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Because Screampaste needed somewhere to expose his GoW fanboy without lollinklove getting in the way.

Kratos finds himself traveling to the East in search of a way to bring down Mt. Olympus. On the way he runs into Ryu Hayabusa, who was deceived into believing a gaijin had taken the dragon sword. Both are out for blood.

Kratos has access to his magic, his full combat abilities, and his equipment including the Blade of Olympus. Ryu has his various weapons, his ninpo (that's his ninja magic stuff, yah?), and his own skills. Can the speedy ninja make Kratos dine in hell, or will the Spartan be the facilitator another unending rivalry?

Been done before. Kratos still wins to my knowlege; physically stronger, more durable, a more versatile arsenal, better magic and weapons (plot-based and otherwise) and his only disadvantage is speed, which is utterly nullified in the composite comparison (being the God of War), along with the fact that he's dealt with things like teleportation.

It could be a fist-fight, a second specialty of Hayabusa, and Kratos would still probably win.

I'll give this to Kratos. He has the Golden Fleece for the projectiles and AoE attacks if Ryu wants to go near him. Finally, there's Rage of the Titans and Prometheus Torment.

Kratos gets move vote.

The only advantage Ryu has here is speed, but that will just allow him to live a bit longer. Kratos takes it.

Ryu has very similar durability feats and much greater speed feats. Additionally he wields the Dragon Sword which has the potential to destroy the world. He can also throw a small black hole as a projectile. I would say that his defeat of the Vigoor Emperor and the Dark Dragon Blade alone is beyond the abilities of Kratos.

I have much in the way of durability feats from Ryu. I've seen his speed, but his speed won't be enough. Kratos somehow beats Hermes whose speed feats in GOW 3 put him above Dante levels from what I've seen in an off-screen video.

Perhaps. Hermes does run down a mountain, and Poseidon is able to break the sound barrier while flying (?). Hermes is bound to be faster than Poseidon.

Kratos then gets Hermes' sandals, which will most likely amp his speed.

Hermes is fast, but he MAY not be as fast as Dante (Dante outran a car, btw).

yvqZyRIsbEw

You guys are deeply underestimating Ryu here.

Durability: Survives multiple megaton explosions that level the area he's at. Falls from ridiculous heights with no damage. Can take multiple tank shells at point blank range. Explosions that demolish entire buildings(cathedral and bell tower) without taking a scratch (Alma 1st form, and whoever the fire god is).

Reaction time: He's fast enough to block every single bullet from a mini gun mounted on the side of a helicopter. Dodges Missiles in midair while throwing black holes at the aircraft that fired them.

I need to play the games again, I'm sure I can come up with 9001 more feats are extremely impressive. He basically does what Kratos does in GoW but without any power beyond his own and the Dragon Sword.

Originally posted by iChaos
Hermes is fast, but he MAY not be as fast as Dante (Dante outran a car, btw).

yvqZyRIsbEw

That video shows exactly why he's FASTER than Dante.

He goes up a completely vertical chain in an absolute blur. His speed in short bursts looks the same as if he's teleporting.

And he runs down Mt. Olympus casually.

*in my first post I meant to say I have NOT see much in the way of durability for Ryu. Typo sorry.

Originally posted by iChaos
Hermes is fast, but he MAY not be as fast as Dante (Dante outran a car, btw).

yvqZyRIsbEw

Outrunning a car isn't his best feat by far. Dante also runs down the side of a building (perhaps he moves faster), but Hermes is able to run up a really long-a** chain. He also has movements that appear Arkham-like.

I don't remember Dante's feats in 4, but he hasn't got such a feat in the other games.

Originally posted by Cyner
You guys are deeply underestimating Ryu here.

Durability: Survives multiple megaton explosions that level the area he's at. Falls from ridiculous heights with no damage. Can take multiple tank shells at point blank range. Explosions that demolish entire buildings(cathedral and bell tower) without taking a scratch (Alma 1st form, and whoever the fire god is).

Reaction time: He's fast enough to block every single bullet from a mini gun mounted on the side of a helicopter. Dodges Missiles in midair while throwing black holes at the aircraft that fired them.

I need to play the games again, I'm sure I can come up with 9001 more feats are extremely impressive. He basically does what Kratos does in GoW but without any power beyond his own and the Dragon Sword.

What are these multiple megaton explosions? The only one I can think of is possibly that guy he beats on a volcano. But it doesn't even seem like it actually hit Ryu. From what I recall the guy blew up in the air, and Ryu would have been below the blast. If he took it, it most definitely wasn't point blank. Did he ever canonically get hit by tank shells at all? Or Alma's blast?

How far has he fallen, I can't remember? Kratos falls so far in God of War 1 after Ares sucked him into the vortex that he caused a crater upon landing.

Hold on a sec, full access to all abilities mean God Kratos in this thread, right?

Originally posted by CosmicComet
That video shows exactly why he's FASTER than Dante.

He goes up a completely vertical chain in an absolute blur. His speed in short bursts looks the same as if he's teleporting.

And he runs down Mt. Olympus casually.



Which is why I said "MAY". It doesn't show how fasts he hits.

Isn't Ryu Hayabusa faster than Dante?

This is an interesting set up, but I think Kratos main advantage is not his reaction time, which is questionable compared to Ryu's speed, but the head of medusa.

Hasn't this been done before?

Is Ryu or Hermes faster than this?

xEc69a8K3Lk

I don't know about Hermes as I don't have GoW3 yet and I refuse to watch that video. Anyway, Cyner posted pretty good feats in Ryu so it's a stalemate in my POV until I see what else Kratos can do in GoW3.

If you want to see cutscene feats only start here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-JpRQVlFLqs

then click on video response after each vid, goes up to 6 i believe.

Actually it goes up to 14, some pretty good stuff in there.

Hell just read the wiki or something. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ryu_Hayabusa

Ryu is just being greatly underestimated in this fight. Research must be done! (goes to find a copy of NG2 for purchase)

I maintain Ryu is probably much faster than Dante.

Originally posted by fascistcrusader
Hold on a sec, full access to all abilities mean God Kratos in this thread, right?

Full access to all combat abilities. God Kratos is not a combat ability, it's an amp.

Originally posted by Sin_Volvagia
Is Ryu or Hermes faster than this?

xEc69a8K3Lk

I don't know about Hermes as I don't have GoW3 yet and I refuse to watch that video. Anyway, Cyner posted pretty good feats in Ryu so it's a stalemate in my POV until I see what else Kratos can do in GoW3. Maybe not faster, but he is around that level cutscene-wise:

1:271qsbHqeLz3IsuBFY39P4Ps

Not saying Ryu is faster, but without Quicksilver, they are around the same level.

Ryu's speed and finesse would overcome Kratos. If I had to pick one guy of the two to get out of an impossible situation, I'd pick Ryu.

Oh by the way, I will say that the creator of the Gaidens (Tomonubu Itagaki, who sadly left Tecmo after NG2 for the Xbox 360 was finished) said that the gameplay represents Ryu's capabilities, meaning, one shouldn't go around and say "that is gameplay" when someone posts a video of Ninja Gaiden gameplay. Director himself said it's representative of Hayabusa.

Of course, that's not to say there aren't glitches, but I think it's obvious what is a glitch and what isn't in Ninja Gaiden. I may look for the video of this (seen it myself, but like 5 years ago lol) later, because that will not be an easy find. I once spent an hour trying to find it on youtube. I'll find it later if I care enough.

Doesn't matter how fast he is, really. Kratos has the head of medusa.

The faster you are, the lesser chance you have of being stoned, right?

Originally posted by iChaos
The faster you are, the lesser chance you have of being stoned, right?

Not if Kratos uses the instant-petrification rays.

Ryu can teleport behind him before then and give him the stone cold stunner.

Not before Kratos drops Poseidon's Rage. Hewouldn't even need a Gorgon head to beat Hayabusa. That, and teleporting didn't help Ares or Zeus; it won't help Hayabusa.

There's still no way Kratos can catch Hayabusa, really.

I should find you guys some videos of the boss fights so you guys can see the kind of power his enemies wield.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dz1LwAEHJwk
:58 - 1:32

just a small showing.

Titans cause more damage than that by walking.

(GoWIII spoiler): And Kratos kills at least three (That, and Poseidon's death causes a tsunami).

Where are you guys getting these spoiler from?

Leaked info/videos from people who have the game already.

Originally posted by FWahMaN
Ryu can teleport behind him before then and give him the stone cold stunner.
Originally posted by ScreamPaste
There's still no way Kratos can catch Hayabusa, really.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Leaked info/videos from people who have the game already. Where?

Let me guess Hayabusa is going to stab Kratos in the back?

Ryu doesn't have the strength to hurt Kratos with a slash. Kratos has some epic durability feats coming up.

Just wait till GoW3 comes out. This is a massive mismatch truly.

Originally posted by Phanteros
Where?

Pretty much just youtube.

Hell, one user has an HD walkthrough that's up to part 13 (as I post this).

Kratos is gonna take over when GoW3 is out

How strong is Ryu?

Can't remember any Ryu strength feats off the bat. All I remember was that he is able to wield massive, likely 100 lbs blades like the Dabilharo and DDB, as if they were much lighter than that.

So he's clearly very well past peak human.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Ryu doesn't have the strength to hurt Kratos with a slash. Kratos has some epic durability feats coming up.

Just wait till GoW3 comes out. This is a massive mismatch truly.

I can't wait. I'd love to know what happens to the Titans.

Then Ryu would be able to get some good damage on him.

^Absolutely not.

Because..?

Originally posted by Phanteros
Where?

If you watch the opening of GoWIII, you won't be able to resist watching. RajmanGamingHD is the user FT was talking about.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Ryu doesn't have the strength to hurt Kratos with a slash. Kratos has some epic durability feats coming up.

Just wait till GoW3 comes out. This is a massive mismatch truly.

Indeed. Heck, he tanks an attack from Zeus that hurts a titan.

Originally posted by BloodRain
Because..?

There's no argument. The idea that Ryu couldn't hurt Kratos with his dragon blade is not logical. Kratos' sharp point durability is not remarkable, neither is Ryu's for that matter.

These guys are not Superman.

^ With that and Ryus speed he should get past most of Kratos' attacks to stab/cut in a fatal area.

Originally posted by Allankles
There's no argument. The idea that Ryu couldn't hurt Kratos with his dragon blade is not logical. Kratos' sharp point durability is not remarkable, neither is Ryu's for that matter.

These guys are not Superman.

There is an argument. Several actually. Some of them are spoilers for GOW3.

And what the hell is 'sharp point durability' exactly? Kratos is not made of rubber. A normal man wielding a blade certainly would not scratch him.

And the only times he's been killed by piercing were by people millions of times above Ryu in physical strength:

1. Ares, who was in full God size and threw a sharpened pillar beyond the speed of sound. That is far beyond anything Ryu can hope to muster physically. Even then Kratos' durability was enough that it slowed down the momentum of the pillar and kept it from bisecting him. And it would have done just that if it went through all the way, as the base was wider than Kratos' torso.

Kratos' has only since gotten much stronger since that game, even in base terms. Even still, that was the Kratos that could be sucked into another dimension and fall so far that his landing makes a massive crater upon impact in solid rock.

2. When he was stabbed by Zeus, who was wielding the BoO nonetheless, while Kratos was already weakened. Zeus is a physical match for Kratos as it is, and then he was wielding the BoO on top of it.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
There is an argument. Several actually. Some of them are spoilers for GOW3.

And what the hell is 'sharp point durability' exactly? Kratos is not made of rubber. A normal man wielding a blade certainly would not scratch him.

And the only times he's been killed by piercing were by people millions of times above Ryu in physical strength:

1. Ares, who was in full God size and threw a sharpened pillar beyond the speed of sound. That is far beyond anything Ryu can hope to muster physically. Even then Kratos' durability was enough that it slowed down the momentum of the pillar and kept it from bisecting him. And it would have done just that if it went through all the way, as the base was wider than Kratos' torso.

Kratos' has only since gotten much stronger since that game, even in base terms. Even still, that was the Kratos that could be sucked into another dimension and fall so far that his landing makes a massive crater upon impact in solid rock.

2. When he was stabbed by Zeus, who was wielding the BoO nonetheless, while Kratos was already weakened. Zeus is a physical match for Kratos as it is, and then he was wielding the BoO on top of it.

As in a sharper object can pierce better then... a non-sharp object.

Those examples dont show his min resistance or any resistance to blades.

A sharp pillar is sharp.

Alright, time to bust out our collective calculators.

Originally posted by BloodRain
As in a sharper object can pierce better then... a non-sharp object.

Those examples dont show his min resistance or any resistance to blades.

I've gone over this simple distinction with you already in another thread. It's quite stupid on versus forums when logic is non-existent and people can only try to compartmentalize durability as either 'sharp' or 'blunt'.

Drop a block of granite, which is sword proof, from the sky, and it breaks. Drop Kratos from the sky, and he gets up with no problem. If he already can survive something which produces more force and PSI than a human wielding a sword can generate, how then is that human being wielding a sword supposed to hurt him? Again, he's not made of rubber is he? No. He's not.

But besides that, I've already given you an example of his sharp point tanking ability in that other thread from GoW3. I didn't put spoilers on it unfortunately and I don't want to post it again even in spoilers now.

I repeat, Ryu is far too weak to cut Kratos.

To be fair, this is sort of a result of Granite's own hardness making it brittle, because it cannot flex.

Still, Kratos has durability feats. Dunno how strong Ryu is. Will ask Cyner.

Originally posted by ScreamPaste
To be fair, this is sort of a result of Granite's own hardness making it brittle, because it cannot flex.

Still, Kratos has durability feats. Dunno how strong Ryu is. Will ask Cyner.

Yes, but bone has hardness as well.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Yes, but bone has hardness as well.
Touche, but we have a system of joints that allows us more flex than a granite block.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
I've gone over this simple distinction with you already in another thread. It's quite stupid on versus forums when logic is non-existent and people can only try to compartmentalize durability as either 'sharp' or 'blunt'.

Drop a block of granite, which is sword proof, from the sky, and it breaks. Drop Kratos from the sky, and he gets up with no problem. If he already can survive something which produces more force and PSI than a human wielding a sword can generate, how then is that human being wielding a sword supposed to hurt him? Again, he's not made of rubber is he? No. He's not.

But besides that, I've already given you an example of his sharp point tanking ability in that other thread from GoW3. I didn't put spoilers on it unfortunately and I don't want to post it again even in spoilers now.

I repeat, Ryu is far too weak to cut Kratos.

Yes but without knowing his min psi limit that he can take to gain injury (especially of a blade) you cant say for certain that he cant be cut.

Got a number?

Originally posted by BloodRain
Yes but without knowing his min psi limit that he can take to gain injury (especially of a blade) you cant say for certain that he cant be cut.

Got a number?

I don't have a number unfortunately, but its a tad redundant saying PSI on a blade, because PSI already accounts for surface area.

Again if the blunt force produces more of that than the cutting option can make up for with its smaller surface area, then that's that.

Did I just read someone say Ryu cannot hurt Kratos?

If Kratos has some way to resist damage from the Dark Dragon Blade (a weapon that, pretty much disintegrated a human being's body upon impact) and a plasma saber (made of the same thing a lightsaber is made out of, plasma), then, yeah. Kratos has mad uber defense.

Considering the fact that he was nearly killed by a hammer.

Also, when did Kratos brush off a attack by Zeus that hurt a Titan?

Kratos can be killed the same way Poseidon and Apollo were...thru "normal" means.

Originally posted by iChaos
Considering the fact that he was nearly killed by a hammer.

Also, when did Kratos brush off a attack by Zeus that hurt a Titan?

Kratos can be killed the same way Poseidon and Apollo were...thru "normal" means.

Is Ryu even strong enough to grapple with Kratos in the first place?

Zeus throws a lightning bolt that hurts Gaia. Nothing happens to Kratos. Pretty sure he wasn't using the Golden Fleece as the fleece wasn't facing the bolt. Either way, if he did use the Fleece, it's a reaction feat, as his hands were on his side when Zeus threw the bolt

Originally posted by iChaos
Considering the fact that he was nearly killed by a hammer.

Also, when did Kratos brush off a attack by Zeus that hurt a Titan?

Kratos can be killed the same way Poseidon and Apollo were...thru "normal" means.

-LOL @ this point. Trying to reach that far back for a non-feat--from when Kratos was nothing more than a normal soldier with no superhuman abilities.

-If you couldn't tell, it was a GoW3 spoiler. It happens near the beginning. I'll say no more, but that it was far more awesome than just Demonic Phoenix's spoiler lets on. Truly.

-Thankfully, you put normal in quotations. Otherwise, this would have been far more silly a point than it already is. Ryu doesn't have the 'normal means' it takes.

Since he was born a demi-god. Fact is, he would've been killed. And he can die the same way any other demigod can.

Yeah, and Gaia has done what?

Also, didn't the Last Spartan brush off Zeus' lighting bolt?

Don't you people know Ryu Hayabusa is from the Dead Or Alive games, he can't lose. I side wit him.

Originally posted by iChaos
Since he was born a demi-god. Fact is, he would've been killed. And he can die the same way any other demigod can.

Yeah, and Gaia has done what?

Also, didn't the Last Spartan brush off Zeus' lighting bolt?

No one is denying that he can die like that. However, that hammer incident was so many years ago, Kratos has gotten stronger etc. Not to mention, he beat a more powerful version of the BK already
Try again.

Oh I don't know, how about the fact that she is the mother of a race of beings that are strong enough to carry mountains on their backs, or tear chunks of solid rock the size of a small building and chuck them up a kilometer high?
She's obviously as strong as them, not to mention, she's the freaking mother of the earth.

Nada, he didn't take a bolt head on, neither did those bolts seem as powerful as this one (he 'charged' the bolt for a lot longer against Kratos)

Originally posted by iChaos
Since he was born a demi-god. Fact is, he would've been killed. And he can die the same way any other demigod can.

Yeah, and Gaia has done what?

Also, didn't the Last Spartan brush off Zeus' lighting bolt?

-He was born a demi-god, but he had no powers until Ares took him under his wing. The barbarian king was nothing more than a really strong man when Kratos was bested. Yet we see Kratos effortlessly take care of a creature larger than a ship in the form of the Hydra, in the opening level of the game, and tank things far stronger than a simple giant hammer blow from a mortal. It's a redundant point constantly saying "oh he can die just like anyone else!". Irrelevant. The question of this thread is can Ryu be the one to do it? By feats. No. He cant.

-On top of what Phoenix has said above, its important to note the obvious, in that Gaia is a near 2000 ft tall being, made of solid rock inside and out and weighs millions of tons.

-LOL. No. Just be quiet. Please.

Originally posted by No End N Site
Don't you people know Ryu Hayabusa is from the Dead Or Alive games, he can't lose. I side wit him.

Shittiest 3D fighter there is, what's your point?

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Shittiest 3D fighter there is, what's your point?

I like it

Yes the jiggling is over the top but I think the fighting system is pretty fun.

Also tekken is way shittier.

I disagree. VF is shittier, not Tekken.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
I disagree. VF is shittier, not Tekken. actually I could agree with that also...

excluding GoW3 feats I definitely think it's a pretty even match here between Hayabusa and Kratos.


In argument for Hayabusa:

The True Dragon Sword has the power to destroy the world, while this doesn't mean anything until it has canonically destroyed a world, it's still a very impressive blade.

Not all of his Ninpo attacks are even projectiles, such as his Wind Blades technique which is hundreds of slashes, Flame Phoenix ninpo which are protective magical fire birds that fly around and attack enemies, and his Piercing Void ninpo which is a miniature black hole. The only actual projectile is his Inferno ninpo.

True Dragon Sword paired with the Blade of the Archfiend is a powerful combination. The Archfiend of course being the most powerful being(so far) in the NG universe.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Shittiest 3D fighter there is, what's your point? I see you haven't payed much attention to the DOA story. Those characters are very powerful. Their bosses can destroy stars...

Originally posted by No End N Site
Don't you people know Ryu Hayabusa is from the Dead Or Alive games, he can't lose. I side wit him. Please, don't talk as if Dead or Alive has ever been overrated. That goes for your other comment above (no one said anyone from the games can do such ridiculous feats, on the other hand...) Oh yes, you can find me one or two examples. Just maybe I'll applaud.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
Shittiest 3D fighter there is, what's your point? Meh, Bloody Roar is probably worse. Also, I doubt there are even many bad 3-D fighting games. For the record, although it may not matter, DOA has always had good reviews. The lowest I can remember is a 7.0 and that was for DOA3, which lacked a good amount of content and online play even.

Originally posted by Cyner
I like it

Yes the jiggling is over the top but I think the fighting system is pretty fun.

Also tekken is way shittier. Tekken? Worse than DOA? How can that thought even manage its way in there?

Also, True DS capable of destroying the world? It cannot "destroy"...anything. It just has the countering power to fight off the Dark Dragon Blade. As that gets stronger, so does the TDS, which is why it's really the only counter for it (in that particular universe). In NG2 the concept is a little different. The blade (TDS) just gets powerful after sensing all the evil shit going on in Mt. Fuji, or that volcano Ryu ventures in.

Other than that, other traits of the sword is that it can cut through what magma can't melt (lava fiends)...that's really it actually.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-He was born a demi-god, but he had no powers until Ares took him under his wing. The barbarian king was nothing more than a really strong man when Kratos was bested. Yet we see Kratos effortlessly take care of a creature larger than a ship in the form of the Hydra, in the opening level of the game, and tank things far stronger than a simple giant hammer blow from a mortal. It's a redundant point constantly saying "oh he can die just like anyone else!". Irrelevant. The question of this thread is can Ryu be the one to do it? By feats. No. He cant.

-On top of what Phoenix has said above, its important to note the obvious, in that Gaia is a near 2000 ft tall being, made of solid rock inside and out and weighs millions of tons.

-LOL. No. Just be quiet. Please.

Yeah...no. Him being able to die like anyone else any irrevelant.

i45ld2xgfXY

Meh, I didn't recall her being made of rocks inside, but meh.

Yeah, I'm sure that bolt killed him (@1:34).

Originally posted by FWahMaN
Also, True DS capable of destroying the world? It cannot "destroy"...anything. It just has the countering power to fight off the Dark Dragon Blade. As that gets stronger, so does the TDS, which is why it's really the only counter for it (in that particular universe). In NG2 the concept is a little different. The blade (TDS) just gets powerful after sensing all the evil shit going on in Mt. Fuji, or that volcano Ryu ventures in.

Other than that, other traits of the sword is that it can cut through what magma can't melt (lava fiends)...that's really it actually.


I'm probably the only person who reads all the lore in the books you find everywhere in Ninja Gaiden, but it's in there.

And considering the True DS mirrors the extent of power of a blade growing in power since the dawn of history (which correct me if I'm wrong, also means the beginning of time) it's safe to say the TDS is a helluva strong weapon......that power only fights off "dark" or "evil" power. Vague as hell, right? You got it. I don't know how power can be "light/good" and "dark/evil"...not the same as "destructive" which is why the TDS has basically no destructive power that a normal katana doesn't. It cannot destroy the world, lmao.

The reason the TDS's power is...well..actually, the game says "unfathomable spirit power" in NG for the Xbox. That's from the 13 dragon deities. It's also in the sacred texts of the game.

Edit: Dude, if you can show me where it says the TDS can do that....then...well...I'll believe it. Until then I'm a disbeliever.

Originally posted by FWahMaN
Please, don't talk as if Dead or Alive has ever been overrated. That goes for your other comment above (no one said anyone from the games can do such ridiculous feats, on the other hand...) Oh yes, you can find me one or two examples. Just maybe I'll applaud.


WOW, You okay sparky? What was that all about? And your silly if you think DOA and NG have never been over overrated on this forum.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
There is an argument. Several actually. Some of them are spoilers for GOW3.

And what the hell is 'sharp point durability' exactly? Kratos is not made of rubber. A normal man wielding a blade certainly would not scratch him.

And the only times he's been killed by piercing were by people millions of times above Ryu in physical strength:

1. Ares, who was in full God size and threw a sharpened pillar beyond the speed of sound. That is far beyond anything Ryu can hope to muster physically. Even then Kratos' durability was enough that it slowed down the momentum of the pillar and kept it from bisecting him. And it would have done just that if it went through all the way, as the base was wider than Kratos' torso.

Kratos' has only since gotten much stronger since that game, even in base terms. Even still, that was the Kratos that could be sucked into another dimension and fall so far that his landing makes a massive crater upon impact in solid rock.

2. When he was stabbed by Zeus, who was wielding the BoO nonetheless, while Kratos was already weakened. Zeus is a physical match for Kratos as it is, and then he was wielding the BoO on top of it.

First of all Ryu is not a normal human, second no one is saying Kratos isn't durable. He has fairly good durability against blunt force trauma but he is just as vulnerable to sharp point trauma as all the gods and titans he kills.

It's a bit far fetched to say that Ryu couldn't tear up Kratos' flesh. He's done it to greater fiends who have more dense muscle than Kratos.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Is Ryu even strong enough to grapple with Kratos in the first place?


If Ryu grapples with Kratos, he's lost this fight. Grappling and muscling opponents is Kratos' game, Ryu is all finesse and speed.

All those greater fiends he fights are stronger than him, he decimates them with his speed and skill.

No one is saying Ryu's going to straight up kick his ass or win in a wrestling match. That would be hilarious.

Ryu can only win, given the circumstances, with his higher end weapons and ninpo. Dhurz, people. Also yes, the Greater Fiends of NG1 and 2 are formidable. They're comparable to DMC bosses, and mid and/or high metas.

*head/desk*

A bit of continued fail here. Will address tomorrow.

I hope that's not at me. I'm pretty honest when it comes to Ninja Gaiden. Also I got some of my facts straightened up over the months.

..

313

They should've given Kratos some hair, like Sephiroth from Final Fantasy 7.

Yes, that last statement was so dumb.

No not you sir.

Originally posted by iChaos
Yeah...no. Him being able to die like anyone else any irrevelant.

i45ld2xgfXY

Meh, I didn't recall her being made of rocks inside, but meh.

Yeah, I'm sure that bolt killed him (@1:34).

-Going in circles with this. Moving on.

-You can't recall what you haven't seen can you? Yes, Gaia is shown to be made of rock inside and out, I'll say no more.

-Thank you for posting the video, now you can understand why I was laughing. See, you are indirectly trying to make a faulty negative assessment of the power of a Zeus lightning bolt because you claim the last spartan 'shrugged one off', but then in that very scene we see that lightning bolt crumble the building that the last spartan and a couple of others were standing on. (how many actual lightning bolts have you seen do that?)
How then does an ordinary human survive that? Choose one:

1.Wasn't point blank. (most likely)
2.P.I.S.
3.Perhaps he wasn't a completely ordinary human? Those other spartans didn't survive.
4.A faulty retelling of the event by the Spartan. (least likely)

Originally posted by Allankles
First of all Ryu is not a normal human, second no one is saying Kratos isn't durable. He has fairly good durability against blunt force trauma but he is just as vulnerable to sharp point trauma as all the gods and titans he kills.

It's a bit far fetched to say that Ryu couldn't tear up Kratos' flesh. He's done it to greater fiends who have more dense muscle than Kratos.

-Firstly, I never said Ryu was a normal human. Like I said in this thread, I put him at well over peak human levels. Probably around Spiderman levels.

The reason I brought up a human wielding a blade being ineffective against Kratos' skin is because I was trying to gauge what your assessment of 'remarkable sharp durability' is, and whether you'd agree with me saying Kratos was invulnerable to a human swinging a sword.

-Secondly...*FACEPALM*. Did you read anyone of my other posts in this? I already addressed this BS conception of 'blunt force durability only'. Is Kratos made of rubber? No? Then stop compartmentalizing the damage types for him. PSI is PSI, whether its from blunt force or a sword, and Kratos has shown even in GOW1 higher PSI durability than what a man wielding a sword can logically output.

-Now, as for why I said Ryu himself isn't strong enough to hurt Kratos, as I said, its because of his GOW3 feats. He has shown a couple of slashing and piercing durability feats in GOW3 from beings a million times physically stronger than Ryu.

Kratos has shown slashing, piercing, explosion, and even burn tanking feats in GOW3.It's funny because looking at the feats I've seen so far in GOW3, it almost seems like Sony Santa Monica was reading boards like this and wanted to address BS concepts like 'Kratos is not bulletproof etc.'

Originally posted by Allankles
First of all Ryu is not a normal human, second no one is saying Kratos isn't durable. He has fairly good durability against blunt force trauma but he is just as vulnerable to sharp point trauma as all the gods and titans he kills.

It's a bit far fetched to say that Ryu couldn't tear up Kratos' flesh. He's done it to greater fiends who have more dense muscle than Kratos.

-Firstly, I know Ryu isn't a normal human. I said in this thread that I put him well above peak-human levels. I'd say about Spiderman levels.

I made the statement of a human wielding a sword being ineffective against Kratos' skin because I was trying to gauge what your assessment of 'remarkable sharp edge durability' is by going to the lowest common denominator, and to see whether you'd agree with my statement or not.

-Secondly...*facepalm*. You didn't read any of my other posts in here dude? I thoroughly addressed the BS concept of 'blunt force durability only'. PSI is PSI, (note force is different, force has nothing to do with area) regardless of if a boulder or a sword is generating it, and Kratos has shown remarkably high PSI durability, even in GOW1 he has taken things with much higher PSI output than a normal man wielding a sword can logically generate. Again, is Kratos made of rubber? No? Then stop trying to compartmentalize his durability levels for this.

-Finally, as for why I said Ryu himself is not strong enough to hurt Kratos? Again, its by GOW3 feats. Kratos has shown a couple of slashing and piercing durability feats from beings a million times stronger than Ryu.

Kratos thus far that I've seen, has shown slashing, piercing, explosion, and even burn tanking feats. Which is funny to me, because looking at those feats it almost appears to me that Sony Santa Monica was reading forums like this and wanted to put to rest BS concepts like 'Kratos is not bulletproof!' and what not.

Originally posted by iChaos
Yeah...no. Him being able to die like anyone else any irrevelant.

i45ld2xgfXY

Meh, I didn't recall her being made of rocks inside, but meh.

Yeah, I'm sure that bolt killed him (@1:34).


Her flesh is rock, she still has cavities and stuff. Her veins are made of wood.

Hit the building most likely i.e. didn't hit him head on. Though the Last Spartan was caught in the radius of the blast, that I'll agree.

Besides, the Last Spartan is a dude who can somewhat fight with Kratos, and someone who was able to make it to the Palace of the Fates from Sparta . He isn't an ordinary human or Spartan .

Finally, the bolt that hit the building was not as charged as the one Zeus used in 3. Deny or argue this all you like, you cannot change those facts.

*edit* I kinda double posted above, as my computer froze when I first tried to submit and I wasn't sure if it got through. So I just started typing it up again.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-Firstly, I know Ryu isn't a normal human. I said in this thread that I put him well above peak-human levels. I'd say about Spiderman levels.

I made the statement of a human wielding a sword being ineffective against Kratos' skin because I was trying to gauge what your assessment of 'remarkable sharp edge durability' is by going to the lowest common denominator, and to see whether you'd agree with my statement or not.

-Secondly...*facepalm*. You didn't read any of my other posts in here dude? I thoroughly addressed the BS concept of 'blunt force durability only'. PSI is PSI, (note force is different, force has nothing to do with area) regardless of if a boulder or a sword is generating it, and Kratos has shown remarkably high PSI durability, even in GOW1 he has taken things with much higher PSI output than a normal man wielding a sword can logically generate. Again, is Kratos made of rubber? No? Then stop trying to compartmentalize his durability levels for this.

-Finally, as for why I said Ryu himself is not strong enough to hurt Kratos? Again, its by GOW3 feats. Kratos has shown a couple of slashing and piercing durability feats from beings a million times stronger than Ryu.

Kratos thus far that I've seen, has shown slashing, piercing, explosion, and even burn tanking feats. Which is funny to me, because looking at those feats it almost appears to me that Sony Santa Monica was reading forums like this and wanted to put to rest BS concepts like 'Kratos is not bulletproof!' and what not.

So Kratos' flesh is bullet proof? As far as the PSI argument, two words "Wonder Woman". She can take all sorts of blunt force trauma, but sharp point trauma is another issue, sharp projectiles shot at her with speed only approaching mach 1, will penetrate her flesh.

And of course there's a difference between blunt and sharp point durability, the kind of damage a blunt instrument deals is differnt from what a sharp point deals, that's common sense. If I jab a person with a wooden baseball bat, they'll be hurt but their flesh will remain in tact, jab the same person with the same baseball bat that has its top sharpened to a spear point, and watch it tear the flesh.

Sharp point trauma is an entire different kettle of fish, a blunt instrument isn't going to cut through tissue, muscle fibers and all.

Also I think Ryu is far beyond peak human in terms of his physical abilities. He seems to have Action Man type awareness, combined with Spiderman level agility.

EDIT: I think this vid confirms that Ryu can indeed pierce Kratos' flesh.
suBFY39P4Ps

Splitting an entire air craft in two with the dragon sword, that feat speaks to both his strength and the power of the dragon blade. Not to mention crazy awareness in avoiding a missile while in mid air as well as the high powered fire.

Originally posted by Allankles
So Kratos' flesh is bullet proof? As far as the PSI argument, two words "Wonder Woman". She can take all sorts of blunt force trauma, but sharp point trauma is another issue, sharp projectiles shot at her with speed only approaching mach 1, will penetrate her flesh.

And of course there's a difference between blunt and sharp point durability, the kind of damage a blunt instrument deals is differnt from what a sharp point deals, that's common sense. If I jab a person with a wooden baseball bat, they'll be hurt but their flesh will remain in tact, jab the same person with the same baseball bat that has its top sharpened to a spear point, and watch it tear the flesh.

Sharp point trauma is an entire different kettle of fish, a blunt instrument isn't going to cut through tissue, muscle fibers and all.

-Yes dude. Kratos' flesh is well beyond bulletproof. You wouldn't even need to see the GoW3 feats that I have to come to that conclusion.

-Wonder Woman? Heh. You bring up another fictional character that has suffered from crappy logic in her writing as some sort of debating point? What does the flawed laws of one fictional universe have to do with another? I'm talking actual physics here. Surviving a punch from Superman, who can at the very least, can cause a crater in the ground, logically makes Wonder Woman immune to a bullet as well. Supes produces more PSI than any bullet. And last I recall, recently DC has realized the stupidity of her vulnerability to sharpness anyway. Was she not recently only cut by a magic blade, and then she was surprised that it cut her at all in the first place?

-Of course there is a difference. But PSI, (which already stands for pounds per square inch), means its already measuring force applied within the area of a square inch. Which means surface area is already accounted for. Which means its redundant saying PSI from a blade vs PSI from say a hammer, as they both generate PSI. Which means that if a blunt option produces more PSI than a sharp option, then the blunt option has more cutting potential too.

Falling so far than you generate a crater upon landing >>> normal guy swinging a sword.

Again, force is different as it has nothing to do with area, all other things being equal, the hammer will generate more force as its heavier, but the sword will generate more PSI. But I'm not talking about force, I'm talking about PSI.

Originally posted by Allankles
Also I think Ryu is far beyond peak human in terms of his physical abilities. He seems to have Action Man type awareness, combined with Spiderman level agility.

EDIT: I think this vid confirms that Ryu can indeed pierce Kratos' flesh.
suBFY39P4Ps

Splitting an entire air craft in two with the dragon sword, that feat speaks to both his strength and the power of the dragon blade. Not to mention crazy awareness in avoiding a missile while in mid air as well as the high powered fire.


Spiderman is far beyond peak human too, which is where I put Ryu at. So we already agree.

But sorry dude, that video doesn't do it. Ryu cuts a moderately sized aircraft in half by slicing through a very thin section of it. I think it was the wing?

Kratos is far more durable than that aircraft.


I like Ryu a lot, and of the big three; Kratos, Dante(hate admitting this douche is anything important at all), and himself, he's clearly the most skilled, but he doesn't have the stopping power to beat Kratos.

I think he does, and I can't change your opinion. As for the PSI argument you realize the PSI from a sharp point is directed at an incredible small surface area, that's why it will pierce flesh in a situation here a cinder block might not.

As for the Jet, Kratos' limbs would survive a collision with a high powered fighter plane now?

-A square inch is already a fairly small area, but if something already produces more PSI (measure of pressure) than a sword swing, it should produce more pressure within the area size of the sword swing impact too. Pressure is just force over a unit of area after all.

-If Kratos and that aircraft were shot at each at the same speed, Kratos' body would prevail.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-Yes dude. Kratos' flesh is well beyond bulletproof. You wouldn't even need to see the GoW3 feats that I have to come to that conclusion.

And last I recall, recently DC has realized the stupidity of her vulnerability to sharpness anyway. Was she not recently only cut by a magic blade, and then she was surprised that it cut her at all in the first place?

I don't think regular guns are what a mordern WW would be worried about, and the projectiles that get thrown her way are moving much faster than any of the blows she receives. And of course sharp points bring more PSI.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Of course there is a difference.

I'm glad you at least recognized there's a difference. There's also the Moh's scale to consider, the dragon blade is much harder than Kratos' flesh. If Kratos had Colossus level durability I might agree that Ryu wouldn't be able to pierce him. But he's already pierced Fiends who have denser muscle than Kratos.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Falling so far than you generate a crater upon landing >>> normal guy swinging a sword.

I agree, but Ryu is not a normal guy. Fiends have way more robust physiologies than humans, essentially they're demi gods yet Ryu has no problems tearing them apart.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
If Kratos and that aircraft were shot at each at the same speed, Kratos' body would prevail.

So basically Kratos would be killed by that impact. I don't even know how you can argue that Ryu's dragon blade would bounce of Kratos. That air craft is way more robust than Kratos, as are all the giant Fiends he fights.

The same force behind the strike and a bladed object creates alot more psi then a blunt one. Ryu is strong enough to slash him.

Also a few other people have taken strong blunt force but are not bullet proof.

-There isn't a bullet out there that travels faster than a Superman punch that I can recall in the DCU. :/

-Interesting that you'd bring up the Moh's scale, but again...have you not been reading anything I've said about his GoW3 feats? This Moh's scale point was trumped before you even brought it up. And please, enough with this muscle density business, you don't know how dense they are. Hell, Superman's body is supposedly super dense, yet on Earth he weighs no more than a normal man his size. :/

-See above. No need to talk about robusticity, it isn't a proper measure of their durability when they have no real feats for their durability. Certainly, logically, they'd have to be more durable than a human. But then again Kratos is far above that level himself.

Moving on.



Umm no, basically what would happen is the impact would leave a huge hole through the aircraft courtesy of a 7 ft mega durable demi-god flying through it.

Again, I really really will not be specifically spoiling what happens in GoW3 in this thread, but you obviously can't know where I get the idea of Ryu's blade 'bouncing off' Kratos' skin if you haven't seen the feats I'm talking about. Demonic Phoenix will agree, hell he already has.

Originally posted by BloodRain
The same force behind the strike and a bladed object creates alot more psi then a blunt one. Ryu is strong enough to slash him.

Also a few other people have taken strong blunt force but are not bullet proof.

-I already said that all things being equal, a hammer will produce more force but a sword will produce more psi. But if the blunt force produces more force than the cutting action can make up for with its smaller area, then the blunt force will be producing more psi too. No, Ryu isn't even a fraction of the necessary strength needed to slash Kratos.

-What few other people and what do their feats in another universe with differing logic have to do with God of War's universe? Kratos is bullet proof. Play God of War 3, when it comes out this Tuesday, and after the first level, none of you will question that again.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-I already said that all things being equal, a hammer will produce more force but a sword will produce more psi. But if the blunt force produces more force than the cutting action can make up for with its smaller area, then the blunt force will be producing more psi too. No, Ryu isn't even a fraction of the necessary strength needed to slash Kratos.

-What few other people and what do their feats in another universe with differing logic have to do with God of War's universe? Kratos is bullet proof. Play God of War 3, when it comes out this Tuesday, and after the first level, none of you will question that again.

I don't care about spoilers since I already have assumptions of how the story ends. Use the spoiler function, if you must.

So what type of attack did Kratos take? Also, you clearly admit that a sword has more PSI, meaning you need a lot less force to use compared to a blunt force implement like a hammer. In some universes swords have been created that can split atoms, imagine how little force such a sword requires to be effective?

The Dragon Sword has its own high level magic imbued into it, allowing it to be even more efficient than a carbon copy made with the finest mundane workmanship.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Umm no, basically what would happen is the impact would leave a huge hole through the aircraft courtesy of a 7 ft mega durable demi-god flying through it.

I noticed how you modified the scenario by adding "if Kratos was hurled at the same speed as the plane". My scenario was simple, if Kratos' met with the plane at the same speed Ryu was descending onto it, he would be cut in two, or at the very least, expire/die/kick the bucket.

I await your GOW 3 feats.

Originally posted by Allankles
I noticed how you modified the scenario by adding "if Kratos was hurled at the same speed as the plane". My scenario was simple, if Kratos' met with the plane at the same speed Ryu was descending onto it, he would be cut in two, or at the very least, expire/die/kick the bucket.

I await your GOW 3 feats.


What....the....hell?

I UPPED your scenario with an even more testing one. Running INTO a punch is going to be far more damaging than if you just planted your feet. If you knew anything about Kratos or God of War, how could possibly come to the solution that Kratos would die if he simply fell onto that moving plane?

I've been trying to be courteous and all, but I can't imagine how much longer I can be. And I would post the spoilers in tags, but as I see now it would be a waste of time as you'll still argue that Ryu can somehow still hurt the guy. I'll just be smugly content in the fact that I'm not the only one who knows about this.

If you want, you can just look up an HD walkthrough of the game that's already on youtube, rajmangaminghd is the profile.

*i meant conclusion, not solution. lol

Originally posted by CosmicComet
--You can't recall what you haven't seen can you? Yes, Gaia is shown to be made of rock inside and out, I'll say no more.

-Thank you for posting the video, now you can understand why I was laughing. See, you are indirectly trying to make a faulty negative assessment of the power of a Zeus lightning bolt because you claim the last spartan 'shrugged one off', but then in that very scene we see that lightning bolt crumble the building that the last spartan and a couple of others were standing on. (how many actual lightning bolts have you seen do that?)
How then does an ordinary human survive that? Choose one:



Didn't I just f'n say that?

I never said he "shrugged" it off. By the looks of it, it hit the Spartan. And how could you tell that it hit EXACTLY the building. And remember, the Spartan is pretty tough for "someone like him". And still, it was a good feat from the Last Spartan.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Hit the building most likely i.e. didn't hit him head on. Though the Last Spartan was caught in the radius of the blast, that I'll agree.

Besides, the Last Spartan is a dude who can somewhat fight with Kratos, and someone who was able to make it to the Palace of the Fates from Sparta . He isn't an ordinary human or Spartan .

Finally, the bolt that hit the building was not as charged as the one Zeus used in 3. Deny or argue this all you like, you cannot change those facts.

Well, it's possibly true, but we don't know how he got to the Palace of the Fates, lol.

So why wasn't it considered PIS (Kratos getting hit, I mean)?

Hmm, does Ryu have poison?

Originally posted by CosmicComet
What....the....hell?

I UPPED your scenario with an even more testing one. Running INTO a punch is going to be far more damaging than if you just planted your feet. If you knew anything about Kratos or God of War, how could possibly come to the solution that Kratos would die if he simply fell onto that moving plane?

I've been trying to be courteous and all, but I can't imagine how much longer I can be. And I would post the spoilers in tags, but as I see now it would be a waste of time as you'll still argue that Ryu can somehow still hurt the guy. I'll just be smugly content in the fact that I'm not the only one who knows about this.

If you want, you can just look up an HD walkthrough of the game that's already on youtube, rajmangaminghd is the profile.

If Kratos is hurled at speed, he carries a force closer to that of the moving air craft. If he gets hit while moving at the speed of Ryu's descent he will not carry the same force and will not come close to damging the plane as much as it damages him. It is a testament to the abilities of the dragon sword, that it cut through that air craft as if it were cutting through butter.

And I'm sure you're compensating for the power of a state of the art air craft vs his enemies in GOW. That aircraft would absolutely destroy most of GOW's cast, that is removing any qualifiers like magic and just considering the level of damage it can cause.

Again, why don't you just put spolier tags on his relevant GOW 3 feats, to pretty much close your case?

Originally posted by Allankles
If Kratos is hurled at speed, he carries a force closer to that of the moving air craft. If he gets hit while moving at the speed of Ryu's descent he will not carry the same force and will not come close to damging the plane as much as it damages him. It is a testament to the abilities of the dragon sword, that it cut through that air craft as if it were cutting through butter.

And I'm sure you're compensating for the power of a state of the art air craft vs his enemies in GOW. That aircraft would absolutely destroy most of GOW's cast, that is removing any qualifiers like magic and just considering the level of damage it can cause.

Again, why don't you just put spolier tags on his relevant GOW 3 feats, to pretty much close your case?

-You have no idea what you are talking about. Running into a force moving towards you will only INCREASE the force that will be exerted on you. Just as backing away from it will lessen it.

Run into punch, greatest chance of KO. Standing still, lesser chance, backing away, least chance.

-What do you mean 'I'm sure you are compensating'? An aircraft that fires bullets and makes meager explosions with missiles is absolutely nothing in the GoW universe. Kratos is bullet proof, and has tanked worse than what those missiles can give. And Kratos is just a demi-god.

-I don't know. I guess I'm just a masochist, and maybe somewhat smug in the knowledge of this being a stomp, while you do not yet know. I don't need to say the specifics. All you need to know is what I've already said. Kratos tanks a piercing and slashing action from a creature and being respectively, both millions of times stronger than Ryu. Arguments of Ryu's sword being magical are null and void when that very element of magic is present in Kratos' feats as well. Sorry.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-You have no idea what you are talking about. Running into a force moving towards you will only INCREASE the force that will be exerted on you. Just as backing away from it will lessen it.

I know it wasn't your intention but that was patronizing. Of course your scenario "upped" things, but it wasn't relevant to my point. I was comparing the durabilty of a 1 ton+ state of the art air craft with a 6 foot something 200+ pound demi god. So I wanted to put Kratos body in the same position as the dragon blade (which is also harder than Kratos).



Originally posted by CosmicComet
-What do you mean 'I'm sure you are compensating'? An aircraft that fires bullets and makes meager explosions with missiles is absolutely nothing in the GoW universe. .

Except that it would destroy 70% of the GOW 1 & 2 bosses.

And we didn't see the missile exploding, that was the plane before that part. Ryu avoids the missile and then nympos the last jet fighter, and then the scene ends, we don't see the missile exploding.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
--I don't know. I guess I'm just a masochist, and maybe somewhat smug in the knowledge of this being a stomp, while you do not yet know. I don't need to say the specifics. All you need to know is what I've already said. Kratos tanks a piercing and slashing action from a creature and being respectively, both millions of times stronger than Ryu. Arguments of Ryu's sword being magical are null and void when that very element of magic is present in Kratos' feats as well. Sorry.

Cool, glad you cleared that up.

Kratos destroys Ryu with the power of hope. Without it, he still has Hermes boots to keep up with his speed, Apollo's rapid-fire arrows, Helios' head which can blind even a titan, and magics that are more impressive than Ryu's Ninpo..

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Umm no, basically what would happen is the impact would leave a huge hole through the aircraft courtesy of a 7 ft mega durable demi-god flying through it.

Again, I really really will not be specifically spoiling what happens in GoW3 in this thread, but you obviously can't know where I get the idea of Ryu's blade 'bouncing off' Kratos' skin if you haven't seen the feats I'm talking about. Demonic Phoenix will agree, hell he already has.

According to one of the character artists in GoWIII, I think that height's sort of been retconned...

Now he's apparently eight and a half feet tall (~8'6'').

Just, you know, for future reference.

8'6"?! Source?

That would make it seem like all the random mortal women he comes across are giants as well...

The new character art video in the GoWIII Treasures section.

I'm kinda calling it far-fetched as well, but given how tall other demi-gods like Theseus and Hercules are, and comparing Kratos to the normal human citizens on Olympus (like the one he slams off the ledge to get to Helios), it doesn't seem completely out of the question.

I just figured Theseus and Herc were 10-14 ft tall respectively compared to Kratos' 7. Now it's just even more exaggerated.

Originally posted by First_Tsurugi06
According to one of the character artists in GoWIII, I think that height's sort of been retconned...

Now he's apparently eight and a half feet tall (~8'6'').

Just, you know, for future reference.

I thought he was 8 and a half feet? Either way, that makes Kratos' wife above 7'7 which makes no sense. If Kratos is 8'6, than that makes Calliope 5'6, only two inches shorter than me

Either the ancient Greeks were giants or somebody is exaggerating measurements too much.

Sin's my height.

The more you know! *Stalk*

Demigawds doodes.

They have exaggerated strength and abilities, why not exaggerated height?

Still, 8 ft 6" is stupidly tall >__>. 8ft is about the most I'd take him to be.

lol i dont even know why this was argued. i followed all of your posts cc, and by far your points make much more sense... i loled at how far they took it though.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
Demigawds doodes.

They have exaggerated strength and abilities, why not exaggerated height?

Still, 8 ft 6" is stupidly tall >__>. 8ft is about the most I'd take him to be.

Kratos' wife is not a demigod.

Originally posted by Sappho
lol i dont even know why this was argued. i followed all of your posts cc, and by far your points make much more sense... i loled at how far they took it though.

With some of Kratos powers and items in GOW 3 he's definitely beating Ryu, but the idea that Ryu couldn't pierce him with his dragon blade is ridiculous.

Everytime he encounters a piercing weapon canonically he gets stabbed, I don't see how a super ninja capable of destroying super human demonic demi gods is going to have a problem piercing his flesh.

Considering Kratos himself doesn't possess the dense muscles of a greater Fiend.

^Read Kratos' respect thread that I updated. It's over.

Ryu can try to stab, cut, whatever. He's not going to do anything. Maybe he could poke him in the eye, but that's about it.

Originally posted by Sin_Volvagia
Kratos' wife is not a demigod.

Ehh, we only see her properly when Gaia takes her form.

Height is inconsistent in a lot of games anyway .

Originally posted by CosmicComet
^Read Kratos' respect thread that I updated. It's over.

Ryu can try to stab, cut, whatever. He's not going to do anything. Maybe he could poke him in the eye, but that's about it.

Ryu is superhuman, wielding a weapon crafted using the power of 12 ancient gods. Kratos is not Superman, hell he's not even at the level of the Thing or Colossus in terms of durability.

It is illogical to assume Ryu the Super Ninja (as he is called) with the very powerful Dragon Sword isn't going to pierce a guy like Kratos or Zeus or any of the other demi gods and gods from GOW given an opportunity.

If he can pierce Greater Fiends who are demi gods and gods by themselves with power over certain elements Fire, Lightning etc with more dense muscles than Kratos, there's no way Kratos flesh will stop Ryu from cutting him.

The Dragon Blade was built to be powerful enough to cut through all the demi gods and gods that are enemies of the Dragon Lineage, and I don't see how Kratos (given his track record with piercing weapons) is going to be the exception. Hell its power is so immense that only Ryu and the other Super Ninjas of the Dragon Lineage can wield it.

Yeah Kratos is more durable than Ryu, but so are the Fiends who brush off attacks that would kill Ryu.

Read. The. Respect. Thread.

And at the below.

I only mentioned Ryu is superhuman because you seem to think that he's only peak human. No peak human can do the stuff Ryu does, a peak human is not superhuman. A ninja is peak human, a Super Ninja (as Ryu is called in the games) is a super human version of the same ninja. He has to have otherwordly ability just to wield the Dragon Sword without it harming him.

As for Kratos not being Superman, he would need to be at least Colossus/Thing level in terms of his durability for Ryu to be unable to pierce him. In fact he is far below Thing/Colossus level in terms of durability.

You can't read. That's the conclusion I've come to.
You haven't read a single word that I've said here, or the respect thread itself.


http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=464264&pagenumber=5#post12599813

I'll even link it for you.

Yeah, this may have been a somewhat close match-up before GoW3, but now it is nothing but spite. I will close it within the next few days.

Seriously Xan, before GoW3 I wouldn't have been saying what I have.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
You can't read. That's the conclusion I've come to.
You haven't read a single word that I've said here, or the respect thread itself.


http://www.killermovies.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=464264&pagenumber=5#post12599813

I'll even link it for you.

I already saw the thread, and some of your durability feats aren't even durability feats i.e. all the durability feats related to resisting piercing weapons coincidentally.

The Hades scene was not a durability feat since Hades blades are meant to grab his soul and they do, he resists the soul taking process. The Blades don't actually hook onto his flesh (physical body), but his soul (spiritual body), the little cutscene clearly shows that.

Hades actually says "your soul is mine" ala Shang Tsung before trying to steal his soul, clearly indicating his intent, which is indeed clearly demonstrated with the blades hooking onto Kratos soul.

So it wasn't actually a durability feat.

Then Poseidon's crab-like creature doesn't actually pierce Kratos he holds off its crab leg with his strength. It didn't actually pierce him. Again, not a durability feat. This is why it looked like I was ignoring your thread, but its because I never saw any durability feats vs sharp objects, it seems you don't even want to give honest feats.

Originally posted by XanatosForever
Yeah, this may have been a somewhat close match-up before GoW3, but now it is nothing but spite. I will close it within the next few days.

Yeah Ryu loses here, but he could still pierce Kratos flesh. I've stopped arguing for Ryu after seeing GOW 3 too.

Originally posted by Allankles
I already saw the thread, and some of your durability feats aren't even durability feats i.e. all the durability feats related to resisting piercing weapons coincidentally.

The Hades scene was not a durability feat since Hades blades are meant to grab his soul and they do, he resists the soul taking process. The Blades don't actually hook onto his flesh (physical body), but his soul (spiritual body), the little cutscene clearly shows that.

Hades actually says "your soul is mine" ala Shang Tsung before trying to steal his soul, clearly indicating his intent, which is indeed clearly demonstrated with the blades hooking onto Kratos soul.

So it wasn't actually a durability feat.

Then Poseidon's crab-like creature doesn't actually pierce Kratos he holds off its crab leg with his strength. It didn't actually pierce him. Again, not a durability feat. This is why it looked like I was ignoring your thread, but its because I never saw any durability feats vs sharp objects, it seems you don't even want to give honest feats.

You moron. The hooks are physical, they are not intangible and have never shown to be. They pierced Atlas, they pierced Cronos, hell when Kratos used them against Hades there was blood there too. There was no blood when he hit Kratos.

Hades came out with the intent to kill Kratos for his own personal vendetta against him, in the most effective way possible. Which is why he sneaked up to give himself a better chance. All that has been made apparent is the hooks don't have to actually cut you to grab your soul. But there was even a fleshy sound made when the hooks connected on Kratos.

The leviathan hit Kratos squarely. He grabbed the leg the same moment it already hit him which means nothing was lost. The leg is longer than Kratos' arms and that Kratos did not grab it at the point, it means he got hit squarely.

Did you also ignore the feat where he blocked the edge of the BoO's blade with his bare hands, twice?

Originally posted by CosmicComet
^Read Kratos' respect thread that I updated. It's over.

Ryu can try to stab, cut, whatever. He's not going to do anything. Maybe he could poke him in the eye, but that's about it.

If Ryu was using his other weapons, I'd agree but the True Dragon Sword? That thing will cut Kratos. I'll even say it's sharper than any GoW weapon.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
You moron. The hooks are physical, they are not intangible and have never shown to be. They pierced Atlas, they pierced Cronos, hell when Kratos used them against Hades there was blood there too. There was no blood when he hit Kratos.

There's no blood when he hit Kratos because they were digging at his soul. The cutscene clearly shows the blade hooking his soul, with Hades intending to pull out his soul: "your soul is mine".

The blades - proven by that scene - have the capacity to hook an intangible soul directly, it had nothing to do with Kratos durability.

How are those other scenes related, when here Hades wanted to yank Kratos soul specifically?

Just move on, the evidence here is against you.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
All that has been made apparent is the hooks don't have to actually cut you to grab your soul. But there was even a fleshy sound made when the hooks connected on Kratos.

Exactly, the blades don't have to cut Kratos to yank his soul out. Hades didn't expect Kratos to actually have the ability to resist having his soul taken away. Why argue something, when the evidence is against you?

The Poseidon crab is the same situation here.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Exactly
The leviathan hit Kratos squarely. He grabbed the leg the same moment it already hit him which means nothing was lost. The leg is longer than Kratos' arms and that Kratos did not grab it at the point, it means he got hit squarely..

It doesn't actually hit Kratos before he grabs it, it almost hits Kratos. You're going to scrap any kind of feat to try make your case aren't you? The Leviathan scene was a strength feat, not a durability feat for sharp point damage.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Did you also ignore the feat where he blocked the edge of the BoO's blade with his bare hands, twice?

The same weapon that has been shown to pierce him .

And as I said, your whole premise was Hayabusa is peak human, but he's more than just that, his weapon by itself is made to cut all soughts of demi gods and gods.

The Dragon sword is given the power to destroy gods through the power of 12 other gods. And Ryu needed to undergo hellish training just so that he can actually use the sword without it harming him. I should have mentioned this at the start, really.

Originally posted by Allankles
There's no blood when he hit Kratos because they were digging at his soul. The cutscene clearly shows the blade hooking his soul, with Hades intending to pull out his soul: "your soul is mine".

The blades - proven by that scene - have the capacity to hook an intangible soul directly, it had nothing to do with Kratos durability.

How are those other scenes related, when here Hades wanted to yank Kratos soul specifically?

Just move on, the evidence here is against you.



Exactly, the blades don't have to cut Kratos to yank his soul out. Hades didn't expect Kratos to actually have the ability to resist having his soul taken away. Why argue something, when the evidence is against you?

The Poseidon crab is the same situation here.



It doesn't actually hit Kratos before he grabs it, it almost hits Kratos. You're going to scrap any kind of feat to try make your case aren't you? The Leviathan scene was a strength feat, not a durability feat for sharp point damage.



The same weapon that has been shown to pierce him .

And as I said, your whole premise was Hayabusa is peak human, but he's more than just that, his weapon by itself is made to cut all soughts of demi gods and gods.

The Dragon sword is given the power to destroy gods through the power of 12 other gods. And Ryu needed to undergo hellish training just so that he can actually use the sword without it harming him. I should have mentioned this at the start, really.

-This bullshit continues. The evidence is against YOU. It is YOU who is the one trying to assume something with nothing to show for it. Hades' hooks are physical. They've never shown the ability to simply phase through something harmlessly. They've cut everything they've made contact with, Hades included, except Kratos himself. When Kratos has durability feats that put him above titans, this should not come as a surprise.

It's a slash durability feat period. There is physical contact with Kratos skin. There is the sound of it actually hitting Kratos' flesh for pete's sake. The point of the weapon is soul stealing AFTER the fact it actually has to make physical contact to do it. Do you even have any logical argument as to why Hades would want it to only phase through Kratos and not try to cut him first? Do you? You are done here.

-I'm sorry, you cannot interpret the Leviathan scene differently. It hit him in the torso. The only way it wouldn't have is if KRatos caught it by the point and it never reached him. He did not. He grabbed it the same moment it hit him and he grabbed it nowhere near the point.

-As for the BoO being able to pierce him? Wow. You think? Piercing is whole different ball park than slashing.

-And you continue to be a terrible reader, and its sad that I have to point this out again. Read through again moron. Where in this thread did I say Ryu was peak human? Point it out for me please? I could have sworn that I said a couple of different times that I put him well above peak human. I said Spiderman levels specifically. (Which is honestly probably a bit too generous, Spiderman can flip over tanks.) You can tout your titles of 'demi-gods' and 'gods' that its able to cut through, but the truthfully those beings have no durability feats at all.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-This bullshit continues. The evidence is against YOU. It is YOU who is the one trying to assume something with nothing to show for it. Hades' hooks are physical. They've never shown the ability to simply phase through something harmlessly. They've cut everything they've made contact with, Hades included, except Kratos himself. When Kratos has durability feats that put him above titans, this should not come as a surprise.

It's a slash durability feat period. There is physical contact with Kratos skin. There is the sound of it actually hitting Kratos' flesh for pete's sake. The point of the weapon is soul stealing AFTER the fact it actually has to make physical contact to do it. Do you even have any logical argument as to why Hades would want it to only phase through Kratos and not try to cut him first? Do you? You are done here.

If they depended on physical contact to function then you'd have a point, as far as the cutscene goes the magical hooking-end of the blade does indeed phase through Kratos body to yank his soul.

You're the one not thinking logically, how can you foolishly insist that the magical edge of the blade didn't bypass Kratos flesh entirely?

How would they have gotten to Kratos soul without going through the physical place that his soul was encased in? Are you going to say they simply displaced his soul from his body, when we actually see them piercing his soul? Don't be a dumb ass.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-I'm sorry, you cannot interpret the Leviathan scene differently. It hit him in the torso. The only way it wouldn't have is if KRatos caught it by the point and it never reached him. He did not. He grabbed it the same moment it hit him and he grabbed it nowhere near the point.

I'm sorry too, because it looks like you watched that scene only once. As the the leviathan descends Kratos actually braces himself to actually grab it.

He bends his knees and the leviathan fails to actually make contact with his body entirely, he then pushes it off into the ground before the final battle on Gaia.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
-As for the BoO being able to pierce him? Wow. You think? Piercing is whole different ball park than slashing.

Who cares, the blade did indeed pierce his flesh. He's not immune to its sharp edge is my point. The Dragon Blade is also a different kettle of fish, for one its too small for that to be relevant.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
You can tout your titles of 'demi-gods' and 'gods' that its able to cut through, but the truthfully those beings have no durability feats at all.

They have durability feats against convential high powered weapons.

Originally posted by Allankles
If they depended on physical contact to function then you'd have a point, as far as the cutscene goes the magical hooking-end of the blade does indeed phase through Kratos body to yank his soul.

You're the one not thinking logically, how can you foolishly insist that the magical edge of the blade didn't bypass Kratos flesh entirely?

How would they have gotten to Kratos soul without going through the physical place that his soul was encased in? Are you going to say they simply displaced his soul from his body, when we actually see them piercing his soul? Don't be a dumb ass.



I'm sorry too, because it looks like you watched that scene only once. As the the leviathan descends Kratos actually braces himself to actually grab it.

He bends his knees and the leviathan fails to actually pierce his body entirely, he then pushes it off into the ground before the final battle on Gaia.



Who cares, the blade did indeed pierce his flesh. He's not immune to its sharp edge is my point. The Dragon Blade is also a different kettle of fish, for one its too small for that to be relevant.



They have durability feats against convential high powered weapons.

--They've had to physically connect with every opponent it has ever come into contact with to steal a soul in the first place. It cut Cronos, It cut Atlas. It cut Hades himself. All that was made clear was even if it can't cut you, it can still steal your soul.

-Prior showings of its physical cutting ability in action, during use by the same person who tried to cut Kratos? Check.
-Prior showing of its physical cutting ability against the master of the weapons themselves? Check.
-Audible sound of the blades physically connecting with Kratos' body--yet still not accompanied by any blood? Check.
-Hades winding up his swing to get as much power as possible while at the same time sneaking up? Check.
-Logical motivator in Hades loathing Kratos and wanting to hurt him as much as possible (all the while trying win as fast as possible) as a reason for him trying to cut Kratos? Check.
-You not having logical argument as to why the hooks would simply be turned completely intangible when it has no feats to show this or an explanation as to why Hades would even want them to be intangible when he hates Kratos? Check.

Kindly, be quiet. You have no leg to stand on.

--I've watched it more times than I can count. Kratos sees it coming yes, but he fails to keep the point from hitting him nor does he bend his knees in anticipation. His knees were forcibly bent by the impact of the leviathan's leg hitting him in the torso. Finished.

--He's not immune to a sharp point sure, but he's highly resistant by feats, And again, Ryu is not Zeus and the True Dragon Sword is leagues below the Blade of Olympus. Zeus is as a strong as Kratos and still could not cut Kratos' despite Kratos catching the sword's edge twice with his bare hands.

--When? I don't remember. Anyway, bullets are unimpressive for either universe anyway.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
--They've had to physically connect with every opponent it has ever come into contact with to steal a soul in the first place. It cut Cronos, It cut Atlas. It cut Hades himself. All that was made clear was even if it can't cut you, it can still steal your soul.

-Prior showings of its physical cutting ability in action, during use by the same person who tried to cut Kratos? Check.
-Prior showing of its physical cutting ability against the master of the weapons themselves? Check.
-Audible sound of the blades physically connecting with Kratos' body--yet still not accompanied by any blood? Check.
-Hades winding up his swing to get as much power as possible while at the same time sneaking up? Check.
-Logical motivator in Hades loathing Kratos and wanting him to suffer as much as possible as a reason for him trying to cut Kratos? Check.
-You not having logical argument as to why the hooks would simply be turned completely intangible when it has no feats to show this or an explanation as to why Hades would even want them to intangible when he hates Kratos? Check.

Get real. The scene does show the magical part of the blades bypassing his flesh to pierce his soul. Logic demands, that they had to phase through Kratos flesh to get to his soul. Logic.

The sound of the blades hittting Kratos is just that, blades hitting Kratos, this doesn't mean that they didn't quite clearly phase through Kratos body to get to his soul, as the evidence clearly shows. That's called SFX, you want seperate SFX for phasing blades?

Your arguments on what Hades or Kratos did to other people with the blades are entirely irrelevant to what actually happened with Kratos.

For that to be a durability feat we would have to abandon logic; "the blades didn't pierce him, but phased through his body, when they were supposed to actually pierce his body and phase through his body at the same time." Just dumb.

It's one or the other, if the blades have 2 seperate phases they'd be seperated into 2 phases, but it was the same single unifrom blade throughout. Please actually think, before your next rebuttal on this.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
--I've watched it more times than I can count. Kratos sees it coming yes, but he fails to keep the point from hitting him nor does he bend his knees in anticipation. His knees were forcibly bent by the impact of the leviathan's leg hitting him in the torso. Finished.

Urgh! Yes the leviathan pushes him down, but Kratos stops it almost dead with his strength, before he spikes it to the ground. Really, a durability feat?

Originally posted by CosmicComet
He's not immune to a sharp point sure, but he's highly resistant by feats, And again, Ryu is not Zeus and the True Dragon Sword is leagues below the Blade of Olympus. Zeus is as a strong as Kratos and still could not cut Kratos' despite Kratos catching the sword's edge twice with his bare hands.

No one is saying it isn't impressive, but the idea is that it does and can pierce him, remember my stance has always been that it's ridiculous to say Ryu couldn't pierce him especially given how lightning quick and efficient he is with the Dragon Sword.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
When? I don't remember. Anyway, bullets are unimpressive for either universe anyway. Speak for yourself.

Conclusion: Ryu is awesome but Kratos got wanked to death in GoW3 therefore he wins. The end.

We all came to that conclusion, this is another argument.

Originally posted by Allankles
Get real. The scene does show the magical part of the blades bypassing his flesh to pierce his soul. Logic demands, that they had to phase through Kratos flesh to get to his soul. Logic.

The sound of the blades hittting Kratos is just that, blades hitting Kratos, this doesn't mean that they didn't quite clearly phase through Kratos body to get to his soul, as the evidence clearly shows. That's called SFX, you want seperate SFX for phasing blades?

Your arguments on what Hades or Kratos did to other people with the blades are entirely irrelevant to what actually happened with Kratos.

For that to be a durability feat we would have to abandon logic; "the blades didn't pierce him, but phased through his body, when they were supposed to actually pierce his body and phase through his body at the same time." Just dumb.

It's one or the other, if the blades have 2 seperate phases they'd be seperated into 2 phases, but it was the same single unifrom blade throughout. Please actually think, before your next rebuttal on this.

You are repeating yourself with the same weak arguments.

It was glowing? oooohh the blades were glowing!!!! So the hell what? It was glowing against Cronos and Atlas too. It glowed when Kratos used them against Hades as well--in which there was blood.

You completely contradict yourself by acknowledging that the blades did indeed make a sound against Kratos flesh, and then say it doesn't mean it didn't phase through. WTF? That's a reaffirmation that the blades are physical. Even if it only touched him for a millisecond, that was all it would have taken for a cut to manifest. It did not.

What happens against Cronos and Atlas cannot be discarded, that would be moronic because the very essence of what we are doing here is determining the properties of the hooks are by their showings.

There is no abandonment of logic, in what I'm saying. And what did I say again? I said that the Blades have never shown the ability to harmlessly pass through something as though it were completely intangible yes? It's a magical weapon that can attack souls but still has basic physical properties. Kratos hits Hades with the hooks, blood comes out, and then he proceeds to take his soul. On the other hand, Hades hits Kratos with the hooks in the very beginning of this fight. No blood, despite audible confirmation of it physically hitting him. But it was still able to attack his soul. Being that it did indeed HIT Kratos before it attached to his soul, that would mean my statement that it 'can't harmlessly pass through anything' is confirmed. Once more, there is no abandonment of logic--rather you are just making a completely different, and flawed, argument that it was completely intangible and can only be intangible in that scene.

You. ****ing. lost. You lost by the evidence mounted against you by past showings-and even by an immediately future showing. You lost by reason of Hades' motivations. You lost absolutely.







Stopping it dead on would grabbing the point before it ever even hit him. That's not what happened. The point of the leg hit Kratos squarely and the impact pushed him down. Kratos gets a hold AROUND the leg the same moment it hits him, that would do nothing to stop the initial force of impact. Yes, its durability feat. It effortless pierces through Gaia and rocks around it. It is also a strength feat being that the Leviathan is able to restrain Gaia.

(--As an aside, I hope you are intelligent enough to comprehend that pretty much all of Kratos' strength feats are in turn durability feats. You can't be strong enough to do something if your body can't handle the stresses)



I know what your stance is, and my stance all along is that your stance is ridiculous. Kratos is millions of times stronger and more durable than Ryu. Harmlessly grabbing the edge of a sword swung by someone in his strength class puts Kratos far above Ryu's ability to harm with. Let alone when that Sword is the Blade of Olympus, swung by Zeus himself.



I'll repeat myself. Bullets ain't shit.

Originally posted by Cyner
Conclusion: Ryu is awesome but Kratos got wanked to death in GoW3 therefore he wins. The end.

Kratos won well before GoW3. Before that, it would have been a close fight in which Ryu could actually HARM Kratos in. Now its simply a curbstomp.

--But actually, Kratos even had a cutting durability feat in God of War 2 as well. Atropos sneaks up behind Kratos and grabs him with her long blade like nails, and that didn't cut Kratos either.

edit: ahhh crap. new page. prior big post is bumped.

Let's get things straight:

1. r6A1KFnqvgI
2:13-3:18

Hades pierces both Cronos and Atlas but there is no visible bleeding. Seeing what the Claws did to Atlas, one can assume that it's meant to do spiritual damage rather than physical

01dyb8LU7XQ
At the very beginning of the video, we see the soul rip. Instead of piercing Kratos, it grabs his soul after hitting the side. I doubt there was piercing involved.

6KfLMAEPsXE
1:45-2:02
The Hades Claws does show physical piercing but when the soul rip is being done (1:45 after Kratos opens his head), there is no blood seen.

Conclusion: The soul rip is not a physical attack.


2. 16TE49oiP8g
The Leviathan appendage is obviously not piercing Kratos. He held it just in time from getting stabbed.


3. -26sOT3axuI
3:33-3:37

Just proof that Kratos wasn't stabbed by Leviathan or Hades Claws. Blades can't make him bleed but being slammed to a wall does?

4. 93IET71shJo
6:13-7:00

Kratos is most likely not touching the sharp edge. Neither him nor Zeus are bleeding from the hands. The only time he does get hit by the BoO is when the player failed to press a certain button.

Conclusion: Kratos will get slashed and stabbed by Ryu's Dragon Sword. No excuses.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
But actually, Kratos even had a cutting durability feat in God of War 2 as well. Atropos sneaks up behind Kratos and grabs him with her long blade like nails, and that didn't cut Kratos either.

Atropos grabbed him and no nails were touching.

1. It pierces Cronos and Atlas but there is no visible bleeding? What's your point? We can visually confirm that it pierced their skin and that is confirmation of their physicality--let alone that blood comes out when Kratos uses it against Hades. A minor inconsistency from the development team, they could have just meant for the wounds to be too small for blood to be warranted as visible. Plus its an FMV, not a game engine scene, (where blood can be coded to come out simply upon any impact.) and thus they may have decided blood wasn't worth the time to implement as it would have been so minor anyway.



2. Oh, you can doubt all you want now, in a previous post you even said there was no bleeding in regards to it as a durability feat. Interesting that you should change your tune.

Prior and future showings of its piercing ability + plus Kratos by feats being more durable than Titans + audible confirmation of the blade physically hitting Kratos = confirmation of my argument. I'm the one going by showings, you guys are the ones trying to speculate.

No one here, absolutely no one, said the soul rip action, is what's doing the physical damage. The BLADES themselves do the physical damage/contact, initially.



3. You've changed your tune again. Watch that video in 720p, and see again what the hell happens. Kratos does not stop the point of the leg from hitting him, all he managed to do was grab AROUND the leg. The impact pushed him down as well, and as we see him push up we see the point of the leg still in contact with his torso. Massive durability and strength feat here.

And LOL. That's some pathetic reasoning. So the impact with that column causing bleeding and Hades claws not is some sort of argument of the latter being discardable? You do remember that Kratos didn't even bleed when jumping down from the Labyrinth, which is a great distance up Mt. Olympus, all the way down to solid ground in the Underworld yes?

This means it can be taken either one of two ways:

1. The bleeding was just a small in-engine inconsistency given that he jumped from a distance up Olympus to the Underworld with no problem.
or
2. It's a demonstration of the hardness of Olympian stone. Considering that in the end cutscene of the first level, Gaia was able to hang on to an Olympian Pillar as the sole means of supporting her millions of tons of weight (her other hand was free trying to attack Zeus.), this just shows the density and hardness of the material.



4. 'Most likely'. Again with these feeble, unsure qualifiers ('i doubt' prior) in front of your arguments. This is entirely retarded as well because we see clearly that Kratos' left hand, and Zeus right hand, are firmly clutched around the edge of the blade. Or are you saying that the blade is only sharp at the tip? That would be wrong as in that same scene Zeus bleeds after being slashed.

In fact, in this very video, Kratos stops the POINT of the BoO with his bare hands too! At 6:22-6:25, Kratos' right hand is clearly clutched around the edge of the blade point. Thanks for reaffirming my position with your haphazard video posting.

Oh, and here's a video where the player does not fail to push a button. Just so we can clearly see Kratos stopping the edge of the slash with his bare hands--twice: (sorry don't know how to embed)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dqwdrLG9Gxk

Conclusion: Same as it always was. Ryu is millions of times too weak to be at the necessary strength level to cut Kratos with his weaponry.




5. Wrong. Do not--post from memory.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pheq4-bLx7s
From 3:57-4:02. Atropos comes up from behind and with a strong swip clutches Kratos with her ridiculously sharp nails, and then HOLDS him for a few seconds while Lahkesis tries to strike him.

This was a very flaccid debate post. Easily rebuked.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
1. It pierces Cronos and Atlas but there is no visible bleeding? What's your point? We can visually confirm that it pierced their skin and that is confirmation of their physicality--let alone that blood comes out when Kratos uses it against Hades. A minor inconsistency from the development team, they could have just meant for the wounds to be too small for blood to be warranted as visible. Plus its an FMV, not a game engine scene, (where blood can be coded to come out simply upon any impact.) and thus they may have decided blood wasn't worth the time to implement as it would have been so minor anyway.

Nope, the soul rip isn't a physical attack. The proof has been shown. There are no blood spurts when it is used. The only reason the Claws did cause bleeding when used on Hades was because Kratos wasn't using the Soul Rip. He was physically tearing him apart so that he won't resist.



LOL More durable than Cronos? Last time I checked, Kratos died when impaled in the stomach by a flying pillar and later, the BoO. At least Cronos survived after getting gutted.

The Soul Rip isn't physical, otherwise the hooks would stay on the character's skin while the soul is being sucked out.



A flying pillar can kill Kratos but Poseidon can't in his water form? Kratos held the appendage with massive strength but the massive force pushed him. He only barely got pierced. Not a durability feat.

Also, Kratos didn't land on his dead when he dropped.



If his hands are around the blade, than the sword isn't that sharp and relies more on force and its godly power. Everytime the sword is used to kill somebody, it pierces so the point is where the sharpness truly is. BoO is much more powerful than the Dragon Sword since it's strong enough to kill Cronos but it's nowhere as sharp.

Ryu regularly slices through things with his sword and he will cut Kratos.



That's not proof enough that Kratos was cut. He was just snatched without getting cut. You fail.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
Oh, you can doubt all you want now, in a previous post you even said there was no bleeding in regards to it as a durability feat. Interesting that you should change your tune.


You're so damn stubborn you even argue against the evidence. This guy at least posted the video evidence to cut down on wasting words. The videos quite clearly show that the blades phased through Titans, Kratos and Hades himself in their canon scenes.

Why speculate on the reasoning behind why the devs didn't show blood in a cutscene? The blades don't show any blood because they're phasing through flesh, it should be that simple.

The devs have never shied away from showing blood in GOW, what a flimsy argument to make.



Originally posted by CosmicComet
And LOL. That's some pathetic reasoning. So the impact with that column causing bleeding and Hades claws not is some sort of argument of the latter being discardable? This means it can be taken either one of two ways:

You just made an even more pathetic argument about why the devs didn't show blood with the phasing, soul catching blades of Hades.

At the least, that scene indicates Kratos bleeding from less extreme trauma.

The blades are meant to draw out souls canonically, Kratos' incident was no exception, if anything the only difference was how quickly Hades yanked his soul.

Originally posted by Sin_Volvagia
The Soul Rip isn't physical, otherwise the hooks would stay on the character's skin while the soul is being sucked out.

At least someone is thinking logically. The blades wouldn't be able to rip souls (like they do) without actually phasing through flesh.

Originally posted by CosmicComet
3. You've changed your tune again. Watch that video in 720p, and see again what the hell happens. Kratos does not stop the point of the leg from hitting him, all he managed to do was grab AROUND the leg. The impact pushed him down as well, and as we see him push up we see the point of the leg still in contact with his torso. Massive durability and strength feat here.


By the time it even touches Kratos, he's stopped its descent to a crawl. At no point does it make full contact with his chest, he was stopping its downward motion from the moment it touched his outstretched hands.

It doesn't "smash his chest", that impact you hear is Kratos' bracing palms smacking up against the hollow exo-skeleton of the the leviathan's clawing leg.

As expected, you had absolutely no worthwhile rebuttle and have become limited to weak few line responses, seeing as I've covered every aspect of your flawed argument, this does not come as a surprise.

But I'll respond in kind anyway.



You moron. Hades hooked into Cronos and Atlas the same way Kratos hooked into Hades. What is this designation of the action from the same weapon being called a 'soul rip', when in every canonical use the very point of the weapon's ability is that it physically connects with an opponent to ensue a 'soul rip'. Every one of its uses has been a 'soul rip'. Fact of the matter is the blades have consistently shown physical properties, even in its use against Kratos there was the sound of the blades physically connecting with Kratos' flesh.

Your argument hinges on the fact that there wasn't some minor visual aid of blood in the Cronos/Atlas piercing scene--despite the fact that the hooks are absolutely minuscule in comparison to their hide and the fact that the blades still visibly pierced their flesh before Hades even began to try to pull their soul out.




LOL what a pathetic abandonment of logic again. Yes, Kratos by feats is more durable than the Titans. He tanked a Zeus lightning bolt that severed Gaia's arm. He shook off a white energy blast that would have destroyed a formation of onyx crystals from Zeus later in the game. The difference is Cronos is BIGGER than Kratos, not that he's more durable than Kratos. That pillar would have been very tiny in comparison to Cronos, thus it wouldn't be fatal, but it would pierce him just as easily. If a proportionately sized pillar was thrown at Cronos he would have died just like Kratos did.

Again, no one is talking about the 'soul rip', I'm talking about the hooks themselves. They have weight, they have physical properties in every showing(again, there was the physically induced sound of them connecting with Kratos' flesh), and they failed to cut Kratos on the initial impact BEFORE the soul ripping attempt occured.





Kratos also needed the Gauntlet of Zeus to kill Persephone at one point whereas now he could literally just snap her neck.

Point being? Kratos got stronger, in all facets. Stupid point again.
The leg is longer than his arms and he couldn't even grab the point, he stopped nothing from hitting him.

It is a strength feat in that he was able to push back the leg of a creature that could restrain Gaia, and it was a durability feat in that Kratos got hit square in the torso by a sharp leg and all it did was push him down.

An aside again--It's sad that I even have to clarify this, but pretty much all of Kratos' big strength feats are in turn durability feats, after all you have to be durable enough to handle the stresses of the strength feat in the first place.

WTF does 'Kratos didn't land on his dead' mean anyway. He fell from a distance up Mt Olympus, landed dead flat on solid ground in the underworld and there was even a little dust up or wave when he landed. That's the end of the story.




Except this is wrong, and I already countered your counter point here before you even made it--Kratos stopped the POINT of the blade with his bare hands too. The sharpest part of it--according to you.

Ryu ain't cutting jack. He's too weak.




LOL typical. Now that your initial claim was proved wrong since you were obviously going off memory, its time to simply backtrack and try to deny its value.

Here's an even clearer video of it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=piMuIIXtV2U

From 3:38 to 3:44. Atropos sneaks up from behind and grabs Kratos with her long talons and proving that it was full force, Kratos was even moved back when she slashed/clutched him. He wasn't cut by someone wielding insanely thin sword like nails whilst that person clutched him with those full force and even restrained him for a few seconds. Ryu has no hope. Ryu isn't as strong as Atropos, he has no hope of restraining him for even a few seconds like Atropos did.

You self owned your self by starting this failed tirade. Your argument was weak from the start and the terrible rebuttles proves your weakened resolve on this stance. You are ****ing owned.

Oh hey Allankles, feeling brave now?

CC, Hades' blades have proven capable of becoming immaterial and passing through solid matter as well as serving as physical weapons. Those things are built for stealing souls by becoming immaterial. At the same time, they can also strike people and hurt them physically.

There are still durability feats for Kratos; Hades was able to rip open part of the arena with the hooks, and Kratos no doubt gets hit by the blades in their battle. I sincerely doubt someone like Kratos could completely avoid those weapons in a fight, given the mastery Hades displays with them.

That initial attack that led to the soul-rip didn't look like a physical attack, as he attempted to take Kratos' soul from the start; as opposed to Kratos, who hurt Hades physically first, and then attempted to rip his soul (there was no blood when Kratos used the second hook).
I will admit that it (Hades' attack) was a little too fast for me to properly tell though.


As for the Leviathan feat, it does indeed look like the Leviathan's leg manages to strike Kratos.