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Well?

Norrin, but not by a whole lot.

Are you counting Orions Astro force..etc.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Are you counting Orions Astro force..etc. Certainly.

Norrin, but it's close.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Certainly.

And Motherbox?

Surfer is more powerfull(not a stomp though) and has a greater range of powers.

Originally posted by Nihilist
And Motherbox?

Surfer is more powerfull(not a stomp though) and has a greater range of powers. I think most would agree the Surfer is by far more versatile than Orion.

All standard gear.

How did their fight in The Hunger turn out? vin

SS by a decent amount

Originally posted by Enyalus
How did their fight in The Hunger turn out? vin let's just say, him and kyle are seeking psychiatric help to deal with their trauma.

:P

nah, you know we can't use that stuff.

Orion is like...Thor Lite. Like BRB.

So, I should probably wait until Godhunter #2 is out, but whatever.

Surfer is more powerful.

Originally posted by Enyalus
How did their fight in The Hunger turn out? vin If that had been canon it would've been Pee Eye Ess on par with the armbar.

Originally posted by Mindship
If that had been canon it would've been Pee Eye Ess on par with the armbar.
Pfft. Like whateva!

Originally posted by Enyalus
How did their fight in The Hunger turn out? vin You shouldn't have.Originally posted by Enyalus
Orion is like...Thor Lite. Like BRB.

So, I should probably wait until Godhunter #2 is out, but whatever.

Surfer is more powerful. I myself see BrB as prevailing over the dog of war in a battle.

I myself see any Marvel herald-leveler prevailing over any DC New God. biscuits

Originally posted by Enyalus
I myself see any Marvel herald-leveler prevailing over any DC New God. biscuits Trick has erased your very mind. You are but a .....parademon now.

I can't be a parademon. Parademons get killed by police bullets. I. AM. A. NEW. GOD.

Dun dun dun DUNNNN!

Originally posted by Enyalus
I can't be a parademon. Parademons get killed by police bullets. I. AM. A. NEW. GOD.

Dun dun dun DUNNNN! Oh shit I have never seen your true form as of yet. Is it enough to bring down the multi-internet?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Oh shit I have never seen your true form as of yet. Is it enough to bring down the multi-internet?
Nothing like me has come before you before, and nothing will again!

Ph3@r mi powah!!

Originally posted by Enyalus
Nothing like me has come before you before, and nothing will again!

Ph3@r mi powah!! Alright that's enough joking around for one day. I need to make someone e angry.

surfer is more versatile (by a small majority), but orion has more energy output, practically unlimited in it's scope. i would say orion.

Should probably mention that the AF is divine power and thus not susceptible to manipulation. And it might as well be magic as far as Surfer is concerned.

As for Quan and Enya: You're just pissed cause Darkseid's dialogue bitchslaps anything Thanos has ever said. biscuits

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Should probably mention that the AF is divine power and thus not susceptible to manipulation. And it might as well be magic as far as Surfer is concerned.
And what is Galactus' power classified under?

That's rhetorical.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
As for Quan and Enya: You're just pissed cause Darkseid's dialogue bitchslaps anything Thanos has ever said. biscuits
That's one possibility.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Should probably mention that the AF is divine power and thus not susceptible to manipulation. And it might as well be magic as far as Surfer is concerned.

As for Quan and Enya: You're just pissed cause Darkseid's dialogue bitchslaps anything Thanos has ever said. biscuits Nothing Darkseid has ever said matches


You address omnipotence, tread carefully.

"Darkseid: I. Am. The. New. God. All is one in Darkseid. This mighty body is my church. When I command your surrender, I speak with three billion voices... When I make a fist to crush your resistance, it is with three billion hands! When I stare into your eyes and shatter your dreams, and break your heart, it is with six billion eyes! Nothing like Darkseid has ever come among you: nothing will again, I will take you to a hell without exit or end, and there I will murder your souls! And make you crawl and beg! And DIE! DIE! DIE FOR DARKSEID! "

The greatest evil speech of all time. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BadassCreed

I'm not impressed.

Rock of Ages.

Darkseid: "I take away their confusion and give them obedience. I take away their fear of themselves and give them fear of Darkseid. I have liberated them from the chaos of indecision! I have given them one straight path! One clear purpose! One goal: To die for Darkseid!"

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
"Darkseid: I. Am. The. New. God. All is one in Darkseid. This mighty body is my church. When I command your surrender, I speak with three billion voices... When I make a fist to crush your resistance, it is with three billion hands! When I stare into your eyes and shatter your dreams, and break your heart, it is with six billion eyes! Nothing like Darkseid has ever come among you: nothing will again, I will take you to a hell without exit or end, and there I will murder your souls! And make you crawl and beg! And DIE! DIE! DIE FOR DARKSEID! "

The greatest evil speech of all time. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BadassCreed To be brutally honest that sounds quite lame. It's like they really want to show you how evil he is and we all get it. Thanos doesn't have to go on a rant to prove a point.

Darkseid: "New Genesis is a stinking cosmic sewer! I have fouled Paradise beyond repair and broken in the mire the shining cities of the Gods! I have won! Is this vanity? Then I will remake the entire universe in the image of my soul, Deasaad. And when at last I turn to look upon the eternal desolation I have wrought...I will see Darkseid, as in a mirror....and know what fear is. HAHAHAHAHA!!!"

That's because Thanos can't pull that off. Thanos is a crappy villain. Decent character, but he can't play the villain at all. Darkseid is a god.

And for the record, it's alot harder to write a truly great villain. Especially one who is the very concept of evil.

Some of his speeches in GDS are better, IMO.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Darkseid: "New Genesis is a stinking cosmic sewer! I have fouled Paradise beyond repair and broken in the mire the shining cities of the Gods! I have won! Is this vanity? Then I will remake the entire universe in the image of my soul, Deasaad. And when at last I turn to look upon the eternal desolation I have wrought...I will see Darkseid, as in a mirror....and know what fear is. HAHAHAHAHA!!!"

That's because Thanos can't pull that off. Thanos is a crappy villain. Decent character, but he can't play the villain at all. Darkseid is a god.

And for the record, it's alot harder to write a truly great villain. Especially one who is the very concept of evil. I like Thanos better as more of an anti hero anyways. I think being pure evil is played out and has been done to death.

Being a god doesn't prove anything. It sounds cool, but it really what does it amount to.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Rock of Ages.

Darkseid: "I take away their confusion and give them obedience. I take away their fear of themselves and give them fear of Darkseid. I have liberated them from the chaos of indecision! I have given them one straight path! One clear purpose! One goal: To die for Darkseid!"

His final crisis speech is good.

That one, not so much.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
"Darkseid: I. Am. The. New. God. All is one in Darkseid. This mighty body is my church. When I command your surrender, I speak with three billion voices... When I make a fist to crush your resistance, it is with three billion hands! When I stare into your eyes and shatter your dreams, and break your heart, it is with six billion eyes! Nothing like Darkseid has ever come among you: nothing will again, I will take you to a hell without exit or end, and there I will murder your souls! And make you crawl and beg! And DIE! DIE! DIE FOR DARKSEID! "

The greatest evil speech of all time. http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BadassCreed
I loved it. But I am shocked that they didn't put Superman small dialogue with Superboy Prime in IC

Surfer

Originally posted by Enyalus
Some of his speeches in GDS are better, IMO.

Darkseid is.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
I loved it. But I am shocked that they didn't put Superman small dialogue with Superboy Prime in IC
Whoever scripts that idiotic site is so far DC biased...I mean, putting all the Lantern oaths in there, including the Star Sapphires? Superman's lines? A freakin' toon duck?...And Wolverine. Then making fun of him about it.

Stupid.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Whoever scripts that idiotic site is so far DC biased...I mean, putting all the Lantern oaths in there, including the Star Sapphires? Superman's lines? A freakin' toon duck?...And Wolverine. Then making fun of him about it.

Stupid. that's why trick likes it so much.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Whoever scripts that idiotic site is so far DC biased...I mean, putting all the Lantern oaths in there, including the Star Sapphires? Superman's lines? A freakin' toon duck?...And Wolverine. Then making fun of him about it.

Stupid.
I loved the little speech DS made. I like all the Oaths(well almost all)

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Rock of Ages.

Darkseid: "I take away their confusion and give them obedience. I take away their fear of themselves and give them fear of Darkseid. I have liberated them from the chaos of indecision! I have given them one straight path! One clear purpose! One goal: To die for Darkseid!"

Superman: "EAT FIST, BIYATCH!"

Surfer

Originally posted by quanchi112
I like Thanos better as more of an anti hero anyways. I think being pure evil is played out and has been done to death.

Being a god doesn't prove anything. It sounds cool, but it really what does it amount to.

It amounts to being cool, which amounts to being entertaining. DS is cool.

Originally posted by Allankles
It amounts to being cool, which amounts to being entertaining. DS is cool. That's why we disagree. I think Ds is cool, but Thanos is by far the coolest. This is entirely subjective.

If someone tells me Rhino is their hero I can laugh, but I really can't change that person's opinion and why would I Rhino needs some love as well.

It is subjective to a point, but it's clear DS has benefited from better writing.

"Faces like yours are not bred on New Genesis! Yet that is your home... You scoff at old men and laugh too loudly.. Yet you really respect us.. and cry when you bow that ugly head! Well, you seem to have lost Metron and chosen Darkseid...

I'll take what I need of you, Esak.. and then give what Highfather would deny you! The strength to kill yourself!" - Darkseid.

orion

Norin

Still going with Orion.

Originally posted by Allankles
It is subjective to a point, but it's clear DS has benefited from better writing. No, he really hasn't. He actually has had terrible writing. I'll give you a few examples. Ds's beatdown in superman/batman. Their rematch in superman/batman where even batman causes him to bleed.

Hp isn't kind to Ds physically or mentally as all he had to do was bfr the unthinking brute. An was also very unkind to Ds.

Countdown also showed that despite all his planning he was beaten at the end of the day by his son. He also showed again prior to that he can't beat Superman straight up.


It's the same thing over and over again plotwise with the ale. It's uncreative writing at it's best. What might have been creative once has turned into something repetitive and stale over the years.

Even in final crisis most readers thought it was terribly written, very confusing, and didn't even have anything climactic concerning Darkseid at all.

Thanos has had some poor writing, too. Like being physically overpowered by Ka-zar while amped (a Thanosi).

Originally posted by Enyalus
Thanos has had some poor writing, too. Like being physically overpowered by Ka-zar while amped (a Thanosi). That wasn't the real Thanos. At the time it was. I am not saying he hasn't fallen victim to it as most characters with a long history have, but it was retconned and most of his stories aren't having him seek out an old plot device like the ig.

Hey quan? It's extremely hypocritical to use the clone arguement, and then dismiss the avatar arguement out of hand.

And you're also not citing Darkseid's best writing, just some of his low points. I can cite a few low points for Thanos. Like Warlock showing him how he subconsciously fails at everything due to an inferiority complex. Or how Surfer was beating him in a battlefield where they were both depowered, and Thanos has to resort to mindgames because he can't beat Surfer in a straight fight.

Don't play this game.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
Hey quan? It's extremely hypocritical to use the clone arguement, and then dismiss the avatar arguement out of hand.

And you're also not citing Darkseid's best writing, just some of his low points. I can cite a few low points for Thanos. Like Warlock showing him how he subconsciously fails at everything due to an inferiority complex. Or how Surfer was beating him in a battlefield where they were both depowered, and Thanos has to resort to mindgames because he can't beat Surfer in a straight fight.

Don't play this game. Thanos' instances have been specifically addressed.

What is Darkseid's best writing? Be a dear and let me in on the best kept secret in comics. Is there a Darkseid story locked up in a vault that really heats up or something?

I like that about Thanos. The only way for them to beat Thanos was to let him beat himself. No one is man enough or smart enough to do it. he also didn't fall victim to it in marvel's the end.


I liked that story as well. Thanos still won in the end. Even when he loses he still comes out on top.


Thanos isn't some superman villain who gets beaten in virtually every medium out there. Even video games have Superman creaming the guy.

Originally posted by TricksterPriest
I can cite a few low points for Thanos. Like Warlock showing him how he subconsciously fails at everything due to an inferiority complex.
That might have been a low-point for Thanos, but it wasn't bad writing and was perfectly within his character at the time.

It was really good writing, IMO. And it happens a few times. The last time I believe is during Thanos #1, when he talks to Warlock about what it was like to have the Heart of the Universe's power. Good stuff. Not bad writing.

Perfect characters are boring characters. Everyone needs a tragic flaw.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanos' instances have been specifically addressed.

What is Darkseid's best writing? Be a dear and let me in on the best kept secret in comics. Is there a Darkseid story locked up in a vault that really heats up or something?

I like that about Thanos. The only way for them to beat Thanos was to let him beat himself. No one is man enough or smart enough to do it. he also didn't fall victim to it in marvel's the end.


Losses and victories aren't what constitute good writing. You can have Thanos be "the toughest there is" and still have a horribly derivative story pushing him. Feats, power ups, battles (to some extent) fall in the same category.

Good writing is about taking a character and giving him a compelling personality something Kirby did successfully with DS, especially in the Hunger Dogs. Being fictionally consistent is also part of good writing as losses have to be plausible. No one is going to bring up S/B as good writing for DS.

How about Seven Soldiers, FC, The Hunger Dogs, JKFW, The New God origin specials, The Great Darkness Saga, Rock of Ages, a couple of fine stories by Simonson and co. in the Orion series.

Getting power ups doesn't constitute a good story either, seeing as there's rarely a compelling story following such events (DONG).

Originally posted by Enyalus
Perfect characters are boring characters. Everyone needs a tragic flaw.

Yeah but it has to be an interesting flaw. An inferiority complex isn't the most interesting flaw, for various reasons (especially for story possibilities).

Originally posted by Allankles
Losses and victories aren't what constitute good writing. You can have Thanos be "the toughest there is" and still have a horribly derivative story pushing him.
Rulk.

Originally posted by Allankles
Good writing is about taking a character and giving him a compelling personality something Kirby did successfully with DS, especially in the Hunger Dogs. Being fictionally consistent is also part of good writing as losses have to be plausible. No one is going to bring up S/B as good writing for DS.

How about Seven Soldiers, FC, The Hunger Dogs, JKFW, The New God origin specials, The Great Darkness Saga, Rock of Ages, a couple of fine stories by Simonson and co. in the Orion series.

I didn't like Seven Soldiers. And I can't see why anybody did. But I think it was because of the style it was written in. It's like, I don't give a damn about Guardian. Why should I have to suffer through four issues of his stories?

Rock of Ages wasn't that special, either.

Originally posted by Allankles
Yeah but it has to be an interesting flaw. An inferiority complex isn't the most interesting flaw, for various reasons (especially for story possibilities).
You're right. It was more like a plot device to explain why someone who had basically become God on more than one occasion was beaten. That's really the only logical way to explain it lol.

Originally posted by Enyalus
Rock of Ages wasn't that special, either.

Rock of Ages was primarily cool because we saw the heroes pushed to the brink by 15 yrs of suffering under the yoke of DS. It was cool to see grizzled, take-no-prisoners guerilla soldier versions of DC's heroes.

Superman dead, the other JLA members weakened, dead or showing the wear and tear of 15 yrs of constant warfare, learning what it's like living on Apokolips.

Originally posted by Enyalus
I didn't like Seven Soldiers. And I can't see why anybody did. But I think it was because of the style it was written in. It's like, I don't give a damn about Guardian. Why should I have to suffer through four issues of his stories?



To each his own. Seven Soldiers basically proved there are different kind of heroes than the big destructively powerful Heralds like Supes and Hal or the glamorous Wonderwoman's and Batmans.

The Guardian is basically what an every day man (in his case a soldier) would be like if he became a super hero. In a way he's like a more realistic, reduced version of Batman.

And, it was a welcome relief from the typical mainstream comic. I liked the re-invented Klarion the Witch Boy.

Originally posted by Allankles
Rock of Ages was primarily cool
It was depressing, to me. Like, after the first issue of the arc, I literally didn't want to read anymore. It got better, yeah. And Batman punking Desaad (who I absolutely despise) was the highlight of it, lol. And I felt so bad for Flash, who got them into that mess in the first place.