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Ok,

Me and my brother had a little argument on this one.

IMO, There is nothing that Superman can do to the Silver Surfer that SS Can't do back here.

I give SS the edge on this one.

Simply because, IMO, If the SS is at FULL POWER.
This means he has FULL control over the POWER COSMIC!!!

Also, he most likely could DRAIN Superman of his Solar Powers.

What is your opinion?

how do u define full power superman??for me..that golden one is a full power superman..

Originally posted by SouthSpawn
Ok,

Me and my brother had a little argument on this one.

IMO, There is nothing that Superman can do to the Silver Surfer that SS Can't do back here.

I give SS the edge on this one.

Simply because, IMO, If the SS is at FULL POWER.
This means he has FULL control over the POWER COSMIC!!!

Also, he most likely could DRAIN Superman of his Solar Powers.

What is your opinion?

This has been done a million times, use the search function. but in general, surfer takes the majority due to superman having some very well known exploitable weaknesses (red solar and kryptonite radiation) that surfer can easily reproduce.

Cosmic awareness means surfer knows about said weaknesses in microseconds.

on the flip side, surfer doesn't really have any achilles heels for supes to use against him.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
This has been done a million times, use the search function. but in general, surfer takes the majority due to superman having some very well known exploitable weaknesses (red solar and kryptonite radiation) that surfer can easily reproduce.

Cosmic awareness means surfer knows about said weaknesses in microseconds.

on the flip side, surfer doesn't really have any achilles heels for supes to use against him. Well said and I agree 100%.

Isn't there a Superman who in the future reaches the full potential of his power (after spending like a thousand years inside a yellow sun) and becomes immune to both Kyptonite and effects of Red Sun radiation?

The only versions of Superman that could defeat SS are: PC Supes, Golden Superman, Superman 1M, and composite Superman.

Originally posted by GahLakTus
Isn't there a Superman who in the future reaches the full potential of his power (after spending like a thousand years inside a yellow sun) and becomes immune to both Kyptonite and effects of Red Sun radiation?

you're thinking of the version of superman that appeared in DC 1 million. That version of superman had no on panel feats of his own. (the only thing he DID do was crush an already beaten solaris with a lantern ring.)

despite his time in the sun, there was still a VERY real concern by everyone present that Kryptonite would kill him- in fact Vandal Savage and Solaris themselves conspired to kill him by firing what they THOUGHT was a large kryptonite projectile into the heart of the sun. They succeeded, but that "kyptonite" was actually a disguised lantern ring.

Theres no source anywhere that says that version of superman was immune to kryptonite.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
despite his time in the sun, there was still a VERY real concern by everyone present that Kryptonite would kill him- in fact Vandal Savage and Solaris themselves conspired to kill him by firing what they THOUGHT was a large kryptonite projectile into the heart of the sun. They succeeded, but that "kyptonite" was actually a disguised lantern ring.

While it was never stated, KC Supes was practically immune to kryptonite because he had been under the sun for too long(a good 20 more years than current Superman), Golden Superman spent 16,000 years in the core of the sun, so I have to say I doubt kryptonite would work on him.

Originally posted by Surtur
The only versions of Superman that could defeat SS are: PC Supes, Golden Superman, Superman 1M, and composite Superman.

PC superman is even worse off than REGULAR superman is, due to the existence of gold kryptonite in the PC continuity. Gold kryptonite will IMMEDIATELY, PERMANENTLY depower superman into a regular human.

If you're thinking "well, PC supes could still hit him first or something" remember that surfer has top speeds hundreds of times faster than lightspeed but can also go intangible or shrink to submicroscopic size and wreck superman from the inside.

"golden" superman from DC 1 million is still vulnerable to kryptonite.

Superman 1 million still stores solar energy from the super sun in his cells like a battery- punching through a temporal distortion in DC 1 million drained him so badly he turned into an old man and nearly died. Surfer can EASILY just rip the damn energy out of him forcibly and do the same thing.

composite superman I have no idea about though.

Originally posted by Surtur
While it was never stated, KC Supes was practically immune to kryptonite because he had been under the sun for too long(a good 20 more years than current Superman), Golden Superman spent 16,000 years in the core of the sun, so I have to say I doubt kryptonite would work on him.

uh, it was stated by solaris- a stellar supercomputer who had fought that version of superman before and who should know better that kryptonite WOULD kill him. in fact, not only was solaris convinced, so was every DC hero present.

did you read DC 1 million? it's pretty obvious that the plan is to kill superman by firing a kryptonite bullet into the sun. If that "wouldn't work", why was everyone involved panicked as hell about letting that happen?

edit: KC superman isn't relevant, since KC superman is an alternate version, much like the superman of earth-2 or superboy. different versions of kryptonite effect different kryptonians differently.

The GOLDEN superman is the mainstream continuity superman, just further into that earth's future.

norrin

Originally posted by Space M ummy
PC superman is even worse off than REGULAR superman is, due to the existence of gold kryptonite in the PC continuity. Gold kryptonite will IMMEDIATELY, PERMANENTLY depower superman into a regular human.

If you're thinking "well, PC supes could still hit him first or something" remember that surfer has top speeds hundreds of times faster than lightspeed but can also go intangible or shrink to submicroscopic size and wreck superman from the inside.

PC Supes can still hit him first. He is much faster than Surfer, he could beat him to death before he pulled out an offense. Thanos beat Surfer to death, and it took him less than 15 punches. PC Supes being vastly stronger than Thanos and fast enough to blitz surfer gives him the win.



Which was never actually shown.



Well admittingly he has the smallest chance out of all whom I mentioned.


As for composite Superman..he has the combined powers of 3 pc kryptonians..plus the powers of the legion..which among other things will allow him to split into 3 equally powered giant versions of himself.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
uh, it was stated by solaris- a stellar supercomputer who had fought that version of superman before and who should know better that kryptonite WOULD kill him. in fact, not only was solaris convinced, so was every DC hero present.

did you read DC 1 million? it's pretty obvious that the plan is to kill superman by firing a kryptonite bullet into the sun. If that "wouldn't work", why was everyone involved panicked as hell about letting that happen?

Yes, I did read it. Wasn't it said at the end that golden superman had been behind the fake kryptonite? That he did it so that Solaris would drop its guard?

Here,from wiki:

It is then revealed that a secret conspiracy - forewarned by the trouble in the 20th century, mainly in that Huntress, inspired by the time capsules students in her class were currently making, realized they had centuries to foil the plot- has spent the intervening centuries coming up with a foolproof plan for stopping Solaris. Their actions included replacing the hidden kryptonite with a disguised Green Lantern ring - with which the original Superman emerges from the sun and finishes Solaris.



I know its a diff superman, my point was if he can become immune after 20 years, it isn't a big leap for Supes to become immune after thousands of years in the sun.

Also stuff like even current Superman being able to shrug off nukes while surrounded by kryptonite..being able to survive going through a red sun even though he was dragged through a field of kryptonite right before that..it shows he's built up a bit of a resistance



I'm aware.

Originally posted by Surtur
PC Supes can still hit him first. He is much faster than Surfer, he could beat him to death before he pulled out an offense.

read what I posted again. surfer has top speeds exceeding lightspeeed by hundreds of times, and reaction times in the nanosecond range. speedblitzing him is nearly impossible.

Given that, Surfer's DEFENSE is superior to superman's in that he can simply will himself intangible or shrink down to submicroscopic size to avoid superman's assault.

Cosmic awareness means that surfer instantly knows all of superman's abilities and weaknesses, but the opposite isn't true. Superman, even PC superman, is at a disadvantage.




not shown, I'll give you- but assumed to be the case by solaris, who was inarguably the most intelligent person present, had been formulating the plan over thousands of years, and had fought that version of superman before. It's a reasonable assumption then that K-nite will have an effect, since EVERYONE in that comic assumed it to be the case.

There's no scan anywhere that says that version of superman is immune to kryptonite. That's pure forum speculation based on KC superman who was "becoming" immune, and ignoring earth-2 superman who was of a similar age and NOT immune.



That version of superman would likely have an edge then, though there's still the possibility that he might still lose, given the existence/abilities of gold-k which permanently depower PC kryptonians.

Originally posted by Surtur
Yes, I did read it. Wasn't it said at the end that golden superman had been behind the fake kryptonite? That he did it so that Solaris would drop its guard?

The tricking of solaris was a joint effort, thought up by batman and MM, I think.

If superman was simply immune, why would you need to take the only remaining lantern ring (as was the case then), disguise it as kryptonite, and hide it for thousands of years in an attempt to fool solaris?

using real kryptonite would have been just as effective in getting solaris to "drop it's guard." Again, NOWHERE does it say that version of superman is immune to kryptonite. In fact it says the opposite. a kryptonite bullet into the sun will kill that superman.



it IS a big leap, since it's a different superman entirely. kryptonite doesn't work at all on superboy prime, and PC superman has an entire range of kryptonites (gold, blue, etc) that work on him, but not any of the other supermen. The Kal-L of earth 2 is also still vulnerable to kryptonite even though he's of a similar age as KC superman, though as he notes, he's not vulnerable to the K-nite of earth-1.



resistance isn't immunity.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
read what I posted again. surfer has top speeds exceeding lightspeeed by hundreds of times, and reaction times in the nanosecond range. speedblitzing him is nearly impossible.

Dude you don't get how insanely fast PC Supes was. He was fast enough to cross the entire universe in the blink of an eye. He was going so fast he was breaking down dimensional barriers and threatening the multi-verse to the point spectre had to stop him. He could casually go back in time on speed alone as a baby.

Surfer can move at hundreds of times the speed of light? Current Superman can fly that fast in space.

As insane as it sounds, PC Supes can blitz surfer.



He needs to consciously do all that, he won't have time. PC Supes is vastly faster.



Superman doesn't need to know his weaknesses, surfer can be physically beat to death..so thats all he needs to do.




Read my other post, it was a conspiracy or something, all set up to stop Solaris.



Except this guy would be 3 times stronger and faster than a pc kryptonian, which means surfer gets blitzed and his head punched off in the first nanosecond. He'd also have planetary level transmutation powers and could turn any gold k created into something harmless at speeds too fast for Surfer to react.

He could then use his legion powers to blast his own body with yellow sun radiation, thus amping himself even more..not that he'd need it.

Originally posted by Surtur
Dude you don't get how insanely fast PC Supes was. He was fast enough to cross the entire universe in the blink of an eye.

I know exactly how fast superman is, but you seem to be underrating the surfer. here's a scan from the first page of the respect thread- which you don't seem to have read- surfer traveling a HALF MILLION light years, in seconds.

part 1

part 2



and surfer can travel back in time or across dimensions under his own power any time he wishes. your point?



I gave you a lowball figure. see above where surfer travels 500,000 lightyears in seconds. current superman is nowhere near that, and any difference in speed between the two is so slight as to be negligible, if not an outright advantage to surfer.



eventually you're going to have to back up this lunacy with hard scans, and it's not going to go well.



given that I've already put a serious hole in your "supes is faster" theory, surfer's reaction times are just as good as his travel speed. we're talking micro and nanoseconds to not only formulate, but react.

you're not blitzing the surfer without MASSIVE PIS.



physically beating to death an intagible object that's as fast or faster than you would be quite a feat.



it was a conspiracy known only to about three people. Everyone else in the known universe assumed superman was still vulnerable to kryptonite, including those who had fought with him, against him, and gained their powers FROM him. Again, if you're going to keep claiming he's immune, start backing it up with scans rather than flawed speculation.



Gold K immediately and permanently depowers kryptonians. getting hit with the radiation in any form (which surfer could emit in a variety of ways, from blasting him with it to turning to entire battlefield into it) would be an instant and permanent loss of kryptonian powers. and don't get me started on how good surfer's transmutation and matter manipulation abilities are.



see above. there's no coming back from a Gold K depowering. it's permanent. That being said, composite superman is a big question mark.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
I know exactly how fast superman is, but you seem to be underrating the surfer. here's a scan from the first page of the respect thread- which you don't seem to have read- surfer traveling a HALF MILLION light years, in seconds.

You don't seem to get it, half a million lightyears in seconds does not even begin to compare to crossing the entire universe in seconds. It doesn't compare to his feat with the Spectre.




Point was he could do it as a baby and has only grown more powerful



PC supes is vastlyfasterthan 500,000 light-years in seconds. Sorry, he threatened the multi-verse with his speed and crossed the universe in seconds, that is a lot more than 500,000 light years.




Go look in the pc kryptonian respect thread, it's all there. Surfer is not faster than PC supes.




You haven't put a hole in it though. You don't seem to understand that 500,000 lightyears in seconds is extremely fast, but it doesn't compare to crossing the universe in seconds or going so fast you nearly break into heaven.



You just need a massive speed advantage, which Superman has.



Except he won't be going intangible, he'll literally be down in 1-2 punches. Thanos downed him in a little over a dozen punches, Superman being vastly stronger and faster than Thanos? Surfer won't even be able to think "go intangible" before he is knocked out.



What I'm saying is that we don't know if he's immune or not. So the whole kryptonite angle might not get surfer the win. You do know its moot anyways? Seeing how large a boost Superman gets from going in the sun for a few seconds, with 16,000 years in the sun he's going to beat the hell out of the surfer before he even forms a thought process.




I just meant if he tried to turn objects into gold k it wouldn't be the best bet. Still, against someone who is 3 times faster than pc supes? it won't matter how much kryptonite surfer can create. Also composite supes has mon'el's powers, which means green k wouldn't completely strip away his powers, and with the other legionnaires powers as well the lead weakness wouldn't be an issue.




I wasn't saying use yellow sun radiation to give himself powers back, but as long as he has his powers he could use it to amp himself.

Originally posted by Space M ummy
This has been done a million times, use the search function. but in general, surfer takes the majority due to superman having some very well known exploitable weaknesses (red solar and kryptonite radiation) that surfer can easily reproduce.

Cosmic awareness means surfer knows about said weaknesses in microseconds.

on the flip side, surfer doesn't really have any achilles heels for supes to use against him. ^yeah that


and even if SS fought Supe fair & square (without using Supe's weaknesses) he'd still win. both got similar strength & speed but SS's invulnaribility is a notch above the likes of Supe, not to mention SS has far more offensive options

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
^yeah that


and even if SS fought Supe fair & square (without using Supe's weaknesses) he'd still win. both got similar strength & speed but SS's invulnaribility is a notch above the likes of Supe, not to mention SS has far more offensive options

Originally posted by Space M ummy
you're thinking of the version of superman that appeared in DC 1 million. That version of superman had no on panel feats of his own. (the only thing he DID do was crush an already beaten solaris with a lantern ring.)

despite his time in the sun, there was still a VERY real concern by everyone present that Kryptonite would kill him- in fact Vandal Savage and Solaris themselves conspired to kill him by firing what they THOUGHT was a large kryptonite projectile into the heart of the sun. They succeeded, but that "kyptonite" was actually a disguised lantern ring.

Theres no source anywhere that says that version of superman was immune to kryptonite. They THOUGHT it might, however it wasn't just the rock, it was poisoning his power source they thought might, however it's still conjecture.

Originally posted by Juntai
They THOUGHT it might, however it wasn't just the rock, it was poisoning his power source they thought might, however it's still conjecture.

Agreed.

Either way, a "FULL" power Surfer is an insane one who can't control his power as absorbing a portion of a sun drove him nearly insane and down to dumb Hulk levels of intelligence.

Meanwhile, Supes in current continuity absorbed a full sun with a smile and has no limits to his power set if we go into the DC 1 Million storyline. IE. He can power his heralds to levels far above Surfer easily.

Supes for the win.

surfer easy

Composite Superman isn't really a different version of Supes. But an entirely different being. Like Ultraman.

Anywho, he'd whip Surfer's ass. So would 1M. And Superboy Prime has a good shot. Most, if not all other versions of Superman, should go down to a FP Surfer.

Man I can see that this is gonna turn into the usual.

Originally posted by Nihilist
surfer easy

Originally posted by Avlon
Agreed.

Either way, a "FULL" power Surfer is an insane one who can't control his power as absorbing a portion of a sun drove him nearly insane and down to dumb Hulk levels of intelligence.
Didn't Superman basically kill himself (to later reform) after dipping in the sun less than 15 years ago?

---

Anyway, this thread doesn't make any sense. There is no upper limit on panel shown to either combatant.

Pick your favorite... that's what everyone else is doing.

What do you mean by Full power?

Superman has stronger/more powerful incarnation in the future.

Surfer does not(or at least not big noticeable change to his powers)

Originally posted by kgkg
What do you mean by Full power?

Superman has stronger/more powerful incarnation in the future.

Surfer does not(or at least not big noticeable change to his powers)

At "full power" Surfer became one with the universe.

Originally posted by Enyalus
At "full power" Surfer became one with the universe. That doesn't count as anything close to Surfer's potential.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Didn't Superman basically kill himself (to later reform) after dipping in the sun less than 15 years ago?

What are you talking about?


Originally posted by Red Hulk
Anyway, this thread doesn't make any sense. There is no upper limit on panel shown to either combatant.

Pick your favorite... that's what everyone else is doing.

An upper limit has been shown to one, while another has been shown (at least in the future that's being reffered to) to have none.

You're right though in that this thread makes little sense.

Originally posted by kgkg
What do you mean by Full power?

Superman has stronger/more powerful incarnation in the future.

Surfer does not(or at least not big noticeable change to his powers)

As Keeper he had a pretty decent upgrade though.

Too bad that doesn't count in this thread though.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
That doesn't count as anything close to Surfer's potential.

Yeah, I know that. Neither should entities like Superman Prime from 1M, though. Who traversed the multiverse and received various upgrades from the ends of space, etc.

Originally posted by Avlon
What are you talking about?




An upper limit has been shown to one, while another has been shown (at least in the future that's being reffered to) to have none.

You're right though in that this thread makes little sense. Superman ended up turning into a skeleton after he sun dipped if I recall correctly. He needed to control his powers, something Surfer didn't have time to do.

No it hasn't. 15 years ago Surfer might have held this limit (although I'm sure I can find something to rule this out), but during that time and now, Surfer has absorbed enough energy to defeat a universal level being, and the side effects have torn straight through a bunch of planets.
As well as it being a low showing in the sense that Surfer was KO'ed by a planet exploding, basically.

No shit. What is full power Surfer or Superman?

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Superman ended up turning into a skeleton after he sun dipped if I recall correctly. He needed to control his powers, something Surfer didn't have time to do.

I have no idea what you're referring to. I know he's gone into the sun as a near skeleton and come out fully powered though...


Originally posted by Red Hulk
No it hasn't. 15 years ago Surfer might have held this limit (although I'm sure I can find something to rule this out), but during that time and now, Surfer has absorbed enough energy to defeat a universal level being, and the side effects have torn straight through a bunch of planets.
As well as it being a low showing in the sense that Surfer was KO'ed by a planet exploding, basically.
You forgot none of this was clean (he needed help/plot device) and none of it was stated to be kept/mentioned again. You're welcome to try and disprove it, but something to that effect would probably already be in his respect threads.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
No shit. What is full power Surfer or Superman?

A fanboy's dream?

Originally posted by Avlon
I have no idea what you're referring to. I know he's gone into the sun as a near skeleton and come out fully powered though...



You forgot none of this was clean (he needed help/plot device) and none of it was stated to be kept/mentioned again. You're welcome to try and disprove it, but something to that effect would probably already be in his respect threads.



A fanboy's dream? The infamous sundip when he pushed Imperiex into the Boomtube. He couldn't handle it, when he first got the powers.

Oh, OK. He had a piece of the Blackbody that was inside him that never left his body, and never needs to be mentioned again if it's permanent, and minor. Hell, it was barely mentioned in the story arc.
No it wouldn't, and it doesn't need to be either to be fact. Although, in the respect thread the Blackbody piece was never stated to have left his body... so what should I be looking for here?

Originally posted by Red Hulk
The infamous sundip when he pushed Imperiex into the Boomtube. He couldn't handle it, when he first got the powers.

Superman set his mind on killing mode for B13 (which is something that goes against his ENTIRE being) and finds Imperiex is still alive thus confusing him temporarily.

Sundipping did nothing to Superman's mental state. Forum myth.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Oh, OK. He had a piece of the Blackbody that was inside him that never left his body, and never needs to be mentioned again if it's permanent, and minor. Hell, it was barely mentioned in the story arc.

Proof? It could be said that Superman never lost the magic immunity that Phantom Stranger gave him since it was never said that he lost it either.

The BB was a plot device that was used for that story (since there was no way SS was going to win without it) and has never been mentioned/seen again.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
No it wouldn't, and it doesn't need to be either to be fact. Although, in the respect thread the Blackbody piece was never stated to have left his body... so what should I be looking for here?

Something that said he kept said upgrade? Let's not play semantic games. We all know (hopefully) that such things tend to come up in later storylines specifically.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Didn't Superman basically kill himself (to later reform) after dipping in the sun less than 15 years ago?

---

Anyway, this thread doesn't make any sense. There is no upper limit on panel shown to either combatant.

Pick your favorite... that's what everyone else is doing. LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's what I mean !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm staying out of this one! I've already learned in my short time on KMC that when someone's mind is made up, it's made up. I've tried in the past to analyze this stuff unbiasedly, but someone always finds a low showing scan or something. And the majority of the time, no one wants to involve character bios unless it supports their point so this could be another endless one.

Originally posted by Avlon
Superman set his mind on killing mode for B13 (which is something that goes against his ENTIRE being) and finds Imperiex is still alive thus confusing him temporarily.

Sundipping did nothing to Superman's mental state. Forum myth. OK.

I'm going off memory, and I never said that anyway.
For about the same amount of time or so that Surfer had his power, Superman went mad and turned into a skeleton if I recall correctly.
You have the issue within reach I bet, confirm or deny.


Originally posted by Avlon
Proof? It could be said that Superman never lost the magic immunity that Phantom Stranger gave him since it was never said that he lost it either.

The BB was a plot device that was used for that story (since there was no way SS was going to win without it) and has never been mentioned/seen again. How am I supposed to prove that he didn't lose it? It never left his body on-panel. Should I post the comic on panel, and every page from every comic that Surfer appears in afterwards? Also, the Black Body was only said to be the purpose for Surfer managing to take the power away, not for withholding the power... if you want to get technical...

Good, then Superman is immune to magic, unless we see him fail against it. Relevance to Surfer, or thread (because I know Surfer doesn't use magic)?



Originally posted by Avlon
Something that said he kept said upgrade? Let's not play semantic games. We all know (hopefully) that such things tend to come up in later storylines specifically. No they don't. Not always anyway, especially when it's an arc in the main series (especially Surfer's main series...). Just because something isn't brought up again, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. That's as bad as logic as you're trying to play to me.

Originally posted by Enyalus
At "full power" Surfer became one with the universe. I know you kidding around but

that was not Surfer's Power ie he will not someday become a Universe it was given as a temporarily by the LT.

While Superman will get Stronger and Faster as we have seen Superman of the Future ie SuperBoy , S1mil , Prime etc.

The strongest version of Surfer i can think of is Surfer with QBand but even that his not his "own" power.

Originally posted by kgkg
While Superman will get Stronger and Faster as we have seen Superman of the Future ie SuperBoy , S1mil , Prime etc.

The strongest version of Surfer i can think of is Surfer with QBand but even that his not his "own" power.

Um, 1M is a distant, distant, distant descendent of Current Supes, with 5th D Imp DNA in him. Hardly his "own" power either. The other "incarnations" of Supes you mention share similiar problems.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Um, 1M is a distant, distant, distant descendent of Current Supes, with 5th D Imp DNA in him. Hardly his "own" power either. The other "incarnations" of Supes you mention share similiar problems.
Thats not 100% true. Superman 1 Million is a decendent. His father was also a "Superman". His mother have (for example) magic immunity which would be passed down to Superman 1 Million. So after so many genes passing down Superman 1 million became very powerful, but its all his power, that he god thanks to his....ancestors.

Superman Prime on the other hand is all his power. His Will, his power, his knownledge...everything

Originally posted by Red Hulk
OK.

I'm going off memory, and I never said that anyway.
For about the same amount of time or so that Surfer had his power, Superman went mad and turned into a skeleton if I recall correctly.
You have the issue within reach I bet, confirm or deny.

I don't remember the part where it's my job to prove your claim for you.


Originally posted by Red Hulk
How am I supposed to prove that he didn't lose it? It never left his body on-panel. Should I post the comic on panel, and every page from every comic that Surfer appears in afterwards? Also, the Black Body was only said to be the purpose for Surfer managing to take the power away, not for withholding the power... if you want to get technical...

If you can't prove it, then don't (especially since it doesn't exist and is pure speculation) make the claim. Simple logic me thinks.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Good, then Superman is immune to magic, unless we see him fail against it. Relevance to Surfer, or thread (because I know Surfer doesn't use magic)?

Upgrade. Never shown to be taken away. Not difficult to understand the comparison. Both would be faulty to use in a debate...

Originally posted by Red Hulk
No they don't. Not always anyway, especially when it's an arc in the main series (especially Surfer's main series...). Just because something isn't brought up again, doesn't mean it doesn't exist. That's as bad as logic as you're trying to play to me.

So it's logical to you to use something that's used once, in which by your admission is barely mentioned in it's own story, and never brought up again or proven as it's nothing but PURE SPECULATION.

Standing ovation for that particular logic.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Composite Superman isn't really a different version of Supes. But an entirely different being. Like Ultraman.

Anywho, he'd whip Surfer's ass. So would 1M. And Superboy Prime has a good shot. Most, if not all other versions of Superman, should go down to a FP Surfer.
I am shocked You actually are on Superman's side for once

Originally posted by Avlon
I don't remember the part where it's my job to prove your claim for you. I don't remember where I said it was your job. Reading comprehension is key.

I merely asked you to confirm or deny something because I know you have the issue probably close. Which would take a quick flip through the book. No scans required.
You're the one who said this:
"Superman set his mind on killing mode for B13 (which is something that goes against his ENTIRE being) and finds Imperiex is still alive thus confusing him temporarily.

Sundipping did nothing to Superman's mental state. Forum myth."

You obviously think you know the specifics, so why wouldn't I ask you to take a quick flip through a f*cking issue?

Also, I'm just merely discussing it, or was, I thought I could get a civil response but apparently not as... what? Are you butthurt or something that somebody disagreed with what you said? I was trying to make it a simple discussion (asking questions... discussing), but apparently you think being a dick is the better option.



Originally posted by Avlon
If you can't prove it, then don't (especially since it doesn't exist and is pure speculation) make the claim. Simple logic me thinks. If I had to prove it, I'd have to post every issue featuring Surfer that came after that arc.

How is it pure speculation that it never left his body? Can you explain this one?
No wait... it's not your job.



Originally posted by Avlon
Upgrade. Never shown to be taken away. Not difficult to understand the comparison. Both would be faulty to use in a debate... Except one is relevant to the thread where the other is just bringing up a random encounter... where it failed anyway:

"Proof? It could be said that Superman never lost the magic immunity that Phantom Stranger gave him since it was never said that he lost it either."

"Good, then Superman is immune to magic, unless we see him fail against it."

Lulz

Thing is, I don't give a shit what you want to use in another debate. If it hasn't been taken away, or contradicted, then it sticks.


Originally posted by Avlon
So it's logical to you to use something that's used once, in which by your admission is barely mentioned in it's own story, and never brought up again or proven as it's nothing but PURE SPECULATION.

Standing ovation for that particular logic. If it's barely mentioned in its own story, then why would it be mentioned in others, was my point. That's the reason why I put brackets a lot (for people to know what I'm talking about), but I thought you'd be smart enough to figure it out (apparently not).

Yes, it's pure speculation that it never left his body.
Are you serious with that logic?

Although, if we're pointing out faulty logic, why not start with completely ignoring something just because it was only happened in the story it pertained to? Would implants go away just because no one brought up that they were implants?

'it not mentioned! it not anymore!'

That's what I see, so I find it funny how you're the one to point out faulty logic. If my logic is faulty, then what's yours?

---

Anyway, this is dumb at best. A simple question, and pointing out something gets turned into this.

This now semi-argument is over on my behalf.

Originally posted by SouthSpawn
Ok,

Me and my brother had a little argument on this one.

IMO, There is nothing that Superman can do to the Silver Surfer that SS Can't do back here.

I give SS the edge on this one.

Simply because, IMO, If the SS is at FULL POWER.
This means he has FULL control over the POWER COSMIC!!!

Also, he most likely could DRAIN Superman of his Solar Powers.

What is your opinion?

full power surfer and superman? full power superman would be the gold guy imo and full power surfer would be ummm.....the keeper??

Originally posted by Red Hulk
I don't remember where I said it was your job. Reading comprehension is key.

Reading comprehension. Good choice of words. Don't guesstimate and read the actual issue you are referring to.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
I merely asked you to confirm or deny something because I know you have the issue probably close. Which would take a quick flip through the book. No scans required.

You ASSumed. On top of that, you don't know the specifics or the example of if it even exists, so why would I know?

"In some issue somewhere, this may have or have not happened."

Originally posted by Red Hulk
You're the one who said this:
"Superman set his mind on killing mode for B13 (which is something that goes against his ENTIRE being) and finds Imperiex is still alive thus confusing him temporarily.

Sundipping did nothing to Superman's mental state. Forum myth."

Originally posted by Red Hulk
You obviously think you know the specifics, so why wouldn't I ask you to take a quick flip through a f*cking issue?

I know it very well, they come up more than enough. Thanks though.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Also, I'm just merely discussing it, or was, I thought I could get a civil response but apparently not as... what? Are you butthurt or something that somebody disagreed with what you said? I was trying to make it a simple discussion (asking questions... discussing), but apparently you think being a dick is the better option.

Tsk tsk..feelings, feelings.



Originally posted by Red Hulk
If I had to prove it, I'd have to post every issue featuring Surfer that came after that arc.

If you say so...

Originally posted by Red Hulk
How is it pure speculation that it never left his body? Can you explain this one?
No wait... it's not your job.

Your claim, remember? Oh that's right..there is no proof or mention of it ever again.



Originally posted by Red Hulk
Except one is relevant to the thread where the other is just bringing up a random encounter... where it failed anyway:

"Proof? It could be said that Superman never lost the magic immunity that Phantom Stranger gave him since it was never said that he lost it either."

"Good, then Superman is immune to magic, unless we see him fail against it."

Lulz

Similar examples. If you want to turn a blind eye to it. Won't bother me.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Thing is, I don't give a shit what you want to use in another debate. If it hasn't been taken away, or contradicted, then it sticks.

And I don't give a shit what you give a shit about.


Originally posted by Red Hulk
If it's barely mentioned in its own story, then why would it be mentioned in others, was my point. That's the reason why I put brackets a lot (for people to know what I'm talking about), but I thought you'd be smart enough to figure it out (apparently not).

Uhh...because you are making a claim that's unproven? Duh.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Yes, it's pure speculation that it never left his body.
Are you serious with that logic?

Without proof, you want to present something as evidence. Are you serious with that logic?


Originally posted by Red Hulk
Although, if we're pointing out faulty logic, why not start with completely ignoring something just because it was only happened in the story it pertained to? Would implants go away just because no one brought up that they were implants?

'it not mentioned! it not anymore!'

Just LOL @ this "logic"

Originally posted by Red Hulk
That's what I see, so I find it funny how you're the one to point out faulty logic. If my logic is faulty, then what's yours?

---

Pretty sound compared to what you're trying to piece together. "A plot device was used in once story, and though nothing has ever been said about it ever since, he must have it and thus it's usable in debates!

Brilliant.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
Anyway, this is dumb at best. A simple question, and pointing out something gets turned into this.

We agree on this.

Originally posted by Red Hulk
This now semi-argument is over on my behalf.

Thanks. I hope you are at peace now.