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No weapons or energy manip, strictly strength, durability, skill and heart, no MB for Orion.

Who wins this bloodlusted match?

A god of war vs. god of thunder?

I'd take Orion.

As much as I like Marvel, I'd have to go with Orion. DC just seems to operate on a higher strength level for its top tier characters, imo.

nahh i dont thinks so....this would be a close one...thor easily rivals orion in h2h combat

Originally posted by bbrem123
nahh i dont thinks so....this would be a close one...thor easily rivals orion in h2h combat

No weapons=Thor without his hammer.

Orion takes it.

Orion knows all forms of combat and specializes in the art of warfare. Thor is no slouch, but I'm going with the DOG OF WAR!

Is Orion nuts or actually calm and trying to use his skills?

i guess that goes for both of them actually^

Originally posted by TheKahn
As much as I like Marvel, I'd have to go with Orion. DC just seems to operate on a higher strength level for its top tier characters, imo.



as for the match, I give this to orion.

Originally posted by TheKahn
As much as I like Marvel, I'd have to go with Orion. DC just seems to operate on a higher strength level for its top tier characters, imo.

Originally posted by carver9


as for the match, I give this to orion.

Just my opinion. Sometimes it seems to me that half of the freaking Justice League is said to be in the planet-destroying-class and then you have to add in their rogues who are depicted as being just as strong or stronger and its enough to make your head spin.

Thor warrior madness > Orion

Orion

Thor

Thor wins this.

Orion. Faster and just as strong As Superman.

Orion. Thor needs Mjonir to hang with them

without Mjolnir Orion wins
Thor is more familiar with armed combat

Originally posted by Warlord
without Mjolnir Orion wins
Thor is more familiar with armed combat

Wouldn't that be "Orion"?

what?

You said Thor is more familiar with armed combat. I think it's the other way around.

Orion but not by much.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
You said Thor is more familiar with armed combat. I think it's the other way around.

Seeing that Thor is always fighting with a weapon I'd say he is more used to fight in that way. I'd give orion an edge in unarmed fight.

Thor's more skilled, but Orion is still physically superior.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Thor's more skilled, but Orion is still physically superior.

far superior?

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Thor's more skilled, but Orion is still physically superior.



I'm gonna have to agree with part of this. In terms of strength, they are both beasts and is a stalemate. Orion is as skilled as they come, but Thor I think has the slight edge in fighting skill. This scenario however sways to Orion's favor cause he has shown better speed feats. Orion takes this by a slight majority. 6/10

Originally posted by bbrem123
nahh i dont thinks so....this would be a close one...thor easily rivals orion in h2h combat

lolz, he doesnt even rival wolverine, Orion takes him .

Orion

Originally posted by -Pr-
Is Orion nuts or actually calm and trying to use his skills?

Orion calm? lol! he's always ready for a brawl.

if Thor had his hammer he would give Orion the ol' "Orion, thou speakest entirely too much!"

But he doesn't

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
if Thor had his hammer he would give Orion the ol' "Orion, thou speakest entirely too much!"

But he doesn't Many Many guys will outmuscle and out brawl thor in a fist fight........

here is the list

WWH
Juggernaut
Hercules
Lobo
Orion
DOS DD
Maestro

and the list goes on and on...........

Originally posted by nicamarvin
Many Many guys will outmuscle and out brawl thor in a fist fight........

here is the list

WWH
Juggernaut
Hercules
Lobo
Orion
DOS DD
Maestro

and the list goes on and on...........

And?

Those guys would take Orion in a brawl as well, barring Hercules and Maestro. And seeing as my post had "if Thor had his hammer in it" and I earlier said that Orion was in fact stronger, I do not see the relevance here. But I guess that's what you get from trolls

Originally posted by WickedDynamite
Orion calm? lol! he's always ready for a brawl. son of darkseid and all that...

Without his motherbox doesn't Orion go into a sort of feral state where he is overcome by his father's rage and gets a huge strength increase but loses the connection to the Astroforce?

Does orion hav any combat skill feats? Thor atleast kept up with cap whilst depowered...

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
And?

Those guys would take Orion in a brawl as well, barring Hercules and Maestro. And seeing as my post had "if Thor had his hammer in it" and I earlier said that Orion was in fact stronger, I do not see the relevance here. But I guess that's what you get from trolls

No. Juggs might be the only one up to the task, because of his enchantments.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Just my opinion. Sometimes it seems to me that half of the freaking Justice League is said to be in the planet-destroying-class and then you have to add in their rogues who are depicted as being just as strong or stronger and its enough to make your head spin.

Show me this planetary destroying strength.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
No. Juggs might be the only one up to the task, because of his enchantments.
Lobo and WWH would both heal from most of the damage that Orion deals.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
No. Juggs might be the only one up to the task, because of his enchantments.

WWH or Lobo would physically CRUSH orion.

Originally posted by carver9
Show me this planetary destroying strength.


We've been down that road before. You ignore any scans given to you as proof and continue to pester whoever you are debating with baseless claims. No thanks.

Originally posted by carver9
WWH or Lobo would physically CRUSH orion. Orion has stood up to a sun amped Superman. Where do you get that they would crush him? Orion is stronger than Sentry and Sentry stood up pretty well to WWH. Orion has also stood up to Superman and Superman has beaten Lobo and vice versa.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
Orion has stood up to a sun amped Superman. Where do you get that they would crush him? Orion is stronger than Sentry and Sentry stood up pretty well to WWH. Orion has also stood up to Superman and Superman has beaten Lobo and vice versa.

Not sure the upper limit of Sentry's strength has been established. Please correct me if I missed it and are wrong.

Originally posted by TheKahn

We've been down that road before. You ignore any scans given to you as proof and continue to pester whoever you are debating with baseless claims. No thanks.

I'll be back with planetary destroying scans. You need help on clarrifying the difference.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
Orion has stood up to a sun amped Superman. Where do you get that they would crush him? Orion is stronger than Sentry and Sentry stood up pretty well to WWH. Orion has also stood up to Superman and Superman has beaten Lobo and vice versa.

LOL, I cant believe you think orion could beat wwh physically.

Originally posted by carver9
I'll be back with planetary destroying scans. You need help on clarrifying the difference.

The difference in what? I've never said that Marvel characters can't destroy planets. Several can in fact such as SS, Thanos, Gladiator, etc...

What I said was that DC seems to have more for the simple reason that nearly everyone top tier strength character in DC is usually compared in some way to Superman - who has repeatedly shown himself capable of destroying/moving moons and planets of various sizes. Thus anyone who is said to have near his strength (Orion, Captain Marvel, Black Adam, WW, etc) should be able of similar feats. Throw in their Rogues who are side to be of a similar strength level and you have an a mind boggling number of people who can destroy planets.

Originally posted by TheKahn
The difference in what? I've never said that Marvel characters can't destroy planets. Several can in fact such as SS, Thanos, Gladiator, etc...

What I said was that DC seems to have more for the simple reason that nearly everyone top tier strength character in DC is usually compared in some way to Superman - who has repeatedly shown himself capable of destroying/moving moons and planets of various sizes. Thus anyone who is said to have near his strength (Orion, Captain Marvel, Black Adam, WW, etc) should be able of similar feats. Throw in their Rogues who are side to be of a similar strength level and you have an a mind boggling number of people who can destroy planets.

You showed me Superman flying through a moon that was still in contact. None of your scans was planetary, NONE.

This is planetary destroying feats.

http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/2520/stormbreaker0308io5.jpg
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/305/stormbreaker0309dg2.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/4829/stormbreaker41415fl8.jpg
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1236/stormbreaker41617ln0.jpg

This is planetary.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet2.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet3.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img367.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld1wl5.jpg/
http://img354.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld2dh8.jpg/

This is planet moving.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh2.jpg

Superman/Wonder woman/Martian manhunter/Orion has none of these under his belt so stop saying that they are planet movers/destroyers

Originally posted by carver9
You showed me Superman flying through a moon that was still in contact. None of your scans was planetary, NONE.

This is planetary destroying feats.

http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/2520/stormbreaker0308io5.jpg
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/305/stormbreaker0309dg2.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/4829/stormbreaker41415fl8.jpg
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1236/stormbreaker41617ln0.jpg

This is planetary.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet2.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet3.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img367.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld1wl5.jpg/
http://img354.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld2dh8.jpg/

This is planet moving.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh2.jpg

Superman/Wonder woman/Martian manhunter/Orion has none of these under his belt so stop saying that they are planet movers/destroyers


Check out their respect threads (though I doubt you will), I've already given you scans before and you ignore them like any good fanboy would. Debating you is not enjoyable to enlightening in the least. If others want to do so, they are welcomed to it.

Originally posted by carver9
You showed me Superman flying through a moon that was still in contact. None of your scans was planetary, NONE.

This is planetary destroying feats.

http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/2520/stormbreaker0308io5.jpg
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/305/stormbreaker0309dg2.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/4829/stormbreaker41415fl8.jpg
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1236/stormbreaker41617ln0.jpg

This is planetary.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet2.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet3.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img367.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld1wl5.jpg/
http://img354.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld2dh8.jpg/

This is planet moving.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh2.jpg

Superman/Wonder woman/Martian manhunter/Orion has none of these under his belt so stop saying that they are planet movers/destroyers I didn't see any indication of what size those planets where. A planet can be smaller than a moon.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
I didn't see any indication of what size those planets where. A planet can be smaller than a moon.

Don't use logic on him. It only makes him grow stronger.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Check out their respect threads (though I doubt you will), I've already given you scans before and you ignore them like any good fanboy would. Debating you is not enjoyable to enlightening in the least. If others want to do so, they are welcomed to it.

So you showed me a planet destroying feat or did you show me zod and superman fighting on a planet that they was connected too?

Originally posted by TheKahn
Don't use logic on him. It only makes him grow stronger.

LOL, I'll be waiting for those feats. You showed NOTHING that indicates anyone on the jla being able to destroy a planet.

Originally posted by carver9
So you showed me a planet destroying feat or did you show me zod and superman fighting on a planet that they was connected too? Since when do DC characters go around destroying innocent plantets?

Originally posted by Zeuodin
I didn't see any indication of what size those planets where. A planet can be smaller than a moon.

They are planetary feats, thats all that matter. Each of them have under there belts that they can and have destroyed a planet.

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, I'll be waiting for those feats. You showed NOTHING that indicates anyone on the jla being able to destroy a planet. If one were to hurl a mountain at a planet, the planet would be destroyed. Planet Killer. All life would die. Any number of JLAers can do that.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
Since when do DC characters go around destroying innocent plantets?

So when does superman go around flying through moons thats connected to a planet.

Plenty of heros destroyed planets, barren planets but planets.

Thor
beta ray bill
Silver surfer
etc....

Originally posted by carver9
They are planetary feats, thats all that matter. Each of them have under there belts that they can and have destroyed a planet. And yet Gladiator couldn't take down Colossus easily. Didn't Thor have a hard time with Nefaria who Got pwned By Vision who slammed him with just 90 tons of weight? My you forget the average effect don't you.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
If one were to hurl a mountain at a planet, the planet would be destroyed. Planet Killer. All life would die. Any number of JLAers can do that.

I never said that they couldnt pick up a mountain. I want to see some evidence that they have planet leveling strength like the scans that I showed.

Would you like for me to post some more planet level power from different people because I dont mind.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
And yet Gladiator couldn't take down Colossus easily. Didn't Thor have a hard time with Nefaria who Got pwned By Vision who slammed him with just 90 tons of weight? My you forget the average effect don't you.

LOL, gladiator couldnt take out colossus easy? The fight didnt even last two panels and gladiator stood there and let colossus throw boulders on the top of his head and he smiled during the entire fight. It was clear that he was playing and KNEW colossus wasnt a threat.

Thor holds back and we seen what a none holding back thor does since he DID destroy a moon in one of his latest fights.

All of that still does not take away from the fact that thor and gladiator have planetary destroying strength. Hell, gladiator soloed a feat where he moved an asteroid that was the size of a planet.

Originally posted by khazra
Does orion hav any combat skill feats? Thor atleast kept up with cap whilst depowered...

Yes, Orion once nearly defeated the "Greatest Martial Artist in the Universe". And this is while in a pacifist state. Valkyrie speed blitzed Orion and the Forever People were "SHOCKED". Saying something like, "Orion would have never let her get 20 yards of him". Or something to that effect. Orion nearly defeated her, even in a pacafist state, until Highfather interrupted the battle.

I don't get how people say Thor is a superior fighter, when Orion has proved that he specializes in all types of warfare and knows every form of armed combat. Similar to Karate Kid.

And on top of that, has thousands upon thousands of years of experience. This is Orions fight here.

Originally posted by carver9
WWH or Lobo would physically CRUSH orion.

No, he would not. Orion's already faced healers and done quite well. Hell, he has the ability to not even get hit. As in the Mother Box phasing him. Physically, Superman has knocked Lobo out and Orion is his peer.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Yes, Orion once nearly defeated the "Greatest Martial Artist in the Universe". And this is while in a pacifist state. Valkyrie speed blitzed Orion and the Forever People were "SHOCKED". Saying something like, "Orion would have never let her get 20 yards of him". Or something to that effect. Orion nearly defeated her, even in a pacafist state, until Highfather interrupted the battle.

I don't get how people say Thor is a superior fighter, when Orion has proved that he specializes in all types of warfare and knows every form of armed combat. Similar to Karate Kid.

And on top of that, has thousands upon thousands of years of experience. This is Orions fight here.

I agree with this, orion is taking this fight.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
No, he would not. Orion's already faced healers and done quite well. Hell, he has the ability to not even get hit. As in the Mother Box phasing him. Physically, Superman has knocked Lobo out and Orion is his peer.

Sigh*

Didnt Orion fail to break out of a titanium box that firestorm put on him?

Originally posted by carver9
Sigh*

Didnt Orion fail to break out of a titanium box that firestorm put on him?
Didn't Spider-Man once beat Firelord?
Didn't Batman once knock out Cheetah in one punch?
Didn't Catwoman once beat Cheetah in h/h? (notice a trend)

What's your point? That was really bad PIS.

Originally posted by carver9
Sigh*

Didnt Orion fail to break out of a titanium box that firestorm put on him?

No, he eventually broke free. A similar situation happened in Simonson's run and Orion INSTANTLY broke free. So, it was a low feat for him.

Here is the situation I was talking about.

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/9e9c118b.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/1fa0f0c6.jpg

Here is a healing feat from a MB: after Orion is hit in EVERY fatal area of his body and thrown into a Fire pit (which is known 10x hotter than the Sun itself, Orion heals)

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/3d1a3edf.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/2714aedf.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/10f93fce.jpg

Everyone is surprised, because he should have been dead.

EDIT: Sorry, the MB only healed his face, but this shows Orion has regenerate abilities of his own.

Originally posted by carver9
You showed me Superman flying through a moon that was still in contact. None of your scans was planetary, NONE.

This is planetary destroying feats.

http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/2520/stormbreaker0308io5.jpg
http://img478.imageshack.us/img478/305/stormbreaker0309dg2.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/4829/stormbreaker41415fl8.jpg
http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/1236/stormbreaker41617ln0.jpg

This is planetary.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet2.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/killplanet3.jpg

This is planetary.

http://img367.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld1wl5.jpg/
http://img354.imageshack.us/i/destroyingworld2dh8.jpg/

This is planet moving.

http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh.jpg
http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc260/Superman-Prime_Respect/planetmovehigh2.jpg

Superman/Wonder woman/Martian manhunter/Orion has none of these under his belt so stop saying that they are planet movers/destroyers

MM has beaten Ultraman. We already know Ultraman can bust planets. Hell, he's held the infinite book in Superman 3d.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/Jimscomic158.jpg


MM knocks the shit out of Superboy Prime. A planet Killer.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/Jimscomic231.jpg

Captain Atom Destroys a universe using his power over the Quantum Field( far more than planet Busting power)
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom056199yp.jpg

Captain Marvel And Superman lift a book with Infinite Mass. Can't get any stronger than That
http://s663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/?action=view&current=SupermanBeyond01Page024.jpg

John Almost recreates an Entire Star System.
http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/6261/greenlantern02614d.jpg

Hal Jordan Literally pulling an entire world back together
http://img38.imagehaven.net/img.php?id=QVEH9AMF0H_Trinity049014.jpg

Oblivion is Kyle Rayner's ID. The dark side of him. And it's all Kyle's power
He creates a sun
http://g.imagehost.org/view/0623/01-Green_Lantern_Circle_of_Fire_29

Creates a quasar that is eating the matter that holds the universe together
http://g.imagehost.org/view/0522/Circle_of_Fire_2_27

Kyle Rayner Recreates Pluto
http://a.imagehost.org/0051/pg0013im.jpg

Kyle Holds the Big bang in place or what ever it was Imperiex was doing
http://h.imagehost.org/view/0702/Superman_v2_173_pg14

Light Ray, Another JLAer, Creates a Supersun out of nothing.
http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/NewGods03-08.jpg

Orion is the only guy on the JLA able to injure the Abstractual being, Star Conquerer
http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/JLA02313.jpg

Superman holds a black hole in his hand.
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/415/blackholejq6.jpg

Superman Destroys a moon which by Saturn's standards can be a planet the size of pluto
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/1534/satsoontb5.jpg

Superman Pushes a ship so massive and heavy that it negated the Earth and the moon's gravity.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Superman/Supermanpush2.jpg

Heat Vision is enough power on it's own to move a planet.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Superman/Supermanpush2.jpg

Wonder Woman EASILY holds up a planet killer asteroid.
http://www.picamatic.com/show/2008/10/23/12/01/1228244_bigthumb.jpg

So what do you mean the JLA lacks anyone with power to destroy a planet? All of these feats clearly show they have the power to do that and more.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Here is the situation I was talking about.

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/9e9c118b.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/1fa0f0c6.jpg

Here is a healing feat from a MB: after Orion is hit in EVERY fatal area of his body and thrown into a Fire pit (which is known 10x hotter than the Sun itself, Orion heals)

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/3d1a3edf.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/2714aedf.jpg

http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/10f93fce.jpg

Everyone is surprised, because he should have been dead.

EDIT: Sorry, the MB only healed his face, but this shows Orion has regenerate abilities of his own.

I know he does but its no where CLOSE to what WWH is capable of healing and WWH is stronger than orion. The only thing orion has over wwh is fighting skills and thats not enough.

Originally posted by carver9
I know he does but its no where CLOSE to what WWH is capable of healing and WWH is stronger than orion. The only thing orion has over wwh is fighting skills and thats not enough.

Please prove that WWH is stronger than Orion instead of just saying it over and over.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
MM has beaten Ultraman. We already know Ultraman can bust planets. Hell, he's held the infinite book in Superman 3d.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/Jimscomic158.jpg


MM knocks the shit out of Superboy Prime. A planet Killer.
http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u131/jason-todd/Jimscomic231.jpg

Captain Atom Destroys a universe using his power over the Quantum Field( far more than planet Busting power)
http://i95.photobucket.com/albums/l130/Red_Atom/Captain%20Atom/Cap%20scans/captainatom056199yp.jpg

Captain Marvel And Superman lift a book with Infinite Mass. Can't get any stronger than That
http://s663.photobucket.com/albums/uu355/ankur29/?action=view&current=SupermanBeyond01Page024.jpg

John Almost recreates an Entire Star System.
http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/6261/greenlantern02614d.jpg

Hal Jordan Literally pulling an entire world back together
http://img38.imagehaven.net/img.php?id=QVEH9AMF0H_Trinity049014.jpg

Oblivion is Kyle Rayner's ID. The dark side of him. And it's all Kyle's power
He creates a sun
http://g.imagehost.org/view/0623/01-Green_Lantern_Circle_of_Fire_29

Creates a quasar that is eating the matter that holds the universe together
http://g.imagehost.org/view/0522/Circle_of_Fire_2_27

Kyle Rayner Recreates Pluto
http://a.imagehost.org/0051/pg0013im.jpg

Kyle Holds the Big bang in place or what ever it was Imperiex was doing
http://h.imagehost.org/view/0702/Superman_v2_173_pg14

Light Ray, Another JLAer, Creates a Supersun out of nothing.
http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/NewGods03-08.jpg

Orion is the only guy on the JLA able to injure the Abstractual being, Star Conquerer
http://img19.photobucket.com/albums/v58/Desaad/JLA02313.jpg

Superman holds a black hole in his hand.
http://img360.imageshack.us/img360/415/blackholejq6.jpg

Superman Destroys a moon which by Saturn's standards can be a planet the size of pluto
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/1534/satsoontb5.jpg

Superman Pushes a ship so massive and heavy that it negated the Earth and the moon's gravity.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Superman/Supermanpush2.jpg

Heat Vision is enough power on it's own to move a planet.
http://i31.photobucket.com/albums/c379/Doggydogg/Superman/Supermanpush2.jpg

Wonder Woman EASILY holds up a planet killer asteroid.
http://www.picamatic.com/show/2008/10/23/12/01/1228244_bigthumb.jpg

So what do you mean the JLA lacks anyone with power to destroy a planet? All of these feats clearly show they have the power to do that and more.

Thanos faught galactus and blew him out of his ship, I guess that make Thanos a solar system/Universe buster. I'm not going to respond to your post because you are going to think that I'm discrediting your feats but you should be able to see the difference between the scans.

I consider you to be a good debator/tacticle debator with a lot of knowledge on these character so PLEASE tell me you see the difference between these scans because if not I'm going to start posting my scans of statements saying that gladiator is the strongest being in the universe.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Please prove that WWH is stronger than Orion instead of just saying it over and over.

Ok, give me 15 minutes, have something important to do.

Originally posted by carver9
Thanos faught galactus and blew him out of his ship, I guess that make Thanos a solar system/Universe buster. I'm not going to respond to your post because you are going to think that I'm discrediting your feats but you should be able to see the difference between the scans.

I consider you to be a good debator/tacticle debator with a lot of knowledge on these character so PLEASE tell me you see the difference between these scans because if not I'm going to start posting my scans of statements saying that gladiator is the strongest being in the universe.

Thanos did NOTHING to galactus. He didn't harm him in anyway. There were other scans. Of super suns being created. Black Holes being held. That is all>>>>Planet busting power. you choose to ignore those.

Originally posted by carver9
Thanos faught galactus and blew him out of his ship, I guess that make Thanos a solar system/Universe buster. I'm not going to respond to your post because you are going to think that I'm discrediting your feats but you should be able to see the difference between the scans.

I consider you to be a good debator/tacticle debator with a lot of knowledge on these character so PLEASE tell me you see the difference between these scans because if not I'm going to start posting my scans of statements saying that gladiator is the strongest being in the universe.

Like I said...
Originally posted by TheKahn
Check out their respect threads (though I doubt you will), I've already given you scans before and you ignore them like any good fanboy would. Debating you is not enjoyable to enlightening in the least. If others want to do so, they are welcomed to it.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Like I said...

You misenterpreted the scans you put up not knowing the meaning of the story.

The only thing I agree with Carver is WWHulk is stronger than Orion. But not amped Hulk.

Originally posted by carver9
Ok, give me 15 minutes, have something important to do.

Its been over an hour....

Yet I see no proof that WWH is stronger than Orion. I'm shocked.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Its been over an hour....

Yet I see no proof that WWH is stronger than Orion. I'm shocked.

I give WW Hulk or pretty much any Savage Hulk against even Thor. WW Hulk simply has more strength feats than Orion. Though Simonson and Byrne have stated Orion is superior in strength compared to Superman.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Its been over an hour....

Yet I see no proof that WWH is stronger than Orion. I'm shocked.

I just got back, give me 5 minutes, dont go anywhere. Now when I post these scans, please dont put up scans of who orion fought, I want to see strength feats.

Originally posted by carver9
I just got back, give me 5 minutes, dont go anywhere. Now when I post these scans, please dont put up scans of who orion fought, I want to see strength feats.

scans of him hurting high level beings are considered strength feats.

Originally posted by -Pr-
scans of him hurting high level beings are considered strength feats.

So I can put up a scan of the beyonder stating that hulk have limitless strength and him backing away from the hulk?

Or him punching through a time stream which would be>>>>>>any feat orion has done his entire career.

Originally posted by carver9
So I can put up a scan of the beyonder stating that hulk have limitless strength and him backing away from the hulk?

no. you'd have to show hulk punching him and hurting him, then doing the same to other beings in the Beyonder's strength class. then it would be all right.

Originally posted by -Pr-
no. you'd have to show hulk punching him and hurting him, then doing the same to other beings in the Beyonder's strength class. then it would be all right.

But using that logic is crazy since thor has damaged celestials with physical might.

That feat alone would making his hits>>>>>>>anyone on the high herald level list.

Is that what you are trying to say?

Originally posted by carver9
But using that logic is crazy since thor has damaged celestials with physical might.

That feat alone would making his hits>>>>>>>anyone on the high herald level list.

Is that what you are trying to say?

no. not at all, and it's not the point i made.

Originally posted by TheKahn
Its been over an hour....

Yet I see no proof that WWH is stronger than Orion. I'm shocked.

I'm not even going to start with hulks high end feats yets, I'm going to take it slow because I'm pretty sure you wont find anything comparable to what I'm going to put up.

Hulk holding planet sakaar together with nothing but pure strength.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkholdsplanettogether.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkholdsplanettogether1.jpg

WWH one handing a big a** space ship like its nothing. The same space ship that he came to the planet on. Lets not forget, WWH was weakend when he was on this planet.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkstrength.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkstrength1.jpg

WWh picking up a small moutain throwing it like it was a paper sized baseball and again, this is a weakend hulk.

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkstrength3.jpg
http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t173/EndlessMike9/Hulk/hulkstrength4.jpg

Forgot to add, you see that island hes on, he destroyed it with his fist.

Your turn

Originally posted by -Pr-
no. not at all, and it's not the point i made.

What was your point?

Originally posted by carver9
What was your point?

that you have to have consistency.

Originally posted by -Pr-
that you have to have consistency.

So the people that Orion punches hurt, are you implying that hulk punches wont have any kind of affect?

Originally posted by carver9
I'm not even going to start with hulks high end feats yets, I'm going to take it slow because I'm pretty sure you wont find anything comparable to what I'm going to put up.


Let me repeat myself: I did not request you to prove that WWH has a great deal of strength. Everyone knows that and accepts that as fact. What I asked you to do was prove your repeated claim that he was stronger than Orion - someone that has consistently been show to be as strong as or even stronger than Superman.

Understand? You are essentially claiming that Character A must be stronger than Character B because A is really, really, really, superduper strong!

Originally posted by TheKahn
Let me repeat myself: I did not request you to prove that WWH has a great deal of strength. Everyone knows that and accepts that as fact. What I asked you to do was prove your repeated claim that he was stronger than Orion - someone that has consistently been show to be as strong as or even stronger than Superman.

Understand? You are essentially claiming that Character A must be stronger than Character B because A is really, really, really, superduper strong!

Originally posted by carver9



you just got owned

Originally posted by TheKahn
Let me repeat myself: I did not request you to prove that WWH has a great deal of strength. Everyone knows that and accepts that as fact. What I asked you to do was prove your repeated claim that he was stronger than Orion - someone that has consistently been show to be as strong as or even stronger than Superman.

Understand? You are essentially claiming that Character A must be stronger than Character B because A is really, really, really, superduper strong!

Character A is stronger than Character B. Grundy has hurt Superman but its pretty obvious WWH is stronger than him also.

Originally posted by -Pr-
no. you'd have to show hulk punching him and hurting him, then doing the same to other beings in the Beyonder's strength class. then it would be all right.
's not like what Carver said was true either.

But I guess you know that.

Originally posted by shokosugi
you just got owned

He didnt say anything or proved anything. How about you ask him to put up feats.

Originally posted by carver9
Character A is stronger than Character B. Grundy has hurt Superman but its pretty obvious WWH is stronger than him also.



Try something new. People have repeatedly discredited that claim in other threads and you know it.

Originally posted by carver9
So the people that Orion punches hurt, are you implying that hulk punches wont have any kind of affect?

Naturally he's not implying anything. HE IS SAYING that Hulk's punches would not affect them to the same degree. Since he is under the opinion, the correct one, that Hulk is not as strong as Orion. See, when I think that A is stronger than B, I, of course, think that B's punches would do more damage to a wall. Unless A has some sort of skill to make up for it, which the Hulk has not.

Originally posted by -Pr-
that you have to have consistency.

Thor has damaged Celestial and Celestial level beings on more than 1, 2, or 3 occasions so its pretty consistant if you ask me.

So going by your definition, thor hitting power>>>>>>>any high herald.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Naturally he's not implying anything. HE IS SAYING that Hulk's punches would not affect them to the same degree. Since he is under the opinion, the correct one, that Hulk is not as strong as Orion. See, when I think that A is stronger than B, I, of course, think that B's punches would do more damage to a wall. Unless A has some sort of skill to make up for it, which the Hulk has not.

Kris, I understand EXACTLY what he's saying but the point is moot.

If I put up the the hulk hurting genis
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1493/genis1c4zr.jpg
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/6085/genis1d2mx.jpg


What would this prove?

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
's not like what Carver said was true either.

But I guess you know that.

i phase in and out of attentiveness.

Originally posted by carver9
Thor has damaged Celestial and Celestial level beings on more than 1, 2, or 3 occasions so its pretty consistant if you ask me.

So going by your definition, thor hitting power>>>>>>>any high herald.

not if it's inconsistent with his other showings, which is what you're not getting.

Originally posted by carver9
Kris, I understand EXACTLY what he's saying but the point is moot.

If I put up the the hulk hurting genis
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/1493/genis1c4zr.jpg
http://img230.imageshack.us/img230/6085/genis1d2mx.jpg


What would this prove? Nothing good for a savage Hulk, but comes up as good showing Genis taking hits, he was even serious.

Ex. If you see Rhino hurting Genis, it could be PIS?

Originally posted by -Pr-
i phase in and out of attentiveness.



not if it's inconsistent with his other showings, which is what you're not getting.

Thats debatable since thor tends to hold back a lot. He might take the gloves off on threats like celestials, we dont know but it has happened enough times for it to be something common for the character.

Lets also add him damaging mangog and the destroyer in that mix.

Originally posted by carver9
Thats debatable since thor tends to hold back a lot. He might take the gloves off on threats like celestials, we dont know but it has happened enough times for it to be something common for the character.

Lets also add him damaging mangog and the destroyer in that mix.

i'm simply amazed that you'll so readily accept thor feats without argument, but when it comes to someone like superman or wonder woman, you're all up in arms.

i honestly don't know if thor could hurt a celestial. maybe he can, but he has to have a consistent basis for doing so woven in to the character and his feats and showings over the years.

Originally posted by -Pr-
i'm simply amazed that you'll so readily accept thor feats without argument, but when it comes to someone like superman or wonder woman, you're all up in arms.

i honestly don't know if thor could hurt a celestial. maybe he can, but he has to have a consistent basis for doing so woven in to the character and his feats and showings over the years.

And what feats have I discredited of Wonder woman and Superman?

Originally posted by carver9
And what feats have I discredited of Wonder woman and Superman?

i actually lol'd. thanks for that.

i dunno... all of them? or a very heavy majority.

Originally posted by -Pr-
i actually lol'd. thanks for that.

i dunno... all of them? or a very heavy majority.

LOL, why did you laugh and I didnt discredit your feats, you add on to feats making it appear as something that its not.

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/1/15921/400499-4891-thanoseid_super.jpg

Originally posted by -Pr-
i actually lol'd. thanks for that.

i dunno... all of them? or a very heavy majority.

He not discrediting them, you and I just aren't smart enough to figure out what's really taking place.

Example

Originally posted by carver9
Example

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, why did you laugh and I didnt discredit your feats, you add on to feats making it appear as something that its not.

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, why did you laugh and I didnt discredit your feats, you add on to feats making it appear as something that its not.

see? you're doing it right now.

Originally posted by carver9
But using that logic is crazy since thor has damaged celestials with physical might.

That feat alone would making his hits>>>>>>>anyone on the high herald level list.

Is that what you are trying to say? I've never seen Thor bust up a celestial with his fist. Show me.

Orion.

Thor has nothing on him in a physical fight that matters.

^What does Orion have on Thor?

Originally posted by lawest9
No weapons or energy manip, strictly strength, durability, skill and heart, no MB for Orion.

Who wins this bloodlusted match?

No motherbox? That means Orion turns into a raging beast doesn't it?

Either way that would favor Thor as I understand it, as Thor would have a clear head and would be able to use his skills effectively (Unless Orion can use his skills just as well when he goes mad like he does without the Motherbox keeping the rage he inherited from Darkseid in check.), and if Thor resorts into a berserker state as well, eventually he'd hit the Madness, and get a 10 times amp in strength.

If Thor goes punch for punch, Orion's brutality and madness would give him the advantage. Eventually though Thor would hit that state of mind as well.

Originally posted by xJLxKing
Orion. Thor needs Mjonir to hang with them

Ridiculous.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Without his motherbox doesn't Orion go into a sort of feral state where he is overcome by his father's rage and gets a huge strength increase but loses the connection to the Astroforce?

See that's how Kirby originally wrote Orion. Mother Box not only heals him but also controls his rage. In KC when Superman asked for an audience with him he was without his MB. Thus explaining he finally became the mighty force DS had held.

Gold locks Thor loses H2H with an enrage Orion. Taking away the MB from Orion just does him a big favor.

Orion is a chained vicious dog and there is a reason the chain must always be on.

Originally posted by WickedDynamite

Gold locks Thor loses H2H with an enrage Orion. Taking away the MB from Orion just does him a big favor.

Orion is a chained vicious dog and there is a reason the chain must always be on.

Orion going feral would work against him both ways because Thor would be able to use a clear head or he could also go feral and become 10 times stronger.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
also go feral and become 10 times stronger. Just like when he fights Hulk or other raging monsters!

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Orion going feral would work against him both ways because Thor would be able to use a clear head or he could also go feral and become 10 times stronger.

A clear head and strategy goes out the window. Case in point...In Orion #5 before the big brawl....DS points to Orion to remove his MB for the fight. DS was expecting to control and exploit the rage of Orion. Then Orion abides and it backfire on DS side.

I'm not taking anything away from Thor nor do I doubt his powers. But an enrage Orion is nothing like an enrage Hulk. Orion is a complete power level here...

Originally posted by WickedDynamite

Gold locks Thor loses H2H with an enrage Orion. Taking away the MB from Orion just does him a big favor.

Orion is a chained vicious dog and there is a reason the chain must always be on.

I get a lot of these misconceptions that an enrage Orion is similar to an enrage Hulk and that's just epic wrong.

While Hulk rage powers him on...Orion's rage on the other hand makes him a better combatant.

Originally posted by WickedDynamite
I get a lot of these misconceptions that an enrage Orion is similar to an enrage Hulk and that's just epic wrong.

While Hulk rage powers him on...Orion's rage on the other hand makes him a better combatant.
Where as Thor's rage makes him about 10 times as strong.

Originally posted by Kris Blaze
Where as Thor's rage makes him about 10 times as strong.

With his Mjolnir....

Originally posted by WickedDynamite
With his Mjolnir....
Eh, when Thor went into berserker rage against Adam Warlock he dropped Mjolnir. Just to take him out with his hands.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
^What does Orion have on Thor?



No motherbox? That means Orion turns into a raging beast doesn't it?

Either way that would favor Thor as I understand it, as Thor would have a clear head and would be able to use his skills effectively (Unless Orion can use his skills just as well when he goes mad like he does without the Motherbox keeping the rage he inherited from Darkseid in check.), and if Thor resorts into a berserker state as well, eventually he'd hit the Madness, and get a 10 times amp in strength.

If Thor goes punch for punch, Orion's brutality and madness would give him the advantage. Eventually though Thor would hit that state of mind as well.

Not really. Simonson's run pretty much did away with that.

Originally posted by Juntai
Just like when he fights Hulk or other raging monsters!

Hulk is actually a perfect example for my point. Thor stated he keeps himself in check against the Hulk. Even when he gets into the fight he keeps himself in check reflecting on how pointless their fights are.

The one time Thor let himself loose (The part with Thor's losing/gaining his powers.), he enters Warrior Madness near the end. Of course he and Hulk were going toe to toe for over an hour.

Warrior madness thor vs a warrior madness orion would be one for the ages.

Originally posted by WickedDynamite
A clear head and strategy goes out the window. Case in point...In Orion #5 before the big brawl....DS points to Orion to remove his MB for the fight. DS was expecting to control and exploit the rage of Orion. Then Orion abides and it backfire on DS side.

I'm not taking anything away from Thor nor do I doubt his powers. But an enrage Orion is nothing like an enrage Hulk. Orion is a complete power level here...

So he loses a clear head and all strategy? That would work for Thor then, as if he engages him in a similar state, the chances are that Thor will enter Warrior Madness jump up greatly, and that isn't good for Orion. Thor could also use his clear head to take advantage over Orion's enraged state.

What? Are you saying an enraged Orion is on a completely different level than an enraged Hulk in a brawl? Really?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Warrior madness thor vs a warrior madness orion would be one for the ages.

Orion has a Warrior Madness state that increases his strength at least 10 fold? Never knew that.

Enraged Orion doesn't mean Savage Hulk. He's still in control and highly intelligent in battle.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Orion has a Warrior Madness state that increases his strength at least 10 fold? Never knew that.

Yep.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Enraged Orion doesn't mean Savage Hulk. He's still in control and highly intelligent in battle.

Really? I thought he loses control. I remember that wasn't the case in a battle once, but I thought that was the consistent portrayal of him. Even when he had the Motherbox he was going feral, to the point he had to be restrained a few times by the Justice League members when he was part of the team.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Yep.

Scans?

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Really? I thought he loses control. I remember that wasn't the case in a battle once, but I thought that was the consistent portrayal of him. Even when he had the Motherbox he was going feral, to the point he had to be restrained a few times by the Justice League members when he was part of the team.

Like I said, Simonson's run did away with that.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Yep. There is no stated number to his increase in speed and strenght. He just becomes stronger and stronger and more viscious.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Scans?

Don't have the books on me. Astro used to have the respect thread up, but many of those scans don't work.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
There is no stated number to his increase in speed and strenght. He just becomes stronger and stronger and more viscious.

I know, I was just going to add that. There was no mention of 10x or whatever, but when Orion is enraged, he did destroy a good portion of Apokolips just by growing.

I remember Orion also going into cosmic being form, where he looked like a universe.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Like I said, Simonson's run did away with that.

So that's probably the instance I'm recalling. That was during the early 00's right? So after Orion's appearance in the JLA which was probably in the late 90's or early 00's.

Cool. Didn't know it was an official retcon.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
There is no stated number to his increase in speed and strenght. He just becomes stronger and stronger and more viscious.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I know, I was just going to add that. There was no mention of 10x or whatever, but when Orion is enraged, he did destroy a good portion of Apokolips just by growing.

I remember Orion also going into cosmic being form, where he looked like a universe.

Really? Well he better increase fast, because when Thor hits Warrior Madness, he has no qualms in killing and with that big of a strength advantage, he'd probably rip his head off.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
So that's probably the instance I'm recalling. That was during the early 00's right? So after Orion's appearance in the JLA which was probably in the late 90's or early 00's.

Cool. Didn't know it was an official retcon.

I don't know if it's official. Starlin's Orion looked like a bafoon in comparison.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Really? Well he better increase fast, because when Thor hits Warrior Madness, he has no qualms in killing and with that big of a strength advantage, he'd probably rip his head off.

Orion has no problems killing as well. Hell, he doesn't have to be in enraged to kill. He did kill a WHOLE species, just because they pissed him off. Innocent bystanders and all.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I know, I was just going to add that. There was no mention of 10x or whatever, but when Orion is enraged, he did destroy a good portion of Apokolips just by growing.

I remember Orion also going into cosmic being form, where he looked like a universe. I have both Issues. Orion grew to Hundreds of feat tall and then went into a rage. He destroyed huge chunks of Apok with Omnidirecitonal Astro-Force blasts.

He can also self amp and become kind of cosmic avatar. HE's done it twice. Once to scare some humans. The second time to fight DS in the source.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Really? Well he better increase fast, because when Thor hits Warrior Madness, he has no qualms in killing and with that big of a strength advantage, he'd probably rip his head off. Orion in his rage once grew hundreds if not Thousands of Feat tall in a fit and just started destorying everything in his path. I doubt ten times the Thor will bother him.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
I have both Issues. Orion grew to Hundreds of feat tall and then went into a rage. He destroyed huge chunks of Apok with Omnidirecitonal Astro-Force blasts.

He can also self amp and become kind of cosmic avatar. HE's done it twice. Once to scare some humans. The second time to fight DS in the source.

Do you have the scans of Orion battleing DS in the Source and also Orion jumping inside DS's body? I've always wanted to see the last one again, but even Astro doesn't have it in his respect thread.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Do you have the scans of Orion battleing DS in the Source and also Orion jumping inside DS's body? I've always wanted to see the last one again, but even Astro doesn't have it in his respect thread. I do. Give me time to upload them. Not at home right now. Still at school.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
I do. Give me time to upload them. Not at home right now. Still at school.

Cool. Just those two. I've been wanting to see the one where Orion jumped in his body. I think it was a pretty cool battle feat and something he didn't do with the MB, IIRC.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Cool. Just those two. I've been wanting to see the one where Orion jumped in his body. I think it was a pretty cool battle feat and something he didn't do with the MB, IIRC. He doesn't really need the mother box for most stuff. He's matter manipulated, used magnetism, force fields, amps, space jumps, etc all with his own power. I guess the MB is just for coolness.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
Orion in his rage once grew hundreds if not Thousands of Feat tall in a fit and just started destorying everything in his path. I doubt ten times the Thor will bother him.

Him growing that tall gives Thor a bigger target, and makes Thor harder to hit.

New Gods in their true form simply are much bigger than the form they appear in on the Earth dimension.

It's his blackberry, he can also HEAL almost from death by himself as well. Getting tossed into the Fire pit and being hit in all fatal areas of his body and he came back pretty quick.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Him growing that tall gives Thor a bigger target, and makes Thor harder to hit.

New Gods in their true form simply are much bigger than the form they appear in on the Earth dimension. NO. You are missing the point. Orion was already on Apok. HE was already in his true form. He can grow. Just like when Devilance was in the regular DCU and he grew. Even DS has grown hundreds of feat. It must be a New God power.

Originally posted by Rage.Of.Olympus
Him growing that tall gives Thor a bigger target, and makes Thor harder to hit.

New Gods in their true form simply are much bigger than the form they appear in on the Earth dimension.

You're correct about the first part, but Orion can sense beings from across the universe and in other dimensions. He has a nose of a blood hound and if he can't do it THAT way, the MB can always help Orion spot Thor. Not a big deal.

Originally posted by Zeuodin
NO. You are missing the point. Orion was already on Apok. HE was already in his true form. He can grow. Just like when Devilance was in the regular DCU and he grew. Even DS has grown hundreds of feat. It must be a New God power.

What Devilance instance are you referring to?