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So I was over at moviecodec (sue me!) and I found this posted by the member Kinasin and was wondering how it would be interpreted here.

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m156/kinasin/250661-goku_dodges_taiyoken1_super.jpg
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m156/kinasin/250663-goku_dodges_taiyoken_2_super.jpg
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m156/kinasin/250664-goku_dodges_taiyoken_3_super.jpg
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m156/kinasin/250665-goku_dodges_taiyoken_4_super.jpg

I don't know what's happening other than Tien using solar flare and Goku stealing Roshi's glasses when he was distracted by bewbz or something.

What are we supposed to see or not see? Taint the sample pool, man! lol

"ZOMG GOKU SNATCHED ROSHI'S SHADES FASTER THAN THE LIGHT FROM TIEN'S SOLAR FLARE COULD REACH HIM THAT'S WHY HE'S NOT BLIND **** YEEEEEAAAAAAAAHHH GOKU > SPEED OF LIGHT AND SUPERMAN."

That's how I'd interpret it.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
"ZOMG GOKU SNATCHED ROSHI'S SHADES FASTER THAN THE LIGHT FROM TIEN'S SOLAR FLARE COULD REACH HIM THAT'S WHY HE'S NOT BLIND **** YEEEEEAAAAAAAAHHH GOKU > SPEED OF LIGHT AND SUPERMAN."

That's how I'd interpret it.

Lol, damn, that's fast.

There's no way to know when Goku took the glasses so there's no real way to evaluate it.

Originally posted by King Kandy
There's no way to know when Goku took the glasses so there's no real way to evaluate it.

We'd have to see the last time Goku was on panel. And see if Roshi had his glasses on before the solar flare.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
We'd have to see the last time Goku was on panel. And see if Roshi had his glasses on before the solar flare.
But you can't even gauge the time between panels. Even if Roshi had his glasses on one panel before, he could have spent time thinking, or preparing to do solar flare.

The thing about Movie Codec is that most of them exaggerate any feat when it concerns Dragonball.

It's so bad they believe Buu is a Galaxy buster. Some believe Goku to be faster than light as a child, some believes Omega Shenron from GT is a universe buster, and he can grants himself wishes even when he's never shown such capabilities.

Originally posted by King Kandy
But you can't even gauge the time between panels. Even if Roshi had his glasses on one panel before, he could have spent time thinking, or preparing to do solar flare.

Why good Goku go for the glasses except to protect himself from solar flare? :O

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Why good Goku go for the glasses except to protect himself from solar flare? :O
Because he predicted Tien was going to use it?

Originally posted by King Kandy
Because he predicted Tien was going to use it?

We'd have to see the last time Goku was on panel before that. And Roshi.

I don't see how that would help because he clearly did it between panels.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
"ZOMG GOKU SNATCHED ROSHI'S SHADES FASTER THAN THE LIGHT FROM TIEN'S SOLAR FLARE COULD REACH HIM THAT'S WHY HE'S NOT BLIND **** YEEEEEAAAAAAAAHHH GOKU > SPEED OF LIGHT AND SUPERMAN."

That's how I'd interpret it.

Nay, sunglasses > DBZ attacks.



awesome

Originally posted by King Kandy
I don't see how that would help because he clearly did it between panels.

Did Tien give off an impression that he would use solar flare and Goku react with shock right before he did it? Did Goku think he would do it before he did and prepare? In fact, given the reaction, it's likely Goku did do it a split second before the attack because Roshi seemed surprised. Or during the attack, but that could be a strech.

Originally posted by SquallX
The thing about Movie Codec is that most of them exaggerate any feat when it concerns Dragonball.

It's so bad they believe Buu is a Galaxy buster. Some believe Goku to be faster than light as a child, some believes Omega Shenron from GT is a universe buster, and he can grants himself wishes even when he's never shown such capabilities.
Omega Shenron grant himself wishes? lol Even anyone here (except maybe Phenomenol if you count the banned users) wouldn't think of something as crazy as that if they were to defend him. Then again... there was that one kid who said "I don't know much about Galactus, but Omega Shenron would beat him".

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Omega Shenron grant himself wishes? lol Even anyone here (except maybe Phenomenol if you count the banned users) wouldn't think of something as crazy as that if they were to defend him. Then again... there was that one kid who said "I don't know much about Galactus, but Omega Shenron would beat him".

rolleyes1

For some reason a statement like that takes me back to grade school, where ever kid who played Yugioh said stupid shit like "Dark Hole would beat Exodia!!!1!1"

^ Well, if any of the Exodia cards are on the field instead of the hand...


Also, did Goku put on the sunglasses during the attack, remove them, and then put them on again to show everyone? That's the impression I'm getting.

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
Omega Shenron grant himself wishes? lol Even anyone here (except maybe Phenomenol if you count the banned users) wouldn't think of something as crazy as that if they were to defend him. Then again... there was that one kid who said "I don't know much about Galactus, but Omega Shenron would beat him".
Although, that makes me wonder why Omega Shenron can't grant wishes. Is there an actual reason for that?

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
^ Well, if any of the Exodia cards are on the field instead of the hand...


Also, did Goku put on the sunglasses during the attack, remove them, and then put them on again to show everyone? That's the impression I'm getting.

Well, we were under the impression once you had all the pieces, you would then summon him to the field where one could kill it with dark hole. We were retarded okay and we only had the show to go on, which didn't help much.

I think he just lifted his hand up there.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
rolleyes1

For some reason a statement like that takes me back to grade school, where ever kid who played Yugioh said stupid shit like "Dark Hole would beat Exodia!!!1!1"
lol Exactly.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Although, that makes me wonder why Omega Shenron can't grant wishes. Is there an actual reason for that?
PIS probably. Him having that kind of power would be just too much for even SSJ4 Goku and Vegeta fused together to handle, let alone the super spirit bomb. Not to mention, OS being able to do that would've led to countless no-limit fallacies and shit.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Although, that makes me wonder why Omega Shenron can't grant wishes. Is there an actual reason for that? Could the "corrupted" Dragon Balls actually grant wishes?

The black-star ones? Yeah, Baby Vegeta got a wish granted from them once.

Originally posted by TheAuraAngel
Well, we were under the impression once you had all the pieces, you would then summon him to the field where one could kill it with dark hole. We were retarded okay and we only had the show to go on, which didn't help much.

I think he just lifted his hand up there.



And Tien somehow never noticed the sunglasses until after Goku lifted his fingers to the glasses?

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
lol Exactly.


PIS probably. Him having that kind of power would be just too much for even SSJ4 Goku and Vegeta fused together to handle, let alone the super spirit bomb. Not to mention, OS being able to do that would've led to countless no-limit fallacies and shit.

Omega Shenron isn't like the Regular Shenron/Porunga/BS Shenron, I think. He just absorbed the balls. The wish-granting dragons have to be summoned.

Originally posted by Ridley_Prime
The black-star ones? Yeah, Baby Vegeta got a wish granted from them once. The Black Star Dragon Balls were not corrupted, they were created when Piccolo and Kami were one.

I am talking about the corrupted normal Dragon Balls.

Originally posted by Demonic Phoenix
And Tien somehow never noticed the sunglasses until after Goku lifted his fingers to the glasses?

Goku could have ducked his head to make it seem like it hit him. Or Tien could just be inattentive.

The regular Dragonballs can only grant wishes in accordance with the power of the maker. Remember when they tried to use the to get rid of Vegeta and Nappa?

That's funny. Later, Goku can't even keep up with Mr. Popo's movement while Popo said he moved as fast as lightning. Something isn't right here...

"Fast as lightning" was a metaphor.

I didn't intend for it to be taken seriously as it's a grave inconsistency. I was just curious as of what people thought of it.

From what I am seeing, it appears as if tien blast took place before goku ran off, goku then outrace the blast, gets roshi glasses and put them on before the attack even registered.

Originally posted by carver9
From what I am seeing, it appears as if tien blast took place before goku ran off, goku then outrace the blast, gets roshi glasses and put them on before the attack even registered. Of course that is what you are seeing.

Originally posted by carver9
From what I am seeing, it appears as if tien blast took place before goku ran off, goku then outrace the blast, gets roshi glasses and put them on before the attack even registered.
Yes, that totally makes sense. I guess Tien must travel FTL since he kicked Goku one panel later.

Wouldn't a kick from someone moving faster than light knock a 120 pound boy like a million miles into the distance? mmm

I think it would splat him personally.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
Wouldn't a kick from someone moving faster than light knock a 120 pound boy like a million miles into the distance? mmm

His foot would phase right through him, since he would be going back, in time. MWHAHAHAHAHAHA.

There's also the problem of his matter flying apart, etc. etc.

And then there's the infinite amount of energy required to even obtain that velocity.


IMPOSSIBLE!

Originally posted by King Kandy
Yes, that totally makes sense. I guess Tien must travel FTL since he kicked Goku one panel later.

This doesn't make sense. If goku outraced the solar flare and tien kept up with him, doesn that mean that tien is just as fast or possibly a tad bit slower?

I guess that scene is why the american dub stated that goku as a child/teen was already ftl. He does have the feats as a child, its just how you perceive it.

You all know what happened in that scan... this thread shouldn't even made it this far (2 pages) because a couple of post as soon as this thread was opened, someone already stated what they saw... goku outpacing the solar flare.

Originally posted by dadudemon
His foot would phase right through him, since he would be going back, in time. MWHAHAHAHAHAHA.

There's also the problem of his matter flying apart, etc. etc.

And then there's the infinite amount of energy required to even obtain that velocity.


IMPOSSIBLE!

Please tell me you are not saying this. When zoom hit wondy at ftl speeds, why didn't she turn to goo? Kid flash fought deathstroke at ftl and didn't even put a scratch on him.

Its called comics.

Originally posted by carver9
Please tell me you are not saying this. When zoom hit wondy at ftl speeds, why didn't she turn to goo? Kid flash fought deathstroke at ftl and didn't even put a scratch on him.

Its called comics.

That's a really easy question to answer: the writers are morons and have very little understanding how science actually works.

It's called physics.

Originally posted by dadudemon
That's a really easy question to answer: the writers are morons and have very little understanding how science actually works.

It's called physics.

So why are you applying physics to dragonball but not all comics when all in all, we know that writers don't use physics when writing stories?

Originally posted by carver9
So why are you applying physics to dragonball but not all comics when all in all, we know that writers don't use physics when writing stories?

Are you kidding? I am constantly facepalming at everything, not just Dragonball. Didn't i just comment on how moronic some of the writers are for comics you referenced that were not Dragonball?

I can tell that a conversation with you would be both hilarious and frustrating so how about a high-five?

In one panel we see roshi with his glasses on and he would have realized if it was gone before the rays hit his eyes IF goku took them before tiens attack. Tien solar flare the ring, goku makes it to roshi in enough time to get the glasses AND put them on AND run back to the spot that he was at before the solar flare completely engulfs the field. Roshi without his glasses gets blind, then he realize that his glasses were gone.

If goku took them before the blast, roshi would have known a lot sooner than what he did since they are "shades". You all tend to forget that roshi have super speed as well so someone taking something from him without him noticing it is a feat within itself.

Goku outran the blast by a large pace and did a couple of things before the blast even registered.

Originally posted by carver9
Please tell me you are not saying this. When zoom hit wondy at ftl speeds, why didn't she turn to goo? Kid flash fought deathstroke at ftl and didn't even put a scratch on him.

Its called comics.


In addition, FTL doesn't work that way.

Energy increases as one approaches the speed of light, but it's impossible to pass it, and energy would likewise increase to a FTL particle that slowed down to approach the speed of light, it flips at lightspeed, it doesn't continue to increase.

It's impossible to accelerate even to the speed of light, let alone past it (though that's really "the speed of light in a vacuum," through a medium like atmosphere light is actually much slower), because there's room for infinite acceleration while STL (with time dilation keeping the accelerator below light no matter how many orders of magnitude faster they do).

Like you say, comics. It doesn't remotely resemble physics.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Are you kidding? I am constantly facepalming at everything, not just Dragonball. Didn't i just comment on how moronic some of the writers are for comics you referenced that were not Dragonball?

I can tell that a conversation with you would be both hilarious and frustrating so how about a high-five?

Lol... deal. My hand is in the air for the high five.

Originally posted by Q99
In addition, FTL doesn't work that way.

Energy increases as one approaches the speed of light, but it's impossible to pass it, and energy would likewise increase to a FTL particle that slowed down to approach the speed of light, it flips at lightspeed, it doesn't continue to increase.

It's impossible to accelerate even to the speed of light, let alone past it (though that's really "the speed of light in a vacuum," through a medium like atmosphere light is actually much slower), because there's room for infinite acceleration while STL (with time dilation keeping the accelerator below light no matter how many orders of magnitude faster they do).

Like you say, comics. It doesn't remotely resemble physics.

I agree with everything you just said.

What do you think about the scan that was presented from astner?

Originally posted by carver9
I agree with everything you just said.

What do you think about the scan that was presented from astner?

I think the grabbing of sunglasses was partially a comedic thing and shouldn't be taken literally.

Originally posted by Q99
I think the grabbing of sunglasses was partially a comedic thing and shouldn't be taken literally.

Why shouldn't it be taken seriously when all in all, it was a smart tactic. I didn't see anything comedy about it and didn't goku almost get disqualified for doing that?

I think the scan the implies that Goku is fast as ****; however, this is something we already know.

I don't think it means he is faster than light though. I only mention that because it has been brought up.

Originally posted by StyleTime
I think the scan the implies that Goku is fast as ****; however, this is something we already know.

I don't think it means he is faster than light though. I only mention that because it has been brought up.

I don't understand this post.

Originally posted by carver9
Why shouldn't it be taken seriously when all in all, it was a smart tactic. I didn't see anything comedy about it and didn't goku almost get disqualified for doing that?

It's basically the same kind of thing that was pulled when Krillian beat a smelly enemy by Goku pointing out he has no nose, despite him having no trouble smelling the guy before.

DB at this point was a lot more humorous.


The yanking of the sunglasses, while helpful and progressing the plot, is faster than the speed shown in the fight itself, and it's a joke. Early DB, characters can do stuff they otherwise couldn't when it's a joke

I thought the famous Akira Toriyama took pride in his inconsistencies or at very least acknowledge them.

Why can't we just chalk up this feat as that. Or if you really want to analyse the feat, Goku could've knew where Roshi was prior to the attack and ran in his direction to swipe the blast while in the attack. Unless he was looking directly at Tien, then I don't think that he would've been affected that much by it.

Originally posted by Q99
It's basically the same kind of thing that was pulled when Krillian beat a smelly enemy by Goku pointing out he has no nose, despite him having no trouble smelling the guy before.

DB at this point was a lot more humorous.


The yanking of the sunglasses, while helpful and progressing the plot, is faster than the speed shown in the fight itself, and it's a joke. Early DB, characters can do stuff they otherwise couldn't when it's a joke

Its kind of different if you ask me. I didn't see anything comedy about it. Even if it was something to humor us, it still happened at it is still a speed feat.

How do you know how fast they were fighting (goku and tien)? That's like me saying "since wonder woman blocked heat vision one day from superman and another day, having a hard time against the royal flush gang, she can't even fight faster than the speed of sound".

Goku knew that he was in trouble when tien did the solar flare so he snatched something that would aid him from being blind since he witnessed the "almost" tko tha jackie chun received when he got kicked in the back of the head... it was a smart tactic, nothing more, nothing less.

I don't get the last part... what couldn't dragonball characters do speed wise to make you "not" give this feat any credit? From what I have seen of dragonball, they never had a problem speed wise with anything. Their speed was almost limitless.

If Goku was that fast using Kinto'un would have been slow.

Originally posted by King Kandy
If Goku was that fast using Kinto'un would have been slow.

Who is kinto'un?

Originally posted by carver9
Who is kinto'un?
The flying cloud, more commonly known as Nimbus or Jindujun.

http://i385.photobucket.com/albums/oo300/leonography/DBz/db_nimbuscloud01.jpg

Did goku know how to fly then? And even if he did, we all know that dragonball characters are mostly known for their short burst of speed and their reflexes. That's like me saqying that if we were to place the flying nimbus in the ring and goku command it to move around the ring a its top speed, it could wink out just like goku could and move faster than the human or super human eye could see.

Do you all honestly believe this... does the cloud have the feats of moving around at constant , invisible speeds. To my knowledge, no. Goku is faster than the cloud, that shouldn't even be argued.

If Goku could travel at the speed of light he wouldn't even need the nimbus.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
If Goku could travel at the speed of light he wouldn't even need the nimbus.

Read above.

What is it that you all do not understand, goku is much faster than his cloud, he use it for transportation.

Going back to Blaxican's point and theoretically saying that Goku could travel FTL according to the feat (which he can't) then why would he need the nimbus cloud. A good example of Goku actually being faster than the nimbus cloud would be during the "Saiyan" arc when he was racing to Nappa and Vegeta's location. If he was faster than the nimbus cloud in that scenarios then why did he use the cloud then.

However this is all to much for just one inconsistency pointed out in all of Dragonball. Goku's not FTL and Tien probably took attention off of Goku when he was using his Solar-Flare. Especially when you have cases like Roshi being a moon-buster but not being able to beat King Piccolo.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
Going back to Blaxican's point and theoretically saying that Goku could travel FTL according to the feat (which he can't) then why would he need the nimbus cloud. A good example of Goku actually being faster than the nimbus cloud would be during the "Saiyan" arc when he was racing to Nappa and Vegeta's location. If he was faster than the nimbus cloud in that scenarios then why did he use the cloud then.

However this is all to much for just one inconsistency pointed out in all of Dragonball. Goku's not FTL and Tien probably took attention off of Goku when he was using his Solar-Flare. Especially when you have cases like Roshi being a moon-buster but not being able to beat King Piccolo.

Did I say that goku could fly faster then light? I guess some people don't understand the difference between combat speed and flight speed. Goku small outburst of speed is MUCH faster than flying nimbus. So comparing the two is irrelevant since goku is much faster "SHORT BURST" wise. His combat speed is on a different level than his travel speed. Put nimbus and goku in a ring and see who can move the fastest and goku speed would be far greater.

Originally posted by carver9
Did I say that goku could fly faster then light? I guess some people don't understand the difference between combat speed and flight speed. Goku small outburst of speed is MUCH faster than flying nimbus. So comparing the two is irrelevant since goku is much faster "SHORT BURST" wise. His combat speed is on a different level than his travel speed. Put nimbus and goku in a ring and see who can move the fastest and goku speed would be far greater.

I'll have to elaborate on my example since it wasn't understood. Goku can travel/fly/whatever faster than the nimbus cloud yet he still used it in the early portions of Dragonball Z. In fact one could argue that Goku doesn't actually become faster than his cloud up until he fights Piccolo at the end of Dragonball. So why doe Goku still need the cloud even thought he's faster than it?

Granted that there is a difference between combat speed and travel speed, Goku's speed isn't that great for him to just outrun the blast before it registers to the audience, get Roshi glasses, and run back to hit Tien before he notices: In fact he could've just knew where Roshi was and ran too him while he was stunned by the attack all the while not looking at Tien when performing the attack. However this whole thing could just be a mishap to explain how he was able to counter Tien's upcoming attack without any hesitation.

Seriously if this one feat was taken as so in Goku's speed feats, it'd outdo anything speedfeat he's ever done in Dragonball Z.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
I'll have to elaborate on my example since it wasn't understood. Goku can travel/fly/whatever faster than the nimbus cloud yet he still used it in the early portions of Dragonball Z. In fact one could argue that Goku doesn't actually become faster than his cloud up until he fights Piccolo at the end of Dragonball. So why doe Goku still need the cloud even thought he's faster than it?

Granted that there is a difference between combat speed and travel speed, Goku's speed isn't that great for him to just outrun the blast before it registers to the audience, get Roshi glasses, and run back to hit Tien before he notices: In fact he could've just knew where Roshi was and ran too him while he was stunned by the attack all the while not looking at Tien when performing the attack. However this whole thing could just be a mishap to explain how he was able to counter Tien's upcoming attack without any hesitation.

Seriously if this one feat was taken as so in Goku's speed feats, it'd outdo anything speedfeat he's ever done in Dragonball Z.

Of course he used nimbus, why not when it takes energy and ki to fly? The FACT is, goku is faster than nimbus... another FACT is goku outran the solar flare... another FACT is roshi and krillin also have nano seconds feats... another FACT is DBZ gave hints on ftl feats, you all just ignored it.

All of the rest of your post is irrelevant because you are "adding" on to the scene and adding things that did not happen.

Originally posted by carver9
Of course he used nimbus, why not when it takes energy and ki to fly? The FACT is, goku is faster than nimbus... another FACT is goku outran the solar flare... another FACT is roshi and krillin also have nano seconds feats... another FACT is DBZ gave hints on ftl feats, you all just ignored it.

All of the rest of your post is irrelevant because you are "adding" on to the scene and adding things that did not happen.

How in the hell is any of that actually explainable? It's and inconsistency, it happens in manga series. The only truth in this whole statement that is canon solid is Goku being faster than the nimbus. When in the hell has anyone in DBZ shown light-speed let alone FTL?

I'm not adding on to anything, I'm explaining a feat that doesn't really need an explaination. Not looking at the attack and swiping Roshi's glasses sound hell of a lot more believeble than being FTL as far as Dragonball feats are concerned.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
How in the hell is any of that actually explainable? It's and inconsistency, it happens in manga series. The only truth in this whole statement that is canon solid is Goku being faster than the nimbus. When in the hell has anyone in DBZ shown light-speed let alone FTL?

I'm not adding on to anything, I'm explaining a feat that doesn't really need an explaination. Not looking at the attack and swiping Roshi's glasses sound hell of a lot more believeble than being FTL as far as Dragonball feats are concerned.

Originally posted by dadudemon
Are you kidding? I am constantly facepalming at everything, not just Dragonball. Didn't i just comment on how moronic some of the writers are for comics you referenced that were not Dragonball?
That reminds me.

http://img602.imageshack.us/img602/6423/lol3r.jpg

It's clear from the equation above that mass doesn't affect the speed of a fall, as speed, v, is only a function of the variables h (height) and g (the local gravitational acceleration).

Yet somehow...

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/4564/whyof.jpg

prodigious rookie noob carelessness against an expert with moderator favor but unbiased action

Existence of rookie suggest potential existence of teacher.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
How in the hell is any of that actually explainable? It's and inconsistency, it happens in manga series. The only truth in this whole statement that is canon solid is Goku being faster than the nimbus. When in the hell has anyone in DBZ shown light-speed let alone FTL?

I'm not adding on to anything, I'm explaining a feat that doesn't really need an explaination. Not looking at the attack and swiping Roshi's glasses sound hell of a lot more believeble than being FTL as far as Dragonball feats are concerned.

What's inconsistent? Goku moving at tremendous speeds that people try to deny and try to low ball?

Again, you are adding onto the feat. First you have to prove that goku knew where roshi was. Then you have to prove that goku didn't look at the attack. Are you able to do any of this or are you going to ignore the obvious?

Goku has been outracing blast since the beginning...been doing things that speedsters throughout marvel and dc speedsters fail to do during combat so them performing light speed feats shouldn't be something "outstanding" for a character like goku. Since he has been doing it since childhood (with the feats that was shown in this thread), it helps out a lot of thing liiike, why picollo was so shocked at raditz dodging his blast at point blank range. Or we have the frieza incident where frieza shot his matter destroying blast at super saiyan goku at point blank range and goku dodging it with ease. That could be why frieza was so shocked about goku dodging his blast.

There are numerous of other things like krillin and roshi super speed movements that happened in less than a second and goku by the end of dragonball being far faster.

Originally posted by carver9
What's inconsistent? Goku moving at tremendous speeds that people try to deny and try to low ball?

Again, you are adding onto the feat. First you have to prove that goku knew where roshi was. Then you have to prove that goku didn't look at the attack. Are you able to do any of this or are you going to ignore the obvious?

Goku has been outracing blast since the beginning...been doing things that speedsters throughout marvel and dc speedsters fail to do during combat so them performing light speed feats shouldn't be something "outstanding" for a character like goku. Since he has been doing it since childhood (with the feats that was shown in this thread), it helps out a lot of thing liiike, why picollo was so shocked at raditz dodging his blast at point blank range. Or we have the frieza incident where frieza shot his matter destroying blast at super saiyan goku at point blank range and goku dodging it with ease. That could be why frieza was so shocked about goku dodging his blast.

There are numerous of other things like krillin and roshi super speed movements that happened in less than a second and goku by the end of dragonball being far faster. True.

Originally posted by Astner
That reminds me.

http://img602.imageshack.us/img602/6423/lol3r.jpg

It's clear from the equation above that mass doesn't affect the speed of a fall, as speed, v, is only a function of the variables h (height) and g (the local gravitational acceleration).

Yet somehow...

http://img266.imageshack.us/img266/4564/whyof.jpg

the mysteries of acceleration were not fundamentaly solved, while it is true that continuos calculus is a solid and valid argument, the calculus of finite difference is necessary to under stand.

Fundamental signal theory based on a new kind of science by stephen worlfram. Tells us that an infinity of symbols exist and though arbitrary correspondence is possible, even the simplest of signals a single dimensionless bit can have infinite information content under the right interpretation or arbitrary rule.

Thus one needs to find the connection between the finite and the infinite. FTL is not fundamentally impossible it just involves infinities too which mathematicians are allergic.

Originally posted by carver9
What's inconsistent? Goku moving at tremendous speeds that people try to deny and try to low ball?

Again, you are adding onto the feat. First you have to prove that goku knew where roshi was. Then you have to prove that goku didn't look at the attack. Are you able to do any of this or are you going to ignore the obvious?

Goku has been outracing blast since the beginning...been doing things that speedsters throughout marvel and dc speedsters fail to do during combat so them performing light speed feats shouldn't be something "outstanding" for a character like goku. Since he has been doing it since childhood (with the feats that was shown in this thread), it helps out a lot of thing liiike, why picollo was so shocked at raditz dodging his blast at point blank range. Or we have the frieza incident where frieza shot his matter destroying blast at super saiyan goku at point blank range and goku dodging it with ease. That could be why frieza was so shocked about goku dodging his blast.

There are numerous of other things like krillin and roshi super speed movements that happened in less than a second and goku by the end of dragonball being far faster.

Nobody here is undermining Goku's speed. It just isn't lightspeed or FTL for that matter. Moving really fast to the point where your opponent can't see you isn't uncommon in a lot of manga series. Just because Goku can react to lightning doesn't really make him FTL either even though there is canon evidence of his increase in power throughout the whole DBZ series.

Frieza can destroy matter now?

Something happening in less than a second doesn't necessarily mean lightspeed either. Roshi and Krillin having nano-second reaction(at least in Dragonball anyway) is a no....unless there's a specific scene where they actually show it.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
Nobody here is undermining Goku's speed. It just isn't lightspeed or FTL for that matter. Moving really fast to the point where your opponent can't see you isn't uncommon in a lot of manga series. Just because Goku can react to lightning doesn't really make him FTL either even though there is canon evidence of his increase in power throughout the whole DBZ series.

Frieza can destroy matter now?

Something happening in less than a second doesn't necessarily mean lightspeed either. Roshi and Krillin having nano-second reaction(at least in Dragonball anyway) is a no....unless there's a specific scene where they actually show it.

No one moves on the level of dbz characters wen it comes to combat. You might have someone in the manga that can blink out and reappear but they can't fight at "constant" super speed.

You got it all wrong, the youngest and under powered goku reacted to lightning... a goku by the end of dbz was FAR above that goku in the speed department. Then we have another weak version of goku outracing the solar flare.

Again, akira gave you all hints on dbz charactters vs light speed. Piccolo said to raditz, "he dodged it, he moves faster than, faster than" but he never finished the sentence. Its pretty obvious what akira wanted us to know but again, you are ignoring it.

I know something happening in less than a second doesn't mean light speed but I want you to think for a bit... think of ALL the things roshi and krillin did in that second and when you do that, come back and holla at yow boy.

Originally posted by carver9
No one moves on the level of dbz characters wen it comes to combat. You might have someone in the manga that can blink out and reappear but they can't fight at "constant" super speed.

You got it all wrong, the youngest and under powered goku reacted to lightning... a goku by the end of dbz was FAR above that goku in the speed department. Then we have another weak version of goku outracing the solar flare.

Again, akira gave you all hints on dbz charactters vs light speed. Piccolo said to raditz, "he dodged it, he moves faster than, faster than" but he never finished the sentence. Its pretty obvious what akira wanted us to know but again, you are ignoring it.

There are manga series that have super-speed fights too. Speed scaling and the duration of the fight differ but Dragonball Z isn't the only one that does it. OP actually has people that move at lightspeed granted its limited to an extent.

Piccolo could've said various things. Once again, just beacuse someone has ungodly amounts of speed doesn't automatically mean its lightspeed.

Originally posted by carver9
I know something happening in less than a second doesn't mean light speed but I want you to think for a bit... think of ALL the things roshi and krillin did in that second and when you do that, come back and holla at yow boy.
Like get their asses kicked. Seriously! one's been obsolete since Piccolo's debut, the other is the "King of Fail". Whatever they have it's not lightspeed and I'm not even sure it nano-second reaction speed. There aren't any people in DBZ that can move FTL or at lightspeed for that matter.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
There are manga series that have super-speed fights too. Speed scaling and the duration of the fight differ but Dragonball Z isn't the only one that does it. OP actually has people that move at lightspeed granted its limited to an extent.

Piccolo could've said various things. Once again, just beacuse someone has ungodly amounts of speed doesn't automatically mean its lightspeed.


Like get their asses kicked. Seriously! one's been obsolete since Piccolo's debut, the other is the "King of Fail". Whatever they have it's not lightspeed and I'm not even sure it nano-second reaction speed. There aren't any people in DBZ that can move FTL or at lightspeed for that matter.

Again, if you ignore EVERYTHING that has happened on panel then yes dbz isn't fast as light and even with low showings, I wouldn't even know what speed feat COMBAT wise that you can use as a low showing to suggest that they can't fight at light speed.

Piccolo said what I just told you and again, its pretty obvious what akira wanted us to think... a child would know this.

When has someone on dbz with superior speed ever get their a** kicked?

Why wasn't it a nano second feat when krillin and roshi performed an entire routine PLUS taunting each other instantly? They performed numerous of tactics in less than a second. If dbz can do this during their weakest, there is no telling what goku during the beginning of dbz was capable of doing speed wise.

Originally posted by wakkawakkawakka
There are manga series that have super-speed fights too. Speed scaling and the duration of the fight differ but Dragonball Z isn't the only one that does it. OP actually has people that move at lightspeed granted its limited to an extent.

Piccolo could've said various things. Once again, just beacuse someone has ungodly amounts of speed doesn't automatically mean its lightspeed.


Like get their asses kicked. Seriously! one's been obsolete since Piccolo's debut, the other is the "King of Fail". Whatever they have it's not lightspeed and I'm not even sure it nano-second reaction speed. There aren't any people in DBZ that can move FTL or at lightspeed for that matter. You're wasting your breath. This is a guy who thinks that everything said in DBZ is Akira toriyama saying that "this is the way it is" even when its shown to clearly not be the case. And if a villian is wrong, if you call him a liar due to how often he's wrong, you're calling Akira Toriyama a liar according to him.

Originally posted by Creshosk
You're wasting your breath. This is a guy who thinks that everything said in DBZ is Akira toriyama saying that "this is the way it is" even when its shown to clearly not be the case. And if a villian is wrong, if you call him a liar due to how often he's wrong, you're calling Akira Toriyama a liar according to him.

If you listen to this guy he apply real world logic to comic books.

Originally posted by carver9
If you listen to this guy he apply real world logic to comic books. I sure do. It's the only way that people can make sense of things especially down in the debate forum.

Have a question... how fast would someone have to be to be in the heart of a nuclear blast... basically surrounded by it and while the nuclear blast is detonating, they escape it without being touched and outrace the blast but remember, this person was in the heart of the blast, right in the center.

You all are master caculators, how fast would someone have to be to outrace a nuclear blast straight from the center of it without it scraping a piece of your body?

By the way astner, that was a light speed feat just like the raditz feat and just like the freiza eye vs goku feat.

Originally posted by carver9
Have a question... how fast would someone have to be to be in the heart of a nuclear blast... basically surrounded by it and while the nuclear blast is detonating, they escape it without being touched and outrace the blast but remember, this person was in the heart of the blast, right in the center.

You all are master caculators, how fast would someone have to be to outrace a nuclear blast straight from the center of it without it scraping a piece of your body?

Can someone answer this post please.

Originally posted by carver9
From what I am seeing, it appears as if tien blast took place before goku ran off, goku then outrace the blast, gets roshi glasses and put them on before the attack even registered.

Not goin' to say I'm with'ya on this, I aint. But had this been any other manga (Not Dragonball, Z or GT). What you stated above is what 90% of this forum would have said happened.

Rampant bias, inconsistencies, and double standards ahoy!

Originally posted by No End N Site
Not goin' to say I'm with'ya on this, I aint. But had this been any other manga (Not Dragonball, Z or GT). What you stated above is what 90% of this forum would have said happened.

Rampant bias, inconsistencies, and double standards ahoy!

You should be with me because I am right.

There really isnt any inconsistencies involving DBZ... we just never accepted what type of speed they have. We can bring up a thousand scenes in DBZ that appears to be light speed but people would discredit it.

I agree with one thing that you did say though, if it was any other manga, yes, everyone would agree with it. The acceptance of DBZ on this forum is IRRITATING because thats the problem, people do not want to accept feats from them because if THAT feat is a light speed feat then Goku during the begining of DBZ should outright be able to STOMP the peeps that so many people have argued that Goku would lose against and THEY DO NOT WANT THAT TO HAPPEN.


Akira stated during the regular dragonball serious that Goku was a light speedster but again, even if there was something showing akira stating this, people will not accept it.

What you stated to have happened on that scan is utterly ridiculous for Dragonball. What you said 'could've' happened but I find it hard to believe. If that did actually happen then that's 1 helluva inconsistency.

Peeps 'round these part just need to...(dare I say it)...Keep It 100(Real). If you're gonna heavily scrutinize and apply an agonizin' level of real world logic to one material, makes sure you keep it uniform. Carry that debatin' style with you where ever you go, don't just drop it or pick it up to suit your needs.