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This is the universe destroying and Galactus and Grandmaster destroying entity from the JLA/Avengers crossover.

Who wins?

Based on implied power: Krona
Based on feats: probably Thanos.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Based on implied power: Krona
Based on feats: probably Thanos. Now THAT........is a very intelligent way of looking at it.

Not sure.

Imo, Krona demonstrated more destructive power (destroying a few universes.) The IG demonstrated more controlled power (usurping Eternity's position.)

Toss a coin..? srug

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Based on implied power: Krona
Based on feats: probably Thanos.

I agree with this.

Would the IG even work on Krona, considering he had all those artifacts?

Grandmaster tried to use the IG on that Krona and failed.

Originally posted by Juntai
Grandmaster tried to use the IG on that Krona and failed.

Tried what? He and Metron purposely plotted to divert Krona to the MU. Supposedly he "tried" to stop Krona. If he didn't want Krona their, he wouldn't have agreed to Metron's terms. He'd outright kill Metron. He knew what he was doing and that death was involved. At the end, he was pleased that he'd played a game where all sides had won. Krona was a pawn like everyone else. The true game was Krona vs the MU/DC heroes, not Krona Vs GM. The stake of the game was his life and both universes depended on the heroes winning. He faked the whole thing.

Thanos

I thought one of the artifacts Krona had was IG?Wouldn't that mean the Krona has his power + the other artifacts?

Thanos, 10/10.

Krona. Being that Krona was The IG plus other powers, The IG alone couldn't beat itself plus other powers.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Thanos, 10/10. Exactly how?This is the pinnicle of fanboyism.Krona had IG + other artifacts.So how does IG beat itself and other things that are nearly equal in power.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Exactly how?This is the pinnicle of fanboyism.Krona had IG + other artifacts.So how does IG beat itself and other things that are nearly equal in power. Krona never beat the ig in battle and he was defeated by far less than the ig.

Originally posted by lawest9
This is the universe destroying and Galactus and Grandmaster destroying entity from the JLA/Avengers crossover.

Who wins?

While it's arguable whether Krona could have defeated all of the artifacts from JLA/Avengers (And after reading it again, I'm leaning towards being unable to.), I think he could take the gauntlet alone. Krona gave Galactus the worst beating of his written career, by far, and matched or exceeded the gauntlets highest feat by capturing both Eternity and Kismet. (And how great a feat was it for Hal Spectre to separate the universe lovers? Too bad we can't accept that as canon.)

Originally posted by Black bolt z
I thought one of the artifacts Krona had was IG?Wouldn't that mean the Krona has his power + the other artifacts?

Krona did say that, yes.

After Grandmaster used them, Krona took on their power.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Krona never beat the ig in battle and he was defeated by far less than the ig. And Krona has IG + other artifacts near IG in power.This is fanboyism at its finest.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
And Krona has IG + other artifacts near IG in power.This is fanboyism at its finest. Not even close. I suggest you reread the arc.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Not even close. I suggest you reread the arc. So Thanos w/ IG beats someone that has IG and many other artifacts that are near IG level.You say he just wins because it is thanos.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
So Thanos w/ IG beats someone that has IG and many other artifacts that are near IG level.You say he just wins because it is thanos. I go by what the comics give me I don't just make stuff up like you are known to do.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I go by what the comics give me I don't just make stuff up like you are known to do.

lol. wow. I think you have him confused with you BRAa
Why dont you show a scan proving his statement wrong instead of running that BS you do.

just change your Sig to Thanos and Void wins
that why you dont even have to bother posting, we will know

Originally posted by Stunner2xx
lol. wow. I think you have him confused with you BRAa
Why dont you show a scan proving his statement wrong instead of running that BS you do.

just change your Sig to Thanos and Void wins
that why you dont even have to bother posting, we will know Krona went down to far less than the ig and it takes time to adjust to such an item so please watch your step.

Krona.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
Krona. How?

Originally posted by quanchi112
I go by what the comics give me I don't just make stuff up like you are known to do.

Krona did have the items though. He mentioned having them, and they showed them, in JLA/Avengers 4.

They didn't simply vanish when Grandmaster was finished with them.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Krona went down to far less than the ig and it takes time to adjust to such an item so please watch your step.

Via plot device/weak point exploitation. This isn't something Hawkeye and Flash could have done before they infiltrated his lair.

In an arena match, this shouldn't be an issue.

Originally posted by cdtm
Krona did have the items though. He mentioned having them, and they showed them, in JLA/Avengers 4.

They didn't simply vanish when Grandmaster was finished with them. Gm didn't actively use the ig's powers against him.

Originally posted by cdtm
Via plot device/weak point exploitation. This isn't something Hawkeye and Flash could have done before they infiltrated his lair.

In an arena match, this shouldn't be an issue. Neither of these characters can affect Thanos anywhere with the ig. The ig can defeat Krona with a mere thought.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Gm didn't actively use the ig's powers against him.

Neither of these characters can affect Thanos anywhere with the ig. The ig can defeat Krona with a mere thought. How does the Ig defeat itself plus the power of other items?

Originally posted by lightyeargee
How does the Ig defeat itself plus the power of other items? By asserting control over reality. The same reason Hawkeye defeated Krona because deep down he wasn't uber he was just slightly above Galactus level.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Gm didn't actively use the ig's powers against him.


Which doesn't change the fact Krona had them in his possession by issue 4.

So it's effectively Thanos with IG vs Krona with all the power items combined, including the IG.

Originally posted by quanchi112
By asserting control over reality. The same reason Hawkeye defeated Krona because deep down he wasn't uber he was just slightly above Galactus level. Your reasoning is just um, well, ok now. Slightly above galactus? If this were galactus against a dc character, say the Spectre, you would be going on and on on how powerful Galactus is. Wait, you've already done that lulz. Krona is the embodiment of DC reality. He defeats eternity and kismet. Eternity is above Galactus by a fair amount.and the ig doesn't even work on dc realities.

Originally posted by cdtm
Which doesn't change the fact Krona had them in his possession by issue 4.

So it's effectively Thanos with IG vs Krona with all the power items combined, including the IG. Krona didn't use the other items in combat nor would he here.

Originally posted by lightyeargee
Your reasoning is just um, well, ok now. Slightly above galactus? If this were galactus against a dc character, say the Spectre, you would be going on and on on how powerful Galactus is. Wait, you've already done that lulz. Krona is the embodiment of DC reality. He defeats eternity and kismet. Eternity is above Galactus by a fair amount.and the ig doesn't even work on dc realities. No, he wasn't the embodiment of the dc reality. He beat Galactus mainly because he caught him off guard. In this thread the ig functions.

With CIS off by default, why wouldn't Krona use them here?

Originally posted by quanchi112
I go by what the comics give me I don't just make stuff up like you are known to do. So how does IG beat itself and other artifacts near equal to it in power?Explain.

Originally posted by quanchi112
How?

Because Stan Lee said Krona would win!!!

Originally posted by Black bolt z
So how does IG beat itself and other artifacts near equal to it in power?Explain. Krona never utilized the gems and used their powers in combat. Hawkeyes' arrows wouldn't even make Thanos blink an eye even if he just had the power gem.

Originally posted by quanchi112
By asserting control over reality. The same reason Hawkeye defeated Krona because deep down he wasn't uber he was just slightly above Galactus level. The Krona does the same and uses the other objects to wtfpwn thanos.You just want thanos to win.Yet you have no logic.It's just thanos wins for you.

And why wouldn't he use the artifacts?That makes no sense...The again thats quanchilogic for you.

Again, the rules clearly state CIS off is the default mode in threads. Which means there's no real reason Krona won't use the items in this fight, regardless of what he did in the comic..

Originally posted by cdtm
Again, the rules clearly state CIS off is the default mode in threads. Which means there's no real reason Krona won't use the items in this fight, regardless of what he did in the comic.. Well The Magus merged two realities in the ig saga. sKrona merged two mega realties or what ever you all them in jlavengers so it would seem that he did use the ig and the other items plus his power.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
The Krona does the same and uses the other objects to wtfpwn thanos.You just want thanos to win.Yet you have no logic.It's just thanos wins for you.

And why wouldn't he use the artifacts?That makes no sense...The again thats quanchilogic for you. He had them once and didn't use them. With the ig he could have defeated his opposition with a thought.

Originally posted by cdtm
Again, the rules clearly state CIS off is the default mode in threads. Which means there's no real reason Krona won't use the items in this fight, regardless of what he did in the comic.. Thanos beats him due to his superior will.

Originally posted by quanchi112

Thanos beats him due to his superior will.

Against ALL the items in his possession?

The gauntlet, the Evil Eye, the Cosmic Cube, and more...?

Originally posted by cdtm
Against ALL the items in his possession?

The gauntlet, the Evil Eye, the Cosmic Cube, and more...? They don't stack.

Originally posted by quanchi112
He had them once and didn't use them. With the ig he could have defeated his opposition with a thought.

Thanos beats him due to his superior will. If he uses them in this fight he obviously wins.Without using them(although there is no reason he wouldn't)thanos wins.Originally posted by quanchi112
They don't stack. Yes they do...why wouldn't they ?

Originally posted by Black bolt z
If he uses them in this fight he obviously wins.Without using them(although there is no reason he wouldn't)thanos wins. Yes they do...why wouldn't they ? How does he win?

Why did Magus not care about the cc's he had when the ig started working because the powers don't stack you noob.

Originally posted by quanchi112
How does he win?

Why did Magus not care about the cc's he had when the ig started working because the powers don't stack you noob. Using the artifacts including IG.How does IG beat itself and other things as strong as it?

What?He stopped using the CC's because the IG is much more powerful.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Using the artifacts including IG.How does IG beat itself and other things as strong as it?

What?He stopped using the CC's because the IG is much more powerful. Yes, because these items don't stack you just agreed with me. Why use these other items if the ig is more powerful, right?

Originally posted by quanchi112
How does he win?

Why did Magus not care about the cc's he had when the ig started working because the powers don't stack you noob.

Quanch,
Krona punched Galactus out. Punched him THE **** OUT! Game over.

Originally posted by tsscls
Quanch,
Krona punched Galactus out. Punched him THE **** OUT! Game over. Due to catching him off guard.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Due to catching him off guard. Galactus has cosmic awarness.How would that work?

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Galactus has cosmic awarness.How would that work? That doesn't mean he can't ever got caught off guard.

Originally posted by quanchi112
That doesn't mean he can't ever got caught off guard. And so by catching him off gaurd that means he's much easier to kill?Phail.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
And so by catching him off gaurd that means he's much easier to kill?Phail. Catching anyone off guard means they are easier to beat. Common sense.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Catching anyone off guard means they are easier to beat. Common sense. Even a cosmic...he still owned him.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Even a cosmic...he still owned him. Yes, because he got the drop on him.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Due to catching him off guard.
Really?
Off guard?
I don't buy that.
Galactus had at least five seconds to react given the on panel dialouge. I think we can both agree that five seconds equals an eternity to a being such as Galactus.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, because he got the drop on him. Catching galactus off gaurd now makes him much easier to kill?Phail.

Originally posted by tsscls
Really?
Off guard?
I don't buy that.
Galactus had at least five seconds to react given the on panel dialouge. I think we can both agree that five seconds equals an eternity to a being such as Galactus. Krona just attacked him though before Galactus knew it was on.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Catching galactus off gaurd now makes him much easier to kill?Phail. Yes, I thought we already went over this.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Krona just attacked him though before Galactus knew it was on.

Yes, I thought we already went over this. Catching someone off gaurd only gives you an advantage the first hit.So....no.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Krona just attacked him though before Galactus knew it was on.

Yes, I thought we already went over this.

Ridiculous!
Galactus knows all!
It's been proven so many times that he has cosmic awareness. I believe that you have argued that. You can't just catch the Big G.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Catching someone off gaurd only gives you an advantage the first hit.So....no. But with a heavyweight like Krona it gives him the edge.

Originally posted by tsscls
Ridiculous!
Galactus knows all!
It's been proven so many times that he has cosmic awareness. I believe that you have argued that. You can't just catch the Big G. Yes, you can. It's happened before and will happen again. Reed I think called his bulff on some fake un and he didn't even know. Wow.

Originally posted by quanchi112
But with a heavyweight like Krona it gives him the edge.

Yes, you can. It's happened before and will happen again. Reed I think called his bulff on some fake un and he didn't even know. Wow.
So Galactus has no cosmic awareness. According to you, cosmic awareness can be cancelled out by Reed Richards IQ? Is this the standrad you're prepared to live by?

Originally posted by tsscls
So Galactus has no cosmic awareness. According to you, cosmic awareness can be cancelled out by Reed Richards IQ? Is this the standrad you're prepared to live by? It's inconsistent writing but he can gets caught off guard all the time. The guy turned tech on Tyrant when he has control over tech yet you say he has ca and nothing ever catches him off guard. Quit being ridiculous.

That's PIS,right? Also, CIS?

Originally posted by quanchi112
It's inconsistent writing but he can gets caught off guard all the time. The guy turned tech on Tyrant when he has control over tech yet you say he has ca and nothing ever catches him off guard. Quit being ridiculous.

Krona punched Galctus TFO with no tech. BTW.

Sorry to come out of the lurking left field Quanch, but Krona has to win this. He was written this way, case closed.

superior willpower to a guardian of the universe.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Catching anyone off guard means they are easier to beat. Common sense. Like When DD caught DS off gaurd in Hunter Prey? Your Double standards ae now becoming epic.

Originally posted by tsscls
So Galactus has no cosmic awareness. According to you, cosmic awareness can be cancelled out by Reed Richards IQ? Is this the standrad you're prepared to live by? For him it is.

JLA/Avengers garbage is only rivaled in horse shit by Marvel vs DC,
that, or Tom & Jerry newspaper skits.

In this ridiculous asinine story DC & Marvel share the same Multiverse. dur

Krona defeats some of the most powerful items in both Marvel & DC
with the power of two alternate universes, and DC's entropy.

Krona needs 12 weapons to subdue entities that have been cracked by far less.
(the UN can erase Eternity's present existence and the IG can stomp and/or replace him)
If Kismet is supposed to be the equal to his fallacious alternate Eternity,
then she goes too, since those two items alone can get the job done.

Anyhow, Thanos conjures up Flash and Hawkeye for FTW.

Originally posted by Mr Master
JLA/Avengers garbage is only rivaled in horse shit by Marvel vs DC,
that, or Tom & Jerry newspaper skits.

In this ridiculous asinine story DC & Marvel share the same Multiverse. dur

Krona defeats some of the most powerful items in both Marvel & DC
with the power of two alternate universes, and DC's entropy.

Krona needs 12 weapons to subdue entities that have been cracked by far less.
(the UN can erase Eternity's present existence and the IG can stomp and/or replace him)
If Kismet is supposed to be the equal to his fallacious alternate Eternity,
then she goes too, since those two items alone can get the job done.

Anyhow, Thanos conjures up Flash and Hawkeye for FTW.
http://telepromptedanthems.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/u-mad1.jpg

Originally posted by Mr Master

Krona defeats some of the most powerful items in both Marvel & DC
with the power of two alternate universes, and DC's entropy.

Krona needs 12 weapons to subdue entities that have been cracked by far less.
(the UN can erase Eternity's present existence and the IG can stomp and/or replace him)
If Kismet is supposed to be the equal to his fallacious alternate Eternity,
then she goes too, since those two items alone can get the job done.

Anyhow, Thanos conjures up Flash and Hawkeye for FTW.

I thought JLA/Avengers was the definitive crossover. I didn't agree with some of the fight outcomes, like Thor having trouble with Firestorms containment field, but the story and epicness, along with nice little touches like making Metron and Grandmaster the real stars of the show, having Cap kick Prometheus's ass when he's using Batmans skills and his tricks, and giving us BATROC, make Marvel vs DC not even fit to wipe it's rear...

Anyways, as to the current argument: Just because Krona had all twelve weapons at his disposal, doesn't mean he "needed" to use all twelve to subdue them.

Also keep in mind, the IG would've been useless to subdue Kismet, seeing the gauntlet only affects 616 or the Marvel Multiverse.

Originally posted by cdtm
I thought JLA/Avengers was the definitive crossover. I didn't agree with some of the fight outcomes, like Thor having trouble with Firestorms containment field, but the story and epicness, along with nice little touches like making Metron and Grandmaster the real stars of the show, having Cap kick Prometheus's ass when he's using Batmans skills and his tricks, and giving us BATROC, make Marvel vs DC not even fit to wipe it's rear...

Anyways, as to the current argument: Just because Krona had all twelve weapons at his disposal, doesn't mean he "needed" to use all twelve to subdue them.

Also keep in mind, the IG would've been useless to subdue Kismet, seeing the gauntlet only affects 616 or the Marvel Multiverse. The gauntlet hasn't shown to be only able to affect 616.It has affected multiple universe.

However at the time of the crossover wasn't the IG deactivated?

Also I wonder if they will ever bring the gauntlet back.

And we don't know Krona only absorbed the power of two alternate universes. That's all we saw him absorb in the story, but we know he was operating for a long, long time since after he was banished from the DC universe, and before JLA/Avengers. There's really no way to determine how many universes he absorbed without being privy to his actions between the time he was banished, and the JLA/Avengers story.

Originally posted by cdtm
And we don't know Krona only absorbed the power of two alternate universes. That's all we saw him absorb in the story, but we know he was operating for a long, long time since after he was banished from the DC universe, and before JLA/Avengers. There's really no way to determine how many universes he absorbed without being privy to his actions between the time he was banished, and the JLA/Avengers story. But does krona nto have IG,UN and other artifacts of the same power?How does thanos win to someone with his power + many many others.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
But does krona nto have IG,UN and other artifacts of the same power?How does thanos win to someone with his power + many many others.

He shouldn't.

If the powers didn't stack between at least a few of the items, Grandmaster wouldn't have bothered having the heroes gather them up. He could've made the entire contest about the IG, and one or two other items for Krona to use for subduing Kismet.

And even if it was only IG vs IG, I'd give the edge to the former Guardian with eons of experience using high level powers and studying even higher level powers.. Not to mention Guardian = will incarnate. So yeah, will vs will isn't in Thanos's favor here..

Originally posted by cdtm

I thought JLA/Avengers was the definitive crossover. I didn't agree with some of the fight outcomes, like Thor having trouble with Firestorms containment field, but the story and epicness, along with nice little touches like making Metron and Grandmaster the real stars of the show, having Cap kick Prometheus's ass when he's using Batmans skills and his tricks, and giving us BATROC, make Marvel vs DC not even fit to wipe it's rear...
The cosmological aspect of the story was complete shit

I could care less about the fan based outcomes.

Marvel and DC do NOT share the same Multiverse, or even Omniverse,
that right there drowns the story in fallacious vomit.
Originally posted by cdtm

Just because Krona had all twelve weapons at his disposal, doesn't mean he "needed" to use all twelve to subdue them.
Actually, if know the story, and on panel artwork,
he DID indeed use All 12 items to subdue that alternate Eternity and Kismet. (book 4)

Originally posted by cdtm
He shouldn't.

If the powers didn't stack between at least a few of the items, Grandmaster wouldn't have bothered having the heroes gather them up. He could've made the entire contest about the IG, and one or two other items for Krona to use for subduing Kismet.

And even if it was only IG vs IG, I'd give the edge to the former Guardian with eons of experience using high level powers and studying even higher level powers.. Not to mention Guardian = will incarnate. So yeah, will vs will isn't in Thanos's favor here.. Ok I know Krona is a uber beats but beating thanos in a test of wills?Thats a bit of a stretch.Even doom would have problems with that and might lose.

Originally posted by Mr Master
The cosmological aspect of the story was complete shit

I could care less about the fan based outcomes.

Marvel and DC do NOT share the same Multiverse, or even Omniverse,
that right there drowns the story in fallacious vomit.

Actually, if know the story, and on panel artwork,
he DID indeed use All 12 items to subdue that alternate Eternity and Kismet. (book 4)
Is it really necessary to be so anal about cosmology?

I was also puzzled when they compared Kismet to Eternity but its not really that big of a deal.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Is it really necessary to be so anal about cosmology? Talk to a cosmologist and see what they say.Or a cosmotologist.

Originally posted by cdtm

And we don't know Krona only absorbed the power of two alternate universes. That's all we saw him absorb in the story, but we know he was operating for a long, long time since after he was banished from the DC universe, and before JLA/Avengers. There's really no way to determine how many universes he absorbed without being privy to his actions between the time he was banished, and the JLA/Avengers story.
The way we determine that is by reading.

Across the arc, at the beginning of every book it was confirmed that Krona destroyed/absorbed TWO Universes and nothing more, and now he was after his third and fourth,
(whatever DC Universe that housed those mainstream cats, and that alternate crap from Marvel)

I say "alternate" because Marvel has no spacial affiliation with DC.
So, whatever universe from Marvel was used, it was one that only exists in that story.

Originally posted by Mr Master
The cosmological aspect of the story was complete shit

I could care less about the fan based outcomes.

Marvel and DC do NOT share the same Multiverse, or even Omniverse,
that right there drowns the story in fallacious vomit.

If they can't co-exist somehow, they can't have a crossover.

Technically, you're correct, but if we don't suspend disbelief enough to allow a way for them to be in the same comic, that means a crossover isn't possible. They simply can't meet without some shoehorning..



He had all twelve items, and used all twelve items. That doesn't mean he NEEDED all twelve items.

Grandmaster collected them, Krona took them and used them. Would it make sense for him to discard the ones he didn't need, instead of going for broke?

Originally posted by cdtm
If they can't co-exist somehow, they can't have a crossover.

Technically, you're correct, but if we don't suspend disbelief enough to allow a way for them to be in the same comic, that means a crossover isn't possible. They simply can't meet without some shoehorning..
Right, which is why cross-overs are only significant withIN the cross-over,
and do not in any way pertain to any relevant story
that takes place withIN the actual DC and Marvel Omniverses.

Cross-overs to me are like stories that take place in a meeting place,
outside/disconnected from the true Marvel & DC realities.
Originally posted by cdtm

He had all twelve items, and used all twelve items. That doesn't mean he NEEDED all twelve items.

Grandmaster collected them, Krona took them and used them. Would it make sense for him to discard the ones he didn't need, instead of going for broke?
That's your unsupported opinion.

What we do know is that Krona did use ALL 12 items
to subdue that alternate Eternity and Kismet.

Please, don't come back with more, this is undeniable.

Do I really need to post the scans?

Originally posted by cdtm
If they can't co-exist somehow, they can't have a crossover.

Technically, you're correct, but if we don't suspend disbelief enough to allow a way for them to be in the same comic, that means a crossover isn't possible. They simply can't meet without some shoehorning..



He had all twelve items, and used all twelve items. That doesn't mean he NEEDED all twelve items.

Grandmaster collected them, Krona took them and used them. Would it make sense for him to discard the ones he didn't need, instead of going for broke? Yes thats exactly what it is.It's obvious they don't share the same omniverse and thats why its non canon.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Right, which is why cross-overs are only significant withIN the cross-over,
and do not in any way pertain to any relevant story
that takes place withIN the actual DC and Marvel Omniverses.

Cross-overs to me are like stories that take place in a meeting place,
outside/disconnected from the true Marvel & DC realities.

That's your unsupported opinion.

What we do know is that Krona did use ALL 12 items
to subdue that alternate Eternity and Kismet.
Except the Cosmic Egg showed up later in a canon DC story.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Ok I know Krona is a uber beats but beating thanos in a test of wills?Thats a bit of a stretch.Even doom would have problems with that and might lose.

Even being reduced to harmless, free floating energy wasn't enough to keep Krona down from his single minded, obsessive quest. He has a pretty powerful will himself.

Originally posted by cdtm
Even being reduced to harmless, free floating energy wasn't enough to keep Krona down from his single minded, obsessive quest. He has a pretty powerful will himself. Was he just that powerful or was it his will?I mean thanos's will(and experience with ultimate power)allowed him to merge with HOTU.Thats a good will.

Originally posted by Omega Vision

Except the Cosmic Egg showed up later in a canon DC story.
Like I give a shit what takes place in DC, or what comedy they wish to run.

Anyhow, quite a different Krona ey?

Originally posted by Mr Master


That's your unsupported opinion.

What we do know is that Krona did use ALL 12 items
to subdue that alternate Eternity and Kismet.

Please, don't come back with more, this is undeniable.

Do I really need to post the scans?

We know he took 12 items from Grandmaster, and used those 12 items to subdue Krona and Kismet.

Saying he absolutely needed all 12 items is unproven.

Correlation does not equal causation.

Originally posted by cdtm

We know he took 12 items from Grandmaster, and used those 12 items to subdue Krona and Kismet.

Saying he absolutely needed all 12 items is unproven.

Causation does not equal correlation.
facepalm

Whatever,
I'll stick to garbage depicted On Panel artwork with character narration,
you stick to self serving unsupported logic.

This is where I'm done.

Now, if you have any proof of any kind that suggest I'm wrong, bring it,
otherwise, I must ceased from a circle surely to form.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Like I give a shit what takes place in DC, or what comedy they wish to run.

Anyhow, quite a different Krona ey?
Alright but you stated that crossovers have no effect outside of the context of a crossover, something that is patently false as shown by the Cosmic Egg appearing in DC again.

Also you seem to have an inexplicable fixation on this: shit

Originally posted by Mr Master
facepalm

Whatever,
I'll stick to garbage depicted On Panel artwork with character narration,
you stick to self serving unsupported logic.

This is where I'm done.

Now, if you have any proof of any kind that suggest I'm wrong, bring it,
otherwise, I must ceased from a circle surely to form.

With all due respect, correlation does not equal causation. If Krona collected the power items himself, maybe you'd have the higher ground. But he didn't. He simply picked them up, and used them. There was no planning on his part that he needed X amount of power.

It's really that simple. If the us army uses a tactical bomb to take out one person, does this mean a bomb is needed to kill one person?

Originally posted by Omega Vision

Alright but you stated that crossovers have no effect outside of the context of a crossover, something that is patently false as shown by the Cosmic Egg appearing in DC again.
ONLY DC on panel recognizes what took place in that nonsense,
and ONLY what pertains to DC.

Marvel's participation was not depicted in Trinity. (current DC Krona story)

So, it's patently true,
that on panel Marvel has kept that shit where it belongs ... in toilet bowls.

Mr. M seems to be in a bad mood...

Originally posted by cdtm
With all due respect, correlation does not equal causation. If Krona collected the power items himself, maybe you'd have the higher ground. But he didn't. He simply picked them up, and used them. There was no planning on his part that he needed X amount of power.

It's really that simple. If the us army uses a tactical bomb to take out one person, does this mean a bomb is needed to kill one person?
Originally posted by Mr Master
facepalm

Whatever,
I'll stick to garbage depicted On Panel artwork with character narration,
you stick to self serving unsupported logic.

This is where I'm done.

Now, if you have any proof of any kind that suggest I'm wrong, bring it,
otherwise, I must ceased from a circle surely to form.
Read the story if you haven't already.

Krona specifically states that he will bound Eternity/Kismet with his new found power. (items)

Originally posted by Mr Master
ONLY DC on panel recognizes what took place in that nonsense,
and ONLY what pertains to DC.

Marvel's participation was not depicted in Trinity. (current DC Krona story)

So, it's patently true,
that on panel Marvel has kept that shit where it belongs ... in toilet bowls.

So have you ever met a crossover you liked?

Pretty much all of them are shit imo.

Originally posted by Mr Master
ONLY DC on panel recognizes what took place in that nonsense,
and ONLY what pertains to DC.

Marvel's participation was not depicted in Trinity. (current DC Krona story)

So, it's patently true,
that on panel Marvel has kept that shit where it belongs ... in toilet bowls. The Cosmic Egg is a trademark of Marvel. Thus for DC to use the term, Marvel had to give explicit permission, which also means, they aso recognize the events of JLAvengers to be canon.

Originally posted by Mr Master
ONLY DC on panel recognizes what took place in that nonsense,
and ONLY what pertains to DC.

Marvel's participation was not depicted in Trinity. (current DC Krona story)

So, it's patently true,
that on panel Marvel has kept that shit where it belongs ... in toilet bowls.
As seen below you clearly made a blanket statement pertaining to both:
Originally posted by Mr Master
Right, which is why cross-overs are only significant withIN the cross-over,
and do not in any way pertain to any relevant story
that takes place withIN the actual DC and Marvel Omniverses.

Cross-overs to me are like stories that take place in a meeting place,
outside/disconnected from the true Marvel & DC realities.

Now you switch to the tried and true "well Marvel never recognized it so nyeh"

Originally posted by Mr Master
Read the story if you haven't already.

Krona specifically states that he will bound Eternity/Kismet with his new found power. (items)

I've read it, many times.

My argument stands.

Originally posted by cdtm

So have you ever met a crossover you liked?

Pretty much all of them are shit imo.


Originally posted by lightyeargee

The Cosmic Egg is a trademark of Marvel. Thus for DC to use the term, Marvel had to give explicit permission, which also means, they aso recognize the events of JLAvengers to be canon.


It's fallacious posts like these that are upsetting me lately.

"Marvel trademark?" ...

The Cosmic Egg is a term invented by real world scientists that have been around since 1930's
to define the beginning of the Universe, how it was housed in an atom of infinite energy.

Alexander Friedmann gave it substance in the Einstein days.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Mr. M seems to be in a bad mood...

The funny thing, is his argument is essentially at odds with quanchi believing the items can't stack. Because if he needed the power of all twelve items, obviously they stacked.

That means Thanos doesn't have a chance here, given CIS/PIS is off by default. Krona has the power of 12 items, stacked, without CIS/PIS...

Originally posted by Mr Master





It's fallacious posts like these that are upsetting me lately.

"Marvel trademark?" ...

The Cosmic Egg is a term invented by real world scientists that have been around since 1930's
to define the beginning of the Universe, how it was housed in an atom of infinite energy.

Alexander Friedmann gave it substance in the Einstein days.
And Wolverine is an animal that God created and yet Marvel has the term or name Wolverine Trade Marked. Infinity is also Trademarked as well as Eternity. Need I go on? Your argument was cute tho.

Originally posted by Omega Vision

As seen below you clearly made a blanket statement pertaining to both:

Now you switch to the tried and true "well Marvel never recognized it so nyeh"
Homie, if the DC update in Trinity ONLY involves DC,
then whatever happened in the cross-over is moot concerning a connection of the two.

Anyone who reads Trinity and never read JLA/Avengers,
would have NO idea that Marvel was involved with Krona back them,
since Trinity makes NO mention of anything even resembling Marvel.

It's like a retcon, not only is Krona WAYYYY weaker in Trinity,
but his history has also changed concerning the Marvel aspect of the comedy.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Homie, if the DC update in Trinity ONLY involves DC,
then whatever happened in the cross-over is moot concerning a connection of the two.

Anyone who reads Trinity and never read JLA/Avengers,
would have NO idea that Marvel was involved with Krona back them,
since Trinity makes NO mention of anything even resembling Marvel.

It's like a retcon, not only is Krona WAYYYY weaker in Trinity,
but his history has also changed concerning the Marvel aspect of the comedy.
Why are you calling it a comedy? Because you don't like it?

Originally posted by lightyeargee

And Wolverine is an animal that God created and yet Marvel has the term or name Wolverine Trade Marked. Infinity is also Trademarked as well as Eternity. Need I go on? Your argument was cute tho.
Nah, you just need to prove this fallacy:
Originally posted by lightyeargee

Marvel had to give explicit permission,
which also means,
they aso recognize the events of JLAvengers to be canon.
Until them, there's nothing for you to add.

Originally posted by lightyeargee
Why are you calling it a comedy? Because you don't like it? Doesn't matter if you think he's wrong...you don't argue with Mr. M

Originally posted by lightyeargee

Why are you calling it a comedy? Because you don't like it?
Because DC & Marvel share the same Multiverse in it.

Which is not only comedy, but horse shit ...

That's aside from all the absurdness that ran rampant across the arc.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Homie, if the DC update in Trinity ONLY involves DC,
then whatever happened in the cross-over is moot concerning a connection of the two.

Anyone who reads Trinity and never read JLA/Avengers,
would have NO idea that Marvel was involved with Krona back them,
since Trinity makes NO mention of anything even resembling Marvel.

It's like a retcon, not only is Krona WAYYYY weaker in Trinity,
but his history has also changed concerning the Marvel aspect of the comedy.
The Cosmic Egg also appeared in JLA 107 though.

I'm not trying to argue that the crossover is canon to both Universes, only that your original statement that the crossover itself had no impact is utter crap. Something you seem to have difficulty admitting:
http://www.qis.net/~jschmitz/lj/butthurt3.jpg

Originally posted by Mr Master
Because DC & Marvel share the same Multiverse in it.

Which is not only comedy, but horse shit ...

That's aside from all the absurdness that ran rampant across the arc. They didn't share the same Multiverse. Even you yourself says that Eternity is the Multiverse. And Kismet was the DC multiverse. So how could they share the same Multiverse if Kismet and Eternity were both in it? They share the same Omniverse. All things fiction which is a term Mark Gruenwald made popular.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
The Cosmic Egg also appeared in JLA 107 though.

I'm not trying to argue that the crossover is canon to both Universes, only that your original statement that the crossover itself had no impact is utter crap. Something you seem to have difficulty admitting:
http://www.qis.net/~jschmitz/lj/butthurt3.jpg Thats...disturbing.

Seriouslsy, your bestiality fetishes are not necessary to strengthen your argument.
Originally posted by Omega Vision

The Cosmic Egg also appeared in JLA 107 though.

I'm not trying to argue that the crossover is canon to both Universes, only that your original statement that the crossover itself had no impact is utter crap. Something you seem to have difficulty admitting:

The Cosmic Egg can be mentioned in every story that was ever been produced by DC,
and it still has no bearing on the fact
that the cross-over is meaningless where Marvel is concerned.

Please, if you can't comprehend what I'm saying. just ignore me.

Originally posted by Mr Master
Seriouslsy, your bestiality fetishes are not necessary to strengthen your argument.

The Cosmic Egg can be mentioned in every story that was ever been produced by DC,
and it still has no bearing on the fact
that the cross-over is meaningless where Marvel is concerned.

Please, if you can't comprehend what I'm saying. just ignore me. Monica Rambeau's Bio mentions that Cross over. And a few others from marvel. If it's meaningless where Marvel is concerned why did they mention it?

Originally posted by lightyeargee

They didn't share the same Multiverse. Even you yourself says that Eternity is the Multiverse. And Kismet was the DC multiverse. So how could they share the same Multiverse if Kismet and Eternity were both in it? They share the same Omniverse. All things fiction which is a term Mark Gruenwald made popular.
facepalm

Eternity is the Multiverse in official Marvel comics, and his form stretches across all creation.

Eternity/Kismet was part of a single Multiverse in the JLA/Avengers arc.

Marvel has its own Omniverse.

I, and many others here, have proven this time and time again.

(with On Panel and Handbook unshakable proof)

Originally posted by Mr Master
Seriouslsy, your bestiality fetishes are not necessary to strengthen your argument.

The Cosmic Egg can be mentioned in every story that was ever been produced by DC,
and it still has no bearing on the fact
that the cross-over is meaningless where Marvel is concerned.

Please, if you can't comprehend what I'm saying. just ignore me.
Your coprophilia is kosher though, amirite?

Oh I comprehend what you're saying. I also comprehend the fact that you're dodging my real point. Where the **** did I say it effected Marvel? I'm saying it effected DC and even though you're too much of a Marvel Zombie to care about that side of the fence it doesn't change the fact that the crossover had an effect on that company.

Originally posted by lightyeargee

Monica Rambeau's Bio mentions that Cross over. And a few others from marvel. If it's meaningless where Marvel is concerned why did they mention it?


Show me one bio where any DC character name is mentioned.

Show me where in any official Marvel title is the title JLA/Avengers mentioned.

Don't come at me with vague impossible to define referrences from two bios.
If it's canon, then Marvel should have no fear of lawsuits in writing the actual names.

I gotta go, we'll continue this some other time.

And there is no way that DC and eternity share the same omniverse because 616 spand out and creates the marvle omniverse.So unless 616 created DC they don't share the omniverse.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
And there is no way that DC and eternity share the same omniverse because 616 spand out and creates the marvle omniverse.So unless 616 created DC they don't share the omniverse.
The reason I don't believe there should be an Omniverse is the inability of any company to lay claim to it.

Originally posted by Mr Master
facepalm

Eternity is the Multiverse in official Marvel comics, and his form stretches across all creation.

Eternity/Kismet was part of a single Multiverse in the JLA/Avengers arc.

Marvel has its own Omniverse.

I, and many others here, have proven this time and time again.

(with On Panel and Handbook unshakable proof)
You are completely Missing it. Krona wanted the secret to the creation of all. Not of a universe or a multiverse. of the everything. In the story it makes no mention of Eternity being a singular universe. Unless you are conceding that he is indeed singular. The story is canon and Marvel Bio's and DC's use of the events prove that it is canon and it did have an effect. If Kismet and Eternity were part of the same multiverse, then they would have been the same. Like two Eternity's or Two Kismets. That is not the case. And Marvel can have it's own Omniverse all it wants that is fine but, there is a larger Omnivere that is all things fiction that allows cross overs like Marvel Star Trek and DC Mortal Kombat. This Omniverse is the one where this cross over took place. And it is recognized by both companies. What ever you don't like about it is not my concern. Marvel Bio's and DC Trinity both validate the cross over.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
The reason I don't believe there should be an Omniverse is the inability of any company to lay claim to it. You mean no specific company controls it?I'm missing your point.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
You mean no specific company controls it?I'm missing your point.
To be a true Omniverse it would have to include everything (even the real world).

Originally posted by Omega Vision
To be a true Omniverse it would have to include everything (even the real world). No because it is still in a comic.Still just a piece of paper.Also there probably is a relfection of the real world but it's still in the comic.

2 different companies,2 different TOAA's,2 different omniverses.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
No because it is still in a comic.Still just a piece of paper.Also there probably is a relfection of the real world but it's still in the comic.

2 different companies,2 different TOAA's,2 different omniverses. Omni means all. There is only one true Omniverse.

Originally posted by lightyeargee
Omni means all. There is only one true Omniverse. But the comic omniverse is still ruled by a supreme being i.e. TOAA/presence.2 companies,2 supreme beings to rule th omniverse,2 omniverses.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
But the comic omniverse is still ruled by a supreme being i.e. TOAA/presence.2 companies,2 supreme beings to rule th omniverse,2 omniverses. the comics omniverse and all fiction verses such as star wars, mortal kombat, etc are ruled by one true supreme being. The readers. we dictate what is hot and what is not. what sells and what doesn't.

Originally posted by lightyeargee
the comics omniverse and all fiction verses such as star wars, mortal kombat, etc are ruled by one true supreme being. The readers. we dictate what is hot and what is not. what sells and what doesn't. But if the writers of the 2 different companies choose to make 2 omniverses they can.They are TOAA.If they choose to have more then 1 omniverse in their company they can.They makes the rules.2 companies/2 supreme beings(writers,artists)/2 omniverses.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
But if the writers of the 2 different companies choose to make 2 omniverses they can.They are TOAA.If they choose to have more then 1 omniverse in their company they can.They makes the rules.2 companies/2 supreme beings(writers,artists)/2 omniverses. No.They still have rules they have to follow. Such as linear progression, artist direction, printing, effective communication etc. Those are things they cannot change.

Originally posted by lightyeargee
No.They still have rules they have to follow. Such as linear progression, artist direction, printing, effective communication etc. Those are things they cannot change. What happens in the comic they decide.If they want to have 5 omniverses they can.They make the rules.

^^

That aside, if anyone wants to claim that DC & Marvel share the same Omniverse,
or that the "real world" is part of a comic book reality ...

Then they should concede that HOM Wanda tore down DC and the "real world" to pieces,
then put it back together with a thought ... which is also equally ridiculous.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff191/Galan_photos/th_mjj0.jpg

Isn't roma the gaurdian of the omniverse?She doesn't watch of DC does she?

Also,what comics have MJJ in them?I wanna read them

Originally posted by Mr Master
^^

That aside, if anyone wants to claim that DC & Marvel share the same Omniverse,
or that the "real world" is part of a comic book reality ...

Then they should concede that HOM Wanda tore down DC and the "real world" to pieces,
then put it back together with a thought ... which is also equally ridiculous.

http://i238.photobucket.com/albums/ff191/Galan_photos/th_mjj0.jpg
How would you know if it happened or not? You got cosmic awareness, brah? dur

Originally posted by Omega Vision
How would you know if it happened or not? You got cosmic awareness, brah? dur Acctually yes he does.

There is one Omniverse. Anything else under one company's belt is just their megaverse. They can call it what they want, but the true definition of Omni cannot be changed.

doh

Omni, means "all"

Omniverse, means "all universes"

All of Marvel's Universes = their Omniverse.

Simple, nothing is being changed.

btw. Gruenwald came up with the term "Omniverse"
and Gruenwald was the Editor of the pre-quel to the Black Celestial arc, (Avengers)
which mentioned many times over how the Omniverse would be destroyed by insatiable Galactus.

Literally, the word "Omniverse" was stated over 10 times,
Gruenwald vouched,
so I guess again, Marvel characters can wipe out DC, Mortal Kombat
and even the real world.

http://27.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_kz4s36lyht1qb7qwco1_400.jpg @ this thread.

Originally posted by tsscls
Krona punched Galctus TFO with no tech. BTW. Because he was really powerful and caught him off guard.

Originally posted by tsscls
That's PIS,right? Also, CIS? The point is ca doesn't mean he can't even screw up and be caught off guard it happens all the time.

Originally posted by Juntai
superior willpower to a guardian of the universe. Yes, he's Thanos and has defeated Eternity based off his willpower.

Originally posted by lightyeargee
Like When DD caught DS off gaurd in Hunter Prey? Your Double standards ae now becoming epic. They were already in a fight and Darkseid was overconfident.

Thanos hasn't beaten eternity due to willpower...where do you get that idea?

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Thanos hasn't beaten eternity due to willpower...where do you get that idea? It actually states it in the comic.

Originally posted by quanchi112
It actually states it in the comic. Not to my memory.I mean thanos has a high will but beating eternity because of it?I don't have access to my comic book right now so if you could post scans.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Not to my memory.I mean thanos has a high will but beating eternity because of it?I don't have access to my comic book right now so if you could post scans. I'd have to plug in my hard drive and I am not feeling up to it.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
To be a true Omniverse it would have to include everything (even the real world).

Earth Prime!

I don't really see the big deal with the cosmology.. Yeah, DC and Marvel have their own seperate omni-verses or whatever you want to call them, because they're owned by two separate companies. That doesn't mean each omniverse can't co-exist outside the walls of their own personal realities..

Maybe DC and MU exist in the same dimensional void Lucifers personal universe co-existed in with the DCU, and specific events brought them close enough together to interact?

Once upon a time, Fawcett and Wildstorm were seperate omniverses too. Than DC bought them out, and things changed. It's not unprecedented, and it's not a big deal..

And in the end, it's just a story specifically designed for cool crossovers with different characters. Whether it's canon or not isn't something I consider worth arguing to the death over....

Originally posted by quanchi112
I'd have to plug in my hard drive and I am not feeling up to it. OK.Computer problems for me too.You ever used safari powered by verizon wireless?You have like 10 min of uber fast then you gotta restart the modem.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
OK.Computer problems for me too.You ever used safari powered by verizon wireless?You have like 10 min of uber fast then you gotta restart the modem. Safari isn't that a mac search engine?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Safari isn't that a mac search engine? Yep.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Yep. My ex had it I didn't care for it myself.

Originally posted by cdtm
Earth Prime!

I don't really see the big deal with the cosmology.. Yeah, DC and Marvel have their own seperate omni-verses or whatever you want to call them, because they're owned by two separate companies. That doesn't mean each omniverse can't co-exist outside the walls of their own personal realities..

Maybe DC and MU exist in the same dimensional void Lucifers personal universe co-existed in with the DCU, and specific events brought them close enough together to interact?

Once upon a time, Fawcett and Wildstorm were seperate omniverses too. Than DC bought them out, and things changed. It's not unprecedented, and it's not a big deal..

And in the end, it's just a story specifically designed for cool crossovers with different characters. Whether it's canon or not isn't something I consider worth arguing to the death over....

DC has a metaverse. Whatever that means.

Originally posted by quanchi112
[Because he was really powerful and caught him off guard.

Really powerful? Powerful enough to BFR the Grandmaster and Galactus and destroy the Anti-Matter Universe that the Anti-Monitor is currently a part of. Plus the countless others he destroyed in his quest for knowledge. Krona was caught off guard by Hawkeye + Flash. By your logic, Hawkeye+Flash>Galactus if he was caught off guard?

Originally posted by quanchi112
My ex had it I didn't care for it myself. Total fail.Like 5 min of speed then 10 min of restart.