.

I made the "comic crack" in response to your "wikipedia crack".

You did insinuate persecution there, or you wouldn't have added that little bit about going against the status quo. Either way, this is irrelevant now and I'll leave it be if you will.

Originally posted by namorsubby
and how do you know she's outclassed in speed? i doubt you've even read a shiva bio. she's peak human,gambit is only peak human when charged.

of course he outclasses her and range and energy projection(range is debatable depending on her weapon set).did that really need to be said?
We know she's outclassed in speed because of your bios. Like I said, he's as fast as Quicksilver according to your material.
Originally posted by namorsubby
.you guys use the stats when it's convient to you.

i could post like 5 more sites who say he has to charge for peak human status,but seeing as posting those ones didn't do much for my argument,i think i'll just pass.

shiva wins because she's just as fast,far more skilled,and ruthless.close-quarters,she'd kill him before he could do much of anything.not so close quarters,gambit has a chance,but she'll most likely just evade him,maybe get him worked up till he slips up,and then do what she does best,assasinate.she is said to be dc's best assasin you know.you don't just get that title for no reason.
No, we used them to show how ridiculous using bios is. I'll point out again that you obviously see the flaw when we do it....yet you still insist on using bios to support your argument while dismissing ours.

....so again you realize how futile it is to use bios exclusively as "they didn't do much for your argument."

Based on what? Bios? I already showed you that bios show Gambit would kill her without significant effort.

Comrade, our problem isn't the stance you take. It's how you arrived at that conclusion. Comics should be the primary source for debating comic characters.
Originally posted by shiv
In Gambit's solo title Bullseye pwns Gambit in h2h with ease, and Remy resorts to bribing Deadpool to spare his life after Wade engages him to fulfill a contract.

Shiva 9/10
For the 6,000,000,000,000,000th time. Gambit had just reacquired his powers in their full scope(new Sun). He didn't have complete control over his powers as shown when he almost disintegrated Rogue and Colossus during training. He fought Bullseye while trying to avoid killing innocent people with his powers.

Please people, read the comics before you post stuff like this. If you did read it, post any extenuating circumstances along with the event. If you don't, it becomes misleading like shiv's post.

Now if you honestly believe Bullseye can beat New Sun Gambit, we need to talk.

uh uh YOU are incorrect.

If Anything Gambits powers were GROWING. this is different from Spiderman who when he has trouble with his powers it usually means his powers are fading.

With Gambit the oppositte was happenning.
His energy projection was steadily increasing and so were his physical stats. In fact for someone who you imply was not 100% The Assassins and Thieves Guilds were shadowing his every move and They decided That of all the Available people at the Time Remy was in the Best Condition to lead them through a Restructuring Period.

Even when Batroc attacks Gambit he and Zaran or whatever comment that They have never seen Remy fight like That.

But when 2 H2H experts engaged Remy in close quaters combat Deadpool and Bullseye -with weapons Remy was outclassed.
Bullseye is an expert marksman and he anticipated Remy's offense with precision and with the same precision worked Gambit into a pposition where he could not evade his knives.

The body reading makes it too much of an Advantage for Shiva.

Originally posted by shiv
uh uh YOU are incorrect.

If Anything Gambits powers were GROWING. this is different from Spiderman who when he has trouble with his powers it usually means his powers are fading.

With Gambit the oppositte was happenning.
His energy projection was steadily increasing and so were his physical stats. In fact for someone who you imply was not 100% The Assassins and Thieves Guilds were shadowing his every move and They decided That of all the Available people at the Time Remy was in the Best Condition to lead them through a Restructuring Period.

Even when Batroc attacks Gambit he and Zaran or whatever comment that They have never seen Remy fight like That.

But when 2 H2H experts engaged Remy in close quaters combat Deadpool and Bullseye -with weapons Remy was out of outclassed.


The body reading makes it too much of an Advantage for Shiva.

I couldn't find it in the respect thread for deal and Bulleyes, if possible you can bring up a scan to see the actual event of the fight and action included

Just throwing out some note here. I just picked up Hush recently, and I think it's impressive that Lady Shiva absolutely tooled the living hell out of Catwoman. Not as in Catwoman got in one blow and proceeded to get beaten down. Shiva own her, and- without visibly using any of her special killing techniques- beat Selina to the point that she was in danger of death.

Just adds more to the uber badassery of Lady Shiva.

not really Shiva was just throwing her around to get at Wayne.

No, Shiva beat her to near-death, while Catwoman was fully trying to beat her.

And this isn't some weakling we're talking about; it's Selina Kyle, who is an extremely proficient martial artist.

jeez you'd think this was new son gambit or death gambit versus shiva the way you guys view this match(most of you anyway).gambit's really not all that impressive.he's the definition of low-level meta.scarely above your average street level peak human.and shiva's definitely not your average street level peak human.

oh,and i forgot about shiva's throwing weapons.that puts the odds even more in her favor.

Originally posted by Master Crimzon
No, Shiva beat her to near-death, while Catwoman was fully trying to beat her.

And this isn't some weakling we're talking about; it's Selina Kyle, who is an extremely proficient martial artist.

how can I put this politely...

Selina-bloodlusted vs Shiva

is like

Spoiler-bloodlusted vs Cassandra Cain

or

Alfred w/shotgun-bloodlusted vs Batman lol.

Originally posted by shiv
how can I put this politely...

Selina-bloodlusted vs Shiva

is like

Spoiler-bloodlusted vs Cassandra Cain

or

Alfred w/shotgun-bloodlusted vs Batman lol.

Which adds to Shiva's obvious incredible proficiency; using simple brute power, she made short work of someone who can occasionally hang with Batman in a fight.

Catwoman isn't the best at what she does, but she's pretty damn good.

catwoman's not nearly as ineffecient as everyone seems to think.she beat ziess.

If I remember correctly, she even held her own against Batman temporarily in the Long Halloween. She's not Batman's equal, but she's a very capable fighter.

Just shows what the difference between a very capable martial artist to the world's greatest assassin is.

She never held her own in The Long Halloween... she just ran from Batman a lot.

Originally posted by shiv
In Gambit's solo title Bullseye pwns Gambit in h2h with ease, and Remy resorts to bribing Deadpool to spare his life after Wade engages him to fulfill a contract.

Shiva 9/10 Wade would kill Shiva too.

Not to mention that Gambit's powers were acting up during the Bullseye fight, plus in that same series he stalemated Daredevil who always beats Bullseye.

shiva would no doubt fair better than gambit,considering her h2h capabilities.

Getting in HTH range is a bad idea seeing as he can charge objects with a single touch.

i wasn't talking about shiva engaging gambit h2h. but either way i think she's good enough to end him before he can do much of anything if they're close.

Not really, seeing as he's faster and skiled enough to stalemate Daredevil.

really,seeing as shiva's just as fast,and far more skilled.skilled enough to beat batman.


oh,and let's not forget far more ruthless

Only she isn't faster or far more skilled or even more ruthless.

lol.that's the way to do it.just say "no she isn't'


would you mind stating why she isn't all of those things? or is she just not?

Let's start with the fact that he's fast enough to not only block machine gun fire but to actually deflect them back at the attacker, then we can move on the him being skilled enough to stalemate Daredevil and have wins w/circumstances over Sabertooth and Wolverine.

We can close by pointing out that Gambit can and has charged people's clothing before.

close?


shiva is fast enough to evade sniper gunfire without knowing in advance.this is a regular thing.how regularly does gambit deflect machine gun fire.i think i've see tim drake to that once.lol

i'll continue this later

Deflecting machine gun fire back at the attacker takes a bit more speed and skill than just dodging a bullet, seeing as the person has to perform a series of precise movements.

Classic Gambit cannot charge inorganic matter w/o contact

So?

Can he charge organic matter now?

Not sure if he kept that ability after the New Sun story arc.

Well im pretty sure he can still charge any matter within his line of sight.

you wish.

Originally posted by shiv
you wish.

Regardless, were dealing with a man good enough to stalemate DD h2h and hold his own agaisnt wolverine...shiva was wasted by prom if im not mistaken.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Well im pretty sure he can still charge any matter within his line of sight.


He has to touch to charge still. organic or non.

Originally posted by shiv
uh uh YOU are incorrect.

If Anything Gambits powers were GROWING. this is different from Spiderman who when he has trouble with his powers it usually means his powers are fading.

With Gambit the oppositte was happenning.
His energy projection was steadily increasing and so were his physical stats. In fact for someone who you imply was not 100% The Assassins and Thieves Guilds were shadowing his every move and They decided That of all the Available people at the Time Remy was in the Best Condition to lead them through a Restructuring Period.

Even when Batroc attacks Gambit he and Zaran or whatever comment that They have never seen Remy fight like That.

But when 2 H2H experts engaged Remy in close quaters combat Deadpool and Bullseye -with weapons Remy was outclassed.
Bullseye is an expert marksman and he anticipated Remy's offense with precision and with the same precision worked Gambit into a pposition where he could not evade his knives.

The body reading makes it too much of an Advantage for Shiva.
No, I am quite correct my friend. After the operation to reinsert the portion of his brain that gives him his full powers, Gambit has all his powers. What he does lack is control of them. This outright stated by Gambit. It's stated by the narrator. It's demonstrated by Gambit. You can't refute that. Here's one example for you. In anger, Gambit storms from the X-Mansion combusts the pier he is on.
http://img292.imageshack.us/img292/6692/gambitouttacontrolrz0.th.jpg

What does the Assassins Guild have to do with this?

....or Batroc?

Again, Remy states that doesn't have control of his powers. Hell, the cards he threw at Bullseye didn't even explode. Remy was serious about trying to control his abilities. Once again I must say. If you think Bullseye, or Deadpool for that matter, can take a fully powered Gambit...well you know the rest.
Originally posted by namorsubby
jeez you'd think this was new son gambit or death gambit versus shiva the way you guys view this match(most of you anyway).gambit's really not all that impressive.he's the definition of low-level meta.scarely above your average street level peak human.and shiva's definitely not your average street level peak human.

oh,and i forgot about shiva's throwing weapons.that puts the odds even more in her favor.
Well, you now admit he is meta level. We're making progress.
Originally posted by snoopdogg
Can he charge organic matter now?
So far, he seems to be back to standard levels. No organic charging.

He can charge organic matter, he just charged Sebastian Shaw in X-men Legacy.

clever.

he is a meta,a meta with only peak human speed/agility when he's charging himself.

i do believe i have exhausted all my points for this argument.time to put this pup down

shiva for a casual 7/10

Originally posted by namorsubby
clever.

he is a meta,a meta with only peak human speed/agility when he's charging himself.

i do believe i have exhausted all my points for this argument.time to put this pup down

shiva for a casual 7/10

Hes peak at his base...but u do realize that if u just admitted hes meta when charged well....is shiva high meta now or something.

i said he was a meta, not a meta with superhuma speed/agility.

Is this still going on? Gambit wrecks her.

This really should have ended ages ago. Shiva kills him up close, but she won't get that chance as he would blast her beforehand.

Up close...wouldnt that be suicide since he could just charge her. His bas is already peak human and she is roughly only street level.

Most of his stats are superhuman. He's more-than-arguably faster than her, with faster reflexes as well.

one of you guys are eventually gonna have to prove that.i've been to the respect thread a million times,and i'm still not convinced. name a time where gambit was shown performing a speed feat out of shiva's league(no PIS).


come to think of it, first tell me what shiva's league is anyway.do you guys even know? you can't just go to her respect thread and find out.not that easy,she doesn't have one. you have to actually know

Ok, deflecting machine gun fire back at the shooter and dancing between rounds from a machine gun.

out of shiva's league? no

evading sniper rounds without knowing of the attempt before the shot.

Originally posted by namorsubby
out of shiva's league? no

evading sniper rounds without knowing of the attempt before the shot.

Deflecting multiple machine guns rounds back at the attacker >> dodging sniper fire.

Dancing around machine gun fire >>> dodging sniper fire

so dodging bullets that you see coming at you and know are coming vastly( i assume that's what >>> is) outclasses dodging a sniper bullet(which has the fastest velocity) when you're not even aware that it's been shot before it has?

i think not.

Again, mulitple bullets >>> 1 bullet.

Dancing between rounds >>> dodging a round.

again. faster accurate bullet that you don't see coming before it comes<<<multiple bullets that are inaccurate anyway and you see coming.it doesn't hurt if you're a bullet timer for this feat either.


besides that,you know everyone from tim drake to batman and yes even lady shiva has dodged machine gun fire. it's pretty much a regular street level DC thing.

Big difference between "dodging" machine gun fire which most street level people have done and having it pointed out that it seems like your dancing between each of the bullets.

Again, he has also deflected machine gun fire back at the attacker, that takes speed and skill.

Originally posted by Mindset
He can charge organic matter, he just charged Sebastian Shaw in X-men Legacy.
You are absolutely correct Mindset. He did charge Shaw. This particular situation is a bit tricky though. I'm not sure if we should assume he can charge all organic matter just yet. Shaw's power allows him to absorb energy. That may be the key to why Gambit was able to power Shaw up enough to destroy Sinister's machine. On the other hand, Gambit did state that he can put "dat charge into anything. And anyone." Gambit's definitely gone through some changes recently, but he appears to have returned to normal save for the Shaw incident. Given his history, I'd say we should withhold judgement until we see Gambit charge another person. Preferably a person without absorption abilities.

Of course, I'm not saying you're wrong. I just think it's iffy right now. I can see your point though.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Up close...wouldnt that be suicide since he could just charge her. His bas is already peak human and she is roughly only street level.

Please educate me about Gambit. For example if he was punched in the face, would his opponent still get blasted from merely touching him or does he have to actively 'charge' then touch them?

he has to consciously charge them. and after shiva physically engages,he won't get the chance.

Originally posted by Warrior18
Please educate me about Gambit. For example if he was punched in the face, would his opponent still get blasted from merely touching him or does he have to actively 'charge' then touch them?
It appears to be a conscious decision to charge when Gambit does it. Why is this of consequence here?

Originally posted by StyleTime
It appears to be a conscious decision to charge when Gambit does it. Why is this of consequence here?

I was just answering another poster who thought Shiva trying to fight Gambit H2H would be suicide, which I think would be the only way she could hope to get anything from this fight. Deck of cards from Gambit is all it takes.Shiva gets zapped basically IMO.

when did gambit become more than a low level meta?


am i in the wrong thread? is this new son gambit? or death gambit?

Originally posted by Warrior18
I was just answering another poster who thought Shiva trying to fight Gambit H2H would be suicide, which I think would be the only way she could hope to get anything from this fight. Deck of cards from Gambit is all it takes.Shiva gets zapped basically IMO.
Understood.
Originally posted by namorsubby
when did gambit become more than a low level meta?


am i in the wrong thread? is this new son gambit? or death gambit?
Noone said Gambit was above low meta.

they sure act like it.

Gambit can go near super-human agility once he tap into his kinetic powers. His base strength and speed is that of average man. Gambit can only charge inorganic objects and it take much longer on larger object. Gambit develop aerobatic combat thanks to his mutant agility when tap and is very skilled with throwing small knives and object.
-Gambit can charge organic being, but has mental block.

Lady Shiva is highly trained assassin in Kung-fu. She has stalemented Batman. In these following images show her strength, agility, and techique

Blocking Cat woman attacks like nothing, Cat woman is consider near peak human. Shiva another tier of peakness.
http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/7015/shivabeatcatwomania0.th.jpg

This show Lady Shiva deflecting incoming arrows from Green Arrow Son "Connar" with kicks
http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/3294/kickingarrowshn8.th.jpg

Then moving on to Shiva offensive feats
Lady Shiva fighting Batgirl(her daugther) striking her with fast deadly technique that disable her oppenent.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/232/shivapressurepointsw7.th.png

Shiva show how powerful her attack can be with technique, shattering stone.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/9875/leopardblowux5.th.jpg

Shiva owning Killer Croc, she doesn't need weapons to fight freaks.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/8610/allweaponlp3.th.png

Shiva here dodging bullets close to point blank, something impossible for other peak humans to do, even Batman!
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/6772/shivadogdebullethr6.th.jpg
After reviewing everything, and learning more of Lady Shiva.
Against Gambit, I have to say her chances are 6/10. Shiva wins

wow, that's great.


batman has dodged close range bullets though.


hey,where'd you get those scans? is there some lost thread of her here? i'm thinking of making one.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/50/109730969_4ff995e101_m.jpg

Gambit catching a fired grenade

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/109730968_21070f7f48.jpg

Gambit blocking machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/39/109730966_3e2b68782d.jpg

Gambit dancing around machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/53/109730965_717a15dd2e.jpg

Gambit dodges 33,000 rounds of machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/53/120017972_51c7bfed33.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/51/120017973_23b5197ea8_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/120017974_f89b8486f1_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/55/120017975_f7df868416_o.jpg

i wish we had a shiva respect thread.i'd make one,but it would take forever and no one would visit anyway.i don't want a repeat of the thread i just made.

Originally posted by Silent Master
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/50/109730969_4ff995e101_m.jpg

Gambit catching a fired grenade

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/109730968_21070f7f48.jpg

Gambit blocking machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/39/109730966_3e2b68782d.jpg

Gambit dancing around machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/53/109730965_717a15dd2e.jpg

Gambit dodges 33,000 rounds of machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/53/120017972_51c7bfed33.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/51/120017973_23b5197ea8_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/120017974_f89b8486f1_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/55/120017975_f7df868416_o.jpg
YOU HAD TO PROVE ME WRONG LOLZ... Those are your own personal uploads right? Can't find them anyways online. Well it is pretty close. Gambit has advantage of dodging with his mutant agility, all defensive feats, but getting close to battle Shiva is resulting for his lost. She can dodge knives/playing cards with ease. Shiva still take this 6/10 in hard earn fight.

Originally posted by vansonbee
YOU HAD TO PROVE ME WRONG LOLZ... Those are your own personal uploads right? Can't find them anyways online. Well it is pretty close. Gambit has advantage of dodging with his mutant agility, all defensive feats, but getting close to battle Shiva is resulting for his lost. She can dodge knives/playing cards with ease. Shiva still take this 6/10 in hard earn fight.

doh

Can she dodge EXPLOSIONS?

They're scans I've come across over the years and saved to a personal flickr account.

Can she dodge EXPLOSIONS? Originally posted by Metalmanx
doh

Can she dodge EXPLOSIONS?
That also comes into play, she might dodge it, but still get side tracked by the explosion simiilar to grenade*(but weaker)
Timing also comes into play, after all both characters have basic knowledge of each other. Gambit is much quicker then Lady Shiva as well. I can't find anything to prove she is compared to Silent_Master Scans.

Like I say this will be close match, 6/10 Lady Shiva
Gambit has great agility that is near super-human
Shiva is near peak human speed, but her H2H combat ability is way overlapping Gambits

Gambit equipment
-Staff
-Cards

Lady Shiva
-Dagger
-Ninja Star

The strange thing is, you've listed reasons why Gambit should beat Shiva, but say that Shiva wins. Her hand to hand skill will garner her some wins, but that alone won't give her a majority without a reliable way of overcoming Gambit's ranged advantage.

Originally posted by StyleTime
The strange thing is, you've listed reasons why Gambit should beat Shiva, but say that Shiva wins. Her hand to hand skill will garner her some wins, but that alone won't give her a majority without a reliable way of overcoming Gambit's ranged advantage.

Because I ain't bias,

Those scan Silent_master upload are mostly defensive feats. Gambit charged inorganic objects take time on larger object.
We are not even sure what his explosion radius is and timing on explosion. Gambit is fast, but his H2H combat isn't comparable to Shiva.



**This thread is set for basic knowledge of oppenents right?

Originally posted by vansonbee
Because I ain't bias,

Those scan Silent_master upload are mostly defensive feats. Gambit charged inorganic objects take time on larger object.
We are not even sure what his explosion radius is and timing on explosion. Gambit is fast, but his H2H combat isn't comparable to Shiva.



**This thread is set for basic knowledge of oppenents right?

How does one OFFENSIVELY dodge bullets then?

Originally posted by vansonbee
Because I ain't bias,

Those scan Silent_master upload are mostly defensive feats. Gambit charged inorganic objects take time on larger object.
We are not even sure what his explosion radius is and timing on explosion. Gambit is fast, but his H2H combat isn't comparable to Shiva.



**This thread is set for basic knowledge of oppenents right?
Actually, that would imply you are indeed biased. You argument basicly says that Gambit should win the majority, but you give it to Shiva anyway.

We don't know the exact measure of his blast radius, but I can give you scans of Gambit causing explosions Shiva has no hope of dodging if you want. He's blown out an entire level of a building with one card before. That's not even the largest he's made. He also done similar sizes with multiple cards at once.

You're putting too much weight on her hand to hand abilities. How will she get to use it?

Originally posted by StyleTime
Actually, that would imply you are indeed biased. You argument basicly says that Gambit should win the majority, but you give it to Shiva anyway.

We don't know the exact measure of his blast radius, but I can give you scans of Gambit causing explosions Shiva has no hope of dodging if you want. He's blown out an entire level of a building with one card before. That's not even the largest he's made. He also done similar sizes with multiple cards at once.

You're putting too much weight on her hand to hand abilities. How will she get to use it?

That why I am asking a question. What the timing and explosive radius on his charged card, don't start pointing at me and saying I am at fault* I like Gambit to win because he a mutant freak that should be above humans. So far his advantage is range*

Shiva shouldn't want to get close to him either. That's just a closer target for his cards.

And they explode on impact. Also, for the majority of time, he hardly takes any time at all to charge objects, regardless of their size. However, the bigger the object, the larger/more potent the explosion (for the most part).

Gambit wins this.

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Shiva shouldn't want to get close to him either. That's just a closer target for his cards.

And they explode on impact. Also, for the majority of time, he hardly takes any time at all to charge objects, regardless of their size. However, the bigger the object, the larger/more potent the explosion (for the most part).

Gambit wins this.
Your opinion like many on this board. Hoping silent_master can bring up scans with offensive feats to support Gambit in H2H combat and explosion radius of the blast.
We know it take longer time on larger objects to charge and the explosion is way stronger then Genade.

Gambit takes the majoirty, can Shiva roll with a building size explosion to her chin?

Sorry, the only scans I had saved for Gambit were those bullet dodging/deflecting ones.

i always thought that gambits "powering up" feats gave him enhanced abilities, not peak

Originally posted by Sin I AM
i always thought that gambits "powering up" feats gave him enhanced abilities, not peak

Gambit enhanced abilities boost his speed from average man to speed is close to spiderman (*near super-human agility)

Originally posted by vansonbee
Gambit enhanced abilities boost his speed from average man to speed is close to spiderman (*near super-human agility)

Average man......his base is peak human.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Average man......his base is peak human.

You know what I mean he above average man, but not on batman peak lvl* prove me wrong at that.

I am just stating he can reach near super-human agility if tap to his kinetic powers

How is Shiva dodging what equates to multiple grenades?

gambit has never displayed the ability to amp his physical attributes to the point where he exceeded batman or came anywhere near peter

Originally posted by Sin I AM
gambit has never displayed the ability to amp his physical attributes to the point where he exceeded batman or came anywhere near peter
Before jumping in and saying Gambit isn't near Batman speed or more* read the page ahead of this, you might seen these scans by Silent_Master*. I never said he was Spiderman speed. He was near it. Page 6 also has Lady Shiva Feats and anything you like to upload or add to support.

Originally posted by Silent Master
http://farm1.static.flickr.com/50/109730969_4ff995e101_m.jpg

Gambit catching a fired grenade

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/109730968_21070f7f48.jpg

Gambit blocking machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/39/109730966_3e2b68782d.jpg

Gambit dancing around machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/53/109730965_717a15dd2e.jpg

Gambit dodges 33,000 rounds of machine gun fire

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/53/120017972_51c7bfed33.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/51/120017973_23b5197ea8_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/37/120017974_f89b8486f1_o.jpg

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/55/120017975_f7df868416_o.jpg

^^
Shang Chi Deathstroke Shatterstar Deadpool Harlequinn Azarel Shiva and Connor Hawke and Nightcrawler can do That.

Incorrect, IIRC none of them have deflected machine gun fire, nor have they had someone comment that they were dancing between bullets.

Originally posted by shiv
^^
Shang Chi Deathstroke Shatterstar Deadpool Harlequinn Azarel Shiva and Connor Hawke and Nightcrawler can do That.
I don't doubt Deathstroke and Nightcrawler can't, but can the rest continuously complete more then 1 part a time? I seen scan of Shiva jump kicking a guy from mid-air on a car. She and the rest doesn't have the feat to support that.

Originally posted by vansonbee
Gambit can go near super-human agility once he tap into his kinetic powers. His base strength and speed is that of average man. Gambit can only charge inorganic objects and it take much longer on larger object. Gambit develop aerobatic combat thanks to his mutant agility when tap and is very skilled with throwing small knives and object.
-Gambit can charge organic being, but has mental block.

Lady Shiva is highly trained assassin in Kung-fu. She has stalemented Batman. In these following images show her strength, agility, and techique

Blocking Cat woman attacks like nothing, Cat woman is consider near peak human. Shiva another tier of peakness.
http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/7015/shivabeatcatwomania0.th.jpg

This show Lady Shiva deflecting incoming arrows from Green Arrow Son "Connar" with kicks
http://img65.imageshack.us/img65/3294/kickingarrowshn8.th.jpg

Then moving on to Shiva offensive feats
Lady Shiva fighting Batgirl(her daugther) striking her with fast deadly technique that disable her oppenent.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/232/shivapressurepointsw7.th.png

Shiva show how powerful her attack can be with technique, shattering stone.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/9875/leopardblowux5.th.jpg

Shiva owning Killer Croc, she doesn't need weapons to fight freaks.
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/8610/allweaponlp3.th.png

Shiva here dodging bullets close to point blank, something impossible for other peak humans to do, even Batman!
http://img355.imageshack.us/img355/6772/shivadogdebullethr6.th.jpg
After reviewing everything, and learning more of Lady Shiva.
Against Gambit, I have to say her chances are 6/10. Shiva wins


Bbbbbbboring! Anyone got a pillow I feel like taking a nap.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Bbbbbbboring! Anyone got a pillow I feel like taking a nap.
I guess it is, if you compare kung fu H2H expert feats to Mutant Freak*

i don't think so, no way is gambit beating Shiva when he got his ass beat by Batroc of all people during the New Sun mini...Shiva is quick and deadly enough to beat him period u people act as if gambit can't be harmed by his own powers

8/10 Shiva

IOW, you're basing this on Gambit's low showings.

Originally posted by vansonbee
I guess it is, if you compare kung fu H2H expert feats to Mutant Freak*

Ummm Gambits feats are better. Bullets are faster than arrows.

shiva FTW. h2h,he won't last long at all. the further you go out,the more of a chance gambit has.

Batroc is an extremely skilled Martial Artist who owned Gambit, i don't see it as a low showing especially noting his increased power level thru-out that arc... remy stated himself that Batroc could of killed him

Wolverine is extremely skilled and Gambit has atleast one win against him, Daredevil is also extremely skilled and Gambit has a stalemate against him.

not the norm though. unpowered blade(regular human speed) gave him a run. he could of decapitated him with that sword from the beginning(he sliced his cigarette)

Originally posted by namorsubby
not the norm though. unpowered blade(regular human speed) gave him a run. he could of decapitated him with that sword from the beginning(he sliced his cigarette)

Gambit wasn't fighting then was he?

Originally posted by Sin I AM
Batroc is an extremely skilled Martial Artist

Don't know about that, hes skilled but not extremely.

your kidding he is a beast, i gotta find the issue...Wolverine stated it himself...i think it was while he was in the cage, can't remember, i gotta dig thru boxes...but shiva outclasses him here...

She has him beat in hth skill, yea...but he has her beat in stats like speed and let's not forget about his powers.

Damn! Shiva use to be one of my favorite DC characters, but fighting Batman isn't the same as fighting Gambit. Gambit even without his powers has crazy unhuman reflexes and fighting ability, which alone would beat Shiva.