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who are the top 10 fastest runners in marvel and dc ?
no flight

example
1. black adam
2. flash
3. captain marvel
4. solomon grundy
5. runner
6 . quicksilver
7. superman
8. hulk
9. thor
10. rhino

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
who are the top 10 fastest runners in marvel and dc ?
no flight

example
1. black adam
2. flash
3. captain marvel
4. solomon grundy
5. runner
6 . quicksilver
7. superman
8. hulk
9. thor
10. rhino

Solomon Grundy and Rhino... obviously.

its just example

inb4close/ban

why would it closed? the guys i named are just example

Flash if its only running

Wally or Barry for DC. Marvel speed works a little differently as a lot of "fast" characters in reality use hyperspace tunnels to zoom from point a to point b.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
who are the top 10 fastest runners in marvel and dc ?
no flight

example
1. black adam
2. flash
3. captain marvel
4. solomon grundy
5. runner
6 . quicksilver
7. superman
8. hulk
9. thor
10. rhino

1 flash
2 superman and runner are a close tie, id give the edge to runner
3 cap and ba

and the rest all suck minus thor and hes not know for running so who cares

1 runner
2 zoom
3 flash
4 surfer
5 superman

For marvel it's probably Northstar and his sister Aurora. Practical speed of Mach 10, Theoretical speed of 99% of light speed. Both CAN fly, but can hit the same speeds on foot no problem.

HOWEVER, since marvel has no speed force, hitting this speed would both severely damage their bodies, and wreck the environment in the process.

edit: makkari is probably right up there, since he can run at "near light speed" (despite what marvel says about environmental destruction re: northstar and his sister) without wrecking his body.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Solomon Grundy and Rhino... obviously.

Originally posted by The Nuul
should add jugernaut to the list

Originally posted by chomperx9
1 runner
2 zoom
3 flash
4 surfer
5 superman since when is surfer known for running

Zoom
Flash
Superman
Runner
..
..
..
Quicksilver
..
..
..
Thor
..
..
..
Silver Surfer

Quicksilver. Close thread.

Originally posted by shokosugi
Zoom
Flash
Superman
Runner
..
..
..
Quicksilver
..
..
..
Thor
..
..
..
Silver Surfer how come superman isnt listed 1st ?

Originally posted by shokosugi
Zoom
Flash
Superman
Runner
..
..
..
Quicksilver
..
..
..
Thor
..
..
..
Silver Surfer

In DC: Zoom.
In Marvel: Runner.

Don't forget guys, as of Siege Quicksilver is FTL.

and once again the speedster twins are neglected for shame.

Originally posted by -K-M-
and once again the speedster twins are neglected for shame.

This thread is only for first class speedsters like Rhino and Grundy. GTFO!

Originally posted by -K-M-
and once again the speedster twins are neglected for shame.

wallys' kids? well in flash rebirth they had no speed...they had other powers....until the end and one became impulse.....


that was actually something in particular i hated

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
This thread is only for first class speedsters like Rhino and Grundy. GTFO!

Izzzz sowwy

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
wallys' kids? well in flash rebirth they had no speed...they had other powers....until the end and one became impulse.....

that was actually something in particular i hated

No, I was refering to Northstar and Aurora.

Originally posted by shokosugi
Runner
Zoom
Flash
Black Adam/Captain Marvel
Superman/Quicksilver
Makari/Northstar/Aurora
..
..
..
..
Hulk
Thor


Fixed.

Quicksilver faster then the twins? heh!

Originally posted by Galan007
In DC: Zoom.
In Marvel: Runner. since when is zoom "fast"?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
who are the top 10 fastest runners in marvel and dc ?
no flight

example
1. black adam
2. flash
3. captain marvel
4. solomon grundy
5. runner
6 . quicksilver
7. superman
8. hulk
9. thor
10. rhino

Going by showings... not in order.

Black adam has ran mach 500 but we really can't count this because jay was stealing speed from him.

Flash is a true light speedster runner.

Captain marvel doesn't have one showing of foot running but I would put him in the same boat as BA so we basically do not know.

Solomon grundy... not one showing so we would be guessing.

Runner can fly through space at speeds rivaling light but he has never had a foot race.

The only speed that was quoted for quicksilver that I know of is 225 mph... the rest is hyperbole... unless someone else have a quote while he was running.

The only quote that I know of from superman was during his race against flash... it was stated that supes was running at 2000 mps... if anyone else have another instance... please advise.

Hulk has ran 500 mph but the thing people fail to realize when bringing this up about hulk is that it was ultimate hulk that was running that fast... not the true hulk.

Thor is the same as grundy... not one showing.

Rhino has ran up to 160 mph unless you all know of something else.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
since when is zoom "fast"? Since he gained the ability to trounce multiple Flashes (Flashi?) like they were nothing? Imo if you percieve something as being incredibly fast, it's fast (whether it exists in your timeline or not...) And fyi the Eobard Thawne version of Zoom IS fast, in the most literal sense of the word.

So I'm right either way. You're wrong. uhuh

Originally posted by -K-M-
Quicksilver faster then the twins? heh!

Why do I somehow feel that you can prove that the twins are at least as fast as Pietro... well judging by the "heh".

Originally posted by Stoic
Why do I somehow feel that you can prove that the twins are at least as fast as Pietro... well judging by the "heh".

That would be very easy to prove since northstar BLITZED emma in a thousandths of a second and then proceeded to blitz cyclops at light speed.

Your turn.

The only person in this thread that I honestly believe could POSSIBLY (don't know for sure) faster than them is flash.

Originally posted by Stoic
Why do I somehow feel that you can prove that the twins are at least as fast as Pietro... well judging by the "heh". Mungi can prove anything. It's best to just let him be. none

Originally posted by -K-M-



No, I was refering to Northstar and Aurora. i c my bad...


Originally posted by Galan007
Since he gained the ability to trounce multiple Flashes (Flashi?) like they were nothing? Imo if you percieve something as being incredibly fast, it's fast (whether it exists in your timeline or not...) And fyi the Eobard Thawne version of Zoom IS fast, in the most literal sense of the word.

So I'm right either way. You're wrong. uhuh

i think he was referring to the fact that Zoom's power is time based not speed based and prof Zoom is the one that's speed based.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
i c my bad...




i think he was referring to the fact that Zoom's power is time based not speed based and prof Zoom is the one that's speed based. I know. My post addressed that.

Originally posted by Galan007
I know. My post addressed that.
So it did.

In The Flash #209 Superman kept up easily with the Flash at over 2000 mph.

2009 Holloween Special- Superman And Flash race around the world at nearly 186,000 miles per sec

Originally posted by paisapower
In The Flash #209 Superman kept up easily with the Flash at over 2000 mph.

2009 Holloween Special- Superman And Flash race around the world at nearly 186,000 miles per sec

No they didnt ... flash and supes was running around the world and flash decides to turn it up and leaves supes and hit light speed and left him in the dust.

Originally posted by carver9
No they didnt ... flash and supes was running around the world and flash decides to turn it up and leaves supes and hit light speed and left him in the dust.

I dont know what your talking about, but in the Holloween special they're neck to neck with the pyramid of Giza as the finish line. Flash wins only because he vibrated through the pyramid while superman ran over it

Originally posted by paisapower
I dont know what your talking about, but in the Holloween special they're neck to neck with the pyramid of Giza as the finish line. Flash wins only because he vibrated through the pyramid while superman ran over it

Ok... we are talking about two different races... you are talking about pre crisis feats.

Originally posted by carver9
Ok... we are talking about two different races... you are talking about pre crisis feats.

Yes ,we are talking about different races.
No, not pre-crisis 2009 Holloween Special

Originally posted by paisapower
In The Flash #209 Superman kept up easily with the Flash at over 2000 mph.

Correction 2000 miles per second

Isn't Makkari faster than runner due to that speed ability that he got stuck in super speed with.

Originally posted by Uriel005
Isn't Makkari faster than runner due to that speed ability that he got stuck in super speed with.

Not too sure about that, the Runner ran rings around Surfer as he flew through space.

Originally posted by carver9
That would be very easy to prove since northstar BLITZED emma in a thousandths of a second and then proceeded to blitz cyclops at light speed.

Your turn.

No, you didn't get it, I want to learn who is the fastest guys, what I put down was just my opinion. If I'm wrong so be it... no biggie.

DC- Flash
Marvel - Runner

Originally posted by tkitna
DC- Flash
Marvel - Runner
again in the race that runner set up for the fastest being didn't Makkari use a speed ability that got him stuck in super-speed so only other speedsters could understand him. I do believe he was faster just not in a good way.

Originally posted by Uriel005
again in the race that runner set up for the fastest being didn't Makkari use a speed ability that got him stuck in super-speed so only other speedsters could understand him. I do believe he was faster just not in a good way. iirc they could all do that just none of them were willing to risk getting caught in non-stop motion.

Originally posted by thanos-prime
iirc they could all do that just none of them were willing to risk getting caught in non-stop motion. only makkari was able to do it, runner was the only other person that could

Originally posted by paisapower
In The Flash #209 Superman kept up easily with the Flash at over 2000 mph.

2009 Holloween Special- Superman And Flash race around the world at nearly 186,000 miles per sec

Superman is no where in the same league of speed with flash....i hope your not being serious

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
Superman is no where in the same league of speed with flash....i hope your not being serious indeed, flash made superman look like a statue compared to his speed

Originally posted by carver9
Ok... we are talking about two different races... you are talking about pre crisis feats.

ok well i know that happened in rebirth....flash and sups along side each other....superman says im as fast as you we have raced and some of those ive won....Barry then replies those were for charity and zooms off leaving sups in the dust....

also when wally was searching for linda after she had gone away....superman confronted him asking for answers(this was after hal had erased everyone's memory as to who flash was) he tried to keep up with wally to stop him and wally zooms off only to be caught up with after he stops moving.

Anybody mention DC Hermes?

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
indeed, flash made superman look like a statue compared to his speed

the fight where flash was fighting zoom?

Originally posted by Stoic
Why do I somehow feel that you can prove that the twins are at least as fast as Pietro... well judging by the "heh".

They have ALWAYS been faster then QS, also yes I can. What era do you want me to use?

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
Superman is no where in the same league of speed with flash....i hope your not being serious

Billy Tucci the writer was serious. In a interview he said Dc ok'd the story to finally tell whos faster.

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
indeed, flash made superman look like a statue compared to his speed

Thats just one showing over plenty that have Flash as slightly faster.

In JLA #10 he makes Flash (jay gerrick) and Power Girl look like statues in mid fight

Originally posted by paisapower
Billy Tucci the writer was serious. In a interview he said Dc ok'd the story to finally tell whos faster.

Dude, that was two kids racing in halloween costumes.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
ok well i know that happened in rebirth....flash and sups along side each other....superman says im as fast as you we have raced and some of those ive won....Barry then replies those were for charity and zooms off leaving sups in the dust....

also when wally was searching for linda after she had gone away....superman confronted him asking for answers(this was after hal had erased everyone's memory as to who flash was) he tried to keep up with wally to stop him and wally zooms off only to be caught up with after he stops moving.

I guess we really dont know what happened in either comic.

In Flash Rebirth #3- supes keeps up just fine until Barry goes all out. And only because he starts entering the speed force. Flashes very first comment in the next panel is ," A band of muscle in my thigh tightens up", just to illustrate his extra effort.

In The Flash #209- All we see is superman keeping up just fine even though Wally is trying to shake him off as he locates Linda.

Point #1- Wally says , "In raw speed superman and I used to be evenly matched. Id say he might have been a tad faster. " (Before he learnt to better tap into speed force)

Point #2- Wally contimplates steeling his kinetic energy but doesnt want to risk the collateral damage. (proof he wants him off his back)

Point #3- Flash says he figures he'll loose supes through the Rockies. Then he says ,"I figure wrong", as he cant.

Point#4- Superman tries to slow him down with small beam of H.V. wich Flash outspeeds saying ,"I'm faster than heat vision."(but obviously not fast enough to blow supes away, in fact supes immediatly catches him but Wally vibrates out of grip.)

Point#5- Only with the apartment building in sight and superman about to grab him again does Flash say,"the thoughts of linda give me my second wind,no one can touch me with her help" and gets inside an insatant before supes.

Just to show the effort needed to be faster

Originally posted by Desaad
Dude, that was two kids racing in halloween costumes.

Come on guy, the ending which illustrated the winner by switching over to the kids in costume was a holloween treat.

If u wont believe me or what is clear in the comic read the writers interview.

Originally posted by carver9
That would be very easy to prove since northstar BLITZED emma in a thousandths of a second and then proceeded to blitz cyclops at light speed.

Your turn. amped by the children of the vault?

current QS is faster and previous showings are likely inconsistant (although their upper limit was supposed to be much higher than his) IIRC magneto mocks norhtstar's speed as nothing compared to pietro's.

Originally posted by carver9
That would be very easy to prove since northstar BLITZED emma in a thousandths of a second and then proceeded to blitz cyclops at light speed.

Your turn.

Yeah that is not what happened. That the narration said something along the lines of "The speed of light is 186,000 miles per sec. The speed of the servo in Cyclops' visor? Significantly slower. Northstar steps into the gap."

The pretty clear indication is that Cyclops optic blast moves at light speed, but his visor doesn't open quick enough for him to hit Northstar with it.

Originally posted by BlackZero30x
the fight where flash was fighting zoom? yea

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Yeah that is not what happened. That the narration said something along the lines of "The speed of light is 186,000 miles per sec. The speed of the servo in Cyclops' visor? Significantly slower. Northstar steps into the gap."

The pretty clear indication is that Cyclops optic blast moves at light speed, but his visor doesn't open quick enough for him to hit Northstar with it. oh yes, I remember it now. andthey were amped and nothing indicated the amp was permanent

DC Flash, Flash and Flash. They're all flashes.

Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Yeah that is not what happened. That the narration said something along the lines of "The speed of light is 186,000 miles per sec. The speed of the servo in Cyclops' visor? Significantly slower. Northstar steps into the gap."

The pretty clear indication is that Cyclops optic blast moves at light speed, but his visor doesn't open quick enough for him to hit Northstar with it.

Incorrect, as noted by the author and in the handbooks they were talking about the twins moving at lightspeed not cyclops visor.

"Aurora later had her powers breifly enhanced by the Children of the Vault to the point where she could move at the speed of light (186, 000 mps)"

This wasn't the first time she could do that.

Originally posted by 753
oh yes, I remember it now. andthey were amped and nothing indicated the amp was permanent

It wasn't, but they have gotten three other amps before that so it's not like it matters.

dc atm
running hierachy imo

1Wally
2 Barry
3)Bart
4)Jay
5)SM
6)BA/CM

Jay's no longer faster then Superman, hasn't been for some time.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Jay's no longer faster then Superman, hasn't been for some time.
Didn't his knee give out in Final Crisis when he was approaching the speed of light?

^ Si.

Originally posted by Stoic
Fixed.


that is a messed up listed lol.

Originally posted by paisapower
Originally posted by Desaad
Dude, that was two kids racing in halloween costumes.

Come on guy, the ending which illustrated the winner by switching over to the kids in costume was a holloween treat.

If u wont believe me or what is clear in the comic read the writers interview.

Interview is at-

http;//supermanfanpodcast.mypodcast.com/2009/10/episode97aninterviewwithbilltucci-252208.html

Originally posted by Omega Vision
Didn't his knee give out in Final Crisis when he was approaching the speed of light?

Sure did and he can't achieve light without pulling speed from an outside source. Jay himself admitted that supes, diana, and kyle was faster and let's not even bring up the fact that vixen matched his speed. He isn't to far over the speed of sound if you use recent showings.

Originally posted by carver9
Sure did and he can't achieve light without pulling speed from an outside source. Jay himself admitted that supes, diana, and kyle was faster and let's not even bring up the fact that vixen matched his speed. He isn't to far over the speed of sound if you use recent showings.

no way! vixen matched him???

his metagene puts him just over speed of sound, speed force puts him close to lightspeed, he was only moving at them speeds when the SF had apparently gone as had wally

when did he say that about diana,SM,kyle

jay says SM and him are about evenly matched

Originally posted by ankur29
dc atm
'running' hierachy imo

1) Wally
2) Barry
3)Bart
5)SM
4)Jay
6)BA/CM
7)Jesse quick

Originally posted by ankur29
no way! vixen matched him???

his metagene puts him just over speed of sound, speed force puts him close to lightspeed, he was only moving at them speeds when the SF had apparently gone as had wally

when did he say that about diana,SM,kyle

jay says SM and him are about evenly matched

Yes... everything that I told you happened, about vixen matching him and again... jay admitted that the people that I named were much faster than him... it happened in a jla comic... can't remember which one... I don't memorize issue numbers like you all.

You are truly overhyping jays speed... if he was anywhere as close to the speed that you say that he is at, he wouldn't have had to steal speed from black adam in order to achieve light speed. Back in the day... yes, jay was a true light speedster but currently, I think it was established that his speed was toned down dramatically.

On foot, the only person in dc that is true light speedsters are the flashes.

Wally
Barry
Bart
Jesse quick
Superman/Captain Marvel
Black Adam
Jay

If surfer can't use his board then...

Batman
.......................
.......................
.......................
Flash
Runner
Superman
BA/CM

Northstar and Aurora,
Makkari, Runner top Marvel speedsters

Originally posted by carver9
Wally
Barry
Bart
Jesse quick
Superman/Captain Marvel
Black Adam
Jay

Jesse can't be faster than SM
and CM& BA are equally fast

i have a scan of Jay saying him and SM are a better match , i woudl concede that SM is faster if flying otherwise i think jay and him are somewhat below speed of light on foot

Originally posted by ankur29
Jesse can't be faster than SM
and CM& BA are equally fast

i have a scan of Jay saying him and SM are a better match , i woudl concede that SM is faster if flying otherwise i think jay and him are somewhat below speed of light on foot

Why isn't jesse faster when he is a true light speedster... this has been stated on numerous of occassions.

Going by feats... captain marvel is faster than black adam.

You have a old scan of jay saying this... current showings have jay saying that supes is faster and he IS faster.

Jesse is a chick.

zoom

Originally posted by MrMind
zoom zoom isnt fast

^ I can't stand that false perception.

In the timeline everyone else operates in, Zoom is insanely fast. Hell, even when Flash became amped enough to operate in the same timeframe as Zoom (which should have negated the natural advantage Zoom has), they were still equals in the speed department.

Bottomline: Zoom is pretty much as fast as it gets.

^Literally.

He operates as fast as he wants compared to the normal timeline to the point where he can stand still in time.

Superman is still the fastest non-Zoom/Flash (Barry/Wally) speed force user though.

Bart.


No one else matters.

Zoom is crazy fast. His drawback is being unable to utilize the speed force the way that Wally, Barry, etc can.

But in terms of speed? Wally needed to basically double his speed to get on Zoom's level.

Originally posted by Desaad
Zoom is crazy fast. His drawback is being unable to utilize the speed force the way that Wally, Barry, etc can.

But in terms of speed? Wally needed to basically double his speed to get on Zoom's level. Those drawbacks actually protected Zoom when Wally tried stealing his speed. So they're kind of a good thing.

Yes, but they also mean he's unable to reach the kind of crazy potential that Wally can in terms of formidability.

Being able to slide his own personal time bubble along the 'mainstream' timeline as far forward/backward as he wants (allowing for time travel) makes Zoom pretty formidable... Even without the SF.

He also can vibrate through objects, idk how.

Originally posted by Galan007
Being able to slide his own personal time bubble along the 'mainstream' timeline as far forward/backward as he wants (allowing for time travel) makes Zoom pretty formidable... Even without the SF.

Time travel is an ability that he sometimes has and sometimes does not. As I recall, only under Guggs was he ever able to actually travel through time. Prof Zoom certainly can, and can actually change things for good/real, but Zoom himself couldn't under Johns.

He'll never have the versatility that someone like Wally had, the cosmic level of power that Wally could occasionally reach (say, against the Anti Monitor).

But in any sort of race, he's pretty much the fastest guy at either company (even if he has been kind of watered down over the years, by none other than Johns himself).

Originally posted by Galan007
Being able to slide his own personal time bubble along the 'mainstream' timeline as far forward/backward as he wants (allowing for time travel) makes Zoom pretty formidable... Even without the SF. i wonder if ares could step in that time bubble

Originally posted by Desaad
Time travel is an ability that he sometimes has and sometimes does not. As I recall, only under Guggs was he ever able to actually travel through time. Prof Zoom certainly can, and can actually change things for good/real, but Zoom himself couldn't under Johns.

He'll never have the versatility that someone like Wally had, the cosmic level of power that Wally could occasionally reach (say, against the Anti Monitor).

But in any sort of race, he's pretty much the fastest guy at either company (even if he has been kind of watered down over the years, by none other than Johns himself). His time traveling ability was also mentioned during Rogues' Revenge (written by Johns.)

Anyhow, agree with the rest.

Originally posted by carver9
Yes... everything that I told you happened, about vixen matching him

You do realize Vixen stole his speed right? and by stealing it makes him weaker as she did to Superman

Originally posted by -K-M-
You do realize Vixen stole his speed right? and by stealing it makes him weaker as she did to Superman

How are you doing km, rarely see you around?

As for your comment, she used her cheetah ability during that race and it was never stated that she stole his speed... she asked jay to race and she was in the lead when they got back.

No, they later revealed that her powers were malfunctioning due to the interference of Anansi, the Spider God. She couldn't adopt the abilities of animals, she was stealing the powers of her teammates.

Originally posted by Desaad
No, they later revealed that her powers were malfunctioning due to the interference of Anansi, the Spider God. She couldn't adopt the abilities of animals, she was stealing the powers of her teammates.

indeed...but im pretty sure her powers are back in check now since she had that face to face with The Spider God

Originally posted by Desaad
No, they later revealed that her powers were malfunctioning due to the interference of Anansi, the Spider God. She couldn't adopt the abilities of animals, she was stealing the powers of her teammates.

I'm pretty sure she gained those abilities back... especially during that arc.

Originally posted by carver9
How are you doing km, rarely see you around?

As for your comment, she used her cheetah ability during that race and it was never stated that she stole his speed... she asked jay to race and she was in the lead when they got back.

Been busy

and yes it was revealed later she no longer could copy the powers of animals just metahumans as Desaad just explained. She even directly stated she stole Jay's speed when she told Superman she stole his powers too.

Originally posted by carver9
I'm pretty sure she gained those abilities back... especially during that arc.

At the end, but when she raced Jay she could only steal metahuman powers and she even stated that.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Been busy

and yes it was revealed later she no longer could copy the powers of animals just metahumans as Desaad just explained. She even directly stated she stole Jay's speed when she told Superman she stole his powers too.



At the end, but when she raced Jay she could only steal metahuman powers and she even stated that.

I believe you... I don't think you would lie about that. Since you read the arc I'm pretty sure you remember jay saying that superman, wonder woman, kyle was faster than him?

Originally posted by Don Corleone
Anybody mention DC Hermes? i dont think we should count him, he is a god, he has actually take flash speed from him once, and superman himself said hermes was faster than the fastest man alive

Originally posted by Colossus-Big C
zoom isnt fast
Personal Time Manipulation? yeah, he's fast, he can be as fast as he wants to be. he's not moving at super speed, but he slows down time relative to himself. and that's fast relatively. zoom can make superman looks like he's not moving

Originally posted by carver9
I believe you... I don't think you would lie about that. Since you read the arc I'm pretty sure you remember jay saying that superman, wonder woman, kyle was faster than him?

Yes, and I have already mentioned in this thread Jay isn't as fast as Superman.

In Flash Rebirth #3- supes keeps up just fine until Barry goes all out. And only because he starts entering the speed force. Flashes very first comment in the next panel is ," A band of muscle in my thigh tightens up", just to illustrate his extra effort.

In The Flash #209- All we see is superman keeping up just fine even though Wally is trying to shake him off as he locates Linda.

Point #1- Wally says , "In raw speed superman and I used to be evenly matched. Id say he might have been a tad faster. " (Before he learnt to better tap into speed force)

Point #2- Wally contimplates steeling his kinetic energy but doesnt want to risk the collateral damage. (proof he wants him off his back)

Point #3- Flash says he figures he'll loose supes through the Rockies. Then he says ,"I figure wrong", as he cant.

Point#4- Superman tries to slow him down with small beam of H.V. wich Flash outspeeds saying ,"I'm faster than heat vision."(but obviously not fast enough to blow supes away, in fact supes immediatly catches him but Wally vibrates out of grip.)

Point#5- Only with the apartment building in sight and superman about to grab him again does Flash say,"the thoughts of linda give me my second wind,no one can touch me with her help" and gets inside an insatant before supes.

Just to show the effort needed to be faster




And now Time Masters #5 - Professor Zoom (reverse flash)speed blitzes Hal, Booster and Rip Hunter but is unable to do it to supes, in fact gets cloths lined.

Then says,"well done superman, your speed rivals my own"

Just wait, Hot Pursuit will be the fastest.

Mas Y Menos FTW

wheres that scan where we proved that flash was going thousands(?) of times faster than light based on the math?

Viewable scans:

http://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt19/Max_Eisenhardt/th_SupesZoom1.jpghttp://i593.photobucket.com/albums/tt19/Max_Eisenhardt/th_SupesZoom2.jpg

"Well done, Superman. You speed rivals my own."

Originally posted by Lord_Talron
wheres that scan where we proved that flash was going thousands(?) of times faster than light based on the math? http://img237.imageshack.us/f/jla89pg012jd.jpg/
http://img237.imageshack.us/f/jla89pg028eh.jpg/

However, the writer's intent was for Wally to be moving < c. Thus any > c speeds deduced via crunching the numbers is irrelevant.

Originally posted by Lord_Talron
wheres that scan where we proved that flash was going thousands(?) of times faster than light based on the math? The trillions of light speed thing I calculated back in September?

He did do the feat and the problem is, if he was going only "slightly" under light he wouldn't have saved anybody. I figured we went by feats first. I remember when I first joined I always said Flash was light speed more or less, and people said he went faster than that, because of feats. In this case since he through it down I think it would. *Especially* since he didn't have the sense to think about what he wrote.

I think he did it in that scan, but that goes into very high end feat territory. Although he does have one where he is in multiple places at once. People either choose to take or leave that one.

Originally posted by psycho gundam
inb4close/ban

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
The trillions of light speed thing I calculated back in September?

He did do the feat and the problem is, if he was going only "slightly" under light he wouldn't have saved anybody. I figured we went by feats first. I remember when I first joined I always said Flash was light speed more or less, and people said he went faster than that, because of feats. In this case since he through it down I think it would. *Especially* since he didn't have the sense to think about what he wrote.

I think he did it in that scan, but that goes into very high end feat territory. Although he does have one where he is in multiple places at once. People either choose to take or leave that one. The problem is that the writer explicitly stated (multiple times) that Flash was moving sub-light when he preformed that feat. So regardless of the speed you get by crunching numbers, the writer's intended speed was flat-out stated.

Comic book writers don't get paid to be mathematicians.

Originally posted by Galan007
The problem is that the writer explicitly stated (multiple times) that Flash was moving sub-light when he preformed that feat. So regardless of the speed you get by crunching numbers, the writer's intended speed was flat-out stated.

Comic book writers don't get paid to be mathematicians. You're of course welcome to disagree (I respect your opinion regardless), but when a feat is that much off it would be impossible to do said feat.

If Superman pushed the moon, and a scan said "He pushed all 100 lbs of it" people would dismiss the 100 lbs and realize that it is way off.

But since this one was only egregious after some more complex math, people are dismissing it the only way around. The only way he could rescue those people would be to move that fast (especially considering the nuke already hit).

Either that or 2.5 quintillion miles per second is sub light in DC.

*shrugs*

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
You're of course welcome to disagree (I respect your opinion regardless), but when a feat is that much off it would be impossible to do said feat.

If Superman pushed the moon, and a scan said "He pushed all 100 lbs of it" people would dismiss the 100 lbs and realize that it is way off.

But since this one was only egregious after some more complex math, people are dismissing it the only way around. The only way he could rescue those people would be to move that fast (especially considering the nuke already hit).

Either that or 2.5 quintillion miles per second is sub light in DC.

*shrugs* Believe me, I understand what you're saying (I used to argue the very same thing) -- but like I said before, comic book writers aren't mathematicians. We know that the intent was for Flash to be moving sub-light, because it was stated so two different times during that scene. Even though it doesn't make sense when you crunch the numbers, the fact still remains that an intended speed was given by the writer himself -- and that's what we should go by, imo.

Regardless, that feat is almost never used to prove that Flash can travel multiples of c for the very same reasons we are debating now... It's just too sketchy.

Originally posted by Galan007
Believe me, I understand what you're saying (I used to argue the very same thing) -- but like I said before, comic book writers aren't mathematicians. We know that Flash was intended to be moving sub-light speed, because it was stated so two different times during that scene. Even though it doesn't make sense when you crunch the numbers, the fact still remains that an intended speed was given by the writer himself -- and that's what we should go by, imo.

Regardless, that feat is almost never used to prove that Flash can travel multiples of c for the very same reasons we are debating now... It's just too sketchy. I give some leeway with that with various other inconsistencies in comicbooks, I guess on my side of the coin would be "If he rescued the city in this time frame, he did the feat. Statements come after".

Especially since we have writers contradict their work often, if we go by what they say over what happened it would be one big mess.

I've had this argument in Street Fighter debates for that reason. So many variations of characters and Word of God changes often.

It seems more fair to say what happens on panel comes first. Then word of God and secondary material. Then any material after that. My opinion of course.

I feel he intended to write a story and make Flash look cool, and then he tacked "right under the speed of light" on there. I think the story of him saving the city matters more than the statement about his speed. That's just me of course.

But I do agree with you on one part. Those feats can be seen in many ways. I would never use it for the most part unless this was a "Flash at max no CIS full potential no BS match". It's a bit messy, although in my opinion he has crazier feats.

Where is Makkari?

The Runner is 1 then Makkari!

^ Generally speaking, writers don't rely on their readers to do above average math to figure out key plot points of a story they create. That said, if something is explicitly stated by the narrator (especially more than once), then imo it should be considered the most factual evidence, bar none.

Now if the writer would have made a blanket comment that Flash was moving 'faster than light', then doing the math to figure out how much faster than light he was traveling would be very logical.... But that wasn't the case.

It's just too iffy, as is.

Originally posted by Galan007
It's just too iffy, as is.

Agreed.

Besides, we all know Wally has better feats anyway.

It is a mess to use. Not my fault the writer can't count lol.

Originally posted by Galan007
^ Generally speaking, writers don't rely on their readers to do above average math to figure out key plot points of a story they create. That said, if something is explicitly stated by the narrator (especially more than once), then imo it should be considered the most factual evidence, bar none.

Now if the writer would have made a blanket comment that Flash was moving 'faster than light', then doing the math to figure out how much faster than light he was traveling would be very logical.... But that wasn't the case.

It's just too iffy, as is. Yea it's a "readers are morons" type of thing that writers do. It is iffy though. Him going lightspeed wouldn't have allowed him to rescue anybody, so it wouldn't have done any good to have him go that fast.

I guess I'm a "story is first" type of person. We could all compromise and call it the "new" light speed.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Agreed.

Besides, we all know Wally has better feats anyway.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
We could all compromise and call it the "new" light speed. hmph

As a fellow speedster fan, I'm shocked many don't recognize teh awesumeness.

After a certain point don't all things happen in the same instance with the speed force anyways?

The Blob.

Originally posted by Mindset
Bart.


No one else matters.

For those who think supes cant keep up with flash

http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/5439/ccf1221201000001.th.jpg

supes is nowhere near as fast as flash

Originally posted by paisapower
For those who think supes cant keep up with flash

http://img707.imageshack.us/img707/5439/ccf1221201000001.th.jpg That would have worked... had it not said 'lightspeed' in the scan.

Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
That would have worked... had it not said 'lightspeed' in the scan. That's not the actual Superman/Flash racing either.

Supes seems to be faster than teleportationhttp://

http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/1729/ccf1221201000006.th.jpg

http://img220.imageshack.us/img220/8857/ccf1221201000005.th.jpg

Originally posted by paisapower
That is the actual supes and flash Nope, read it again. It's two little kids in Halloween costumes. It's why "Superman" screams "Flash, stop" - because the little kid dressed into Flash is going through the house's door while running.

Supes makes JL look like statues (even Garrick Flash) in mid fight

http://http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/9453/ccf1223201000001.th.jpg

Originally posted by paisapower
Sorry, but your wrong, the ending switched over to the kids just to illustrate the victor.

If you dont believe me listen to his Interview regarding the comic.

http://supermanfanpodcast.mypodcast.com/2009/10/episode97aninterviewwithbilltucci-252208.html Minute I should be listening at?

I just skimmed through the first 14 minutes, and I don't believe there's anything that contradicts what I just said. In fact, he mentions the "twist at the end" several times - which is, like I said, the fact that it was just two kids playing out the race; what you're saying - which is that the kid going through the door was used to illustrate Flash winning, can't really be considered a twist. So can you be more specific on what he says that makes you believe that? Maybe I missed it.

Supes claims femto sec reaction

http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/5554/ccf1223201000002.th.jpg

Jesse Quick in the recent Justice Society issue just raised the damn bar.

Omega (An Onslaught wanna be) consumes planets/people or whatever (The usual villain shtick). Jade creates a dome over Washington DC, and Jesse Quick is constantly re-arranging every single person in DC, moving them around, effectively hiding them from Omega Man's cosmic senses.

F*cking insane.

Supes can measure time between nano secshttp://http://img121.imageshack.us/img121/2420/ccf1223201000000.th.jpg

edit.

Is the argument actually Superman running faster than Flash?

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Is the argument actually Superman running faster than Flash?

No, I think its pretty clear that Flash is faster. My argument was that hes only slightly faster.

And also the validity of the scans of Flash and Supes running at light spped, that I posted.

Originally posted by paisapower
It seems too late to edit. What do you mean? I didn't tell you to edit that, I just edited my post, if that's what you mean.

Originally posted by paisapower
Did you ever listen to that Interview ? Yes, I've listened to it, and though he says that this is his tribute to the original race of Superman 199 and his feelings about the whole Superman/Flash rivalry, I don't think there's a single line about the kids at the end being meant to throw everybody off of the fact that this race actually took place. And, like I've already mentioned, the fact that he specifically mentions the ending to be a twist, when your interpretation of what he means is nothing as such, clearly suggests that it was just that - the race never happened, and it was just two kids playing it out for Halloween.

This is the last post on this matter though, since I feel we're running in circles.

Originally posted by paisapower
No, I think its pretty clear that Flash is faster. My argument was that hes only slightly faster.

And also the validity of the scans of Flash and Supes running at light spped, that I posted. superman is no where near as fast as a CIS/PIS less flash

flash is on a completley different league

C'mon everyone, Flash Rebirth summed it up perfectly for everyone.

"Clark...Those were for CHARITY."

Yep.