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Week 1 Battlefield: New York City

Battle Duration: Monday, September 15th @ 10am thru Friday, September 19th @ 12am)

Combatants: Bdub/Smurph Vs. Scoob/Leo

Judges: Badabing, Red, Galan

Good luck to the combatants.

Team name: Old's Cool
(wonders what Leo will say when he reads this as it has not been pre-approved)

The Mandarin - 30
Spiral - 30
Brit - 20
Magik - 20
Century - 20
Alfred - 5

New York: not sure how far apart we're starting but I'm going with the assumption that we're not right next to each other.

PREP

Location = Batcave

Amalgamation of: Mandarin+Spiral+Century+Brit

This creates a 6 armed figure with with Mandy's rings fused in the spine, Brit's physical invulnerability and Century's ... uh ... hair?

Penalty = 6 minutes of prep time

During this time Alfred has been trying to seduce Magik. He didn't get very far though ... until he whipped out the platinum card naughty

Prep time usage for Alfred = 24 seconds.



Seriously though, during this 6 minutes Alfred and Magik have been collecting any explosive materials they can find in the cave (bat bombs or C4 or whatever)

After this, Magik hands off her soul-sword to our amalgam (let's call it Hex) Alfred grabs his shotgun (but you just know by this point that he's not going to survive anyway)

Hex then uses a combination of Spiral's matter manip & genetics background coupled with Mandarin's matter re-arranger:

http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mattermanipdb4vs5.jpg

http://img162.imageshack.us/my.php?image=69pm6.jpg
http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=70wg6.jpg

To instantly alter Magik so that she now has the same 6 armed physique as Spiral had and to incorporate all the explosives available into Alfred's clothing.

With maybe a few minutes left, Hex uses Spiral's mental powers, boosted by Mandarin's mento-intesifier ring, to transfer her magical knowledge to Magik (can't find the scan ... Leo's got it somewhere, we'll post it in one of our battle posts, it basically shows Spiral delivering knowledge telepathically from a great distance)

We'll also use this ability to make sure Alfred will go through with his role as a living bomb even if he doesn't want to:

http://img229.imageshack.us/my.php?image=56hypnonl3.jpg

Magik is prepped to go astral form when the fight starts to quickly recon the area.

Spiral will be making our guys invisible (another scan I haven't gotten from Leo yet)

With the scouting and enhanced senses of Hex we'll know their location pretty much instantly.

We will, of course, be entering the match intangible in case there are any random doomsday devices waiting for us:

http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=intangibilityvh4zf9.jpg

I know I personally argued against this ability last time SPiral showed up in a tourney as BFR ... but it's been cleared as the same type of thing Knightcrawler or Martian Manhunter/Miss Martian does when using their abilities.

Um ... what else?

Basically we're prepping, scouting and locating here ... we wont rush in against unknown enemies without minimal intel, and as we don't know the combinations being used by the enemy we're playing it smart.

Feck it ... Century's hardly been mentioned yet ... when the match starts we'll use him to randomly transport around the city so the enemy can't pinpoint us until we know what we're facing.

Brit's power doesn't help us during prep, but when the fighting starts you'll see why he made the cut.

Deus Ex Machina: Post 1 (Smurph Originally posted by illadelph12

PREP

Location = Batcave That's not Alfred's prep zone.



Originally posted by illadelph12
Seriously though, during this 6 minutes Alfred and Magik have been collecting any explosive materials they can find in the cave (bat bombs or C4 or whatever) lol?

So, Alfred and Magik get taken out by Batman's security devices, traps and so forth during prep.

Originally posted by illadelph12
Magik hands off her soul-sword to our amalgam Few people can effectively wield the soul sword- Kitty Pryde has shown that it's innate, not necessarily something anyone can learn.

Originally posted by illadelph12
Hex then uses a combination of Spiral's matter manip & genetics background coupled with Mandarin's matter re-arranger:

http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=mattermanipdb4vs5.jpg

http://img162.imageshack.us/my.php?image=69pm6.jpg
http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=70wg6.jpg

To instantly alter Magik so that she now has the same 6 armed physique as Spiral had and to incorporate all the explosives available into Alfred's clothing.

As comics have taught us, inorganic and organic matter manipulation are two completely different things. Neither of those scans cover organic manip, none show additional mass being added (mass is only converted... where are all the extra arms gonna come from?). None of those scans show that Spiral's gonna be able to recall everything that she has on genetics fast enough for you to successfully alter someone's base physiology and actually add extra living matter (which is completely different from just adding a cybernetic set of legs... and much, much harder). You'd have to add each individual extra nerve and synapse, every separate vesicle of acetylecholine, as well as manipulating impulse pathways to/from the brain... and that's JUST the nervous system.

For all we know, the spell that Spiral used in that situation was specifically designed to create a Mojo-like set of legs for exactly the reason she referenced in the scan... which hardly supports matter manipulating a whole separate set of bodily functions, from thin air.

This would be further backed up by the fact that Rita (Spiral) has a body shoppe that she's used to cybernetically enhance herself, and people like Lady Deathstrike... by actually working on them. If she was as skilled as you would have us believe, she could just wave her fingers and make the changes, and she wouldn't have a cybernetic arm herself, instead have a real one.

Finally, you're working against the clock, since you seem to assume you'll do all this and still have a "few minutes" left for the next part of your prep.

So, you end up with a bloody, unrecognizable mess from what used to be Magik's body. El oh el.

Also, Magik's already dead because all the big guns were amalgamating while the Bat-security was pwning her.

Originally posted by illadelph12
With maybe a few minutes left, Hex uses Spiral's mental powers, boosted by Mandarin's mento-intesifier ring, to transfer her magical knowledge to Magik (can't find the scan ... Leo's got it somewhere, we'll post it in one of our battle posts, it basically shows Spiral delivering knowledge telepathically from a great distance) Scans of Mandarin's ring doing anything remotely close to what you're suggesting here?

Originally posted by illadelph12
We'll also use this ability to make sure Alfred will go through with his role as a living bomb even if he doesn't want to:

http://img229.imageshack.us/my.php?image=56hypnonl3.jpg


Alfred's already dead from the Bat security. Try to keep up.

Originally posted by illadelph12
Magik is prepped to go astral form when the fight starts to quickly recon the area. Didn't you draft Exiles Magik? When has she done anything like this? It's already shown that their (Exiles and 616 Magik, that is) powersets differ, so this is a huge leap of faith.

Plus, you've already given away the soulsword, which amps magical ability... so you'll need to show that she can do this on earth, without the soul sword.
Originally posted by illadelph12
We will, of course, be entering the match intangible in case there are any random doomsday devices waiting for us:

http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=intangibilityvh4zf9.jpg
That's a complete misnomer... it's not intangibility, just very fast teleportation, that can't be kept up for any great period of time.

Originally posted by illadelph12
I know I personally argued against this ability last time SPiral showed up in a tourney as BFR ... but it's been cleared as the same type of thing Knightcrawler or Martian Manhunter/Miss Martian does when using their abilities. It was actually kicked out of the last tourney for not being like J'onn's ability... but meh, not important.

So, in summary:

Their batprep doesn't work. Their matter manip doesn't work. I'm skeptical of whether their telepathy trick can instantly process such vast amounts of information, but I'll wait for the scan. Their intangibility doesn't work. They can still be hit by every attack we've put in place, and, as Blair or I will detail in the next post, they're grasping at straws when they try to debunk our strategy, and our Arsenal amalgam could take them out by itself.

okey dokey. my partner got things started off very well. i'd only like to add a little bit of support to some of what he said.

first, in response to this:



and this:





here we see nimrod simply trying to upload only a PART of his OWN programming into a different unit (built by forge, btw--the SAME forge who built NIMROD himself . . .)

http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uploadpn2.jpg

umm, HOW much time did that say?

http://img185.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uploadpn2.jpg

yep, i thought so--TWENTY-FOUR minutes. for his OWN programming. into a unit designed by the same guy who designed him. and they want him to absorb ALL THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE KREE EMPIRE in 6 mins? and they ALSO want to absorb all the multi-dimensional knowledge that went into that battlefield thingy too??

seriously, boys . . . scoob severely understated your overstatement of nimrod's programming capabilities . . .

as far as vector--i honestly have no idea how his telekinetic ability to repel things seemingly hindered strange's powers, but it doesn't much matter. in my time on the forum, i've made it known how much i depise calling PIS, and i only rarely ever label anything as such. in this case though, vector's every other appearance portrays his powers as unidirectional--ie--he doesn't/can't set up an all-encompassing force field. he repels things in front of him (unless you've proof to the contrary . . . please, show me a scan of him creating a force field or concede that THAT part of your plan is utterly baseless.) that vector scan directly contradicts every depiction of his powers at any other time.

but . . . even if you accept it, it is utterly meaningless. we're not using magic to locate you. we're using our eyes to find the 600' tall robot stomping around in new york. not too difficult i'd imagine . . .

now, because i don't believe you can set up a vector-style force field, and because, like my partner, i don't believe for one second that pym particles (if you can prove you have access to them . . .) would affect a device thousands of years beyond our understanding and capable of housing within it its own rules of physics! that isn't a gun, or a potion. damn . . . at least show us SOME sort of proof the particles would work on something that bends physics. what's the most complex thing pym has altered?? nothing close to that i'd wager . . .

anyway, i digress. like i said, i don't believe for a moment you could set up a vector-repelling force field, but again, it hardly matters. even if you DID, the field has proven ineffective against high-yield energy attacks in the past:

http://img409.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vectorfallseb3.jpg

if his little old field can't repel THAT attack, i REALLY don't like his odds against a blast that can literally unhinge time and space . . .

oh, and vector's powers are TELEKINETIC--that is, mental. that means they would affect a larger area, but it does NOT mean they would be more puissant. our attack would literally decimate them--even IF they could somehow prove vector's powers could be used to surround them and protect their backs.

our attack is utterly simple and indefensible. we just hit them with more than they can handle. nimrod has been overwhelmed by physical damage on a number of occasions, his armor cracked by colossus even as he failed to sense kitty intangible INSIDE colossus. his senses aren't great, he CAN be fooled and distracted and he has not shown the ability to adapt to multiple/simultaneous attacks. by attacking him at the same time from the front and back, we play on his observed weaknesses and crush him with a single assault.

lastly--even if for whatever reason anyone DOES believe the whole PB thing. WE HAVE SPIRAL! she is an INTERDIMENSIONAL SORCERESS! she has used her magic at the BIG CRUNCH--the end of time, when all of REAILTY was colliding and ending. she dances through magical dimensions like we walk on the sidewalk, bends space and time, can and has time traveled. spiral is the walking, talking version of 'broken physics'. you actually think for a second that whatever was inside that battlefield would have ANY impact on her at all?

not.
a.
chance.

Deus Ex Machina: Post 2 (Smurph)

Originally posted by Scoobless

Well ... we did expect a plan from these two that would stretch the realms of believability .. can't say we've been disappointed. Yeah... so, to recap my last post:

Scoob and Leo want to:

Use a character that can't astrally project, to astrally project.
Use a character that can't go intangible... to go intangible.
Use a character that can't do anything close to complex organic matter manip... to do exactly that.
Use a character that has never been shown to use the soulsword, to use the soulsword.


This list goes on. But we're the ones with an incredible plan?

Heh.




Originally posted by Scoobless
Entire history of the Kree, a race who are (at least) hundreds of thousands of years more advanced than the era Nimrod comes from? ... this is really not happening.
You assume, despite the fact that they come from an alternate dimension, are a completely separate branch of Kree, and have no on panel display of vast history, that this would overload us. Let's throw a few more completely baseless adjectives in there, eh?

And we really only want the info on Noh-Varr's tech anyways. If Arsenal really needs to, he can adapt himself to have a faster data intake and greater storage.

The fact is, Nimrod may not be as advanced, but he can become as advanced as he needs to (based on the information that he has... logic based programming, etc.) in seconds.
Originally posted by Scoobless
Vector can repel gravity, not negate it, he pushes himself from the ground, the pressure is still on him from his own mass though, even metal alloys have limits (intricate circuits have much lower limits)
Vector has repelled elements of reality before, as well as intangible, nonphysical concepts. He's also repelled elements of the electromagnetic spectrum, another one of the fundamental forces, just like gravity.

So to say he can't repel gravity's force on his body is not necessarily true.

And Nimrod can always adapt his body to overcome any physical limits. He's already displayed that his tech can overcome our measly understanding of physics... Rachel Grey dumped a building on him, and he was out without a scratch. Most metal alloys have limits far, far below his.

Originally posted by Scoobless
You're telling me pym particles will have a regular affect on a device that, as you stated, does not conform to the laws of physics? The actual device conforms regularly to the laws of physics. It just projects different pocket dimensions, that doesn't mean that it obeys the laws of those dimensions, not our own.

A school projector doesn't change color based on what you're projecting on to the screen.

A phantom zone projector isn't in the phantom zone.

And it's entirely plausible that we could just set the settings to cover the entire battlefield without growing.

Or we could just use the version that Nimrod's busy creating.

Originally posted by Scoobless Also, isn't Nth metal a bit screwy when it comes to reacting normally to regular physics? No. Nth metal just controls regular physics to the users will, based on the amount of it.

Originally posted by Scoobless Lastly ... where the hell are you getting Pym particles from in the first place? you're prepping at Marvel Boy's base! he has never had access to them and Pym hasn't carried any around on himself since his powers became part of his body. Ever since his powers became part of his body, he's been able to do all these things at will... shrink and grow other objects with a touch. It's why he was still capable of using his mini-lab as Yellowjacket (who is the same as what we've drafted). It's why he could shrink War Machine's armor with a touch. Etc.

Originally posted by Scoobless Marvel Boy doesn't have a clue how it works and he's from a civilization that wouldn't use Starktech to clean their toilets ... as Nimrod cannot possibly contain all the info he's trying to, he'll probably overload and shut down ... I suggest you find his ctrl/alt/del buttons and reboot him after that attempt (if that doesn't work, try unplugging him) The Plex knows exactly how it works, and can give us all info we need. And we can adapt to increase the DL speed and storage capacity in seconds. And Nimrod is also incredibly far advanced beyond Starktech.


Originally posted by Scoobless Again, Nimrod isn't even as advanced as a bog-standard Kree Sentry unit ... no way is he managing 1% of the stuff BW/Smurph are crediting him for.

lol.

This is the typical "attack for lack of a better option" route.

Even if we couldn't grow the main device, even if we couldn't just alter its settings, even if we couldn't copy the device, we can still just hit you with the one that Noh-Varr used in those scans.

Nimrod comes from leagues into the future, and has been credited with being able to create anything from his body based on what he needs. We're adding a creative mind to that shifting (Hank and Vector's minds), and giving him a computer advanced enough to give him the specs in seconds (the Plex). Scoob and Leo are so afraid of this plan that they're forced to talk down Nimrod on any occaision... but it's Nimrod. He's already shown to have a massive database with info on all super powered people that he can retrieve info from when he pleases, and has shown tech that can instantly update itself as soon as a timeline is altered. Tech that can overcome Juggernaut's defenses with ease, and alter to any given situation based on need.

Leo already showed scans that proved that he could change a robot husk body, into a clone of his, with missing HARDWARE in 24 minutes. And we just need to DL some info, from a super computer whose advanced-ness Scoob keeps crediting, and shift our already existing hardware to match the specs.

Or just supersize the damn thing.

We need a 4th of the time (24 minutes) to do something that's immeasurably less complex... (we're not creating tech from nothing, after all).

Originally posted by Scoobless Major leap of faith there ... I am going to have to insist on proof to back up his ability to adapt his logic based programming to a situation where logic is rendered completely useless. He doesn't rely on logic based programming when he's amalgamated with Hank Pym.

And, as I've already mentioned, Nimrod has access to tech that can instantly update itself when there are changes in the space time continuum.. and we're expected he can't deal with a situation where physics gets a little kooky? He likely already has scanners built in for this. Or he can make them in seconds.

Originally posted by Scoobless Now you're saying our abilities wouldn't work in the PB, but Vector's wouldn't be affected? I don't think we even need to dissect this one any further.

The way the PB works, Vector's powers would probably make his own head explode ... it's just lucky for you that there's no way that it's going to work.

Here's to hoping, yet again, that Vector's power would be miraculously unaffected by the one thing you are claiming screws up everyone else's powers.

It's just not gonna work. As soon as Vector's amalgamated with Nimrod, his powers stem from Nimrod's body, and can be altered as we see fit.

Insert a quarter, try again.

Originally posted by Scoobless
Summary: Their whole plan rests on Nimrod's ability to handle the entire information database of an alien empire that is, literally, over one million years old (seriously - http://www.marvel.com/universe/Kree)

crylaugh

Not even close.

Our plan incorporates Nimrod's proven ability to replicate one piece of technology, from an alternate dimensional race, that's completely different from the one you've linked to.

Furthermore, we can just supersize the thing, which would take seconds, and be done with it all.

Or just hit the "bigger radius" button, and laugh at Scoob's grasping at straws.

And Scoob thinks we'll need more than 8 minutes...

Deus Ex Machina: Post 3 (Smurph)

Originally posted by Scoobless
In fact a, possibly, couple hundred foot tall robot is going to stand out from a crowd (even in New York) so it's fair to assume that we'll see them long before they see us. You're trying to use a half dozen different powers in a location with altered physics in order to fight a robot that can develop sensors to track your energies faster than you can comprehend we're there...

heh.

Originally posted by Scoobless

Mandarin's rings are normally limited by the fact that he is only a regular human beneath them ... Hex, on the other hand,is far more than human.

....

Now we could easily argue that Spiral alone could magically amplify the rings to this level (and if needed we can show magic amplifying them on other occasions) lol.

Ironman has been shown to have power reservoirs that can laugh off Human Torch's nova blast, that can fire off heat that exceeds that of the sun, and that can completely drain Doc Doom, a low herald, in a page or so.

And you're comparing that to Spiral's feats of doing... what?

heh.

Ironically, even if you pulled off something greater than what was shown in that scan, it wouldn't matter. After the initial blast, we'd simply adapt to the rest of the heat, and regrow any minor damage... if you even broke through our hull, we can heal. Nimrod alone has shown to be capable of regrowing his entire arm in a panel.

Also, your amalgam, according to your write-up, has the rings infused in its spine... so creating such a huge blast would just rip through your own body.

Since your other characters have already been killed thanks to matter manip, Battech, the pocket battlefield, and our attacks, that should be the end of the game.

Finally, and this is most important...

The characters are in the pocket battlefield. Physics are completely altered. Their attacks will do something entirely unexpected, and we'll be laughing at them because we've already adapted to the new physics.

Originally posted by Scoobless
But Century has this nifty alien staff that's just full of power as well:

Mandarin tried to use this before to achieve virtual godhood ... he couldn't manage it because his knowledge of the staff was extremely limited. Mandarin was also using the Orb of Darkness, his own rings (which are unusable, as they're in your spine), and prep to reach this height of power.

All you've got are a couple seconds, and one out of three necessary items for this power up to work.

Finally, and this is most important...

The characters are in the pocket battlefield. Physics are completely altered. Their attacks will do something entirely unexpected, and we'll be laughing at them because we've already adapted to the new physics.

Originally posted by Scoobless As we don't want to leave Alfred on the sidelines, this is his time to shine. Hex teleports him in front and in the eyeline of the large Nimrod character

http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=teleport4ol2op8.jpg

His new bomb suit is activated at the same time we teleport directly behind the robot and let loose With our time & space shredding assault ... with this diversionary tactic annoying/distracting him there's, frankly, no way for Arsenal to withstand this attack.


We'll heal almost instantly, immediately adapt to the new attack, and kill you all.

Plus, we're unleashing omnidirectional blasts with Vector... so any teleporters you unleash can be immediately repelled and flayed.

We can also concentrate these blasts to become something that flayed Hulk alive, back when Vector was human sized, and didn't have Nimrod's body to power himself up with.

Finally, and this is most important...

The characters are in the pocket battlefield. Physics are completely altered. Their attacks will do something entirely unexpected, and we'll be laughing at them because we've already adapted to the new physics.

________________

So... they teleport in, and are immediately thrown off by the pocket battlefield. So much so, that they don't notice how we're broadcasting sonic frequencies through the air capable of shutting off the human brain (again, this worked on Juggernaut), and a further attack to inhibit synapses, to leave them completely paralyzed (again, this worked on Juggernaut).

This is all while getting turned into mush by Vector's attacks.

Then we beat them to a pulp. Any invulnerabilities and defenses they had can be overcome by Nimrod's tech.

This is all assuming, of course, that they can do half of what they've claimed... and I've already proven that they can accomplish none of it.

Looks like Smurph covered everything I would covered. However, there are a few points Id like to adress

Originally posted by leonidas
here we see nimrod simply trying to upload only a PART of his OWN programming into a different unit (built by forge, btw--the SAME forge who built NIMROD himself . . .)

seriously, boys . . . scoob severely understated your overstatement of nimrod's programming capabilities . . .

As Smurph has already told you, he literally had to re-create hardware since the spare body was not completely up to par. It was a damaged/unfinished spare. Also, WHILE doing this, he was controlling ALL of Forge's robots/guards. He was severly/critically damaged AND multi-tasking. You guys are stretching/over reaching



He's used it on aspects of reality, molecules, electromagnetic spectrum, and other things. Either way, it happened on panel. Just because you dont like it, does not mean it does not exist. No further proof is needed, its in the scans.



And yet you want to use magic to teleport (with the staff or Spirals magic). Magic would be nulled based on Vectors field AND the Pocket Battlefield we are inhibiting. ALSO to hamper you would be the fact that Nimrod can detect when teleporters teleport:

http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page16sq3.jpg



Its a good thing we have Nimrod, so that disbelievers like you can know that he is being backed my Nimrod. First things first, Nimrod can adapt as he goes along:

http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newxmen31006ww1.jpg

As shown above he can have forcefields that push omni-directionaly (and since Vector is now a part of Nimrod, Vectors power as well can go omni-directionally). His forcefields can also not allow Adamantium to cut him (see teleporting scan above)

However I would like to draw your attention to that last quote of Leo's. He wants to do a great big attack using Mandarin's rings right? Heres what happens when physics/probabilities shift and he's trying a normal blast:

http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=forceworksv100718roughezs8.jpg

It took Mandarin quite some time to recover. Imagine him trying that in the Pocket Battlefield without adjusting to the physics. He would blow himself up without us even having to do anything.


Summary Statements

We are fighting inside of a pocket battlefield to which only we have adapted to. We are giants inside said battlefield, making us exponentially more powerful.

We are omnidirectionally using Vectors powers reinforced by Nimrod's own forcefields, sonic abilitities, and his Synapse Dislocuter. You will not know what is happening, be disoriented, and suddenly find your body unable to follow your brains commands. On top of that you will be flayed down to bones. Literally.

To top it all off, Scoob and Leo want to make a mega bomb in a place where Physics do not act as they should. They are as likely to spew toilet paper from the rings as they are of blowing themselves up internally.

Vote for Team Deus Ex Machina aka Physics R Us.

Scoob & Leo: Old's Cool

The Mandarin + Spiral + Brit + Century = Hex

Magik & Alfred are solo.

Battle Post #3

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Scoob and Leo want to:

Use a character that:
Can't astrally project, to astrally project.
Go intangible... to go intangible.
Can't do anything close to complex organic matter manip... to do exactly that.
Has never been shown to use the soulsword, to use the soulsword.

You're confused, we have 616 Magik, this was all cleared up in the draft thread.

Lots of characters who have never held the soul sword before use it perfectly well.

Intangible scan was already shown, your interpretation is the only thing to suggest that dimensionally shifting mass isn't the same thing that Martian Manhunter does when he "phases".

Matter manip, already showed mutating Storm into a Mojo like character instantly, there's also this:

http://img55.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uncanny46104mj0.jpg
http://img55.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uncanny46105bo8.jpg

I also posted scans of Mandarin turning men into stone. Here those stone men are still mobile:
http://img229.imageshack.us/my.php?image=stoneab9.jpg

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
You assume, despite the fact that they come from an alternate dimension, are a completely separate branch of Kree, and have no on panel display of vast history, that this would overload us.

And you assume they are so different from the regular Kree ... Noh Varr recognised Mar-Vell instantly when they met (Skrull Mar-Vell, but he still knew him)

It's also stated that their Plex system is directly derived from the Supreme Intelligence - just another coincidence?

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
The fact is, Nimrod may not be as advanced, but he can become as advanced as he needs to.
And Nimrod can always adapt his body to overcome any physical limits.

Sounds like a lot of PIS to me, if he could truly, TRULY, advance without limit, he'd be a God. All tech has limits, Nimrod has been beaten enough times to not escape that little fact.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Ever since his powers became part of his body, he's been able to do all these things at will... shrink and grow other objects with a touch.

Pym lost his ability to alter the state of other objects years/decades ago ... the only things he can alter these days are objects he has specifically pre-treated with Pym particles ... which you have no access to.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
And Nimrod is also incredibly far advanced beyond Starktech.

Like ... low meta level? that IS the lowest power level that could be described as "incredibly" beyond Starktech.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Even if we couldn't grow the main device, even if we couldn't just alter its settings, even if we couldn't copy the device, we can still just hit you with the one that Noh-Varr used in those scans.

No, no you can't ... because that would be bringing >> Iron Man level tech into the battle ... and as I've never seen Stark create a device that shatters adamantium with a touch I'm fairly sure this thing is over the limits.

Face it, the PB plan is a non-starter.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
it's Nimrod. He's already shown tech that can instantly update itself as soon as a timeline is altered. Tech that can overcome Juggernaut's defenses with ease, and alter to any given situation based on need.

Hmm ... if any of that were true it would definitely mean that you just drafted an illegal character.

If it's not true then how can we believe anything you post?



Originally posted by Faux Smurph
He likely already has scanners built in for this. Or he can make them in seconds.

Scans?

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
And Scoob thinks we'll need more than 8 minutes...

Considerably more ... if it were possible at all (which it isn't)

_________________________


To save space I'm just going to ignore the points from this other post of Smurph's that involve using the Pocket Battlefield (PB) as we've focused on that enough already.

__________________________


Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Ironman has been shown to have power reservoirs that can laugh off Human Torch's nova blast, that can fire off heat that exceeds that of the sun, and that can completely drain Doc Doom, a low herald, in a page or so.

And you're comparing that to Spiral's feats of doing... what?


It's not about electrical energy, it's just "power" (which in comic terms comes in lots of different forms) Spiral clearly has "power" the soulsword will amplify this, this will then be added to the extra "power" we'll be drawing from Century & Parallax (his staff)

Or did you think the dragons who pointed all of this out (in the scans provided) were going to go put on armour before using the rings?

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Ironically, even if you pulled off something greater than what was shown in that scan, it wouldn't matter. After the initial blast, we'd simply adapt to the rest of the heat

After reality (which you are a part of) gets ripped apart ... you'll just heal?

Is that why Nimrod has never been defeated before? ... oh, never mind, I just remembered that he has been defeated ... many, many times.



Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Also, your amalgam, according to your write-up, has the rings infused in its spine... so creating such a huge blast would just rip through your own body.

The power from the rings still comes out of Mandarin's hands when the rings have been bonded to his spine:

http://img502.imageshack.us/my.php?image=43168490rc8.jpg

http://img123.imageshack.us/img123/7406/29974678iz6.th.jpg

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Mandarin was also using the Orb of Darkness, his own rings (which are unusable, as they're in your spine), and prep to reach this height of power.

The Orb was used to create the null tech field and help him create zombie golem things, not much else. Doesn't matter though, we're not doing any of the stuff from that storyline here, we're just harnessing power from other devices/power to amp our overall output.

Nothing about the placement of the rings limits their power ... on the contrary it probably increases their effectiveness due to them being, literally, a part of him.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Plus, we're unleashing omnidirectional blasts with Vector... so any teleporters you unleash can be immediately repelled and flayed.

Alfred is only a distraction, flay away.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
We can also concentrate these blasts to become something that flayed Hulk alive, back when Vector was human sized, and didn't have Nimrod's body to power himself up with.

Good thing for him that Hulk is somewhat limited in attack options or he'd have been dead on that occasion, we don't need to walk through power blasts like a moron to affect our enemies.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
This is all assuming, of course, that they can do half of what they've claimed

Ummmmmmmmm.......

_________________________


To save space I'm just going to ignore the points from Blair's post that involve using the Pocket Battlefield (PB) as we've focused on that enough already.

__________________________


Originally posted by Blair Wind
And yet you want to use magic to teleport (with the staff or Spirals magic). Magic would be nulled based on Vectors field AND the Pocket Battlefield we are inhibiting. ALSO to hamper you would be the fact that Nimrod can detect when teleporters teleport:

http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page16sq3.jpg

He has to detect teleportation signatures, is there any proof that he can detect magical energies? also, Kurt's teleporting has been detected by relatively average speed guys like Wolverine and Beast before, his "Bamfs" aren't instant and there's an implosion of air before he appears, neither Spiral nor Century suffer from this drawback.

Originally posted by Blair Wind
He wants to do a great big attack using Mandarin's rings right? Heres what happens when physics/probabilities shift and he's trying a normal blast:

http://img228.imageshack.us/my.php?image=forceworksv100718roughezs8.jpg

It took Mandarin quite some time to recover. Imagine him trying that in the Pocket Battlefield without adjusting to the physics.

The only people in any danger there were the ones around Mandarin ... even if the PB trick was possible (which it so definitely is not) the only ones in trouble from that would still be your own team.


I guess the PB stuff was the largest part of their strategy. It's almost a pity that it has zero chance of success.

okay, so once again my partner has gone ahead and stolen my thunder!

anyway, that leaves me with clean up duties again. so, where to begin. how about with this:



well . . .

http://img225.imageshack.us/my.php?image=astralsp4.jpg
http://img229.imageshack.us/my.php?image=astral1ne1.jpg



scoob touched on the intangibility issue. there is no reason whatsoever that we couldn't remain intangible indefinitely. spiral dances between dimensions at will, and you dislike it--and its legality--all you'd like, but . . .

scoob ALSO (damn you!) showed the extent of spiral's ability to use matter manipulation, and disparaging her talents and saying she needs the body shoppe really isn't relevent. why? well, because THIS spiral is amped with the soulsword AND the rings, one of which is amped BY her AND can control matter. and we can't overlook the rings. mandarin has used the rings to remake a body for himself. this from marvel.com:



so BOTH have exhibited the ability to remake and restructure organic matter on very significant levels. COMBINE their talents and amp them? what we're trying to do (give magik 6 arms) really isn't any sort of a reach at all.

so, what's next? how bout this:





http://img393.imageshack.us/my.php?image=doomku0.jpg
http://img393.imageshack.us/my.php?image=darkothto5.jpg

on to this:



so . . . proof? scans? i keep hearing this, but . . . where is the evidence? i SHOWED him being ko'd by EM energy, so where is he repelling them?

next:







umm . . . No?

http://img529.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nimrod0ag3.jpg

instant heal, eh? try 187 SECONDS! know how much damage we could so to you in 187 seconds?? and that damage was inflicted by a low level mutant like leland!

of course, we can always look at what happened the only time nimrod came across a AMALGAMATED CHARACTER!

http://img225.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nimrod1te9.jpg

as i said, he doesn't deal well with simultaneous attacks and powersets, nor is his ability to identify and adapt to all combat conditions anywhere NEAR as strong as they claim it is.

he does NOT heal instantly (he did put himself back together after rogue smashed him, but he was not able to continue the battle), nor does he 'instantly' adapt to combat situations as proven by the above scans.

the PB--i think that has been suitably debunked. they wouldn't have time to DL the thing, or make one. it's illegal to bring the ACTUAL one into battle cuz it's too advanced, so . . . bye-bye PB. not that it would have mattered anyway. spiral would be completely at home in any environment you can think up and magic does NOT rely on physics! so if anyone DOES think you can use the PB somehow--who cares!

about vector 'flaying us'--we'd be utterly fine. scoob, may be time to drop a little brit on them . . .

and century does NOT teleport via magic, which someone mentioned above.

so . . . no PB, we teleport behind you and crush you with an attack that shreds your force field, your armor and spacetime. i know it's not LELAND attacking, but . . . we do what we can.

go old's cool. nwoot

Team Deus Ex Machina: Kicking Ass, Taking Names

So, rather than waste a bunch of time by taking apart Scoob and Leo's posts by paragraph, I'll summarize their straw-grasping in this post. I'm gonna try to get all of our opponents baseless attacks on our strategy out of the way here (as well as point out the numerous holes in theirs), so that Blair, in the next post, can point out what everybody's been sorely downplaying- our unbelievable offense.

So, without further ado...

Leo & Scoob's Misconceptions.

#1- The Pocket Battlefield is illegal

Wrong.

Delph says:
No. It's not an actual offensive implement. It just alters the dynamics of the battlefield.

It's entirely legal... which means that though we'll have plenty of time to DL the specs on it, we can also just bring it on to the battlefield, supersized. Or we can set it to cover the whole battlefield from it's own size.

But we really just need to copy the specs with Nimrod, and have him shift his form to make one...

Anyways, so, all their attacks are now altered by the physics. Leo says that Spiral can cope, but we have nothing to base this off of other than "she casts magic!!1!"

Moving on...

#2- The Soulsword helps them

I pointed out that they can't just easily hand off the soulsword, because it's mentioned that it's very rare that Kitty Pryde was able to use it- implying that most have trouble... meaning that their amalgam character has the odds stacked against them of using the thing (which Leo and Scoob have made clear is key to their plan since it supposedly amplifies what they need it to).

Their response? They show Doc Doom wielding the thing... the same guy who perfectly copied Doc Strange's spell after seeing it, the same guy who has utilized all manner of magical and cosmic technology in the past with no previous experience to make himself on power with the Beyonder...

And they say that Spiral can do it because Doctor Doom can?

HA!.

Furthermore, they rave about how much the soulsword amplifies characters, so they take it away from one of their magical characters (Magik)... and then expect her to operate at full capacity (specifically travelling to the Astral Plane) despite the fact that that's the most complex spell she's used on Earth, an environment that severely inhibits her powers.

#3- They can go intangible

They claim they can go intangible.

Lolz.

THIS was their infamous intangibility scan:

http://img230.imageshack.us/my.php?image=intangibilityvh4zf9.jpg

"All I had to do was transport myself to another dimension for the split second your shield would have hit me."

That's not intangibility... crylaugh

That's teleportation

Leo and Scoob want to continuously remain intangible based on that scan... they'd have to continuously remain in the other dimension. That's BFR.

Their response?

"Intangible scan was already shown, your interpretation is the only thing to suggest that dimensionally shifting mass isn't the same thing that Martian Manhunter does when he "phases".

As you can see, side by side, Scoob likes to paraphrase his answers to something that's completely different... how can we really trust what he says?

Let's take a look at why Leo had to stop using it in the last tournament that he drafted Spiral in:

Originally posted by darthgoober
Ok folks sorry for the confusion but what Blair said about leo's teleporting is true. For some reason, I've been under the impression that leo was just shunting his mass off to another dimension in a manner similar to Martian Manhunter, I didn't realize that he was actually teleporting away. My allowing leo to do that would be right along the same lines as my allowing Blair to go to the Spot Dimension to avoid attacks, and I've always said that that kind of thing isn't allowed. So my apologies to leo for OKing it and then flip flopping, but I guess I just never paid close enough attention to the scan to notice.

So... Leo's been forced to accept the fact that this is teleportation before, but trys to sneak it in as intangibility... again.

They're both fairly untrustworthy, when you look at it.

#4- They can make a second Spiral

To quote myself...

"As comics have taught us, inorganic and organic matter manipulation are two completely different things. Neither of those scans cover organic manip, none show additional mass being added (mass is only converted... where are all the extra arms gonna come from?). None of those scans show that Spiral's gonna be able to recall everything that she has on genetics fast enough for you to successfully alter someone's base physiology and actually add extra living matter (which is completely different from just adding a cybernetic set of legs... and much, much harder). You'd have to add each individual extra nerve and synapse, every separate vesicle of acetylecholine, as well as manipulating impulse pathways to/from the brain... and that's JUST the nervous system.

For all we know, the spell that Spiral used in that situation was specifically designed to create a Mojo-like set of legs for exactly the reason she referenced in the scan... which hardly supports matter manipulating a whole separate set of bodily functions, from thin air.

This would be further backed up by the fact that Rita (Spiral) has a body shoppe that she's used to cybernetically enhance herself, and people like Lady Deathstrike... by actually working on them. If she was as skilled as you would have us believe, she could just wave her fingers and make the changes, and she wouldn't have a cybernetic arm herself, instead have a real one.

Finally, you're working against the clock, since you seem to assume you'll do all this and still have a "few minutes" left for the next part of your prep.

So, you end up with a bloody, unrecognizable mess from what used to be Magik's body. El oh el.

Also, Magik's already dead because all the big guns were amalgamating while the Bat-security was pwning her."

No surprise, none of this was addressed... all that the showed was more scans of mass being reduced or turned to stone, not more organic mass being added... and adding organic mass is much harder.

Spiral has one cybernetic arm that she had to build... according to the Theory of Leo (and Scoob), she could have snapped her fingers to regrow the arm she had to cybernetically replace.

What's also of interesting note is that the only beings that Spiral has performed matter manip on, are the X-Babies... which were originally clones that Mojo manufactured... and then Spiral turned the X-Men into them. And then she matter manipulated one of them (Storm) into a being like Mojo.

They were all structures that Spiral was intimately familiar with... they had the DNA and cell structures for the X-Babies... and she's no doubt turned other females into Mojo-brides.

Now Leo and Scoob want to extrapolate this to mean that she can make any anatomical changes with a snap of her fingers...

heh.

#5- They have any offensive power, whatsoever

So, their futile attempt to get the pocket battlefield banned got me thinking...

I realized that Scoob and Leo are trying to bring a weapon on the battlefield as well:

Originally posted by Scoobless
Mandarin's rings are normally limited by the fact that he is only a regular human beneath them ... Hex, on the other hand,is far more than human.

This is what happens when more power is added:

2. http://img222.imageshack.us/my.php?image=43ringboostqx6.jpg
3. http://img222.imageshack.us/my.php?image=44ringboostzb5.jpg
4. http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=45ringboostte4.jpg
5. http://img293.imageshack.us/my.php?image=46ringboosttu1.jpg

Now we could easily argue that Spiral alone could magically amplify the rings to this level (and if needed we can show magic amplifying them on other occasions)

But Century has this nifty alien staff that's just full of power as well:

http://img242.imageshack.us/my.php?image=09parallax1ll6.jpg

Mandarin tried to use this before to achieve virtual godhood ... he couldn't manage it because his knowledge of the staff was extremely limited. With Century's mind in the mix though, that's a non-issue ... all that extra power is just sitting in Hex's many hands.


Originally posted by leonidas
if his little old field can't repel THAT attack, i REALLY don't like his odds against a blast that can literally unhinge time and space . . .


Originally posted by leonidas
so . . . no PB, we teleport behind you and crush you with an attack that shreds your force field, your armor and spacetime. i know it's not LELAND attacking, but . . . we do what we can.


Originally posted by Scoobless

After reality (which you are a part of) gets ripped apart ... you'll just heal?


So, anyways, Scoob and Leo consistently maintain that they will be unleashing an attack that can rip apart time and space.

I tried saying that they wouldn't have enough power, but....

Originally posted by Scoobless
It's not about electrical energy, it's just "power" (which in comic terms comes in lots of different forms) Spiral clearly has "power" the soulsword will amplify this, this will then be added to the extra "power" we'll be drawing from Century & Parallax (his staff)



So... we can all agree that this will be an attack actually superior to the one shown in the scans, and will rip apart time and space?

Good.

Smurph says:
Is it legal to bring devices on to the field that have been shown to be able to tear apart time and space, if provided with an ample power source... and you've given them to a character with that level of power source?

Delph says:
If it's a weapon, no

...

...

...

HA!

So, now that the only plan of attack they've invested any planning in is moot... they're pretty much screwed.

At normal sized levels, Nimrod's durability is top tier, and his healing is more powerful than Wolverine's.

Now he's 600 feet tall, and constantly emitting rays powerful enough to flay Hulk's skin (only much more powerful, omni directional, and coming from a power source many thousands times bigger).

They're also constantly debilitated and so forth, but Blair will cover that next.

That being said...

Game, set, match.

Rule Clarification on the weapon ruling:

The tech cap is that you can not create and bring any weapon with a payload greater than an independently powered Ironman into combat. Therefore, the answer I gave to Smurph is in fact correct. However, the question was asked with a bit of ambiguity (and late at night, so I didn't provide a full answer due to fatigue). In relation to the attack posed in this thread by Leo/Scoob, which is a result of meshing various standard implements and characters powers to achieve said results, the attack is in fact legal. There is no cap on meshing. If the weapon itself had been created with said power during prep it would in fact be illegal. Sorry for any confusion.

Scoob & Leo: Old's Cool

The Mandarin + Spiral + Brit + Century = Hex

Magik & Alfred are solo.

Battle Post #5


Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Delph says:
No. It's not an actual offensive implement. It just alters the dynamics of the battlefield.

It's entirely legal... which means that though we'll have plenty of time to DL the specs on it, we can also just bring it on to the battlefield, supersized. Or we can set it to cover the whole battlefield from it's own size.

But we really just need to copy the specs with Nimrod, and have him shift his form to make one...

Heh, guess I overlooked this before:

http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/944/pb1fx3.th.jpg http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/2438/pb2ke6.th.jpg

Turns out the Kree (from whatever dimension) have NEVER invented or built a Pocket Battlefield before.

"Stolen from the Pink Pantheon"

Also, the friggin' artificially intelligent super-computer they keep falling back on (Plex) had to READ. THE. MANUAL. to find out how it works ... and he didn't even understand it all himself!

How exactly does that translate to creating one inside of 8 minutes?

SRSLY?

On top of that you can clearly see that the PB in the scan (the only one ever shown on panel anywhere) is no more than 20-30 feet across ... you can even see the interior corners in the first scan - bottom right of the pic.

Second scan just show that it never even grew enough to encapsulate the buildings in the surrounding area .... claiming that it can grow to any size they'd like is nothing more than wishful thinking.

(and they still don't have access to Pym Particles)

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
they say that Spiral can do it (use the soul sword) because Doctor Doom can?

How about because Knightcrawler can?

http://img78.imageshack.us/img78/9052/71664238pt6.th.jpg

(fairly sure he's not some uber magician/warlock)

Spiral is already a well versed sorceress & warrior, it wont be a problem for her to use a magical sword.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Furthermore, they rave about how much the soulsword amplifies characters, so they take it away from one of their magical characters (Magik)... and then expect her to operate at full capacity
Originally posted by Faux Smurph
#4- They can make a second Spiral

...lots of stuff about transmuting Magik...

Actually, if you recheck our opening posts, your own giant robot plan means we didn't even need to use Magik to locate you ... and we really haven't used her for anything else at all ... I'm not sure why you are even bothering to question the one aspect of the battle that has almost zero influence on the outcome.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
They claim they can go intangible.

That's not intangibility... That's teleportation

Meh, dimensionally shifted mass can be either one or the other ... again, you're wasting your time picking on unimportant factors ... as soon as you went giant we didn't need to act evasive ... we found you first and attacked with so much pure force that even Nimrod couldn't heal from it.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
They're both fairly untrustworthy, when you look at it.

I have no idea why you feel the need to make this personal. I'm not going to respond in kind because tourneys are supposed to be fun, not venues for unnecessary flaming.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
I realized that Scoob and Leo are trying to bring a weapon on the battlefield as well:



So that's that covered.


Originally posted by Faux Smurph
So... we can all agree that this will be an attack actually superior to the one shown in the scans

Um ... that's really generous of you ... thanks.


________________________



Ok, on to other things.

They made some attempt early on to suggest that Nimrod's sonic capabilities would stop Hex.

http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page17ah6.jpg

As shown, the range and spread of this attack are both limited, Kitty, not in the path of it and merely 10 feet or so away, notes it as little more than a headache (which doesn't stop her from doing whatever she's trying to do)

With us locating you first (undoubtedly) there's not much chance for this avenue of attack to succeed.

Especially as we can counter it like so:

http://img154.imageshack.us/my.php?image=13sonicsdd0.jpg
http://img231.imageshack.us/my.php?image=14sonicsdn8.jpg

and those scans are from way before Mandarin gained his much greater level of knowledge/control over the rings.

________________


Ok - unfocused omni-directional attacks. A lot of you may not be familiar with Brit, brief rundown:

Brit is invulnerable - that's all. no super powers whatsoever other than being really, really, tough. If he fought Spider-Man he would easily be webbed up, if he fought anyone with any degree of super strength he could be restrained without too much effort (unless they are as retarded as the Rhino)

That said, his invulnerability is top notch ... probably higher than anyone else eligible for this tourney.

Here's a sample:

1. http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=01zz3.jpg
2. http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=02gu3.jpg
3. http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=03tb9.jpg

4. http://img88.imageshack.us/my.php?image=13ur1.jpg
5. http://img75.imageshack.us/my.php?image=14gf0.jpg

So the idea of a random, unfocused attack taking Hex out of this fight is ludicrous.

umm, proof that it can be any size you wish?

cuz if you can't supersize it, you can't fit in it. and how you expect pym to supersize anything THAT complex is entirely beyond me. there is still the issue of the pym particles and how you've accessed them at all!

no specs since the ship itself doesn't know how it was made. damn, there are just too many things wrong with that PB idea to keep straight.



in light of what acoob just showed . . .




no . . . other than the fact that she wanders through dimensions and time, has visited the END OF THE UNIVERSE AND USED HER MAGIC, AND the fact that magic does NOT rely on physics to work. so, nothing to base it off of other than that . . .

Moving on...





darkoth is not doom. s'ym is not doom. nightcrawler is not doom. belasco is not doom. amanda sefton is not doom . . . all have used the sword without problem or incident. the sword is truly a non-issue in every sense of the word (though if i were you i'd be trying to put attention on anything other than my own failing plan as well . . . )



actually, with spiral's spells in her mind, she is MORE powerful than she has ever been on earth. spiral is 10x the magic-user she is on earth.



and . . . . .

it's legal. don't believe it judges? ask delph. not sure why they harp on it--oh, wait, yes i do . . . (see above comment about their failing plans . . .)

and, if it IS just a cool version of teleportation as they suggest, why b!tch about it? after all, teleportation IS legal. so . . . thanks for further proving the legality of the action. you guys are the best! heh


about the matter manip--spiral could repair herself in her body shoppe if she wanted. she hasn't. why? not sure. could be because she didn't make herself as she is--MOJO DID. perhaps she can't undo his work, or change it. maybe she LIKES it. after all it is the arms that let her cast spells. whatever. we have an amped spiral, an amped matter ring and 2 of the greatest geneticists in marvel (spiral and mandarin) in our amalgamation. if you think adding some arms is a problem . . . oh, and who said they need to be organic? we could create cybernetic arms as easily. so, again, a non-issue, disguised as an issue to draw attention away from what really has been a lack-lustre plan and end product by our esteemed opponents.

so, yeah. we hit them with a blast that rips them and spacetime to atoms and it's over.

and about this:



ummm . . . oops? heh

Unofficial post... obviously.

Originally posted by Scoobless

I have no idea why you feel the need to make this personal. I'm not going to respond in kind because tourneys are supposed to be fun, not venues for unnecessary flaming.


What I said was a direct reaction to:

Originally posted by Scoobless

If it's not true then how can we believe anything you post?





Granted, I didn't include a condescending smilie with it, but we can't all be perfect. (That's a joke, btw)

I'm not making things personal... this is usual tourney dickishness. If you're still upset, PM me, but... come one. We're in a tourney, on KMC... this ribbing is hardly grounds for accusations of flaming.

Anyways... Blair's post will hopefully be up soon.

Or... not.

I'll wrap everything else up in the meantime.

-------------------------------------------

Originally posted by leonidas
darkoth is not doom. s'ym is not doom. nightcrawler is not doom. belasco is not doom. amanda sefton is not doom . . . all have used the sword without problem or incident.
Darkoth and S'ym fought for control of the soul sword... under a contest made by Belasco. Belasco taught Magik most of what she knows. It's all about the context... of course they'd be able to control the soul sword in a competition made by Belasco...

Nightcrawler had an intimate connection with the soul sword, if I'm not mistaken.

Amanda Sefton was the second Magik.

All characters have prerequisites filled far beyond anything that Spiral has.

---------------------------------


Mandarin's Rings- Legal?

I talked with Delph about it.

The consensus was that he was gonna rule for them, since they're standard equipment, not created tech... but that I could push for a ban for Mandarin, if I wished... but that would decidedly come across as if this affected the outcome of the match. It's really not a big deal, so I won't bother.

Their only offense vs. our numerous offenses and defenses

So- their only hope of affecting us, is through Mandarin's rings. Other than that, they've provided us with supposition and zero scans.

Let's take a look at this plan for Hex:

They never stated this (or the plan with Century's staff) in their opening post, and seeing as 3/4 of their amalgam has never experienced this, and it's nothing that Mandarin has ever thought to replicate, the chance of them even thinking to pull off this attack is nill, even without interference from us.

Secondly- we did actually bother to state an opening plan in our write-up... so we'll be performing that from the get go.

We can develop sensors right from the start... and knowing that they'll immediately be attempting to unleash multiple magical energies (which will have an unknown, unhelpful affect thanks to the Pocket Battlefield), will make them extremely easy to track.

So, we immediately hit them with this...

http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page17ah6.jpg

Keep in mind that Nimrod only uses it as a beam there, but that we can easily turn it into a widespread attack as well.

Keep also in mind that Arsenal will be 100's of feet tall, so a beam attack from him would actually sweep city blocks at a time.

Keep also in mind that Nimrod shows in that scan that he only has to hit Juggernaut once to keep him down... which means we can just perform widespread sweeps to KO everybody.

Finally keep in mind that if we can KO Juggernaut, we can KO Brit...

Take another look at the same scan-

http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page17ah6.jpg
"He seems to be able to come up with whatever he needs, on demand."

Heh...

So we hit them with that first. We can either simultaneously use the Synapse Dislocuter, or we can use it immediately afterwards.

http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page19sy3.jpg

This was all posted in the writeup, but note that the Synapse Dislocuter can be cast at a wide range... with our size, we could take out the battlefield at the start of their match.

Their response is to believe that astral projection and intangibility will save them...

But their intangibility is actually teleportation, and so they'd have to continuously teleport to keep it up... which means they spend split seconds in our world... which means they get hit with the dislocuter.

And they haven't shown to be able to astrally project without the soul sword.

So... moving on...

Third reason why their "destroy timespace!" attack won't work:

The pocket battlefield.

Let's take a second to assume we can't simply enlarge it (despite the fact that Pym was never shown to have lost access to Pym particles, as far as I'm aware), that we couldn't just hit the "wider range" button, that we couldn't adapt it into our system, despite the fact that it's been shown we have access to a manual and the technology... let's assume all that is correct for a second.

We're still set to deploy the thing ASAP... which means it still surrounds us (we've adapted to it).

They're teleporting next to us!

Of course, they would never think to pull off this attack before we've located them and destroyed them... but if they did?

We've still got them trapped in the pocket battlefield.

Then their timespace ripping attack makes two thousand marshmallows... or something. This field made adamantium as brittle as... brittle. Their attack relys so much on comicbook physics that it really has no hope of succeeding in a locale with altered physics.

Their response is to say that Spiral is capable of dealing with altered physics... but they've supported this with nothing, and haven't even shown her casting spells that aren't turning things into things she's intimately familiar with.

The fact that she requires a Body Shoppe and a bunch of tech tools to rearrange cybernetics only lends this point more.

How are we supposed to believe that a character that relies so heavily on precise spells that she can't alter it at will, is going to deal with a sudden change in reality's laws?

And one last reason that their attack won't work...

From the very start, they'll be hit with Vector's Hulk-flaying powers. Even if Brit doesn't die, he'll still be buffetted backwards, and we'll KO him with the tech that took out Juggernaut.

http://img515.imageshack.us/img515/5421/flayedhulkst9.th.jpg

We kill them all in seconds.

Game, set, match.

no worries on the trash talk. scoob gets a bit sensitive. he's old you know.

now then--this PB thingy really does seem to be a big deal for them. they can't absorb schematics, they can't make one themselves and smurph himself has placed doubt in their ability to enlarge it. and yet . . . they are still ready to deploy it? the thing would be like a grain of sand in the palm of 600' robot! how the hell are they gonna surround themselves in something so small?? really, it makes no sense whatsoever.

'intangibility'--again, i don't see the problem. when she removed herself and allowed the shield to pass through her, she only needed to do so for a split-second. spiral's powers allow her to move through dimensions, it's what she does. there is exactly ZERO reason to suugest she couldn't simply REMAIN outside our dimension. unlike goob's event that smurph likes to keep bringing up, THERE IS NO RULE AGAINST SELF-BFR! we could remain that way indefinitely. and if you doubt it, consider that we are AMPED by the soul sword! that seems to be something they continuously overlook. it's nt JUST what spiral has done (which is PLENTY) but also what she could do with her powers augmented by the blade. we can also vary our teleportational powers so that nimrod could NOT adapt to any ONE signature.

i've already--ON PANEL--shown what happened when nimrod faced an amalgamated rogue. he was confused and BEAT DOWN. and that was just rogue, nightcrawler and colossus. he couldn't adapt fast enough to counter her powerset, he was NOT able to 'instantly' create counters. again, nimrod is a powerful character--he is NOT everything they claim he is. (which is good for them or he'd be illegal). our amalgam>>>>>then that group of x-men that rogue possessed to take him out.

i also already showed scans in my last post of magik astrally traveling without the sword . . .

their meshing really wasn't very effective. nimrod gained next to nothing except size, which really only made our job easier. if you look at the mandarin scan again, the range is quite extensive. even if we were to be repelled somehow (it wouldn't damage us) we could still attack them outside vector's powers' range. so, again, their amalgam really didn't gain any advantages via the mesh--specially since we showed the limits of nimrod's programming capabilities.

we otoh made ourselves MUCH stronger. our combination of weapons and powersets give us a vast amount of versatility, manouverability and sheer power. we can quite literally wipe them out of existence with one blow.

oh, and as far as vector's power, and the dislocutor, etc--that can easily be countered and more--it can be turned back AGAINST them. spiral can simply use her power-reversal spell and send whatever they throw at us, right back at them. i don't have the scan handy, but it's the same spell that tunred PHOENIX's powers and starfire's powers back on them, ko'ing BOTH. scoob should have the scan somewhere, (in case some of you don't remember the spell from the tourney where i used her before). so, factor that in, and they have . . . nothing.

old is indeed cool.

Unofficial post.

Originally posted by leonidas

i also already showed scans in my last post of magik astrally traveling without the sword . . .


My bad. Totally missed this in all the havok. Still wouldn't help you, due to the nature of it (I'm not gonna debate in an unofficial post) but let the record stand that scans have been shown.

Guess its time the baddest mofo in the tournament shows his offensive powers to their fullest. Thats right, I challenge anyone to compare to Arsenals power level, versatility, and offensive output. Cant think of anyone who can? Me either. Ill explain why here

Offensive Measures

Let us begin by systematically reminding you who we have in Arsenal.

- We have Hank Pym aka Yellow Jacket. He is the brains of the operation, gives Nimrod the creativity to use is powers to the fullest, and allows them to change size.

- We have the biggest and most versatile pure offense in the game with Vector.

- And finally we have Nimrod, the king of versatility, of adapting to all situations, the bane of all super powered individuals.

Now you have to remember, all of these characters are amalgamated. That means they shore up each others weaknesses, play on each others strengths, and make them the most feared amalgam, well, ever. I will explain more thoroughly below.

Yellowjacket allows us to grow to giant proportions. This, as you can imagine, will allow our attacks to have wider areas of which to affect (think entire blocks, streets, city areas). It is also its on defense, as they will have to attack more area to actually cause us ANY kind of harm.

Now comes in Vector, the king of offense in this scenario. We will be unleashing a full force blast of his continuously. Non-stop. Now to understand what that means giant sized just look at what he can do normal sized:

http://img211.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ultimatesp4.jpg
http://img515.imageshack.us/my.php?image=flayedhulkst9.jpg

Now what you have to understand is that because he is amalgamated with Nimrod and Yellowjacket, he can be much more effective. You see, he could do an omni-directional attack full force at giant sizes. Think about that. If this was our ONLY attack, we would still win. They would get ambushed by the force, and flayed to the bone. Hell, at that size and with that much pressure, their bones would repel themselves as well. You would end up with ashes!

Now we move on to our more varied selection of character specific weaponry with Nimrod

While the Vector Blast is happening, we also hit them with an omni-directional version of this:

http://img338.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page17ah6.jpg

Keep in mind that Nimrod only uses it as a beam there, but that we can easily turn it into a widespread attack as well, since Nimrod can adapt to all situations, and has shown omni directional attacks:

http://img153.imageshack.us/my.php?image=newxmen31006ww1.jpg

Keep also in mind that Arsenal will be 100's of feet tall, so a beam attack from him would actually sweep city blocks at a time, and an omni directional version? Well, it would be HUGE.

Keep also in mind that Nimrod shows in that scan that he only has to hit Juggernaut once to keep him down, which means we can just perform widespread sweeps or omni-directional blasts to KO everybody.

To add insult to injury, we take them out with the Synapse Dislocutert:
http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page19sy3.jpg

Note that the Synapse Dislocuter can be cast at a wide range, and with our size, we could take out the battlefield at the start of their match. Notice that if we can KO Juggernaut, we can KO Brit.

Just because we are ridiculously powerful already, we might as well add to the powerful full body omni directional blasts we will be having. I present to you a gun from Marvel Armory:

http://img229.imageshack.us/my.php?image=marvelboyv01003imbie18za0.jpg

Now, since we downloaded all the specs from Plex on all of Marvel's weapons, this is now on the list. Imagine at giant sizes bullets bigger than that one flying from all around Nimrods body (imagine guns forming around Nimrods body, and bullets coming out from them).

And the best thing is? We are doing this ALL SIMULTANEOUSLY, a combination of Vector's attack and Nimrod's attack. It will be kicking the crap out of ALL your characters.

Their "Defenses"
Now, I have to laugh at something . Their response is to believe that Mandarin's rings and Spirals Magic will save them.

First of all, do any of you really believe that the Mandarin will be able to:

A) Match the frequency we are using, and more importantly
B) Overpower our giant sized sonic attacks?

I mean, it would be like the buzzing of a bee compared to the roar of a jet plane, except the difference would be even GREATER! Also of note, we could just magnetize Mandarin's rings and have them come to us. It happened once in a Tales of Suspense storyline where Ironman took them from Mandarin. I'll see what I can do about getting scans for that. Mandarin is good, but not that good my friends.

Moving on to Spirals Magic, Leo is quoted as saying:
oh, and as far as vector's power, and the dislocutor, etc--that can easily be countered and more--it can be turned back AGAINST them. spiral can simply use her power-reversal spell and send whatever they throw at us, right back at them

Yet they ignore the very specific scans I showed in our opening post that state that Vectors field can deflect spells!

http://img129.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vectordeflect2xu5.jpg
http://img152.imageshack.us/my.php?image=vectordeflecteo5.jpg

Any spell they use will be deflected and/or messed up thanks to the Vector field AND the PB (which I have allowed Smurph to handle, so I wont touch on it).

So in an offensive summary, from the very start, they'll be hit with Vector's Hulk-flaying powers. Even if they dont die (I say this unconvinced because they should ALREADY be dead), they'd still be buffeted backwards, and we'd kill/KO them with the tech that Nimrod brings to the table

Nimrod's Regeneration/Durability/

I like it how Leo uses half scans to prove unrealistic dreams of his, specifically that Rogue beat down on Nimrod. In fact his quote is:

"i've already--ON PANEL--shown what happened when nimrod faced an amalgamated rogue. he was confused and BEAT DOWN. and that was just rogue, nightcrawler and colossus. he couldn't adapt fast enough to counter her powerset, he was NOT able to 'instantly' create counters. again, nimrod is a powerful character--he is NOT everything they claim he is. (which is good for them or he'd be illegal). "

The scan he showed was this one:
http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page20xu7.jpg

Yet neglected to show this one:
http://img513.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page21mf5.jpg

He just regenerated his entire body in ONE Panel. *Tisk tisk* Using half scans is not helpful Leo. Added with the fact that with Yellowjacket they can regrow mass, even the teleportation trick would not work, he could just regrow the arm!

And to top it all off, you cannot deny his durability:
http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page18xs2.jpg
http://img395.imageshack.us/my.php?image=uxm194page19sy3.jpg

He just took an entire building at FULL size on top of him without a scratch. You think you can do ANYTHING to us?

Also, Nimrod by himself might not be very creative (though he is very logical and VERY VERY useful), but thanks to Hank's genius mind, creativity is no problem.

Summary
In summary, we will be applying offensive measures to which the other team cannot stack up to. This offensive measure doubles as a defensive measure (they cant hurt what they cant touch), and even if they COULD, I just showed how Nimrod regenerated himself

Your King was taken down, your Queen raped, and your Bishops and Knights ran away. Checkmate my friends.

Loose Ends

Now that Blair and I have torn down our opposition's pitiful defenses and poorly coordinated offenses, I have time to touch on everything that wasn't hyped up or touched on yet.

First, replies...

Pocket battlefield

Scoob says: The ship doesn't have the specs! It has a digital manual covering how to use it!

OK then, make our jobs easier...

Nimrod DLs the manual.

Moving on...

Untouched on Nimrod Powers

Technopathy

Nimrod controlled FORGE'S entire lab and defense robots.

We could just take control of the rings...

http://img385.imageshack.us/img385/9860/newxmen030003bg9.th.jpghttp://img292.imageshack.us/img292/6998/newxmen030004uw2.th.jpghttp://img292.imageshack.us/img292/548/newxmen030008gq2.th.jpghttp://img390.imageshack.us/img390/9950/newxmen030009vf3.th.jpghttp://img46.imageshack.us/img46/4536/newxmen030011tq9.th.jpghttp://img46.imageshack.us/img46/778/newxmen030012zy9.th.jpg

Freezing

http://img167.imageshack.us/img167/5486/newxmen22027qt5.th.jpghttp://img68.imageshack.us/img68/7608/img008za0.th.jpg

We can freeze the entire city and leave it in the stone age.

Magnetism, energy shields, sensors... etc.

All in upcoming scans.

Magik's Astral Plane

She has to concentrate to do this, and leaves her mortal body behind...

So we KO her the moment she enters.

Another enemy defense down the drain.

The rest of our team

I just want a chance to hype the rest of our team.

Noh Varr can be punted five miles, and race all the way back from a laying position in three panels.

Hawkman has lifted a falling plane before, and hurt top tiers with weapon + strength.

Scans and stuff later.

I know Arsenal could take out the opposition by himself, but I'm fond of these guys too.

Vector...

.... has repelled telepathy (which is a signal from the EM spectrum)
has blocked all the sensory technology of Reed Richards and Ironman
has repelled reality before (at least twice)
has repelled Dr. Strange's magic before

We can block every single attack our opponents make.

Scan Only #1

Noh Varr taking out the entire Runaways/New Avengers in a couple pages.

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/3505/whiterunva2.th.jpghttp://img229.imageshack.us/img229/917/whiterun1hi6.th.jpghttp://img390.imageshack.us/img390/519/whiterun2xd7.th.jpghttp://img505.imageshack.us/img505/2369/whiterun3zo6.th.jpghttp://img401.imageshack.us/img401/758/whiterun4ac9.th.jpghttp://img88.imageshack.us/img88/3092/whiterun5pa5.th.jpghttp://img227.imageshack.us/img227/6440/whiterun6vw0.th.jpg

The 5 mile feat I was referring to.

http://img411.imageshack.us/img411/7200/5milerunhy5.th.jpg

Scan Only #2

Vector repels reality
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/4779/theincrediblehulkv23051xs3.jpg
http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/1039/theincrediblehulkv23051ax8.jpg

http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/1313/theincrediblehulkv23041ua8.jpg

Imagine a 600 foot version of this, while Nimrod makes it omnidirectional, and amps the power output.

http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/9563/theincrediblehulkv23040tw7.jpg

http://img519.imageshack.us/img519/4531/ultimatedp0.jpg

Repels telepathy, technology and magic.

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/2882/theincrediblehulkv22770nd6.jpg
http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/2155/theincrediblehulkv22770qs1.jpg
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/6114/theincrediblehulkv22770yl5.jpg
http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/599/theincrediblehulkv22770gj2.jpg

http://img227.imageshack.us/img227/3075/vectordeflecthc2.jpg

Scan Only #3

Nimrod vs. Juggernaut plus lots of little extra powers displayed by Nimrod.

http://img175.imageshack.us/img175/2839/uxm194page12xc9.th.jpghttp://img395.imageshack.us/img395/3451/uxm194page13ov5.th.jpghttp://img338.imageshack.us/img338/2319/uxm194page14xy7.th.jpghttp://img395.imageshack.us/img395/250/uxm194page15pl2.th.jpghttp://img338.imageshack.us/img338/4818/uxm194page16sq3.th.jpghttp://img338.imageshack.us/img338/4448/uxm194page17ah6.th.jpghttp://img395.imageshack.us/img395/1585/uxm194page18xs2.th.jpghttp://img395.imageshack.us/img395/3171/uxm194page19sy3.th.jpghttp://img395.imageshack.us/img395/8923/uxm194page20xu7.th.jpghttp://img513.imageshack.us/img513/5210/uxm194page21mf5.th.jpg


Nimrod pwns.

Scan Only #4

Nimrod's sensors
http://img168.imageshack.us/img168/4862/newxmen029012sz0.th.jpghttp://img168.imageshack.us/img168/2098/newxmen029022pw9.th.jpghttp://img168.imageshack.us/img168/8018/newxmen029023hq0.th.jpg

Adapting to attacks
http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/3001/newxmen31006ww1.th.jpg
http://img329.imageshack.us/img329/484/newxmen31009fi6.th.jpg

Nimrods disintegration ray is more thorough then Ultrons.
http://img401.imageshack.us/img401/4500/img005hb6.th.jpghttp://img440.imageshack.us/img440/6729/img006eu5.th.jpg

Stryker used Nimrods arm to freeze the O.N.E. Sentinels.
http://img219.imageshack.us/img219/5109/scan0024mf1.th.jpg

Nimrod pwns hard.

FIN

We've torn down enemy defenses.

We've shown how our characters hit harder, are by far harder to affect, heal fast, and are far, far, far more versatile.

We have a prepared plan that will be initiated from start, where as our opponents have a cobbled together plan that they suggested after their write-up... so ours will happen first, and will cover every defense they have.

We can recover from, adapt to and simply outdo anything they throw at us.

We win.

Thus is Scotland owned. Not in the match itself (I've only read parts) but because Scoob checks out at about 7-8PM EST most nights, or earlier. I hope leo's depriving his wife of his manly physique tonight, or you guys are going to get the last 6-7 posts. No fault of yours...you're just doing your job as participants. But as an observer, it's unfortunate that such a long period of posting goes without a chance for a rebuttal.

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Thus is Scotland owned. Not in the match itself (I've only read parts) but because Scoob checks out at about 7-8PM EST most nights, or earlier. I hope leo's depriving his wife of his manly physique tonight, or you guys are going to get the last 6-7 posts. No fault of yours...you're just doing your job as participants. But as an observer, it's unfortunate that such a long period of posting goes without a chance for a rebuttal. I had a bottle of booze delivered to Scoob's house, and a mock porn bill sent to Leo's wife.

This was no coincidence.

....poor leo's wife. At least Scoob gets to get trashed.

Originally posted by Faux Smurph
Pocket battlefield

Scoob says: The ship doesn't have the specs! It has a digital manual covering how to use it!

OK then, make our jobs easier...

Nimrod DLs the manual.

Moving on...

I, frankly, don't have the time at this moment to read through everything since my last post (leaving in 5 minutes) but this needed a response.

An instruction manual to a device that's 20 feet wide in a massive city? I don't see that being useful at all.

Manual's certainly don't tell you how to build the items ... how many of you got instruction books with your computers or phones? did they come with info on how to construct your own? Mine didn't.

PB is tiny in comparison to the city ... and it glows pink ... why would we ever go into it? (if they can bring it along that is)



What else ... uh ... Vector ... every decent feat of his involves single direction blasts ... he has no idea where we are and we're also using a distraction tactic (see OP)


Nimrod, regardless of the fact that there ONLY sonics scan states that he uses a "tight beam" version on Juggernaut, they believe this means that it can go omni directional.
... it can't (that's why it's called "tight beam" in the first place)

Increased height wouldn't increase the sonic frequency of your speakers.


ok ... Don't think I have time for anything else ... um - Reality ripping >>> defenses that can't fuly push back Prof Hulk or stop COlossus.

If I had ten more minutes I'd post scans of Nimrod getting busted up by Leland/Shaw and one where Colossus craks his armour just by grabbing him ... but I don't have ten minutes (and I think the deadline is in about 4 minutes anyway)


Sooo ...
our output >>> their output
our invulnerability >>> their invulnerability
our team name >>> their team name
I'm late for work
s**t ... gotta go, cyas later.




GG BTW.

Sorry Delph, I just started reading this match.

http://www.i-mockery.com/minimocks/zod/zod-4-prez.jpg

Not a match related post

Originally posted by DigiMark007
Thus is Scotland owned. Not in the match itself (I've only read parts) but because Scoob checks out at about 7-8PM EST most nights, or earlier.

I gotta get to work for/before 8am GMT (around midnight PST) ... you may have noted that I was late today.



Yeah, honestly I feel that that really does work to the advantage of people in US time zones ... if we could perhaps have a shifting schedule from match to match it would even this out so as to be fair to everyone.

Probably wont happen though.

I just feel that people waiting until I (and/or other participants) can't respond is a little cheap ... even if it's not meant to be ... and possibly shows that they know their plans can be easily countered if there was time.


Maybe a point for later matches/future tourneys - perhaps adding an extra day time on the limit to allow for "reply only posts" - where no further offense can be made but gives participants the opportunity to address anything that is brought up last minute.

Not only fair to different time zones, but it allows everything to face cross examination - isn't that the point of a tournament based on debating?

Otherwise, what's to prevent a team in any given match to write up all their posts in MS Word (or whatever) then wait to the last 10 minutes of the last day and post everything at once in order to deprive their opponents a chance at rebuttal?




I honestly didn't have time to do more than skim through a couple of the posts made last night before I left this morning, saw the first point which grabbed my attention and replied to it, no time for anything else.

Not sure there's much point in reading through the rest now, I know that they'd only make me want to post replies which would probably just be deleted.


Anyway... on to the judging.

This match began looking like it was going to be very close, but most of the fight devolved into each team trying to tear down the basis for the other team's prep ahead of strengthening the standing of the abilities of their own rosters. However, Bdub/Smurph's gigantic Vector/Nimrod ominblast is, well, pretty much an end game. The pocket battlefield didn't pan out, so they just pulled out the big gun. The giant repel everything blast is kind of nasty.

Judge's Vote: Bdub/Smurph.

I thought Galan was the 3rd judge...?

Galan has withdrawn from judging for this tourney.