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They go at to kill no BFR. No interference from galacus or anyone else. Fight is on Apokolips.

Darkseid.

Darkseid

darkseid, OE ftw

Surfer, with ease.

Originally posted by MrMind
darkseid, random/punch blast ftw

Darkdeid ftw.

Why do people keep saying current Surfer, as if he is more powerful than before, he never got any upgrade.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Darkdeid ftw.

Why do people keep saying current Surfer, as if he is more powerful than before, he never got any upgrade.


They want to believe he's better than Thanos... And Thor!

Current Surfer > Current Thanos, imo.

at least as far as dignity and self-respect goes.

Thanos Imperative destroyed what class and villenous aura Thanos used to exude. now he's nothing more than a cosmic tampon and Death's ***** in purple spandex .


Surfer just looks as if he has no penis.
Whereas Thanos acts like he has none!


anyway, oh yeah and Thor's a pussy too

Anus 77 you would have a point if now for a few things.
1.Thanos easily slapped around Marvell, who easily slapped around Surfer.
2.Surfer never had the balls to save Nova and Starlord in the Cancervers whilst facing Thanos.
3.You do realize you so called bad ass skyfather Hulk cried his eyes out at the sight of Skaar transformed into his boy incarnation and thr fact he had another son in Hiro.
4.You weren't a idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Anus 77 you would have a point if now for a few things.
1.Thanos easily slapped around Marvell, who easily slapped around Surfer.
2.Surfer never had the balls to save Nova and Starlord in the Cancervers whilst facing Thanos.
3.You do realize you so called bad ass skyfather Hulk cried his eyes out at the sight of Skaar transformed into his boy incarnation and thr fact he had another son in Hiro.
4.You weren't a idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

LMAO @ Anus77

Surfer wins.

lol at anyone says surfer has a chance here.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Anus 77 you would have a point if now for a few things.
1.Thanos easily slapped around Marvell, who easily slapped around Surfer.
2.Surfer never had the balls to save Nova and Starlord in the Cancervers whilst facing Thanos.
3.You do realize you so called bad ass skyfather Hulk cried his eyes out at the sight of Skaar transformed into his boy incarnation and thr fact he had another son in Hiro.
4.You weren't a idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about.

orly?

1. power level has nothing to do with dignity as thanos and darkseid btw have demostrated again and again. "boohoooo death doesnt want meeeee, ill start cutting my wrists and throw a tantrum. i want to die so badly buaaaahahaha nobody understands my unwarranted self-importance and my retarded infatuation with an abstract concept that posed as a woman I couldnt get into bed once".

2. please, nova himself convinced him to stay and fight in the 616 side of the trenchs which is where he was needed the most

3. right... a man (who survived and abusive relationship with his own father) crying over reconnecting with a child he thought was dead and then lost to the trauma of growing up in hell and one he didn't even know he had are the same as thanos whining over some ***** who could care less for him.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
lol at anyone says surfer has a chance here. LOL at you trying to start something. Surfer wins.

Originally posted by janus77
Current Surfer > Current Thanos, imo.

at least as far as dignity and self-respect goes.

Thanos Imperative destroyed what class and villenous aura Thanos used to exude. now he's nothing more than a cosmic tampon and Death's ***** in purple spandex .


Surfer just looks as if he has no penis.
Whereas Thanos acts like he has none!


anyway, oh yeah and Thor's a pussy too right on.


DS wins btw.

Originally posted by Nihilist
Darkdeid ftw.

Why do people keep saying current Surfer, as if he is more powerful than before, he never got any upgrade. he got a change of attitude that counts even more though

Originally posted by Bentley
darkseid, random/punch blast ftw

http://img18.imageshack.us/img18/4615/dg45.jpg

@Mr. Mind that isn't canon.


LOL.

Originally posted by quanchi112
@Mr. Mind that isn't canon.


LOL.

it's a joke..........

Originally posted by MrMind
it's a joke.......... I don't find it funny.

Originally posted by quanchi112
LOL at you trying to start something. Surfer wins. Prove it.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
Prove it. Surfer's domination of Brb, him tanking blasts from proemial gods, him schooling Skaar, him dominating Nova, him dominating Ravenous.

Who has Darkseid beaten anyways recently ?

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer's domination of Brb, him tanking blasts from proemial gods,

What domination? you mean the even match until SS resulted with a cheap shot with the board? and what proemial gods?

Originally posted by -K-M-
What domination? you mean the even match until SS resulted with a cheap shot with the board? and what proemial gods? Surfer easily warding off an attack and beating the snot out of Bill while holding back.

T and A.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer easily warding off an attack and beating the snot out of Bill while holding back.

T and A.

haha ok Quan sure.

Concerning T&A maybe you should mention the context about the Crunch? If you go by that logic then DS beat all of DC earth using the Anti-life Equation

Originally posted by -K-M-
haha ok Quan sure.

Concerning T&A maybe you should mention the context about the Crunch? If you go by that logic then DS beat all of DC earth using the Anti-life Equation I said he tanked their attacks showing how durable he is. He can't beat them on his own but surviving multiple attacks is far more impressive than being completely dominated by DD in two panels.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I said he tanked their attacks showing how durable he is. He can't beat them on his own but surviving multiple attacks is far more impressive than being completely dominated by DD in two panels.

yeah and so what? He was easily defeated the first time and the second time they fought he would have died if it wasnt for Galactus. You're trolling Quan.

Originally posted by -K-M-
yeah and so what? He was easily defeated the first time and the second time they fought he would have died if it wasnt for Galactus. You're trolling Quan. I agree he can be defeated by these two but they dwarf his power and he tanked their attacks which is much more impressive than what has beaten Seid. He's lost to considerably weaker opponents one on one. Surfer wins.

Originally posted by quanchi112
I agree he can be defeated by these two but they dwarf his power and he tanked their attacks which is much more impressive than what has beaten Seid. He's lost to considerably weaker opponents one on one. Surfer wins.

Yeah and those apparently were M-bodies not their full power and they did treat him like an insect until the Crunch incident. haha oh Quan I wouldn't go by low showings as SS has been beaten by a brick. You're trolling.

Mungi wins. 131

Originally posted by -K-M-
Yeah and those apparently were M-bodies not their full power and they did treat him like an insect until the Crunch incident. haha oh Quan I wouldn't go by low showings as SS has been beaten by a brick. You're trolling. What is this m body talk ? It doesn't limit their power so please stay on point here.

Losing to DD isn't a low showing but unlike you I do bring up losses. I guess to you losing to DD is trolling. Man up.

Originally posted by quanchi112
What is this m body talk ? It doesn't limit their power so please stay on point here.

Losing to DD isn't a low showing but unlike you I do bring up losses. I guess to you losing to DD is trolling. Man up.

M bodies are like avatars

haha so what's worse getting knocked out by a brick or losing to DD? hmmm......

Originally posted by Badabing
Mungi wins. 131 Maybe the band might beat me but KM the poster loses.

Originally posted by Badabing
Mungi wins. 131

also, Darkseid. Too powerful.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Maybe the band might beat me but KM the poster loses.

You're so witty.

Originally posted by -K-M-
You're so witty. I wish there was on off button but I'm always on.

Originally posted by -K-M-
M bodies are like avatars

haha so what's worse getting knocked out by a brick or losing to DD? hmmm...... Current Surfer hasn't been ko'd by a brick.

It's irrelevant. The writer went on to state Darkseid could never beat DD unless he prepped or used strategy. I am bringing up someone I feel is superior to Seid. I don't think losing to DD is a low showing either.

Mr. M provided a link to show they aren't limited in power through m bodies and you have no proof this was an mbody which made these two weaker anyways.

Originally posted by Black bolt z
lol at anyone says surfer has a chance here. surfer has a chance

Originally posted by quanchi112
Current Surfer hasn't been ko'd by a brick.

It's irrelevant. The writer went on to state Darkseid could never beat DD unless he prepped or used strategy. I am bringing up someone I feel is superior to Seid. I don't think losing to DD is a low showing either.

Mr. M provided a link to show they aren't limited in power through m bodies and you have no proof this was an mbody which made these two weaker anyways.

Current SS has not recieved an upgrade even the writer has admitted that if you wish to go by writers comments then. So current = classic.

They were physically destroyed and yet they appeared again undamaged. This is similar to how other abstracts have used m-bodies before. Show me this scan Im actually curious as I have never seen it (Im being honest)

Originally posted by Badabing
Quan's Halloween photo from Facebook!

Originally posted by -K-M-
Current SS has not recieved an upgrade even the writer has admitted that if you wish to go by writers comments then. So current = classic.

They were physically destroyed and yet they appeared again undamaged. This is similar to how other abstracts have used m-bodies before. Show me this scan Im actually curious as I have never seen it (Im being honest) Provide a link and anyways his showings are vastly superior so whether it's an attitude change that is an upgrade of sorts.

I am sure there was a reason given.


There was no mention of m bodies being used.

It's in one o fmr. m's debates with gstorm I can't recall which but was from a few days ago. I glanced it.

DS wins with little effort

Originally posted by -K-M-
What domination? you mean the even match until SS resulted with a cheap shot with the board? and what proemial gods? cmon, he beat brb fair and square. it was a good fight, but there was no doubt who was the strongets out of the 2.

Originally posted by -K-M-
Yeah and those apparently were M-bodies not their full power and they did treat him like an insect until the Crunch incident. haha oh Quan I wouldn't go by low showings as SS has been beaten by a brick. You're trolling. hum... I dont know about that. how they came back during imperative was never explained, but galactus has his humanoid star body that he uses to interact with the abstracts and apparently that would be m-body not his usual dorky one, neither seems to be limited in power. Given their backstory, the corpses they found of other proemial gods and how similar they were to G, being often compared to him, I'm guessing the same applies to them and those physical bodies are the real thing.

Originally posted by -K-M-
What domination? you mean the even match until SS resulted with a cheap shot with the board? and what proemial gods?

As much as you don't like it, SS dominated BRB. I find it stupid that ppl still argue that it was somehow an even fight based on the Surfer using his board to hit BRB behind his neck. :-/

And saying "even match" is just retarded. Did the Surfer hit BRB behind his neck? Yes. Did he need to? No.

At NO point did it seem that BRB was shown to be even remotely a threat to the Surfer and at no time did he (even when he scored several hits) shown that he could actually injure the Surfer with his best shots. The Surfer took his best shots and took him down easily while obviously holding back and apologizing the whole time.

Even if SS dominated BRB, so would Darkseid.

Norrin still loses, imo.

IMO, non-jobbing DS would squeek out a win. 6/10 mebbe.

High-showings DS would dominate.

But the DS that Superman keeps punking simply loses.

DS desperately needs good feats against SM

Originally posted by 753
DS desperately needs good feats against SM

Why? Superman beats everyone eventually, and DS already has good feats against him. He tends to have around the same if not more wins against Superman than vice versa, iirc.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Why? Superman beats everyone eventually, and DS already has good feats against him. He tends to have around the same if not more wins against Superman than vice versa, iirc.

Every hero can be argued to "beat everyone eventually".

The fact that Supes gets wins from DS means that DS is within the level that Surfer can beat as well. I mean, if Supes can beat DS, why can't Surfer (who is arguably more powerful)?

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Every hero can be argued to "beat everyone eventually".

The fact that Supes gets wins from DS means that DS is within the level that Surfer can beat as well. I mean, if Supes can beat DS, why can't Surfer (who is arguably more powerful)?

Superman is a step above in general.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Superman is a step above in general.

Edit. Oh wait. Lol. Misconstrued your meaning earlier.

You mean to say that Supes is above the Surfer in general?

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
So is the Surfer. What's your point?

That Surfer isn't.

Originally posted by -Pr-
That Surfer isn't.

Yes he is.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Yes he is.

Originally posted by -Pr-
That Surfer isn't. Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Yes he is. Originally posted by -Pr-
That Surfer isn't. Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Yes he is. Originally posted by -Pr-
That Surfer isn't.

amazing.

Originally posted by -Pr-
amazing.

It's BRILLIANT, really!

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
It's BRILLIANT, really!

Indeed.

Originally posted by -Pr-
Superman is a step above in general. nah...DS's recent performances against SM have watered him down to a high herald/very low trans. If SM can beat him, it's entirely plausible for SS to do so.

I gave DS the win considering that his embarassing defeats at the hands of SM are mostly jobbing.

Originally posted by 753
nah...DS's recent performances against SM have watered him down to a high herald/very low trans. If SM can beat him, it's entirely plausible for SS to do so.

I gave DS the win considering that his embarassing defeats at the hands of SM are mostly jobbing.

No.

Originally posted by 753
nah...DS's recent performances against SM have watered him down to a high herald/very low trans. If SM can beat him, it's entirely plausible for SS to do so.

I gave DS the win considering that his embarassing defeats at the hands of SM are mostly jobbing.


I'm not sure I would go that far, Supes in physically as strong as most trans levelers, DS can do much better against someone with a different powerset, I'd go as far as to say he's physically superior to most heralds.

Originally posted by Bentley
I'm not sure I would go that far, Supes in physically as strong as most trans levelers, DS can do much better against someone with a different powerset, I'd go as far as to say he's physically superior to most heralds.

Doomsday utterly crushed DS, tho. Physically, he just wasn't quite there. And his fight with Orion wasn't all that decisive in putting him in the "physically beyond HH" category, either. "Beyond HH" should show him utterly schooling/slapping around HHs the way Thanos/DP Tyrant or SBP does it.

I know that DS mostly has better feats than that, but the way Supes has been tooling him (tho he's had his moments as well) kinda lowers his overall value in terms of formidability.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Doomsday utterly crushed DS, tho. Physically, he just wasn't quite there. And his fight with Orion wasn't all that decisive in putting him in the "physically beyond HH" category, either. "Beyond HH" should show him utterly schooling/slapping around HHs the way Thanos/DP Tyrant or SBP does it.

I know that DS mostly has better feats than that, but the way Supes has been tooling him (tho he's had his moments as well) kinda lowers his overall value in terms of formidability. Doomsday in that particular story was superior to Silver Surfer in that he could adapt to any given power including the Omegas. He was also able to resist high level time and matter manipulation in the form of waverider as well as resist being physically stronger than an amped Superman. Silver Surfer would have done worse against Doomsday than Darksied did considering DS's omegas are stronger than anything Surfer could crank out. Doomsday crushed DS with no head to head conflict. Head on, DS would simply BFR Doomsday to the end of time.

Originally posted by -Pr-
No. yes!

DS and pretty easily IMO

Originally posted by 753
yes!

except no.

it's happening again...

Originally posted by -Pr-
except no.

it's happening again... But it's fun!

I wish all debating was like this.

Originally posted by TitoSanchez
Doomsday in that particular story was superior to Silver Surfer in that he could adapt to any given power including the Omegas. He was also able to resist high level time and matter manipulation in the form of waverider as well as resist being physically stronger than an amped Superman. Silver Surfer would have done worse against Doomsday than Darksied did considering DS's omegas are stronger than anything Surfer could crank out. Doomsday crushed DS with no head to head conflict. Head on, DS would simply BFR Doomsday to the end of time.

Surfer would actually do better against DD since he wouldn't try to fight him on the ground and wouldn't turn his back to him while monologing. :P

SS'd prolly just BFR DD after figuring out he couldn't really put him down by blasting him.

Anyway, my point was ppl mentioned that DS is physically superior to most heralds (while the statement IS true as he IS physically superior to MOST heralds), I disagree to the implication that it would take a herald with "trans-level physical stats" like Superman to put DS down.

Superman is a HH physical combatant (tho he DOES have trans-level or higher showings if we base it on his high showings only) the same way that the Surfer is a HH energy manipulator (even tho he's been shown to manipulate abstract-level energies at times during his high showings). The way it is, Surfer's powerset is actually just as suited to fight DS as Superman is (but with different methods). It would be argued that DS would NEED to BFR the Surfer as the Surfer can use his board to deflect the OBs while blasting DS. Thing is, BFR works less on the Surfer than it would Supes as he has more ways to come back from it.

If Supes can beat DS, so can the Surfer. Thing is, DS would still win the majority, of course. But it is in no way a stomp or easy as some ppl would say it.

In no way can you project Superman's defeat of Darkseid to Surfer. It makes no sense.

Superman's combat speed and fighting prowess are far above that of Surfer, and that's really how Superman beat Darkseid: by getting super bloodlusted and unleashing a good old fashioned heroic beatdown. Surfer isn't doing that.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
In no way can you project Superman's defeat of Darkseid to Surfer. It makes no sense.

Superman's combat speed and fighting prowess are far above that of Surfer, and that's really how Superman beat Darkseid: by getting super bloodlusted and unleashing a good old fashioned heroic beatdown. Surfer isn't doing that. surfer could age darkseid into an shriveled old man

Originally posted by Omega Vision
In no way can you project Superman's defeat of Darkseid to Surfer. It makes no sense.

Superman's combat speed and fighting prowess are far above that of Surfer, and that's really how Superman beat Darkseid: by getting super bloodlusted and unleashing a good old fashioned heroic beatdown. Surfer isn't doing that.

You're arguing that if Superman gets serious, he' beat DS but Surfer (who holds back less now than before, is more powerful, more durable and has a ton more options) can't?

Bias much?

Originally posted by 753
cmon, he beat brb fair and square. it was a good fight, but there was no doubt who was the strongets out of the 2.

He did, but before the board trick it was very even. Not a domination as was said.

Originally posted by 753
hum... I dont know about that. how they came back during imperative was never explained, but galactus has his humanoid star body that he uses to interact with the abstracts and apparently that would be m-body not his usual dorky one, neither seems to be limited in power. Given their backstory, the corpses they found of other proemial gods and how similar they were to G, being often compared to him, I'm guessing the same applies to them and those physical bodies are the real thing.

Breevort said m-body, but we don't take writers statements as facts but it does make sense.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
As much as you don't like it, SS dominated BRB. I find it stupid that ppl still argue that it was somehow an even fight based on the Surfer using his board to hit BRB behind his neck. :-/

And saying "even match" is just retarded. Did the Surfer hit BRB behind his neck? Yes. Did he need to? No.

At NO point did it seem that BRB was shown to be even remotely a threat to the Surfer and at no time did he (even when he scored several hits) shown that he could actually injure the Surfer with his best shots. The Surfer took his best shots and took him down easily while obviously holding back and apologizing the whole time.

It was the board trick that got SS the edge, is it legal? Most definetly, but SS had to resort to it to get an edge. Which is fine, but not really a domination.

Originally posted by 753
nah...DS's recent performances against SM have watered him down to a high herald/very low trans. If SM can beat him, it's entirely plausible for SS to do so.

I gave DS the win considering that his embarassing defeats at the hands of SM are mostly jobbing.

Supes lost all his recent encounters with DS. FC's countervibration was the one victory Supes had over DS in their last four battles.

I don't see why people are referencing all of DS low showings and none of his high ones. Surfer gets raped by DS.

Originally posted by Allankles
Supes lost all his recent encounters with DS. FC's countervibration was the one victory Supes had over DS in their last four battles. When did Darkseid beat Superman under his own power without anyone's help ?

Now DS needs people's help to beat Supes? With the exception of SF DS ko'ing Supes all other battles were DS under his own power.

Originally posted by Allankles
Now DS needs people's help to beat Supes? With the exception of SF DS ko'ing Supes all other battles were DS under his own power. Uhm, using jimmy olsen as k'nite is an example of him using someone else to gain an advantage.


We don't used amped Ds victories over Superman anyways.
Name the recent victories then.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Uhm, using jimmy olsen as k'nite is an example of him using someone else to gain an advantage.


We don't used amped Ds victories over Superman anyways.
Name the recent victories then.

No. It's an example of using esoteric powers to gain advantage. Last I checked Jimmy was a conduit that DS had created i.e. he directed the New God powers to Jimmy then matter maniped Jimmy to emit kryptonite. He didn't use a device just the Omega Force. So yeah, esoteric abilities.

Who said anything to deny that? I was simply stating a fact, that in the last four most recent battles with Supes DS was 3 of 4. What part of that assesment is inaccurate? I was talking about recent encounters, and DS was amped for one of those (most people recall the Soul fire equation).

Originally posted by Allankles
No. It's an example of using esoteric powers to gain advantage. Last I checked Jimmy was a conduit that DS had created i.e. he directed the New God powers to Jimmy then matter maniped Jimmy to emit kryptonite. He didn't use a device just the Omega Force. So yeah, esoteric abilities.

Who said anything to deny that? I was simply stating a fact, that in the last four most recent battles with Supes DS was 3 of 4. What part of that assesment is inaccurate? I was talking about recent encounters, and DS was amped for one of those (most people recall the Soul fire equation). Jimmy doesn't normally have this power within him so yes he isn't capable of this on his own so yes he used jimmy's amp against Superman. On his own he couldn't beat Superman, yet again.

You left out the context that without outside aid or an amp Ds hasn't beaten Superman lately at all.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Jimmy doesn't normally have this power within him so yes he isn't capable of this on his own so yes he used jimmy's amp against Superman. On his own he couldn't beat Superman, yet again.

You left out the context that without outside aid or an amp Ds hasn't beaten Superman lately at all.

It seemed to have flown over your head that Darkseid amped Jimmy by directing the New God powers and other powers from other superbeings he wanted to acquire (through their deaths) into Jimmy.

As in, he used his power to turn Jimmy into repository of energy, an energy which he planned to use at his leisure e.g. to quickly eliminate Superman if he interfered with his plans.

Darkseid used the Omega Force to make Jimmy a superbeing with multiple powers from the New Gods and other beings. He later simply matter manipulated Jimmy to end Supes interference.

It was an esoteric use of his own abilities, your opinion doesn't change facts.

Originally posted by Allankles
It seemed to have flown over your head that Darkseid amped Jimmy by directing the New God powers and other powers from other superbeings he wanted to acquire (through their deaths) into Jimmy.

As in, he used his power to turn Jimmy into repository of energy, an energy which he planned to use at his leisure e.g. to quickly eliminate Superman if he interfered with his plans.

Darkseid used the Omega Force to make Jimmy a superbeing with multiple powers from the New Gods and other beings. He later simply matter manipulated Jimmy to end Supes interference.

It was an esoteric use of his own abilities, your opinion doesn't change facts. Yes, power that isn't his own so this isn't what he's capable of normally. If Thanos uses a cc that doesn't mean it's his own power just a power source he acquired thus not applicable to a normal Thanos showing just like here.

He used power outside his own through his own power. he doesn't have access to this power outside this appearance thus not applicable. You can try to dance around this all you want but I'm right.

The ability to transfer power and then matter manip are his. It's nothing like the cc, since the cc provides all the power and ability.

It was context specific and thus would be invalid in a forum battle, but it is valid as a canon victory under his own power, since he used his own power to achieve it (including amping Jimmy).

Originally posted by Allankles
The ability to transfer power and then matter manip are his. It's nothing like the cc, since the cc provides all the power and ability.

It was context specific and thus would be invalid in a forum battle, but it is valid as a canon victory under his own power, since he used his own power to achieve it (including amping Jimmy). Yes, but the power he had access to is not so not applicable.

No, it isn't valid under his own power only through this story is it canon but not something he can do under his own power.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Yes, but the power he had access to is not so not applicable.

No, it isn't valid under his own power only through this story is it canon but not something he can do under his own power.

Uhh. He can amp people in many ways under his own power and has done so, he can also matter manip and has done so. You've lost the argument.

I already said that it was context specific and would be invalid in a forum battle, specifically - using someone as a conduit for powers.

But as far as it being under his own power, it was definitely under his own capability, most especially the part where he turns Jimmy into walking kryptonite.

Jimmy's new powers allowed for his body to be manipulated into producing kryptonite radiation, that part is context specific and invalid in a forum battle (which is irrelevant to my argument), but it's not the actual power that transformed him, which was the Omega Force.

For once you actually have grounds for an argument. It is arguable. But the context - Jimmy's condition allowing for the manipulation of his cells, is context specific and invalid as a strategy in a forum battle, but the power that transformed him is DS' own, and is therefore valid in regards to it being a legitimate feat under his own power.

A simple analogy would be using magnetism to manipulate a person's body, with iron in the bloodstream it is possible (Jimmy's condition) without iron not possible. So the iron is context specific but the magnetism is not, same thing here. I'm not arguing a forum battle, simply the facts, which is that he did claim the victory using his own power.

Originally posted by Starscream M
surfer could age darkseid into an shriveled old man
New Gods don't age you dolt.
Originally posted by D_Dude1210
You're arguing that if Superman gets serious, he' beat DS but Surfer (who holds back less now than before, is more powerful, more durable and has a ton more options) can't?

Bias much?
No, I'm arguing that Surfer lacks Superman's CQC prowess and combat speed, the things that allowed Superman to overcome Darkseid.

As a result saying that Surfer can beat DS because Superman did is faulty reasoning.

Originally posted by Allankles
Uhh. He can amp people in many ways under his own power and has done so, he can also matter manip and has done so. You've lost the argument.

I already said that it was context specific and would be invalid in a forum battle, specifically - using someone as a conduit for powers.

But as far as it being under his own power, it was definitely under his own capability, most especially the part where he turns Jimmy into walking kryptonite.

Jimmy's new powers allowed for his body to be manipulated into producing kryptonite radiation, that part is context specific and invalid in a forum battle (which is irrelevant to my argument), but it's not the actual power that transformed him, which was the Omega Force. The only reason he did so was the power stored in olsen had he done so without this power you'd have a valid argument but since he didn't you don't.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
New Gods don't age you dolt.

No, I'm arguing that Surfer lacks Superman's CQC prowess and combat speed, the things that allowed Superman to overcome Darkseid.

As a result saying that Surfer can beat DS because Superman did is faulty reasoning. Surfer has combat speed due to his board which could result in the same conclusion.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
No, I'm arguing that Surfer lacks Superman's CQC prowess and combat speed, the things that allowed Superman to overcome Darkseid.

As a result saying that Surfer can beat DS because Superman did is faulty reasoning.

So you're saying that Superman beat DS because he is far Superior to DS in CQC combat prowess?

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
So you're saying that Superman beat DS because he is far Superior to DS in CQC combat prowess?

OV would also believe that Superman is more durable, i'd bet.



and Quan, stop trolling. Seriously. You're on thin ice as it is. Even Bada won't protect you this far.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
So you're saying that Superman beat DS because he is far Superior to DS in CQC combat prowess?
He's certainly a more able brawler. Faster too.

He's not far superior, that much is evident in the fact that Superman's fights with Darkseid are always among his most intense and trying.

In either case, my point was that Surfer simply doesn't have the same fighting prowess and combat speed to replicate Superman's showings against DS the way Superman beat him. So the "Superman beat DS ergo Surfer can" isn't sound reasoning.

Originally posted by Omega Vision
He's certainly a more able brawler. Faster too.

He's not far superior, that much is evident in the fact that Superman's fights with Darkseid are always among his most intense and trying.

In either case, my point was that Surfer simply doesn't have the same fighting prowess and combat speed to replicate Superman's showings against DS the way Superman beat him. So the "Superman beat DS ergo Surfer can" isn't sound reasoning.

Thing, is DS isn't an accomplished range/flight combatant himself. He doesn't really fly around and attack his opponents at range by using speed and skill.

If anything, he's shown to BRAWL with his opponents or simply attack them with his OB.

The OB would hurt the Surfer, no doubt, if it would hit him. Thing is, if they travel at light speed, can't the Surfer (who travels millions of times that speed) simply outrun it? Superman has certainly evaded it before. Why not the Surfer? If not, he can always deflect it with his board (w/c has been shown to EASILY deflect Thor's hammer)?

SS is more accomplished than DS in the fighting style HE employs (flight/dodge/weave/blas). DS would most likely stand there hovering and blasting at SS with his OBs, w/c is questionable if he can hit the SS before the SS can strike him with planet destroying blasts.

If DS has shown the same/higher/comparative level of flight/blast/evasion skill that the Surfer has shown in his long history, pls show this via scans.

Superman's punches can sure hurt him, why not the Surfer's blasts?

So basically, Superman fights DS CQC (w/c is one of DS's preferred mode of combat) and wins due to superior skill and speed.

Surfer would fight DS at range, using speed, evasion, deflection (via board) and powerful ranged attacks (w/c, I believe is NOT DS's preferred mode of combat) and would also win via superior skill and speed.

they'd both lose without the assitance of pis because they're a lot weaker than him.

Originally posted by Starscream M
surfer could age darkseid into an shriveled old man This genius

Originally posted by 753
they'd both lose without the assitance of pis because they're a lot weaker than him.

So you're saying that every win Supes has vs DS is PIS? And every instance Supes has hurt DS with his punches and HV is PIS?

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
So you're saying that every win Supes has vs DS is PIS? And every instance Supes has hurt DS with his punches and HV is PIS? hurt, no. besides, I'm talking about who takes a majority. SM's victories usually depend on retarded low showings from DS forggeting most of his powers or specific plot devices. HV has blocked the OB, DS was blinded by swallen eyes, SM blitzed the OBs and drove them into DS's ass, shoved him into the wall of the universe when DS was face to face with him and didnt fire the omega beams, the list goes on, and what the **** is counter-vibration?

No PIS, no way, DS takes a majority form both of them.

Originally posted by 753
hurt, no. besides, I'm talking about who takes a majority. SM's victories usually depend on retarded low showings from DS forggeting most of his powers or specific plot devices. HV has blocked the OB, DS was blinded by swallen eyes, SM blitzed the OBs and drove them into DS's ass, shoved him into the wall of the universe when DS was face to face with him and didnt fire the omega beams, the list goes on, and what the **** is counter-vibration?

No PIS, no way, DS takes a majority form both of them.


At worst they split

Originally posted by 753
hurt, no. besides, I'm talking about who takes a majority. SM's victories usually depend on retarded low showings from DS forggeting most of his powers or specific plot devices. HV has blocked the OB, DS was blinded by swallen eyes, SM blitzed the OBs and drove them into DS's ass, shoved him into the wall of the universe when DS was face to face with him and didnt fire the omega beams, the list goes on, and what the **** is counter-vibration?

No PIS, no way, DS takes a majority form both of them.

Well, that's in accordance to what I previously said anyway.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
IMO, non-jobbing DS would squeek out a win. 6/10 mebbe.

High-showings DS would dominate.

But the DS that Superman keeps punking simply loses.

Originally posted by quanchi112
Surfer wins.

Nope. LOL
Darkseid in a stomp.