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Figured I'd start a thread instead of having the confusion of responding to people in the NBA discussion thread while other topics could be ensuing.

So anyway, this years race has gotten alot of heat and debate. Let's hear what us KMC'ers have to say!

It SHOULD be Dwyane Wade, but it will be LeBron or Kobe, depending on which team has the better record.

I go lebron over Kobe because his support isnt as good

Its a two man race between Kobe and LeBron..

In the end I think Kobe will edge him out

Originally posted by DanZeke25
It SHOULD be Dwayne Wade, but it will be LeBron or Kobe, depending on which team has the better record.

I think it will be LeBron. They have the slightly better record and have like only 4 more road games. That said, if they start losing home games suddenly and let the Lakers pass them up, that may swing things towards Kobe.

Kobe

Wade is having an incredible season. But how can they give it to him when they passed on Kobe for Nash in 05-06? As of right now I'll have to say LeBron James. His team is currently onu up on LA, James has better numbers than Kobe or LeBron, and I agree he's playing with less than Kobe.

Lebron James. Pencils down.

Its too bad for Chris Paul though. Hes playing better than Nash when he won his, yet with Lebron and Howard etc around he might not ever win one.

Honestly I felt that James deserved it last year. But if they had given it to CP3 I wouldn't have minded much. I didn't even mind that Kobe got it cause it was 'his turn' since the skipped him several times when it should have been his.

Having said that Lebron is far and away the leading candidate IMHOP. By any metric he deserves it.

Originally posted by forumcrew
Its too bad for Chris Paul though. Hes playing better than Nash when he won his

That to me has more to do with Nash getting lucky than Paul getting screwed. Especially this year, since the Hornets will only be around 50 wins.

Originally posted by Warmonger
Honestly I felt that James deserved it last year. But if they had given it to CP3 I wouldn't have minded much. I didn't even mind that Kobe got it cause it was 'his turn' since the skipped him several times when it should have been his.

Having said that Lebron is far and away the leading candidate IMHOP. By any metric he deserves it.

D Wade is on a good team, but in the end, the Heat are not a real contender.

The fact that Wade practically carries his team to win big games says more than what Lebron does, because he is surrounded by the likes of Mo Williams and Big Z. Kobe is no different.

Kobe is arguably the best in the league today, but he's surrounded by talent. Even more than Lebron. He's been called a ball hog, but he's also that good. He's hard working and driven. The reason he might not win; he's been around and what he does isn't new.

Lebron is explosive this year and he's out shined Kobe. So has Wade for that matter, but he's been around for a while as well. People like to see the young guy because he's expected to carry the league for his generation.

Who wins the M.V.P. will come down to who has the best team record. With that in mind, Cleveland certainly wouldn't have the record it has without Lebron (*cough* and the refs *cough* ), but you could argue that without Mo, they wouldn't have said record either. Which is why what Wade has done is so impressive. He's practically winning games for the Heat.

Also, CP3 and Dwight are both amazing, but to the mass, it's about 40+ points and team records.

It will be Lebron. It should be Wade.

In the end, it doesn't bother me. Wade and Lebron are on the same level. It's more about the situation.

Originally posted by geshien
D Wade is on a good team, but in the end, the Heat are not a real contender.

The fact that Wade practically carries his team to win big games says more than what Lebron does, because he is surrounded by the likes of Mo Williams and Big Z. Kobe is no different.

Kobe is arguably the best in the league today, but he's surrounded by talent. Even more than Lebron. He's been called a ball hog, but he's also that good. He's hard working and driven. The reason he might not win; he's been around and what he does isn't new.

Lebron is explosive this year and he's out shined Kobe. So has Wade for that matter, but he's been around for a while as well. People like to see the young guy because he's expected to carry the league for his generation.

Who wins the M.V.P. will come down to who has the best team record. With that in mind, Cleveland certainly wouldn't have the record it has without Lebron (*cough* and the refs *cough* ), but you could argue that without Mo, they wouldn't have said record either. Which is why what Wade has done is so impressive. He's practically winning games for the Heat.

Also, CP3 and Dwight are both amazing, but to the mass, it's about 40+ points and team records.

It will be Lebron. It should be Wade.

In the end, it doesn't bother me. Wade and Lebron are on the same level. It's more about the situation.


good words

Originally posted by geshien
D Wade is on a good team, but in the end, the Heat are not a real contender.

The fact that Wade practically carries his team to win big games says more than what Lebron does, because he is surrounded by the likes of Mo Williams and Big Z. Kobe is no different.

Kobe is arguably the best in the league today, but he's surrounded by talent. Even more than Lebron. He's been called a ball hog, but he's also that good. He's hard working and driven. The reason he might not win; he's been around and what he does isn't new.

Lebron is explosive this year and he's out shined Kobe. So has Wade for that matter, but he's been around for a while as well. People like to see the young guy because he's expected to carry the league for his generation.

Who wins the M.V.P. will come down to who has the best team record. With that in mind, Cleveland certainly wouldn't have the record it has without Lebron (*cough* and the refs *cough* ), but you could argue that without Mo, they wouldn't have said record either. Which is why what Wade has done is so impressive. He's practically winning games for the Heat.

Also, CP3 and Dwight are both amazing, but to the mass, it's about 40+ points and team records.

It will be Lebron. It should be Wade.

In the end, it doesn't bother me. Wade and Lebron are on the same level. It's more about the situation.

I agree with much of what you say. We can all see wade carrying this team on his back. Also Mo has been a godsend for the Cavs this season but Lebron is the MVP because he is more valuable to the Cavs organization than Dwayne Wade is to the Heat.

How you say? First let me preface this by saying that these metrics are subjective and subject to some interpretation. First though lets replace Lebron with an average SF say Joe Alexander. He is not too bad but he isn't the face of any franchise. So you got a starting line up like this

Mo Williams
Delonte West
Joe Alexander
Anderson Varejao
Iglauskus

Terri fed? No one is. That is a team barely better than the Nets and fighting like a dog to get a playoff spot.

Take out D-Wade and you got a joke team that would struggle to take down OKC much less sniff a playoff spot.

So what does that mean? A team like the one I described would be lucky to get a seed but they would be bounced out first round. Dwayne wade is keeping his team in it but they will in all likely hood get a second round boot. In the end both teams will be sitting home come June and since this is a league where there is only one championship the player that gives his team the greatest chance to win that championship is the MVP. Kobe certainly puts his team over the top, but I don't believe it is by as wide a margin.

Of course its basketball and there is room for plenty of upsets and unexpected turns. But you have to ask yourself what is more valuable? Having a chance at making the play-offs or having a good chance of winning a ring?

Kobe does have the better talent

2 man race

I also realize by the standard I just ut there Dwight Howrad is a serious competitor.

Originally posted by Myth
That to me has more to do with Nash getting lucky than Paul getting screwed. Especially this year, since the Hornets will only be around 50 wins.

Dont get me wrong was not commenting on CP3 getting screwed this year. I never said that and dont think he is.

I was saying for his entire career he will be against Lebron/Howard/Kobe/Wade etc... and likely wont win because of it.

Dirk Nowitzki

Originally posted by occultdestroyer
Dirk Nowitzki

Nah

I'd love to see Kobe repeat but LeBron has better stats and his team has a better record, case closed.
Wade is doing what Kobe did when he had Smush and Kwame in the starting line up with him, he didnt win MVP then and neither should Wade this year. I dont agree with that criteria by the way, but if you set the precedent you have a adhere to it every year.

I agree

Originally posted by koolruningz
I'd love to see Kobe repeat but LeBron has better stats and his team has a better record, case closed.
Wade is doing what Kobe did when he had Smush and Kwame in the starting line up with him, he didnt win MVP then and neither should Wade this year. I dont agree with that criteria by the way, but if you set the precedent you have a adhere to it every year.

But they don't adhere to it every year, because if that was the case then Chris Paul would have won MVP since Steve Nash won. Therefore, Wade should be the MVP.

Im pretty sure you would have voted for Wade last year to man, so i'll take that with a pinch of salt.

Originally posted by koolruningz
Im pretty sure you would have voted for Wade last year to man, so i'll take that with a pinch of salt.

I agree they should adhere to how the MVP's have been chosen every year, but the fact is they don't. If they did, Chris Paul would have won. So to say that Dwyane Wade shouldn't win because the of years past is not a valid point because it hasn't affected the League's decision in the past, so it probably won't now.

My point was that the criteria has always taken in to account the teams record, thats why when Kobe was scoring at will they said that he didnt win enough games. Wade is the same this year, he has played as well as any player in the league but his teams record is barely over 500. Who was the last player to win MVP with a record like that? I dont agree with it either but thats what it comes down to nowadays.
Chris Paul could have won it last season but his team had the 2nd best record in the west, Nash when he won it had a great team record, same with Dirk. Team record has always been a factor, right or wrong.

Originally posted by koolruningz
My point was that the criteria has always taken in to account the teams record, thats why when Kobe was scoring at will they said that he didnt win enough games. Wade is the same this year, he has played as well as any player in the league but his teams record is barely over 500. Who was the last player to win MVP with a record like that? I dont agree with it either but thats what it comes down to nowadays.
Chris Paul could have won it last season but his team had the 2nd best record in the west, Nash when he won it had a great team record, same with Dirk. Team record has always been a factor, right or wrong.


truth

Originally posted by koolruningz
My point was that the criteria has always taken in to account the teams record, thats why when Kobe was scoring at will they said that he didnt win enough games. Wade is the same this year, he has played as well as any player in the league but his teams record is barely over 500. Who was the last player to win MVP with a record like that? I dont agree with it either but thats what it comes down to nowadays.
Chris Paul could have won it last season but his team had the 2nd best record in the west, Nash when he won it had a great team record, same with Dirk. Team record has always been a factor, right or wrong.

I thought you meant that Wade shouldn't win it only because Kobe didn't win it with the same type season, not because Lebron's team has a better record.

What is interesting si that Wade is shooting slightly better than Kobe did that year .49 as opposed to .45. Not to mention he is putting in about three more assists and rebounds than Kobe did.

What is strange to me is that people are acting like Wade is having a better year by a country mile. The only area he compltely beats James in is steals with 2.25 to James 1.74. James his him in rebounding, and he commits less turnovers and personal fouls.

When you combine that with the Cavs superior record the 1.4 point lead Wade has over James in PPG doesn't stretch that far.

Originally posted by Warmonger
What is interesting si that Wade is shooting slightly better than Kobe did that year .49 as opposed to .45. Not to mention he is putting in about three more assists and rebounds than Kobe did.

What is strange to me is that people are acting like Wade is having a better year by a country mile. The only area he compltely beats James in is steals with 2.25 to James 1.74. James his him in rebounding, and he commits less turnovers and personal fouls.

When you combine that with the Cavs superior record the 1.4 point lead Wade has over James in PPG doesn't stretch that far.


The thing is though, I like LeBron , but Kobe obviously much more, what it will come down to is can the Cavs win the title this year??

Lebron will most likely be MVP(BUT I HOPE KOBE GETS IT INSTEAD), I think we all remember when Dirk won his MVP, the Mavs were out after the first round.. I am not saying that will happen to the Cavs, but is winning the MVP for the regular season that important as opposed to winning the MVP in the NBA Finals????

Originally posted by Warmonger
What is interesting si that Wade is shooting slightly better than Kobe did that year .49 as opposed to .45. Not to mention he is putting in about three more assists and rebounds than Kobe did.

And 5 less points.

I dont mind LeBron winning the MVP he deserves it, as long as Kobe gets the finals MVP i'll be very happy.

Indeed

Originally posted by koolruningz
My point was that the criteria has always taken in to account the teams record, thats why when Kobe was scoring at will they said that he didnt win enough games. Wade is the same this year, he has played as well as any player in the league but his teams record is barely over 500. Who was the last player to win MVP with a record like that? I dont agree with it either but thats what it comes down to nowadays.
Chris Paul could have won it last season but his team had the 2nd best record in the west, Nash when he won it had a great team record, same with Dirk. Team record has always been a factor, right or wrong

Couldn't have said it better myself.

Moreover, no one in this race is not deserving of the title. Whom ever wins it will be worthy of it.

The thing with dirk wasn't so much that he lost, but got a brutal first round beatdown.

I mean who was reallya better choice at the time. No one knew he was going to get stomped on. Besides MVP is a regular season award you don't have to win it all to get it.

As for winning it all, I don't know. Considering our previous matchups with L.A I don't like our chances. If LA keeps the ball moving and goes inside to Pau then its going to be a touch series. If Kobe wants to play superman and shoot his team right out of the game then our chances are much better.

The Lakers need to realize its ok, if Pau is the focal point for a few games. Kobe has shot the ball over 50% once in his last 5-6 games. Injured the last few games. His will to win is undeniable

Originally posted by Warmonger
What is interesting si that Wade is shooting slightly better than Kobe did that year .49 as opposed to .45. Not to mention he is putting in about three more assists and rebounds than Kobe did.

What is strange to me is that people are acting like Wade is having a better year by a country mile. The only area he compltely beats James in is steals with 2.25 to James 1.74. James his him in rebounding, and he commits less turnovers and personal fouls.

When you combine that with the Cavs superior record the 1.4 point lead Wade has over James in PPG doesn't stretch that far.

I don't watch the Cavs much(even though it's either them or the Lakers on national TV every other night) but Lebron plays Forward a lot of the game, so he should be getting more rebounds since he will be in position to do so more than he would if he played a guard, and he doesn't handle the ball as much as Wade, so he should have less turnovers than Wade.

With that said, the Cavs record will get Lebron the MVP, no matter how close or far away the stats may be.

King James, baby!

How is it Dwight Howard is not in the conversation more?

15th in scoring (1st in shooting % among the top 32 scorers, 3rd in the league)

1st in rebounding (by a much larger margin than wade is in scoring, no one is even close)

1st in blocks (only one even close to averaging 3 a game)

He may not have those 50 point games but damn...

21 points, 23 rebounds (7 offensive), 5 assists, 4 blocks, 3 steals (tonights numbers)


Guys a monster, and his team would be absolutely awful with out him. Far worse than the Cavs or Lakers would be without Kobe or Lebron.

Originally posted by forumcrew
How is it Dwight Howard is not in the conversation more?

15th in scoring (1st in shooting % among the top 32 scorers, 3rd in the league)

1st in rebounding (by a much larger margin than wade is in scoring, no one is even close)

1st in blocks (only one even close to averaging 3 a game)

He may not have those 50 point games but damn...

21 points, 23 rebounds (7 offensive), 5 assists, 4 blocks, 3 steals (tonights numbers)


Guys a monster, and his team would be absolutely awful with out him. Far worse than the Cavs or Lakers would be without Kobe or Lebron.

Awful? Far worse?

Really, you can make the same case for the Cavs, if you're gonna say that.

Lakers, I can agree with that. The Lakers have more depth than either of the other two mentioned.

Compared to a season without Dwight, sure, but overall, depends on what you call awful.

They have Lewis and Nelson who both are at all-star level. Turk is so clutch. Lee is getting better and has a lot of potential. Their bench, while shallow, is decent.

If the Magic had a season with some mediocre or just a decent center at starter (Gortat or someone else with Gortat starting or at back), they'd still be a good team.

Without Dwight, they certainly wouldn't be in the spot they are now. Either squandering just below the playoff spots (like the Bucks) or at best getting the number 5-6 spot, which is still pretty good.


And why he's not in the serious contention...

Originally posted by geshien
Also, CP3 and Dwight are both amazing, but to the mass, it's about 40+ points and team records.

And Dwight is having such an amazing year. Breaking records left and right. It's a shame.

If team records count that would be for Dwight not against him.

I think Dwight should be right in the conversation with Wade for 3rd.

Originally posted by forumcrew
If team records count that would be for Dwight not against him.

Except he isn't a 40+ point guy. He doesn't have the flash and dazzle that the other guys have.

Apparently you need both the record and the flair, if that makes any sense.

SF's and PG's are that way. Centers not so much. Even though Dwight is an amazing athlete, you will not see him cross guys up and run up to the basket for an impossible layup.

Guess I would like to think the sportswriters could look past the "flash"

Originally posted by forumcrew
Guess I would like to think the sportswriters could look past the "flash"

Agreed.

Kobe