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Who will win?

Winner fights Mecha Gouki.

What has Cosmic Gouki done?

Turned Silver.

You know what that means.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
What has Cosmic Gouki done?

IDK. He is brought up 2 basic Herald lvl + his mastery of martial arts, SNH, his own chi and spiritual powers and what have U, tho. That added 2 whatever Galactus gave him, most likely forced upon him, should make him a major threat.

How do you feel Pyron compares to Galactus.

Characters-wise, it's clear that Pyron was Nspired by Galactus. Capcom may never come out and say it but a lot of what he does is eerily similar 2 Galactus.

As far as power go, I don't think there is a comparison. Galactus is everywhere and has years upon years of history. Pyron has, N canon, been N 1 game where he was just playing around with the cast. Where his power actually stops is not known. His best so far R is N, no doubt, the JP version of CFE.

My point is that the Heralds are nothing to Galatctus. He could erase Silver Surfer with a thought. Hence my point.

Yeah. If Pyron is an equal of Galactus, Akuma should get practically sneezed out of existence here.

Heralds aren't anywhere near Galactus in power. That's why it's considered such a high showing when they manage to hold their own against him.

Out of curiosity, where do you all rank Pyron? I'm definitely not a Darkstalkers expert.

He's an upper level Darkstalkers.

Heralds hold up to Galactus when he jobs.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
My point is that the Heralds are nothing to Galatctus. He could erase Silver Surfer with a thought. Hence my point. Pyron is "limited" in this thread. I guess that means small and terrestrial like he appears in the games. True Pyron would destroy this Akuma.Originally posted by StyleTime


Out of curiosity, where do you all rank Pyron? I'm definitely not a Darkstalkers expert.

4th strongest from the top when includin playable characters. Pretty far from the top when including "all" important characters. Mind you, based only on what we know. I or Frisky can tell you that the plot of DS is heavily incomplete.

Pyron is really powerful, however, he lacks spiritual and magical abilities. DS characters have those sorts of powers in spades. CFE, tho. Dude is like some sort of God. And I'm really subject to say that he's showin canon ability in that game.

Pyron would wreck an average bietch slump Galactus. And Galactus has been quite a bietch lately.

Pyron, based on showings, is a Skyfather in terms of power and ability, not on the level of Odin in all likelihood, but he would ***** Darkseid (Not Final Crisis) or Thanos.

So do you think Pyron could beat a decent level Big G?

Not really sure.

Define "decent level" I guess.

Though what, is Cosmic Gouki as powerful as Galactus or something?

No, at best PC Herald Gouki is high herald level at best estimates.

And I would include heralded Shin and Oni levels in that too.

Shin Akuma in the same league as Superman and Silver Surfer. That's too much. Don't get me started on the Flash.

I don't know what it is in the games forum. I was thinking comics forum counterpart.

Well personally I don't think any High Herald really poses any threat to Pyron at all.

Full power I mean.

Limited, eh.

Yea, that's what I was saying. I was asking if you thought he could beat an average Galactus.

I don't really know, to be honest.

IIRC Galactus at piss-starved levels vaped three solar systems casually, but that is the only signifigant feat I can recall with actual context, except the theoretical full power Galactus who can apparently eat the universe.

Kind of a wide gap.

Not to mention the jobbing.

It's really hard 2 say that Pyron would lose or win ANYTHING @ 100% win he has never been shown, close 2 that lvl of his own power. Even the feats and the abilities we R told about can B accomplished @ his planet sized lvls.

If we go by his CFE back story, Pyron could GOOF around with whole dimensional planes.

Galactus is barely shown that way either, he's generally shown as a jobber unfortunately.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
He's an upper level Darkstalkers.

Heralds hold up to Galactus when he jobs.
Originally posted by No End N Site
Pyron is "limited" in this thread. I guess that means small and terrestrial like he appears in the games. True Pyron would destroy this Akuma.

4th strongest from the top when includin playable characters. Pretty far from the top when including "all" important characters. Mind you, based only on what we know. I or Frisky can tell you that the plot of DS is heavily incomplete.

Pyron is really powerful, however, he lacks spiritual and magical abilities. DS characters have those sorts of powers in spades. CFE, tho. Dude is like some sort of God. And I'm really subject to say that he's showin canon ability in that game.
I meant where do you rank him in relation to characters like Galactus or Surfer.

I don't really have a reference point for Darkstalkers since I don't know much about them.

Idk enough about Surf and Galactus to make a comparison, so beats me. What's the 'greatest' thing they've ever done so I would have somethin to go on?

I mean, Pyron could step on Galaxies and there isn't really a limit to how much he can consume, since he is said to be able to eat the entire universe, eventually.

He also managed to reach the corners of the universe and back in a very human amount of time.

Originally posted by StyleTime
I meant where do you rank him in relation to characters like Galactus or Surfer.

I don't really have a reference point for Darkstalkers since I don't know much about them. At least mid Galactus. Peers around that.

Originally posted by No End N Site
Idk enough about Surf and Galactus to make a comparison, so beats me. What's the 'greatest' thing they've ever done so I would have somethin to go on?

I mean, Pyron could step on Galaxies and there isn't really a limit to how much he can consume, since he is said to be able to eat the entire universe, eventually.

He also managed to reach the corners of the universe and back in a very human amount of time.
Gotcha. Creating black holes just from firing an energy blast is a good feat people like to bring up with Surfer; however, it sounds like Pyron is probably above him in power. Being a universe level threat is greater than typical Surfer.

Galactus's status seems more like a ranking issue rather than outright feats. He did blow up 3 solar systems and wasn't at full capacity though. It's implied he's well beyond that at full power and he asserts himself against guys like Thanos and High Evolutionary occassionally. The only time I recall him ever seeming hurt/losing was in a fight against Phoenix. Based on C-master's response, it seems like Pyron is around here somewhere.
Originally posted by Tha C-Master
At least mid Galactus. Peers around that.
I see.

I'd say they are around peers overall. But going by feats I know he's done some solid Galactus stuff.

On a physical level at least, he'd wreck an average Galactus.

Possibly. Be hard explaining that in comic versus.

So you think he's arguably better than Big G?

Originally posted by StyleTime
Gotcha. Creating black holes just from firing an energy blast is a good feat people like to bring up with Surfer; however, it sounds like Pyron is probably above him in power. Being a universe level threat is greater than typical Surfer.

Galactus's status seems more like a ranking issue rather than outright feats. He did blow up 3 solar systems and wasn't at full capacity though. It's implied he's well beyond that at full power and he asserts himself against guys like Thanos and High Evolutionary occassionally. The only time I recall him ever seeming hurt/losing was in a fight against Phoenix. Based on C-master's response, it seems like Pyron is around here somewhere.



I think Pyron would kill Surfer. Pyron can make multiple mega stars hyper/super nova just thru will. And that's after he shrinks them and teleports them across a series of galaxies N matter of seconds. After he does this, he can recreate them and put them back again. This can actually B done N his most weakest form, thru an attack called Cosmo Disruption.

Pyron would B able 2 erase Galaxy just by kicking it. With his matter manip @ larger size, he should B able 2 wipe out a series of Galaxies thru only his will 2 do so.

I agreed it sounds like Pyron is above Surfer.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
At least mid Galactus. Peers around that.

As badly we would like 2, what I and, I think, No End R trying 2 get across is, U CAN'T place him anywhere N a Marvel tier list. He has NEVER been shown @ full power. Not @ all, not ever even close.

We would B placing him N these spots based off of thing he can do hog tied. Everything we have stated thus far R things that R N the very nature of his being. These R things he does naturally on a normal bases 2 bring Ntertainment 2 his boring life.

Right, on a comparative scale. But we can guess what we no he can do, without applying a no-limit fallacy.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Right, on a comparative scale. But we can guess what we no he can do, without applying a no-limit fallacy.

But we can't guess Bcause we no that there is an unfathomable gap Btween what we have seen him do, and what he can do if he wanted 2.

The gap so is large that N the JP CFE, win he merges multiple dimensions: Ncluding the past, present, and the future of the same universes all to 1 point out of sheer boredom, it doesn't seem out of his realm of power, @ all. Bcause what we no about his power is so vague.

So are we saying we can't use him in debates? Very few characters show their true best. We can say that it is likely that they are in the same league and that a herald level character stands no chance.

Galactus at his strongest theoretical level is apparently an Omniversal thread, at least if I am remembering Mr. Master's Marvel tiers thread correctly.

We can safely assume that is far above Pyron, but I could be remembering wrong.

Pyron's best feats are on a galactic+ level, not counting CFE apparently though.

To be honest, based on actual feats, the only character in DS rivaling Pyron is Jedah, IMHO.

Yea, and that is theory. Which is why I said that he is probably better than average, considering the jobbing.

What about Morrigan full potential? I guess you are saying that featwise.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Yea, and that is theory. Which is why I said that he is probably better than average, considering the jobbing.

What about Morrigan full potential? I guess you are saying that featwise. I was not aware a full potential Morrigan had feats. O:

Wearing little "clothing"?

Pft, even Felicia can do that, and is better at it.

Both can, I prefer Morrigan myself. I'd take either though.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Galactus at his strongest theoretical level is apparently an Omniversal thread, at least if I am remembering Mr. Master's Marvel tiers thread correctly.

We can safely assume that is far above Pyron, but I could be remembering wrong.

How do we know that Pyron at full power could not just think away the universe? He is at a point where he can evolve no further and is stated to have the power to rule the universe.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Pyron's best feats are on a galactic+ level, not counting CFE apparently though.


In truth, Pyron has 'no feats'. Everything he has done and has been said to be able to do are based on his size and are special moves in some way, shape, or form.

This is akin to sayin that Ryu throwin a Hadouken is a feat. Or because Ryu is bigger than a watermelon thus his ability to smash one, is a feat. These instances require no effort and is just too lil information about said character to be used.Originally posted by Tha C-Master
So are we saying we can't use him in debates?

I for one have been sayin this shit for a very long time. We can't, unless he is small. There does come a point where there is just so lil info that you just can't use someone. This is a case of that very thing.

C my man, you gotta realize how lil effort this guy has put forth in every showin. It's like he's been asleep in every game he has been in, even in CFE. He literally has displayed zero effort. He's probably put more effort into powerin down than he has into a fight. He doesn't even care about dyin. He will hold back even if it kills him and it did.

Yeah Morrigan is the better looking of the two, would agree on that.

Though to be honest, I like most Capcom fighting girls in terms of looks.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master


What about Morrigan full potential?

Morrigan at full power is above Pyron, she may very well be the strongest of the 'playable' characters. In the comics she was said to be nigh-omnipotent. As newborn infant, she ranked in the same class as Jedah.

Originally posted by No End N Site
How do we know that Pyron at full power could not just think away the universe? He is at a point where he can evolve no further and is stated to have the power to rule the universe.

In truth, Pyron has 'no feats'. Everything he has done and has been said to be able to do are based on his size and are special moves in some way, shape, or form.

This is akin to sayin that Ryu throwin a Hadouken is a feat. Or because Ryu is bigger than a watermelon thus his ability to smash one, is a feat. These instances require no effort and is just too lil information about said character to be used. Because it was said that in time he could eat and become the new universe. Which carries the implication he cannot just think it away. Freeza ruled large sections of the galaxy, but was "merely" a planet buster.

No, but a Hadouken being able to destroy, I dunno, a mountain is a feat. Like how Pyron shrinking constellations and making them go supernova is a feat. Oh, and embodying, controlling, and mantaining an orbit of planets four times larger than the Milky Way is a feat as well.

This is the same logic you used with Vegeto, ironically against Pyron. While we cannot say for sure, we can make an assumption, and the difference between Pyron's galaxy+ level feats and universe busting, let alone Omniversal feats, is gigantic, so until proven different, the logical assumption is to assume he probably does not have that level of power.

Originally posted by NemeBro
Because it was said that in time he could eat and become the new universe. Which carries the implication he cannot just think it away.

It did not say that he "could", it said he would (paraphrasin). Those are 2 very different things. Pyron could have destroyed Earth. But he did not, cuz he was just tryin to find a way outta of his boredom. Now tell me, how would he not be bored, sittin' in nothingness because he just erased the universe? Clearly, shrinkin' down and scannin every single planet in the cosmos is his intent. He's not tryin to destroy anything. A 400k LY being is going to every planet he finds pretty 1 by 1, havin fun.


Originally posted by NemeBro
Freeza ruled large sections of the galaxy, but was "merely" a planet buster.

There is a difference between ruling in a sense that you have laid claim to a territory and being able to control it. Freeza blows shit up and rules as a king/tyrant would. Pyron is said to rule space and can turn gravity on and off, shrink objects, make objects appear before him instantly, blow up stars at will, look at a creature and can deduce what the creature will evolve into, and can look at a being and instantly tell that said being does not belong in this universe.

Freeza rules in a very human way. Pyron clearly does not.

Originally posted by NemeBro
No, but a Hadouken being able to destroy, I dunno, a mountain is a feat. Like how Pyron shrinking constellations and making them go supernova is a feat. Oh, and embodying, controlling, and mantaining an orbit of planets four times larger than the Milky Way is a feat as well.

This is barely a feat. It is a special move that in fact, requires even less effort than Ryu uses to do a Hadouken. The things you are bringin up is shit he naturally does on a regular bases. Because it is so easy for him to do, it is an act of his own nature than it is a feat. He can do these things at less than a real fraction of his actual size.

FEAT/An achievement that requires great courage, skill, or strength. An act of skill, endurance, imagination, or strength; an achievement.

What you stated requires none of that from Pyron.

Originally posted by NemeBro
This is the same logic you used with Vegeto, ironically against Pyron. While we cannot say for sure, we can make an assumption, and the difference between Pyron's galaxy+ level feats and universe busting, let alone Omniversal feats, is gigantic, so until proven different, the logical assumption is to assume he probably does not have that level of power.

This is actually an even better case, at least Geto went SSJ2. Pyron has not even done that much. And galaxy bustin feats? When? Pyron can bust a galaxy cuz he can kick it like a soccer ball, where is the effort in that? You are makin logical assumption for a case where there is especially no evidence to make one. I could see if Pyron actually went the whole 400k or even planet sized to fight somethin, but not even that.

I am not sayin that dude could bust the universe just by thinkin about it but given what we know, 'anything' could be in the realm of his power. Hell, there's barley enough info to tell where the facts start and the hyperbole ends. There isn't even info to dispute whether or not what he did in CFE is not in the realm of his actual power and even in that game, he equates what he did to thorwin a party. And that is literal.

Well this is a hypothetical debate so assumptions must be made. Galactus doesn't use his "full potential" either, and he has a tendency to job, but we can only use what they have done.

Same with Ryu, he hasn't reached or shown his full potential either, and will likely be higher than Akuma, however we can use him as he is now.

It's not a hypothetical debate, it has "limited" in parentheses next to Pyron's name. Usin the human sized Pyron is fine, since that is the form we have actually seen do battle.

The problem is, the characters you just mentioned have at least went past level 0. I am not exaggerating either, he has put forth 0 effort to do anything he has done. The characters you have stated have at least TRIED to do something. They may have never went 100%, but they have put forth 'some' effort.

You can not assume in this case, even in hypothetical circumstances, cuz there is literally, NOTHING, ZERO, 0, ZIP to go on. If we can put this dude in threads at full power, then we can argue for 100% Morrigan who is stated to be nigh-omnipotent in her back-story in the comic.

I think we were measuring the full power Pyron in the thread superstud.

But yea, if a character has only been speculated and hasn't done *anything* then we don't know. If they have done some things, we can make a debate. There will be speculation of course.

Yeah, Pyron hasn't done anything. That's why he should be removed from debates unless he is in his tiny human form. Jedah, Demitri, Morrigan, and a bunch of other characters from the series also fall into this boat.

Things are like this cuz Capcom ended the series on a God Damn cliff hanger. The characters gain new powers, unlock powers and or recover 100% of their powers and then the series ends abruptly.

Jedah absorbs over 300 billion souls in one sitting and I assume regains his full power...game ends.

Morrigan fuses with Lilith to restore her full power...game ends.

Demitri absorbs Pyron, then goes off to face Jedah...game ends.

Anita is implied to be a Belial Aensland human equivalent (really damn powerful)... game ends.

We have no idea what the current versions can do. It's like puttin Ryu in a thread 'after' his trainin with Oro.

We have to use up the that point. It's how it works. There are tons of threads like this.

^Yup, I agree with that form of logic.

It just really sucks 2 Dbate that way with the DS characters. The characters R limited by plot Dvices just so that wont Dstroy the rest of the cast. Arguing 4 their "so far" versions just means keeping the plot devices Ntact. And there PDs R tremendously limiting.

So what did Gouki do with the power cosmic? Or are we just to assume he gets the upped physical stats combined with his skills?

If so...then sweet.

Pretty much, from what I see.

The way O figure it, it's like giving Akuma Silver Surfer's powers.... that pretty much is what this is...

Who is O?

typo...

Typo. That's a cool name.