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1. random encounter
2. one day of prep

Team Marvel 6/10

Team one in both since you threw in Insane Genis.

Monarch is the only real threat unless Darkseid has the OS

Insane Gensis solos team 2 and takes down RKT, Thanos and the universe they're fighting in in the process.

Originally posted by Astner
Insane Gensis solos team 2 and takes down RKT, Thanos and the universe they're fighting in in the process.

Originally posted by iceman24567

http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1021826_1.jpg

This is current Seid

Originally posted by Astner
Insane Gensis solos team 2 and takes down RKT, Thanos and the universe they're fighting in in the process.



What the hell?

Originally posted by Astner
http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1021826_1.jpg

You do know he didn't actually crush Eternity right there, don't you?

He and Entropy defeated Eternity "off panel". I highly doubt it he defeated a being he doesn't even have a truly physical body, by crushing it.

Either way, it was a statement from a being, who thinks his God....

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Either way, it was a statement from a being, who thinks his God....



Well, since he destroyed the entire Marvel Universe, then triggered the Big Bang which recreated it, he may have a case.

And Genis has destroyed entire universes before. Wanda's universe, for instance.




Anywho, Team One every time.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Well, since he destroyed the entire Marvel Universe, then triggered the Big Bang which recreated it, he may have a case.

And Genis has destroyed entire universes before. Wanda's universe, for instance.

Anywho, Team One every time.

Context.

Genis-Vell shot a Entropy in the head, with his blaster. That triggered it. All that was needed was an energy discharge etc. to trigger it, as to Entropy, creation is foreign etc.

Wanda's Universe?

Context.

I love Genis-Vell, but he is so overrated in my opinion.

Okay how about this RKT, Insane GV, Thanos vs. Gog (Kingdom Come), Monarch & Parallax Hal

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Context.

Genis-Vell shot a Entropy in the head, with his blaster. That triggered it. All that was needed was an energy discharge etc. to trigger it, as to Entropy, creation is foreign etc.
I know the context. I was just explaining his rationale for him saying he was God. He was toying with Rick the entire time he was calling himself God, too. Talking about how he killed himself then resurrected himself, all of his acts so far had been very biblical if you looked at the scope, etc. He was messin' around.

Originally posted by KuRuPT Thanosi
Okay how about this RKT, Insane GV, Thanos vs. Gog (Kingdom Come), Monarch & Parallax Hal
If you did that lineup, Team Two wins.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I know the context. I was just explaining his rationale for him saying he was God. He was toying with Rick the entire time he was calling himself God, too. Talking about how he killed himself then resurrected himself, all of his acts so far had been very biblical if you looked at the scope, etc. He was messin' around. /B]

All this says, is that he is rather loony.

I seriously dislike the hype around Genis-Vell.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
All this says, is that he is rather loony.

I seriously dislike the hype around Genis-Vell.

There is no hype. The Nega Bands give him access to infinite power, and his soul is part of the core of the Heart of the Universe, the artifact which made Thanos the Supreme Being of the MU. That's where his Cosmic Awareness comes from. Genis has infinite power in the literal sense. Its all a matter of how much he cuts loose.

Originally posted by Enyalus
There is no hype. The Nega Bands give him access to infinite power, and his soul is part of the core of the Heart of the Universe, the artifact which made Thanos the Supreme Being of the MU. That's where his Cosmic Awareness comes from. Genis has infinite power in the literal sense. Its all a matter of how much he cuts loose.



The Nega Bands give him Infinite Power?

I haven't seen this Infinite Power. Since when are the Nega Bands, weapons of limitless power?

His soul is part of the Heart of the Universe?

Are you saying, he can access the Heart of the Universe and all it's power?

I've never seen him wield that much power.

Like I said, Genis-Vell is all hype, and most of his feats are circumstantial. Context changes them significantly.

I love Genis-Vell. Easily one of my favorite characters ever, but he is more hype than actual power.

^ Most of what you said is actually very very wrong.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


The Nega Bands give him Infinite Power?

I haven't seen this Infinite Power. Since when are the Nega Bands, weapons of limitless power?

His soul is part of the Heart of the Universe?

Are you saying, he can access the Heart of the Universe and all it's power?

I've never seen him wield that much power.

Like I said, Genis-Vell is all hype, and most of his feats are circumstantial. Context changes them significantly.

I love Genis-Vell. Easily one of my favorite characters ever, but he is more hype than actual power.

Want scans? lol

Originally posted by Enyalus
And Genis has destroyed entire universes before. Wanda's universe, for instance. I remember it being stated that Genis was capable of destroying universes, during HoM. I don't remember it actually happening, though. Scans?

Originally posted by Galan007
I remember it being stated that Genis was capable of destroying universes, during HoM. I don't remember it actually happening, though. Scans?

Here you go my man - Genis collapsing and restarted Wanda's universe (he may have done it twice ), and saying he might destroy all reality...

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/Photon/th_Photon_universalcollapse1HOM.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/Photon/th_Photon_universalcollapse2HOM.jpg

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus


Like I said, Genis-Vell is all hype, and most of his feats are circumstantial. Context changes them significantly.

I love Genis-Vell. Easily one of my favorite characters ever, but he is more hype than actual power.

I disagree with all of this.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Most of what you said is actually very very wrong.

Which part?

I never even stated anything about Genis-Vell directly, except that context changes his feats and their are circumstantial.

All I did was ask him to clarify his statements. I also said that he is a lot of hype which is also true, if you've seen some of the crap I've had to deal with before.

This is most of my post. I mostly asked him to clarify.

How exactly am I wrong?

"The Nega Bands give him Infinite Power?

I haven't seen this Infinite Power. Since when are the Nega Bands, weapons of limitless power?

His soul is part of the Heart of the Universe?

Are you saying, he can access the Heart of the Universe and all it's power?

I've never seen him wield that much power."

Originally posted by Mindset


I disagree with all of this.

With some of the people I've come, in my experience he is a great deal of hype.

How does that mean that most of his feats are circumstantial?

Originally posted by Enyalus
Here you go my man - Genis collapsing and restarted Wanda's universe (he may have done it twice ), and saying he might destroy all reality...

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/Photon/th_Photon_universalcollapse1HOM.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/Photon/th_Photon_universalcollapse2HOM.jpg Yeah, that's the instance I was thinking of.

I disagree with the notion of Genis having actually collapsed reality there - but there's no reason to argue it. Anyhow, wasn't that version 'different' from his mainstream self?

No

Originally posted by Galan007
I disagree with the notion of Genis having actually collapsed reality, but there's no reason to argue it. Anyhow, wasn't that version 'different' from his mainstream self?

In a way. This was during his Photon phase. And his power works a little differently as Photon than from Captain Marvel. However, it was before that transformation was fully complete.

But I think what you may have been asking was, since it was an alternate universe version of the character, was his power different from the 616 one? My answer is no. He immediately knows something is wrong when he's warped into Wanda's universe, since his CA is omniversal. And when he touches Flashback, he becomes fully himself - which is why he's able to see the 616 universe (in the second scan I posted.) Genis as Photon exists in all realities at once, and all are the same 'Genis.'

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
With some of the people I've come, in my experience he is a great deal of hype. Nega Bands allow him to channel photonic energy, which is literally the fundamental building block of reality according to Marvel science. He's killed Eternity once already, he threatened it again later unconsciously. Death held no meaning to him since he's actually killed himself and just come back, he's resurrected dead characters before, and he can travel back and forth in time. He was an omniversal telepath. This is all on-panel. How is this all hype?

He destroyed an Eternity that was willing with Entropy off panel. Resurrecting the dead is impressive, but others have done it. He had Cosmic Awareness that was for all intents and purposes Omniversal.

That doesn't mean, he can go around crushing abstracts in the palm of his hand. It was off panel.

On some of the boards I've been, people have said he is more powerful than Living Tribunal etc. and crap like that.

In my experience, he has been more hype than anything. Doesn't still change the fact that Genis-Vell is powerful and badass but some I've come across a lot of people who take it to far.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
He destroyed an Eternity that was willing with Entropy off panel. Resurrecting the dead is impressive, but others have done it. He had Cosmic Awareness that was for all intents and purposes Omniversal.

That doesn't mean, he can go around crushing abstracts in the palm of his hand. It was off panel.

On some of the boards I've been, people have said he is more powerful than Living Tribunal etc. and crap like that.

In my experience, he has been more hype than anything. Doesn't still change the fact that Genis-Vell is powerful and badass but some I've come across a lot of people who take it to far. Entropy trapped Eternity, Genis actually killed him.

Eternity is also on the higher end of abstract beings.

Originally posted by Enyalus
But I think what you may have been asking was, since it was an alternate universe version of the character, was his power different from the 616 one? Well at first I couldn't remember if Genis was one of the characters who's powers were 'altered' in order to suit his dreams (as was the case with many others.) After I made that post I remembered that, while reality had been altered entirely, the ony thing which had changed with Genis was his initial frame of mind.

Originally posted by Mindset
Entropy trapped Eternity, Genis actually killed him.

Eternity is also on the higher end of abstract beings.

We never saw what happened. In one issue they went on a quest to destroy Eternity, with Entropy, and the next issue, Eternity was already destroyed.

They had bound him somehow, and destroyed him. Somehow he was reduced to the point he can be destroyed.

Either way, it was off panel. According to some people, it's as if, Genis-Vell alone, fought and massacred Eternity.

King Thor, tossing Mjolnir has broken through his Force Field and set him flying...

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Nega Bands allow him to channel photonic energy

I loved the rest of your post. This is just a minor correction, and explanation of how the Nega Bands work, and why their power is infinite:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Negabandsexplained3.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Negabandsexplained2.jpg

Awesome, huh?

Now, as Photon the Nega Bands actually absorbed into Genis' very being, and he was photonic energy.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
We never saw what happened. In one issue they went on a quest to destroy Eternity, with Entropy, and the next issue, Eternity was already destroyed.

They had bound him somehow, and destroyed him. Somehow he was reduced to the point he can be destroyed.

Either way, it was off panel. According to some people, it's as if, Genis-Vell alone, fought and massacred Eternity.

King Thor, tossing Mjolnir has broken through his Force Field and set him flying... We do know what happened, Entropy bound him and Genis killed him. There was never any mention of his power being reduced, though.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I loved the rest of your post. This is just a minor correction, and explanation of how the Nega Bands work, and why their power is infinite:

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Negabandsexplained3.jpg http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Negabandsexplained2.jpg

Awesome, huh?

Now, as Photon the Nega Bands actually absorbed into Genis' very being, and he was photonic energy. What happened to Rick when he became Photon?

Originally posted by Mindset
What happened to Rick when he became Photon?
I don't recall them explaining it, but I imagine somehow they became molecularly unbonded. Considering that Rick was in WWH and all, without the bands.

Dunno.

Yea, he kinda just stopped being important after Captain Marvel comic ended.

Originally posted by Mindset
We do know what happened, Entropy bound him and Genis killed him. There was never any mention of his power being reduced, though.

It was stated he was bound and then destroyed off panel.

Eternity, doesn't even have a physical being in the true sense to destroy. He is everything. The embodiment of the Universe.

Of course the bonding must have reduced him to the level where he could actually be destroyed. It was never said how he was destroyed etc. if I recall.

^ Yes it was. Genis said he crushed him in his fist:

http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1021826_1.jpg

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
It was stated he was bound and then destroyed off panel.

Eternity, doesn't even have a physical being in the true sense to destroy. He is everything. The embodiment of the Universe.

Of course the bonding must have reduced him to the level where he could actually be destroyed. It was never said how he was destroyed etc. if I recall. All abstracts have physical manifestations.

Never said, mentioned, or hinted at that the bonding brought his power level down.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
^ Yes it was. Genis said he crushed him in his fist:

http://s1d3.turboimagehost.com/t/1021826_1.jpg

I love Genis, but he is crazy.

That must have been some powerful bondage, to reduce, Eternity to the point where it can fit in the palm of Genis' hand, can be crushed like an insect, and can be truly destroyed.

Like I said, it actually happened off panel.

Either he is over exaggerating, like he has done before, or Eternity was severely hindered.

Either way, debatable...

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I love Genis, but he is crazy.

That must have been some powerful bondage, to reduce, Eternity to the point where it can fit in the palm of Genis' hand, can be crushed like an insect, and can be truly destroyed.

Like I said, it actually happened off panel.

Either he is over exaggerating, like he has done before, or Eternity was severely hindered.

Either way, debatable... When has he over-exaggerated his own power?

Yea, we know Eternity was hindered, he was bound.

Originally posted by Mindset
All abstracts have physical manifestations.

Never said, mentioned, or hinted at that the bonding brought his power level down.

If I recall, they have M-Bodies through the dimension of Manifestations.

Eternity isn't a true physical being. He is more of a manifestation.

You can't actually destroy Eternity, by crushing him in the palm of you're hand last I checked.

So either Genis-Vell was over exaggerating as that was only something akin to a hologram, or the bonds reduced Eternity to that point.

Either way, subjective.

It isn't an exaggeration to say Genis had the power on his own to destroy the MU. Since, if Photon continued to exist, that's exactly what he would have done. And Thanos did destroy the MU using the HOTU, which is a part of Genis' soul.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
If I recall, they have M-Bodies through the dimension of Manifestations.

Eternity isn't a true physical being. He is more of a manifestation.

You can't actually destroy Eternity, by crushing him in the palm of you're hand last I checked.

So either Genis-Vell was over exaggerating as that was only something akin to a hologram, or the bonds reduced Eternity to that point.

Either way, subjective. Yea, and if you kill these manifestations the abstract is killed as well, like when they were destroyed by the IG or HOTU.

Originally posted by Mindset
When has he over-exaggerated his own power?

Yea, we know Eternity was hindered, he was bound.

When he calls himself God.

He was bound. Was his power reduced significantly when he was bound?

Something was done so that Genis-Vell and Entropy could actually physically destroy him. According to Genis-Vell, in the palm of his hand at that.

So don't take that at face value. Genis-Vell didn't actually destroy Eternity on his own, and Eternity was bound so easily because it was practically willing, according to Genis-Vell.

Originally posted by Enyalus
It isn't an exaggeration to say Genis had the power on his own to destroy the MU. Since, if Photon continued to exist, that's exactly what he would have done. And Thanos did destroy the MU using the HOTU, which is a part of Genis' soul.

Context.

Photon would have destroyed the Universe because Baron Zemo, siphoned of energy from the beginning and the end of the Universe. Hence why Baron Zemo destroyed Photon. He was a risk to the entire Universe.

Has he shown that he has access to all the Infinite Power of the Heart of the Universe?

Originally posted by Mindset
Yea, and if you kill these manifestations the abstract is killed as well, like when they were destroyed by the IG or HOTU.

facepalm

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
When he calls himself God.

He was bound. Was his power reduced significantly when he was bound?

Something was done so that Genis-Vell and Entropy could actually physically destroy him. According to Genis-Vell, in the palm of his hand at that.

So don't take that at face value. Genis-Vell didn't actually destroy Eternity on his own, and Eternity was bound so easily because it was practically willing, according to Genis-Vell. You might want to actually look back at the comic where he calls himself God, it happened, I believe twice, he was joking one time and the other he was making a point.

Eternity could always been physically destroyed, this has been shown, they didn't have to do anything.

The actually destruction of Eternity was entirely Genis's doing. Actually looking back Genis and Entropy worked together to trap him. Yea, he was bound easily, that doesn't have anything to do with him being destroyed.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
facepalm A facepalm is not an argument, it's an admission of a lack in ability to debate.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Context.

Photon would have destroyed the Universe because Baron Zemo, siphoned of energy from the beginning and the end of the Universe.
You're...not saying that correctly. Zemo recreated Photon, using energy from the Big Bang and Entropy to create Photon's new body. So yes, that his very existence, every second Photon existed, threatened to destroy Eternity and all existence.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Has he shown that he has access to all the Infinite Power of the Heart of the Universe?
Sure he has access to it all. Whether he can use it anywhere near as well Thanos could is extremely doubtful. Amping his own strength, for instance, has its limits. He can amp himself to roughly the power of a large star, but any more than that and he himself goes nova (which is no problem, really, considering Genis can exist as pure energy or as a spirit.) Channeling the power into blasts, though? I don't think he'd have any problems accessing it there.

Originally posted by Mindset
A facepalm is not an argument, it's an admission of a lack in ability to debate. Unless you're 'debating' with quancho, or Allank. Then a facepalm becomes a necessity.

Originally posted by Galan007
Unless you're 'debating' with quancho, or Allank. Then a facepalm becomes a necessity. True

Originally posted by Galan007
Unless you're 'debating' with quancho, or Allank. Then a facepalm becomes a necessity.

What blasphemy is this?

Originally posted by Mindset
True

Lies.

Originally posted by Enyalus
You're...not saying that correctly. Zemo recreated Photon, using energy from the Big Bang and Entropy to create Photon's new body. So yes, that his very existence, every second Photon existed, threatened to destroy Eternity and all existence.

Not saying it correctly?

He healed him by feeding him energy from the beginning and end of the Universe, which is the Big Bang and Entropy. How did I say it wrong?

That made Photon, a danger to the Universe.

All circumstance.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Sure he has access to it all. Whether he can use it anywhere near as well Thanos could is extremely doubtful. Amping his own strength, for instance, has its limits. He can amp himself to roughly the power of a large star, but any more than that and he himself goes nova (which is no problem, really, considering Genis can exist as pure energy or as a spirit.) Channeling the power into blasts, though? I don't think he'd have any problems accessing it there.

So he has been shown to have access to power of the Heart of the Universe? On such a scale he can access it's Full Power?

I thought I read every issue Genis-Vell has appeared in. Guess I missed something.

I'm honestly intrigued. I've never seen Genis-Vell wield a power as immense as the Heart of the Universe and all it's glory.

Originally posted by Mindset
You might want to actually look back at the comic where he calls himself God, it happened, I believe twice, he was joking one time and the other he was making a point.

I have all the comics. Like I said, he is rather crazy, and has been known to say nonsense in the past.

Originally posted by Mindset
Eternity could always been physically destroyed, this has been shown, they didn't have to do anything.

Eternity is the physical embodiment of time and space. You cannot truly destroy Eternity without destroying all time and space.

If I am right, I recall that Thanos with the Heart of the Universe, grew to incalculable size, had Eternity in the palm of his hand, and willed him to begone. Eternity comics back next issue completely unharmed.

Eternity, exists on another plane. It's is beyond simply physical attacks.

I honestly am shocked that you think Eternity can be crushed in the palm of Genis-Vell's hands and that Genis-Vell can do it without those circumstances.

At least that's what it seems to me from you're posts.

Originally posted by Mindset
The actually destruction of Eternity was entirely Genis's doing. Actually looking back Genis and Entropy worked together to trap him. Yea, he was bound easily, that doesn't have anything to do with him being destroyed.

This exactly what I'm talking about. With statements like this, one would think, that Genis-Vell, can crush abstracts like Eternity.

They bound him in some unknown manner, while he was basically willing, and supposedly he was crushed by Genis-Vell, which all happened off panel. This alone shows that Eternity, wasn't truly at optimum.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Not saying it correctly?

He healed him by feeding him energy from the beginning and end of the Universe, which is the Big Bang and Entropy. How did I say it wrong?
You made it sound like Zemo drained off energy from the beginning and end of time, thus weakening Eternity. You didn't say anything about him using it to reconstruct Photon, lol.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So he has been shown to have access to power of the Heart of the Universe? On such a scale he can access it's Full Power?

I thought I read every issue Genis-Vell has appeared in. Guess I missed something.

I'm honestly intrigued. I've never seen Genis-Vell wield a power as immense as the Heart of the Universe and all it's glory.

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Genis_HOTU1.jpg

Genis flat out states 4-5 times that he wields 'infinite power' and is 'omnipotent.' And...since he controls all energy, even if we ignore the HOTU part, he's got a pretty good point.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Eternity is the physical embodiment of time and space. You cannot truly destroy Eternity without destroying all time and space.
That's what happened when Genis destroyed Eternity. The entire MU was...gone.

Originally posted by Enyalus
You made it sound like Zemo drained off energy from the beginning and end of time, thus weakening Eternity. You didn't say anything about him using it to reconstruct Photon, lol.

I thought you read the issue, meaning you already knew the context.

You can't say I was wrong.

Originally posted by Enyalus
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Genis_HOTU1.jpg

Genis flat out states 4-5 times that he wields 'infinite power' and is 'omnipotent.' And...since he controls all energy, even if we ignore the HOTU part, he's got a pretty good point.

I know he is connected to the Heart of the Universe. We both know that. I believe I read every issue he has ever appeared in.

What I am asking is, does he have access to it's unlimited power? Has he shown that he can access it's full power?

From what I recall, the answer is no. I don't remember every exact detail of his history, hence why I asked. Dont make me dig....

Genis-Vell is Omniscient to a point. He is not Omnipotent and God etc. like he claims.

That much is evident. Plus, that title belongs only to one.

Originally posted by Enyalus
That's what happened when Genis destroyed Eternity. The entire MU was...gone.

I've already been through this before.

Okay man, I have to go now. Good night. Well continue this interesting conversation tommorow.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I thought you read the issue, meaning you already knew the context.

You can't say I was wrong.
Sure. But for the people who didn't know, I was clarifying your potentially misleading statement.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I know he is connected to the Heart of the Universe. We both know that. I believe I read every issue he has ever appeared in.

What I am asking is, does he have access to it's unlimited power? Has he shown that he can access it's full power?
He says he does...

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
That much is evident. Plus, that title belongs only to one.
If your name was Victor von Doom or your screen name 'Enyalus' that would be true. As it stands, the statement you made is very much false.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I've already been through this before.
Yeah, your contention was that Eternity was weakened beforehand or Genis had assistance destroying him. I was skipping that, and pointing out that when Eternity was destroyed by Genis (as is explicitly stated), the MU ceased to exist. Confirmed in later CM issues, Marvel.com, and probably Eternity's bio.

Genis had help binding him. Stated fact. Genis was the one who killed him. Another stated fact. Eternity had a cosmic case of apathy. Implied fact. But no where does it insinuate that Eternity was somehow weaker. So, I don't see how you can make a case for it.


Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Okay man, I have to go now. Good night. Well continue this interesting conversation tommorow.
Or will we? Dun dun dunnnn!




Night.

Originally posted by Enyalus


http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x287/Deywos/Captain%20Marvel/th_Genis_HOTU1.jpg

And Thanos did destroy the MU using the HOTU,

which is a part of Genis' soul

That's Eternity/Infinity's heart he's talking about,
not The Heart of the Infinite (TOAA's power withIN the omniverse)

Genis (my fav character) has absolutely no relation to THOTI from Marvel:The End.

Originally posted by Enyalus


Genis had help binding him. Stated fact.
Genis was the one who killed him.

Another stated fact. Eternity had a cosmic case of apathy. Implied fact.

But no where does it insinuate that Eternity was somehow weaker.
The only reason Genis/Entropy were able to affect Eternity in that instance,
was because Eternity's time to be re-created had arrived.

Genis himself admits,
that if Eternity would not have been in this predicament,
they wouldn't have been able to even bound Eternity let alone kill em.

Still though,
we can't take away from the fact that Genis did destroy all that space-time regardless,
only catch is that Eternity had to be in his death-throes first.

But let's not forget friends,
that aside,
Genis did have the potential to obliterate space-time,
proven during HOM when Wanda accelerated his potential
which allowed him to blink a universe in and out.

Further proven later on when he transitioned into Photon,
and was seen in the future eliminating all realities.

Originally posted by Galan007
Unless you're 'debating' with quancho, or Allank. Then a facepalm becomes a necessity.

I'd agree with the first part at least.

Interesting stuff MM..

Originally posted by Enyalus
Sure. But for the people who didn't know, I was clarifying your potentially misleading statement.

It's not misleading.

Originally posted by Enyalus
He says he does...

Let's see him using it's Infinite Power.

The Heart of the Universe, doesn't mean he has access to the same power as Thanos does.

I've never seen him show the ability to access it.

As I recall, he is referring to another power source either way.

So even at full power he obviously won't be as powerful as Thanos was in anyway.

Originally posted by Enyalus
If your name was Victor von Doom or your screen name 'Enyalus' that would be true. As it stands, the statement you made is very much false.

What?

I'm confused. Are you saying that my statement that Genis-Vell calling himself God is a lie, is untrue?

That doesn't make sense.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Yeah, your contention was that Eternity was weakened beforehand or Genis had assistance destroying him. I was skipping that, and pointing out that when Eternity was destroyed by Genis (as is explicitly stated), the MU ceased to exist. Confirmed in later CM issues, Marvel.com, and probably Eternity's bio.

Yes he was destroyed by Genis-Vell, but I was pointing out that there was circumstances in play, that is all.

I never disputed the fact that Eternity was destroyed. I know that, but there were circumstances in play that allowed that to happen.

It was Entropy's destiny, in the cosmic drama, to destroy Eternity. It was time, also Eternity was willing hence why they were able to bound it, and it was Eternity's time.

So like I said, either Eternity was obviously reduced significantly, or it's transition period had come, and that's why it happened.

You get what I'm trying to say?

Originally posted by Enyalus
Genis had help binding him. Stated fact. Genis was the one who killed him. Another stated fact. Eternity had a cosmic case of apathy. Implied fact. But no where does it insinuate that Eternity was somehow weaker. So, I don't see how you can make a case for it.

I said there are two possibilities yesterday as I recall. It was either weakened severely by bondage etc. or seeing as how it was willing, plus it was time for the transition, that is what allowed Eternity, the embodiment of time and space to be destroyed by such beings.

Those are the two scenarios I said that are possible if I recall that make sense to me.

It was Eternity's time to die or something along those lines, and it was willing hence why they were able to bound it. So either circumstances allowed it to happen, or he was weakened. I personally go for the former.



Originally posted by Enyalus
Or will we? Dun dun dunnnn!

We are. At least I am...



Originally posted by Enyalus
Night.

Good afternoon.

Originally posted by Mr Master
That's Eternity/Infinity's heart he's talking about,
not The Heart of the Infinite (TOAA's power withIN the omniverse)

Genis (my fav character) has absolutely no relation to THOTI from Marvel:The End.
Do you have a better explanation? I know you've probably read the issue, so...on the previous page, he was telling Magus about his cosmic awareness. And on that page (scan posted) he says its because his soul is part of the living Heart of the Universe. Now, we know Genis' cosmic awareness is omniversal, so he couldn't have been playing a metaphor game and using 'Heart of the Universe!' in a literal, strictly universal sense.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I'm confused. Are you saying that my statement that Genis-Vell calling himself God is a lie, is untrue?
No.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
You get what I'm trying to say?
Yes.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
I said there are two possibilities yesterday as I recall. It was either weakened severely by bondage etc.

Kinky.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Good afternoon.


...Cosmic bondage FTW.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Do you have a better explanation? I know you've probably read the issue, so...on the previous page, he was telling Magus about his cosmic awareness. And on that page (scan posted) he says its because his soul is part of the living Heart of the Universe. Now, we know Genis' cosmic awareness is omniversal, so he couldn't have been playing a metaphor game and using 'Heart of the Universe!' in a literal, strictly universal sense.


Wasnt the "Heart of the universe" just a name that thanos coined for the "Heart of the infinite" energy source? I mean Genis was clearly talking about the universe and its sentience, hence the references to its living soul etc. I would think it more likely then that he was referring to Eternity/Infinity.

Originally posted by Naija boy
Wasnt the "Heart of the universe" just a name that thanos coined for the "Heart of the infinite" energy source?
Same thing.

Originally posted by Naija boy
I mean Genis was clearly talking about the universe and its sentience, hence the references to its living soul etc. I would think it more likely then that he was referring to Eternity/Infinity.
Why would he be referring to the universe, when he was using the 'living heart of the universe' line to explain to Magus his cosmic awareness, which is omniversal in scale?

Originally posted by Enyalus


Why would he be referring to the universe, when he was using the 'living heart of the universe' line to explain to Magus his cosmic awareness, which is omniversal in scale?

The same reason that "omniverse" ,"multiverse" and "universe" are used interchangeably. Still the point is that he seemed to be referring to the universe/multiverse/omniverse or whatever u want to call it in regards to its embodiment and totality. Therefore its not very likely that he was talking about the HOTU itself.

Originally posted by Naija boy
The same reason that "omniverse" ,"multiverse" and "universe" are used interchangeably.
Exactly. The HOTU was obviously called 'Universe' when it was in fact omniversal. Genis was speaking about something which was omniversal, using the same HOTU reference.


...2 + 2 = 4.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Exactly. The HOTU was obviously called 'Universe' when it was in fact omniversal. Genis was speaking about something which was omniversal, using the same HOTU reference.
2 + 2 = 4.

Yes but the HOTU is an independent energy source. Genis wasnt refferring to such but rather was referring to the "cosmos" in its totality. That would be Eternity/Infinity.Whether they/it embodies a universe/multiverse/omniverse is up to the writers choice of words.

Originally posted by Naija boy
Yes but the HOTU is an independent energy source. Genis wasnt refferring to such but rather was referring to the "cosmos" in its totality.
I don't think you can say confidently either way. So, I choose to take it literally.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I don't think you can say confidently either way. So, I choose to take it literally.

Heh. I just realized he is actually on thors team so i renounce my former argument and also choose to take it literally.

Originally posted by Enyalus

Do you have a better explanation?

I know you've probably read the issue, so...on the previous page, he was telling Magus about his cosmic awareness. And on that page (scan posted) he says its because his soul is part of the living Heart of the Universe. Now, we know Genis' cosmic awareness is omniversal, so he couldn't have been playing a metaphor game and using 'Heart of the Universe!' in a literal, strictly universal sense.
Eternity/Infinity together comprise the totality of everything,
many times Eternity is referenced alone, but it's both actually.

Roma, the Omniversal guardian said it best concerning Eternity:

"Eternity .... withIN it ... ALL That Ever Was, Ever Is, or Ever Will Be"

http://s2d1.turboimagehost.com/t/792375_Et.jpg

Originally posted by Mr Master
Genis (my fav character) has absolutely no relation to THOTI from Marvel:The End. The IG does, though:

http://s1d2.turboimagehost.com/t/1649528_heart1.jpg
herbhappy

Originally posted by Enyalus
No.

Okay then.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Yes.

I knew you would.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Kinky.



Originally posted by Enyalus
...Cosmic bondage FTW.

spank

Team 1, Highfather is the weak link.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Eternity/Infinity together comprise the totality of everything,
many times Eternity is referenced alone, but it's both actually.

Right. Okay. But how does Genis keep his powers when Eternity is destroyed, like he clearly did, if that's in fact where he gets them from? Also, its very weird to think Genis' soul is a core part of the abstract Eternity, or that his Cosmic Awareness comes from there - considering he seems to have better cosmic awarness than Eternity himself. And lastly, why assume 'the living Heart of the Universe' is referring to Genis when he says it, while Eternity is not referenced at all?

To me, it seems like a big jump in logic. And again, if his soul is part of the core of Eternity, and Eternity was killed (as Genis in fact did do), then...why was Genis still alive/powered?

That doesn't seem to make sense to me.

Originally posted by Enyalus
he seems to have better cosmic awarness than Eternity himself.


Very Doubtful.

Originally posted by Naija boy
Very Doubtful.
Like the odds of you getting laid tonight.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Like the odds of you getting laid tonight.

Or the odds of u.................shit cant think of anything

Originally posted by Naija boy
Or the odds of u.................shit cant think of anything

The odds of you not sucking a penis tonight.

Originally posted by Galan007

The IG does, though:
Actually neither Genis nore the IG,
have anything at all to do with "The Heart of the Infinite" (TOAA's power withIN the omniverse)

THOTI is a concentrated energy source comprised of the "Almighty's" (TOAA) power.

The IG is the majority of the Infinity Being's power
adding the Ego Gem completes the IB as you know.

If the IG were THOTI, it would've stomped LT when Warlock blasted him with it,
but that fact aside, it simply isn't the same,
and I think you alrerady know that G, ... or was that sarcasm? (ok, ok you got me)

Originally posted by Enyalus

Right. Okay. But how does Genis keep his powers when Eternity is destroyed, like he clearly did, if that's in fact where he gets them from?
Eternity's power was never destroyed,
it was merely transitioned from one concept to another.

Entropy becomes Eternity,
because their relationship is one & the same.

The only reason Entropy even manifested upon reality
is because Eternity had reached his finality where he must recycle himself anew.

Entropy is the manifested representation of that finality
while simultaneously being the manifested representation of the re-birth,
this is because it's through Eternity that Entorpy can and does exist,
this is why Entropy is Eternity's son,
because when Eternity is about to die naturally, Entropy is born.

When Eternity is about to die un-naturally,
Abraxas is the one that manifests,
because now creation must collapse,
and that collapse comes in the form of Abraxas,
who is the representative concept of Eternity's collapse.

But Abraxas is an un-natural occurance that takes place
due to Galactus not being able to balance reality anymore with his conscious existence,
making Abraxas a danger, unlike Entropy who's just part of the cosmic scheme.
Originally posted by Enyalus

Also, its very weird to think Genis' soul is a core part of the abstract Eternity, or that his Cosmic Awareness comes from there - considering he seems to have better cosmic awarness than Eternity himself.
Everything is a part of Eternity/Infinity on all levels of creation,
but that also includes anomalies that somehow surpass them in power,
... yes senseless I know, but that's what it is.

Without a doubt,
Genis was speaking about Eternity/Infinity's Heart,
which is the living soul of the Universe,
which is the core from which ALL UniverseS die and are born,
which is the conceptualized manifestation of all space & time.
Originally posted by Enyalus

And lastly, why assume 'the living Heart of the Universe' is referring to Genis when he says it, while Eternity is not referenced at all?
Eternity/Infinity are referenced, just not by name:

"The Cosmos ... it's a living thing ... it has a soul"

I can ssure you,
THOTI from Marvel: The End, was NOT a living thing with a soul,
but Eternity/Infinity are living things with souls. (spirit/consciousness)
Originally posted by Enyalus

And again, if his soul is part of the core of Eternity,
and Eternity was killed (as Genis in fact did do), then...
why was Genis still alive/powered?

That doesn't seem to make sense to me.
Hopefully I cleared things up good friend.

Originally posted by Galan007
Unless you're 'debating' with quancho, or Allank. Then a facepalm becomes a necessity.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually neither Genis nore the IG,
have anything at all to do with "The Heart of the Infinite" (TOAA's power withIN the omniverse)

THOTI is a concentrated energy source comprised of the "Almighty's" (TOAA) power.

The IG is the majority of the Infinity Being's power
adding the Ego Gem completes the IB as you know.

If the IG were THOTI, it would've stomped LT when Warlock blasted him with it,
but that fact aside, it simply isn't the same,
and I think you alrerady know that G, ... or was that sarcasm? (ok, ok you got me) I was being horribly sarcastic, (hence the "herbhappy" smilie.)

Originally posted by quanchi112
facepalm

Originally posted by Galan007
I was being horribly sarcastic, (hence the "herbhappy" smilie.)

facepalm Still.