Luke Cage and Iron Fist versus Spiderman and Wolverine

Arachnid1

Originally posted by StarsNeverFall7
Im going to ignore the Wolverine stroking going on...

Setting Cage against Spider-Man...Cage should be able to take a lot more of a damage soak than Spider-Man with the whole steel hard skin deal and what not.. Being in the same strength class and such, Cage will get Spidey eventually so I'd even be willing to hand a slight majority to cage for durability reasons.

IF and Wolverine could really go either way, pretty much a 5/10 split here...real deciding factor is in who wins between Cage and Spidey.

Eh, this seems more rational. After thinking about it again, I got to go with this.

Soljer

Cage versus:

Spidey? It's all about speed versus durability, which wins out in your opinion?

Also note that Spiderman is NOT officially a class 25 hero. He is still in the 10 tons - 25 ton range. Officially, he hasn't yet been upgraded to 25, so (as far as we know), Cage is still stronger.

Logan? Here, Cage's durability is meaningless and his strength means little more. I think Cage versus Logan is clearly in favor of Wolverine.

Now;

Iron Fist versus

Spiderman? Here, Spidey's speed is nullified a bit, considering that Fist can chi amp up to his level. I've also seen Fist work some nerve strikes on Spidey before, and we all know it'd probably only take ONE Iron Fist to put Spiderman out of commission. But, Spidey does have the webbing and, therefore, mobility advantage. Though, maybe Fist will be able to hypnotize Spiderman, considering he's mastered that technique now. Meh, I'll give the majority here to Danny.

Wolverine? This is a draw, to me. Neither is vastly superior in speed or strength, and if either can land a good hit, it's a one-hit-knock out. 5/10.

Seems like team 1's best chance is if the match ups go Cage vs. Spidey and Fist vs. Logan. But even then, they probably wouldn't win much more than 6/10. And, if the matchups go the other way, team 2 will probably take the majority.

Alfheim

Originally posted by Arachnid1
Actually, Spiderman was officially declared a 25 tonner. That means he is on par with Cage in strength. Combine that with a spider sense and agility and speed, and your being speed blitzed by Luke Cage himself.

Thats not accurate. First of all we dont know for sure wether Spiderman can lift 25 tons. Even if that was the case Luke Cage's durability enables him to hit harder than people with the same strength level

Furthermore Luke Cage may not be as fast as Spiderman but hes not slow and is an expert streetfighter. Cage could probably take anything that Spiderman would give him and Cage will eventually hit Spiderman and Cages punches will do more to Spiderman than it will do to him.

FOOM

"Danny and Luke are IMO the most under-rated team up ever, they probably have the best team-work in a duo then any other two in MU." yes

Spidey or Wolverine would beat either of them one on one... not easily, but eventually.
But team work should count for something.
team vs. team: 50/50

CasanoVa

Danny would take Wolverine, He could give Spider-Man a good fight (as he has twice before).

Luke would go down to Spider-Man after a good fight, Wolverine depends on whether his claws can cut Cage.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by Soljer
Cage versus:

Spidey? It's all about speed versus durability, which wins out in your opinion?

Also note that Spiderman is NOT officially a class 25 hero. He is still in the 10 tons - 25 ton range. Officially, he hasn't yet been upgraded to 25, so (as far as we know), Cage is still stronger.

Logan? Here, Cage's durability is meaningless and his strength means little more. I think Cage versus Logan is clearly in favor of Wolverine.

Now;

Iron Fist versus

Spiderman? Here, Spidey's speed is nullified a bit, considering that Fist can chi amp up to his level. I've also seen Fist work some nerve strikes on Spidey before, and we all know it'd probably only take ONE Iron Fist to put Spiderman out of commission. But, Spidey does have the webbing and, therefore, mobility advantage. Though, maybe Fist will be able to hypnotize Spiderman, considering he's mastered that technique now. Meh, I'll give the majority here to Danny.

Wolverine? This is a draw, to me. Neither is vastly superior in speed or strength, and if either can land a good hit, it's a one-hit-knock out. 5/10.

Seems like team 1's best chance is if the match ups go Cage vs. Spidey and Fist vs. Logan. But even then, they probably wouldn't win much more than 6/10. And, if the matchups go the other way, team 2 will probably take the majority.

I'm not sure I understand your reasoning here.

IF can take out Spider-Man for the majority, but not Wolverine? Does the Iron Fist do less damage to Wolverine than it does Spidey: blink

And you even said that IF can amp himself speed-wise to match Spidey, yet he's not clearly faster than Wolverine when doing the same thing?

Eh. Concerning Spidey and Cage, I'd have to give to Spidey. The strength issue is the still in the air, as we've already seen Spidey show strength in the 20+ ton region. But I don't think strength will be the key here. Spidey is exponentially faster than Cage, as well as faster reflexes. Sure, he can't puncture Cage, but doesn't have to. He could just as easily immobilize him with webbing. Or he could cause internal damage via repeated blows or using the environment to his advantage. And really, he's just too fast to receive a good hit from Cage.

Soljer

Originally posted by Metalmanx
I'm not sure I understand your reasoning here.

IF can take out Spider-Man for the majority, but not Wolverine? Does the Iron Fist do less damage to Wolverine than it does Spidey: blink

And you even said that IF can amp himself speed-wise to match Spidey, yet he's not clearly faster than Wolverine when doing the same thing?
With Wolverine versus Iron Fist, it is a 'who can strike first' scenario. If Danny lands a good Iron Fist on Logan, it's lights out. Likewise, if Wolverine lands a good claw strike on Danny, he's probably out of the game.

Then again, Danny CAN heal himself with chi, so maybe he'd win more often than I first hypothesized.

Also, while Spiderman is faster than Wolverine (and probably faster than even a chi-amped Danny), it isn't by a noticeable margin. I was merely pointing out that if Danny amps his speed, Spiderman will lack his largest advantage. Wolverine's largest advantages are his healing factor and his lethal weapons.
Originally posted by Metalmanx

Eh. Concerning Spidey and Cage, I'd have to give to Spidey. The strength issue is the still in the air, as we've already seen Spidey show strength in the 20+ ton region. But I don't think strength will be the key here. Spidey is exponentially faster than Cage, as well as faster reflexes. Sure, he can't puncture Cage, but doesn't have to. He could just as easily immobilize him with webbing. Or he could cause internal damage via repeated blows or using the environment to his advantage. And really, he's just too fast to receive a good hit from Cage.
That fight I'm still not going to give a judgment on. It's all about speed versus durability, and I'm not convinced in either direction.

Right now, I'd think that Iron Fist could take either Spiderman or Wolverine for a slight majority, but Cage'd likely lose to either, so....

Damn.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by Soljer
With Wolverine versus Iron Fist, it is a 'who can strike first' scenario. If Danny lands a good Iron Fist on Logan, it's lights out. Likewise, if Wolverine lands a good claw strike on Danny, he's probably out of the game.

Then again, Danny CAN heal himself with chi, so maybe he'd win more often than I first hypothesized.

Also, while Spiderman is faster than Wolverine (and probably faster than even a chi-amped Danny), it isn't by a noticeable margin. I was merely pointing out that if Danny amps his speed, Spiderman will lack his largest advantage. Wolverine's largest advantages are his healing factor and his lethal weapons.

That fight I'm still not going to give a judgment on. It's all about speed versus durability, and I'm not convinced in either direction.

Right now, I'd think that Iron Fist could take either Spiderman or Wolverine for a slight majority, but Cage'd likely lose to either, so....

Damn.

Okay, I can understand where you're coming from now, this post is a little more clear in your intentions.

And while I understand your reasoning for IF closing the speed gap against Spidey, Spidey's still got the GINORMOUS strength advantage. So if he can dodge IF enough (which I think both you and I believe he can) and land even just a decent shot, it should put Fist down. Kind of the same deal with Wolverine really.

But yea. By NO means is this an easy match. Not by a long shot. Both Fist and Cage lay some serious damage on the other two, but I just don't think it'll be enough.

Soljer

Originally posted by Metalmanx
Okay, I can understand where you're coming from now, this post is a little more clear in your intentions.

And while I understand your reasoning for IF closing the speed gap against Spidey, Spidey's still got the GINORMOUS strength advantage. So if he can dodge IF enough (which I think both you and I believe he can) and land even just a decent shot, it should put Fist down. Kind of the same deal with Wolverine really.

But yea. By NO means is this an easy match. Not by a long shot. Both Fist and Cage lay some serious damage on the other two, but I just don't think it'll be enough.

Meh, when Danny has a chi surge, it also amps his durability. Think of the crazy monks you see getting concrete broken over their head, but on a comic-book level. I think he could take a punch or two from Spiderman(especially considering that he's taken punches from Cage). The same can't really be said of Spiderman against the Iron Fist, however. Hell, even without the Iron Fist, Danny's punched through A SOLID STEEL GIRDER, with it he's been able to knock out Hercules and do some insane damage in the past.

I still maintain that Rand can take a slight majority from either Pete or Logan. Though, my first instinct is that Cage'd probably lose at LEAST A slight majority against either, as well.

Thusly, as you said, this'll be quite a tough match for either team to win.

Meh, I'm gonna give this to team one, based on it being really close to begin with, and the fact that Danny and Luke have MUCH better teamwork than Spidey and Logan.

Sparkz

I know this was a long time ago but I remember a fight between when Spidey and Luke fought, when Spidey was like class 5-10 and Cage was class 2 and both were going at it in a pure brawl and were pretty even, now even though Cage has had a strength increase I doubt his durability would have gone up to much, and Spidey is still in a strength range to affect Cage.

So I would still have give the majority to Spidey because well in an all out brawl I still think these 2 are quite evenly matched in strength but Cage's durability gives him a huge edge but then when Spideys Speed and agility get thrown in I can see Spidey overwhelming Cage, not that this fight would be easy but I see this could go either way for either, though I'd give an advantage for Spidey.

But personally I see it would be easier for Wolverine to take down Cage with his superior speed fighting skill and the fact he can hit Cage with a pretty fatal blow while Spidey, if nothing else holds off IF.

Team 2 8/10

masterbruce

Can Logan cut Cage?

Endless Mike

I say team 1, they are seriously underestimated here.

Arachnid1

Originally posted by Endless Mike
I say team 1, they are seriously underestimated here.

I was under estimating them but once I thought more on it, I changed it to 5/10.

capt it up

team two wins I am sorry no ones being underestimated they are just better.

Sparkz

Originally posted by masterbruce
Can Logan cut Cage?

I'm pretty sure he can.

jasonk3

Originally posted by masterbruce
Can Logan cut Cage?

Yes. Luke Cage's skin can be cut by adamantium.

Soljer

Originally posted by masterbruce
Can Logan cut Cage?

Yes.

The Fake Macoy

Luke has no defence against Spidey webbing him and slamming him into objects repeatedly. Luke and Danny are good but Spidey and Wolverine are just better. The only way Luke and Danny would win is by using teamwork, in which case they mmight be able to pull off a few wins. Still, I don't know enough about Luke and Danny to see how they fight as a team.

Daredevil1

Spiderman/Wolverine 7/10

golem370

Spider-Man would hit Luke Cage 5 times before Luke could blink.

CasanoVa

Originally posted by golem370
Spider-Man would hit Luke Cage 5 times before Luke could blink.

No he couldn't.

Soljer

Originally posted by golem370
Spider-Man would hit Luke Cage 5 times before Luke could blink.

Blink? Do you think he's quicksilver or something? The Flash?

Uhhh....

capt it up

Originally posted by golem370
Spider-Man would hit Luke Cage 5 times before Luke could blink.
also why would you put spiderman vs Luke Cage any ways? Logan is better suited for taking a guy like Luke Cage out fast.

Soljer

Originally posted by capt it up
also why would you put spiderman vs Luke Cage any ways? Logan is better suited for taking a guy like Luke Cage out fast.

Agreed. Spiderman would have to beat on Luke for a little while. Wolverine would slice through him the same way he slices the Hulk and the Thing.

capt it up

Originally posted by Soljer
Agreed. Spiderman would have to beat on Luke for a little while. Wolverine would slice through him the same way he slices the Hulk and the Thing.

yes

StyleTime

This WOULD be a good fight if it wasn't for the fact that Wolverine will gut Cage about 4 seconds into the fight. Then it's Spiderman and Wolverine vs Iron Fist.

Joey Stacks

People underrate Luke Cage's fighting skills, when he's probably the top untrained brawler in the MU.

I'd say team 1 ignoring the fact that they have much better chemsitry and know each other like the back of their hand, but for the fact that they actually tolerate each other.

StarsNeverFall7

Granted with the team work, and Cage knowing that Logan's claws can damage him, logical sense for them and team work would push them to throw IF at Logan and Cage at Spidey.

Im still going to say that I'd put Cage a win or two above Spidey, just for the durability difference mainly, matched strength, and pretty even fighting ability, if not leaning to Cage a bit. Giving Cage a 6/10 here, maybe even a 5.5 out of 10.

IF versus Logan is a lot harder to guess, because a good swipe from Logan or a good IF could put the other out without much trouble. So it could really go either way, 5/10 either party here.

So I'd give team one a slight bit of a majority here...mainly based on Cage vs Spiderman.

jrodslam

Originally posted by StarsNeverFall7
Granted with the team work, and Cage knowing that Logan's claws can damage him, logical sense for them and team work would push them to throw IF at Logan and Cage at Spidey.

Im still going to say that I'd put Cage a win or two above Spidey, just for the durability difference mainly, matched strength, and pretty even fighting ability, if not leaning to Cage a bit. Giving Cage a 6/10 here, maybe even a 5.5 out of 10.

IF versus Logan is a lot harder to guess, because a good swipe from Logan or a good IF could put the other out without much trouble. So it could really go either way, 5/10 either party here.

So I'd give team one a slight bit of a majority here...mainly based on Cage vs Spiderman.

Im gonna have to agree here. ALTHOUGH, i must say that if Spidey were to web Cage up something nasty, its a wrap for team 1. If not, i give CAge and Fist a slight majority. Everything here depends on Spidey imo.

StarsNeverFall7

Is Cage strong enough to break the webbing? A location would be a bit easier to guage too, if it's in a open city it really opens the options for team 2. In a closed building scenario, it really helps out team 1.

jrodslam

Originally posted by StarsNeverFall7
Is Cage strong enough to break the webbing? A location would be a bit easier to guage too, if it's in a open city it really opens the options for team 2. In a closed building scenario, it really helps out team 1.

I think it depends on how much is applied. Spidey recently webbed Cage's hands up and when Cage tried to get them off, Spidey said that it'll be on for a few hours. His fists were completely coved in webbing. Kinda like boxing gloves.

If Spidey were just to web his arms, i think Cage could break free. All depends on how much is there.

Soljer

Originally posted by jrodslam
I think it depends on how much is applied. Spidey recently webbed Cage's hands up and when Cage tried to get them off, Spidey said that it'll be on for a few hours. His fists were completely coved in webbing. Kinda like boxing gloves.

If Spidey were just to web his arms, i think Cage could break free. All depends on how much is there.

What he said ^.

Spidey's webbing is kinda inconsistent. In some cases, it'll hold Rhino. In others, it's ripped apart by class 10 foes.

In others? It stops a full power uni beam.... stick out tongue

Wolverine2006

Wolverine vs. Cage...Wolverine is a better fighter and has claws that can cut through his skin. Cage is not strong enough to knock out Wolverine. Wolverine wins.

Spider-man vs. Iron Fist...Spider-man is faster and stronger, Spider-man wins easily, if hes not jobbing.

capt it up

If the fight is wolverine vs cage and spiderman vs IF.

The team 2 wins 8-9/10

Now is it is Wolverine vs IF and Spiderman vs Cage then it a lot closer. However wolevrine would take IF the magority. He far likly to take IF out then IF is to KO him. The you have spiderman and Luke cage which in my opinion spiderman would win. This fight would go 6-8/10 for the team depending on the enviorment.

jrodslam

Originally posted by capt it up
If the fight is wolverine vs cage and spiderman vs IF.

The team 2 wins 8-9/10

Now is it is Wolverine vs IF and Spiderman vs Cage then it a lot closer. However wolevrine would take IF the magority. He far likly to take IF out then IF is to KO him. The you have spiderman and Luke cage which in my opinion spiderman would win. This fight would go 6-8/10 for the team depending on the enviorment.

Ehh. I can live with most of that capt. Although id say if its Spidey vs Fist, Cage vs Wolvie team 2 takes 7-8/10.

Do you really think it woud be easier for Wolvie to take out Fist than it is for Fist to KO Wolvie? Thats the only part of your post that i disagree with.

capt it up

Originally posted by jrodslam
Ehh. I can live with most of that capt. Although id say if its Spidey vs Fist, Cage vs Wolvie team 2 takes 7-8/10.

Do you really think it woud be easier for Wolvie to take out Fist than it is for Fist to KO Wolvie? Thats the only part of your post that i disagree with.
yes actaully I do. First all logan has to do is stabb IF. IF has to power up his IF strong enough to KO wolverine which again is not likly to happen. It takes time to power it up that much and even at it best he only hitting with 100 class blows. Which we all know wolverien can take many of.

jrodslam

Originally posted by capt it up
yes actaully I do. First all logan has to do is stabb IF. IF has to power up his IF strong enough to KO wolverine which again is not likly to happen. It takes time to power it up that much and even at it best he only hitting with 100 class blows. Which we all know wolverien can take many of.

Not one bit do i think Wolverine can stab Iron Fist before Fist knocks him out with the If. You say it as if it would be an easy thing. Hey, opinions vary.

Metalmanx

Originally posted by jrodslam
Not one bit do i think Wolverine can stab Iron Fist before Fist knocks him out with the If. You say it as if it would be an easy thing. Hey, opinions vary.

Agreed. 50/50 between Fist and Wolvie.

capt it up

Originally posted by jrodslam
Not one bit do i think Wolverine can stab Iron Fist before Fist knocks him out with the If. You say it as if it would be an easy thing. Hey, opinions vary.
it would be. Why woudl IF be able to not only power up the IF to full power, but also land the hit before wolverine could. Oh and then add on the fact IF would need many hits when wolverine really only needs a stabb.

Logan needs one stabb

IF needs many hits.

logically wolverine would win.

Soljer

The Iron Fist knocked out Hercules. no expression

.

A full power Iron Fist has some insane feats. Seriously. If he landed ONE good, full power Fist, Logan'd be knocked for a loop.

capt it up

Originally posted by Soljer
The Iron Fist knocked out Hercules. no expression

.

A full power Iron Fist has some insane feats. Seriously. If he landed ONE good, full power Fist, Logan'd be knocked for a loop.
knock out hercules in one punch? Hell wolevrine him self has some crazy feats of kncoing out heavy hitters with fists.

I doubt one hit would be enough and it not like wolverine will simply let IF power up that much.

Soljer

Knocking out heavy hitters with fists? Name ONE besides Roughhouse, who is arguable at best.

capt it up

Originally posted by Soljer
Knocking out heavy hitters with fists? Name ONE besides Roughhouse, who is arguable at best.
calibain, and has beaten both war paths ( forgett there originaly names), domina, sun spot and a few others that slip my mind at the moment, rough-house is not arguable at all.

StarsNeverFall7

Like I already said, knowing each other as well as they do, and the fact that Logans claws can cut Cage, IF is going to take Logan and Cage Spidey, just smart for them as a team, and if they work together they should be able to pull a very slight majority, like 5.5-6/10. Like Soljer said though, opinions vary.

Soljer

Yeah he is. no expression

.

You've never been able to prove that he's a top tier brick.

Metalmanx

One good IF can knock Logan out. 50/50.

capt it up

Originally posted by Soljer
Yeah he is. no expression

.

You've never been able to prove that he's a top tier brick.
he between 75 tons and 100 as stated in his bio. He also been stated in many comics as being one of the strongest people wolverine knows, as well as being stated as just below hulk level.

Soljer

*still waiting*

capt it up

Originally posted by Soljer
*still waiting*
still waiitng on what?

Daredevil1

A drunk/Mortal Hercules......plus the IF technique is as random as Cap's shield affecting top-tiers. Or Daredevils pressure-points as well.

On the other hand we know how easily Logans claws can affect the street level group.

Wonder Man

the little psyco and most popular win this i figure.
pssst...Wolvie alone could prob. do them in. Having the web crawler on his side makes this a dance.

C_Skills

Spiderman was upgraded to a class 25 and then later brought back to a class ten so Luke Cage is stronger. Also they have fought before to a draw, but that's before Cage got his upgrade.

As for Wolverine and Iron Fist it can go either way.

But if we are taking about team up as mucha as i like Spiderman and Wolverine I would have to give it to Luke Cage and Iron Fist because they have work together longer.

srankmissingnin

Webbing + Claws = powerful combo.

Spider-man's webbing can incapacitate virtually anyone briefly, and Wolverine's claws can kill just about anyone. Spidy locks them down, and Wolverine finishes them off. Logan and Pete is potentially a very devastating combo, especially considering their relatively low rungs on the power scale; there is excellent synergy between their collective abilities.

jalek moye

Team 2

Spidey can contain either of team one for Wolverine to take down.

and even if Wolverine is busy fighting Iron Fist, Spidey can beat Cage or at the very least webb him up somewhere and go for a quick double beat down on Iron fist

Juk3n

Webbing is the game changer, sans webbing and team 1 look nice for this.

h1a8

Originally posted by C_Skills
Spiderman was upgraded to a class 25 and then later brought back to a class ten so Luke Cage is stronger. Also they have fought before to a draw, but that's before Cage got his upgrade.

As for Wolverine and Iron Fist it can go either way.

But if we are taking about team up as mucha as i like Spiderman and Wolverine I would have to give it to Luke Cage and Iron Fist because they have work together longer.

Actually classic Spiderman has mostly been around 25tons when serious. If he as the upgraded version was more stronger then that version was definitely over the 30ton level. Many say that spidey is about 10 tons. This is not true since Spidey has countless feats above 40tons, 50tons, and he even has some class 100 ton feats. It all depends on how serious he is.

Also, in almost everyone Spidey fight people always mention his strength and speed but not his most powerful power, his SPIDER SENSE. This is arguably one of the strongest powers in all of comics.
Spidey has dodged seeking lightning, homing lasers, and many other super fast sh!t due to his spider sense. The spider sense has been known to jerk his body out of the way before the attack is launched (without his permission or knowledge or of what is going on) as if it is a separate living entity. And it has guided his body perfectly out of the way through a many thick attacks such as a large hail of machine gun fire initiated by multiple shooters.

Spider-man if written correctly is unbeatable by any street leveler to mid tier. He his the most difficult character to write for. Most writer's have him get hit because they have no fuccking idea how to add adversity to the story. How can you defeat someone that virtually can't hit due to pre cog?

Juk3n

That is a lot of spider-wank their friend, "unbeatable by any street leveller to mid-tier" his ENTIRE career says otherwise, you can't call someones whole career PIS or bad writing. Spider-man gets hit, it's comics, EVERYONE gets hit at somepoint and no frickin' Spider-sense is gonna save him from an almighty whoop-ass come crunch time against someone - in comics - who has superior skill.

Phantom Zone

Luke has a better chance against Spiderman, if he goes up against Wolverine hes f*ked.

Originally posted by Juk3n
That is a lot of spider-wank their friend, "unbeatable by any street leveller to mid-tier" his ENTIRE career says otherwise, you can't call someones whole career PIS or bad writing. Spider-man gets hit, it's comics, EVERYONE gets hit at somepoint and no frickin' Spider-sense is gonna save him from an almighty whoop-ass come crunch time against someone - in comics - who has superior skill.

LOL did you see the latest issue of Spiderman were a policewomen kicks him in his head.

thanos-prime

Cage andIF

h1a8

Originally posted by Juk3n
That is a lot of spider-wank their friend, "unbeatable by any street leveller to mid-tier" his ENTIRE career says otherwise, you can't call someones whole career PIS or bad writing. Spider-man gets hit, it's comics, EVERYONE gets hit at somepoint and no frickin' Spider-sense is gonna save him from an almighty whoop-ass come crunch time against someone - in comics - who has superior skill.

Spider-man getting hit by slower beings is not PIS.

IT IS FALSE!

And being FALSE is stronger than being PIS since PIS can be accepted as the truth.

Rage.Of.Olympus

^Lol.

Team 1 wins.

Juk3n

Originally posted by h1a8
Spider-man getting hit by slower beings is not PIS.

IT IS FALSE!

And being FALSE is stronger than being PIS since PIS can be accepted as the truth. Do your arms not get tired?

Lord Prime

Team 1

srankmissingnin

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Webbing + Claws = powerful combo.

Spider-man's webbing can incapacitate virtually anyone briefly, and Wolverine's claws can kill just about anyone. Spidy locks them down, and Wolverine finishes them off. Logan and Pete is potentially a very devastating combo, especially considering their relatively low rungs on the power scale; there is excellent synergy between their collective abilities.

I think I'm just going to post this over and over again. Team 2 winning is the only acceptable answer.

Get it right people! mad

h1a8

Originally posted by Juk3n
Do your arms not get tired?

I don't understand. What does that mean?

StiltmanFTW

Originally posted by h1a8
I don't understand. What does that mean?

That means you're wanking Spiderboy too much.

--
T2 ftw.

SamZED

Originally posted by Phantom Zone
Luke has a better chance against Spiderman, if he goes up against Wolverine hes f*ked.

LOL did you see the latest issue of Spiderman were a policewomen kicks him in his head. That wasn't a woman. That was chameleon.

On-topc. Spider-man keeps IF busy while Logan stabs Luke. Then it's 2 against one. Wolverine and Spider-man = dead IF...

Stoic

Spideys best feats outweigh anything that Danny or Luke has done collectively not to mention 1 on 1. Firelord ring a bell? How about when he embarrassed the Xmen and the Fantastic 4.

Adding Wolverine to the mix is overkill.

Juk3n

Originally posted by Stoic
Firelord ring a bell?

Know better

Learn lessons

and GTFO!

cdtm

)

Remember evil, red suited Danny? Vibranium suit shredding ki levels? Luke Cage claimed he hit Danny as hard as he can in the back of his head, while in this condition, and he failed to knock him unconscious.

Basically, like Soljer said, his entire stats become amped while channeling his chi (Which is alluded to under Claremont when Colleen Wing gained the ability to amp her strength with her chi after mind melding with Danny.)

Since pictures are worth more then words, here's one of Danny restraining a tiger:

http://comicsalliance.com/luke-cage-power-man/

Nothing Spidey couldn't do without breaking a sweat, but it's certainly more then a normal street should be capable of.

pym-ftw

Lord Rand & the herald of Bendis

SamZED

Superior.

/thread.

pym-ftw

Superior spiderman got his face kicked in by iron fist...

SamZED

He kicked him once. It was both him and Cage. Plus a gauntlet of many other heroes before them. Also the Carrion virus left both Cage and Fist so SpOck probably beat them off-pannel. He's that awesome.

cdtm

Originally posted by Stoic
Spideys best feats outweigh anything that Danny or Luke has done collectively not to mention 1 on 1. Firelord ring a bell? How about when he embarrassed the Xmen and the Fantastic 4.

Adding Wolverine to the mix is overkill.

Herc is worth a Firelord, even while drunk. stick out tongue

And there's Bres.

h1a8

Team 2.
Logan is hard to put down with one shot claws and Spidey is just too fast and has unfair spidey sense.

cdtm

Originally posted by h1a8
Team 2.
Logan is hard to put down with one shot claws and Spidey is

just too fast and has unfair spidey sense.

Cage pins Logan with a big rock?

Seriously, whenever a "Wolverine can beat brick" arguments come up, I wonder why Hulk or someone never bothered dropping a mountain on him. Lets see him claw his way out of that.

And Danny can match Spidey's better speed feats. His bullet catch alone is > almost any bullet time feat you can bring up.

h1a8

Originally posted by cdtm
Cage pins Logan with a big rock?

Seriously, whenever a "Wolverine can beat brick" arguments come up, I wonder why Hulk or someone never bothered dropping a mountain on him. Lets see him claw his way out of that.

And Danny can match Spidey's better speed feats. His bullet catch alone is > almost any bullet time feat you can bring up.

Wolverine is faster and far more skilled than Cage and can cut him up (especially the eyes).

The bullet catch is nothing compared to moving one's WHOLE BODY completely out of the line of fire AFTER a bullet is only inches away. Or dodging and evading a homing bullet for a good while (even catching it at the end). Or covering so much ground to block bullets after they were fired. Let's face it, Spidey can move his body faster than Danny can move his hands LOL. But even if their speed was comparable we still have the unfair spidey sense along with being much stronger and more durable and with webbing.

cdtm

Originally posted by h1a8

The bullet catch is nothing compared to moving one's WHOLE BODY completely out of the line of fire AFTER a bullet is only inches away. Or dodging and evading a homing bullet for a good while (even catching it at the end). Or covering so much ground to block bullets after they were fired. Let's face it, Spidey can move his body faster than Danny can move his hands LOL. But even if their speed was comparable we still have the unfair spidey sense along with being much stronger and more durable and with webbing.

No calcs? Getting kind of lazy, aren't you h1? smile

And no, catching a bullet is more impressive then dodging a bullet. Unless the bullet is dodged at point blank range, with the muzzle up against the body.

cdtm

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/IronFist03-TheCitysNotforBurning-04_zps01908250.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/IronFist03-TheCitysNotforBurning-05_zpsf5383291.jpg

h1a8

Originally posted by cdtm
No calcs? Getting kind of lazy, aren't you h1? smile

LOL calcs aren't need when there is a big enough difference.
Let's say that the bullet was fired 10ft away from Danny before he caught it.
So Danny moved his hand about 3-4ft in that time the bullet was traveling.

Spidey moved his body about 3ft when the bullet was 2-3 inches away from him. This is a big difference.

In another scene, Spidey traveled at least 10ft after bullets were fired at someone. Spidey reacted, traveled more than 10ft and got in front and blocked them with webbing.

Im mostly joking of course here. I do believe Spidey is faster (not a whole lot though) but I feel his spidey sense is the key along with his superior strength and pain in the ass webbing.

Daredevil1

Spiderman and Logan got this.

cdtm

Originally posted by h1a8
LOL calcs aren't need when there is a big enough difference.
Let's say that the bullet was fired 10ft away from Danny before he caught it.
So Danny moved his hand about 3-4ft in that time the bullet was traveling.

So, by your logic:

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/0/2532/496833-batgirl022_10_11.jpg

Batgirl is as fast as Spider-man? big grin

That bullet came awfully close, before she started moving.

h1, do you know the velocity of military grade flechette rounds?

Pretty sure they're slower then bullets at any distance due to wind drag, but have comparable muzzle escape velocity.

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/scale_super/8/83871/2916597-ironfist01_2.jpg

And these flechettes could pierce steel. Danny redirects something like 50 of them here, at point blank range, without getting a scratch on him.

cdtm

Originally posted by h1a8

Im mostly joking of course here. I do believe Spidey is faster (not a whole lot though) but I feel his spidey sense is the key along with his superior strength and pain in the ass webbing.

If we're in agreement about their speed, relative to each other, then here's my main point:

Lets say Spider-Oct comes flying at him with his best punch. Iron Fist is ready for him, with an Iron Fist. The results would probably look something like this:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/Spider-ManUnlimited13p40_zps530f9070.jpg

Just picture Spidey's fist instead of Scorpian's tail. (Incidentally, the tails fast enough to catch even Spidey with his SS flatfooted, if he's distracted. Happened a few issues after the one this scan is from, so this is quite the reaction/speed feat in addition to a pure power feat.)

h1a8

Originally posted by cdtm
If we're in agreement about their speed, relative to each other, then here's my main point:

Lets say Spider-Oct comes flying at him with his best punch. Iron Fist is ready for him, with an Iron Fist. The results would probably look something like this:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/Spider-ManUnlimited13p40_zps530f9070.jpg

Just picture Spidey's fist instead of Scorpian's tail. (Incidentally, the tails fast enough to catch even Spidey with his SS flatfooted, if he's distracted. Happened a few issues after the one this scan is from, so this is quite the reaction/speed feat in addition to a pure power feat.)

Characters in comics have varying speed, strength, power showings. They don't always operate at the same levels. Spidey has operated at slightly above human speed to speeds multiple times faster than bullets, same with scorpion or any other character.

Gladiator shattered a planet with a few punches. It would be stupid of me to argue
"Colossus beats Namor for a majority because he tanked Gladiator punches and Gladiator was shown to destroy planets with his punches."

Arguments like that are faulty but nonetheless convincing to those who don't understand how comics work.

I believe that Spidey can operate his limbs about 1.5-3x faster than Iron Fist. But he holds back. So that would probably reduce his attack speed to that of Iron Fist levels. Similarly, Iron Fist (in character) wouldn't attempt to shatter Spidey's arm like he did Scorpions tail. Scorpions tail can be replaced while Spidey's arm cannot. Plus Spidey's sense would be going off and telling him not to throw that particular punch at that time (rather use webbing instead).

deathslash

I think team one wins this fight more times than not. cage and Iron fist have a very good amount of skill and training together. it would be a very hard fought battle, but I think team one wins 6/10

cdtm

Originally posted by h1a8
Characters in comics have varying speed, strength, power showings. They don't always operate at the same levels. Spidey has operated at slightly above human speed to speeds multiple times faster than bullets, same with scorpion or any other character.

Gladiator shattered a planet with a few punches. It would be stupid of me to argue
"Colossus beats Namor for a majority because he tanked Gladiator punches and Gladiator was shown to destroy planets with his punches."

Arguments like that are faulty but nonetheless convincing to those who don't understand how comics work.

I believe that Spidey can operate his limbs about 1.5-3x faster than Iron Fist. But he holds back. So that would probably reduce his attack speed to that of Iron Fist levels. Similarly, Iron Fist (in character) wouldn't attempt to shatter Spidey's arm like he did Scorpions tail. Scorpions tail can be replaced while Spidey's arm cannot. Plus Spidey's sense would be going off and telling him not to throw that particular punch at that time (rather use webbing instead).

Danny's also operated from slightly above peak human, to much faster then bullets.

So how can you make a hard claim about Spider-man's limb speed relative to Iron Fist's?

I think Claremont nailed it with his Steel Serpent/Spider-man fight, where at full speed Spidey was quick enough to dart in and out of SS's reach, but was unable to hit him at full strength , or more then once or twice, for fear of being hit with a fully chi amped punch (Which Spidey's durability would be useless against.)

Or put another way, a middleweight boxer is faster then a heavyweight boxer. A middleweight might even be able to win on points. But all the heavyweight needs to land, is a single punch..

h1a8

Originally posted by cdtm
Danny's also operated from slightly above peak human, to much faster then bullets.

So how can you make a hard claim about Spider-man's limb speed relative to Iron Fist's?

I think Claremont nailed it with his Steel Serpent/Spider-man fight, where at full speed Spidey was quick enough to dart in and out of SS's reach, but was unable to hit him at full strength , or more then once or twice, for fear of being hit with a fully chi amped punch (Which Spidey's durability would be useless against.)

Or put another way, a middleweight boxer is faster then a heavyweight boxer. A middleweight might even be able to win on points. But all the heavyweight needs to land, is a single punch.. I can make a claim about Spider-man's relative speed because he is normally portrayed as faster than IF. He is a low level speedster. Plus I use a character's full capacity as the power level in a forum fight.

Spidey could kill IF with one punch if he didn't hold back. Peter can literally punch and grab his heart. Spidey holds back on beings he can kill. IF also isn't going to hit Spidey with a killing punch either (he holds back too). Both can ko the other in one hit or two if they unleash a little. Spidey's chance of hitting IF is much greater than the other way around. Spidey has SS added to his speed, reflexes, and agility. He also has webbing to slow IF down greatly.

cdtm

Originally posted by h1a8
I can make a claim about Spider-man's relative speed because he is normally portrayed as faster than IF. He is a low level speedster. Plus I use a character's full capacity as the power level in a forum fight.

Spidey could kill IF with one punch if he didn't hold back. Peter can literally punch and grab his heart. Spidey holds back on beings he can kill. IF also isn't going to hit Spidey with a killing punch either (he holds back too). Both can ko the other in one hit or two if they unleash a little. Spidey's chance of hitting IF is much greater than the other way around. Spidey has SS added to his speed, reflexes, and agility. He also has webbing to slow IF down greatly.

You seem to be under the impression that Danny's durability is street level.

The truth is, his durability is variable depending on his chi amping.. This is proven in numerous stories, like the one where Luke Cage failed to knock him out with a punch to the back of the head when he was red suited "evil Iron Fist". And Black Panther could not even get a reaction against the same.

Obviously, these are extreme examples, but it's more likely Iron Fist can simply block Spider Man's attacks with his charged Iron Fist's, which he tends to have charged nearly all the time lately, and greatly enhances the durability of his hand and arm (Hence why it's called "Iron Fist" wink

.

Spidey, on the other hand, can't really block an IF.. He'd need to fully dodge. The fact he HAS to dodge, and opens himself up to being hit whenever he's in striking range, either gives Danny a defensive advantage, or negates Spidey's speed advantage, depending on how much faster you think he is.

Also, while Spidey has webbing, Danny has ranged attacks of his own. His chi attacks can be cast out like "beams" of sorts, shockwaves, all by punching the air.

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/Misc/IronFist-016.jpg

http://i825.photobucket.com/albums/zz176/jalekmoye/Danny%20respect%20thread/Misc/Immortal_Iron_Fist_001_010.jpg

And as a final demonstration of the IF's amping ability, and specifically against Spidey's webbing:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v330/CDTM3000/marvelteamup031p17_zpsb2797c90.jpg

When the likes of Black Tarantula break his webbing like this, Spidey reacts in shock, so that gives you an idea of how impressive this feat is. (Bricks like Cage, and Rogue struggle to break it. Spidey himself was trapped in webbing once, having to wait for it to dissolve naturally.)

Yes, Danny waited a bit before performing his amping, but this is also very early Iron Fist. I believe it even predates Chris Claremont's series. Today, he could perform this feat effortlessly and immediately.