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Darkseid before ALE.
Current superman.
Thanos w/o any power gems.
Classic thor.

Team Two.

depend on match up.
I go with Team 2. Superman>DS
Thanos>thor

Either person on team two would be able to take either person on team one for the majority, matchups be damned.

T2

Originally posted by Enyalus
Either person on team two would be able to take either person on team one for the majority, matchups be damned.

Superman can take Darkseid for the majority?

Originally posted by Naija boy
Superman can take Darkseid for the majority?

No, because Darkseid can grow thousands of feet tall and hes never shown his true new god form and motherboxes can destroy the universe and boomtube will throw him into a red sun and darkseid has matter manipulation so he turns Supes suit into k-nite and and and...


...Yeah. He'd take the majority. He's Superman.

Originally posted by Enyalus
No, because Darkseid can grow thousands of feet tall and hes never shown his true new god form and motherboxes can destroy the universe and boomtube will throw him into a red sun and darkseid has matter manipulation so he turns Supes suit into k-nite and and and...


...Yeah. He'd take the majority. He's Superman.

See, you're trying to insult New God fans, but the problem is......everything you said in the first paragraph is true. shocklaugh

Darkseid would only lose to Superman in a fistfight with all other powers barred. Which is not a knock on DS, given that very very few people can beat Superman in a fistfight. Even your god Thanos would get smashed.

Darkseid uses his vast powerset and ends this easily. Boomtubes, Omega Effect, reality warp, etc, etc, etc.

And FC #5 actually PROVES that Darkseid's true form has never been seen, so your shit just got shut down. And it's far more than thousand of feet, given what happened.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
And it's far more than thousand of feet, given what happened.

I was referencing Countdown and the Jimmy/DS battle.

The rest of your post, I'm not touching.

Originally posted by Enyalus
No, because Darkseid can grow thousands of feet tall and hes never shown his true new god form and motherboxes can destroy the universe and boomtube will throw him into a red sun and darkseid has matter manipulation so he turns Supes suit into k-nite and and and...


...Yeah. He'd take the majority. He's Superman.

team 2 FTW..

Team 1 wins you people should listen to TP everyone here is outclassed. The New Gods are prime celestials at current levels DS is squeezing the multiverse into a singularity in which there's no escape. The ALE just makes him god by right of his will over life.

Originally posted by Allankles
Team 1 wins you people should listen to TP everyone here is outclassed.

And you should listen to the OP specifications. It says "Darkseid before ALE." Meaning him prior to having it. Which invalidates his "current levels" for this bout.

Originally posted by Enyalus
And you should listen to the OP specifications. It says "Darkseid before ALE." Meaning him prior to having it. Which invalidates his "current levels" for this bout.

I assumed DS without the ALE. DS at DONG, countdown levels is still more powerful than everyone on team 2. He has those shadow demons that seem to operate beyond physical laws.

Kind of leaning with team one......no, team two.

Originally posted by Allankles
I assumed DS without the ALE. DS at DONG, countdown levels is still more powerful than everyone on team 2. He has those shadow demons that seem to operate beyond physical laws.

He has the ALE for some of the DOTNG.

And I don't know wtf was up with him in Countdown. He was amped in some kind of way with the New Gods dying and them being stored in Jimmy, wasn't he? It was confusing.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid would only lose to Superman in a fistfight with all other powers barred. Or.... Would.... He?

http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1178703_ds3.jpg http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1178704_ds4.jpg

----

http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1178701_ds1.jpg http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1178702_ds2.jpg

Originally posted by Enyalus
And I don't know wtf was up with him in Countdown. He was amped in some kind of way with the New Gods dying and them being stored in Jimmy, wasn't he? It was confusing. No, that was 'standard' DS, iirc. At that point in the story he was still trying to extract the New God energies from Jimmy (which was the sole reason for their battle.)

Originally posted by Galan007
Or.... Would.... He?



BUT THAT WAS BEFORE SUPES UPGRADES HE IZ ALMOST PC LVLS NOW!!

...And in the second scan he had just been hit with Black Racer's blast and fought his way through parademons and Kalibak.

Originally posted by Enyalus
...And in the second scan he had just been hit with Black Racer's blast and fought his way through parademons and Kalibak. Which only seems to matter when it's convienent for Supes. Fkn fanboys.

uhuh

Originally posted by Galan007
Which only seems to matter when it's convienent for Supes. Fkn fanboys.

uhuh

Don't knock Supes, man. He takes down universal-level threats on a regular basis. He'd bench-press Darkseid's granite ass. Hell, Thanos might just sit back and watch him work his magic.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Don't knock Supes, man. He takes down universal-level threats on a regular basis. He'd bench-press Darkseid's granite ass. Hell, Thanos might just sit back and watch him work his magic. I'm thinking Thanos' reaction to Supes would be much like the robber's reaction was, here:

yn5pLc5LUho



uhuh

Originally posted by Galan007
I'm thinking Thanos' reaction to Supes would be much like the robber's reaction was, here:

uhuh

Bastard. That's blasphemy and you know it.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Bastard. That's blasphemy and you know it. galan_jesus








evillaugh

Originally posted by Enyalus
And you should listen to the OP specifications. It says "Darkseid before ALE." Meaning him prior to having it. Which invalidates his "current levels" for this bout.

Darkseid having the ALE or being current does not matter. His scale was the same even back then. The doomsday singularity was caused by his fall, which makes his true size the same back then as it is now. In other words, his powers and stature were the same and thus, he actually is that powerful and massive.

All Final Crisis did was confirm their true size and show that we have never seen it in our reality. Making all the past references to it true. Wonderworld, S'ivaa, the necessity of the boom tube.

you can dispute this with DS not being in his true form in this fight, but you can no longer dispute his true power.

^ you creamed yourself when you read FC didn't you?

You probably did first when you read Marvel: The End. uhuh

I notice you aren't disputing that I'm right.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
You probably did first when you read Marvel: The End. uhuh

I love Thanos and even I was like, "Oh, this shit is lame."

It was a poor read.

For some reason Thanos fanatics love it.

It's basically more proof that Starlin is a ****ing hack.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
It's basically more proof that Starlin is a ****ing hack.

Yo, don't talk bad about my man Starlin or I'll need to bring up everything Morrison wanks.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Yo, don't talk bad about my man Starlin or I'll need to bring up everything Morrison wanks.


ermm

orly Morrison is a ****ing genius writer, your boy is not only a hack, he wanks his favorites at the expense of others.

the proof is in the events and their story arcs. Morrison's are complex, rewarding and never try to spoon-feed you the plot. you actually have to think and connect the dots yourself.

Starlin's work is basically wanking a few characters and downgrading others, while being heavy-handed and unoriginal.

And Morrison also has better endings and dialogue. spliff

Morrison is a good writer, yes. But like Starlin, he overpowers everything and anything he gets his hands on.

like who? He's been remarkably accurate most of the time.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Yo, don't talk bad about my man Starlin or I'll need to bring up everything Morrison wanks. I do not much care for Morrison.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
like who? He's been remarkably accurate most of the time.

JLA, multiple Superman (including All-Star) runs, and now FC come to mind immediately. I could grab a list if you want.

team 2 wins

Team 1 with bfr.

Team 2 without.

Originally posted by Enyalus
JLA, multiple Superman (including All-Star) runs, and now FC come to mind immediately. I could grab a list if you want.

In FC the New Gods are much closer to Kirby's vision of these characters. They were larger than life characters with astonishing science which along with their mystical connection to the Source made them super gods.

It's a lot of inaccurate bs in titles like JLA through the last decade that has had them portrayed like super heroes and not the enormous celestial beings they are.

Team 2, only because of thanos.
Thor>Supes
Darkseid>Supes

Thanos>>ALL

Originally posted by carver9
Team 2, only because of thanos.
Thor>Supes
Darkseid>Supes

Thanos>>ALL

Correction
Darkseid>> All

Originally posted by carver9
Team 2, only because of thanos.
Thor>Supes
Darkseid>Supes

Thanos>>ALL agree with carver

Originally posted by Allankles
Correction
Darkseid>> All

Darkseid before the ale was a mere top tier, I can fill up my hands on the many times that he has been embarrassed. Thanos>>all.

Originally posted by Allankles
Correction
Darkseid>> All darkseid has been embarrassed many times. uxas is still very powerful with his omegas,but i've seen them fail too many times to see this matchup any other way.

Originally posted by carver9
Team 2, only because of thanos.
Thor>Supes
Darkseid>Supes

Thanos>>ALL

Supes > Thor (already on panel)
Supes = Darkseid (At least the version used here)

Thanos/Supes/DS > Thor.

Originally posted by Avlon
Supes > Thor (already on panel)
Supes = Darkseid (At least the version used here)

Thanos/Supes/DS > Thor.

Well I guess since we're using on panel crossovers then venom>superman, both dc and marvel writers agreed that venom can take superman.

Thor>supes, thor is overrall more versatile and powerful then supes.

Originally posted by carver9
Well I guess since we're using on panel crossovers then venom>superman, both dc and marvel writers agreed that venom can take superman.

Thor>supes, thor is overrall more versatile and powerful then supes. The venom/supes thing was not canon. supes/thor was canon acknowledged by both companies.

Originally posted by lawest9
The venom/supes thing was not canon. supes/thor was canon acknowledged by both companies.

I know it wasnt cannon but it was still decided and judged by both dc and marvel writters. There isnt a difference except they just made one cannon and left the other alone.

Originally posted by carver9
I know it wasnt cannon but it was still decided and judged by both dc and marvel writters. There isnt a difference except they just made one cannon and left the other alone. Aahhhh.......But superman and thor are so close in power that it was very conceivable that either one could have won, supes just happened to get the telling blow in first, And you'll have to admit that supes/venom was pure writers PIS bull.

Originally posted by carver9
I know it wasnt cannon but it was still decided and judged by both dc and marvel writters. There isnt a difference except they just made one cannon and left the other alone.

So then Black Panther > Surfer, Spidey > Firelord, and Aquaman > Probe in your opinion?

Originally posted by lawest9
Aahhhh.......But superman and thor are so close in power that it was very conceivable that either one could have won, supes just happened to get the telling blow in first, And you'll have to admit that supes/venom was pure writers PIS bull.

I agree, it was pure bull crap just like the superman vs thor fight was. Superman catching a hammer that has enough power to wreck a planet is full of pis but if I was the writter then yes superman would win, no matter what because he's superman. Then after superman takes out thor he almost get koed by a repulsor ray blast by ironman, just dont make since to me.

Originally posted by Avlon
So then Black Panther > Surfer, Spidey > Firelord, and Aquaman > Probe in your opinion?

If your going by crossovers then yes but I dont believe in crossovers even if they make in cannon because no matter what it will always be decided off of popularity. I agree, superman can beat thor but for a majority, hell no. I think that glads is> and he is my favorite character but I still wont give him a majority over thor, thor has to much raw power and if thor can damage a celestial, he shouldnt have a problem hitting either of these opponents strong enough to take them out permanently.

Originally posted by carver9
If your going by crossovers then yes but I dont believe in crossovers even if they make in cannon because no matter what it will always be decided off of popularity. I agree, superman can beat thor but for a majority, hell no. I think that glads is> and he is my favorite character but I still wont give him a majority over thor, thor has to much raw power and if thor can damage a celestial, he shouldnt have a problem hitting either of these opponents strong enough to take them out permanently. I agree that thor has the pure energetic powers to beat superman and the hulk both but not supes in a pure H2H fight, but he used to be written as being able to hang with hulk physically but that has changed in recent years and as a thor fan as well as a superman fan this frustrates me, Thor with his mystical energetic powers should be able to vaporize the hulk.

Originally posted by carver9
If your going by crossovers then yes but I dont believe in crossovers even if they make in cannon because no matter what it will always be decided off of popularity. wut.

That didn't address his point.

Originally posted by I'm Bran
wut.

That didn't address his point.

What was it that I was suppose to address?

Superman VS Thor was cannon so as much as people hate to accept it, it was still accepted by every writer

personally, i don't agree about most crossovers, but jla/avengers was written by kurt busiek, a man intimately familiar with both teams, as he's written some of the best arcs ever written about several of the characters.

even if its not canon, and its fine with me if its not, its the closest we're ever going to get a fair, balanced crossover imo...

Originally posted by Avlon
Supes > Thor (already on panel)

Superman won one fight with Thor and it was still a hard fought battle. Both admitted their foe were tough. It's hardly an indication that Supes > Thor if they fought a second or third time around. It could have easily gone in Thor's favor as well if he blocked Superman's HV with Mjlornir and redirect a blast back at Supes.


With that said, team 2 takes it. Thanos has been superior to Thor in most encounters. And Superman's has had a number of wins against Darkseid and vice versa. Either Superman beats Darkseid or hold him off long enough for Thanos to join the battle.

Originally posted by Raoul
personally, i don't agree about most crossovers, but jla/avengers was written by kurt busiek, a man intimately familiar with both teams, as he's written some of the best arcs ever written about several of the characters.

even if its not canon, and its fine with me if its not, its the closest we're ever going to get a fair, balanced crossover imo...
I though the fight was cannon and all writers agreed to the conclusion and victories ?

it was a shitty fight any way, and neither of them really went all out.

They were both attack all out. Thor didn't have a chance to go all out because Superman KOed him in one punch . I love the fact how he said something about the count going up to 12 . It was sweet

Team 2.

"sweet" indeed....

obviously the writer was sticking it to marvel, avlon is probably the writer's kmc screen name.

anyway, thor got up like a second later and said that he had his number, if they fought again mjolnir would have to be surgically removed from superman's chest cavity.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
"sweet" indeed....

obviously the writer was sticking it to marvel, avlon is probably the writer's kmc screen name.

anyway, thor got up like a second later and said that he had his number, if they fought again mjolnir would have to be surgically removed from superman's chest cavity.

Thor did not get up a second later, he was out for sometime and wanda helped revived him minutes later as zatanna was helping supes up after he was gang whip by the avengers top five.

Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Superman won one fight with Thor and it was still a hard fought battle. Both admitted their foe were tough. It's hardly an indication that Supes > Thor if they fought a second or third time around. It could have easily gone in Thor's favor as well if he blocked Superman's HV with Mjlornir and redirect a blast back at Supes.


With that said, team 2 takes it. Thanos has been superior to Thor in most encounters. And Superman's has had a number of wins against Darkseid and vice versa. Either Superman beats Darkseid or hold him off long enough for Thanos to join the battle.

BS. Superman has only one clean win over Darkseid. Apokolips now. S/B, Wondy helped him and he had a sun amp. Countdown wasn't a full fight, and even then DS ended it when he chose. OWAW? Darkseid was the obvious superior, even when he was weakened after taking down Imperiex.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
BS. Superman has only one clean win over Darkseid. Apokolips now. S/B, Wondy helped him and he had a sun amp. Countdown wasn't a full fight, and even then DS ended it when he chose. OWAW? Darkseid was the obvious superior, even when he was weakened after taking down Imperiex.

LOL. The point was that Supes can hold his own against Darkseid and then when Thanos was done with Thor; team 2 would rape Darkseid...repeatedly.

Against a Darkseid not using his powers. Big whup. He could take Thanos 50/50 even if they both went all out.

But against Darkseid's true power? The lord of Apokolips cleans houses here.

Originally posted by lawest9
Darkseid before ALE.


Obviously he is intending to use the DS that Supes fights.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
BS. Superman has only one clean win over Darkseid. Apokolips now. S/B, Wondy helped him and he had a sun amp. Countdown wasn't a full fight, and even then DS ended it when he chose. OWAW? Darkseid was the obvious superior, even when he was weakened after taking down Imperiex.

He also gets his salad tossed by Supes in Action Comics, one-shotted into a Boom Tube. And there were two fights in OWAW. One, where Supes was previously injured by Black Racer and then took on Kalibak and parademons, which Darkseid one...then the other, where Supes looked superior.

don't forget superman batman vin

Originally posted by Raoul
don't forget superman batman vin

Meh, he mentioned that. ("S/B"

Originally posted by Enyalus
Meh, he mentioned that. ("S/B"

mhmm

bad trick for trying to say wonder woman and the sun made that big a difference...

Team 2 for the vast majority 8(9)- 10

Originally posted by xJLxKing
I though the fight was cannon and all writers agreed to the conclusion and victories ?

Superman is D/C flagship character. I would call a few things in the fight PIS and for the must part think Thor would take supes 6/10 if they battled. Heck Stan Lee stated that he would not of haved Thor lose to Supes. I am more into Marvel then mainly Thor as my name goes i would have Supes lose in a cross over Only b/c one reason he is Superman but any one who counts the cross over between the two and can't see the PIS in it well thats just lame.

Heck Thor has taken out the avengers before on his on and he stated that he hold back when he is fights. He has one shotted ironman in his newer armour which was way great then one supes fought. Supes should of done the same to him and a number of avengers more pis.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
Superman is D/C flagship character. I would call a few things in the fight PIS and for the must part think Thor would take supes 6/10 if they battled. Heck Stan Lee stated that he would not of haved Thor lose to Supes. I am more into Marvel then mainly Thor as my name goes i would have Supes lose in a cross over Only b/c one reason he is Superman but any one who counts the cross over between the two and can't see the PIS in it well thats just lame.

Heck Thor has taken out the avengers before on his on and he stated that he hold back when he is fights. He has one shotted ironman in his newer armour which was way great then one supes fought. Supes should of done the same to him and a number of avengers more pis. SUPERMAN is the one who is known for holding back, and he has always been historically portrayed as being more powerful than thor and most. I have no problem with the t-God winning a few from supes but there was nothing PIS about that fight. Now if you want to complain about PIS writing.........look at the black panther vs silver surfer fight in a issue of FF over a year back.

Originally posted by Raoul
mhmm

bad trick for trying to say wonder woman and the sun made that big a difference...

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I was talking with Raoul, and I realized, there's some bullshit in S/B.

Darkseid would know if the beams missed. He has total control over them. So why would the teleport fool him?

Also, given how Wondy had to be outside Darkseid's visual range, and how he was blind-sided (and only stunned) by his own OE, it's obvious the beam is at least as fast as Heat Vision.

Darkseid's Omega Effect isn't the beams anyway. They're just the finder. The OE itself follows right after the beam hits.

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/AdventuresOfSuperman495p16.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/AdventuresOfSuperman495p17.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/new_gods2_012_22_rougher.jpg

http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/Supermanv2104-17.jpg

Note here that he says Beams, but given what happened, it's obvious that one can appear to be the other as Darkseid wills it.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/jkfw-10-17.jpg

Here's what happens later. Kanto aka Iluthin, the kid sent back in the previous scan, was being trained in renaissance Italy. While there, he ends up in a Romeo&Juliet situation, and the end of it being resolved happily, Kanto 13 shows up.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/New%20Gods%20Forces/jkfw-11-20.jpg

Brings his younger self to the future.
http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/TheLegion030-07.jpg

Proof of temporal awarness.
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SupermanBatman16-22.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SupermanBatman16-23.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SupermanBatman16-24.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SupermanBatman23-27.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SupermanBatman23-28.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/SupermanBatman24-02-03.jpg

Thanks for helping me figure this out btw. g_grin

facepalm

TP your New Gods wanking is very strong indeed. Tell me something where was the super awesome DS and his true from when HP DD was wrecking him and taking over Apok. Where was the super Darkseid when Supes & Orion have beaten him. Where was this true from then. Now all of a sudden he's written to be greater then he ever has been and you run around saying look look this is his true form. So, where was it during the times in questions that haven't been designated as Avatars? I say again this DS like all villans and DS in general will lose all his true form power nd be beaten by Top Tiers and Herald Levelers as usual.

Not a lot of people could do anything to HP Doomsday.

That's a shitty example.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
TP your New Gods wanking is very strong indeed. Tell me something where was the super awesome DS and his true from when HP DD was wrecking him and taking over Apok. Where was the super Darkseid when Supes & Orion have beaten him. Where was this true from then. Now all of a sudden he's written to be greater then he ever has been and you run around saying look look this is his true form. So, where was it during the times in questions that haven't been designated as Avatars? I say again this DS like all villans and DS in general will lose all his true form power nd be beaten by Top Tiers and Herald Levelers as usual.

Henshaw controlled Apokolips tech, making your example irrelevant.
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/NewGodsv310-11.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/NewGodsv310-12.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/NewGodsv310-14.jpg

The true form thing is confirmed by the boomtube and their entire history, but you'd know that if you ever bothered to read anything DC. doped

This "True Form" has never been shown before until now. Thus a lot of things could be the reason for it now that could be explained at any point in time. I say again.. where was this true form when Doomsday laid waste to him and Apok? Where was this true form with the other examples I used. Or let me guess he just choose not to show it then? Fact is TP i do read DC and enjoy DC. I also know that Morrison as you say likes people to connect the dots but often times that connection is left up to the reader with many possible avenues. So, while you think you may have connected the dots correct doesn't make it so. Again tell me where this true form was when he's lost to Heralds in his home world?

Originally posted by lawest9
SUPERMAN is the one who is known for holding back, and he has always been historically portrayed as being more powerful than thor and most. I have no problem with the t-God winning a few from supes but there was nothing PIS about that fight. Now if you want to complain about PIS writing.........look at the black panther vs silver surfer fight in a issue of FF over a year back.

Thor has stated he holds back twice once when he fought a low level street villian forgot the issues and then in the new series when he smack down ironman issue 2 or 3 he said he no longer is holding back they are both now for holding back both you can argue back and fourth about who is strouger but they are close in strength noway should supes be able to catch mjolnir.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
Thor has stated he holds back twice once when he fought a low level street villian forgot the issues and then in the new series when he smack down ironman issue 2 or 3 he said he no longer is holding back they are both now for holding back both you can argue back and fourth about who is strouger but they are close in strength noway should supes be able to catch mjolnir. Why not? didn't count nefaria accomplished the same act.

Originally posted by lawest9
Why not? didn't count nefaria accomplished the same act.

I never seen that one i didn't say no one can stop the hammer but Supes and Thor are to close in strength for that to happen.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
This "True Form" has never been shown before until now. Thus a lot of things could be the reason for it now that could be explained at any point in time. I say again.. where was this true form when Doomsday laid waste to him and Apok? Where was this true form with the other examples I used. Or let me guess he just choose not to show it then? Fact is TP i do read DC and enjoy DC. I also know that Morrison as you say likes people to connect the dots but often times that connection is left up to the reader with many possible avenues. So, while you think you may have connected the dots correct doesn't make it so. Again tell me where this true form was when he's lost to Heralds in his home world?
False. His true form has been seen a few times in the past.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
I never seen that one i didn't say no one can stop the hammer but Supes and Thor are to close in strength for that to happen.

Count Nefaria and Thor are peers in strength as well. He caught Mjolnir in the very same manner as Supes.

Originally posted by Eel O'Brien
Count Nefaria and Thor are peers in strength as well. He caught Mjolnir in the very same manner as Supes.

i read up on that a bit it appears That count Nefaria had a great boost as he stole altas power and a few other villains and his along with taking altas power it was increased 100 fold so i think it is safe to say that is one hello of a boost.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
i read up on that a bit it appears That count Nefaria had a great boost as he stole altas power and a few other villains and his along with taking altas power it was increased 100 fold so i think it is safe to say that is one hello of a boost. You're right, my memory of that story when thor and CN were fighting and CN was uplifting an skyscapper toward thor, the t-God thought to himself "he is lifting that building with a casual ease that not even I can match" I would think that this could be used as evidence that both nefaria and superman may well be stronger than thor.

Originally posted by lawest9
You're right, my memory of that story when thor and CN were fighting and CN was uplifting an skyscapper toward thor, the t-God thought to himself "he is lifting that building with a casual ease that not even I can match" I would think that this could be used as evidence that both nefaria and superman may well be stronger than thor.

Pre crisis supes yes but thats about it, I think the midguard serphant ways a bit more then a skyscraper lol

Originally posted by DarkOdin
Thor has stated he holds back twice once when he fought a low level street villian forgot the issues and then in the new series when he smack down ironman issue 2 or 3 he said he no longer is holding back they are both now for holding back both you can argue back and fourth about who is strouger but they are close in strength noway should supes be able to catch mjolnir.

What do you mean no way should Supes catch Mjlonir? Considering the circumstances surrounding that moment it is quite believable for Supes to have been able to grab the hammer.

People say Mjlonir can shatter planets (and Supes says he could do the same with his fists) but the reality is Thor doesn't throw Earth shattering blows with every swing of Mjlonir, just like Supes doesn't throw his planet shattering punches with every swing of his fist.

So with that in mind, and given that Thor was weakened by Supes attacks up to that point, it's not unreasonable that Supes could grab Mjlonir.

Team one wins.
DS>>Everyone
Thanos>Everyone But DS. But Thor and Superman are close to Thanos IMO.
Thor>Superman. In overall power and versatility.

Thanos>>Durability with DS and Superman Tying.

But Thor has better energy block than anyone.
DS and Thor also have Trump powers that the other team doesn't have.

Godblast and Omega Effect combo for the Ultimate Win.

Originally posted by Allankles
What do you mean no way should Supes catch Mjlonir? Considering the circumstances surrounding that moment it is quite believable for Supes to have been able to grab the hammer.

People say Mjlonir can shatter planets (and Supes says he could do the same with his fists) but the reality is Thor doesn't throw Earth shattering blows with every swing of Mjlonir, just like Supes doesn't throw his planet shattering punches with every swing of his fist.

So with that in mind, and given that Thor was weakened by Supes attacks up to that point, it's not unreasonable that Supes could grab Mjlonir.

You have some great points but on the sameway of thinking Supes was weaken 2 for the fight by him catching the hammer and surprising Thor it makes it look like supes has a huge strength and duraability over Thor.

Given Thor's way of fighting with his fist over his other powers Supes should come out on top.I have no problem with Thor losing to supes but stopping the hammer is a bit much. Thor using all his power smartly should out do supes imo. In a brawl supes i think would have the edge
6 out 10 but given Thor powers he should win 6 out 10.

Originally posted by DarkOdin
You have some great points but on the sameway of thinking Supes was weaken 2 for the fight by him catching the hammer and surprising Thor it makes it look like supes has a huge strength and duraability over Thor.

Given Thor's way of fighting with his fist over his other powers Supes should come out on top.I have no problem with Thor losing to supes but stopping the hammer is a bit much. Thor using all his power smartly should out do supes imo. In a brawl supes i think would have the edge
6 out 10 but given Thor powers he should win 6 out 10. And they also made a point to show that Thor could win a 2nd fight and how Superman was awed by how powerful Moljnir carried.

I think a 5/10 split or 6/10 either way is fair.

Originally posted by Allankles
People say Mjlonir can shatter planets (and Supes says he could do the same with his fists) but the reality is Thor doesn't throw Earth shattering blows with every swing of Mjlonir

Who says this? The only time I know of him shattering a planet with one swing of Mjolnir was when he was in WM mode, amped 10 times his normal strength level.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Who says this? The only time I know of him shattering a planet with one swing of Mjolnir was when he was in WM mode, amped 10 times his normal strength level.

BRB did it with storm breaker. Stormbreaker is equal to Thor as is bill.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Who says this? The only time I know of him shattering a planet with one swing of Mjolnir was when he was in WM mode, amped 10 times his normal strength level.

I was just trying to elaborate my point. which is given the circumstances it was well within Superman's means to stop the hammer.

This is the same hammer blow that was stopped dead by Rulk's head.

Also people fail to address other factors like Supes' speed, he could conceivably see the blow coming at him in slow motion and then steel/harden/tighten his body to absorb the impact of the blow.

Originally posted by Allankles
I was just trying to elaborate my point. which is given the circumstances it was well within Superman's means to stop the hammer.

This is the same hammer blow that was stopped dead by Rulk's head.

Also people fail to address other factors like Supes' speed, he could conceivably see the blow coming at him in slow motion and then steel/harden/tighten his body to absorb the impact of the blow.

Rulk head you mean the first time when he grabed Thors hand and hit him with the hammer or the 2nd time when Thor was laying the smack down.

Anyway please try not to use Rulk as an example Loeb is trash and everything he touch turns to trush .

I like to think of Rulk as the Santa claus and the easter bunny just a folklore that doesn't exist LMAO

The supe speed think could be shown him reaction but to absorb a blow either way would of still hand a greater impact on him.

Whether or not Superman can catch a hammer swing probably isn't going to be the deciding factor in this fight anyway.

Originally posted by Eel O'Brien
Whether or not Superman can catch a hammer swing probably isn't going to be the deciding factor in this fight anyway.

True but i was debating that supes and Thor were more or less equal.

I think either side could take this it just depends how they play there cards. i would lean toward Team 2 if supes could hold of Darkseid long enough for thanos to take our Thor which shouldn't take so long. Then supes and Thanos finish off Darkseid. But this is only one way to do it and only a 6/10 for team 2

Originally posted by Allankles
Also people fail to address other factors like Supes' speed, he could conceivably see the blow coming at him in slow motion and then steel/harden/tighten his body to absorb the impact of the blow.

I've still never seen this "super density" ability you keep harping on in any Superman comic I've read in the last 10 years.

I think Team Two wins 6/10 my reasoning is simple...

1. Thanos = DS I think Thanos is a tad bit higher because I don't see him losing to some of the people DS has. However, I think they are basically equal and for the sakes of this we'll call them equal.

2. Super >= Thor. I think Thor is more versatile and has more power output but supes is fast and better at h2h fighting which gives him the ever so slight edge.

3. DS >= to Supes. I think Supes can beat DS but more often then not DS should win

4. Thanos > Thor. There is no equal because I feel Thanos has shown his clear superiority of Thor without too much trouble. Thor is tough and can hurt Thanos and give him a good fight but not win.

To me this fight comes down to the fact that Supes can and has hung with DS on numerous occasions. He's done better against DS then Thor has against Thanos. I see Thanos fighting Thor first and getting the better of it after a good battle while Supes holds off or barely losses to DS. Which leaves Thanos fresh or in better condition to finish of Seid. If Supes goes after Thor I believe he wins that fight after a great fight more often then not. SO, while Thanos and Seid battle to a virtual stand still supes will finish of Thor more times then not and before Thanos and DS finish as they are pretty equal. He'll then come in to finish it off. No matter the matchup I see Team two winning an ever so slight majority.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Thor is tough and can hurt Thanos and give him a good fight but not win.

Not even. You're being way too generous.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Not even. You're being way too generous.

Maybe a little generous. My other issue is... Supes has shown to be better then Thor yet I think Thor can win and almost should've won. I see why Supes can win and did win but it's tough because I see Thor being more versatile and having more power. It's like we have to go by what we saw in the comic supes being greater then thor yet it's a tough pill to swallow at the same time. The reason I gave some victories and it being so close is because I think Thor can beat supes and then Thor plus Seid would be too much for Thanos.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Maybe a little generous. My other issue is... Supes has shown to be better then Thor yet I think Thor can win and almost should've won. I see why Supes can win and did win but it's tough because I see Thor being more versatile and having more power.

Yeah. I was thinking, "Why are you walking through the heat vision when you can absorb it and then blast it back at him a hundred times stronger?"

facepalm

Originally posted by Enyalus
I've still never seen this "super density" ability you keep harping on in any Superman comic I've read in the last 10 years.

I think he just means bracing for impact. Superman even refers to that as "steeling" for impact.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Team one wins.
DS>>Everyone
Thanos>Everyone But DS. But Thor and Superman are close to Thanos IMO.
Thor>Superman. In overall power and versatility.

Thanos>>Durability with DS and Superman Tying.

But Thor has better energy block than anyone.
DS and Thor also have Trump powers that the other team doesn't have.

Godblast and Omega Effect combo for the Ultimate Win. I disagree with Darkseid being greater than everyone.

We have had this song and dance over and over.


Thor and Superman is very close though. Superman and Darkseid has proven to be very close as well. Either way you slice it I see Thanos putting down whoever gets in his way. Superman can beat darkseid or keep him busy until Thanos makes his way over for the backup.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Superman can beat darkseid or keep him busy until Thanos makes his way over for the backup.

Basically, my sentiments exactly.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I disagree with Darkseid being greater than everyone.

We have had this song and dance over and over.


Thor and Superman is very close though. Superman and Darkseid has proven to be very close as well. Either way you slice it I see Thanos putting down whoever gets in his way. Superman can beat darkseid or keep him busy until Thanos makes his way over for the backup.
LOL. Grant Morrison already explained it in FC secret files. What we saw as the new Gods was only a SHADOW of their real form and power. you pretty much lose anyway you slice it.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Basically, my sentiments exactly. I think Thanos pounds whoever gets into his way. None of these characters have the power at their disposal of an Odin who basically pounded on Thanos in asgard. Thanos took the pounding without any of his shields up.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Basically, my sentiments exactly.
No. He can't. Superman has beaten a shadow of DS power once. He's lost every other encounter before they even really began.

Originally posted by fangirl101
LOL. Grant Morrison already explained it in FC secret files. What we saw as the new Gods was only a SHADOW of their real form and power. you pretty much lose anyway you slice it. This is before the ale meaning classic Darkseid.

Girlfriend u crazy!

Originally posted by quanchi112
This is before the ale meaning classic Darkseid.
DS doesn't even need the ALE. Every instance we've seen of the NG or their weapons are shadows of what they really are. As written in Final Crisis Secret Files.

Originally posted by fangirl101
No. He can't. Superman has beaten a shadow of DS power once. He's lost every other encounter before they even really began. This is classic Darkseid.

Originally posted by fangirl101
DS doesn't even need the ALE. Every instance we've seen of the NG or their weapons are shadows of what they really are. As written in Final Crisis Secret Files. But the threadstarter wanted this to be old school Darkseid. Has Darkseid even battled anyone yet without his ale?

Ahh! Young love.

Originally posted by quanchi112
This is classic Darkseid.
Even Classic DS still has more powers and Power than anyone on the battle field. Classic DS created Libra. He also created Stayne. He also Pwned Jimmy who had all of the New Gods powers. I know you hate DS and I know you hate the fact that It is revealed that All the new gods are far more powerful than what we've seen. I know that just irks you. Oh well. LMAO.

Originally posted by quanchi112
But the threadstarter wanted this to be old school Darkseid. Has Darkseid even battled anyone yet without his ale?
What the heck are you talking about? The ALE is an equation that is being used for will control. It's not boosting DS powers in anyway. Do you know anything about DS? Really.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Even Classic DS still has more powers and Power than anyone on the battle field. Classic DS created Libra. He also created Stayne. He also Pwned Jimmy who had all of the New Gods powers. I know you hate DS and I know you hate the fact that It is revealed that All the new gods are far more powerful than what we've seen. I know that just irks you. Oh well. LMAO. No,Darkseid doesn't.

Creating libra and stayne means what in battle? Jimmy was inexperienced so defeating him wasn't that big of a feat. In that same story he couldn't beat Superman without the aid of jimmy and k-nite.

I like Darkseid,but to be honest you make that very hard on me.

Originally posted by fangirl101
What the heck are you talking about? The ALE is an equation that is being used for will control. It's not boosting DS powers in anyway. Do you know anything about DS? Really. He has been using the ale is what I have been hearing. I havent read fc in a while and stopped at three.

Supes beats Thor
Supes beats 'seid
Thanos is the icing on the cake.

Originally posted by tsscls
Supes beats Thor
Supes beats 'seid
Thanos is the icing on the cake.
No.
Fail.
Wrong.

Unless you can show me 3 times Superman has beaten DS. Bet you can't.

Originally posted by tsscls
Supes beats Thor
Supes beats 'seid
Thanos is the icing on the cake. Supes,Thor,and Seid are all on the playing field. Thanos is on another level.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He has been using the ale is what I have been hearing. I havent read fc in a while and stopped at three.
The ALE doesn't boost DS powers in anyway. It doesn't even have anything to do with the New Gods real power lvls. It's a revelation that the New Gods Forms that we've seen have been shadows of their true forms. Something that I think has been discussed here before.

Originally posted by quanchi112
No,Darkseid doesn't.

Creating libra and stayne means what in battle? Jimmy was inexperienced so defeating him wasn't that big of a feat. In that same story he couldn't beat Superman without the aid of jimmy and k-nite.

I like Darkseid,but to be honest you make that very hard on me.
LOL. Do you honestly think DS needed jimmy to beat Superman? Why would Superman let DS kill all those thousands of Innocents? LMAO. He couldn't even begin to scratch DS once DS stopped playing around and got serious. DS likes to play with his food. That's the only reason Superman ever had any chance in any fight in the first place.

Originally posted by fangirl101
The ALE doesn't boost DS powers in anyway. It doesn't even have anything to do with the New Gods real power lvls. It's a revelation that the New Gods Forms that we've seen have been shadows of their true forms. Something that I think has been discussed here before. Regardless,I havent read any of fc since 3 and I do not think that is relevant to this thread anyways.

Originally posted by fangirl101
LOL. Do you honestly think DS needed jimmy to beat Superman? Why would Superman let DS kill all those thousands of Innocents? LMAO. He couldn't even begin to scratch DS once DS stopped playing around and got serious. DS likes to play with his food. That's the only reason Superman ever had any chance in any fight in the first place. Superman isn't Darkseid's food. He is a peer and he admitted as much in death of the new gods and has matched up against him and outright beaten him before.


if you really think Darkseid meant to lose then that is possibly one of their wierdest arguments I have ever heard of in my life.

Originally posted by fangirl101
No.
Fail.
Wrong.

Unless you can show me 3 times Superman has beaten DS. Bet you can't.
Superman/Batman..supergirl--shoved him into the source wall
Superman--The one where he beats him blind on the asteroid
Owaw--beat him around pretty good. Enough that it was stated on panel that he was weakened due to the fight.

Originally posted by fangirl101
LOL. Do you honestly think DS needed jimmy to beat Superman? Why would Superman let DS kill all those thousands of Innocents? LMAO. He couldn't even begin to scratch DS once DS stopped playing around and got serious. DS likes to play with his food. That's the only reason Superman ever had any chance in any fight in the first place.

Well that was seriously the dumbest ****ing thing I've ever heard in my life.

What the ****?

RETARD UP IN HERE

Originally posted by tsscls
Superman/Batman..supergirl--shoved him into the source wall
Superman--The one where he beats him blind on the asteroid
Owaw--beat him around pretty good. Enough that it was stated on panel that he was weakened due to the fight.

Epic fail.

Superman was losing in S/B until wonder woman assisted. Giving Superman enough time for a sun amp.

The one where he beat him blind. Lulz. you do realize Superman only won by using DS own omega beams against ds. It wasn't even Superman's own power.

And OWAW DS won that fight. After both had been weakened. DS beat Superman in 3 punches. You failed. hard.

Originally posted by KGBeast
Well that was seriously the dumbest ****ing thing I've ever heard in my life.

What the ****?

RETARD UP IN HERE
Now explain why it was dumb. Or do you care that I make you look even more foolish for not understanding the statement. I'm sure quantum physics is dumb to a monkey.

Are you a monkey?

Originally posted by fangirl101
Epic fail.

Superman was losing in S/B until wonder woman assisted. Giving Superman enough time for a sun amp.

The one where he beat him blind. Lulz. you do realize Superman only won by using DS own omega beams against ds. It wasn't even Superman's own power.

And OWAW DS won that fight. After both had been weakened. DS beat Superman in 3 punches. You failed. hard. So,using Darkseid's own omega beams against him is somehow not a legit win for Superman? Should he have let him hit him with them?

Supes pwned him hard by means of bfr in his own comic.

Darkseid also fled the scene in superman/batman making that three wins.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Epic fail.

Superman was losing in S/B until wonder woman assisted. Giving Superman enough time for a sun amp.

The one where he beat him blind. Lulz. you do realize Superman only won by using DS own omega beams against ds. It wasn't even Superman's own power.

And OWAW DS won that fight. After both had been weakened. DS beat Superman in 3 punches. You failed. hard.

Oh bull,

1. How did ww assist? By getting thrown through a roof into the stratosphere?

2. "only won" thanks for clarifying

3. It was stated on panel that supes weakened DS to the point that he couldn't use his OE against Imperiex.

I like DS as much as the next guy (or girl) but let's not be overzealous.

Originally posted by quanchi112
So,using Darkseid's own omega beams against him is somehow not a legit win for Superman? Should he have let him hit him with them?

Supes pwned him hard by means of bfr in his own comic.

Darkseid also fled the scene in superman/batman making that three wins.
EPIC fail. You always Fail. you will continue to fail. You are a fail.

DS was assaulted by the technology of Himon, the guy who made the Mother boxes, and The staff of highfather. The same one that can rip space/time open with just a wave. He was injured before Superman came in. You Fail. Hard.

Superman used DS omega beams against DS. which is the only way you can beat him in the pre crisis days. That's hardly a win of pure power. Without the beams, Superman couldn't win. He is not as powerful and cannot beat Classic DS without using DS pwn powers against him. You fail yet again.

And when did Superman pwn DS hard by means of Bfr?

^^I do think that the ww assist isn't a straight up win. If ds hit him with those beams I think he would have won that particular fight.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Now explain why it was dumb. Or do you care that I make you look even more foolish for not understanding the statement. I'm sure quantum physics is dumb to a monkey.

Are you a monkey?

What a fallacious statement. You're comparing what you said earlier to quantum physics. Problem is, what you said before was truly retarded, and quantum physics is an exact science that is carefully understood through math. It can't be disputed through opinion.

And no, I'm not a monkey. However, even a monkey could tell you're retarded.

Originally posted by quanchi112
^^I do think that the ww assist isn't a straight up win. If ds hit him with those beams I think he would have won that particular fight.

Arguable, Supes has survived the Omega Beams before.

Originally posted by fangirl101
EPIC fail. You always Fail. you will continue to fail. You are a fail.

DS was assaulted by the technology of Himon, the guy who made the Mother boxes, and The staff of highfather. The same one that can rip space/time open with just a wave. He was injured before Superman came in. You Fail. Hard.

Superman used DS omega beams against DS. which is the only way you can beat him in the pre crisis days. That's hardly a win of pure power. Without the beams, Superman couldn't win. He is not as powerful and cannot beat Classic DS without using DS pwn powers against him. You fail yet again.

And when did Superman pwn DS hard by means of Bfr? I think you are exaggerating the staff just a little here. Regardless,Darkseid left which I count as a victory for Superman who just freed himself from the source.

Darkseid cannot defeat Superman without his omega beams imo. If its a slugfest I give it to Superman.

Originally posted by KGBeast
What a fallacious statement. You're comparing what you said earlier to quantum physics. Problem is, what you said before was truly retarded, and quantum physics is an exact science that is carefully understood through math. It can't be disputed through opinion.

And no, I'm not a monkey. However, even a monkey could tell you're retarded.
Well, for one, you are reported, for two, it is fact that Superman would never let DS kill thousands of innocents if he had the power to stop him. Any Superman fan would know that. Obviously, you are just a troll and not a real Superman fan. Monkey.

Originally posted by tsscls
Arguable, Supes has survived the Omega Beams before. Yes,I know. In that comic I think they were honoring the whole kill you one hit thing. In some other comics they are just powerful energy beams. Its gotta be hard to write against darseid with those plot device omega beams.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I think you are exaggerating the staff just a little here. Regardless,Darkseid left which I count as a victory for Superman who just freed himself from the source.

Darkseid cannot defeat Superman without his omega beams imo. If its a slugfest I give it to Superman.
Has superman ever beat DS in a slugfest? Nope. Has DS ever bitched Superman in a slugfest? Yes. A few times. he has even ***** slapped in Superman a couple of times. You will excuse me if I decline to respect your opinion in this matter.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Well, for one, you are reported, for two, it is fact that Superman would never let DS kill thousands of innocents if he had the power to stop him. Any Superman fan would know that. Obviously, you are just a troll and not a real Superman fan. Monkey.

Despite the fact that Superman has made Darkseid look like a complete chump on many different occasions? Right.

Believe what you want to.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Has superman ever beat DS in a slugfest? Nope. Has DS ever bitched Superman in a slugfest? Yes. A few times. he has even ***** slapped in Superman a couple of times. You will excuse me if I decline to respect your opinion in this matter. When has Darkseid beaten Superman into submission with his fists?

I still think that Supes would beat Thanos in a slugfest.

Originally posted by tsscls
I still think that Supes would beat Thanos in a slugfest. Come now. Thanos doesn't lost to top tiers he pwns them.

Originally posted by KGBeast
Despite the fact that Superman has made Darkseid look like a complete chump on many different occasions? Right.

Believe what you want to.
LULZ. Has he? When?

When Wonder Woman had to help superman after he'd given his best and got ***** slapped into a rock?

Or How about the time when Batman was using Himon's tech and assaulted ds, Who had also just been blasted by the reality alter Source staff? That Time? Is that when Superman bitched DS? It had nothing to do with the planet being pulled into the source wall that DS left did it? LULZ at your pathetic attempt.

Oh wait, When Superman got 3 shotted by DS? Is that what you are talking about?

Or what about the time DS held superman like a 3 year old in a stasis field?

Damn I mean what about the time DS Actuallly Pimp Smacked Superman. Wait. He did that like 2 or 3 times didn't he?

Lulz. You fail.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Come now. Thanos doesn't lost to top tiers he pwns them.

I don't know. In the last FC, Supes looked like he was in a skyfather stomping mood.

Originally posted by tsscls
I don't know. In the last FC, Supes looked like he was in a skyfather stomping mood.

DS has already been shot by his own weapon.

Originally posted by quanchi112
When has Darkseid beaten Superman into submission with his fists?
3 shotted. And DS was weakened.
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/B17-All-OutWar-SupermanManofStee-1.jpg
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh187/DarkseidRes/B17-All-OutWar-SupermanManofStee-2.jpg

Originally posted by fangirl101
DS has already been shot by his own weapon.

Calm down, I was baiting Quanch with that statement.