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Gladiator
http://www.dragonhero.com/graphics/marvel2/gladiator2c.jpg

vs

Captian Marvel
http://www.dragonhero.com/graphics/dc/Universe/captain-marvel2.png

CM

CM

CM

CM 7-8/10

8/10?
no way

Originally posted by Warlord
8/10?
no way

Why not? His confidence will drop pretty fast once he sees CM is his euqal or superior in every sense.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Why not? His confidence will drop pretty fast once he sees CM is his euqal or superior in every sense.

I didn't see his confidence dropping when he was fighting Thor, Hyperion or Quasar

Originally posted by Warlord
I didn't see his confidence dropping when he was fighting Thor, Hyperion or Quasar

Thor beat him though like always. Hyperion lost IIRC but that's something different, Hyperion is just a Superman wannabe himself, Marvel's way to say "Supes will lose". CM is also physically >= Gladiator IMHO.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Thor beat him though like always. Hyperion lost IIRC but that's something different, Hyperion is just a Superman wannabe himself, Marvel's way to say "Supes will lose". CM is also physically >= Gladiator IMHO.
1. Thor has lost too
2. Gladiator is Marvel's Superman more than Hyperion
3. CM would win IMO too but no way 8/10

Originally posted by Warlord
1. Thor has lost too
2. Gladiator is Marvel's Superman more than Hyperion
3. CM would win IMO too but no way 8/10

How many wins would you give him?

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Why not? His confidence will drop pretty fast once he sees CM is his euqal or superior in every sense.

6/10 it's a close fight IMO their feats are pretty much comparable baring pre crisis stuff

Originally posted by Warlord
1. Thor has lost too
2. Gladiator is Marvel's Superman more than Hyperion
3. CM would win IMO too but no way 8/10
also Gladiator took is to silver surfer.

Originally posted by Lord Feron


Stop lughing you little brat!

Gladiator is just an Superboy ripp off.

CM is an Superman ripp off.

Man > Boy 7-8/10!



Originally posted by Battlehammer
also Gladiator took is to silver surfer.

And lost?

Gladiator

CM would win for the same reason he would beat Superman. Magic vulnerability.

It would be close however

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Stop lughing you little brat!

Gladiator is just an Superboy ripp off.

CM is an Superman ripp off.

Man > Boy 7-8/10!





And lost?

Originally posted by Batman-Prime


And lost?
it was a stalemate.

Originally posted by Battlehammer
it was a stalemate.

You think so? Surfer could easily beat Glads, you surely don't doubt that`?

we just doubt CM would easily beat Glads...

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Why not? His confidence will drop pretty fast once he sees CM is his euqal or superior in every sense. When has his confidence dropped when he fought someone in his league rather than someone far below him. The point is Glads confidence becomes an issue when he takes on characters far beneath him as to make the story believable for how they can even take the guy on.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime

CM is an Superman ripp off.




cant believe nobody has said anything about this comment.

Originally posted by r0nm0n88
cant believe nobody has said anything about this comment.

Because hes not.

Billy for the win

Originally posted by The Nuul
Because hes not.

i know, thats why im surprised the CM fans havent started talking. But anyway i think CM takes a majority, like supes would

CM wins his a superman with extra's, and with out any weakness

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
You think so? Surfer could easily beat Glads, you surely don't doubt that`?
thats not how there fight went.

Captain Marvel 6/10.

Captian Marvel

Originally posted by Battlehammer
also Gladiator took is to silver surfer.

Pretty sure thats non canon

Glads has greater versatility; CM has the edge in combat speed and while more or less equally durable, has the advantage in stamina.

Generally 5/10 split, but a 6/10 win for Billy if the battle goes on for a protracted period, as I think Glads confidence would fluctuate at least a little after awhile. However, if Glads could BFR the battle (not Billy, as such, but the area of battle) to outerspace, especially fairly far out, then he'd have the advantage, though that would be difficult for him to do with CM, to say the least...

5/10

Originally posted by Naija boy
Pretty sure thats non canon
im pretty sure it cannon but I could be wrong.

Physically, Gladiator>Captain Marvel and this is going off of feats.

Gladiator would still lose though due to magic weakness.

Marvel 6/10

But gladiator is stronger, faster and more durable by a huge gap if you ask me.

Originally posted by carver9
Physically, Gladiator>Captain Marvel and this is going off of feats.

Gladiator would still lose though due to magic weakness.

Marvel 6/10

But gladiator is stronger, faster and more durable by a huge gap if you ask me. Why is the gap huge?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Why is the gap huge?

Feats.

Gladiator feats and statements about his power are better.

One feat of him containing a solar system destroying blast should indicate to you just how powerful this guy is.

Originally posted by carver9
Physically, Gladiator>Captain Marvel and this is going off of feats.

Gladiator would still lose though due to magic weakness.

Marvel 6/10

But gladiator is stronger, faster and more durable by a huge gap if you ask me.

facepalm

you're only going off gladiator's feats, not billy's.

Originally posted by carver9
Physically, Gladiator>Captain Marvel and this is going off of feats.

Gladiator would still lose though due to magic weakness.

Marvel 6/10

But gladiator is stronger, faster and more durable by a huge gap if you ask me.

when the **** did gladiator be specifically vulnerable to magic???

Originally posted by Lord Feron
when the **** did gladiator be specifically vulnerable to magic???

He has always been vulnerable to it, it was stated not to long ago. Thats why he got stabbed with that spear.

Originally posted by Lord Feron
when the **** did gladiator be specifically vulnerable to magic???

Originally posted by -Pr-
facepalm

you're only going off gladiator's feats, not billy's.

Whats up raoul, long time no debate.

I know both Billy and Glads and Glads feats are just better, especially his lifting and moving feats, along with his durability feats.

Originally posted by carver9
Whats up raoul, long time no debate.

I know both Billy and Glads and Glads feats are just better, especially his lifting and moving feats, along with his durability feats.

we never really actually "debate" though.

even if that were true, you don't consider their combat feats, no?

Originally posted by -Pr-
we never really actually "debate" though.

even if that were true, you don't consider their combat feats, no?

Glads combat speed>>>Billy. I have shown scans of him doing an entire combo in nanoseconds. Thats much faster than light.

I even put up scans where he blitzed at near light speed with him and the narrator saying it. Billy doesnt have those feats.

Originally posted by carver9
Glads combat speed>>>Billy. I have shown scans of him doing an entire combo in nanoseconds. Thats much faster than light.

I even put up scans where he blitzed at near light speed with him and the narrator saying it. Billy doesnt have those feats.

where are the scans?

Originally posted by carver9
Feats.

Gladiator feats and statements about his power are better.

One feat of him containing a solar system destroying blast should indicate to you just how powerful this guy is. We have seen him though beaten up by far less than this. We saw him sliced open in war of kings. We saw him overpowered by some character in a vulcan story. I can't remember his name off hand as it's been a while since I read the story. He's been downed by his own hv while the Hulk took it while his durability was taking a downturn in his own comic.

We also saw Masteron Thor almost beat him to death.

Originally posted by -Pr-
where are the scans?

Blitz at near lightspeed.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4850/32505489pi3.jpg

Did a series of combos in a nanosecond.

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/6687/39597113mf8.jpg

Now go ahead and discredit the feats.

Originally posted by carver9
Blitz at near lightspeed.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4850/32505489pi3.jpg

Did a series of combos in a nanosecond.

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/6687/39597113mf8.jpg

Now go ahead and discredit the feats.

that's not a blitz. heck, it's more a travel speed feat.

where's the combo? he tries to hit hyperion, only to be blocked. hyperion hits back. that aint no combo.

Originally posted by carver9
Blitz at near lightspeed.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4850/32505489pi3.jpg

Did a series of combos in a nanosecond.

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/6687/39597113mf8.jpg

Now go ahead and discredit the feats. F&%^ing lying

Originally posted by carver9
He has always been vulnerable to it, it was stated not to long ago. Thats why he got stabbed with that spear.

What really? I don't remember the last time someone hurt him with magic (or even triued to use magic against him).


Also the spear incident, I thought his durability went down after being tired, killing so many people. Guess I missed the "magic" part.

but seriously other than that spear incident (and im taking your word on that) When has he been hurt by magic? (not being a douche I just really wanted to know because I always thought that he only had one huge weakness)

Originally posted by quanchi112
We have seen him though beaten up by far less than this. We saw him sliced open in war of kings. We saw him overpowered by some character in a vulcan story. I can't remember his name off hand as it's been a while since I read the story. He's been downed by his own hv while the Hulk took it while his durability was taking a downturn in his own comic.

We also saw Masteron Thor almost beat him to death.

LOL, masterson thor snuck attack him with his weakness and dropped him. Master thor got CRUSHED that entire fight and you know that quanchi. Stop bringing that up as a low showing when we seen Gladiator standing over masterson thor laughing. He had the opportunity of killing him at any moment but decided to toy with him. That was a none fight.

Who was he over powered by in the vulcan story because to my knowledge he one shotted vulcan. One shotted one of the strongest skrulls on the battle field. One shotted warbird, someone that was killing the entire imperial guards with one blast and fought dozens of other people before being cheap shotted by a magical blade that stabbed him in the torso. The showings that you are talking about was good showings, I didnt see anything low about it.

LOL, please dont tell me you are using the hulk fight. The guy punched hulk a mile and then got up and started dusting his cloths off. How about this, show me gladiator fighting back or throwing more than one punch that entire fight.

Originally posted by -Pr-
that's not a blitz. heck, it's more a travel speed feat.

where's the combo? he tries to hit hyperion, only to be blocked. hyperion hits back. that aint no combo.

Read the scan Pr.

He flew to hyperion, punched him, hyperion punched back, he blocked the punch. All of this happened in nanoseconds.

Originally posted by carver9
Read the scan Pr.

He flew to hyperion, punched him, hyperion punched back, he blocked the punch. All of this happened in nanoseconds.

i did read the scan. it said he would hit him a few more times. was it shown?

no. it said a nanosecond later AFTER gladiator's punch. gladiator didn't cross that distance and punch him in a nanosecond, nor was it stated.

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, masterson thor snuck attack him with his weakness and dropped him. Master thor got CRUSHED that entire fight and you know that quanchi. Stop bringing that up as a low showing when we seen Gladiator standing over masterson thor laughing. He had the opportunity of killing him at any moment but decided to toy with him. That was a none fight.

Who was he over powered by in the vulcan story because to my knowledge he one shotted vulcan. One shotted one of the strongest skrulls on the battle field. One shotted warbird, someone that was killing the entire imperial guards with one blast and fought dozens of other people before being cheap shotted by a magical blade that stabbed him in the torso. The showings that you are talking about was good showings, I didnt see anything low about it.

LOL, please dont tell me you are using the hulk fight. The guy punched hulk a mile and then got up and started dusting his cloths off. How about this, show me gladiator fighting back or throwing more than one punch that entire fight. The point is he was almost beaten to death by Masterson and has nothing to do with who'd win in a fight. he did get lucky but this doesn't change Glads durability just his formidability.

The eldest one I think his name was.

Glads was helpless when Hulk redirected his own hv back into his face. You claimed his durability was miles better and it's not looking that way. You are impressed with feats which don't carry over to the battlefield. If Superman survives a mega bomb what blew up 8 planets he'd still get hurt by Thor's hammer and the same applies to Gladiator. you are all worked up by meaningless feats imo.

Originally posted by quanchi112
The point is he was almost beaten to death by Masterson and has nothing to do with who'd win in a fight. he did get lucky but this doesn't change Glads durability just his formidability.

The eldest one I think his name was.

Glads was helpless when Hulk redirected his own hv back into his face. You claimed his durability was miles better and it's not looking that way. You are impressed with feats which don't carry over to the battlefield. If Superman survives a mega bomb what blew up 8 planets he'd still get hurt by Thor's hammer and the same applies to Gladiator. you are all worked up by meaningless feats imo.

Thats not the point when it is meant for the hero to win. Masterson thor got crushed and he also got lucky that Gladiator decided to laugh instead of just taking him out of the fight. People was even mentioning during the fight that Masterson thor was fighting someone that was completely over his league.

The eldest one; oh, you are talking about the cheap shot when he stabbed gladiator after gladiator took out almost every villian that was there and busted through more. If you consider that a low showing, then hey, be my guess.

Gladiator didnt throw a single punch after hitting hulk off of him. If that doesnt tell you something quan then I dont know what does.

Originally posted by -Pr-
i did read the scan. it said he would hit him a few more times. was it shown?

no. it said a nanosecond later AFTER gladiator's punch. gladiator didn't cross that distance and punch him in a nanosecond, nor was it stated.

I guess we are reading the scans different then.

Originally posted by carver9
Thats not the point when it is meant for the hero to win. Masterson thor got crushed and he also got lucky that Gladiator decided to laugh instead of just taking him out of the fight. People was even mentioning during the fight that Masterson thor was fighting someone that was completely over his league.

The eldest one; oh, you are talking about the cheap shot when he stabbed gladiator after gladiator took out almost every villian that was there and busted through more. If you consider that a low showing, then hey, be my guess.

Gladiator didnt throw a single punch after hitting hulk off of him. If that doesnt tell you something quan then I dont know what does. Yes, in a fight Glads beats him and I agree. The point is his durability was nothing special as he was beaten senseless in a matter of moments with a rookie with the powers of Thor.

I consider it a showing of someone easily overpowering him. You asked for examples and I provided them. You overrate Glads' durability to the point of insanity.

The point is Hulk's durability was lower than usual yet one redirection of hv blast left Glads helpless to the Hulk. He carried him over to the reactor at this point. You claimed his durabiity was leagues better and I just took a dump on your case.

Originally posted by carver9
I guess we are reading the scans different then.

seems that way.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, in a fight Glads beats him and I agree. The point is his durability was nothing special as he was beaten senseless in a matter of moments with a rookie with the powers of Thor.

I consider it a showing of someone easily overpowering him. You asked for examples and I provided them. You overrate Glads' durability to the point of insanity.

The point is Hulk's durability was lower than usual yet one redirection of hv blast left Glads helpless to the Hulk. He carried him over to the reactor at this point. You claimed his durabiity was leagues better and I just took a dump on your case.

But you are not proving anything though. Your arguments are baseless.
The only reasonn Masterson Thor even posed a threat was due to him hitting Gladiator with his WEAKNESS and dropping him. Of course he can pound away on someone that he koed or incapitated with a blast, thats not hard to do but he still didnt have a scratch on him after all of that beating.

He wasnt easily overpowered though. He fought a thousand people before even facing him and got stabbed by a magical (yet again) blade and was still trying to fight. What was low about that? I agree, magic does hurt him but you have to do better than this quan to prove anything about his durability.

So you dont think having your heatvision directed back into your head wouldnt ko you and stop using that fight because its irrelevant. Gladiator wasnt even fighting the hulk.

Originally posted by -Pr-
seems that way.

But I'm right though since light moves 1 foot per second and gladiator did two moves in less than a nanosecond.

Originally posted by carver9
Blitz at near lightspeed.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4850/32505489pi3.jpg

Did a series of combos in a nanosecond.

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/6687/39597113mf8.jpg

Now go ahead and discredit the feats.

(Just randomly jumping into a thread out of curiosity)

I'm afraid I have to agree with Pr and other posters: those really are *not* good examples, as such, of a speed blitz attack; against Ego, that is a *flying speed* feat, not a combat speed feat (and - if CM were better in a vacuum setting - one that he could simulate, himself, as much like Diana, CM can attain sublight speed in flight - he just normally doesn't because much like WW he usually operates in an atmosphere, not empty space, as he isn't as readily designed to operate there); as for the fight with Hyperion, that is most *definetly*not* a speed blitz combo, at all -- in fact, it is stated in time as nanoseconds (plural) is the response time for *Hyperion* counter-attacking, not Glads covering the distance to Hyperion (which, as indicated by Hyp's recovery time, takes Glads several seconds to cover the distance between them) -- thus *not* making this combat attack FTL, but "merely" sub-light, and how Hyperion blocks and couterattacks (and is blocked in return) is exactly how I'd see that specific example playing out between CM and Glads.

As a disclaimer: usually I've noticed you are better at citing examples, Carver, and have to say I am a little disappointed in this particular set; you are definetly misinterpreting and misusing the examples you are citing in this specific case. No offense intended, just calling 'em like I see'em... I think if you go back and *truly* re-read your scans, you'll see that they aren't what you're claiming them to be. Again, no offense.

NOOoo. Your wrong. Light moves 7 around the planet in one second

Originally posted by carver9
But you are not proving anything though. Your arguments are baseless.
The only reasonn Masterson Thor even posed a threat was due to him hitting Gladiator with his WEAKNESS and dropping him. Of course he can pound away on someone that he koed or incapitated with a blast, thats not hard to do but he still didnt have a scratch on him after all of that beating.

He wasnt easily overpowered though. He fought a thousand people before even facing him and got stabbed by a magical (yet again) blade and was still trying to fight. What was low about that? I agree, magic does hurt him but you have to do better than this quan to prove anything about his durability.

So you dont think having your heatvision directed back into your head wouldnt ko you and stop using that fight because its irrelevant. Gladiator wasnt even fighting the hulk. What was his weakness? He got hit and set up for Masterson to pick him apart. You acted as if his durability was well above other top tiers. It isn't and never has been.

There was no magical blade when he fought against the Eldest One so I have no idea what it is you are addressing here.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Your posts don't make any sense. We go from talking about the Hulk vs. Gladiator to you saying they didn't fight. LOL.

Originally posted by tideoftime
(Just randomly jumping into a thread out of curiosity)

I'm afraid I have to agree with Pr and other posters: those really are *not* good examples, as such, of a speed blitz attack; against Ego, that is a *flying speed* feat, not a combat speed feat (and - if CM were better in a vacuum setting - one that he could simulate, himself, as much like Diana, CM can attain sublight speed in flight - he just normally doesn't because much like WW he usually operates in an atmosphere, not empty space, as he isn't as readily designed to operate there); as for the fight with Hyperion, that is most *definetly*not* a speed blitz combo, at all -- in fact, it is stated in time as nanoseconds (plural) is the response time for *Hyperion* counter-attacking, not Glads covering the distance to Hyperion (which, as indicated by Hyp's recovery time, takes Glads several seconds to cover the distance between them) -- thus *not* making this combat attack FTL, but "merely" sub-light, and how Hyperion blocks and couterattacks (and is blocked in return) is exactly how I'd see that specific example playing out between CM and Glads.

As a disclaimer: usually I've noticed you are better at citing examples, Carver, and have to say I am a little disappointed in this particular set; you are definetly misinterpreting and misusing the examples you are citing in this specific case. No offense intended, just calling 'em like I see'em... I think if you go back and *truly* re-read your scans, you'll see that they aren't what you're claiming them to be. Again, no offense.

I agree with the statement of the vacuum of space and flight and I also agree with gladiator flying at hyperion which isnt included in the nanoseconds but the two moves after that was.

Originally posted by carver9
Blitz at near lightspeed.

http://img354.imageshack.us/img354/4850/32505489pi3.jpg

Did a series of combos in a nanosecond.

http://img68.imageshack.us/img68/6687/39597113mf8.jpg

Now go ahead and discredit the feats.
What? That isn't a speed blitz... More Like traveling at near lightspeed...

And a combo in nanoseconds... WTF he blocks that ain't no combo.

Originally posted by quanchi112
What was his weakness? He got hit and set up for Masterson to pick him apart. You acted as if his durability was well above other top tiers. It isn't and never has been.

There was no magical blade when he fought against the Eldest One so I have no idea what it is you are addressing here.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Your posts don't make any sense. We go from talking about the Hulk vs. Gladiator to you saying they didn't fight. LOL.

Magic is his weakness and Masterson thor hit him with a magical lighting which koed him.

I'm getting the fight mixed up, I know which one you are talking about. I still dont consider that a low showing. Its kind of like when titus and konvikt first fought the jla, we had no indication of his power, we just went by him crushing the jla and this is the same case. The eldest one was too strong for the imperial guards (including gladiator) so they were unable to physically beat him. So that basically gave us an indication on how strong the eldest one was.

What I'm telling you and what I have been saying the entire time is that the hulk and the gladiator fight shouldnt be brought up since it wasnt even a fight (gladiator wasnt even trying).

Originally posted by ares834
What? That isn't a speed blitz... More Like traveling at near lightspeed...

And a combo in nanoseconds... WTF he blocks that ain't no combo.

I already agreed with 99 on this, its more of a travel feat but punching and reacting at nanoseconds is light speed.

Raoul, I would love for you to show me Captain Marvel being able to react/move at nano second speed.

Here are other speed feats and I would love for you to show me some Captain marvel speed feats.

He bounce cannonball all over the place and raps him up in steel instantly.

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/8748/canuo8.jpg

http://img5.imageshack.us/i/71744606.jpg/
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8125/65500345.jpg

Originally posted by carver9
Raoul, I would love for you to show me Captain Marvel being able to react/move at nano second speed.

Here are other speed feats and I would love for you to show me some Captain marvel speed feats.

He bounce cannonball all over the place and raps him up in steel instantly.

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/8748/canuo8.jpg

http://img5.imageshack.us/i/71744606.jpg/
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8125/65500345.jpg

do you make it a point to misrepresent scans?

Didny expect Carver to be repping Glads!!

Originally posted by quanchi112
What was his weakness? He got hit and set up for Masterson to pick him apart. You acted as if his durability was well above other top tiers. It isn't and never has been.

There was no magical blade when he fought against the Eldest One so I have no idea what it is you are addressing here.

I have no idea what you are talking about. Your posts don't make any sense. We go from talking about the Hulk vs. Gladiator to you saying they didn't fight. LOL.

Quan, this is for you.

Takes out binary with one punch and just walks through her attacks (high herald binary).

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/146/60603030cg2.jpg

Rips through vulcan and yet again, walks through his attacks.

http://img355.imageshack.us/i/89200274nk8.jpg/

Take out the entire nova corpse.

http://img2.imageshack.us/img2/9594/nova3.jpg
http://img297.imageshack.us/img297/9054/nova4.jpg

Takes it to two beings that was one shotting the imperial guards with a single punch.

http://img190.imageshack.us/img190/9112/86433487.jpg
http://img218.imageshack.us/img218/8752/52609522.jpg

I can post the rest if you want. Gladiator busting through everyone.

Originally posted by -Pr-
do you make it a point to misrepresent scans?

What did I misrepresent?

Originally posted by Nihilist
Didny expect Carver to be repping Glads!!

Shut up

Originally posted by carver9
What did I misrepresent?

you claimed him vs cannonball was a speedfeat.

him blitzing a bunch of people with no real speed themselves is something wolverine does all the time, and yet its supposed to be impressive?

Originally posted by carver9
Shut up

In the last SHAZAM mini, Billy had to move beyond light speed to enter the ROE.

Originally posted by -Pr-
you claimed him vs cannonball was a speedfeat.

him blitzing a bunch of people with no real speed themselves is something wolverine does all the time, and yet its supposed to be impressive?

The imperex probes didnt have any speed or has any kind of speed feats but you use Superman blitzing it as a combat speed feat. People from Black lightning to aquaman outmaneauverd it.

Also, Superman fought a weakened Doomsday Rex that was getting weakened by the second and you still used that showing as a speed feat.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
In the last SHAZAM mini, Billy had to move beyond light speed to enter the ROE.

Here we go using caculations again.

Originally posted by carver9
Here we go using caculations again.

huh?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
huh?

Not having a real indication on how fast character "A" was going, just basing things off of him flying to this area due to it just being part of the story and not truly being a speed feat based on from the writer (basically just adding on to the story).

Originally posted by carver9
Raoul, I would love for you to show me Captain Marvel being able to react/move at nano second speed.

Here are other speed feats and I would love for you to show me some Captain marvel speed feats.

He bounce cannonball all over the place and raps him up in steel instantly.

http://img368.imageshack.us/img368/8748/canuo8.jpg

http://img5.imageshack.us/i/71744606.jpg/
http://img19.imageshack.us/img19/8125/65500345.jpg

Okay, now *those* are better examples of a speed blitz. Kudos.

However...

They are against people who don't have *remotely* high-end superspeed; nothing that was demonstrated in those scans isn't something that CM couldn't replicate, easily. I'll leave it to others to provide scans, as I am not arguing any particular bias, as such, one way or the other, but was merely disheartened at your first set of examples. This set is a better example, but not on point, as such, in context to other uber-speedsters, like CM, et al...

To my knowledge, Captain Marvel always had to reach lightspeed in order to reach the Rock of Eternity.

Originally posted by carver9
Not having a real indication on how fast character "A" was going, just basing things off of him flying to this area due to it just being part of the story and not truly being a speed feat based on from the writer (basically just adding on to the story).

Like this?

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/DCChallenge-005-19.jpg

Originally posted by tideoftime
Okay, now *those* are better examples of a speed blitz. Kudos.

However...

They are against people who don't have *remotely* high-end superspeed; nothing that was demonstrated in those scans isn't something that CM couldn't replicate, easily. I'll leave it to others to provide scans, as I am not arguing any particular bias, as such, one way or the other, but was merely disheartened at your first set of examples. This set is a better example, but not on point, as such, in context to other uber-speedsters, like CM, et al...

But every speed feat that is shown from high heralds is shown against people that does not pertain any speed.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Like this?

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii315/darkseidres2/DCChallenge-005-19.jpg

Yeah, like that (even though that precrisis).

Originally posted by carver9
The imperex probes didnt have any speed or has any kind of speed feats but you use Superman blitzing it as a combat speed feat. People from Black lightning to aquaman outmaneauverd it.

the imperiex probes tagged plenty of people with speed, though, like wally, for instance.

Originally posted by carver9
Also, Superman fought a weakened Doomsday Rex that was getting weakened by the second and you still used that showing as a speed feat.

doomsday rex wasn't weaknened, and doomsday has always had comparable reflexes to superman.

Originally posted by carver9
Yeah, like that (even though that precrisis).

Still proves that he can go beyond light speed. Which cap can do.

Originally posted by -Pr-
the imperiex probes tagged plenty of people with speed, though, like wally, for instance.



doomsday rex wasn't weaknened, and doomsday has always had comparable reflexes to superman.

Are we talking about the same imperex probes that struggled to take out black lightning and a weakened Supergirl?

The imperex probes were slow.

It was stated that doomsday rex was being weakened. Superman even said this.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Still proves that he can go beyond light speed. Which cap can do.

Prove that he still contain that speed.

Marvel wins, Glads aint fast enough to compete.

Originally posted by carver9
Prove that he still contain that speed.

Prove that he cannot. In last SHAZAM 4 issues he went light speed for a long time to reach ROE.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Marvel wins, Glads aint fast enough to compete.

LOL, , Cant wait to see these speed feats. You all are saying things without backing your statements up.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Prove that he cannot. In last SHAZAM 4 issues he went light speed for a long time to reach ROE.

Its precrisis feats. Its up for you to prove that he still has those abilities.

Prove that the feat that you mentioned is light speed. Post the feat.

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, , Cant wait to see these speed feats. You all are saying things without backing your statements up. You think i was serious mariofacepalm

Originally posted by Nihilist
You think i was serious mariofacepalm

I'm sorry

Originally posted by carver9
I'm sorry It's ok friendslikethese

Originally posted by carver9
Its precrisis feats. Its up for you to prove that he still has those abilities.

Prove that the feat that you mentioned is light speed. Post the feat.

I said LAST SHAZAM mini. Keep up. BTW, it's in continuity.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I said LAST SHAZAM mini. Keep up. BTW, it's in continuity.

Show me some speed feats from Captain Marvel besides precrisis.

I don't have the SHAZAM mini scans with me, so no luck. Justice seemed to have a bunch of speed feats, but I'm not sure if that is in continuity.

Originally posted by carver9
Are we talking about the same imperex probes that struggled to take out black lightning and a weakened Supergirl?

The imperex probes were slow.

It was stated that doomsday rex was being weakened. Superman even said this.

they didn't struggle, so i don't know where you're getting that.

no, they weren't.

weakened because he could understand the concept of fear?

Originally posted by -Pr-
they didn't struggle, so i don't know where you're getting that.

no, they weren't.

weakened because he could understand the concept of fear?

Supergirl and Black lightning stalled an imperex probe and again that Supergirl was nothing. The imperex probe died by a blast that wasnt even the size of a small nuke.

Aquaman defeated an imperex probe. They had no speed, I dont know where you get the idea that they did. The imperex probes isnt as close to be impressive as you are making them out to be. Didnt two of them get there heads taken off by a space ship?

Again, Superman said that he was weakening. His strength along with his speed was deplinishing and it was leaving him fast. Superman wouldnt have said that he wasnt weakening if he couldnt tell.

Gladiator wins. too strong and fast for CM. Combat speed and reaction speed goes to gladiator. But i would like to clear up the term (speedblitz). A speedblitz is when a character reaches his/her target before that target can react or attack, there is no such thing as a speedblitz without travel speed. Gladiator has blitz a radiation machine at near-light speed and carried a massive spaceship out of thors sight in an instant. Also he has a documented travel speed of 100 times lightspeed.

2. Using fights were a character loses to the hero or main character? I see a lot of people use fights were a person has to lose to maintain a storyline. Just like people use low feats for one character, then use high feats for the other. Gladiator has the powerset to beat thor and hulk, but he will lose in the comics because he is not the hero. He will not come to save the earth nor really care what happens to it or its people.

3. One character blitz yet the other bullrush?
How can two character that speed towards a foe be classified as two different approaches? One attacks at near light speed, yet its a bullrush? The other attacks at an unknown speed and its a speedblitz?

4. Conclusion.
Throwing out the comics and what happened in a writer controlled fight. One must use a characters powerset and what is known of them to do. Thus its is very easy to make a claim who would and should win. CM has never displayed the power to destroy a planet, nor the ability to fly at 100 times lightspeed, nor be able to carry a spaceship the size of texas out of sight in an instant. Also the confident thing about gladiator is wrong. Gladiator also has heatvision hotter than stars and freeze breath to use. Since they will be fighting at their best, due to gladiators many advantages... He wins this fight 9/10.

Marvel took a beating from Spectre and stood up to 5-d Demons and energy. I doubt Glads has what it takes to put down Billy. And if Billy decides to amp up his strength and other atributes, Gladiator will have even a harder time.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Marvel took a beating from Spectre and stood up to 5-d Demons and energy. I doubt Glads has what it takes to put down Billy. And if Billy decides to amp up his strength and other atributes, Gladiator will have even a harder time. You are missing the point about writer controlled events.. If i make a thread about CM vs Spectra to the death outside of a comic, who would win?

Spectre, of course. And he was going to kill him.

Originally posted by carver9
Supergirl and Black lightning stalled an imperex probe and again that Supergirl was nothing. The imperex probe died by a blast that wasnt even the size of a small nuke.

Aquaman defeated an imperex probe. They had no speed, I dont know where you get the idea that they did. The imperex probes isnt as close to be impressive as you are making them out to be. Didnt two of them get there heads taken off by a space ship?

Again, Superman said that he was weakening. His strength along with his speed was deplinishing and it was leaving him fast. Superman wouldnt have said that he wasnt weakening if he couldnt tell.

that's not true.

aquaman killed it by breaching it's shell. that's it. not a hard thing to do when you have a MAGICAL TRIDENT AND ARMOUR.

he was talking about his fear. nothing else, iirc.

Back to speed feats from glads.

In an instante his fist becomes and blur of whirling fist (stated by the narrator). Then during all of this punching, he picks up an iron bar and hits reed.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=5560542

Originally posted by -Pr-
that's not true.

aquaman killed it by breaching it's shell. that's it. not a hard thing to do when you have a MAGICAL TRIDENT AND ARMOUR.

he was talking about his fear. nothing else, iirc.

OMG, , Whats not true? Wonder Womans mother didnt take two imperex probes head of with a ship? I could have sworn thats what I saw. What else isnt true, that the blast didnt have the power of a nuke? Were they not fighting by a base? Wasnt that base still in tact after the blast went off? Wasnt black lightning still standing after the blast? Now prove that the blast had more power than a nuke?

OMG, It was pretty plain and clear that THAT doomsday was extremely weaker than his other counterparts. Post the scans.

Originally posted by carver9
Back to speed feats from glads.

In an instante his fist becomes and blur of whirling fist (stated by the narrator). Then during all of this punching, he picks up an iron bar and hits reed.
http://www.killermovies.com/forums/attachment.php?s=&postid=5560542

Not very impressive.

Justice's Cap and Barry:

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/17/scan10061vc2.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/756/scan10062joinmw8.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/3465/scan10064xu6.jpg

Fighting a bunch of villains at super-speed.

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/5580/justice06005ys0.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/7396/justice07005do8.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/2150/justice08005fk7.jpg

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Not very impressive.

How about this? In earths gravity, he disarms a delta particle device at near light speed.

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/7296/hyperspeed11mv.jpg

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Justice's Cap and Barry:

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/17/scan10061vc2.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/756/scan10062joinmw8.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/3465/scan10064xu6.jpg

None cannon. Tried using these scans but I got wailed on.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Fighting a bunch of villains at super-speed.

http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/5580/justice06005ys0.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/7396/justice07005do8.jpg
http://img248.imageshack.us/img248/2150/justice08005fk7.jpg

None cannon. I tried using these scans also and got ripped up.

Like I said, it's non cannon, but he's flown faster to get to the ROE. which IS cannon.

How about this? He has been operating since his return for hours at hyper speed. Moving at Super speed constantly.

http://img67.imageshack.us/img67/8585/hyperspeed35nr.jpg

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Like I said, it's non cannon, but he's flown faster to get to the ROE. which IS cannon.

Gladiator flight speed is more impressive since he has flown 100 times the speed of light. I'm not asking for that (and I dont even think its a light speed scan), I want you to show me what I'm showing you and stop showing me scans that means nothing.

Originally posted by carver9
Are we talking about the same imperex probes that struggled to take out black lightning and a weakened Supergirl?

The imperex probes were slow.

It was stated that doomsday rex was being weakened. Superman even said this.

Low balling again? The imperiex Probe who faught Superman seemed pretty fast. The Probe that took on Zod and his Army, and gave them a beating seemed strong, etc.

IMO Imperiex Probes ranged from, Mid-High Herald if not higher.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Low balling again? The imperiex Probe who faught Superman seemed pretty fast. The Probe that took on Zod and his Army, and gave them a beating seemed strong, etc.

IMO Imperiex Probes ranged from, Mid-High Herald if not higher.

Who am I low balling, the imperex probes? Everything that I told you was true. Them getting one shotted by a space ship. Them getting taken out by black lightning and a weak Supergirl. Them getting taken out by Wonderwoman with a shield to the back of the head. Them getting taken out by aquaman.

They were slow but I agree on one thing, the output of power that they had was pretty impressive.

Its nothing low balling about the truth. The imperex probes sucked.

By the way, show me a speed feat from the probes that makes anyone think that they have speed. Dont bring up the flash since he has been tagged by deathstroke, gorilla grod, batman, titus, konvikt, hell, almost everyone in dc has tagged the flash.

Show me some real speed feats from a probe besides telliing me that it has speed.

Originally posted by carver9
Who am I low balling, the imperex probes? Everything that I told you was true. Them getting one shotted by a space ship. Them getting taken out by black lightning and a weak Supergirl. Them getting taken out by Wonderwoman with a shield to the back of the head. Them getting taken out by aquaman.

They were slow but I agree on one thing, the output of power that they had was pretty impressive.

Its nothing low balling about the truth. The imperex probes sucked.

Black lighting did it all alone? Supergirl did it all alone? Aquaman did it without special devices? WW's mom did it without special devices?

That is low balling. Saying Black lightining took one out without mentioning that he didn't do it on his own, without telling the special circumstances.
It's like saying Aunt may took Spiderman out, without telling the people that she shoot him in the head while he was unconscious.

Originally posted by carver9
By the way, show me a speed feat from the probes that makes anyone think that they have speed. Dont bring up the flash since he has been tagged by deathstroke, gorilla grod, batman, titus, konvikt, hell, almost everyone in dc has tagged the flash.

Show me some real speed feats from a probe besides telliing me that it has speed.

http://s673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/?action=view&current=probesupes14.jpg

Originally posted by carver9
Gladiator flight speed is more impressive since he has flown 100 times the speed of light. I'm not asking for that (and I dont even think its a light speed scan), I want you to show me what I'm showing you and stop showing me scans that means nothing.

And he's still been taged by the likes of the Hulk. Gladiator doesn't always use speed in fights.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Black lighting did it all alone? Supergirl did it all alone? Aquaman did it without special devices? WW's mom did it without special devices?

That is low balling. Saying Black lightining took one out without mentioning that he didn't do it on his own, without telling the special circumstances.
It's like saying Aunt may took Spiderman out, without telling the people that she shoot him in the head while he was unconscious.



http://s673.photobucket.com/albums/vv95/galanphotos/?action=view&current=probesupes14.jpg

Where is the speed feat at and didnt if you actually read my post, I said that the imperex probe that was stalemated by Supergirl and Black lightning got taken out by a blast that didnt even have the power of a small nuke.

That scan isnt a speed feat.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
And he's still been taged by the likes of the Hulk. Gladiator doesn't always use speed in fights.

I know he doesnt but the point of my entire argument is that he is stronger, faster, and more durable than Captain Marvel.

Originally posted by carver9
Where is the speed feat at and didnt if you actually read my post, I said that the imperex probe that was stalemated by Supergirl and Black lightning got taken out by a blast that didnt even have the power of a small nuke.

That scan isnt a speed feat.

Look at it.

Originally posted by carver9
I know he doesnt but the point of my entire argument is that he is stronger, faster, and more durable than Captain Marvel.

Not more durable. Stronger, by a small hair. Faster? Nope.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Look at it.

LOL, I looked at it; what do I suppose to see, them showing Superman and a imperex probe punching at each other? I hope you dont consider that fight to be after images (please tell me you dont think that).

Originally posted by carver9
LOL, I looked at it; what do I suppose to see, them showing Superman and a imperex probe punching at each other? I hope you dont consider that fight to be after images (please tell me you dont think that).

No I don't think that, but you still haven't looked at it for more then a second have you?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Not more durable. Stronger, by a small hair. Faster? Nope.

I showed you gladiator reacting at nanoseconds, blitzing near light speed, doing work and moving for hours at hyper speed, him doing a series of punches instantly. Him wrapping cannonball in a thick barrell of iron instantly, him blitzing a horde of people before they had the chance to react and what have you shown me? Shit.

I like the way people debate around here, its amusing.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
No I don't think that, but you still haven't looked at it for more then a second have you?

I own the comic and again, thats not a speed feat. What make you think that its a speed feat?

And yet Cannonball managed to get some hits. Hulk managed to kick his ass even though his weakness is radiation, etc... Gladiator = jobber.

Can Gladiator stand up to 5-D science? Don't think so.

Originally posted by carver9
I own the comic and again, thats not a speed feat. What make you think that its a speed feat?

If you don't see it shrug I see no hope for you.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
And yet Cannonball managed to get some hits. Hulk managed to kick his ass even though his weakness is radiation, etc... Gladiator = jobber.

Can Gladiator stand up to 5-D science? Don't think so.

Cannonball got some licks? , Have you even seen the fight? Cannonball got ONE LICK and that lick was when Gladiator was about to punch Cannonball to the core of the sun and Cannonball absorbed that entire punch and hit gladiator back with it. Now answer this, who wouldnt that trick work on?

Did you see the Hulk fight? Gladiator didnt throw not one punch during that fight and he was dusting off his clothing because he got dirt on it.

Originally posted by Batman-Prime
If you don't see it shrug I see no hope for you.

Tell me what I'm suppose to see.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
And yet Cannonball managed to get some hits. Hulk managed to kick his ass even though his weakness is radiation, etc... Gladiator = jobber.

Can Gladiator stand up to 5-D science? Don't think so. Using low feats for gladiator and high feats for CM is not the way to debate. Thats like me using a scan of superman struggling with the daily globe, and hyperion lifting a mountain.

Originally posted by carver9
Cannonball got some licks? , Have you even seen the fight? Cannonball got ONE LICK and that lick was when Gladiator was about to punch Cannonball to the core of the sun and Cannonball absorbed that entire punch and hit gladiator back with it. Now answer this, who wouldnt that trick work on?

Did you see the Hulk fight? Gladiator didnt throw not one punch during that fight and he was dusting off his clothing because he got dirt on it.

My point was that Cannonball was able to keep up. I didn't see the Gladiator moving 100x the speed of light, because if he were, Cannonball would have lost in a single panel. Speed won't be a factor in the fight for either billy or glads. Both move beyond the speed of light and both are exremely durable and strong. So, speed won't be a factor.

Originally posted by RIVER-OF-POWER
Using low feats for gladiator and high feats for CM is not the way to debate. Thats like me using a scan of superman struggling with the daily globe, and hyperion lifting a mountain.

How many times has Gladiator moved 100x the speed of light against an opponent? I don't see it often.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
How many times has Gladiator moved 100x the speed of light against an opponent? I don't see it often. In a comic book, if gladiator, superman, flash or WW use their full speed to fight, the book would be very short and not many characters could be matched up against them. Writers must overlook those advantages to make a storyline. There is no storyline on KMC. Match cannonball against gladiator here, and cannonball dies before he can move.

Originally posted by RIVER-OF-POWER
In a comic book, if gladiator, superman, flash or WW use their full speed to fight, the book would be very short and not many characters could be matched up against them. Writers must overlook those advantages to make a storyline. There is no storyline on KMC. Match cannonball against gladiator here, and cannonball dies before he can move.

I understand this, but my point is that Gladiator's not going to speed blitz Cap, especially since Cap can move fast as well. Gladiator might have a small speed edge, but it's not by a big margin.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
My point was that Cannonball was able to keep up. I didn't see the Gladiator moving 100x the speed of light, because if he were, Cannonball would have lost in a single panel. Speed won't be a factor in the fight for either billy or glads. Both move beyond the speed of light and both are exremely durable and strong. So, speed won't be a factor.

Would you like for me to post the fight for you because I dont think you see the cannonball fight? Gladiator wasnt fighting cannonball, that was made plain and clear throughout the comic. When he did use his speed, cannonball was like "how fast are you" and that was when gladiator wrapped him up in iron instantly.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
How many times has Gladiator moved 100x the speed of light against an opponent? I don't see it often.

I never said that gladiator would fight at 100 times the speed of light but I did post two scans of him blitzing in an environment at near light speed and showing him doing about 6 punches instantly and showing him reacting at nanoseconds. Can you do the same for Captain Marvel?

Originally posted by Prep-Man
I understand this, but my point is that Gladiator's not going to speed blitz Cap, especially since Cap can move fast as well. Gladiator might have a small speed edge, but it's not by a big margin. Yes it is. CM has never in his creation move anywhere near 10 times the speed of light. Thor has a speed feat of 3 times the speed of light on record. Not even superman has that on record.

My point this entire time is that Gladiator is stronger (true planet buster and he moved a comet that was blocking a star lane with pure strength and also lifted the baxter building without the aid of flight), more durable (survived a solar system destroying blast point blank, in the face, swim in stars, etc..), and faster (he's one of the few that actually have faster than light showings in comics, especially in an environment that has atmosphere).

Cap has exceeded many times light to enter ROE.

Originally posted by carver9
My point this entire time is that Gladiator is stronger (true planet buster and he moved a comet that was blocking a star lane with pure strength and also lifted the baxter building without the aid of flight), more durable (survived a solar system destroying blast point blank, in the face, swim in stars, etc..), and faster (he's one of the few that actually have faster than light showings in comics, especially in an environment that has atmosphere).

Cap has endured the Spear of Destiny, survived a battle with Spectre, and endured 5-D science. I say Cap is overall more durable than Gladiator.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Cap has exceeded many times light to enter ROE.

Show me.

Originally posted by carver9
Show me.

Read Jeff Smith's SHAZAM Monsters of Evil.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Cap has endured the Spear of Destiny, survived a battle with Spectre, and endured 5-D science. I say Cap is overall more durable than Gladiator.

Now I agree with this BUT its kind of hard to use what you said in a debate like this because if he survived everything that you said, then that mean that people like Wonder Woman, Supes, and Orion shouldnt even have the power or strength to KO him. Is that what you are saying?

I think you should base things off of true durability showings like piercing, blasts, etc.... because I could easily show Gladiator tanking attacks from Tyrant.

Originally posted by carver9
Now I agree with this BUT its kind of hard to use what you said in a debate like this because if he survived everything that you said, then that mean that people like Wonder Woman, Supes, and Orion shouldnt even have the power or strength to KO him. Is that what you are saying?

I think you should base things off of true durability showings like piercing, blasts, etc.... because I could easily show Gladiator tanking attacks from Tyrant.

That 5-D incident was a BLAST. And it was even mentioned that beings like Wonder Woman, Superman, and Martian Manhunter couldn't survive such an explosion and energy output. ONLY Cap.