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LT is rumored to return in Dr. Strange

LT wins 10/10

LT >> IG >> Multi Eterntiy >>>>>>>>>>....>>>...>>> Eternity >>> Tiamut

(dunno much about Fulcrum...)

Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum

Tiamut is his =

LT follows his boss

Who is LT's boss

Can't remember Tiamut being Jack's equal, but yeah Jack represented the Fulcrum.

Jack wins.

Read Eternals #9 for me

Really good

I did read it...but don't remember the part where Tiamut was Jack's equal. Maybe I'll read it again...if I can find it.

Originally posted by Lord S
I did read it...but don't remember the part where Tiamut was Jack's equal. Maybe I'll read it again...if I can find it.
http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/2/27967/745031-individual_001_super.jpg

Doesn't say he became his equal so LT anyone?

I'm going with LT.

Jack Kirby is TOAA

LT follows

See, Guy222 wins

Fulcrum isn't TOAA, please understand that Wiki isn't to be trusted.

LT wins easily.

Originally posted by guy222
Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum

Tiamut is his =

LT follows his boss

Who is LT's boss GRR you knew the results

I haven't read Strange#1 yet, so I'm assuming its happening in issue#2?

Well, if in this case Jack represents The Fulcrum, then The Fulcrum, LT and Tiamut by far the weakest.

Tiamut = Jack

Rank em for X

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Fulcrum isn't TOAA, please understand that Wiki isn't to be trusted.

LT wins easily.

Understand good friend

Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum. No denying that

Ur a Celestial fan, u should know Kirby

U can tell everyone don't trust Wiki. And that's cool, but

Its clear as day

Originally posted by Xplosive
Well, if in this case Jack represents The Fulcrum, then The Fulcrum, LT and Tiamut by far the weakest.

How would Tiamut b the weakest if he's Jack's = ?

Originally posted by kevdude
Doesn't say he became his equal so LT anyone?

Read the issue Kev

Originally posted by guy222
How would Tiamut b the weakest if he's Jack's = ?

He isn't.
The Fulcrum said that celestials have evolved into beings of greater power, including Tiamut, but unlike others, Tiamut has questioned him. That doesn't mean power level. Nothing is mentioned of power level, only about becoming an individual and to become his companion.

The Fulcrum (assuming that The Fulcrum is truly Jack incarnation in comic verse)
Living Tribunal
Tiamut

Originally posted by guy222
Understand good friend

Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum. No denying that

Ur a Celestial fan, u should know Kirby

U can tell everyone don't trust Wiki. And that's cool, but

Its clear as day

Jack and Stan collectively make up TOAA in most Marvel fans opinions. Fulcrum isn't TOAA so he doesn't = Jack. I know you really want to believe he is because that would make your favorite Celestial equal to God, but we need to try and maintain some perspective here. No where in the story did it say the Fulcrum was TOAA and, IMO, no where was it hinted.

Originally posted by galactusischere
LT wins 10/10

@Xplosive.....
http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/4862/fulcrum.jpg
yep, it definitely says power.

also, tiamut says the fulcrum is all knowing and all powerful, and then says the Fulcrum is the essence of what holds reality in it's place. I'm pretty sure celestials (especially the most powerful one, and yes he is the most powerful one being as the Fulcrum says so and he is the one who the celestials follow so i'd imagine he'd know) would know who is the most powerful and all knowing being. I don't think they'd go around saying he is what hold reality in place and all that other jazz if he were just some other normal super being. Soooo yea....assuming something different that what is stated in the comic is crazy. I don't know why you all keep doing it. That's what they writers put in the comics. The editors approved, and all that. Soooo take it as it was written. Quit trying to read more or less into it. Just read what it says and there you go.

What do you think he meant when he said the Fulcrum was all-powerful and all-knowing?

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
What do you think he meant when he said the Fulcrum was all-powerful and all-knowing?
....exactly what he said. he's all powerful, all knowing, and holds reality in place.

Well, that doesn't mean much. Many beings have been referred to as being all-knowing and all-powerful. Watchers have been called all-knowing. In Quasar, Epoch referred to herself as being "omnipotent". Atlez and Atleza are also said to hold reality in its place.

These titles mean nothing unless you're trying to imply something.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
Well, that doesn't mean much. Many beings have been referred to as being all-knowing and all-powerful. Watchers have been called all-knowing. In Quasar, Epoch referred to herself as being "omnipotent". Atlez and Atleza are also said to hold reality in its place.

These titles mean nothing unless you're trying to imply something.

when you're one of the hands down most powerful beings in the marvel continuity and you say another being is omnipotent I think that counts for more than when some super human being calls a watcher all knowing. And the watchers do pretty much know all that has happened in the past and is presently happening. So in that respect they are. But the Celestials exist on multiple dimension at one time and multiple planes of existence. And everyone considers them to be one of the most powerful races in the marvel-verse. It's like an ant saying a spider is the most powerful being....to the ant thats true. To a human not so much. You have to factor in who's making the statement. In this case you have the greatest, most powerful celestial saying the fulcrum is the most powerful. You also have the Horde saying they just do what the fulcrum tells them, and the watcher talking about how the fulcrum is super powerful. All high level cosmic beings talking about how bad ass and powerful this one guy is. I mean he's also chilling in what is like purgatory or w/e that place is for eternals, sending them either on to heaven or wherever, or back to earth. Pretty good amount of evidence to put him at TOAA level.

that and TOAA and Fulcrum both took kirbys form. Seems kind of strange someone the celestials consider to be all powerful takes the same form as TOAA but isn't either TOAA or part of TOAA

p.s- i took an extended break....it's good to be back!

So good to see u

My peeps are in disbelief

Jack Kirby's dream is here

I win either way

I am a Celestial and LT fan

U can't **** on Jack Kirby or Stan Lee

Period

Go to seep yall

Fulcrum FTW..

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
@Xplosive.....
http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/4862/fulcrum.jpg
yep, it definitely says power.

also, tiamut says the fulcrum is all knowing and all powerful, and then says the Fulcrum is the essence of what holds reality in it's place. I'm pretty sure celestials (especially the most powerful one, and yes he is the most powerful one being as the Fulcrum says so and he is the one who the celestials follow so i'd imagine he'd know) would know who is the most powerful and all knowing being. I don't think they'd go around saying he is what hold reality in place and all that other jazz if he were just some other normal super being. Soooo yea....assuming something different that what is stated in the comic is crazy. I don't know why you all keep doing it. That's what they writers put in the comics. The editors approved, and all that. Soooo take it as it was written. Quit trying to read more or less into it. Just read what it says and there you go.

But not power-wise. So celestial has questioned him and then suddenly Tiamut power increased and has become all-powerful, just because of questioning him?. If he has, then TOAA has granted him such power, thus no one from comic can be TOAA equal. And I think it's more meant like in authority or something like that. Not power level. And come on, do you really think that celestial can become equal to TOAA. THOTI was the ultimate power withing MU (and even the wielder of THOTI can never been equal to TOAA. He would be just another TOAA pawn) and Tiamut is not. But if Tiamut is equal power-wise (while I don't think it's the case at all, but I might be wrong), then The Fulcrum is not TOAA. Except if Tiamut will be one of TOAA incarnation from now on, which I don't think so.

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
also, tiamut says the fulcrum is all knowing and all powerful, and then says the Fulcrum is the essence of what holds reality in it's place. I'm pretty sure celestials would know who is the most powerful and all knowing being.

No. Maybe he only thinks he is all-powerful and all-knowing, because he answered to him.

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
I don't think they'd go around saying he is what hold reality in place and all that other jazz if he were just some other normal super being.

You are kidding?
You do know how many times is said something like that. ''He is the most powerful, the most dangerous, all realities will shatter'' and so on...''. But only few have lived up to it.

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
Pretty good amount of evidence to put him at TOAA level.

Tiamut is just another pawn to TOAA. TOAA has written him. What don't you understand. No one from comic is equal to TOAA.

Celestial to be all-knowing and all-powerful. Yeah right. When he does something like that, then I will agree.

Don't be silly... read a comic. Tribunal wins, he's beyond the Universe. Celestials are under his athority. Galactus had to plead with Tribunal when he wanted the Gauntlet reformed. Even Eternity is under Tribunal's authority... Goku vs Living Tribunal?

Also in Infinity Gauntlet, the Celestials fought Thanos. But it was said the Living Tribunal could beat Thanos, but the Tribunal decided the matter was beneath him... therefore, the Tribunal is beyond the Celestials... now, TOAA, I don't know where he fits in...

Originally posted by Xplosive
He isn't.
The Fulcrum said that celestials have evolved into beings of greater power, including Tiamut, but unlike others, Tiamut has questioned him. That doesn't mean power level. Nothing is mentioned of power level, only about becoming an individual and to become his companion.

The Fulcrum (assuming that The Fulcrum is truly Jack incarnation in comic verse)
Living Tribunal
Tiamut


100% how I took that scan as well when I read the issue. I love guy but he's just so happy that a celestial was even implied to be the Fulcrums equal he won't let it go. I repeat a celestial has never and will never be able to do what the TOAA can do. He can delete the entire Marvel Omniverse with but a thought, all abstracts everybody done. He can recton anything he chooses to when he feels like it. None of these things can Tiamut do nor even close. He's certainly not equal to TOAA that much is for sure. The scan merely said he's different because he questioned things and something he (the fulcrum) has also done. Nothing, nada about them being equal in power.

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
@Xplosive.....
http://img36.imageshack.us/img36/4862/fulcrum.jpg
yep, it definitely says power.

also, tiamut says the fulcrum is all knowing and all powerful, and then says the Fulcrum is the essence of what holds reality in it's place. I'm pretty sure celestials (especially the most powerful one, and yes he is the most powerful one being as the Fulcrum says so and he is the one who the celestials follow so i'd imagine he'd know) would know who is the most powerful and all knowing being. I don't think they'd go around saying he is what hold reality in place and all that other jazz if he were just some other normal super being. Soooo yea....assuming something different that what is stated in the comic is crazy. I don't know why you all keep doing it. That's what they writers put in the comics. The editors approved, and all that. Soooo take it as it was written. Quit trying to read more or less into it. Just read what it says and there you go.

He CLEARLY said A power equal to my own. A power. The power he's referring to is the questions of things as he the fulcrum did. He was merely saying you have showed A power that is equal to my own. Nothing NOTHING about him being equal in power in general.

Tiamut = Jack Kirby

KT, is it not?

If all knows Jack Kirby, then u believe

If not, I can't change ur mind

Opinions Respected

Guy222

Originally posted by guy222
If all knows Jack Kirby, then u believe

If not, I can't change ur mind

Opinions Respected

Guy222

It could be my friend it could be. However, he only said A power. Singular. He even mentioned what that SPECIFIC power was that was equal to his own. The questioning of things which is something no other Celestial has ever done. So, I just fail to see how him saying A power means he's equal to his power overall.

Furthermore my friend, you believe Tiamut to be equal to the Fulcrum correct? You believe the Fulcrum to be Kirby correct? So, if you answer yes to both those.. Then you believe Tiamut can wish the Marvel Omniverse away with but a thought? He can defeat any and all people in the Marvel Universe at the same time with a thought. He can recton anything he choose to because after all he's TOAA. So, you believe Tiamut the celestial can do all these things?

Originally posted by LDHZenkai
when you're one of the hands down most powerful beings in the marvel continuity and you say another being is omnipotent I think that counts for more than when some super human being calls a watcher all knowing. And the watchers do pretty much know all that has happened in the past and is presently happening. So in that respect they are. But the Celestials exist on multiple dimension at one time and multiple planes of existence. And everyone considers them to be one of the most powerful races in the marvel-verse. It's like an ant saying a spider is the most powerful being....to the ant thats true. To a human not so much. You have to factor in who's making the statement. In this case you have the greatest, most powerful celestial saying the fulcrum is the most powerful. You also have the Horde saying they just do what the fulcrum tells them, and the watcher talking about how the fulcrum is super powerful. All high level cosmic beings talking about how bad ass and powerful this one guy is. I mean he's also chilling in what is like purgatory or w/e that place is for eternals, sending them either on to heaven or wherever, or back to earth. Pretty good amount of evidence to put him at TOAA level.

Tiamut when he was "just" a Celestial was NOT hands down one of the most powerful beings in Marvel continuity. Him saying the Fulcrum is omnipotent or omniscient doesn't carry any extra weight, sorry.

I'll make this easy. Do you see this scan?

http://thumbnails17.imagebam.com/5638/9a1d6056375104.gif

The writer says the LT is all-powerful, all-knowing, he is the power of creation, he is the alpha and the omega. Now I don't know about you, but that sounds a whole heckuva lot more impressive than Tiamut and Uatu make a few vague claims about who the Fulcrum is and how powerful he is.

Is the LT the OAA? No. Is the LT OAA level or close? No.

Originally posted by guy222
U can't **** on Jack Kirby or Stan Lee

And yet here you are, giddy as all hell over a book that does exactly that.

And this friend isn't ICT

Be careful pal

Mods favor.....guess who

For sure...Been saying on numerous sites

Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum. Period

Do u have a winner

Peace Yall

Originally posted by guy222
Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum. Period

If you truly believe this then the Fulcrum can't be TOAA. It's generally accepted that both Kirby and Stan together make up TOAA.

Originally posted by guy222
And this friend isn't ICT

Be careful pal

Mods favor.....guess who

For sure...Been saying on numerous sites

Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum. Period

Do u have a winner

Jack Kirby is dead. Jack Kirby did not write this.

The whole idea behind that classic meta-wink is simply that the writer is more powerful than anything else. Kirby is represented because he and Stan are THE writers at Marvel. Capital T. Capital H. Capital E.

To turn around and make him into a silly character like "The Fulcrum" in service to some mediocre Celestial story is borderline insulting. To then imply that the Celestial is equal to Jack freaking Kirby on the grounds that the Celestial has gained real world sentience (Did this book write itself? Should I be worried?) and broken free of any writer's control? Well that's just stupid.

Originally posted by Knowsbleed33
The writer says the LT is all-powerful, all-knowing, he is the power of creation, he is the alpha and the omega. Now I don't know about you, but that sounds a whole heckuva lot more impressive than Tiamut and Uatu make a few vague claims about who the Fulcrum is and how powerful he is.

Exactly and we all know that also for LT that is not the case.

Originally posted by guy222
Jack Kirby is The Fulcrum. Period

Maybe, but that doesn't make Tiamut equal to The Fulcrum power wise and he isn't and will never be equal to TOAA.

I still consider Tiamut a joke compared to someone like LT.

Guy ur silly

I love you so much

Originally posted by Xplosive
Exactly and we all know that also for LT that is not the case.



Maybe, but that doesn't make Tiamut equal to The Fulcrum power wise and he isn't and will never be equal to TOAA.

I still consider Tiamut a joke compared to someone like LT.

LT does what. I know what LT knows and does and Marvel doesn't use him properly

Jack Kirby created the Eternals and Celestials. Jack in the story is Jack Kirby. No getting around that good friend

Power wise what. He became Jack Kirby's = good friend

I said before...Lets say it together...Jack Kriby is The Fulcrum

Living Tribunal is who's boss. Who is the TOAA

Tiamut the Communicator maybe a joke to u. To me...He's not. Remember when I had a thread with Tiamut, Jaspers and the words....Read Your Bible....Tell me who faught over a Trillion Horde. Tell me who sings a death song that put Stupid Richards and Earth to sleep. Tell me who's the Greatest Celestial

Yall can keep debating whether this and that. My time is here is over real soon...but my legacy is made

I respect ur call. I can't lose either way

Why....I love all characters



Have a blessed one X

Originally posted by guysangel
Guy ur silly

I love you so much

Hey hunie

hug4

Originally posted by guy222
LT does what. I know what LT knows and does and Marvel doesn't use him properly

Jack Kirby created the Eternals and Celestials. Jack in the story is Jack Kirby. No getting around that good friend

Power wise what. He became Jack Kirby's = good friend

I said before...Lets say it together...Jack Kriby is The Fulcrum

Living Tribunal is who's boss. Who is the TOAA

Tiamut the Communicator maybe a joke to u. To me...He's not. Remember when I had a thread with Tiamut, Jaspers and the words....Read Your Bible....Tell me who faught over a Trillion Horde. Tell me who sings a death song that put Stupid Richards and Earth to sleep. Tell me who's the Greatest Celestial

Yall can keep debating whether this and that. My time is here is over real soon...but my legacy is made

I respect ur call. I can't lose either way

Why....I love all characters



Have a blessed one X
Remember guy, Tiamut was eaten sure it was an alternative timeline but it was in the future of 616.
im sure TOAA wouldn't allow that to happen to himself.