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i dont really read that much dc comics but, people said darkseid has punked olympus and beat every there before.
if thats true than is darkseid skyfather level?

Yes and yes. Most writers just forget that Post Crisis. The truth is the Olympian Gods were if not afraid then at least respectful of DS's power.

Darkseid, before harnessing the OE, feared the power of the Olympian Gods and weakened them by spreading tales of the Roman pantheon. The Olympians were all split in two, their power divided when people started to worship the Roman as well as Olympian Gods.

After claiming the OE though I don't think DS feared them and it was shown that it took Highfather, Odin, Zeus, Jove, and Ares to equal Darkseid and Highfather's power and penetrate the Source Wall.

So yeah, DS>>DC Zeus.

Is DC Zeus just as powerful as Marvel Zues?

Originally posted by galactusischere
Is DC Zeus just as powerful as Marvel Zues?
I don't know. They seem to be in the same rough power class though. Zeus rarely invokes his power though it seems his lightning powers Captain Marvel and the other members of the Quintessence considered him a peer.

so darkseid is above skyfather.
why do people say thanos can beat him then

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
so darkseid is above skyfather.
why do people say thanos can beat him then
I wouldn't say Post Crisis DS is above Skyfather but he's in the Tier. PC Darkseid, yeah he was at times above Skyfather for sure.

As for why people think Thanos beats him I'd say there is a good case to be made for Thanos but it mostly relies on the premise that the No-PIS Omega Effect won't work on him. For every Thanos fan that approaches the matchup rationally there's two or three who lowball DS and wank Thanos to make it seem like DS isn't even close, which is a ridiculous notion.

The real Darkseid wasn't seen until Final Crisis. Yeah, he is above skyfather.

I think PC Darkseid was somewhere between skyfather and Galactus level. So, what what that be? Elder God level?

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
The real Darkseid wasn't seen until Final Crisis. Yeah, he is above skyfather.

I think PC Darkseid was somewhere between skyfather and Galactus level. So, what what that be? Elder God level?
I put him at Elder God level due to the fact that a weakened version of him was able to one shot Elite Skyfathers like PC Mordru and Time Trapper.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
The real Darkseid wasn't seen until Final Crisis. Yeah, he is above skyfather.

I think PC Darkseid was somewhere between skyfather and Galactus level. So, what what that be? Elder God level? between sky father and galactus are a couple levels
galactus>celestials>cosmic cubes>eldergods>>skyfathers.

yea he might be elder god level, cosmic cubes have universal warping powers

It is called entity level

Learned it. Love it.


Abstract
entity
Skyfather

Darkseid gets his ass handed to him regularly by high-heralds. Zeus spanks him.

PC DS was certainly powerful. If it's post crisis, Zeus. FC DS stomps.

A PIS free 'Seid would win, imo. Just so happens that the guy suffers from PIS a lot.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
I wouldn't say Post Crisis DS is above Skyfather but he's in the Tier. PC Darkseid, yeah he was at times above Skyfather for sure.

As for why people think Thanos beats him I'd say there is a good case to be made for Thanos but it mostly relies on the premise that the No-PIS Omega Effect won't work on him. For every Thanos fan that approaches the matchup rationally there's two or three who lowball DS and wank Thanos to make it seem like DS isn't even close, which is a ridiculous notion. So ignorig that happens in the comics is how we should debate? Since when? Also when has Darkseid beaten Zeus straight up? If Hades comes up with a plan to defeat Zeus does this mean he can beat him straight up in combat?

Originally posted by Gecko4lif
It is called entity level

Learned it. Love it.


Abstract
entity
Skyfather
entity covers many things,
elder gods, cytorrak, cosmic cubes, and celestials are all entitys.
its still a big gap between skyfather and abstract
thats why imo its easier to just say

Abstract level>celestial level>cosmic cube level>eldergod level>>skyfathers.

Originally posted by TheTyrant
Darkseid gets his ass handed to him regularly by high-heralds. Zeus spanks him. Originally posted by quanchi112
So ignorig that happens in the comics is how we should debate? Since when? Also when has Darkseid beaten Zeus straight up? If Hades comes up with a plan to defeat Zeus does this mean he can beat him straight up in combat?


Originally posted by JakeTheBank
A PIS free 'Seid would win, imo. Just so happens that the guy suffers from PIS a lot.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
entity covers many things,
elder gods, cytorrak, cosmic cubes, and celestials are all entitys.
its still a big gap between skyfather and abstract
thats why imo its easier to just say

Abstract level>celestial level>cosmic cube level>eldergod level>>skyfathers.
That is why there is high mid and low

If you broke it up too much there would be empty tiers

Originally posted by Omega Vision



It is true.

Originally posted by TheTyrant
It is true.
How is it true? In his 40 year history he's been defeated a whopping total of three times by High Heralds, once by Orion and twice by Superman who as everyone knows has a Jobber Aura. You don't even read DC comics.

Originally posted by Omega Vision

What did I say that was wrong? When has Darkseid proven his superior in combat?

Originally posted by Omega Vision
How is it true? In his 40 year history he's been defeated a whopping total of three times by High Heralds, once by Orion and twice by Superman who as everyone knows has a Jobber Aura. You don't even read DC comics. DD crushed him. Raker humiliated him. He's also stalemated Superman a lot. Who has he defeated which cements his status?

Originally posted by quanchi112
What did I say that was wrong? When has Darkseid proven his superior in combat?

DD crushed him. Raker humiliated him. He's also stalemated Superman a lot. Who has he defeated which cements his status?
H/P Doomsday is not High Herald.

Raker didn't come close to humiliating him, Raker attacked a Darkseid who wasn't even fighting back, did no damage, and would have been erased by the OE or crushed in Darkseid's hands had the Guardians not come to save him. You are absolutely retarded if you think Raker had the slightest chance of defeating Darkseid. There's also the fact that when the Guardians arrived (in force) all of them combined obviously respected DS's power enough that they would rather suffer an embarassing defeat and cut their losses than try to take him on directly. If DS wasn't a Skyfather do you honestly believe the Guardians would be afraid to battle him and finish the job themselves?

Name these stalemates.

He depowered Secret, easily I might add, defeated Eclipso, again easily, killed Kalibak with a touch, swatted aside Captain Atom like if CA was a ragdoll, easily defeated Full Geared Wonder Woman in Rock of Ages, defeated Superman more times than the converse, defeated Orion both with the OE and with physical strength, vaporized an Old God Dregg with the OE, oneshotted Highfather, completely annihilated Cyborg Superman with the OE, barely noticed Lobo's punches, and easily defeated Supergirl.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
H/P Doomsday is not High Herald.

Raker didn't come close to humiliating him, Raker attacked a Darkseid who wasn't even fighting back, did no damage, and would have been erased by the OE or crushed in Darkseid's hands had the Guardians not come to save him. You are absolutely retarded if you think Raker had the slightest chance of defeating Darkseid. There's also the fact that when the Guardians arrived (in force) all of them combined obviously respected DS's power enough that they would rather suffer an embarassing defeat and cut their losses than try to take him on directly. If DS wasn't a Skyfather do you honestly believe the Guardians would be afraid to battle him and finish the job themselves?

Name these stalemates.

He depowered Secret, easily I might add, defeated Eclipso, again easily, killed Kalibak with a touch, swatted aside Captain Atom like if CA was a ragdoll, easily defeated Full Geared Wonder Woman in Rock of Ages, defeated Superman more times than the converse, defeated Orion both with the OE and with physical strength, vaporized an Old God Dregg with the OE, oneshotted Highfather, completely annihilated Cyborg Superman with the OE, barely noticed Lobo's punches, and easily defeated Supergirl. How is he not?

Darksei dwas prevented from fighting back because of his lantern ring. Unless you think Darkseid's intentions were to be on his backside?

The guardians are appeasers and incompetent boobs so I see no inconsistency here. They failed left and right and make deals, ala Larfleeze despite saying we won't make any deals. Darkseid's army eradicated raker's due to desaad's discovery of the yellow weakness so what's your point?


It wasn't just Darkseid he had his entire planet there. LOL.

Depowered secret what's that prove? Can he depower Superman? Can he depower captain marvel? He created eclipso so that's why he easily did so. We found out in the ish making it not so impressive.

Kalibak his son whom Orion has destroyed on panel and who is just a fool? Really?

Captain Atom who was rocked by apollo? LOL. So you are using an alternate reality where he was easily killed by the Atom. Ok.

Superman is his equal and imo his superior as he has bested Darkseid more times than not in the past ten years.

When did he oneshot Highfather? I saw Ares kill his rival with a few slashes but when did this supposed oneshot take place? I don't remember it being a oneshot.

Cyborg was busy fighting Superman while he shot him twice without him even fighting darkseid so how is this impressive?

Supergirl is someone he should beat. Were these lobo shots in an alternate reality?

Raker humiliating Darkseid. Nahhh...Squirrel Girl beating Thanos was humiliating!!!

Originally posted by JakeTheBank
A PIS free 'Seid would win, imo. Just so happens that the guy suffers from PIS a lot.

Yeah, and it's usually related to Superman stuff.

Darkseid does have his good showings though.. Back in the early post crisis days, his Omega beams were "too fast" for Superman to dodge.

And there's tons of stuff non Superman related that prove Darkseid is pretty high on the food chain. But when the writers had the bright idea of feeding Darkseid to Superman, all they ended up doing was breaking 'Seid..

And than Loeb gets the bright idea to do it again in Superman/Batman, only making Darkseid look infinitely worse...

But I think Byrne's the one who laid the foundations for Jobberseid, by actually allowing Superman to not only knock 'Seid around, but get teleported away making it look like that was the only thing that saved him from a further beat down. I believe Byrne since said he's regretted that portrayal...

Originally posted by Omega Vision
H/P Doomsday is not High Herald.

Raker didn't come close to humiliating him, Raker attacked a Darkseid who wasn't even fighting back, did no damage, and would have been erased by the OE or crushed in Darkseid's hands had the Guardians not come to save him. You are absolutely retarded if you think Raker had the slightest chance of defeating Darkseid. There's also the fact that when the Guardians arrived (in force) all of them combined obviously respected DS's power enough that they would rather suffer an embarassing defeat and cut their losses than try to take him on directly. If DS wasn't a Skyfather do you honestly believe the Guardians would be afraid to battle him and finish the job themselves?

Name these stalemates.

He depowered Secret, easily I might add, defeated Eclipso, again easily, killed Kalibak with a touch, swatted aside Captain Atom like if CA was a ragdoll, easily defeated Full Geared Wonder Woman in Rock of Ages, defeated Superman more times than the converse, defeated Orion both with the OE and with physical strength, vaporized an Old God Dregg with the OE, oneshotted Highfather, completely annihilated Cyborg Superman with the OE, barely noticed Lobo's punches, and easily defeated Supergirl.

Don't forget how he easily destroyed Agogg, a high level brick.

Originally posted by Tattoos N Scars
Raker humiliating Darkseid. Nahhh...Squirrel Girl beating Thanos was humiliating!!! Not the real thanos. By the way she's pretty formidable. She'd annihilate Raker.