Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

?

Scathan is not a supreme being..Beyonder win this easily..

Beyonder should win. But, it's hard to say. If Scathan was an agent imbued with the TOAA's power for that fight, then it could be a stalemate...not enough is known.

Beyonder crushed an entire planet full of Celestials using only hand to hand fighting. This is almost spite.

Originally posted by frommd
Beyonder crushed an entire planet full of Celestials using only hand to hand fighting. This is almost spite.

Beyonder

Originally posted by frommd
Beyonder crushed an entire planet full of Celestials using only hand to hand fighting. This is almost spite. 1.) A planet 'full of Celestials' = about 8 of them.

B.) Scathan isn't exactly your 'standard' Celestial.

Beyonder.

Originally posted by Galan007
1.) A planet 'full of Celestials' = about 8 of them.

B.) Scathan isn't exactly your 'standard' Celestial. Beyonder can't handle the muzel!

Scathan has one feat that is very ambiguous. He didn't even actually defeat the cosmic kid. And the PR beyonder has no actual battle feats of anyone anywhere near omniversal lvl.

Stalemate.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Scathan has one feat that is very ambiguous. He didn't even actually defeat the cosmic kid. And the PR beyonder has no actual battle feats of anyone anywhere near omniversal lvl.

Stalemate. He didn't erase Death?

Originally posted by Mindset
He didn't erase Death? you mean with a sizable portion of his power. Did she fight back?

Originally posted by fangirl101
you mean with a sizable portion of his power. Did she fight back? When he erased Death he was limiting himself. And I don't think it actually took a sizable portion of his power since he brought her back w/o any signs of weakening, as far as I remember.

I don't see how her fighting back would do anything, Beyonder could erase her from existence and bring her back on a whim...and I don't she wanted to be erased, but she probably knew there was nothing she could do about it.

Originally posted by Mindset
When he erased Death he was limiting himself. And I don't think it actually took a sizable portion of his power since he brought her back w/o any signs of weakening, as far as I remember.

I don't see how her fighting back would do anything, Beyonder could erase her from existence and bring her back on a whim...and I don't she wanted to be erased, but she probably knew there was nothing she could do about it. you are doing a lot of subjective reasoning.

He couldn't bring her back unless someone sacrificed themself.

he also didn't really erase the concept of death. Just the power of death over all things living. Becuz had he actually erased death, no one would have known what it was.

Originally posted by Galan007
B.) Scathan isn't exactly your 'standard' Celestial. on panel did they jus say "scathan the celestial" or did they add something like "super-celestial" or "trans-uber-celestial" or somethin like that?

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
on panel did they jus say "scathan the celestial" or did they add something like "super-celestial" or "trans-uber-celestial" or somethin like that?

Galan is correct.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Beyonder can't handle the muzel! He can't handle the muzzle, either!! 313

Originally posted by Galan007
He can't handle the muzzle, either!! 313

Gotta stop sippin' Beyonder Haterade.

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
on panel did they jus say "scathan the celestial" or did they add something like "super-celestial" or "trans-uber-celestial" or somethin like that? No, his feats cover that.

And Beyonder wins.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Gotta stop sippin' Beyonder Haterade. Not hating anyone. Just making fun of Bran, is all. ermmgrin

Originally posted by Galan007
Not hating anyone. Just making fun of Bran, is all. ermmgrin

Oh. Well that's definitely allowed. Even encouraged. Carry on.

Originally posted by Galan007
He can't handle the muzzle, either!! 313 fail

Originally posted by SoulDevourer
on panel did they jus say "scathan the celestial" or did they add something like "super-celestial" or "trans-uber-celestial" or somethin like that? Legendary Celestial

Beyonder stomps him.

Beyonder easily.

Admittedly, I don't know a lot about Scathan. But, I do know Beyonder was stated to be "millions of times more powerful than all the rest of the multiverse combined."

http://img431.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyondermillionsofxmorepowerfu.jpg

Originally posted by frommd
Admittedly, I don't know a lot about Scathan. But, I do know Beyonder was stated to be "millions of times more powerful than all the rest of the multiverse combined."

http://img431.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyondermillionsofxmorepowerfu.jpg Scathan was shown to be At least equal if not superior to the lt who is infinitly more powrerful than the multiverse.

Beyonder pawn LT and all the other abstract

Originally posted by frommd
Beyonder crushed an entire planet full of Celestials using only hand to hand fighting. This is almost spite. Scathan is more than any other Celestial imo, but that doesn't change the outcome of this. Beyonder ftw.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Scathan was shown to be At least equal if not superior to the lt who is infinitly more powrerful than the multiverse. Didn't pre-retcon Beyonder beat LT? Can't find the scans.

No, he just made the LT cower before him like a sissy.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
No, he just made the LT cower before him like a sissy. I would love to see the scan where LT 'cowers before Beyonder like a sissy.' I truly would.

Though if I had to guess, I'd say you're just over-exaggerating this scan (the next to last panel, in particular):

http://s1d2.turboimagehost.com/t/1494288_sw1.jpg

That's probably as close to the LT cowering as we're ever going to see.

I remember that issue where Odin died and everyone across all realities reacted to it. The LT barely took notice.

Originally posted by Galan007
I would love to see the scan where LT 'cowers before Beyonder like a sissy.' I truly would.

Though if I had to guess, I'd say you're just over-exaggerating this scan (the next to last panel, in particular):

http://s1d2.turboimagehost.com/t/1494288_sw1.jpg Arguing semantics ftl.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
That's probably as close to the LT cowering as we're ever going to see.

I remember that issue where Odin died and everyone across all realities reacted to it. The LT barely took notice. Meh, LT's face (along with the faces of other members of the hierarchy) is displayed, along with the quote - "and the mighty of the multiverse tremble." That is a far cry from LT 'cowering before Beyonder like a sissy.'

To me, at least.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Arguing semantics ftl. I argued nothing but a blatant over-exaggeration.

Was LT 'scared' of Beyonder's next move? Presumably so. Was he cowering at Beyonder's feet? Nope.

LT is the judge, grand artbitor of the omniverse. He's suppose to be completely unbiased. I very much doubt you're going to see an obvious emotional response to anything from the LT.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
I very much doubt you're going to see an obvious emotional response to anything from the LT. Which is, more or less, my point.

Is it?

Originally posted by Mindset
Is it? Yesh.

What omniverse was the lt over in85?

The DC Omniverse

Originally posted by Mindset
The DC Omniverse I am not sure whether to lol or masturbate.

LT does look much like the AM. No one else sees the resemblance?

Originally posted by Enyalus
LT does look much like the AM. No one else sees the resemblance? ?

http://i342.photobucket.com/albums/o411/bomber59/Marvel%20Figurines/Fig%20Mega%20Special/Living_Tribunal_001.gif

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y72/dstorres/DCU/anti-monitor.jpg

Explain.

Originally posted by ThunderGodEneru
Explain.

You just posted the explanation.

scathan should fashion the AM some celestial braces for his teeth.

Originally posted by Galan007
I would love to see the scan where LT 'cowers before Beyonder like a sissy.' I truly would.

Though if I had to guess, I'd say you're just over-exaggerating this scan (the next to last panel, in particular):

http://s1d2.turboimagehost.com/t/1494288_sw1.jpg Don't think he cowered like a sissy, but he didn't seem able to do anything to stop Beyonder.

There was also the scans where Eternity, LT and a bunch of other abstracts show up to stop Beyonder from erasing Death. Note the second panel of the second scan, Beyonder is said to be, "more powerful than everybody else in the room combined." That included; Living Tribunal, Pre-retcon Molecule Man, Eternity and more.
http://img128.imageshack.us/my.php?image=abstractsbegbeyonder2wr7.jpg
http://img391.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyonderkillsdeath2kv6.jpg
http://img162.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyonderkillsdeath3tq0.jpg

Originally posted by frommd
Don't think he cowered like a sissy, but he didn't seem able to do anything to stop Beyonder.

There was also the scans where Eternity, LT and a bunch of other abstracts show up to stop Beyonder from erasing Death. Note the second panel of the second scan, Beyonder is said to be, "more powerful than everybody else in the room combined." That included; Living Tribunal, Pre-retcon Molecule Man, Eternity and more.
http://img128.imageshack.us/my.php?image=abstractsbegbeyonder2wr7.jpg
http://img391.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyonderkillsdeath2kv6.jpg
http://img162.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyonderkillsdeath3tq0.jpg Which means the story is crap concerning the LT of today. Becuz He is more powerful than everyone else. His power is as infinite above everyone else as thiers is above a regular human being.

Originally posted by fangirl101
Which means the story is crap concerning the LT of today. Becuz He is more powerful than everyone else. His power is as infinite above everyone else as thiers is above a regular human being. Maybe so. The story wasn't that great, but that is how Beyonder was portrayed back then. He was that powerful. So, back to the fight, Beyonder wins.

Originally posted by frommd
Maybe so. The story wasn't that great, but that is how Beyonder was portrayed back then. He was that powerful. So, back to the fight, Beyonder wins. He was that powerful. But He was that powerful over an LT that was LESS powerful.

Originally posted by fangirl101
He was that powerful. But He was that powerful over an LT that was LESS powerful. I didn't look at it as LT was diminished in the story, Beyonder was just that much more powerful. In the other scan I posted it is said Beyonder is "millions of times more powerful than the rest of the multiverse combined."
http://img431.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyondermillionsofxmorepowerfu.jpg

To fangirl101

That's like saying we can use the feats of the Living Tribunal of yesterday.

If they're not the same, then the current Living Tribunal doesn't have the former Living Tribunal's feat, vice versa. Where would we draw the line. Does a new Living Tribunal come out every year or so? You see how retarded that sounds?

Originally posted by frommd
I didn't look at it as LT was diminished in the story, Beyonder was just that much more powerful. In the other scan I posted it is said Beyonder is "millions of times more powerful than the rest of the multiverse combined."
http://img431.imageshack.us/my.php?image=beyondermillionsofxmorepowerfu.jpg I never said the LT was diminished. But he was a shadow of what he is today. Today he's the boss of the Omniverse. That includes everything. Event he Beyond wrealm which is now part of the Omniverse. Back then, he was only the boss of the Multiverse. And not even the entire multiverse. Becuz the Molecule man was more powerful than he.

Originally posted by fangirl101
I never said the LT was diminished. But he was a shadow of what he is today. Today he's the boss of the Omniverse. That includes everything. Event he Beyond wrealm which is now part of the Omniverse. Back then, he was only the boss of the Multiverse. And not even the entire multiverse. Becuz the Molecule man was more powerful than he. By this statement, you are retconning Beyonder.

Originally posted by Astner
To fangirl101

That's like saying we can use the feats of the Living Tribunal of yesterday.

If they're not the same, then the current Living Tribunal doesn't have the former Living Tribunal's feat, vice versa. Where would we draw the line. Does a new Living Tribunal come out every year or so? You see how retarded that sounds?
Actually people are trying to use the current lt's feats as a power gage for the beyonder from yesteryear. You see how retarded that sounds?

Originally posted by frommd
By this statement, you are retconning Beyonder. No. I'm stating facts. The editors already retconned him for me. thanks.

Originally posted by fangirl101
No. I'm stating facts. The editors already retconned him for me. thanks. But, the thread is pre-retcon Beyonder, so it doesn't matter what the editors have done since.

Originally posted by frommd
But, the thread is pre-retcon Beyonder, so it doesn't matter what the editors have done since. but fangirl says that beyonder has been retconned, so it doesn't matter what the OP said

If using pre-retconned Beyonder, it's logical you use only the pre-retconned period, and all the feats Living Tribunal/Eternity etc have done during that time. Only those.

Originally posted by Galan007
I've seen the scans/read the comics several times. I know what happens. All I corrected was an extreme exaggeration that was made, regarding LT/Beyonder.I agree with you it was an extreme exaggeration.
But... But... We need to make Beyonder look as powerful as possible. Fanboy. none Not sure if you were directing this at me. But, I'm just going by what was shown on panel. I thought the Beyonder was a pretty stupid character personally after Secret Wars I, but he was portrayed as more powerful, by a lot, over everyone else combined.

Sorry if you don't like it, but that is what was shown.

Originally posted by frommd
I agree with you it was an extreme exaggeration.

Originally posted by frommd
Not sure if you were directing this at me. Nope, it was directed at Phil (hence the reason I quoted/replied to his post.)

Originally posted by Galan007 Nope, it was directed at Phil (hence the reason I quoted/replied to his post.) Cool.

Originally posted by frommd
Cool. lol u fell for that.

Originally posted by fangirl101
lol u fell for that. You're really smart. I'm jealous of you.

lol

I don't know if you guys buy into the omnipotence over feats bullshit. But if we use that specific period of time, then he was supreme--equal to TOAA. Basically a trade of positions.

Originally posted by Astner
I don't know if you guys buy into the omnipotence over feats bullshit. But if we use that specific period of time, then he was supreme--equal to TOAA. Basically a trade of positions. no he wasnt. toaa knows all. is absolutely omnipotent. the beyonder wasnt even the creatopr of the marvel multiverse. he was not toaa. not even close.

Originally posted by Galan007
But... But... We need to make Beyonder look as powerful as possible. Fanboy. none

facepalm I forgot. I apologize.

I'll go back to ignoring pre-retconned Beyonder/Molecule Man threads.

Originally posted by fangirl101
no he wasnt. toaa knows all. is absolutely omnipotent. the beyonder wasnt even the creatopr of the marvel multiverse. he was not toaa. not even close. So, what is your opinion based on? I've shown scans that say he was millions of times more powerful than the Marvel multiverse combined. But, you just say, "no, he wasn't." That's your great argument?Originally posted by Galan007
It would behoove you.

uhuh Who do you pick in the fight Galan?

Originally posted by frommd
So, what is your opinion based on? I've shown scans that say he was millions of times more powerful than the Marvel multiverse combined. But, you just say, "no, he wasn't." That's your great argument? Who do you pick in the fight Galan? no. I'm basing it on the fact that the lt is currently more powerful than the omniverse. Which is bigger than the multiverse. And that the beyond wrealm is part of the omniverse.

Preretcon beyonder was more powerful than lt, around toaa level above below at... Whatever...

Postretcon beyonder is less than lt who is less than toaa

In both instances scathan is less than lt. Therefore preretcon wins. Post well there's your possible debate.

Originally posted by rotiart
In both instances scathan is less than lt. nope

Originally posted by fangirl101
no. I'm basing it on the fact that the lt is currently more powerful than the omniverse. Which is bigger than the multiverse. And that the beyond wrealm is part of the omniverse. But, you ignore the fact that Beyonder was standing a few feet from LT and was said to be much more powerful than him and all the other abstracts there?

Originally posted by frommd
But, you ignore the fact that Beyonder was standing a few feet from LT and was said to be much more powerful than him and all the other abstracts there? and u ignore the faxt that the lt had no beyond multiversal feats then as a matter of fact he was weaker than the molecule man. Pre retconned beyonder was only more powerfulk than the pre retconned abstracts.

Originally posted by fangirl101
and u ignore the faxt that the lt had no beyond multiversal feats then as a matter of fact he was weaker than the molecule man. Pre retconned beyonder was only more powerfulk than the pre retconned abstracts. So, despite the fact that they are standing a few feet apart and Beyonder is said to by much more powerful, I should ignore that and say that really LT is more powerful because you think so? Maybe LT just hadn't hit puberty yet?

I think I'll stick with what happened in the comics instead. Thanks though.

I'm not a fanboy of Beyonder. I think he was a stupid character. Looked like David Hasselhoff with a disco suit on, but his feats at that time are not ambiguous. LT, and all the others were powerless to stop him.

I've looked in the Celestials respect thread and the scans of Scathan show nothing that makes me think the outcome of this would be any different. Beyonder wins.

Originally posted by fangirl101
and u ignore the faxt that the lt had no beyond multiversal feats then as a matter of fact he was weaker than the molecule man. Pre retconned beyonder was only more powerfulk than the pre retconned abstracts.

Do you also ignore that narration said Beyonder was millions of times more powerful than the rest of the Marvel Universe?

That alone with erasing Lady Death would give him the win in my book.

Originally posted by rotiart
In both instances scathan is less than lt.

Nope.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Do you also ignore that narration said Beyonder was millions of times more powerful than the rest of the Marvel Universe?

That alone with erasing Lady Death would give him the win in my book.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Nope.


Marvel Heiarchy

1)TOAA
2)Pre retcon Beyonder
3)Heart of the Infinite (artifact)
4)The Living Tribunal

Scathan is somewhere below all of these

Originally posted by Doom and Gloom
Marvel Heiarchy

1)TOAA
2)Pre retcon Beyonder
3)Heart of the Infinite (artifact)
4)The Living Tribunal

Scathan is somewhere below all of these

2 of those no longer exsist and Scathan slots in right above the LT.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
2 of those no longer exsist TOAA and LT?

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
2 of those no longer exsist and Scathan slots in right above the LT.

Can you provide scans proving Scathan is above LT?

Originally posted by Doom and Gloom
Can you provide scans proving Scathan is above LT? The fact that Scathan beat someone more powerful than LT (ie. Protege) with a gesture?

Originally posted by Galan007
The fact that Scathan beat someone more powerful than LT (ie. Protege) with a gesture?

When I read that last issue, I think of the ending of Terminator 2...

Originally posted by Enyalus
When I read that last issue, I think of the ending of Terminator 2... I didn't see Arnold Schwarzenegger get melted in that issue. mmm

Originally posted by Galan007
I didn't see Arnold Schwarzenegger get melted in that issue. mmm

I get the special edition Marvel comics like TP gets the special edition DC comics.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I get the special edition Marvel comics like TP gets the special edition DC comics. So that's why your debating skillz are so similiar to his...

Originally posted by Galan007
So that's why your debating skillz are so similiar to his...

I. Have. The Powerrrrrr!

Originally posted by Doom and Gloom
Marvel Heiarchy

1)TOAA
2)Pre retcon Beyonder
3)Heart of the Infinite (artifact)
4)The Living Tribunal

Scathan is somewhere below all of these Why do you have the beyonder above the heart?

Beyonder erases him. I speak the truth.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why do you have the beyonder above the heart?

Because the heart is only more powerful than our multiverse from what we've seen. Beyonder was said to be millions of times more powerful than that.

Originally posted by Doom and Gloom
Because the heart is only more powerful than our multiverse from what we've seen. Beyonder was said to be millions of times more powerful than that. The heart was well beyond the Lt and everyone combined. Thanos easily crapped all over them while the Beyonder drained himself erasing death. Thanos showed not one weakness.

There is no proof that Protege was above the LT at all or what would've happened had they fought it out till the end. Just because a 'super' celestial muzzles Protege from behind, so he couldn't witness that power and copy it, says nothing of what would've happened had they been face to face as the LT and Protege were. I see no proof that Scathan could've absorb Protege the way the LT did. To me if it was that easy he should've just finished the job and done it. However, it seemed to me like he probably couldn't have and just need to give the LT time to 'powerup' and finish the job. I see no proof at all that Protege/Scathan were above the LT

Originally posted by quanchi112
The heart was well beyond the Lt and everyone combined.


So was Beyonder



Thanos easily crapped all over them while the Beyonder drained himself erasing death.

Beyonder was deliberatly holding back there

Originally posted by Doom and Gloom
Beyonder didn't prove it though by taking them all on at once. Thanos did. All we have on panel is beyonder limiting himself so that is what we can debate against.

Originally posted by quanchi112

The heart was well beyond the Lt and everyone combined.
Thanos easily crapped all over them

while the Beyonder drained himself erasing death.

Thanos showed not one weakness.
While I agree Beyonder & the Heart would stalemate,
due to the fact that Supreme Being vs Supreme Being = stalemate,
I have to point out that stating Beyonder was drained by killing Death is false.

Not only was Beyonder ridiculously limiting himself at that point,
but Beyonder re-created Death with a gesture afterwards.

Had Beyonder "drained" himself,
he wouldn't have been able to perform the latter.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
There is no proof that Protege was above the LT at all or what would've happened had they fought it out till the end. Just because a 'super' celestial muzzles Protege from behind, so he couldn't witness that power and copy it, says nothing of what would've happened had they been face to face as the LT and Protege were. I see no proof that Scathan could've absorb Protege the way the LT did. To me if it was that easy he should've just finished the job and done it. However, it seemed to me like he probably couldn't have and just need to give the LT time to 'powerup' and finish the job. I see no proof at all that Protege/Scathan were above the LT

and again

There's proof.