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who wins.

Takion. Pretty easily.

Monarch

Monarch.

Originally posted by Galan007
Monarch.

Originally posted by KingD19
Monarch

Monarch

Originally posted by Enyalus
Takion. Pretty easily. im curious why you think this?

monarch ftw.

Originally posted by Merlyn
im curious why you think this?

monarch ftw.

Nathaniel already has had his energies messed with and controlled by an upstart Takion. Monarch would be no different. Plus Takion can warp and contort the metal of Monarch's suit via magnetic or gravitational manipulation. He can create black holes to suck Monarch into, freeze time to do whatever he wants to him, step between time (thus moving faster than Monarch could ever hope to cope with), teleport, go intangible, shift his own energies into dark matter or anti-matter to screw with Monarch. Or, like I originally said - control Monarch's own energies, which stem from the Quantum Field...of which is only one limited aspect of The Source, which Takion controls.

Takion takes it easily IMO.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Nathaniel already has had his energies messed with and controlled by an upstart Takion. Monarch would be no different. This logic is on the same line as saying BP could suck Galactus's energy because he sucked Surfer's (ignoring Duff).

Or that the cosmic shark would fudge Galactus over srsly.

Originally posted by Mekrob
This logic is on the same line as saying BP could suck Galactus's energy because he sucked Surfer's (ignoring Duff).

They're the same person, CA and Monarch. Different suit.

Originally posted by Enyalus
They're the same person, CA and Monarch. Different suit. Completely different power levels.

And the same thing powers Surfer and Galactus, no?

Originally posted by Enyalus
Nathaniel already has had his energies messed with and controlled by an upstart Takion. Monarch would be no different. Plus Takion can warp and contort the metal of Monarch's suit via magnetic or gravitational manipulation. He can create black holes to suck Monarch into, freeze time to do whatever he wants to him, step between time (thus moving faster than Monarch could ever hope to cope with), teleport, go intangible, shift his own energies into dark matter or anti-matter to screw with Monarch. Or, like I originally said - control Monarch's own energies, which stem from the Quantum Field...of which is only one limited aspect of The Source, which Takion controls.

Takion takes it easily IMO. I disagree with the better majority of this.

Originally posted by Galan007
I disagree with the better majority of this.

Lol. I'm happy to see you disagree in such a civilized manner.

Originally posted by Mekrob
And the same thing powers Surfer and Galactus, no?

Sure, but they're different beings. And the power levels separating them are a lot more than 50 fold (Monarch absorbing the other CAs in existence).

But lets go with that...what's Monarch's defense against freezing time or a black hole to the face or a molecular dispersal or a number of other (frankly) stupid powers Takion has?

Originally posted by Enyalus
But lets go with that...what's Monarch's defense against freezing time or a black hole to the face or a molecular dispersal or a number of other (frankly) stupid powers Takion has? The fact that CA has demonstrated crap like that in the past?

Originally posted by Galan007
The fact that CA has demonstrated crap like that in the past?

The Source > Quantum Field. uhuh

Takion.






















































...looks tighter.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Sure, but they're different beings. And the power levels separating them are a lot more than 50 fold (Monarch absorbing the other CAs in existence).

But lets go with that...what's Monarch's defense against freezing time or a black hole to the face or a molecular dispersal or a number of other (frankly) stupid powers Takion has? Who operate under the same power... which is the only thing in a forum battle really connecting Monarch to CA.
But there's a massive power difference regardless, and that's the point. What happened to a CA who was, by your logic 50 times less powerful is not relevant to Monarch. Just because he can screw with the power at let's say, the lowest level, doesn't mean he can screw with it at an extremely high level.

Also, it's far more than 50x. Remember that Monarch beat all of those CA's (as well as Supermen) before he absorbed them.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Just because he can screw with the power at let's say, the lowest level, doesn't mean he can screw with it at an extremely high level.

I think he can. *shrug* He's nearly a skyfather-level energy manipulator who knows exactly what Monarch's power is due to his cosmic awareness and previous experience with Adam. And even if we leave out the screwing with his power angle, he's still got a host of other abilities to take Monarch down with.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I think he can. *shrug* He's nearly a skyfather-level energy manipulator who knows exactly what Monarch's power is due to his cosmic awareness and previous experience with Adam. And even if we leave out the screwing with his power angle, he's still got a host of other abilities to take Monarch down with. I think I can touch the moon if I get hard enough.

Which obviously means he can manipulate the energy as easily he did CA. Hell, there's no chance that he gets overloaded by energy that can destroy the universe, or simply can't manipulate it.
Did you miss the point behind the comparisons with Surfer and Big G by the way?

No doubt... but I have no idea what he could use off the top of my mind. refresh.

Originally posted by Mekrob
I think I can touch the moon if I get hard enough.

You probably can. My mother always said you can do anything you set your mind to. Give it a try.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Which obviously means he can manipulate the energy as easily he did CA. Hell, there's no chance that he gets overloaded by energy that can destroy the universe, or simply can't manipulate it.

Why? He routinely channels and manipulates energy which powers the entire multiverse. Of which the Quantum Field is only a small fraction.

Originally posted by Mekrob
No doubt... but I have no idea what he could use off the top of my mind. refresh.

Black hole generation, other BFR, molecular dispersion (he did so to Stayne, who herself is at least trans-tiered), temporal manipulation, energy blasts, gravitational mucking (nice scientific term, no?), magnetic field tampering, changing his own energy into anti-matter to royally screw Monarch, etc. Plenty of things.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Why? He routinely channels and manipulates energy which powers the entire multiverse. Of which the Quantum Field is only a small fraction. In tiny... tiny... etc quantities. Just because someone can manipulate a glass of water, doesn't mean he can manipulate an ocean.



Originally posted by Enyalus
Black hole generation, other BFR, molecular dispersion (he did so to Stayne, who herself is at least trans-tiered), temporal manipulation, energy blasts, gravitational mucking (nice scientific term, no?), magnetic field tampering, changing his own energy into anti-matter to royally screw Monarch, etc. Plenty of things. You do realize that Monarch can teleport himself across universes, and heal (or at the very least, create parts of himself) himself (assuming Takion could screw with his molecules). Which answers most of your scenarios.

If energy blasts can do it...

First off, when did he change himself into anti-matter, and second why would we assume he'd do it here? CIS is on.

Originally posted by Mekrob
In tiny... tiny... etc quantities. Just because someone can manipulate a glass of water, doesn't mean he can manipulate an ocean.
Why not? Makes perfect sense to me.


On a completely unrelated note, I agree with Carver 98% of the time.


Originally posted by Mekrob
First off, when did he change himself into anti-matter, and second why would we assume he'd do it here? CIS is on.
He's done it in battle before, so its a viable tactic here:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/th_Takion_Staye_AM1.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/th_Takion_Staye_AM2.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/th_Takion_Staye_AM3.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/th_Takion_Staye_AM4.jpg

Originally posted by Enyalus
On a completely unrelated note, I agree with Carver 98% of the time.
This made me not click your scans, or read what you were replying to.

Originally posted by Mekrob
This made me not click your scans, or read what you were replying to.



Well, while I was finding those scans, I also remembered that Takion naturally produces some kind of energy distortion field around him which disrupts all Source-generated powers. Oan batteries, Speed Force, Quantum Field, etc. Without trying. Somekind of natural effect produced by what he is.

... or read your last post.

Bran is the goodest debator here.

Still don't see anything Takion can do to beat Monarch, here.

Monarch > every alternate Captain Atom + several GL's + numerous Supermen > Takion. imo.

Originally posted by Galan007
Monarch > every alternate Captain Atoms' + several GL's + numerous Supermen > Takion. imo.

Fanboy. biscuits

Originally posted by Enyalus
Fanboy. biscuits dur313


Tack on the fact that he owned the aforementioned with little to no difficulty (with gestures, for the most part) - and then went on to add all of that power to his own.

Just don't see Takion doing much at all, personally.

Cat got stalemated by a 'roided up emotional wreck.

IMO Takion could take down GA Prime.

no he can't

Originally posted by Enyalus
Cat got stalemated by a 'roided up emotional wreck.

IMO Takion could take down GA Prime. Cat also didn't use his powers much. By my count he only used three meager energy attacks on Prime, and one halfway decent blast (all of which pale in comparison to pretty much all of the attacks he used during "Arena".) In all honesty, Monarch spent most of that battle antagonizing Prime/monologuing. *thumbsdown*

That said, because we know what Monarch is capable of when he's serious, I certainly wouldn't say he was fighting to the 'best of his ability' versus Prime. And per the rules, he would be fighting to that standard here - which is why I think he'd swat Takion away.

Originally posted by Galan007
That said, because we know what Monarch is capable of when he's serious, I certainly wouldn't say he was fighting to the 'best of his ability' versus Prime. And per the rules, he would be fighting to that standard here - which is why I think he'd swat Takion away.

Meh, you gotta point.

Tak got the potential and powerset to pwn Monarch but he doesn't have the experience imo.

Monarch for the majority.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Takion. Pretty easily. Monarch would dominate Takion, Darkseid, and Orion at the same time.

Originally posted by Mekrob
I think I can touch the moon if I get hard enough.

Which obviously means he can manipulate the energy as easily he did CA. Hell, there's no chance that he gets overloaded by energy that can destroy the universe, or simply can't manipulate it.
Did you miss the point behind the comparisons with Surfer and Big G by the way?

No doubt... but I have no idea what he could use off the top of my mind. refresh.

Simply put you have a sig of W. Silva who in his day was the best Light Heavyweight ever. However, he's second in my book to my favorite fighter Rampage Jackson. So, therefore I side with Eny, plus he's cutier lol

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Simply put you have a sig of W. Silva who in his day was the best Light Heavyweight ever. However, he's second in my book to my favorite fighter Rampage Jackson. So, therefore I side with Eny, plus he's cutier lol And Shogun. Both have winning records against Page.

Eny sides with Carver though, and likes BJ Penn.

Cutier isn't a w3rd.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Eny sides with Carver though, and likes BJ Penn.

I don't like any of that UFC crap. Boxing? Okay. K-1? Cool. UFC?

Originally posted by Enyalus
I don't like any of that UFC crap. Boxing? Okay. K-1? Cool. UFC?

I'm going to forget you typed that Eny

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I'm going to forget you typed that Eny

Olympic-style wrestling and UFC both make me cringe. I'd rather watch Sumo wrestling. I mean, jesus, keep off the freakin' ground and stop grabbing each other between the legs.

Have you ever, ever been in a street fight where the other person goes down and you jump ontop of him to feel him up? For real. Ghey.

K-1 is amazing. I love UFC to but not a fan of the grappling which alot of fight sometime turns into, a big hugfest. George St. Pierre ALL THE WAY!!

Remy vs Alistair in 12 days.

So exited.

Monarch every time.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Remy vs Alistair in 12 days.

So exited.

HaHa Remy is going to WTF Pwn Allstair with ease. Not even a close match. Now as far as the grappling of MMA arts... Just as you referenced street fights eny how many end up going to the groud or wrestling standing up? More often then not they end up on the ground or wrestling for position. Very rarely is it just a slugfest with no groud work. Thus MMA is much like real fight simulation minus some obvious difference but the point is much like a real fight ground work is important. I personally love submissions and transitions. I agree I don't like the hugging against the cage but meh you take the bad with the good.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I agree I don't like the hugging against the cage but meh you take the bad with the good.

Right. The hugging on the ground and against the cage is very annoying, and very homo lol. Other than that, I've got no problems with it. But because of that, I can't really watch it.

Monarch.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
HaHa Remy is going to WTF Pwn Allstair with ease. Not even a close match. That's what Hari was supposed to do... same with Mirko.

It'll be a good match.

And topped off by Melvin winning the mini-tourney.

JLB!

who gunna win vs chuck and shogun?

Hopefully Shogun.

I see chuck taking that fight.

depends if chuck actaully uses all his tool's

anyone see keith jardine vs rampage jackson

Originally posted by Battlehammer
anyone see keith jardine vs rampage jackson I did and chuck really doesn't have many tools. I just question shogun's chin when he's hit by chuck.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
anyone see keith jardine vs rampage jackson Jardine was surprising...

Originally posted by Mekrob
Jardine was surprising...

Surprising he lasted that long? True. However, there was no doubt who won that fight and controlled that fight.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Surprising he lasted that long? True. However, there was no doubt who won that fight and controlled that fight. Jardine lost in the last 10 seconds.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I did and chuck really doesn't have many tools. I just question shogun's chin when he's hit by chuck.
he does have tools he just never needed to uses them

Originally posted by Mekrob
Jardine was surprising...
true, but I think it actaully worses he lost that way then to a knock out

Originally posted by Mekrob
Jardine lost in the last 10 seconds.



I don't want to bash a fellow MMA but really you sound like sore Silva, Machida, Chuck fans on Sherdog. I know way shape or form did Jardine lose in the last 10 seconds of that fight. I had all three rounds going to Rampage. The first round was kinda close but gave it to page. Page did all the damage and knockdown Jardine twice but took him down another 3 times. What did Jardine do... land a few leg kicks and a couple punches? Come on man don't be silly.. the last 10 seconds lol

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
I don't want to bash a fellow MMA but really you sound like sore Silva, Machida, Chuck fans on Sherdog. I know way shape or form did Jardine lose in the last 10 seconds of that fight. I had all three rounds going to Rampage. The first round was kinda close but gave it to page. Page did all the damage and knockdown Jardine twice but took him down another 3 times. What did Jardine do... land a few leg kicks and a couple punches? Come on man don't be silly.. the last 10 seconds lol I don't go to Sherdog. And I don't like Jardine. I thought, and wanted Page to KO him in the first minute.

You had all three rounds. I had Jardine winning until the second knockdown, your opinion means more.
A judge also told Jardine he lost in the last 10 seconds...

Two takedowns iirc.

Had Octagon control, and agressiveness. And was winning the third before the second knockdown. Jackson did nothing with the takedown besides take him down. Jackson won the second, and IMO, Jardine won the first.

Mind you I haven't seen the fight since it was aired, but still, just going by what the judges would have seen.

only one judge said rampage one it in the last 10 seconds. another judge gave rapmage 27/30, so I highly doubt all three judges believed rampage won it in the last 10 seconds.

also rapamge looked like shit, he said he over trained, he looked weak. I actually think it worses for jardine that he wasent KOed.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
only one judge said rampage one it in the last 10 seconds. another judge gave rapmage 27/30, so I highly doubt all three judges believed rampage won it in the last 10 seconds.

also rapamge looked like shit, he said he over trained, he looked weak. I actually think it worses for jardine that he wasent KOed. Ya... that was Cecil Peoples...

Meh. Still looked good for Jardine.

I disagree. The only way jardine could beat rampage is to decission him and he failed to do so, vs a very passive agressive rampage who only used his hands, looked weak and stated he was weak

^ there is always the lucky punch ko.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
I disagree. The only way jardine could beat rampage is to decission him and he failed to do so, vs a very passive agressive rampage who only used his hands, looked weak and stated he was weak Ya, but everyone thought the only way he would last against Rampage is to hurt him with leg kicks... he failed to do so.

Rampage only uses his hands anyway... and he's not that aggressive if he doesn't KO you with one big shot. He's just got a crazy amount of power.

It's still good that he went to decision. He still took some big shots regardless, and everyone thought he had a weak chin. Page weakened or however, still hits harder than most.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Ya, but everyone thought the only way he would last against Rampage is to hurt him with leg kicks... he failed to do so.

Rampage only uses his hands anyway... and he's not that aggressive if he doesn't KO you with one big shot. He's just got a crazy amount of power.

It's still good that he went to decision. He still took some big shots regardless, and everyone thought he had a weak chin. Page weakened or however, still hits harder than most.

he was hurting him with leg kicks and make a weak rampage power even weaker.


He normally way more agressive he himself even admitt he dident go with his normal game plan.


It not. It have been better to get KO, now it looks like jardine stands zero chances of ever holding the title. Re watch he took almost no direct shots and got dazed and dropped. His chin sucks. If you watch with out the commentary and look closly you will see what I mean.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
he was hurting him with leg kicks and make a weak rampage power even weaker.


He normally way more agressive he himself even admitt he dident go with his normal game plan.


It not. It have been better to get KO, now it looks like jardine stands zero chances of ever holding the title. Re watch he took almost no direct shots and got dazed and dropped. His chin sucks. If you watch with out the commentary and look closly you will see what I mean. He didn't do any notiable damage... besides to Page's chin. Surprisingly.
All he did was land them, but it never slowed him down.

He said he didn't use the gameplan he planned to use against Jardine... rush him. That doesn't say that's his normal gameplan, seeing as how he usually counters, and waits for openings.

How would that have been better?
He never stood a chance before this fight of ever holding the title...
I won't, but on another note... Jardine seemed gassed, something that shouldn't have happened. meh

Originally posted by Mekrob
He didn't do any notiable damage... besides to Page's chin. Surprisingly.
All he did was land them, but it never slowed him down.

He said he didn't use the gameplan he planned to use against Jardine... rush him. That doesn't say that's his normal gameplan, seeing as how he usually counters, and waits for openings.

How would that have been better?
He never stood a chance before this fight of ever holding the title...
I won't, but on another note... Jardine seemed gassed, something that shouldn't have happened. meh

might not be noticable, but it takes effect on ones power. Though to be fair the only real damage jardine did to him was becuases he kick him dirrectly in the balls.

he normally sits in the pocket and ban's and he just dident really that that. he was acting wierd. Never seen him fight to unagreessive.

true, but he had a chances to be a contender.

yea jardine did gas which was wierd

Originally posted by Battlehammer
might not be noticable, but it takes effect on ones power. Though to be fair the only real damage jardine did to him was becuases he kick him dirrectly in the balls.

he normally sits in the pocket and ban's and he just dident really that that. he was acting wierd. Never seen him fight to unagreessive.

true, but he had a chances to be a contender. Maybe, but in this fight, it didn't seem to do anything.
Which caused him to drop out of his fight with Rashad, due to chin injury. Page also said that Jardine had him dazed... weird.

That's because he couldn't with Jardine. Jardine attacks, moves away. He throws from weird places, etc. He did counter quite a few leg kicks though... which seems to be the only thing that you can counter on Jardine.

Not at all. He wins, then he loses. He'll win his next fight no matter who it's against, and then he'll lose the next fight no matter who he's fighting.

Originally posted by Mekrob
Maybe, but in this fight, it didn't seem to do anything.
Which caused him to drop out of his fight with Rashad, due to chin injury. Page also said that Jardine had him dazed... weird.

That's because he couldn't with Jardine. Jardine attacks, moves away. He throws from weird places, etc. He did counter quite a few leg kicks though... which seems to be the only thing that you can counter on Jardine.

Not at all. He wins, then he loses. He'll win his next fight no matter who it's against, and then he'll lose the next fight no matter who he's fighting.
that was due to wanda. also only reason he got dazed was becuases it was all ready injured and he got kick in the balls lol.


I think he looked sloppy to be quite honest. Hell forrest is a better leg kick and more elusive, just not wierd like jardine. thought rapmage look so much better in that fight.


I know so wierd lol

Originally posted by Battlehammer
that was due to wanda. also only reason he got dazed was becuases it was all ready injured and he got kick in the balls lol.


I think he looked sloppy to be quite honest. Hell forrest is a better leg kick and more elusive, just not wierd like jardine. thought rapmage look so much better in that fight.


I know so wierd lol eh?

Forrest only kicks harder. Jardine just fights weird which would throw a lot of people off.
Rampage looked terrible in the Forrest fight...

If he breaks that, I'd be more impressed than him winning the title.

Originally posted by Mekrob
eh?

Forrest only kicks harder. Jardine just fights weird which would throw a lot of people off.
Rampage looked terrible in the Forrest fight...

If he breaks that, I'd be more impressed than him winning the title.
wanda messed up rampage chin with thoses punches he throw right before he got KOed.

forrest lands more kicks, even in there fight jardine was getting completely out kick and out punched.
he looked way worses in the kieth fight. He looked small in the keith fight to.

lol

Originally posted by Battlehammer
wanda messed up rampage chin with thoses punches he throw right before he got KOed.

forrest lands more kicks, even in there fight jardine was getting completely out kick and out punched.
he looked way worses in the kieth fight. He looked small in the keith fight to.

lol His attacks got parried. Otherwise Rampage would have been suspended due to being Wandied.

Not really. That's all Keith lands is leg kicks.
I haven't watched the Forrest fight in a while, but it was only the first round. That's because he was fat in the Wandy fight.

Originally posted by Mekrob
His attacks got parried. Otherwise Rampage would have been suspended due to being Wandied.

Not really. That's all Keith lands is leg kicks.
I haven't watched the Forrest fight in a while, but it was only the first round. That's because he was fat in the Wandy fight.
No rapmage admitted his injuries were from the wanda fight and he now getting surgery for it.

in his fight with forrest, forrest land way more leg kicks they even comment on it.

look at rampage in the kieth fight and compare it to the rampage in forrest fight, he a lot smaller.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
No rapmage admitted his injuries were from the wanda fight and he now getting surgery for it.

in his fight with forrest, forrest land way more leg kicks they even comment on it.

look at rampage in the kieth fight and compare it to the rampage in forrest fight, he a lot smaller. Did he ever get hit in the Wandy fight?

Vs Jardine? Meh, haven't seen it in a while, and it was only the first round.

Get pics.
He has better, or harder training as well now...

Originally posted by Mekrob
Did he ever get hit in the Wandy fight?

Vs Jardine? Meh, haven't seen it in a while, and it was only the first round.

Get pics.
He has better, or harder training as well now...
yea he got hit few times, but took the damage inorder to counter.

yea, the commentator even makes comments about it.

harder can be worses, he peaked to early which is a very bad thing.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
yea he got hit few times, but took the damage inorder to counter.

yea, the commentator even makes comments about it.

harder can be worses, he peaked to early which is a very bad thing. I don't recall one square shot landed...

OK, but that's not telling of what could have happened in the fight. It was only the first round.

But it explains why he's smaller.

Yeah I don't think he did land one good shot at all against Page (Wandy) . The shots your referring to were all blocked with his gloves before his MONSTER counter left hook . Somehow it might have damaged his chin from an accumulation over the years and that was the final straw, but make no mistake Wandy didn't land a single solid CLEAN shot. On the whole leg kick thing... Jardine IMO throws harder better leg kicks then Forrest. It's just that forrest got Rampage off guard and thus kept doing it and it took it's toll. He was more prepared for it against Jardine. Plus jardine looked scared to throw them knowing page trained for them and appeared ready to take them to counter with big punches. Page clearly over trained and yet still imo got a unanmious verdict which one judge agreed with. Only one judge MAYBE said that and even then the other two and it clearly in pages Favor.

Who wins Machida against Evans and then
Page vs Winner?

Forrests length helped him accomplish that. by all rights, Forrest should be heavyweight. He drops like 45 to fight at 205. He's just huge for a light-heavy.

And Rampage gets the winner of Machida-Evans, since he's technically number one contender, he's just not ready to fight again, and Evans has to defend the belt.