Logan's Army vs WWHulk

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Starscream M
Wolverine, The Gorgon (blind-folded and has adamantium katana), Omega Red, and Sabretooth (with Adamantium)

vs

WWHulk

Battlehammer
Team

Starscream M
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Team you think so? even though so many failed? why do you think the team would win?

iceman24567
If they cut his head off he's gone right? They don't have the punching power to kill or ko him thats for sure. If he doesn't Thunderclap from the go i think he's headless.

Battlehammer
Omega red power is a big factor.

Starscream M
Originally posted by iceman24567
If they cut his head off he's gone right? They don't have the punching power to kill or ko him thats for sure. If he doesn't Thunderclap from the go i think he's headless. WWHulk is extremely smart and tactical, and skilled as well. remember, he also has that metal arm brace that he could use to block with.

The Pict
WWH takes it IMO

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Starscream M
WWHulk is extremely smart and tactical, and skilled as well. remember, he also has that metal arm brace that he could use to block with.
He was not that smart nor tactical or skilled. he was smart skilled and tactical for hulk, but to say extremely is just pushing it.

brace won't do shit. wolevrine had no trouble slashing him nor will anyone on this team. Gorgon gunna be tearing into him all the while he beeing drain by red.

Wild Shadow
the team takes it imo. no jobbing here

Starscream M
Originally posted by Battlehammer
He was not that smart nor tactical or skilled. he was smart skilled and tactical for hulk, but to say extremely is just pushing it.

brace won't do shit. wolevrine had no trouble slashing him nor will anyone on this team. Gorgon gunna be tearing into him all the while he beeing drain by red. he was smart

thats how he beat so many of his opponents

wolverine was only slashing him because hulk allowed him to...toying with him

WWH could've easily kicked or punched Logan into the next state

The Pict
Originally posted by Battlehammer
He was not that smart nor tactical or skilled. he was smart skilled and tactical for hulk, but to say extremely is just pushing it.

brace won't do shit. wolevrine had no trouble slashing him nor will anyone on this team. Gorgon gunna be tearing into him all the while he beeing drain by red.

He was extremely skilled, he took down some of the most powerful heroes on Earth no expression

Of course Wolverine will have trouble slashing him. They already fought and Logan got his ass kicked. He slashed him along the ribs then got knocked into the woods. Slashed his eyes and arm when Hulk grabbed him before getting his head pounded. Each time he went in to claw at Hulk he got owned.

Wolverine is one of my favourite characters and I really don't like Hulk after the last few years, but WWH is not going to have a problem here.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Starscream M
he was smart

thats how he beat so many of his opponents

wolverine was only slashing him because hulk allowed him to...toying with him

WWH could've easily kicked or punched Logan into the next state
he was smarter, extremely smart is pushing it.

He pritty much powered through people. Is intellect harldy came into play, he was simply utilizing his powers like any functioning person would and not using them like a child.

Not at all. Logan hit him becuase he faster and quicker. Same reason X hit him amoung others. Hulk did not let anything happen.


Yet that never happens in comics. He couldent or he would have.

Starscream M
Originally posted by Battlehammer


Yet that never happens in comics. He couldent or he would have. it never happens in comics?

actually it has happened..usually the end of a fight, hulk punches logan or throws him miles away

the reason it doesn't happen is it would be pretty boring comic if hulk just BFRed logan the second the fight starts.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by The Pict
He was extremely skilled, he took down some of the most powerful heroes on Earth no expression

Of course Wolverine will have trouble slashing him. They already fought and Logan got his ass kicked. He slashed him along the ribs then got knocked into the woods. Slashed his eyes and arm when Hulk grabbed him before getting his head pounded.

Wolverine is one of my favourite characters and I really don't like Hulk after the last few years, but WWH is not going to have a problem here.
Not becuase of his skills. To pretend like he some wicked skilled fighter is laughable.


No he dident wolverien easily slashed him. Sure WWH hulk too him out, he took most everyone out, but wolverine never had problems slashing him. With gorgon there, sabre-tooh helping out and Red drain hulk it be game over. Ever slash hitting him would be deadly from the life drain.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Starscream M
it never happens in comics?

actually it has happened..usually the end of a fight, hulk punches logan or throws him miles away

the reason it doesn't happen is it would be pretty boring comic if hulk just BFRed logan the second the fight starts.
Yes it hardly happens in comics the majority of the time the vast majority of the time no one is sent miles. Actaully Hulk has hit wolverine miles away twice out of 15 fights...... 15:2 ratio.


No the reason it does not happen is it a comic. It does not rely on real worl logic. If it did Thing would beat the hulk in a single hit and every single fight between 10 tonner up would end in one shot.

guy222
WWH

The Pict
Battlehammer arguing that WWH loses it's what's laughable. The guy took on the X-Men (shitloads of them) Strange, the FF4 and even Sentry (though I always count that as a stalemate) and you think because Omega Red is here Hulk will lose? Not a chance. His HF will keep him safe while he one shots everyone except Logan, that'll take 4 or 5 shots.

And he was skilled, he was a gladiator on planet Skaar, and the writer's intended for Hulk to have full use of Banner's intellect. It's in his bio, obviously not always the most reliable source but he was more than just cunning, as you seem to suggest.

http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/2175/wwhgf021.th.jpg

Naija boy
WWH plows through these guys.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by The Pict
Battlehammer arguing that WWH loses it's what's laughable. The guy took on the X-Men (shitloads of them) Strange, the FF4 and even Sentry (though I always count that as a stalemate) and you think because Omega Red is here Hulk will lose? Not a chance. His HF will keep him safe while he one shots everyone except Logan, that'll take 4 or 5 shots.

And he was skilled, he was a gladiator on planet Skaar, and the writer's intended for Hulk to have full use of Banner's intellect. It's in his bio, obviously not always the most reliable source but he was more than just cunning, as you seem to suggest.

http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/2175/wwhgf021.th.jpg
No it not at all. Hulk healing factor wont cancle anything. Red life drain drains wolverine to nothing in seconds. Hulk healing factor is not going to withstand it espically with 3 other guys clawing the shit out of him. You do realies every single person in here damage soak is wolverines level, except gorgon body dead, sabre-tooth is much more durable then wolverine and Red is even more durabkle then sabre-tooth. You saying they all be one shotted asside from wolverine shows your ignorances of the other characters, even more so then your assumption that hulk healing factor can some how match red life drain. Oh and Gorgon will be reading his mind like and open book along with cutting him to shit with a adamatium sword.


gladiators arnt even known for there skill. Most of them are highly unskilled. let a lone extremely skilled. Hulk is well be neath any combatant on the team in skill or tactical prowesses.

Knowsbleed33
If Pak were writing, WWH would win in a landslide.

The Pict
Originally posted by Battlehammer
No it not at all. Hulk healing factor wont cancle anything. Red life drain drains wolverine to nothing in seconds. Hulk healing factor is not going to withstand it espically with 3 other guys clawing the shit out of him. You do realies every single person in here damage soak is wolverines level, except gorgon body dead, sabre-tooth is much more durable then wolverine and Red is even more durabkle then sabre-tooth. You saying they all be one shotted asside from wolverine shows your ignorances of the other characters, even more so then your assumption that hulk healing factor can some how match red life drain. Oh and Gorgon will be reading his mind like and open book along with cutting him to shit with a adamatium sword.


gladiators arnt even known for there skill. Most of them are highly unskilled. let a lone extremely skilled. Hulk is well be neath any combatant on the team in skill or tactical prowesses.

Are any of these combatants as durable as Thing? Obviously not. However WWH put down Thing with one attack, a fist to either side of his head. Now that would put anyone down here besides Logan as he has a invulnerable skull.

It took WWH 7 shots to put Logan out of the X-Men fight.

Bouboumaster
Hulk bfr them on one side an another, then, he go stomp the face of everyone in 1 vs 1

Battlehammer
Originally posted by The Pict
Are any of these combatants as durable as Thing? Obviously not. However WWH put down Thing with one attack, a fist to either side of his head. Now that would put anyone down here besides Logan as he has a invulnerable skull.

It took WWH 7 shots to put Logan out of the X-Men fight.

No it wouldent. It took hulk 7 direct shots to the head to nock out wolverine. Sabre-tooth even more durable by a lot and has adamatium skeleton. Then you have red who even more durable then sabre-tooth who was not even scratched by a boozoka. These guys arnt just durable they posses crazy level of damage soak which lets them keep on fighting.


yea seven he ahd to direct right at the head, he even stated if he dident thye be going at it all day. Now you have two guys even more durable. You have gorgon who a telepath with crazy level of speeds who gunna be one pain in the ass for Hulk to even hit. Then you have Red who has Thing or higher level of strength and who has the pheramones which will weaken Hulk healing factor slightly and the life drain which will drain hulk to nothingness as he been slash to bits by the team oh and then to make it worses red gets more powerful as he drains the life force.

Survivor19
Ok, team, if they play it smart.
Though it's not beyond Hulk to BFR the most troublesome (OR, Wolverine) first, and then manhandle others until their heads go pop...

The Pict
Gorgon won't make a difference, Xavier couldn't use telepathy on WWH so Gorgon doesn't have that advantage. Also Hulk caught Wolverine and X-23 easily enough so I doubt he'll have trouble tagging everyone here.

Naija boy
not being scratched by a bazooka is a laughable durability feat when we are talking about taking WWhulks punches. The only reason hulk cant ko wolverine in one punch is his HF and adamantium skull. Omega red doesnt have said advantages. Also that lifeforce drain isnt likely to work on an angry hulk anyways. A powerful enough thunderclap will put down the gorgon and then all thats left is for hulk to beat the crap out of wolvie and sabertooth.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by The Pict
Gorgon won't make a difference, Xavier couldn't use telepathy on WWH so Gorgon doesn't have that advantage. Also Hulk caught Wolverine and X-23 easily enough so I doubt he'll have trouble tagging everyone here.
Gorgon telepathy is not the same, nor is he trying to stop hulk, he simply reading his mind which I dont recall anyone not being able to do they simply could not effect it. Wolverien has stopped many people from entering his mind and yet gorgon with utter ease could enter.

Gorgon moves at the speed of though, he faster then either wolverine and X-23. Hell he toy with elektra who has superhuman levels of speed to the point she could not even hit him. Every one on the list is faster then X-23 is. There all going to be landing hits at will. Also What hulk to do when Red draining his energy from him weakening his body vastly. We saw how he did when red hulk drained him of gamma. Imagin this but instead you have 3 other guys slashing him to shit as it happens.

Starscream M
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Also What hulk to do when Red draining his energy from him weakening his body vastly. WWHulk would rip those tentacles out of Red's arms

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Naija boy
not being scratched by a bazooka is a laughable durability feat when we are talking about taking WWhulks punches. The only reason hulk cant ko wolverine in one punch is his HF and adamantium skull. Omega red doesnt have said advantages. Also that lifeforce drain isnt likely to work on an angry hulk anyways. A powerful enough thunderclap will put down the gorgon and then all thats left is for hulk to beat the crap out of wolvie and sabertooth.
red take shots from colossus in a weaken state with out the uses of his armor after being tortured for months on end with out pauses. Hulk aint going to be easily knocking out 100% red with armor. Life drain will certainly work. Hulk being angry cant stop some one from draining the energy from him, to assume so is laughable. Thunder clap can't put gorgon down, his body dead the thunder clap sonic attack would be utterly usesless.

Battlehammer
Originally posted by Starscream M
WWHulk would rip those tentacles out of Red's arms
not at all. Not that he even needs to touch him with the tentacles. in recent issues it seems now be a range attack. Red drain work instantly as seen with how well colossus did.

Naija boy
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Gorgon telepathy is not the same, nor is he trying to stop hulk, he simply reading his mind which I dont recall anyone not being able to do they simply could not effect it. Wolverien has stopped many people from entering his mind and yet gorgon with utter ease could enter.

Gorgon moves at the speed of though, he faster then either wolverine and X-23. Hell he toy with elektra who has superhuman levels of speed to the point she could not even hit him. Every one on the list is faster then X-23 is. There all going to be landing hits at will. Also What hulk to do when Red draining his energy from him weakening his body vastly. We saw how he did when red hulk drained him of gamma. Imagin this but instead you have 3 other guys slashing him to shit as it happens.

Dont compare Red hulk and Omega red. that is just ridiculous considering red hulk has also drained Surfer (albeit a rookie surfer) as well as what he has acomplished. Further Red hulk drained savage hulk and there is a big difference between he and WWH. during WWH darwin tried draining hulk and failed miserably.

Hulk will heal almost as soon as the slashes go through his body so he wont be worrying about that. On the other hand it ll take just few punches for him to ko most of those here and even less for him to BFR.

Starscream M
battlehammer, did you watch the animated movie, Hulk vs Wolverine?

He destroyed Wolverine, Omega Red, Sabretooth, Deadpool, and Lady Deathstrike

Starscream M
Originally posted by Battlehammer
not at all. Not that he even needs to touch him with the tentacles. in recent issues it seems now be a range attack. Red drain work instantly as seen with how well colossus did. if its a ranged attack, then it will hurt his teammates more than hulk, as Hulk has the best HF

Starscream M
Originally posted by Battlehammer
Thunder clap can't put gorgon down, his body dead the thunder clap sonic attack would be utterly usesless. but it would hurt Logan and Sabretooth as their ears are especially sensitive

also the force of the thunderclap will send Gorgon flying

The Pict
WWH will not be effected by them "slashing him to shit" as he has one of the most powerful HF. Hell Strange put both his arms through Hulk and he was up seconds later.

And he got slashed already when fighting the X-Men. He got slashed by Wolverine, X-23, Warpath and still handeled them. The X-Men team there were far more trouble than the team here.

WWH's thunderclap was enough to knock down Colossus and Emma in diamond form. They are more duarable than his opponents here. Gorgon will be put down.

There's no way Hulk is going to lose.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
Thunder clap can't put gorgon down, his body dead the thunder clap sonic attack would be utterly usesless.

It's not a sonic attack as much as a creation of pure force. It knocked down Colossus so Gorgon doesn't have a chance.

iceman24567
LOL at Gorgon not being affected by a thunderclap eek!

Naija boy
Originally posted by Battlehammer
red take shots from colossus in a weaken state with out the uses of his armor after being tortured for months on end with out pauses. Hulk aint going to be easily knocking out 100% red with armor. Life drain will certainly work. Hulk being angry cant stop some one from draining the energy from him, to assume so is laughable. Thunder clap can't put gorgon down, his body dead the thunder clap sonic attack would be utterly usesless.

lol collosus? please. his strength level is nothing compare to WWH. Hulk oneshotted Ares,Thing, and she hulk during WWH. Omega Red is not as durable as any of those people. Further Darwin already tried draining hulks energy during WWH and failed miserably. Omega red will fail as well. The thunderclap isnt only a sonic attack as it releases alot of concussive force, force which in the past has put down the likes of Ironman and Wonderman. Gorgon is getting koed as well.

Wild Shadow
you guys seem to the avoid the most obvious attack taht each team member would most likely go for that would put hulk down regardless.

the neck stab. each member is known for using such an attack WWH or not he will not walk away from that when they manage to dogpile on him and exploit the attack.

The Pict
Originally posted by iceman24567
LOL at Gorgon not being affected by a thunderclap eek!

I know laughing out loud

Battlehammer is only arguing because of his love for Wolverine srug

WWH basically put down the biggest players in the MU (though I thought a lot of it was BS) and Battlehammer thinks Omega Red will beat him?? Crazy!

Originally posted by Naija boy
lol collosus? please. his strength level is nothing compare to WWH. Hulk oneshotted Ares,Thing, and she hulk during WWH. Omega Red is not as durable as any of those people. Further Darwin already tried draining hulks energy during WWH and failed miserably. Omega red will fail as well. The thunderclap isnt only a sonic attack as it releases alot of concussive force, force which in the past has put down the likes of Ironman and Wonderman. Gorgon is getting koed as well.

I forgot that, about Darwin. He won't be bothered by being drained. The team have no way of putting down WWH.

iceman24567
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
you guys seem to the avoid the most obvious attack taht each team member would most likely go for that would put hulk down regardless.

the neck stab. each member is known for using such an attack WWH or not he will not walk away from that when they manage to dogpile on him and exploit the attack.
Thats what I'm guessing they would do but a Thunderclap would put them all on their asses.

Knowsbleed33
Originally posted by The Pict


WWH basically put down the biggest players in the MU (though I thought a lot of it was BS)

Ehh, I agree WWH wins this, most of the people WWH handled easily weren't that impressive. The top tiers he faced, he struggled against.

The Pict
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
you guys seem to the avoid the most obvious attack taht each team member would most likely go for that would put hulk down regardless.

the neck stab. each member is known for using such an attack WWH or not he will not walk away from that when they manage to dogpile on him and exploit the attack.

WWH was near torn in half by Strange and recovered. A "neck stab" won't bother him. He'll definitely be walking away from that.

Dogpile? Do you know how strong WWH was? They will get flung away with the greatest ease.

The Pict
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Ehh, I agree WWH wins this, most of the people WWH handled easily weren't that impressive. The top tiers he faced, he struggled against.

I dunno. The Avengers were easily put down.
The X-Men (though they slapped WWH around a bit) lay in crumpled heaps at WWH's feet before he decided to leave.
The FF4 got crushed.
Iron Man didn't stand a chance after the Spin Tech didn't work.

Though admittedly Juggernaut had the upper-hand I think and it was a stalemate against Sentry.

Edit: Struggled against Strange was well. He was getting whooped until Strange took over from the demon to help the people from getting crushed.

jrodslam
In WWH when Darwin was draining, it was the gamma energy he was trying and not Hulks actual life force. Red's life drain via tentacles also work pretty fast.

I think that may be the groups only chance to win. They lack a powerhouse.

Knowsbleed33
Originally posted by The Pict
I dunno. The Avengers were easily put down.
The X-Men (though they slapped WWH around a bit) lay in crumpled heaps at WWH's feet before he decided to leave.
The FF4 got crushed.
Iron Man didn't stand a chance after the Spin Tech didn't work.

Though admittedly Juggernaut had the upper-hand I think and it was a stalemate against Sentry.

Edit: Struggled against Strange was well. He was getting whooped until Strange took over from the demon to help the people from getting crushed.

Well, i meant mostly that the fights were indeterminable. Sentry, Zom/Strange, Juggernaut.

geshien
Originally posted by Starscream M
if its a ranged attack, then it will hurt his teammates more than hulk, as Hulk has the best HF

Any scans of accuracy/control? Or are you just making conjectures?

After all, Red can control his spores to affect specific targets in a group.

Naija boy
Originally posted by jrodslam
In WWH when Darwin was draining, it was the gamma energy he was trying and not Hulks actual life force. Red's life drain via tentacles also work pretty fast.

I think that may be the groups only chance to win. They lack a powerhouse.

Hulks gamma energy is his lifeforce ("gamma irradiated lifeforce"wink As seen in these scans. When hulk isnt that angry pariah is able to drain him of his lifeforce. However when he gets pissed it just stops working. WWH is hulk at anger levels never before seen. Omega red isnt doin jackshit

Edit- here the right first scan http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/76f8fa91
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/fa056157

Badabing
Yeah, this team doesn't succeed where the rest of Marvel Earth failed. Whether you like the WWH arc or not, the character was consistently portrayed the entire time as a team wrecker.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Naija boy
Hulks gamma energy is his lifeforce ("gamma irradiated lifeforce"wink As seen in this scan. When hulk isnt that angry pariah is able to drain him of his lifeforce. However when he gets pissed it just stops working. WWH is hulk at anger levels never before seen. Omega red isnt doin jackshit

http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/76f8fa91
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/fa056157

"In a fit of mindless rage, you thrown off the desires of the strone?!?"

Meaning they no longer "desired" or wanted his life force anymore im gathering from that. Difference in not wanting it and it "just stopping" Looked like paiah didnt have control over it as to where Red is in full control of his abilities. Not quite the same.erm

Naija boy
Originally posted by jrodslam
"In a fit of mindless rage, you thrown off the desires of the strone?!?"

Meaning they no longer "desired" or wanted his life force anymore im gathering from that. Difference in not wanting it and it "just stopping" Looked like paiah didnt have control over it as to where Red is in full control of his abilities. Not quite the same.erm

The spirits in the stone were what was sapping his energy. The "desires" of the spirits of stone were to absorb his energy. When he got angry HE (hulk) threw off said desires and stopped them from absorbing his energy. As is clearly shown, the absorbing ray is still on banner but when he gets angry he transforms into hulk despite it, which clearly shows its failure to work. Paraih was using the stone to absorb the energy and it failed when hulk got angry. That is clear as day. Whether he was doing it himself or using something else to absorb it is absolutely irrelevant. Further that scan was to show that Hulks lifeforce is his gamma energy and we saw WWH (the hulk in question here) easily ward off his gamma being drained. As i said earlier, Red isnt doing jack.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Naija boy
The spirits in the stone were what was sapping his energy. The "desires" of the spirits of stone were to absorb his energy. When he got angry HE (hulk) threw off said desires and stopped them from absorbing his energy. As is clearly shown, the absorbing ray is still on banner but when he gets angry he transforms into hulk despite it, which clearly shows its failure to work. Paraih was using the stone to absorb the energy and it failed when hulk got angry. That is clear as day. Whether he was doing it himself or using something else to absorb it is absolutely irrelevant. Further that scan was to show that Hulks lifeforce is his gamma energy and we saw WWH (the hulk in question here) easily ward off his gamma being drained. As i said earlier, Red isnt doing jack.

You mention when he got angry and turned to Hulk the stone stopped working because of THAT, but that seems a bit flawed. When the drainage first started, Banner was in Hulk form initially. I dont think it would be correct to assume that it stopped working because Hulk changed. From what was said, the spirits no longer "desired it", thus stopped doing it on its own. Not because it couldnt any longer. Its your assumption that it failed, but the text as well as the initial drainage says otherwise. Also, in WWH, the drainage was working. It was alot of it as Darwin said, but then again i wouldnt expect his draining ability to be as good as someone whos power is a life stealing ability. As youve stated, Red Hulk was able to drain Green Hulk and revert him back. Energy draining is part of Rulks powerset, thus making that ability more potent for him. Same would go for Red i reckon.

Naija boy
Originally posted by jrodslam
You mention when he got angry and turned to Hulk the stone stopped working because of THAT, but that seems a bit flawed. When the drainage first started, Banner was in Hulk form initially. I dont think it would be correct to assume that it stopped working because Hulk changed. From what was said, the spirits no longer "desired it", thus stopped doing it on its own. Not because it couldnt any longer. Its your assumption that it failed, but the text as well as the initial drainage says otherwise. Also, in WWH, the drainage was working. It was alot of it as Darwin said, but then again i wouldnt expect his draining ability to be as good as someone whos power is a life stealing ability. As youve stated, Red Hulk was able to drain Green Hulk and revert him back. Energy draining is part of Rulks powerset, thus making that ability more potent for him. Same would go for Red i reckon.

You are not reading the text properly at all. The text says " In a fit of rage you throw off the desires of the spirits of the stone?!?". IT NEVER says thye spirits no longer desired it. How the hell did u get that? Paraih clearly talks about Hulk throwing off the desires of the spirits of the stone which was referring to his energy being drained. He does this in a fit of rage indicating his anger. The stone didnt stop doing it on its own and there is no where that that is shown, stated or even alluded to in the panel. This is not even debatable as the language used is self explanatory.
Moreover Hulk easily overloaded Darwin when he tried to drain his energy. Saying that it being a part of reds powerset would make it more potent is absolutely baseless. Its a part of Darwins powerset to evolve abilities neccessary for situations. It has never been mentioned that the abilities he evolves are somehow weaker than those naturally born with said abilities. Red hulk has far better absorption feats than Omega red and so they arent even comparable. Being part of ur original powerset is completely irrelevant. Omega Red doesnt have feats showing him absorbing energy from someone with energy on WWH levels or resistance to it and thats what matters. As i said before Red isnt doing jack shit and WWH plows through these guys.

jrodslam
Originally posted by Naija boy
You are not reading the text properly at all. The text says " In a fit of rage you throw off the desires of the spirits of the stone?!?". IT NEVER says thye spirits no longer desired it. How the hell did u get that? Paraih clearly talks about Hulk throwing off the desires of the spirits of the stone which was referring to his energy being drained. He does this in a fit of rage indicating his anger. The stone didnt stop doing it on its own and there is no where that that is shown, stated or even alluded to in the panel. This is not even debatable as the language used is self explanatory.
Moreover Hulk easily overloaded Darwin when he tried to drain his energy. Saying that it being a part of reds powerset would make it more potent is absolutely baseless. Its a part of Darwins powerset to evolve abilities neccessary for situations. It has never been mentioned that the abilities he evolves are somehow weaker than those naturally born with said abilities. Red hulk has far better absorption feats than Omega red and so they arent even comparable. Being part of ur original powerset is completely irrelevant. Omega Red doesnt have feats showing him absorbing energy from someone with energy on WWH levels or resistance to it and thats what matters. As i said before Red isnt doing jack shit and WWH plows through these guys.

When the text says "You throw off the desires of the spirits..." What does that mean? To throw off the desires. To me, it means that if you desire something and try to take it, being thrown off of your desire means you no longer desire that which you crave. If you think otherwise, what is your interpretation? Like i stated, initially, there was no problem, so because Hulk went into a "mindless rage", he then became immune? Its like saying Hulk has 10 levels of anger, and youre able to drain if hes lvl's 1-5, but as soon as he pasts 5, he becomes immune. Yes Darwins powers allow him to evolve to fix situations, so i find it odd, that his powers didnt allow for his draining abilities to be amplified or evolve to where hed be able to take multiple hits. Yet it ported him out? Flawed. Darwin is a walking plot device and his powers are suppose to evolve to whatever is necessary. Overloaded? Where was this stated? He just said that there was so much of it and it was endless, but we all know thats not the case ala Red Hulk, so flawed yet again. Red has drained Wolverine to where he was out in seconds. Seconds. Hell, when Josh(Elixir) applied his death touch, it took away Hulks healing factor for a bit, and that allowed him to take some damage. I have no doubt that Reds Death Factor would be similar.
With all this said, im not saying the team wins nor loses. It will be difficult for them, but i dont see them getting swatted away as easily as most think.

D_Dude1210
Originally posted by jrodslam
When the text says "You throw off the desires of the spirits..." What does that mean? To throw off the desires. To me, it means that if you desire something and try to take it, being thrown off of your desire means you no longer desire that which you crave. If you think otherwise, what is your interpretation? Like i stated, initially, there was no problem, so because Hulk went into a "mindless rage", he then became immune? Its like saying Hulk has 10 levels of anger, and youre able to drain if hes lvl's 1-5, but as soon as he pasts 5, he becomes immune.

I've read the scan, too. I think Naija's interpretation is correct. The stone was trying (desiring) to drain Hulk of his gamma-irradiated lifeforce, but in Hulk's anger, he formed a resistance to it thru sheer act of will/rage. Seems pretty cut and dry.

Eternal Idol
Team ftw. Jobber War Hulk was awful. Hulk has always been a team wrecker, but the rest of Marvel Earth was severely downplayed... more than everyone usually is whenever it's the team(s) vs. global threat of the month scenario. Iron Man was doing pretty damned well on his own for a little while. If a few more mid-tiers or top-tiers where there to help him out, it wouldn't be so farfetched to believe they could win.

Survivor19
That's not how i remember it. Prof. X has read his memories, and then just decided to surrender. He just didn't try to attack Hulk anymore.

Hulk was nearly immobilized by Warpath. Brween Wolverine and Gorgon team can do the same, while Sabertooth rips his face off and Omega Red punctures tendons on Hulk's legs with his rentacles, preventing Hilk from shaking the rest off.
After that OR drains life of him, while all vital organs are being ripped and the head being torn off. The end.

Naija boy
Originally posted by jrodslam
When the text says "You throw off the desires of the spirits..." What does that mean? To throw off the desires. To me, it means that if you desire something and try to take it, being thrown off of your desire means you no longer desire that which you crave. If you think otherwise, what is your interpretation? Like i stated, initially, there was no problem, so because Hulk went into a "mindless rage", he then became immune? Its like saying Hulk has 10 levels of anger, and youre able to drain if hes lvl's 1-5, but as soon as he pasts 5, he becomes immune. Yes Darwins powers allow him to evolve to fix situations, so i find it odd, that his powers didnt allow for his draining abilities to be amplified or evolve to where hed be able to take multiple hits. Yet it ported him out? Flawed. Darwin is a walking plot device and his powers are suppose to evolve to whatever is necessary. Overloaded? Where was this stated? He just said that there was so much of it and it was endless, but we all know thats not the case ala Red Hulk, so flawed yet again. Red has drained Wolverine to where he was out in seconds. Seconds. Hell, when Josh(Elixir) applied his death touch, it took away Hulks healing factor for a bit, and that allowed him to take some damage. I have no doubt that Reds Death Factor would be similar.
With all this said, im not saying the team wins nor loses. It will be difficult for them, but i dont see them getting swatted away as easily as most think.

*Sigh*. This is not a matter of interpretation at all. This is a matter of simple reading comprehension and is not up for debate. Your so called interpretation has absolutely no relationship with the text. The text says "You throw off the desires of the stone in a fit of mindless rage!?!" How the hell can you claim that Hulk throwing off the desires of the spirits of the stone means that the spirits of the stone themselves didnt want to absorb his energy anymore? It was the Hulk who threw of the desires of the spirit of the stone and THAT is exactly why Paraih was so shocked and exclaimed the way he did. The spirits of the stone having their desires thrown off by the Hulk indicates that Hulk stopped the spirits "desires" (which were to drain his energy) in a fit of rage. Not that the spirits willfully stopped draining his energy. There is nothing to support that even in the slightest.

Also it seems you dont know much about the hulk. the hulk has shown on NUMEROUS occasions that he indeed does have different levels of anger. And when he gets to a certain stage of anger things which worked on him previously dont work anymore. As seen in the examples below.
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/125694c8
http://mynetimages.com/viewimage/63c07aab
This is common fact about the hulk.

Darwins powers allow him to evolve to the best means to counter situations and the best strategy against hulk is usually to drain him and return him to banner. However the problem was that WWH was using FAR FAR more gamma energy than past hulks (we saw the amount of energy he contained towards the end of WWH). Equating WWH to current savage hulk and then outright calling the instance flawed is just inane. Darwin said it that it was endless which indicates that he couldnt absorb it all or he would be overloaded. What works on savage hulk will not neccessarily work on WWH or any angrier version of Hulk because of the differing levels of anger and the huge gap in their energy levels.

Red being able to drain wolverine is an absolutely laughable basis for him being to drain WWH who has shown energy levels astronomically higher than anything wolverine can even dream of. Further, Elixirs death touch isnt even at all the same as Red lifeforce draining power. Elixirs death touch isnt a "drain" at all bot rather him manipulating matter on a genetic level. so that is totally irrelevant as well.
Team gets thrashed as i said before.

DarkOdin
Originally posted by Naija boy
WWH plows through these guys. You are just sick there are little kids that read this you know












stick out tongue

WWH wins 10/10

Naija boy
Originally posted by DarkOdin
You are just sick there are little kids that read this you know












stick out tongue

WWH wins 10/10

laughing out loud , sick sick

Master Court
WWHulk stood in one place for like five to ten minutes being shot up by hundreds of soldiers who were firing thousands of rounds of adamantium bullets. The minute he got free of Strange's spell, WWHulk trashed the army with ease. So adamantium advantages aren't that great.


Also, it's a big stretch to say WWHulk "struggled" against anyone. He was constantly portrayed as solely interested in his ultimate agenda. WWHulk vs Juggernaut was so half-hearted. WWHulk vs Hercules didn't have anything to do with power. That was skill. Hercules has centuries piled on centuries of combat experience. Any top-tier would have problems with him. But at the end of the fight, who was the one with the face that looked like freezer burnt hamburger? Zom/Strange wasn't much of a struggle either. He blew a few holes in Hulk, and then got KTFO. Even the final fight with Sentry was no biggie. WWHulk seemed to know from pretty much the beginning of the fight that he was going to beat Sentry. Saying sh*t like "You don't want this fight." and "You think your stupid machines can stop him?"


This Team is nothing WWHulk can't handle. WWHulk takes this 10/10 in a very one-sided f*cking sh*t stomp. Seriously, four slightly super-human street levelers with adamantium weapons? They lose every time.

The Nuul
Omega Red solos.

Master Court
Originally posted by The Nuul
Omega Red solos.


Wrong

Wild Shadow
interesting debating style. no

Apolloknight
I haven't posted in awhile but, I felt the need to post in this thread for the substantial amounts of epic in it.

Master Court
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
interesting debating style. no


I know, I know. sad But Omega Red soloing? That's bananas.

Spire
Hulk.

iceman24567
Originally posted by Master Court
I know, I know. sad But Omega Red soloing? That's bananas. http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v207/iceman2456/gwen-1.jpg

rotiart
Ww hulk for the win. I have no intention of arguing with wolverine fanboys. Wwhulk 10/10

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by Master Court
This Team is nothing WWHulk can't handle. WWHulk takes this 10/10 in a very one-sided f*cking sh*t stomp. Seriously, four slightly super-human street levelers with adamantium weapons? They lose every time.
What is your definition of street-level? erm

The Pict
Originally posted by The Nuul
Omega Red solos.

eek! Agreed!

Knowsbleed33
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
What is your definition of street-level? erm

He just gave it.

Warlord
hulk

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
He just gave it.
Where? I saw him make a case for Hulk by emphasizing his power and feats in the WWH arc. That's cool... but dismissing Wolverine, Sabertooth, Omega Red, and Gorgon as mere "street-levelers with adamantium weapons" isn't. It makes his case sound more like a Hulk fanboy rant than an objective point of view.

Sin I AM
but they are only just street levelers with adamantium weapons...the only one that could be argued against is OR

Eternal Idol
Omega Red absolutely qualifies a mid-tier character. Gorgon is also a mid-tier with his ever increasing powerset. Sabretooth at his best had an undetermined level of superhuman strength. He also had enhancements to his speed, reflexes, and healing factor.

Wolverine is actually the weak link on the team, power-wise. Even still, he's got incredible durability and a great healing factor. He's probably the only one on the team that can be labeled as street-level, but the damage he can inflict is anything but.

Placidity
Watch "Hulk vs Wolverine"

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by Placidity
Watch "Hulk vs Wolverine"
It's non-canon anyhow.

I've seen it, and while it gives a pretty good idea of what Hulk is capable of, it made the Weapon X team look unskilled and incompetent. Omega Red was MIA a few times, and Hulk was practically fighting them one-on-one. Wolverine did pretty well against Hulk early on in the film, despite the ass-kicking he was taking at first.

Master Court
Originally posted by Eternal Idol
What is your definition of street-level? erm


Nah, dude, I said "slightly super-human" street-level. Wolverine can't lift a car, but he can break chains. You could call him "meta-human", but "super-human" is a stretch.

Same for the others, except Omega Red. But his ass is still going to get f*cked. All of them get f*cked.



Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
He just gave it.


Now I just gave it.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Badabing
Yeah, this team doesn't succeed where the rest of Marvel Earth failed. Whether you like the WWH arc or not, the character was consistently portrayed the entire time as a team wrecker.

yeah. Hulk ftw.

Juk3n
Originally posted by Master Court
Nah, dude, I said "slightly super-human" street-level. Wolverine can't lift a car, but he can break chains. You could call him "meta-human", but "super-human" is a stretch.


Now I just gave it.

What? All four of the team are meta-humans by definition. And all according to feats are vastly super human in specific areas.(All four for speed and reaction time, 3 of them for strength, And none of them, NOT ONE is classed as a street leveller.

The inability to fly doesnt mean they're street level..ya know, just cos they...walk on a street..

Master Court
Originally posted by Juk3n
What? All four of the team are meta-humans by definition. And all according to feats are vastly super human in specific areas.(All four for speed and reaction time, 3 of them for strength, And none of them, NOT ONE is classed as a street leveller.

The inability to fly doesnt mean they're street level..ya know, just cos they...walk on a street..


No! I mean they're not super. You know, lifting and throwing cars and sh*t. Except Omega Red, really. They're low-tiers. Low-tier meta-humans, I mean. The only thing mid-tier would be the HF of the majority of the team, while Logan's is definitely top-tier. Strength wise, Gorgon is like in the range of a few tons. Sabretooth as well. Wolverine is about a ton. Omega Red is several tons. And they're fighting a guy that had the power to destroy the world whenever the Hell he wanted. WWHulk healed from thousands of rounds of adamantium bullets that he took while standing still for several minutes. He healed from Zom/Strange's blast holes in just a few frames. Even with his HF deactivated, the X-Men couldn't put a dent in WWHulk, except for Logan's claws. And for that matter, Logan is the only one in this team whose HF can even shake a stick at Hulk's. Digressing; Hulk left Hercules a battered mess while he himself walked away unscathed. He healed from a broken neck.

That's really my point. A few low-end meta-humans with adamantium weapons are not going to beat the Hulk that beat up the adamantium equipped army, the X-Men, the Fantastic Four, (more or less) Hercules, Sentry, Zom/Strange, and so on. Marvel made it clear that WWHulk couldn't be put down until he got his point across and let the satellites drop him. And even with the satellite argument that puts into question the power of the satellites, it's still easy enough to figure that it would take a very substantial amount of power for an energy blast to drop the Hulk. And an amped one at that. But, needless to say, they didn't elaborate on the power of the satellites. However, we do know Hulk had more power than the satellites. It seemed to be accepted that the satellites couldn't put down Sentry, but Hulk's physical power did. But of course, Hulk's durability is lacking a bit, and added to that he actually wanted to be dropped. WWHulk was definitely, as someone else put it, an elite top-tier.

Four low-tiers, with adamantium weapons, and barely enough strength between them to effectively throw a single mini-van, are not dropping WWHulk. Especially since Logan's the only one who could survive a direct shot from a green Hulk.

Eternal Idol
Originally posted by Master Court
*wall of text*

Four low-tiers, with adamantium weapons, and barely enough strength between them to effectively throw a single mini-van, are not dropping WWHulk. Especially since Logan's the only one who could survive a direct shot from a green Hulk.

ugh3

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by Master Court



Four low-tiers, with adamantium weapons, and barely enough strength between them to effectively throw a single mini-van, are not dropping WWHulk. Especially since Logan's the only one who could survive a direct shot from a green Hulk.

What the f**k? eer

StiltmanFTW
I also facepalm'd at Sabretooth being "in the range of a few tons".

Wild Shadow
can his post be considered trolling?

anyways Omega can take WWH punches just as well as logan if not better so can sabe.

they are all more then capable of inflicting more then enough damage to slow down or incapacitate the hulk.

the most likely viable attack is a blitz joined attack to the base of the hulks throat for kill or ko regardless of hulks amped HF.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
can his post be considered trolling?

You've seen nothing yet.

Master Court
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
I also facepalm'd at Sabretooth being "in the range of a few tons".


For f*ck's sake, I was generalizing. Look at Captain America. One minute he struggles with under a thousand pounds, the next he's tossing his shield through jets. One minute Sabretooth seemed almost barely super human, the next he's tearing the place apart. That's why I used "a few". It's not specific and accepts feats portraying different levels of power. Sabretooth is in the range of a few f*cking tons. I should counter-facepalm your ultra-literal ass, but I'm not that kinda person. You know, not not lazy.


As for the mini-van. Yes, the f*cking mini-van. If they chucked a mini-van, it wouldn't bother Hulk at all. So... Yeah...


Low-tiers. Generalizations. Mini-vans... WWHulk wins easily.

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Master Court
For f*ck's sake, I was generalizing. Look at Captain America. One minute he struggles with under a thousand pounds, the next he's tossing his shield through jets. One minute Sabretooth seems almost barely super human, the next he's tearing the place apart. That's why I used "a few". It's not specific and accepts feats portraying different levels of power. Sabretooth is in the range of a few f*cking tons. I should counter-facepalm your ultra-literal ass, but I'm not that kinda person. You know, not lazy.


As for the mini-van. Yes, the f*cking mini-van. If they chucked a mini-van, it wouldn't bother Hulk at all. So... Yeah...


Low-tiers. Generalizations. Mini-vans... WWHulk wins easily.

Cap's shield is indestructible and really sharp (depending on the writer). That helps a lot.

Fail. Y'know, Sabes got many official upgrades. Most current adamantiumized Sabretooth was NOT in the range of a few tons. Period.

Starscream M
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Most current adamantiumized Sabretooth was NOT in the range of a few tons. Period. depends on what 'few' means

sabretooth seems to be in the 10 ton range, give or take

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Starscream M
depends on what 'few' means

sabretooth seems to be in the 10 ton range, give or take

MC compared his strength to Gorgon's, who is officially Class 2...

Starscream M
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
MC compared his strength to Gorgon's, who is officially Class 2... how strong is class 2?

Wild Shadow
sabe causally slapped his sports car through a wall before his ada. upgrade. ninja

Starscream M
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
sabe causally slapped his sports car through a wall before his ada. upgrade. ninja how heavy is a sports car...about 4 - 5 tons, right?

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Starscream M
how strong is class 2?

We don't know what system Fury was using at that time lol... I'd assume he just meant "2 tons under optimal conditions" thing.

In the handbook his category in strength is 4 (800Ibs - 25 tons range).

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Wild Shadow
sabe causally slapped his sports car through a wall before his ada. upgrade. ninja

Before his first ad. upgrade and claw-in-the-brains upgrade (after he recovered from that he was gettin' stronger) wink

snoopdogg
In the All-New handbook Vol. #6 it states Sabretooth can lift 2 tons from Earth-295 and all of his other physical stats are identical to 616 Creed.

Wild Shadow
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Before his first ad. upgrade and claw-in-the-brains upgrade (after he recovered from that he was gettin' stronger) wink

yes, before his 1st initial upgrade that he mysteriously acquired and displayed in wolverine issue #126 only to have lost it at the hands of Apoc. and given to wolverine as his horse man death. geek


let us remember that in wolverine issue #90 sabretooth was stated to have charged through a shield that was stated to stop a herd of elephants by Forge.king

all praise jack kirby and stan lee.smartass

live long and prosper.

Master Court
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Cap's shield is indestructible and really sharp (depending on the writer). That helps a lot.

Fail. Y'know, Sabes got many official upgrades. Most current adamantiumized Sabretooth was NOT in the range of a few tons. Period.


Okay, but Cap has even been shown bench pressing higher than what he used to. It seems odd, considering the SS was suppose to have already put him at absolute peak. That kinda leaves little room for improvement.


Yeah, Sabes got the upgrades, but isn't he still about Class 10-15? Okay, so "a few" is a bit of an understatement, but still.


Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
MC compared his strength to Gorgon's, who is officially Class 2...


I must be thinking of someone else, but I could've swore Fury said he was Class 2 before the upgrade. It's not much of an upgrade if he's still Class 2.

BUSTER1
WWH ftw-he takes some damage but his durability coupled with insane HF and strength means this team ain't putting him down.

-Pr-
Originally posted by Starscream M
how heavy is a sports car...about 4 - 5 tons, right?

god no. maybe one and a half...

StiltmanFTW
Originally posted by Master Court
Okay, but Cap has even been shown bench pressing higher than what he used to. It seems odd, considering the SS was suppose to have already put him at absolute peak. That kinda leaves little room for improvement.

Yeah, writers have different definitions of "pinnacle of human perfection". Some think that "what a man can do, Captain America will do!" (then have him effortlessly tossing a tree with one hand...) and others believe he is outright superhuman. Brubaker for example thinks of Cap as the next step of human evolution.

Originally posted by Master Court
Yeah, Sabes got the upgrades, but isn't he still about Class 10-15? Okay, so "a few" is a bit of an understatement, but still.

He has some feats suggesting that he's higher. But yeah, putting him in that range seems right. I'd say Weapon X Sabes was somewhere between 15-20 tons, but that's just my opinion. Hard to measure his strength when we don't have enough lifting feats for every incarnation and official stats.

Originally posted by Master Court
I must be thinking of someone else, but I could've swore Fury said he was Class 2 before the upgrade. It's not much of an upgrade if he's still Class 2.

If you call resurrection an upgrade... well actually you'd be right, he no longer possessed a heartbeat and got a healing factor it seems. But why then would the writer give us an accurate number in his first appearance? Just to fool us? He had superhuman strength in his origin story and none of his feats went beyond Class 2 imo.

Master Court
Originally posted by StiltmanFTW
Yeah, writers have different definitions of "pinnacle of human perfection". Some think that "what a man can do, Captain America will do!" (then have him effortlessly tossing a tree with one hand...) and others believe he is outright superhuman. Brubaker for example thinks of Cap as the next step of human evolution.



He has some feats suggesting that he's higher. But yeah, putting him in that range seems right. I'd say Weapon X Sabes was somewhere between 15-20 tons, but that's just my opinion. Hard to measure his strength when we don't have enough lifting feats for every incarnation and official stats.



If you call resurrection an upgrade... well actually you'd be right, he no longer possessed a heartbeat and got a healing factor it seems. But why then would the writer give us an accurate number in his first appearance? Just to fool us? He had superhuman strength in his origin story and none of his feats went beyond Class 2 imo.



Yeah, so, back to the original point, as strong as a couple of them are, they aren't on par with Hulk in any form of power. Hulk has higher durability, faster HF, and WWHulk in particular had some skills in agility, Hulk is quick enough to catch Spider-Man, so these guys are not much of a challenge to get a hold of, and it goes without saying that Hulk is stronger.

Now, I don't like to pick at little things like Wolverine not getting along with Sabretooth. So, assuming the Team are working together at optimum efficiency and cooperation, and individually are having good days and at their best, we can draw up some scenarios.

The worst threat is Gorgon, on account of his adamantium katana. The katana would be long enough to cut through Hulk's neck. The rest pose a relatively lesser threat. Wolverine and Sabretooth could only pull off relatively minor damage, which WWHulk heals from efficiently and quickly.

And Omega Red, despite being the (overall)most powerful of the Team, is probably the least threat. Don't facepalm just yet! Hear me out. I doubt his powers would hurt Hulk. How many absorbing foes has Hulk overcharged? Sometimes deliberately. I think WWHulk, as soon as he figures out Omega Red's powers, would pull that off. Can Omega Red be overcharged? I don't know. But Hulk has overcharged a lot of guys. If not, Omega Red still has to be in attack range to do his thing.

WWHulk already proved that Wolverine is not a big problem.

Sabretooth is a good physical opponent to guys in his range, but I just can't see him lasting long against Hulk. Sabes just has to get too close to attack. Hulk one-shots him as soon as he's in range.

Gorgon is another matter. He moves faster than even Wolverine can follow, and his agility is nuts. He almost moves like a vampire or something. And it seems to me that the best way for a non-top-tier to fight Hulk is to simply be faster than him. Gorgon actually killed Wolverine, and Wolverine has beaten the Hell out of Spider-Man before. Gorgon, in my opinion, lasts the longest and does the most damage... but we're still talking about WWHulk. I think he'd have the smarts and presence of mind to know when someone's going for a decap shot, and the skill to avoid it or even use it against them. Hulk's reaction speed, after all, has allowed him to even punch tank-fired shells. So that's not only reaction time, but reflex and physical gesture speed.

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