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Who wins?

Hmm, close call but Id say Supes. Good fight though

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Hmm, close call but Id say Supes. Good fight though Really?

You question the fact that he thinks its a good fight?

Originally posted by Bentley
You question the fact that he thinks its a good fight? I wanted to hear his reasoning for how Superman wins this fight.

What feats does SS have?

Well why not, Supes has excellent combat speed,h2h skill and striking power and SS has great durability. I dont see either stomping the opposite site but he does take it on the account of his MA level.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Well why not, Supes has excellent combat speed,h2h skill and striking power and SS has great durability. I dont see either stomping the opposite site but he does take it on the account of his MA level. How does Superman avoid being cut in half?

I don't know anything about SS exiles, but SS can just turn supes into a muffin, assuming exiles still has the ability to manipulate matter.

LMAO, well aside from his durability he could just easily dogde it since he does have superior MA skill and combat speed. The question that should really be asked is how does SS compete agaisnt Supes h2h skill.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
LMAO, well aside from his durability he could just easily dogde it since he does have superior MA skill and combat speed. The question that should really be asked is how does SS compete agaisnt Supes h2h skill. You do realize that the Surfer could keep sending back at him over and over again.

The Surfer easily caught one of Gladiator's punches like it was nothing. He was a force to be reckoned with and easily disposed of the galaxy's greatest warriors.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
LMAO, well aside from his durability he could just easily dogde it since he does have superior MA skill and combat speed. The question that should really be asked is how does SS compete agaisnt Supes h2h skill.

Does it matter when he can manipulate matter and is at least as fast as supes? SS via muffin morph.

Originally posted by quanchi112
You do realize that the Surfer could keep sending back at him over and over again.

The Surfer easily caught one of Gladiator's punches like it was nothing. He was a force to be reckoned with and easily disposed of the galaxy's greatest warriors.

Catching Glad's is somehow comparable to beasting 2 top tiers at once...with precise preasure strikes all at superspeed. Besides Glad is marvels unfortunate whippingboy..who hasnt owned him.

Originally posted by snyper1982
Does it matter when he can manipulate matter and is at least as fast as supes? SS via muffin morph.

His travel speed is faster then Supes but his combat speed is a differtent story, matter manip doesnt mean much when u have a opponent as quick as Supes. SS will need to keep distance and keep hurling bolts and eventually hope one of them lands.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
His travel speed is faster then Supes but his combat speed is a differtent story, matter manip doesnt mean much when u have a opponent as quick as Supes. SS will need to keep distance and keep hurling bolts and eventually hope one of them lands.

Hey I like supes, I just don't think he can take Norrin.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Catching Glad's is somehow comparable to beasting 2 top tiers at once...with precise preasure strikes all at superspeed. Besides Glad is marvels unfortunate whippingboy..who hasnt owned him. Hulk and Thor didnt own him like the Surfer did in exiles. Did you read either of those fights? Surfer also just beat the galaxy's best. He also has the power cosmic,so ho wdoes he lose when he has all of this going for him?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Hulk and Thor didnt own him like the Surfer did in exiles. Did you read either of those fights? Surfer also just beat the galaxy's best. He also has the power cosmic,so ho wdoes he lose when he has all of this going for him?

Because SS has never fought a opponent who uses strength,h2h skill all at superspeed. Im not convinced about his abilities in close quarters and the only way I see him winning is by keeping his distance.

Originally posted by quanchi112
How does Superman avoid being cut in half?
He has access to the "Bat Kick"
Supes 10/10

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Because SS has never fought a opponent who uses strength,h2h skill all at superspeed. Im not convinced about his abilities in close quarters and the only way I see him winning is by keeping his distance. Glads. He has the same powerset.

You havent convinced me that Superman can avoid the board.

Originally posted by tsscls
He has access to the "Bat Kick"
Supes 10/10 Wont save him.

Originally posted by tsscls
He has access to the "Bat Kick"
Supes 10/10

Touche.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Wont save him.

Bat Kick>The Spectre

Plus, with this whole Trinity thing, is he going to eventually get WW's breasts? That + "The BatKick" would put him way over the top.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Catching Glad's is somehow comparable to beasting 2 top tiers at once...with precise preasure strikes all at superspeed. Besides Glad is marvels unfortunate whippingboy..who hasnt owned him.


I'll tell you who: Vulcan


Originally posted by The Great Galen
Because SS has never fought a opponent who uses strength,h2h skill all at superspeed. Im not convinced about his abilities in close quarters and the only way I see him winning is by keeping his distance.

Of course he has! Its called Thanos and Surfer got schooled.

Originally posted by tsscls
Bat Kick>The Spectre

Plus, with this whole Trinity thing, is he going to eventually get WW's breasts? That + "The BatKick" would put him way over the top. The Spectre didnt want to kill him or else he could have. Your still outta control!!!!!

Has not Supes resisted matter or reality manipulation from a multiversal being or something? Maybe not multiversal, but the guy was poweful. Where is Avlon when you need him?

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Because SS has never fought a opponent who uses strength,h2h skill all at superspeed. Im not convinced about his abilities in close quarters and the only way I see him winning is by keeping his distance.
Why does he have to keep his distance when his quickest path to victory is a One Hit KO via bullrush? Seems to me that the fight boils down to whether or not Supes can react to things moving at Surfer's top traveling speed(since that's the type of speed used in a bullrush).

meh, supes wins

If we assume The Keeper has all of Surfer's powers/abilities and experience plus how ruthless and bloodlusted he was I can see him beating Supes.

I mean...Keeper was the one from Exiles, right?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Why does he have to keep his distance when his quickest path to victory is a One Hit KO via bullrush? Seems to me that the fight boils down to whether or not Supes can react to things moving at Surfer's top traveling speed(since that's the type of speed used in a bullrush).

Bullrush, you mean from there starting distance hes going to bullrush Supes....I suppose that makes sense except Supes has survived thishttp://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=5190704 Maggadon warhead>SS Bullrush . Or how bout Supes flying towards SS and how will SS react to a opponent of Supes combat speed.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Bullrush, you mean from there starting distance hes going to bullrush Supes....I suppose that makes sense except Supes has survived this http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=5190704

Maggadon warhead>SS Bullrush . Or how bout Supes flying towards SS and how will SS react to a opponent of Supes combat speed.

Fixed it.

And did I say that Supes would go down from the bullrush? Unless I'm mistaken I just asked why he'd keep his distance because his best feat was one shotting Gladiator. That's why I don't like dealing with Exiles Surfer, his limited showings in an alternate reality make difficult to debate him.

But as for Supes coming at him with super speed goes, depending on how fast Gladiator was in that alternate reality(it varies greatly) it could be argued that Surfer would do this...

http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/7616/exiles0872006teamdcp09xs9.jpg

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Bullrush, you mean from there starting distance hes going to bullrush Supes....I suppose that makes sense except Supes has survived thishttp://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=5190704 Maggadon warhead>SS Bullrush . Or how bout Supes flying towards SS and how will SS react to a opponent of Supes combat speed.

Supes combat speed will only come into play in close quarter hand to hand. No need for SS to get into this when he can blast the hell out of superman while on his board. He has shown that he is able to execute multiple blasts at superspeeds while moving on his board. If supes starts flyin towards SS at sperspeed, SS who has a much faster mental processing rate can proceed to instantly( his control of his board is mental afterall) send his razor sharp board towards supes at an even greater speed which wud hurt greatly. While ON his board SS can certainly evade and avoid most of supermans attacks. The problem only comes when instead of blasting and flying around simultaneously in order to avoid supes, he tries to take on supes physically. Frakly unless trinity superman is no longer weak to kryptonite, red sun radiation and solar energy manipulation then this fight ends just as quickly as normal supes against SS.

Note: this is assuming that exiles SS has the same powerset as his 616 counter part.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Fixed it.

And did I say that Supes would go down from the bullrush? Unless I'm mistaken I just asked why he'd keep his distance because his best feat was one shotting Gladiator. That's why I don't like dealing with Exiles Surfer, his limited showings in an alternate reality make difficult to debate him.

But as for Supes coming at him with super speed goes, depending on how fast Gladiator was in that alternate reality(it varies greatly) it could be argued that Surfer would do this...

http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/7616/exiles0872006teamdcp09xs9.jpg

That was a cool feat but technically though shudnt regular 616 SS be able to do similar by restructuring his board into that sort of razor shape? Yes highly out of character but it wud be an effective way of easily taking out alot of characters.

Personally i think marvel was trying to show us just how dangerous SS can be with a little ruthlesness.

Originally posted by darthgoober
Fixed it.

And did I say that Supes would go down from the bullrush? Unless I'm mistaken I just asked why he'd keep his distance because his best feat was one shotting Gladiator. That's why I don't like dealing with Exiles Surfer, his limited showings in an alternate reality make difficult to debate him.

But as for Supes coming at him with super speed goes, depending on how fast Gladiator was in that alternate reality(it varies greatly) it could be argued that Surfer would do this...

http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/7616/exiles0872006teamdcp09xs9.jpg

You guys are crazy. I don't really care who you think wins, but SS isn't beating Supes in such a manner. The time he took to say: "to me my board" Supes would have smashed several shots on his mug.

Originally posted by Allankles
You guys are crazy. I don't really care who you think wins, but SS isn't beating Supes in such a manner. The time he took to say: "to me my board" Supes would have smashed several shots on his mug.

Actually SS saying "to me my board" was just for added effect as SS controls his board by mental command and not word of mouth. And no Ss wont be beating him just like that but it wud be a useful tactic.

Originally posted by ultimatethor
Actually SS saying "to me my board" was just for added effect as SS controls his board by mental command and not word of mouth. And no Ss wont be beating him just like that but it wud be a useful tactic.

I know his words are for effect but they represent a pocket of time between Glads standing there with his fist in SSS's hands and the board slicing him in half. Supes wouldn't get caught by such a maneuver not to mention, there's no guarantee it's cutting him in half.

Originally posted by Allankles
I know his words are for effect but they represent a pocket of time between Glads standing there with his fist in SSS's hands and the board slicing him in half. Supes wouldn't get caught by such a maneuver not to mention, there's no guarantee it's cutting him in half.

He controls his board mentally so he cud have certainly summoned it much faster. The time it took him to call the board out aloud is not neccessarily how long it takes him to summon it. As i said it was just for effect. Also the board likely wont slice him in half but it wud still do some nice damage. Surfers board btw is much faster than superman so it wud be able to get him.

Originally posted by Allankles
You guys are crazy. I don't really care who you think wins, but SS isn't beating Supes in such a manner. The time he took to say: "to me my board" Supes would have smashed several shots on his mug.
Are you saying that Supes has never been taken aback when an opponent laughed at his best punch(or something similar)?

Originally posted by darthgoober
Are you saying that Supes has never been taken aback when an opponent laughed at his best punch(or something similar)?

Not that I can remember. The last time something like that happened that I'm aware of was the Atlas fight, and he didn't stop trying ro drop Atlas even though his blows weren't having the desired effect. Superman is the persistent type, he says that if he hits anything long enough it goes down. Glads is the type who feeds on confidence, Superman just cares about action, he isn't afraid to lose. It also helps that Superman can seemingly control his strength by sheer will.

Originally posted by Allankles
Not that I can remember. The last time something like that happened that I'm aware of was the Atlas fight, and he didn't stop trying ro drop Atlas even though his blows weren't having the desired effect. Superman is the persistent type, he says that if he hits anything long enough it goes down. Glads is the type who feeds on confidence, Superman just cares about action, he isn't afraid to lose.
What about when he stood dumbfounded after DD took on an energy barrage from the Justice League and got nailed by DD's charge because of it? Give me a minute and I'll come up with a better example(it WAS the whole Justice League after all so the surprise is understandable), that's just the first one I was able to think of(but I seriously doubt it'll be the last).

Originally posted by darthgoober
What about when he stood dumbfounded after DD took on an energy barrage from the Justice League and the got nailed by DD's charge because of it? Give me a minute and I'll come up with a better example(it WAS the whole Justice League after all so the surprise is understandable), that's just the first one I was able to think of(but I seriously doubt it'll be the last).

But that doesn't apply to his own efforts. He usually gauges a characters abilities anyway. He was throwing blows at Infninity Man even though the latter dwarfed him in power and durability. So I doubt he'd go :"OMG" if Surfer shrugged off his haymaker. Darkseid has tossed him around like he was nothing but Supes kept coming, he generally doesn't stop until he is stopped himself. The thing is Superman isn't afraid of people that are more powerful than him.

In DONG he acknowledges that the battle between the aspect of the Source and soulfire equation empowered Darkseid is way beyond his league but he still attacks DS, getting KO'd with one shot for his efforts. Of course SS isn't that powerful so I doubt Supes would be dumbstruck in such a sitaution.

Originally posted by Allankles
But that doesn't apply to his own efforts. He usually gauges a characters abilities anyway. He was throwing blows at Infninity Man even though the latter dwarfed him in power and durability. So I doubt he'd go :"OMG" if Surfer shrugged off his haymaker. Darkseid has tossed him around like he was nothing but Supes kept coming, he generally doesn't stop until he is stopped himself.
Did you not see the acknowledgement that it wasn't the best example because of the Justice League? I just was just looking for something that sets SOME kind of precedent. Now that it's set I'll look for a better example...

Originally posted by darthgoober
Did you not see the acknowledgement that it wasn't the best example because of the Justice League? I just was just looking for something that sets SOME kind of precedent. Now that it's set I'll look for a better example...

And I've given you the example of a Soul fire quation Darkseid being attacked by Supes. Supes acknowledged that they were well beyond his league, but it didn't stop him from attacking Darkseid. You're trying to say that Supes would react like Glads, no way, they don't have similar personalities. Superman can acknowledge greater power and still act decisively. He even wrestled with Asmodel, even though he knew the angel was much more powerful.

Originally posted by Allankles
And I've given you the example of a Soul fire quation Darkseid being attacked by Supes. Supes acknowledged that they were well beyond his league, but it didn't stop him from attacking Darkseid. You're trying to say that Supes would react like Glads, no way, they don't have similar personalities. Superman can acknowledge greater power and still act decisively. He even wrestled with Asmodel, even though he knew the angel was much more powerful.
No I'm contesting Supes definitely NOT reacting like Gladiator. I'm not saying that it'll necessarily happen, it just seems far fetched to say that there's no way it would happen because I'm all but certain that I've seen him in similar circumstances before. Now I may be wrong(I'm about to go looking to find out) and if I am I have no problem conceding the point because I have no real stake in a debate about Exiles Surfer and Supes.

Originally posted by Allankles
You guys are crazy. I don't really care who you think wins, but SS isn't beating Supes in such a manner. The time he took to say: "to me my board" Supes would have smashed several shots on his mug. Surfer would catch his fist imo just like he caught Glads' fist.

Originally posted by snyper1982
Does it matter when he can manipulate matter and is at least as fast as supes? SS via muffin morph. well superman has resisted transmutation before

Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
well superman has resisted transmutation before How does he avoid being cut in half?

Originally posted by quanchi112
How does he avoid being cut in half? I'll be waiting for the scans of Superman where he's been cut in half before. duryes

Wow...Tell me how Trinity Supes win this, please?

He's got current Supes' power level, and Batman's H2H skills and intelligence.

Glads power ~ Supes power. Yet Exiles Surfer was clearly far, far, far above him in that department. He easily caught Gladiator's fist who has proven to have hyperspeed (was that the term, Quan) combat reflexes on panel. Surfer could probably literally stand there and tank Supes' punches to no affect.

And if all else fails - he's still SS and this is still against Superman. Who wins all SS vs. Supes threads? SS. Why? Matter manipulation. Hell, by simply powering up in Annihilation he destroyed a planet and caused a black hole. Before Galactus' power up. Exiles Surfer is leagues above Current SS.

Trinity Superman wins this never. You'd need SMP to even compete physically with such sheer power and speed.

Originally posted by Badabing
I'll be waiting for the scans of Superman where he's been cut in half before. duryes Dc took it off the market as fanboys starting cutting themselves.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Wow...Tell me how Trinity Supes win this, please?

He's got current Supes' power level, and Batman's H2H skills and intelligence.

Glads power ~ Supes power. Yet Exiles Surfer was clearly far, far, far above him in that department. He easily caught Gladiator's fist who has proven to have hyperspeed (was that the term, Quan) combat reflexes on panel. Surfer could probably literally stand there and tank Supes' punches to no affect.

And if all else fails - he's still SS and this is still against Superman. Who wins all SS vs. Supes threads? SS. Why? Matter manipulation. Hell, by simply powering up in Annihilation he destroyed a planet and caused a black hole. Before Galactus' power up. Exiles Surfer is leagues above Current SS.

Trinity Superman wins this never. You'd need SMP to even compete physically with such sheer power and speed.

I agree, but this is assuming that Exiles Gladiator was on the same level as 616's Gladiator. As I've said before Exiles Surfer seemed more like he was in Tyrant's ballpark in terms of power ratings. Who can really say though.

Originally posted by CaptainStoic
I agree, but this is assuming that Exiles Gladiator was on the same level as 616's Gladiator. As I've said before Exiles Surfer seemed more like he was in Tyrant's ballpark in terms of power ratings. Who can really say though. No,nowhere near Tyrant level imo.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Dc took it off the market as fanboys starting cutting themselves. My point is that you've debated that since something never happened to a character before that it's not applicable to said character.

You also debated since a character has never accomplished a feat against a character of a certain power set that the feat is not applicable.

You can't show so much hypocrisy and such a double standard Quan. I hope I don't see any more in the near future.

Originally posted by Badabing
My point is that you've debated that since something never happened to a character before that it's not applicable to said character.

You also debated since a character has never accomplished a feat against a character of a certain power set that the feat is not applicable.

You can't show so much hypocrisy and such a double standard Quan. I hope I don't see any more in the near future. Finally somebody notices the stuff he types. How do we know that version of Gladz was Superman level anyways?

surfer wins everytime...he has all the powerset to take down supes..

Originally posted by Badabing
My point is that you've debated that since something never happened to a character before that it's not applicable to said character.

You also debated since a character has never accomplished a feat against a character of a certain power set that the feat is not applicable.

You can't show so much hypocrisy and such a double standard Quan. I hope I don't see any more in the near future. Ok,let me say my piece. I understand your point. Maybe the board would fail to cut Supes in half just like maybe the bfr would fail to work against Rulk. Here is why I have come to my conclusions as to both threads.

I think that Superman and Gladiator are both top tiers with exactly the same powerset. You wont find two characters more closely related than these two from opposing universes. The board sawed Glads in half easily. I think it would cut through Superman just the same.

Now with regards to Rulk and Superman. I think that a bfr off the planet is possible but it isnt very likely and its much more difficult to accomplish. I saw Supes use a speed blitz to beat his opponents and easily. I dont think he could have quickly bfr'd them off the planet but he did ko them quite easily. Now,I have seen Supes bfr Darkseid off the planet but it took an injured Seid and time for Supes to do it. If Darkseid hadnt been injured I think he would have reacted and stopped the whole process.

Both of these events can happen but I see the Surfer feat happening and being more likely to happen while I dont see the bfring off the planet as being as likely to occur.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Ok,let me say my piece. I understand your point. Maybe the board would fail to cut Supes in half just like maybe the bfr would fail to work against Rulk. Here is why I have come to my conclusions as to both threads.

I think that Superman and Gladiator are both top tiers with exactly the same powerset. You wont find two characters more closely related than these two from opposing universes. The board sawed Glads in half easily. I think it would cut through Superman just the same.


Both of these events can happen but I see the Surfer feat happening and being more likely to happen while I dont see the bfring off the planet as being as likely to occur.

The problem with this is that their similarities end with their power set, thats it, they don't even have the same magnitude of power. It's like saying all of Galactus heralds are the same, some were gifted with more of the power cosmic than others.

Further Glads doesn't necessarily have kryptonian durability. Does Glad have a Bio aura? No. Does he have the same sub atomic density? No. Are his powers derived from an inter dimensional source via the general absorption of solar radiation (yellow sun and all)? No. So apart from having similar powers, they are actually nothing alike, completely different genetic make up.

Originally posted by Allankles
The problem with this is that their similarities end with their power set, thats it, they don't even have the same magnitude of power. It's like saying all of Galactus heralds are the same, some were gifted with more of the power cosmic than others.

Further Glads doesn't necessarily have kryptonian durability. Does Glad have a Bio aura? No. Does he have the same sub atomic density? No. Are his powers derived from an inter dimensional source via the general absorption of solar radiation (yellow sun and all)? No. So apart from having similar powers, they are actually nothing alike, completely different genetic make up.

The other issue is we don't know how this Glads stacks up agaisnt the 616 Glad's who's top feats are trans level. I believe it was actually stated in a comic that Glads can travel 100 times FTL, he has destroyed a planet in 3 blows and can even move a planet. I guess the question is did Glad come at SS 100 times FTL with planet wrecking punching power thats physical strength is enough to move a planet?

SS wins. What can supes do punch an kick at him all day? Eventually Surfer will get angry and kill him the way he did to Thor and his hammer. All he has to do is grab him for a few seconds. Supes if fast but he is like a gold fish compared to a kwasaki mortcycle. The cycle being Surfer.

H2H skills mean nothing when you can't hurt the opponent. Remember Karnak vs Hulk? So SS wins.

Originally posted by kakuzu
SS wins. What can supes do punch an kick at him all day? Eventually Surfer will get angry and kill him the way he did to Thor and his hammer. All he has to do is grab him for a few seconds. Supes if fast but he is like a gold fish compared to a kwasaki mortcycle. The cycle being Surfer.

H2H skills mean nothing when you can't hurt the opponent. Remember Karnak vs Hulk? So SS wins.

Except that Supes striking power ranks amongst the best of all top tiers and he has actually rocked characters above him power with it.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
The other issue is we don't know how this Glads stacks up agaisnt the 616 Glad's who's top feats are trans level. I believe it was actually stated in a comic that Glads can travel 100 times FTL, he has destroyed a planet in 3 blows and can even move a planet. I guess the question is did Glad come at SS 100 times FTL with planet wrecking punching power thats physical strength is enough to move a planet?

If they were on the same level why would Gladiator hold back in such a situation? Exiles Gladiator knew that his battle with that Silver Surfer was to the death, I mean the evidence was all around him, the entire Shiar Imperial Guard were dead or on their way to death right?

Evidence would suggest that Exiles Gladiator was pretty damn powerful as his punch did generate a whiteout effect, which was portrayed as being nothing to the Exiles Surfer.

On the other end of the spectrum Gladiator has always been deflated when his best didn't cut it, so perhaps he lost confidence and in doing so his massive durability may have been deminished as well.

All the same Superman would retain all of his strengths even if his punch failed, the question here is would Superman be able to take better than he could give, and for how long?

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Except that Supes striking power ranks amongst the best of all top tiers and he has actually rocked characters above him power with it.

Its funny because Silver Surfers punches can do the same thing and more. Why mention this?

Originally posted by CaptainStoic
If they were on the same level why would Gladiator hold back in such a situation? Exiles Gladiator knew that his battle with that Silver Surfer was to the death, I mean the evidence was all around him, the entire Shiar Imperial Guard were dead or on their way to death right?

Evidence would suggest that Exiles Gladiator was pretty damn powerful as his punch did generate a whiteout effect, which was portrayed as being nothing to the Exiles Surfer.

On the other end of the spectrum Gladiator has always been deflated when his best didn't cut it, so perhaps he lost confidence and in doing so his massive durability may have been deminished as well.

All the same Superman would retain all of his strengths even if his punch failed, the question here is would Superman be able to take better than he could give, and for how long?

The above is a great post. It really doesn't matter if Supes would be cut in half by Surfer's board (not that DC would allow that to happen to their flagship character anyway). Surfer has a hundred other ways to beat him. It's like saying that because Surfer doesn't physically kick the shit out of Glads that he couldn't. No, he simply cuts him in half because it's quicker and he doesn't need to prove himself.

He'd own Supes in just about every way imaginable.

Originally posted by kakuzu
Its funny because Silver Surfers punches can do the same thing and more. Why mention this?

Scan of SS's punching power enough to destroy dwarf planets?

Originally posted by Enyalus
The above is a great post. It really doesn't matter if Supes would be cut in half by Surfer's board (not that DC would allow that to happen to their flagship character anyway). Surfer has a hundred other ways to beat him. It's like saying that because Surfer doesn't physically kick the shit out of Glads that he couldn't. No, he simply cuts him in half because it's quicker and he doesn't need to prove himself.

He'd own Supes in just about every way imaginable.

Your post is good and speaks truth.

Really if you want to imagine Supes fighting Surfer. Mold a steel human sized thing a few inches thick. Then punch at it. When your hands are badly bruised and a few fingers broken then you shall feel like Superman after a few good hits.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Scan of SS's punching power enough to destroy dwarf planets?

He powers up (think Dragonball Z style) and it destroys a planet and creates a black hole, as noted by Thanos...

Do we really need to see him punching planets apart when simply tapping into his full power does the trick?

Originally posted by Enyalus
The above is a great post. It really doesn't matter if Supes would be cut in half by Surfer's board (not that DC would allow that to happen to their flagship character anyway). Surfer has a hundred other ways to beat him. It's like saying that because Surfer doesn't physically kick the shit out of Glads that he couldn't. No, he simply cuts him in half because it's quicker and he doesn't need to prove himself.

He'd own Supes in just about every way imaginable.

Supes fought WW from the earth to the sun in only 1:54 secons and keep in mind it would take 19 minutes to make it from earth to saturn. Still have yet to see a combat feat from SS that is FTL...oh keep in mind http://img82.imageshack.us/my.php?image=supermanshazamspeedfeat40bm.jpg he can vibrate his body so quickly he can pass through enemy grips. Keep in mind a human size object would need to be vibrating at least light speed within the earths amosphere to become intangible as proven by Flash.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Scan of SS's punching power enough to destroy dwarf planets?

Lets See Superman knocking over Drax?

So since you don't see Superman do it you can't assume he can't. Don't assume Surfer can't destroy a dwarf planet which Marvel probably doesn't have. They usually have real ones getting destroyed.

Lets see Superman nearly destroy earth in his sleep?

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Supes fought WW from the earth to the sun in only 1:54 secons and keep in mind it would take 19 minutes to make it from earth to saturn. Still have yet to see a combat feat from SS that is FTL...oh keep in mind http://img82.imageshack.us/my.php?image=supermanshazamspeedfeat40bm.jpg he can vibrate his body so quickly he can pass through enemy grips. Keep in mind a human size object would need to be vibrating at least light speed within the earths amosphere to become intangible as proven by Flash.

...And SS is incapable of going faster than light since when?

Why are people continuisly bringing up 616 surfer when exiles isn't 616 surfer he didn't show nearly his power speed ect.

Originally posted by Enyalus
He powers up (think Dragonball Z style) and it destroys a planet and creates a black hole, as noted by Thanos...

Do we really need to see him punching planets apart when simply tapping into his full power does the trick?

Im aware of SS amping powers, which by the by take time. What u have failed to address is in what frame of time it would take for this"amping"and if its quick enough to avoid supes FTL travelling speed.

Originally posted by vlaaad12345
Why are people continuisly bringing up 616 surfer when exiles isn't 616 surfer he didn't show nearly his power speed ect.

If Galen can say Superman can vibrate his molecules to escape enemy grasp I think we can say Surfer can move pretty fast no matter what version.

Originally posted by Enyalus
...And SS is incapable of going faster than light since when?

Fighting FTL theres a big difference between flight speed and combat speed. SS can fly FTL but he has never been shown to fight FTL.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Im aware of SS amping powers, which by the by take time. What u have failed to address is in what frame of time it would take for this"amping"and if its quick enough to avoid supes FTL travelling speed.

You're acting like Surfer would be scared of Supes. SS can go FTL as well. And is a ruthless SOB in Exiles form as well as decidedly stronger. Maybe SS decides to rush Supes instead? Or throw energy blasts at him via the Power Cosmic.

Originally posted by Enyalus
You're acting like Surfer would be scared of Supes. SS can go FTL as well. And is a ruthless SOB in Exiles form as well as decidedly stronger. Maybe SS decides to rush Supes instead? Or throw energy blasts at him via the Power Cosmic. great galen changes his mind all the time. dont take him seriously

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Fighting FTL theres a big difference between flight speed and combat speed. SS can fly FTL but he has never been shown to fight FTL.

Guess what? When Superman uses such speeds it is only on really big foes. IE Shaggy man, Doomsday, Mongoul, Imperiex. When he blitz then it does no harm. When he moves that fast it is a last resort because he knows he can't do anything else. Remember when he tried this on Anti Monitor? It didn't even tickle him. Why try it on Surfer unless your saying that Supermans last resort and he knows he can't do anything else.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Im aware of SS amping powers, which by the by take time. What u have failed to address is in what frame of time it would take for this"amping"and if its quick enough to avoid supes FTL travelling speed.

Do you even know what it takes for Superman to go light speed? He can't just go light speed in one second. He has to attack from a distance. He can't just say "Light speed time" an go forward in a few feet. Light speed won't even be used in this battle.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Actually Supes has virbated his moecules, and if u dont believe me check his fight with DD. He literally vibrated through his punches as proven here http://img378.imageshack.us/img378/1971/supermanfast3ar.jpg and here is him using his MA in superspeed http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=trinity13p06zw7.jpg

The scarfice fight is the one in which Supes fought from the earth back to the sun in less then 2 mintues, note that he was actually fighting and not just simply fighting.

Wrong again. I don't know if you took the time to read the comic but it clearly shows Superman DODGING THE PUNCH and hitting Doomsday later on. He doesn't show to vibrate his molecules. Again the is Flashes only move.

Okay he used Super speed on Ultraman and still got pwned? SS is more powerful the Ultraman.

Superman can't vibrate his molecules.

Originally posted by kakuzu
Do you even know what it takes for Superman to go light speed? He can't just go light speed in one second. He has to attack from a distance. He can't just say "Light speed time" an go forward in a few feet. Light speed won't even be used in this battle.

What the hell are guys even talking about, forum rules stipulate full capcity rules meaning each character is in peak condition. Theres an actual fight of Supes vs WW in sacrfice that has them fighting from the sun to the earth in less then 2 mintues...i mean its right there if u dont believe me.

Originally posted by kakuzu
Wrong again. I don't know if you took the time to read the comic but it clearly shows Superman DODGING THE PUNCH and hitting Doomsday later on. He doesn't show to vibrate his molecules. Again the is Flashes only move.

Okay he used Super speed on Ultraman and still got pwned? SS is more powerful the Ultraman.

Superman can't vibrate his molecules.

Dude...he vibrated his body I mean...its either a case of u accepting it or u not accepting it.At anyrate any particular reason why u think SS can beast Ultra and Superwomen both at the sametime and in the manner he did. You still havnt addressed a single issue, u hant proven SS MA skill, u still havnt shown SS combat speed and u still have havnt proven his striking power.

Galen, you're saying he can vibrate his molecules and that'll help give Supes the win. I think that's been disproven by kakuzu.

What else do you think would give Supes the win, so we'll better understand your points?

Wow. I don't think anything will get through to you. Tell me why name your self after Galactus original name who was the person who made SS then be a Superman fanatic?

The reason I say this is because you make things up, you don't prove points(Logical ones anyway) if you do have something you believe is right you keep repeating it even when its wrong. Why?


If you think Superman wins say something real. Say something with truth. Say something that doesn't annoy every one else around because it isn't true.

Originally posted by kakuzu
Wow. I don't think anything will get through to you. Tell me why name your self after Galactus original name who was the person who made SS then be a Superman fanatic?

The reason I say this is because you make things up, you don't prove points(Logical ones anyway) if you do have something you believe is right you keep repeating it even when its wrong. Why?


If you think Superman wins say something real. Say something with truth. Say something that doesn't annoy every one else around because it isn't true.

So saying Supes has superior MA skill,combat speed and striking power is false...and yet when I have provided scans you've just rationlized why they are not viable. You guys havnt made a cause aside from"no this wont work because"and willfully ignoring on-panel feats isnt anyway to win a argument. Either you provide an exmaple of SS fighting using superspeed or some display of h2h skill that is comparable to Supes or you just concede due to sheer ignorance over Supes powerset.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
So saying Supes has superior MA skill,combat speed and striking power is false...and yet when I have provided scans you've just rationlized why they are not viable. You guys havnt made a cause aside from"no this wont work because"and willfully ignoring on-panel feats isnt anyway to win a argument. Either you provide an exmaple of SS fighting using superspeed or some display of h2h skill that is comparable to Supes or you just concede due to sheer ignorance over Supes powerset.

So you say we ignored you when you posted the wrong pictures? You say we ignored you when you said the wrong information? You say we ignored you when you keep repeating the same phrase for the last five pages?

You don't read comics. I'm sorry to say this. You post one picture an assume what happens in it. You are in your own little world. Seeing as how you can't post proof an are just going by opinion there isn't much I can do for you.

I can't see any of your scans, kakuzu. They all say 404 - Not Found.

Originally posted by kakuzu
So you say we ignored you when you posted the wrong pictures? You say we ignored you when you said the wrong information? You say we ignored you when you keep repeating the same phrase for the last five pages?

You don't read comics. I'm sorry to say this. You post one picture an assume what happens in it. You are in your own little world. Seeing as how you can't post proof an are just going by opinion there isn't much I can do for you.

Originally posted by kakuzu
So you say we ignored you when you posted the wrong pictures? You say we ignored you when you said the wrong information? You say we ignored you when you keep repeating the same phrase for the last five pages?

You don't read comics. I'm sorry to say this. You post one picture an assume what happens in it. You are in your own little world. Seeing as how you can't post proof an are just going by opinion there isn't much I can do for you.

Woops tripple post, damn computer. Anyhow exaclty what wrong information and wrong scans are u talking about. All you've done is just rationlize why the feats arent viable and continued with useless SS feats that dont have anything to do with this debate. Seriously dude i dont know what ur trying to say here but exactly what point r u trying to make?

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Once again providing a laundry list worth of feats that dont in anyway shape or form support your argument. Okay I dont know how many times I need to say this..your either missing the point or arguing some other debate cause right now ur really confusing.

SS has better travel feats but Supes has better combat speed and MA skill...easy enough concept right. Supes physical strength is greater and his striking power is greater but SS has great energy versatility. My argument has been that if the fight were to become close quarters Supes would win overwhealming due to these advantages. However in order for that to happen he would need to narrow the gap between himslf and SS which would be a difficult task...now hopfully thats simple enough for u to understand. What amazes me is the fact you can't comprehend I posted feats of SS fighting this time rather then Travel. Your in such a state of denial you ignore it, you just skim through it or don't read it at all an just copy and paste the same phrase.

You yourself can't even post the right picture of Superman blitzing or the fight picture of Superman moving fast. At least I've proven my point. I've put the right picture. What have you put down?

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Woops tripple post, damn computer. Anyhow exaclty what wrong information and wrong scans are u talking about. All you've done is just rationlize why the feats arent viable and continued with useless SS feats that dont have anything to do with this debate. Seriously dude i dont know what ur trying to say here but exactly what point r u trying to make?
1)You post a scan of Superman blitzing and say he moved his molecules.

2)You post a scan of Superman throwing people off and using superbreath and you say he is vibrating molecules.

Basically you aren't making any sense. Your making up things are you go. Can you even lay down one point right now?

Also by the way you say the feats I posted are useless, yet they seem to be more right then yours. Then again which feats have you actually posted?

Originally posted by kakuzu
What amazes me is the fact you can't comprehend I posted feats of SS fighting this time rather then Travel. Your in such a state of denial you ignore it, you just skim through it or don't read it at all an just copy and paste the same phrase.

You yourself can't even post the right picture of Superman blitzing or the fight picture of Superman moving fast. At least I've proven my point. I've put the right picture. What have you put down?

LMAO, fighting...u mean dodging enery blast. No dude im talking about actual combat h2h superspeed like when he fought UM and SW...or even the countless othertimes he use superdpeed with MA in battle...you're just arguing some mutable point for some odd reason and I seriously dont know wat ur trying to get at.

Originally posted by kakuzu
1)You post a scan of Superman blitzing and say he moved his molecules.

2)You post a scan of Superman throwing people off and using superbreath and you say he is vibrating molecules.

Basically you aren't making any sense. Your making up things are you go. Can you even lay down one point right now?

Also by the way you say the feats I posted are useless, yet they seem to be more right then yours. Then again which feats have you actually posted?

How are they right, I requested a very specific feat of him ultalizing MA skill in a combat situation at superpseed. I asked for you to prove SS stirking power, I ask you to prove his MA skill and I asked u to prove his combat speed. Now if you claim you've proven all that(which u havnt)then show me a example of SS using all 3 of those attributes at once in a combat situation like Supes has.

Careful The Great Galen, you don't have the shield of Thanos to protect yourself in KMC.

Originally posted by CaptainStoic
If they were on the same level why would Gladiator hold back in such a situation? Exiles Gladiator knew that his battle with that Silver Surfer was to the death, I mean the evidence was all around him, the entire Shiar Imperial Guard were dead or on their way to death right?

Evidence would suggest that Exiles Gladiator was pretty damn powerful as his punch did generate a whiteout effect, which was portrayed as being nothing to the Exiles Surfer.

On the other end of the spectrum Gladiator has always been deflated when his best didn't cut it, so perhaps he lost confidence and in doing so his massive durability may have been deminished as well.

All the same Superman would retain all of his strengths even if his punch failed, the question here is would Superman be able to take better than he could give, and for how long?

Well like I said, if the battle gets close then the fight is in his favor but if its from a distance I can see this being a problem. Bads said it best though"Superman has shown to be able to use speed, precision and brute force on opponents who were shown to be his peers from past meetings. " IMO, if both are written in peak form I can see it being a close fight but on the account of Supes MA skill I would say he takes it...i guess it depends if the battle gets close or not.

Originally posted by kakuzu
Wrong again. I don't know if you took the time to read the comic but it clearly shows Superman DODGING THE PUNCH and hitting Doomsday later on. He doesn't show to vibrate his molecules. Again the is Flashes only move.

Okay he used Super speed on Ultraman and still got pwned? SS is more powerful the Ultraman.

Superman can't vibrate his molecules.

Superman does vibrate through, DD's first punch, he stands still and DD's punch passes through him. He's also vibrated his body to turn invisible and "phase" through energy attacks.

Originally posted by Allankles
Superman does vibrate through, DD's first punch, he stands still and DD's punch passes through him. He's also vibrated his body to turn invisible and "phase" through energy attacks.

Dont bother with him I spend 2 pages worth arguing a on-panel showing that he just refues to accept....just put him on ignore.

Originally posted by Allankles
Superman does vibrate through, DD's first punch, he stands still and DD's punch passes through him. He's also vibrated his body to turn invisible and "phase" through energy attacks.
Has it ever actually been stated that Supes vibrates his molecules like that as opposed to it being an "after image" effect? I can totally except it if it has, but if we're just going off the a punch apparently passing through someone's body...
http://img516.imageshack.us/img516/7940/story2page01combatwa4.jpg

Originally posted by Allankles
Dude has surfer fought any a person at light speed? Why debate who light speed travel? Superman can move several times the speed of light like traveling from Rao to Earth or to Oa traversing several galaxies in minutes. He can travel just as fast when the situation demands it, all that is irrelevant to combat speed because these guys don't move at FTL in one on one combat.

Don't tell me this. Tell Galen this. He think everytime Superman does something he does it in light speed format. I clearly stated so many pages ago he doesn't blitz an do light speed. Plus Superman cannot vibrate his molecules.

Originally posted by kakuzu
Don't tell me this. Tell Galen this. He think everytime Superman does something he does it in light speed format. I clearly stated so many pages ago he doesn't blitz an do light speed. Plus Superman cannot vibrate his molecules.


LMAO, u claimed supes couldnt move FTL so i posted a scan proving he could. I then posted a scan proving he uses superspeed in h2h which lead to u posting travel feats from SS for some reason lol. When all i ever asked was to show a scan of SS using superspeed in combat...oh and supes can vibrate so u should learn to read.

Originally posted by Allankles
Dude has surfer fought any a person at light speed? Why debate who light speed travel? Superman can move several times the speed of light like traveling from Rao to Earth or to Oa traversing several galaxies in minutes. He can travel just as fast when the situation demands it, all that is irrelevant to combat speed because these guys don't move at FTL in one on one combat. Do you have any scans of this INDICATING Superman moving faster than light? I mean not just doing math calculation of distance since Superman has said that he cannot move faster than light under normal conditions. I mean a clear word or anything indicating FTL travel.

I have seen Superman do above light speed stated on panel Twice both he had amped his speed by , flash and in a space vacuum.

Supes does use superspeed in h2h combat but he has never actually fought at light speed. The sacrifice fight is NOT an example of him doing such btw. The during the sacrifice fight, supes was FLYING FORWARD to the sun at light speed but this DOES NOT mean that the attacks(punches etc) that he was throwing at wonderwoman were coming in at light speed themselves. Its just like if two people are running and fighting simultaneously. While the people may be running really fast, there attacks themselves WONT be equal to the speed of there forward movement.

As i said earlier, supes h2h combat speed will only come into play if SS tries to go into a close quarter hand to hand brawl instead of keeping his distance and blasting at high speeds.

Also why is so much emphasis on whether supes can vibrate his molecules? I think he can but it does not help him in this fight as SS can also become intangible anyway.

Originally posted by Badabing
I'll be waiting for the scans of Superman where he's been cut in half before. duryes

http://img460.imageshack.us/img460/4610/jla07838fc.th.jpg

Originally posted by Allankles
Dude has surfer fought any a person at light speed? Why debate who light speed travel? Superman can move several times the speed of light like traveling from Rao to Earth or to Oa traversing several galaxies in minutes. He can travel just as fast when the situation demands it, all that is irrelevant to combat speed because these guys don't move at FTL in one on one combat.

Travel speed surfer is considerably greater than supes. Didnt it take supes like three hours to travel 2.5million light years? In comparison it took surfer only a few seconds to travel 500000 light years. When u do the math, going at that speed it wud still have taken SS a few seconds to traverse the 2.5million light years, well under three hours.

Originally posted by DestinyGuy678
well superman has resisted transmutation before

Did not know that. Not calling you a liar, but do you have any proof of it?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Ok,let me say my piece. I understand your point. Maybe the board would fail to cut Supes in half just like maybe the bfr would fail to work against Rulk. Here is why I have come to my conclusions as to both threads.

I think that Superman and Gladiator are both top tiers with exactly the same powerset. You wont find two characters more closely related than these two from opposing universes. The board sawed Glads in half easily. I think it would cut through Superman just the same.

Now with regards to Rulk and Superman. I think that a bfr off the planet is possible but it isnt very likely and its much more difficult to accomplish. I saw Supes use a speed blitz to beat his opponents and easily. I dont think he could have quickly bfr'd them off the planet but he did ko them quite easily. Now,I have seen Supes bfr Darkseid off the planet but it took an injured Seid and time for Supes to do it. If Darkseid hadnt been injured I think he would have reacted and stopped the whole process.

Both of these events can happen but I see the Surfer feat happening and being more likely to happen while I dont see the bfring off the planet as being as likely to occur.

Funny thing though, Glads power depends on his confidence. His just got wiped out when SS caught his fist. Think about it.

Originally posted by kgkg
Do you have any scans of this INDICATING Superman moving faster than light? I mean not just doing math calculation of distance since Superman has said that he cannot move faster than light under normal conditions. I mean a clear word or anything indicating FTL travel.

I have seen Superman do above light speed stated on panel Twice both he had amped his speed by , flash and in a space vacuum.

Superman referred to a Zeta beam, which is far, far faster than standard light. He wasn't outracing that under normal circumstances.

Originally posted by Badabing
You can't show so much hypocrisy and such a double standard Quan. I hope I don't see any more in the near future.

crylaugh

Lulz.

Originally posted by darthgoober

http://img460.imageshack.us/img460/4610/jla07838fc.th.jpg



ha ha owned.

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
ha ha owned.
To be fair, I have no idea of the context behind that scan, I just happened to stumble upon it in Supes's respect thread a while back and remembered it when I saw Bada's statement.

Originally posted by Allankles
The problem with this is that their similarities end with their power set, thats it, they don't even have the same magnitude of power. It's like saying all of Galactus heralds are the same, some were gifted with more of the power cosmic than others.

Further Glads doesn't necessarily have kryptonian durability. Does Glad have a Bio aura? No. Does he have the same sub atomic density? No. Are his powers derived from an inter dimensional source via the general absorption of solar radiation (yellow sun and all)? No. So apart from having similar powers, they are actually nothing alike, completely different genetic make up. They are basically the same but arent exactly the same. Glads at his best is faster than Supes and unlike the man of steel he has destroyed a planet on panel with his fists. I have seen Glads fly at 100 times the speed of light while Prime left Superman in the dust when he took off at the speed of light in infinite crisis. I said they both had roughly the same powerset and never said the same genetic makeup.

Do you even read my whole post?Originally posted by The Great Galen
The other issue is we don't know how this Glads stacks up agaisnt the 616 Glad's who's top feats are trans level. I believe it was actually stated in a comic that Glads can travel 100 times FTL, he has destroyed a planet in 3 blows and can even move a planet. I guess the question is did Glad come at SS 100 times FTL with planet wrecking punching power thats physical strength is enough to move a planet? What does moving a planet have to do with beating someone up? Are you telling me Superman pushing something hurts more than punching something?

Originally posted by Avlon
Superman referred to a Zeta beam, which is far, far faster than standard light. He wasn't outracing that under normal circumstances. Do you have the issue number for this?

What you think of the new Atlas beating?

Originally posted by kgkg
Do you have the issue number for this?

What you think of the new Atlas beating?

Not at work. I'll see if I can scan it once I'm home though. If you remember the story though, it's a Zeta beam he had to race against.


The Atlas beating was cool. I'm curious to see how that arc ends.

Originally posted by Avlon
Not at work. I'll see if I can scan it once I'm home though. If you remember the story though, it's a Zeta beam he had to race against.


The Atlas beating was cool. I'm curious to see how that arc ends. ohh your talking about the JLA 21 v3 I posted scans of that he did go faster than light but flash lend this speed have posted the scan somewhere.

An still trying to find some concrete evidence of Superman's top speed if you know any.

is this the one?

Originally posted by kgkg
is this the one?

That's the one. That's a zeta beam. Those are far faster than light.

Supes best recent example was in the countdown series from a Star system 27 light years away.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That is your interpretation which is fine and dandy. But dont try to pass it off like its a fact when I havent seen anyone agree with it, as of yet. How do you know its less than two minutes?

Agreed.

When has Superman fought anyone at light speed? Are you having fun?

In the sacrfice fight it took them less then 2 minutes to get from earth to the sun...I think it was like 1:40 seconds or something. kakuzu stated Supes cant fly FTL and that he didnt have MA skill or that his stirking power wasnt even good...in fact he even claimed SS striking power ws greater so I posted scans disproving all those claims and then he proceeded to post useless scans of SS that didnt proven a single thing...and what I really asked for was an exmaple of SS combat speed.

Originally posted by quanchi112
They are basically the same but arent exactly the same. Glads at his best is faster than Supes and unlike the man of steel he has destroyed a planet on panel with his fists. I have seen Glads fly at 100 times the speed of light while Prime left Superman in the dust when he took off at the speed of light in infinite crisis. I said they both had roughly the same powerset and never said the same genetic makeup.

Do you even read my whole post? What does moving a planet have to do with beating someone up? Are you telling me Superman pushing something hurts more than punching something?

Originally posted by quanchi112
They are basically the same but arent exactly the same. Glads at his best is faster than Supes and unlike the man of steel he has destroyed a planet on panel with his fists. I have seen Glads fly at 100 times the speed of light while Prime left Superman in the dust when he took off at the speed of light in infinite crisis. I said they both had roughly the same powerset and never said the same genetic makeup.

Do you even read my whole post? What does moving a planet have to do with beating someone up? Are you telling me Superman pushing something hurts more than punching something?

Actually I was asking for was some confirmation that Exiles Glad is comparable to his 616 counter part and if the punch SS caught was from Glads while travelling 100 times FTL with a planet busting punch?

Originally posted by kgkg
ohh your talking about the JLA 21 v3 I posted scans of that he did go faster than light but flash lend this speed have posted the scan somewhere.

An still trying to find some concrete evidence of Superman's top speed if you know any.

Well in red son he has a speed feat that puts him well above multiples of light. I don't think red son is considered cannon though...

Originally posted by The Great Galen
In the sacrfice fight it took them less then 2 minutes to get from earth to the sun...I think it was like 1:40 seconds or something. kakuzu stated Supes cant fly FTL and that he didnt have MA skill or that his stirking power wasnt even good...in fact he even claimed SS striking power ws greater so I posted scans disproving all those claims and then he proceeded to post useless scans of SS that didnt proven a single thing...and what I really asked for was an exmaple of SS combat speed. Do you have a scan of this? I dont get what you are saying about combat speed vs travel speed. What is top speed Superman has fought at mentioned on panel?Originally posted by snyper1982
Well in red son he has a speed feat that puts him well above multiples of light. I don't think red son is considered cannon though... Red Son is an entirely different Superman.

Originally posted by Avlon

Superman referred to a Zeta beam,
which is far, far faster than standard light.
"Zeta" beam?

That's a DC centered concept right AV?


Btw friends, 616 Surfer battled Redshift in light-speed.
So we know, he surely can, don't know about exiles version,
but I also don't see why not.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Do you have a scan of this? I dont get what you are saying about combat speed vs travel speed. What is top speed Superman has fought at mentioned on panel? Red Son is an entirely different Superman.

Well Exiles is a totally different surfer too. It was the same character, different back story. His powers didn't change or anything. Besides, I already said I didn't believe it was cannon... Just trying to give an example of his speed.

Originally posted by snyper1982
Well Exiles is a totally different surfer too. It was the same character, different back story. His powers didn't change or anything. Besides, I already said I didn't believe it was cannon... Just trying to give an example of his speed. Both characters speed is comparable. So imo it comes down to who wins a fight, not who is faster.

Originally posted by quanchi112
They are basically the same but arent exactly the same. Glads at his best is faster than Supes and unlike the man of steel he has destroyed a planet on panel with his fists. I have seen Glads fly at 100 times the speed of light while Prime left Superman in the dust when he took off at the speed of light in infinite crisis. I said they both had roughly the same powerset and never said the same genetic makeup.


Superman has traveled faster than 100 times the speed of light, do the math for crying out loud. So there goes your Glads is faster than Supes opinion, not that that has to do with anything I was arguing.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Both characters speed is comparable. So imo it comes down to who wins a fight, not who is faster.

Which I posted way back, that surfer does via muffin morph. I am still waiting for someone to show me proof that superman can resist being transmutated.

Originally posted by Allankles
Superman has traveled faster than 100 times the speed of light, do the math for crying out loud. So there goes your Glads is faster than Supes opinion, not that that has to do with anything I was arguing. When was it stated?

What particular instance are you referring to?

Superman couldnt keep up with Prime going the speed of light in infinite crisis.

Originally posted by snyper1982
Which I posted way back, that surfer does via muffin morph. I am still waiting for someone to show me proof that superman can resist being transmutated. Ok. Youll have to talk to someone who thinks superman can win in this thread.

Check the respect threads, supes has resisted it b4. Mr I remember that scan of SS but it didnt actually state that they were fighting....they were travelling if im not mistaken

Originally posted by snyper1982
Which I posted way back, that surfer does via muffin morph. I am still waiting for someone to show me proof that superman can resist being transmutated.

Im still waiting for a combat feat of SS...tis getting late.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Im still waiting for a combat feat of SS...tis getting late. Did you read exiles?

Originally posted by quanchi112
When was it stated?

What particular instance are you referring to?



Of the top of my head he makes a round trip from Saturn to the Sun in seconds, approximated this feat puts him at well above 1000 times the speed of light. Also he moved from Saturn to the Earth in seconds given that light takes about 20 minutes to get from these two planetoids it would put Superman's speed at roughly over a 100 times the speed of light.

The first feat put's his speed at thousands of times the speed of light. He's also moved from Earth across twenty galaxies in hours, putting his speed well well above the 100x light year range and closer to hundreds of thousands the speed of light.

Originally posted by Allankles
Of the top of my head he makes a round trip from Saturn to the Sun in seconds, calculate this feat puts him at well above 1000 times the speed of light. Also he moved from Saturn to the Earth in seconds given that light takes about 20 minutes to get from these two planetoids it would put Superman's speed at roughly over a 100 times the speed of light.

The first feat put's his speed at thousands of times the speed of light. He's also moved from Earth across twenty galaxies in hours, putting his speed well well above the 100x light year range and closer to hundreds of thousands the speed of light. Was it mentioned as seconds?

That is travel speed anyways. Glads is much faster than Supes. He couldnt keep up with Prime at the speed of light.

I see you have no proof at all.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Was it mentioned as seconds?

That is travel speed anyways. Glads is much faster than Supes. He couldnt keep up with Prime at the speed of light.

I see you have no proof at all.

I think it was stated in minutes, but regardless its still beyond FTL speeds. Besides why does ir matter if he couldnt tag prime...SMP>>>SS so its mutable. Still waiting a combat scan.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Was it mentioned as seconds?

The round trip with Saturn was mentioned as seconds, it was JLA 52 0R 51. His trips across 20 galaxies (Rao is at least 20 galaxies away) have been described as taking hours for him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That is travel speed anyways. Glads is much faster than Supes. He couldnt keep up with Prime at the speed of light.

I see you have no proof at all.

Right!! Despite feats indicating he's moved well above your 100x light speed Glads example.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
I think it was stated in minutes, but regardless its still beyond FTL speeds. Besides why does ir matter if he couldnt tag prime...SMP>>>SS so its mutable. Still waiting a combat scan. I have seen the Surfer fly faster than Prime. Surfer can catch someone going at the speed of light.

Why would I show you a combat scan when you havent posted anything showing Superman fighting anywhere past the speed of sound.

Originally posted by Allankles
The round trip with Saturn was mentioned as seconds, it was JLA 52 0R 51. His trips across 20 galaxies (Rao is at least 20 galaxies away) have been described as taking hours for him.



Right!! Despite feats indicating he's moved well above your 100x light speed Glads example. Scans?


You havent even figured out how fast 100 times the speed of light is. You just throw out feats that for all I know you made up.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Scans?


You havent even figured out how fast 100 times the speed of light is. You just throw out feats that for all I know you made up.

Ha! Saturn to the sun is about 30 light minutes (you can wiki it) and I gave you a reference JLA 51 52. He made a round trip in seconds this puts his speed at over 1000 times the speed of light.

I find it funny how Superman is so slow that you have to do the math of how fast you would really think he is.

SS is so fast Marvel actually post his speed and shows how fast he is going.

People keep saying Superman went over the speed of light by so much. Can some one even show me a scan of Superman going light speed? From what I see its assumptions.

Originally posted by The Great Galen
Im still waiting for a combat feat of SS...tis getting late.
HOw about a scan clearly specifying and depicting superman fighting( actually intiating attacks) at anywhere close to the speeds u have been claiming?

Originally posted by kakuzu
I find it funny how Superman is so slow that you have to do the math of how fast you would really think he is.

SS is so fast Marvel actually post his speed and shows how fast he is going.

People keep saying Superman went over the speed of light by so much. Can some one even show me a scan of Superman going light speed? From what I see its assumptions.

That's why we have mathematics. Superman has for instance escaped black holes which need ftl speeds to escape. We also have veritable facts on the distance between planetoids, there's no assuming on my part. We have evidence on the distance between our galaxy and the nearest ones, given that places like Oa and Rao are several galaxies away and given that Rao is at least 20 galaxies away, we know that Supes is easily surpassing the speed of light.

Originally posted by kakuzu

SS is so fast Marvel actually post his speed and shows how fast he is going.



That's just narrative license it has nothing to do with SS's speed specifically. We know Supes goes FTL, he has stated he moves FTL and has deliberately propelled himself at FTL given certain circumstances, narrators don't have redundantly mention he's going FTL when he is traversing galaxies on his own power and doing it hours or minutes. If you know the relative distances between galaxies you'd know such speed is well over thousands of times light speed.

EDIT: Now if SS has better travel feats that's all well and good, but travel speed doesn't translate to combat speed. We know this because none of these chracters have actually fought another character at light speed and because (especially for Superman) he is mostly fighting around planets and he consciously avoids approaching ftl speeds because of the damage he'd cause, he's stated this before, he even slows down further in populated regions.

Okay but I can post pictures of SS fighting using speed and also flying use of course speed.

You have to assume how fast Superman is going. That doesn't count. Its either you post a scan that clearly states he is goign 100 times the speed of light or you don't. I don't want to see you or others try to use mathematics for something like this.

It would be okay if you tried math in this. If you tried only math on Supermans side and say he would even stand a chance against SS then thats just biased.

So please show me proof. No more assumptions. If you keep assuming I shall assume Wolverine can lift well over 100 tons because he fought Hulk and I shall assume Wolverine can fire powerful blast because he stood up to Thanos and Thor.

Originally posted by Allankles
That's just narrative license it has nothing to do with SS's speed specifically. We know Supes goes FTL, he has stated he moves FTL and has deliberately propelled himself at FTL given certain circumstances, narrators don't have redundantly mention he's going FTL when he is traversing galaxies on his own power and doing it hours or minutes. If you know the relative distances between galaxies you'd know such speed is well over thousands of times light speed.

EDIT: Now if SS has better travel feats that's all well and good, but travel speed doesn't translate to combat speed. We know this because none of these chracters have actually fought another character at light speed and because (especially for Superman) he is mostly fighting around planets and he consciously avoids approaching ftl speeds because of the damage he'd cause, he's stated this before, he even slows down further in populated regions.

I agree, but some posters are dubiously trying to pass off sues fighting SS at light speed as a viable tactic without providng any useful evidence to support it.

Originally posted by kakuzu


So please show me proof. No more assumptions. If you keep assuming I shall assume Wolverine can lift well over 100 tons because he fought Hulk and I shall assume Wolverine can fire powerful blast because he stood up to Thanos and Thor.

Those are not the same thing fighting has nothing to do with the specific strength of those characters. I don't have to be stronger or similar in strength with you to fight you.

Distance and time on the other hand are definitive measures (not assumptions), markers to make unbiased calculations. There's no assuming on my part, narrative license here does not eliminate the cold, hard unbiased evidence which - through the unbiased practice of mathematics - demonstrates that Supes has traveled faster than 100x ftl.

Also this has nothing to do with SS or the fight. I was bringing up evidence of Superman evidently moving faster than Glads. And I already gave you a reference JLA 51, i believe.