Abraxas vs Anti monitor

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gobstakid777
who wins this

xJLxKing
It's been done before. I'd say AM from COIE at Full Power wins.

occultdestroyer
Originally posted by xJLxKing
It's been done before. I'd say AM from COIE at Full Power wins.

iceman24567
Yeah full power AM wins

galactusischere
Anti-Monitor and easily aswell

Knowsbleed33
He isn't winning easily if at all.

I'll go Abraxas ftw.

gobstakid777
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
He isn't winning easily if at all.

I'll go Abraxas ftw.
most ppl r sayin am.y does abe beat am

Knowsbleed33
Because I very much doubt AM can duplicate what it took to put and end to Abraxas.

Galan007
giving uatu amnesia, along with killing a handful of galactus', were the best feats we saw from abraxas. while that may be impressive, it's nowhere near enough to harm AM - who survived the very same type of event that utterly destroyed abraxas

AM also...
-warped the energies of the central battery.
-destroyed all but three of an infinite amount of universes.
-bested an amped spectre.
-etc, etc.


feat-wise, abraxas doesn't come close, imo.

Peterlane
Spectre is overrated imo

galactusischere
Originally posted by Galan007
giving uatu amnesia, along with killing a handful of galactus', were the best feats we saw from abraxas. while that may be impressive, it's nowhere near enough to harm AM - who survived the very same type of event that utterly destroyed abraxas

AM also...
-warped the energies of the central battery.
-destroyed all but three of an infinite amount of universes.
-bested an amped spectre.
-etc, etc.


feat-wise, abraxas doesn't come close, imo.

yea but 616 galactus owned him basically.. "You hold nothing, you are nothing!!"

Galan007
Originally posted by galactusischere
yea but 616 galactus owned him basically.. "You hold nothing, you are nothing!!" exactly. thumb up

abraxas almost seemed frightened by the 'prime' galactus.

galactusischere
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
He isn't winning easily if at all.

I'll go Abraxas ftw.

AM>>>>>>>>>>>>> 616 Galactus
and remember what Galactus told Abraxas?
" You hold nothing, you are NOTHING!!" and then Abraxas was scared sh**less.

Knowsbleed33
It took power beyond what AM is capable of to defeat Abraxas, it's that simple.

Abraxas wasn't scared, he was shocked that Galactus just took the UN from him. In a straight up fight Abraxas would destroy Galactus.

xJLxKing
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
It took power beyond what AM is capable of to defeat Abraxas, it's that simple.

Abraxas wasn't scared, he was shocked that Galactus just took the UN from him. In a straight up fight Abraxas would destroy Galactus. Abraxas died from an attack that recreated reality. AM lived!

Knowsbleed33
Abraxas was re-IMPRISONED by Reed Richards pushing the reset button on the entire multiverse.

Abraxas still exsists.

galactusischere
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Abraxas was re-IMPRISONED by Reed Richards pushing the reset button on the entire multiverse.

Abraxas still exsists.

As much as I like Galactus i gotta agee with you that Abraxas is more powerful but come one he was scared or atleast intimidated.
but still AM is pretty powerful and Abraxas is nowhere near his power.. just my opinion.

Peterlane
Abraxas wins

Knowsbleed33
Originally posted by galactusischere
As much as I like Galactus i gotta agee with you that Abraxas is more powerful but come one he was scared or atleast intimidated.
but still AM is pretty powerful and Abraxas is nowhere near his power.. just my opinion.

He wasn't afraid, he was shocked that Galactus easily stripped him of the UN.

Abraxas is the physical representation of the destruction. He's an abstract on a level higher than AM.

AM lacks the ability to easily reset the multiverse like the UN does. As far as we know that's the only way you can defeat Abraxas.

Mr Master
Originally posted by galactusischere

and remember what Galactus told Abraxas?

"You hold nothing, you are NOTHING!!"
If Abraxas was nothing,
then why did 616 Eternity (multi-Eternity or all of Eternity)
need to cry for help against Abraxas?

Heck it was 616 Eternity that created a Galactus for every Universe
just to keep Abraxas imprisoned.

Galactus did his boast ("you are nothing"wink
because Galactus knew he could take the UN, which is a part of him,
which was the ONLY possible way to defeat Abraxas.

Anyhow, that ending was PIS,
as Reed should've never had enough time to contemplate & then press that button.
Abraxas should've been able to strip the UN from Reed, as easily as it was stripped from him,
and even faster considering his cosmic senses/speed/reflexes etc.
(instead he jobs at the end, by talking to Reed) thumb down
Originally posted by galactusischere

and then Abraxas was scared sh**less.
The only thing Abraxas was depicted fearing was the UN.

As it was stated on panel and in his bio to be his only weakness.
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33

He wasn't afraid, he was shocked that Galactus easily stripped him of the UN.
thumb up
Originally posted by Galan007

giving uatu amnesia, along with killing a handful of galactus',

were the best feats we saw from abraxas.
I think collapsing entire Universes just by approaching them are better feats.

Abraxas doesn't even need to attack, to crush a Universe, his presence does the job.

As for the match, AM never did what it took to defeat Abraxas,
and that is,
to nullify all that was/is and ever will be in time-space in an instant.

AM barely survived that "destroying/creation" blast, but he did survive,
but Abraxas still exists as well.

As I understand it, AM was absorbing one Universe at a time,
in the same fashion Abraxas collapses the Multiverse,
which then leads to the fall of the Omniverse.

This may be a stalemate at best imo. (if AM is already at full power)

Wei Phoenix
Originally posted by Mr Master

in the same fashion Abraxas collapses the Multiverse,
which then leads to the fall of the Omniverse.


There is a difference between Multiverse and Omniverse? Can you explain because I thought they were like synonyms.

galactusischere
Originally posted by Mr Master
If Abraxas was nothing,
then why did 616 Eternity (multi-Eternity or all of Eternity)
need to cry for help against Abraxas?

Heck it was 616 Eternity that created a Galactus for every Universe
just to keep Abraxas imprisoned.

Galactus did his boast ("you are nothing"wink
because Galactus knew he could take the UN, which is a part of him,
which was the ONLY possible way to defeat Abraxas.

Anyhow, that ending was PIS,
as Reed should've never had enough time to contemplate & then press that button.
Abraxas should've been able to strip the UN from Reed, as easily as it was stripped from him,
and even faster considering his cosmic senses/speed/reflexes etc.
(instead he jobs at the end, by talking to Reed) thumb down

The only thing Abraxas was depicted fearing was the UN.

As it was stated on panel and in his bio to be his only weakness.

thumb up

I think collapsing entire Universes just by approaching them are better feats.

Abraxas doesn't even need to attack, to crush a Universe, his presence does the job.

As for the match, AM never did what it took to defeat Abraxas,
and that is,
to nullify all that was/is and ever will be in time-space in an instant.

AM barely survived that "destroying/creation" blast, but he did survive,
but Abraxas still exists as well.

As I understand it, AM was absorbing one Universe at a time,
in the same fashion Abraxas collapses the Multiverse,
which then leads to the fall of the Omniverse.

This may be a stalemate at best imo. (if AM is already at full power)

and galactus still survived the UN blast.

Mr Master
Originally posted by galactusischere

and galactus still survived the UN blast.
Actually he didn't, he was re-created with everything else.

Galactus is susceptible to the UN's power, even though its part of him.

Imo, I've always guessed that the UN was created by Eternity
as a means of defense against Abraxas.

I mean Eternity created all the other Galactuses,
and basically 616 Galactus is one with Eternity/Death/Infinity/Oblivion. (in a way)

galactusischere
Originally posted by Mr Master
Actually he didn't, he was re-created with everything else.

Galactus is susceptible to the UN's power, even though its part of him.

Imo, I've always guessed that the UN was created by Eternity
as a means of defense against Abraxas.

I mean Eternity created all the other Galactuses,
and basically 616 Galactus is one with Eternity/Death/Infinity/Oblivion. (in a way)

Eternity created the other Gs but not Galactus prime, I know that Abraxas is more powerful than Galactus(without the UN tht is) but he was scared when Galactus took the UN from him with a thought.

Scans:
1) http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/4316/23as6.jpg
2) http://img155.imageshack.us/img155/8072/26iq3.jpg
3) http://img225.imageshack.us/img225/111/27jm6.jpg

Mr Master
Originally posted by galactusischere

Eternity created the other Gs but not Galactus prime,
Wiat, do you know who created Galactus "prime?"
Originally posted by galactusischere

I know that Abraxas is more powerful than Galactus(without the UN tht is)
but he was scared when Galactus took the UN from him with a thought.
With the UN Reed was able to defeat him,
of course he was scared friend. smile

Still, Abraxas is a beast, and it takes a mighty power to take em out.

Tattoos N Scars
Galactus was the sole surviver of the previous universe, eh?

Nihilist
Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
Galactus was the sole surviver of the previous universe, eh? Yeah, Galan of Taa.

galactusischere
Originally posted by Mr Master
Wiat, do you know who created Galactus "prime?"

Yes, he is the sole survivor of the previous universe combined with that universe's eternity I think.

Peterlane
Originally posted by galactusischere
Yes, he is the sole survivor of the previous universe combined with that universe's eternity I think.

Yup your right. Pheonix Force also survived...just saying.

Anyways Abraxas rapes.

Prep-Man
AM wins.

iceman24567
Yeah AM wins

Mr Master
Originally posted by Peterlane

Yup your right. Pheonix Force also survived...just saying.
Phoenix Force didn't survive,
it was reborn in the fires of the Big Bang like all other abstracts.

Only Galan survived, and actually even Galan was remade ... into Galactus.

Galan only survived because the Infinity Being allowed it,
it then merged with Galan,
in order to create a new Marvel Universe with a new Galan (Galactus) as its balance.

In fact, since the Infinity Being was the only sentience in existence,
this means Galan was actually a part of the Infinity Being, like everything else.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Mr Master
Phoenix Force didn't survive,
it was reborn in the fires of the Big Bang like all other abstracts.

Only Galan survived, and actually even Galan was remade ... into Galactus.

Galan only survived because the Infinity Being allowed it,
it then merged with Galan,
in order to create a new Marvel Universe with a new Galan (Galactus) as its balance.

In fact, since the Infinity Being was the only sentience in existence,
this means Galan was actually a part of the Infinity Being, like everything else.

do you have the issue off hand where it shows galactus's origin?

redhotrash
Beating Eternity really isnt that impressive. Seems like half his appearances hes being punked by someone. I wouldnt be shocked if Norman made him register....

Galan007
Originally posted by Mr Master
I think collapsing entire Universes just by approaching them are better feats. how many universes did we actually see abraxas destroy? i remember seeing a universe being torn apart, but i don't remember any having actually been destroyed... regardless, i know for a fact he didn't destroy the number of universes AM did.

so in the department of displayed power output, AM >.

Originally posted by Mr Master
As for the match, AM never did what it took to defeat Abraxas,
and that is, and abraxas never demonstrated anything on panel that leads me to believe he could harm AM. at all.

Originally posted by Mr Master
AM barely survived that "destroying/creation" blast, but he did survive,
but Abraxas still exists as well. the fact that abraxas has yet to be seen since that arc is more than enough to say his 'reign of terror' was certainly ended.

AM, however, survived the exact same type of 'attack' which utterly annihilated abraxas - and afterwards, was none the worse for wear, really.

so in the area of durability, AM >.

Originally posted by Mr Master
As I understand it, AM was absorbing one Universe at a time,
in the same fashion Abraxas collapses the Multiverse,
which then leads to the fall of the Omniverse. no. AM destroyed all but 3 of an infinite amount of universes, seemingly one by one. however, he absorbed the entirety of their combined energies, in one foul swoop.


in nearly all areas, AM's on panel feats are > those of abraxas. that said, if one character's displayed feats are better than another character's, there's no reason to believe said character wouldn't be victorious in a given battle.

AM ftw.

guy222
AM FTW

john allerdyce
I never saw anything in the 5 issues Abraxas was involved in that led me to believe he was on Anti-Monitor's level.

Anti-Monitor wins.

Knowsbleed33
Despite the fact that AM never displayed the ability to duplicate what it took to defeat Abraxas?

Yea, Abraxas wins.

Galan007
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Yea, Abraxas wins. i'd sure like to hear how. smile

Knowsbleed33
I dunno, by destroying him? That is his job.

How does AM win?

Galan007
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
I dunno, by destroying him? That is his job.

How does AM win? -what feats does Abraxas have that lead you to the conclusion that he could destroy AM?

-by having superior feats. you see, usually the character with superior feats wins the battle.

Knowsbleed33
Originally posted by Galan007
-what feats does Abraxas have that lead you to the conclusion that he could destroy AM?

He can do everything AM can. He wanted the UN so he could do it in one fell swoop.



You're kidding right? I always thought you were better than this nonsense.

SoulDevourer
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
I dunno, by destroying him? That is his job.

How does AM win? I dunno, by destroyin him & the universe hes in? thats his thing stick out tongue

Mr Master
Originally posted by Galan007

how many universes did we actually see abraxas destroy?
All the Universes that contained all those Galactuses Abraxas killed were collapsed.

There were another 9 Universes the writer stated Abraxas would collapse.

Those were the ones we know about, as far as individualism,
then there's the fact that at the end Reed had to realign "all that was"
suggesting, everything was out of wack,
or in other words,
the Multiverse entire was collapsing courtesy of Abraxas' presence.

Abraxas also displayed influence over reality across infinity simultaneously,
when he was killing every Reed in infinity with a gesture.
Originally posted by Galan007

i remember seeing a universe being torn apart,
but i don't remember any having actually been destroyed... regardless, i know for a fact he didn't destroy the number of universes AM did.
Only because Abraxas was stopped by the UN before he could finish his job,
regardless, it was the entire Multiverse that was collapsing according to the story,
so ...
Originally posted by Galan007

so in the department of displayed power output, AM >.
I disagree.

Nothing imo suggests this equation to be true.
Originally posted by Galan007

and abraxas never demonstrated anything on panel
that leads me to believe he could harm AM. at all.
And AM never demonstrated anything on panel
that leads me to believe he could harm Abraxas. at all.
Originally posted by Galan007

the fact that abraxas has yet to be seen since that arc is more than enough to say his 'reign of terror' was certainly ended.
Abraxas is safe and sound buried within Eternity, nothing more.

His reign of terror will easily appear again if 616 Galactus 'dies' again.
Originally posted by Galan007

AM, however, survived the exact same type of 'attack' which utterly annihilated abraxas - and afterwards, was none the worse for wear, really.

so in the area of durability, AM >.
It was the UN that defeated Abraxas,
a weapon,
not a being re-creating reality on top of his opponent,
that affect, was the UN's side-affect as a result.

Heck, Eternity, who sunders and creates entire Universes anew all day every day,
who can rebirth every Universe if he wanted,
could've easily remade creation,
but that was not the solution, the solution was the UN's nullfication capabilities,
which is to erase an act from ever having taken place.

So a new Marvel Universe was created where Abraxas never manifested,
from his prison within Eternity.

Remember, the same totality that AM nearly destroyed, (an infinite Multiverse)
was afraid of Abraxas, and had to seek help against Abraxas.

Meh, Eternity actually represents time across the Omniverse.
Originally posted by Galan007

no. AM destroyed all but 3 of an infinite amount of universes, seemingly one by one. however, he absorbed the entirety of their combined energies, in one foul swoop.
Abraxas was collapsing the entire Marvelverse,
and didn't need to absorb any of it in order to do so.

AM destroying one, all or but 3 of an infinite amount of realities means little,
as Abraxas was fuly capable and on his way to doing the same shit
only he was stopped by the UN before completing his task.

Same story with AM, he was stoped before reaching the finish line.

I don't see any difference.
Originally posted by Galan007

in nearly all areas, AM's on panel feats are > those of abraxas.
I disagree.
Originally posted by Galan007

that said, if one character's displayed feats are better than another character's, there's no reason to believe said character wouldn't be victorious in a given battle.
I agree, although this imo doesn't relate to AM vs Abraxas.
Originally posted by Galan007

AM ftw.
Abraxas ftw. (see, easy)

SoulDevourer
k but how did Abraxas exacly destroy those universes? iirc he dint destroy the universes themselve, only it was consequence of all the Galactuses deaths wich caused universes to colapse, right? huh (kinda like takin whole building down not by busting the bulding but by takin out a few pilars)

unless im mixin up with somethin else sad

Philosophía
Anti-Monitor stomps.

Mr Master
Originally posted by SoulDevourer

k but how did Abraxas exacly destroy those universes? iirc he dint destroy the universes themselve, only it was consequence of all the Galactuses deaths wich caused universes to colapse, right? (kinda like takin whole building down not by busting the bulding but by takin out a few pilars)
Abraxas collapses Universes with just his presence.

Basically, he gets close to a Universe (not even entering it)
and said Universe begins to collapse,
simple as that.

Galactuses dying have nothing to do with Abraxas' ability to collapse Universes,
in fact Universes do not collapse because of any Galactus dying.

The Marvelverse entire begins to collapse because 616 Galactus dies,
but this collpase is what Abraxas is.

Basically, Abaraxas is the embodiment of that collapse taking place,
because of 616 Galactus dying. (returning to his natural state)

But the collapsing itself is Abraxas' power at work.

SoulDevourer
Originally posted by Mr Master
Basically, Abaraxas is the embodiment of that collapse taking place,so hes what like another Oblivion? huh (but then the UN worked on him so that means hes < Oblivion)



what if he dint kill the Galactuses in the other realities, those realities would of still collapsed?

or did the others collapse only because 616 was collapsing? (cuz iirc they said something about 616 reality being special or somethin, if it goes then the rest also goes with it)

Mr Master
Originally posted by SoulDevourer

so hes what like another Oblivion?
(but then the UN worked on him so that means hes < Oblivion)
Who said Oblivion is immune to the UN?

And Oblivion is nothing like Abraxas,
they're two completely different entities with different purposes.
Originally posted by SoulDevourer

what if he dint kill the Galactuses in the other realities,
those realities would of still collapsed?
Yes, since like I said,
it's Abraxas' presence that collapses Universes.
Originally posted by SoulDevourer

or did the others collapse only because 616 was collapsing? (cuz iirc they said something about 616 reality being special or somethin, if it goes then the rest also goes with it)
I already explained it to ya in my previous post,
read it again cuz it answers this question.

SoulDevourer
Originally posted by Mr Master
Who said Oblivion is immune to the UN? no1 but it make sense dont it? (if Oblivion is nulified then he still exist cuz he is nulification, so if hes nulified then hes not nulified embarrasment)

Originally posted by Mr Master
Yes, since like I said,
it's Abraxas' presence that collapses Universes so u think its gonna work in the DC multiverse too? (where theres no galactus)

Knowsbleed33
Originally posted by SoulDevourer
I dunno, by destroyin him & the universe hes in? thats his thing stick out tongue

How's that going to work? Abraxas was never killed, he was just put back in his cage.

SoulDevourer
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
How's that going to work? Abraxas was never killed, he was just put back in his cage. but Abraxas wuz killed/nulified for a moment when they use the UN right? huh (then he was restore when they restore the MU)

Knowsbleed33
Nope. The multiverse was reset to the way it was before Abraxas was released.

AM can't duplicate this. He was destroying universes slowly, one at a time.

SoulDevourer
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Nope. The multiverse was reset to the way it was before Abraxas was released.
allrite

but AM dont just destroy universes he eats them (iirc he absorb them into himself or something, thats what it look like anyway) so if Abraxas is in it then at best hes just trapped inside the AM, at worse hes nulified/digested along with the universe laughing out loud

Knowsbleed33
yeah, not gonna happen. Abraxas can travel cross-dimensionally.

AM isn't that durable. He was nearly killed by Supergirl.

Galan007
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
You're kidding right? I always thought you were better than this nonsense. no feats abraxas has are better than AM's. you've posted nothing to the contrary.

Originally posted by Mr Master
It was the UN that defeated Abraxas,
a weapon,
not a being re-creating reality on top of his opponent,
that affect, was the UN's side-affect as a result.

Heck, Eternity, who sunders and creates entire Universes anew all day every day,
who can rebirth every Universe if he wanted,
could've easily remade creation,
but that was not the solution, the solution was the UN's nullfication capabilities,
which is to erase an act from ever having taken place. *sighs*

the blast unleashed destroyed creation from it's beginning, then melded said infinity into a single universe. the SAME thing totally owned abraxas. AM, however, rather easily survived it.

no matter how you try and justify things, AM's displayed durability > abraxas'.



Originally posted by Mr Master
Abraxas was collapsing the entire Marvelverse,
and didn't need to absorb any of it in order to do so.

AM destroying one, all or but 3 of an infinite amount of realities means little,
as Abraxas was fuly capable and on his way to doing the same
only he was stopped by the UN before completing his task.

as Abraxas was fuly capable and on his way to doing the same AM did not have to absorb a universe, to destroy one. none it was only at the end that he absorbed their cumulative power.

anyhow, a character being fully capable of doing something means very little when compared to a character who has ACTUALLY done so, on panel. that said, AM destroying nearly an infinite amount of universes, on panel > abraxas destroying a handful of them, on panel.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
AM isn't that durable. He was nearly killed by Supergirl. 1.) if you actually look at the depiction, it's very clear that AM wasn't 'nearly killed'. as he had already reformed on the very next page.

2.) the second shell he built as a result of her attack was FAR more durable than the first shell. it took a multiverse-busting attack to even rupture it.

leonidas
Originally posted by Galan007
how many universes did we actually see abraxas destroy? i remember seeing a universe being torn apart, but i don't remember any having actually been destroyed... regardless, i know for a fact he didn't destroy the number of universes AM did.

so in the department of displayed power output, AM >.

and abraxas never demonstrated anything on panel that leads me to believe he could harm AM. at all.

the fact that abraxas has yet to be seen since that arc is more than enough to say his 'reign of terror' was certainly ended.

AM, however, survived the exact same type of 'attack' which utterly annihilated abraxas - and afterwards, was none the worse for wear, really.

so in the area of durability, AM >.

no. AM destroyed all but 3 of an infinite amount of universes, seemingly one by one. however, he absorbed the entirety of their combined energies, in one foul swoop.


in nearly all areas, AM's on panel feats are > those of abraxas. that said, if one character's displayed feats are better than another character's, there's no reason to believe said character wouldn't be victorious in a given battle.

AM ftw.

yep. smile

leonidas
Originally posted by Galan007
no feats abraxas has are better than AM's. you've posted nothing to the contrary.

*sighs*

the blast unleashed destroyed creation from it's beginning, then melded said infinity into a single universe. the SAME thing totally owned abraxas. AM, however, rather easily survived it.

no matter how you try and justify things, AM's displayed durability > abraxas'.



AM did not have to absorb a universe, to destroy one. none it was only at the end that he absorbed their cumulative power.

anyhow, a character being fully capable of

doing something means very little when compared to a character who has ACTUALLY done so, on panel. that said, AM destroying nearly an infinite amount of universes, on panel > abraxas destroying a handful of them, on panel.

1.) if you actually look at the depiction, it's very clear that AM wasn't 'nearly killed'. as he had already reformed on the very next page.

2.) the second shell he built as a result of her attack was FAR more durable than the first shell. it took a multiverse-busting attack to even rupture it.

yep. again. smile

Merlyn
Heh, all the "arguments" I've seen for Abraxas here scream of bias, and are pushing laughable.

Anti-Monitor ftw.

starlock
Originally posted by Merlyn
Heh, all the "arguments" I've seen for Abraxas here scream of bias, and are pushing laughable.

Anti-Monitor ftw.

Yep smile

Enyalus
I don't really see anything feat-wise that would indicate AM has the requisite power to harm Abraxas. I can't see anti-matter harming the embodiment of destruction. This is like pitting AM against Destruction of The Endless.


I think it's a stalemate, even though I would agree to COIE AM being more powerful.

id369
The Classic Anti Monitor outranks Abraxas in just about every category.

Zack M
Anti-Monitor wins.

XSUPREMEXSKILLZ
Yeah, Abraxas doesn't possess the power of 2 multiverses like Peak AM does.

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