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Savage Hulk
Namor with wet suit
Classic surfer


vs

Orion with astro force gear but no motherbox.
GL- Hal with standard gl ring
Flash -Wally West.

Fight takes place in wide open deserted area
who wins and why?

Team 2 easy win

Namor solos

Surfer blows up the planet. And without Firestorm to make oxygen for him, Hal dies. So does Flash (obviously). And for a Surfer vs. Orion matchup, see The Hunger.

So, Surfer solos 10/10.

Either that, or Flash solos.
It isn't in-character for Surfer to randomly blow up planets, is it?

Team 2, easily.

Team 2 Namor is the weak link here

Originally posted by kgkg
Team 2 easy win

Yup, Team 1s only hope is SS.

Hulk and Namor gets raped.

Originally posted by The Nuul
Yup, Team 1s only hope is SS.

Hulk and Namor gets raped.

Hulk raped? By who?

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Hulk raped? By who?

Thats what I want to know. Hulk is extremely underrated.

Team 2.

Hulk is at least able to punk Flash, and would probably defeat Orion in a straight fight. Silver Surfer is the top dog out there too.

But Namor is a weak, weak link, and I agree that team 2 win

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Hulk is at least able to punk Flash, and would probably defeat Orion in a straight fight. Silver Surfer is the top dog out there too.

But Namor is a weak, weak link, and I agree that team 2 win

I agree that team 2 wins also but its not because of hulk because hulk is physically one of the most powerful on the field if you ask me. He's the strongest, most durable (healing factor, etc....) and doesnt have a cap on his abilities.

By the way, namor is underrated.

Namor may be the weak link but Surfer is enough to make up for it, Marvel wins

How is he hitting Wally exactly?

Team DC.

Originally posted by AlmightyKfish
How is he hitting Wally exactly?

Dude, by shaking the ground for miles around. And cathing him, and tearing him in half like a sheet of paper.

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Dude, by shaking the ground for miles around. And cathing him, and tearing him in half like a sheet of paper.
Or teh thunderclap.

Flash >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> speed of sound

Lol at Hulk beating Orion or Wally West and lol at Surfer being enough to beat team two just LOL

Originally posted by iceman24567
Lol at Hulk beating Orion or Wally West and lol at Surfer being enough to beat team two just LOL
Originally posted by Enyalus
Surfer blows up the planet. And without Firestorm to make oxygen for him, Hal dies. So does Flash (obviously). And for a Surfer vs. Orion matchup, see The Hunger.

So, Surfer solos 10/10.

uhuh

Originally posted by Enyalus
uhuh I C

Originally posted by iceman24567
I C
You read Superman/Batman, right? Otherwise that joke won't make sense.

Yeah i read the last 13 or so Superbat Hawkgirl/whoever wrote that shit

It was a Geoff Johns and Grant Morrison team up

Originally posted by Mindset
It was a Geoff Johns and Grant Morrison team up I could have swore Canadians wrote that shit

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Hulk is at least able to punk Flash, and would probably defeat Orion in a straight fight. Silver Surfer is the top dog out there too.

But Namor is a weak, weak link, and I agree that team 2 win

Hulk will lose to Orion.

Hulk is going to punk the Flash?

LOL!

How the hell is that happening?

Originally posted by Bouboumaster
Dude, by shaking the ground for miles around. And cathing him, and tearing him in half like a sheet of paper.

You're statement betrays you're ignorance of Flash and his capabilities. That might work for someone like Quicksilver but against the Flash?

hysterical

Shaking the ground, I mean seriously. The Flash can run in space, has shown he can fly. Even if you ignore all that, Wally would have defeated the Hulk before he can move a muscle.

By the way, Wally West can vibrate. All Hulk will do is have his molecular structure charged, and Hulk will go splat.

Seriously. Shaking the ground, catching him, and ripping him in half like a piece of paper.

hysterical

Hulk would heal.

How many times has Wally flown?

Flash has insane durability he can take Hulk's punches if he felt like it look what Amazo poured on him and he still had enough left in him to steal Amazo's speed

Shaking the ground sure as hell worked on Flash when Konvikt did it.

Amazo is about as strong as Grey Hulk.

Grey Hulk when he was a baby

Originally posted by Mindset
Amazo is about as strong as Grey Hulk.

Grey Hulk when he was a baby

Yea, I'm probably overrating Amazo

Originally posted by Enyalus
Shaking the ground sure as hell worked on Flash when Konvikt did it.



Don't bring up that stupidity.

I mean seriously, in that fight Flash, Green Lantern etc. were all taken out by a thunder clap. Firestorm was taken out by debris and so on.

A great deal of things were off with that fight.

Shaking the ground, and a thunder clap?

Plenty of instances in his history, contradict why that's such PIS.

How lazy are writers currently?

You don't even have to read past issues to know that's stupid. All you would have to do is "google" Wally West. It ain't that damn hard.

Originally posted by Mindset
Hulk would heal.

How many times has Wally flown?

Heal, if Flash vibrated through an arm etc. sure, but I don't think his coming back if Flash vibrated through his entire body.

Flown?

Probably a few times.

Wally's weakness is ground shaking, this is a documented fact.

All Flashes can't be as good as Bart, unfortunately.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Heal, if Flash vibrated through an arm etc. sure, but I don't think his coming back if Flash vibrated through his entire body.

Flown?

Probably a few times. Yea, he would heal, he would not completely blown apart in the first place, if that's what you're thinking.


What specific times has he flown?

Originally posted by Mindset
Wally's weakness is ground shaking, this is a documented fact.

All Flashes can't be as good as Bart, unfortunately.

You aren't helping. I sometimes think, you argue for no reason than just to argue.

Ground shaking? Lol!

Didn't I already prove to you why Wally is superior?

Either way, Wally West is the best. Bart knows that too.

I don't recall you proving Wally was the best, but I don't hold that against you, it's hard to prove the impossible.

Ground shaking = Wally's kyrptonite

Fact.

Bart used to look up to Wally, then he realized he was actually superior.

Originally posted by Mindset
Yea, he would heal, he would not completely blown apart in the first place, if that's what you're thinking.

Why not?

If Flash vibrated, through him entirely, as Flash is so fast, he can vibrate through each square inch of his body, multiple times (Does that sound wrong to everyone else as it does to me?), before Hulk can even heal a paper cut, there shouldn't be much left of him.

Originally posted by Mindset
What specific times has he flown?

Here's one.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_AirSlowerThanFlash.jpg

Originally posted by Mindset
I don't recall you proving Wally was the best, but I don't hold that against you, it's hard to prove the impossible.

Ground shaking = Wally's kyrptonite

Fact.

Bart used to look up to Wally, then he realized he was actually superior.

How is Wally not the best?

In what way, is Bart superior?

He needed a significant power boost, just to attempt to do what Wally West could already do, and would have done were it not for his children and wife. When he came back to this dimension because of the Legion, he got all the power Bart had either way.

He mainlines the Speed Force etc.

Just because Bart Allen can remember what he reads, doesn't mean he is superior. It's evident Wally West is the best. His called the fastest man who ever lived for a reason.

facepalm

Wally's kryptonite?

Be serious....

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Why not?

If Flash vibrated, through him entirely, as Flash is so fast, he can vibrate through each square inch of his body, multiple times (Does that sound wrong to everyone else as it does to me?), before Hulk can even heal a paper cut, there shouldn't be much left of him.



Here's one.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_AirSlowerThanFlash.jpg Durability + Healing factor means Hulk would not be completely blown apart.

Yea, I saw that from the other thread. He's not actually flying.

Got any scans where he is actually flying?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
How is Wally not the best?

In what way, is Bart superior?

He needed a significant power boost, just to attempt to do what Wally West could already do, and would have done were it not for his children and wife. When he came back to this dimension because of the Legion, he got all the power Bart had either way.

He mainlines the Speed Force etc.

Just because Bart Allen can remember what he reads, doesn't mean he is superior. It's evident Wally West is the best. His called the fastest man who ever lived for a reason.

facepalm

Wally's kryptonite?

Be serious.... Bart has shown more speed force abilities than Wally, and at a much younger age.

What power boost, are you talking about when he came back from the other dimension in IC? What was this power boost?

Hal also has green and blue ring, he would rape Namor.

From there he could either help out Orion with SS or BFR Hulk.

Originally posted by Mindset
Durability + Healing factor means Hulk would not be completely blown apart.

Yea, I saw that from the other thread. He's not actually flying.

Got any scans where he is actually flying?

What is in you're opinion flying?

I mean, if you don't consider that flying, then what do you consider flying?

If he isn't flying, then what's he doing, sure he has some after images to the right but that's because he is incredibly fast and likes to move around. We can clearly see Wally West on the left as solid, and I don't see anything but air, below his feet.

A healing factor would be play a factor, but unfortunately, Wally would be able to do that to him before it even registers any damage.

Durability?

A punch from the Thing to World War Hulk's face, made him bleed profoundly for a time.

His durability isn't anything that's incredible.

Originally posted by Mindset
Bart has shown more speed force abilities than Wally, and at a much younger age.

What power boost, are you talking about when he came back from the other dimension in IC? What was this power boost?

Wally has shown abilities Bart Allen hasn't either. So he can read and memorize what he has read. Nothing impressive.

He can make speed clones etc. but they are more of a liability than anything and with Wally being that fast, he doesn't need them either.

Bart Allen's heritage allowed him to have access at such a young age. That's all.

Did you not read the part where Bart Allen returned?

They had him absorb a part of the Speed Force, so he could try and do what was necessary.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
What is in you're opinion flying?

I mean, if you don't consider that flying, then what do you consider flying?

If he isn't flying, then what's he doing, sure he has some after images to the right but that's because he is incredibly fast and likes to move around. We can clearly see Wally West on the left as solid, and I don't see anything but air, below his feet.

A healing factor would be play a factor, but unfortunately, Wally would be able to do that to him before it even registers any damage.

Durability?

A punch from the Thing to World War Hulk's face, made him bleed profoundly for a time.

His durability isn't anything that's incredible. I consider flying to be flying, and floating to be floating.

Got anymore scans of Wally flying?

Damage normally happens before you can register it, after the damage is done he would begin to heal.

Yea, pretty much everyone with good durability in Marvel bleed from much weaker attacks than they can actually take. Thor, Gladiator, etc.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Wally has shown abilities Bart Allen hasn't either. So he can read and memorize what he has read. Nothing impressive.

He can make speed clones etc. but they are more of a liability than anything and with Wally being that fast, he doesn't need them either.

Bart Allen's heritage allowed him to have access at such a young age. That's all.

Did you not read the part where Bart Allen returned?

They had him absorb a part of the Speed Force, so he could try and do what was necessary. Wally got his powers young too, Bart is just more skilled than he is. Wally is so fast he doesn't need speedforce clones...what? If that's the case then you could say the same for Bart, I don't see how speed is relevant, though. Not that that takes away from the fact that it is an ability Bart has that Wally doesn't.

Yea, I did read the part when Bart returned, all I remember him getting is Barry's suit.

Got a scan or comic number of what you're talking about?

Originally posted by Mindset
I consider flying to be flying, and floating to be floating.

Got anymore scans of Wally flying?

Damage normally happens before you can register it, after the damage is done he would begin to heal.

Yea, pretty much everyone with good durability in Marvel bleed from much weaker attacks than they can actually take. Thor, Gladiator, etc.

He was obviously flying. We even see after images, showing he is was moving about the place, and was not just floating.

I have scans of him running space, launching himself into the air, and flying.

After the damage was done, Hulk would be a stain on the floor.

Flash can vibrate through every square inch of his body multiple times. Including his head etc.

I seriously doubt Hulk will be able to come back after all that. The best you could hope for is that he will be able to eventually come back, and by that time, he should be considered knocked out.

People with good durability don't bleed profoundly, and have a nose resembling like a crunched chip after being punched in the face once by someone like the Thing or She-Hulk.

Originally posted by Mindset
Wally got his powers young too, Bart is just more skilled than he is. Wally is so fast he doesn't need speedforce clones...what? If that's the case then you could say the same for Bart, I don't see how speed is relevant, though. Not that that takes away from the fact that it is an ability Bart has that Wally doesn't.

Yea, I did read the part when Bart returned, all I remember him getting is Barry's suit.

Got a scan or comic number of what you're talking about?

How in the hell is Bart Allen more skilled than Wally West in terms of their powers?

You could say the same for Bart, hence why that ability isn't relevant with beings of their speed.

Wally West has abilities Bart Allen doesn't have either. Wally West is just superior. His more than Bart Allen is, plain and simple.

Why do you debate when you haven't read the arc?

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_AllFlash6.jpg

He absorbed a part of the Speed Force so that he could travel back into the other dimension and warn everybody.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_Flashmainline.jpghttp://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_Flashmainline2.jpg

Wally West returned, and took all the extra boost Bart Allen had. He mainlines the Speed Force. Wally West, is the best. The moment he came back, Bart Allen, lost what he gained in extra power.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
He was obviously flying. We even see after images, showing he is was moving about the place, and was not just floating.

I have scans of him running space, launching himself into the air, and flying.

After the damage was done, Hulk would be a stain on the floor.

Flash can vibrate through every square inch of his body multiple times. Including his head etc.

I seriously doubt Hulk will be able to come back after all that. The best you could hope for is that he will be able to eventually come back, and by that time, he should be considered knocked out.

People with good durability don't bleed profoundly, and have a nose resembling like a crunched chip after being punched in the face once by someone like the Thing or She-Hulk. Maybe obvious to you, but he was ,in fact, floating.

Yea, I'm aware he can launch himself in the air, but once their he can not maneuver like someone who has the ability to fly.

Barring the fact the Flash wouldn't even do that, I still doubt he could...now on to the durability, since that is one of the factors why I think he couldn't.

*sigh* Hulk took less damage from Juggs hits than when he was hit by Thing, according to you, I don't actually remember Thing doing that much damage to Hulk. Honestly, you are gauging Hulk's durability off of one instance?

Shame on you.

Originally posted by Mindset
Maybe obvious to you, but he was ,in fact, floating.

Yea, I'm aware he can launch himself in the air, but once their he can not maneuver like someone who has the ability to fly.

Barring the fact the Flash wouldn't even do that, I still doubt he could...now on to the durability, since that is one of the factors why I think he couldn't.

How the hell was he only floating?

He was clearly moving around etc.

He launched himself, and was able to speed blitz his opponent multiple times. He had definite maneuverability. Just like Johny Quick. Theoretically they all have the ability to fly like Johny Quick. Wally West takes the most advantage off this ability.

Originally posted by Mindset
*sigh* Hulk took less damage from Juggs hits than when he was hit by Thing, according to you, I don't actually remember Thing doing that much damage to Hulk. Honestly, you are gauging Hulk's durability off of one instance?

Shame on you.

The Thing punched him, and the Hulk was bleeding. She-Hulk punched him and Hulk was bleeding. One hits from both to the face, and he was pouring out blood for like 3 entire pages.

I'm not basing my opinion on only one situation. The Hulk has crappy durability currently.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
How in the hell is Bart Allen more skilled than Wally West in terms of their powers?

You could say the same for Bart, hence why that ability isn't relevant with beings of their speed.

Wally West has abilities Bart Allen doesn't have either. Wally West is just superior. His more than Bart Allen is, plain and simple.

Why do you debate when you haven't read the arc?

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_AllFlash6.jpg

He absorbed a part of the Speed Force so that he could travel back into the other dimension and warn everybody.

http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_Flashmainline.jpghttp://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e139/RageOfTheGod/Flash/th_Flashmainline2.jpg

Wally West returned, and took all the extra boost Bart Allen had. He mainlines the Speed Force. Wally West, is the best. The moment he came back, Bart Allen, lost what he gained in extra power. Umm, it is relevant, it shows another ability Bart has with the speedforce that Wally doesn't.

What abilites does Wally have that Bart doesn't? Bart is just better, sorry man.

Lol, nice attempt at trying to say I didn't read it, when I clearly told you that I did read it, I just didn't remember, obviously I did read it since I remembered Barry giving Bart his suit. Please try to just stick to debating, if that's possible.

But anyway, as I thought Bart didn't actually get a power boost, he had to absorb the speed force to get back BEFORE PRIME, he didn't need it to get back, which is exactly the same thing Wally would have had to do. I don't know where you were going with this one.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
How the hell was he only floating?

He was clearly moving around etc.

He launched himself, and was able to speed blitz his opponent multiple times. He had definite maneuverability. Just like Johny Quick. Theoretically they all have the ability to fly like Johny Quick. Wally West takes the most advantage off this ability.



The Thing punched him, and the Hulk was bleeding. She-Hulk punched him and Hulk was bleeding. One hits from both to the face, and he was pouring out blood for like 3 entire pages.

I'm not basing my opinion on only one situation. The Hulk has crappy durability currently. Look up the definition of floating, now look at the scan, that's how he's floating.

Yes, we both agree he can launch himself. I believe the word you are looking for is finite, he has limited maneuverability because he can't actually fly. Theoretically I could beat an entire allstar team of basketball players in a game.

I'm sorry, you have two instances of She Hulk and Thing making him pour out blood, I guess that matches my two instances of Juggs causing less damage to him, not to mention his past fights, such as the one with Gladiator.

That's not really flying.

The funny thing is I just started this to mess with you Rage, but now you're trying to use PIS to disprove Hulk's durability, and claiming I haven't read comics and other such buffoonery.

It's surprisingly enjoyable.

It's peanut butter jelly time...

Current status? Team Marvel ftw hard win.

Phuck, Rage please don't write a novel length response.

He wants to torture you in the process.

I'd probably just not read it and never come back to this thread.

ORION solos

Originally posted by Mindset
Umm, it is relevant, it shows another ability Bart has with the speedforce that Wally doesn't.

Neither abilities are relevant or off any importance.

Originally posted by Mindset
What abilites does Wally have that Bart doesn't? Bart is just better, sorry man.

One important fact is that he has better control over his abilities.

I also don't recall Bart Allen ever being able to steal speed before. It's been a while send I read his Impulse comics, but I don't believe he has that ability. I could be wrong.

Originally posted by Mindset
Lol, nice attempt at trying to say I didn't read it, when I clearly told you that I did read it, I just didn't remember, obviously I did read it since I remembered Barry giving Bart his suit. Please try to just stick to debating, if that's possible.

If you did read it, then why the hell did you need me to post scans for you?

I'm sure we had this debate before, where you made me do the exact same thing. Post probably entire issues worth of scans, until you finally let up.

I don't care if you did read it or not, and you might have been lying, as you didn't seem to know what I was talking about.

Originally posted by Mindset
But anyway, as I thought Bart didn't actually get a power boost, he had to absorb the speed force to get back BEFORE PRIME, he didn't need it to get back, which is exactly the same thing Wally would have had to do. I don't know where you were going with this one.

Absorbing a part of the Speed Force is a power boost. A huge one, and he still didn't do anything Wally West isn't capable off.

His boost did not make him seem superior to Wally West in anyway, as he did not do anything Wally could not, and the moment Wally West came back to that dimension, he immediately took Bart Allen's powers and his power boost.

Did he not need help to get there in the first place?

I've seen Wally West do things which indicate that he would not need to absorb the Speed Force to do what Bart Allen attempted to do.

Originally posted by Mindset
Look up the definition of floating, now look at the scan, that's how he's floating.

He was not just floating. He was not hovering a few feet of the ground etc.

He obviously could control himself as he reached that level of height, and he obviously had maneuverability as he was moving around at Super Speed.

How was he not flying?

He had maneuverability, he had control, and he was in motion, while in air. That is flight, not floating.

Him hovering a few feet off the ground is floating. What he was doing there is flying.

Originally posted by Mindset
Yes, we both agree he can launch himself. I believe the word you are looking for is finite, he has limited maneuverability because he can't actually fly. Theoretically I could beat an entire allstar team of basketball players in a game.

What limited maneuverability?

When was it ever stated he only had limited maneuverability?

He was clearly in motion, in control over himself, hence he was flying. The second instance, he launched himself into the air, and was able to control himself again. He even speed blitzed his opponent.

Originally posted by Mindset
I'm sorry, you have two instances of She Hulk and Thing making him pour out blood, I guess that matches my two instances of Juggs causing less damage to him, not to mention his past fights, such as the one with Gladiator.

Juggernaut made him bleed as well, and made him eat pavement.

I don't care if you think Juggernaut caused less damage or not. In that same arc, She-Hulk and the Thing with a single blow made him bleed profoundly. They were not the only ones.

Even Colossus damaged World War Hulk more than Juggernaut as I recall. He also made Hulk bleed with a punch to the face. So did depowered Juggernaut.

Cyclops did a lot of damage too.

Hulk was literally black and blue all over for most of that arc anyways.

It was all written by the same guy, Greg Pak, and he loves the Hulk to the point he says, Superman stands no chance and apparently Rune King Thor would have his hands full, and that's obviously just his opinion which is crap.

Gladiator fluctuates a lot and Gladiator wasn't in War World Hulk.

Currently the Hulk's durability is crappy. That's the point.

Originally posted by Mindset
The funny thing is I just started this to mess with you Rage, but now you're trying to use PIS to disprove Hulk's durability, and claiming I haven't read comics and other such buffoonery.

It's surprisingly enjoyable.

I know you did. I even said it a few posts back.

When did I claim you didn't read comics?

I just implied you didn't read that arc, which seemed the case as you didn't know what the hell I was talking about. I'm not using PIS. He was bleeding throughout the entire arc. It was pretty consistent.

I'm glad you enjoy it, but it's just annoying for me.