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Let the battle begin...!

Maxima absolutely DESTROYS her. I'm not kidding, DESTROYS.

Rachel was an IDIOT in the way she wielded the PF. Check out the various issues of Excalibur if you don't believe me. Necrom, with a SLIVER of the PF Rachel had access to, wiped out an entire solar system and he was just warming up! Rachel has never done anything anywhere near that.

Maxima 1000000000/10

Rachel stomps.

rachel

rachel defeated necrom

i posted those scans along time ago

At her best, I'd bet on Rachel winning.

Yeah that fight with necrom was pretty epic. I don't think Maxima would be able to hang with that.

damn... I shoulda put most current version (echo)
i knew u guys would bring up the necrom fight

make it the echo version.

you meas the blue shadow phoenix? could go either way really.

Rachel is an idiot, but a damn powerful idiot.

Originally posted by "Id"
Rachel is an idiot, but a damn powerful idiot.

lol

yep. rachel was tough to figure. i could see her winning or losing this tbh. she certainly has the power to win, but she isn't always written to a level to match her power. max is also meaner. split i think, though there is no doubt to me rachel is more powerful.

Originally posted by "Id"
Rachel is an idiot, but a damn powerful idiot.
Yep, Emma made a similar comment when she beat her. Rachel acknowledges her own recklessness too.

Maxima is the better warrior, but if she gets Rachel pissed, game over.

What are you guys smoking cause I want some?

Rachel never beat Necrom. She allowed him to drain the PF portion that she had and it overloaded him.

He was hurling hundreds of millions of tons of molten core at her, flinging moons, igniting planets into stars, and utlimately destroying a solar system to coerce her into giving up the PF.

She was hurling 2 small asteroids at him and a solar flare. There was no comparison.

Maxima rage stomps Rachel into paste.

Originally posted by zopzop
What are you guys smoking cause I want some?

Rachel never beat Necrom. She allowed him to drain the PF portion that she had and it overloaded him.

He was hurling hundreds of millions of tons of molten core at her, flinging moons, igniting planets into stars, and utlimately destroying a solar system to coerce her into giving up the PF.

She was hurling 2 small asteroids at him and a solar flare. There was no comparison.

Maxima rage stomps Rachel into paste.

How does Rachel being less proficient with the PF then Necrom translate to Maxima rage stomping her?

And he tossed planets at her, not cores/moons, IIRC.

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
How does Rachel being less proficient with the PF then Necrom translate to Maxima rage stomping her?

And he tossed planets at her, not cores/moons, IIRC.

Check the issue again. He kept escalating his attacks. First it was the entire molten core of a planet he hurled at her, then moons, then he ignited a planet into a sun, finally he eradicated an entire solar system. He would have kept on but she surrendered her portion of the PF to him and he exploded.

She wasn't anywhere near as proficient or as powerful as him despite the fact that she had a GREATER share of the PF! She's trash dude. Face it.

Rachel takes it. Hell with just a echo, she was holding Gladiator at bay.

Originally posted by zopzop
Check the issue again. He kept escalating his attacks. First it was the entire molten core of a planet he hurled at her, then moons, then he ignited a planet into a sun, finally he eradicated an entire solar system. He would have kept on but she surrendered her portion of the PF to him and he exploded.

She wasn't anywhere near as proficient or as powerful as him despite the fact that she had a GREATER share of the PF! She's trash dude. Face it. does the fact that she could handle the PF while he exploded from having a shred of it infused in him tell you anyhting? nobody is saying she is better or equally good with her powers, just that she is more powerfull than both necrom and maxima. and yeah, she beat him.

since this is the most recent version of rachel with the phoenix fragment, she is weaker but much more skilled with her power. this could go either way.

Originally posted by zopzop
Check the issue again. He kept escalating his attacks. First it was the entire molten core of a planet he hurled at her, then moons, then he ignited a planet into a sun, finally he eradicated an entire solar system. He would have kept on but she surrendered her portion of the PF to him and he exploded.

She wasn't anywhere near as proficient or as powerful as him despite the fact that she had a GREATER share of the PF! She's trash dude. Face it.

Yeah, i remember it now. Those were moons.

But you never answered my question: How does Rachel being less proficient with the PF than Necrom have anything to do with Maxima beating her in a fight? :-/

Originally posted by D_Dude1210
Yeah, i remember it now. Those were moons.

But you never answered my question: How does Rachel being less proficient with the PF than Necrom have anything to do with Maxima beating her in a fight? :-/

Because after all those years with her power she never accomplished half of what Necrom did with only a sliver of what she had access to!

Maxima's highest feats dwarf Rachel. Rachel literally stands no chance at all. Prof. X would have been a better fight vs Maxima but he'd still die none the less.

Maxima 10/10.

Now if this had been Necrom (with PF sliver) vs Maxima, it'd be a whole different story.

Pre-Necrom fight or after?

Rachel wins, the Necrom argument is moot (especially if Maxima can't accomplish any of his Phoenix empowered feats) no matter how much better he handled the power than she did, nothing he did put her down, he threw molten cores, moons, created a sun and busted a galaxy and she was still alive, in the end the power that she had scattered his atoms to far corners of the universe.

Rachel. Rachel's TK is on a whole other level than all of Maxima's powers combined.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
Rachel. Rachel's TK is on a whole other level than all of Maxima's powers combined.

What has Rachel ever done with her TK that's anywhere near as impressive as Maxima?

Originally posted by zopzop
What has Rachel ever done with her TK that's anywhere near as impressive as Maxima? What has Maxima done with her Tk? Rachel fought Thor. Who has Max fought?

Superman, Powergirl, Doomsday...list goes on.

Rachel. Maxima doesn't really stand a chance if Summers actually tries.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
What has Maxima done with her Tk? Rachel fought Thor. Who has Max fought?

Rachel was ONE SHOTTED by Thor. Maxima has fought and beat/held her own vs Superman himself. Check out her respect thread in the "Respect" forum.

Originally posted by Konton
Rachel. Maxima doesn't really stand a chance if Summers actually tries.

I used to be Rachel Sumers/Phoenix fan, trust me she stands NO chance vs Maxima.

I don't know anything about Rachel, but if we exclude the necrom fight(which apparentely was uber) where would you rank her? What has she done with her tk/tp?

Originally posted by Zack Fair
I don't know anything about Rachel, but if we exclude the necrom fight(which apparentely was uber) where would you rank her? What has she done with her tk/tp?

Nothing! She's done nothing that's the point.

Necrom hurled hundreds of millions of tons of molten core at and she barely dodged it.

She hurled two SMALL asteroids at him. He hurled two large MOONS at her.

He ignited a planet into a star, she attacked with a minor solar flare.

He destroyed the entire solar system they were fighting in and she ran for her life.

She "beat" him by allowing him to drain her of her lifeforce which was attached to the PF (which is what he wanted all along that's why he didn't outright kill her, she had to relinquish it to him) and he blew up.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Superman, Powergirl, Doomsday...list goes on. Thor is more powerful than Superman. Powergirl? You mean when she was an atlantean and not as powerful? And Doomsday was weaker than most current top tiers in those days. There was a sever power degrade back then. DD didnt' even down a powerful league.

Originally posted by zopzop
Rachel was ONE SHOTTED by Thor. Maxima has fought and beat/held her own vs Superman himself. Check out her respect thread in the "Respect" forum.

I don't need to. I own most of those issues.

Rachel took on beings like Galactus. Thor and Maxima should be insects to her. Getting hit by Thor is a low showing anyway. She duked it out with Gladiator with nothing but the echo.

Originally posted by zopzop
Nothing! She's done nothing that's the point.

Necrom hurled hundreds of millions of tons of molten core at and she barely dodged it.

She hurled two SMALL asteroids at him. He hurled two large MOONS at her.

He ignited a planet into a star, she attacked with a minor solar flare.

He destroyed the entire solar system they were fighting in and she ran for her life.

She "beat" him by allowing him to drain her of her lifeforce which was attached to the PF (which is what he wanted all along that's why he didn't outright kill her, she had to relinquish it to him) and he blew up.

small asteroids are still pretty large.... and a small solar flare is ENORMOUS. still shows the range of her power. she HAS had low showings. under mordru she couldn't put down quasar, has her power absorbed by thor, but in the x-time caper her power drove the arc and she has fought g and HUMILIATED nova who is still a herald, if not the most powerful of them.

in terms of overall power rachel crushes her. she's had enough lower showings though to make me think max COULD win some. a well-written rachel kills her 10/10.

Nova > Surfer???

Rachel created a small black hole with her TK that warped physical reality in the area it affected. It was ripping The Fury apart until The Fury adapted.

Just throwing that into her feat pool for discussion.

Originally posted by leonidas
small asteroids are still pretty large.... and a small solar flare is ENORMOUS. still shows the range of her power.

Please check the issue again. When I said "small", I literally meant they were barely larger than Necrom, who is normal humanoid size. That's not impressive at all.




When did she fight Galactus? The only time I can recall is after she was in a comatose state and it was the PF in control of her body and not Rachel herself. Plus it was a starving/near death Galactus.



This has yet to be proven. Based on showings and feats, it's Maxima, not Rachel, that wins 10/10.

Originally posted by zopzop
What has Rachel ever done with her TK that's anywhere near as impressive as Maxima?

She telekinetically altered all her DNA and became a dinosaur without the Phoenix Force.

rofl how silly.

Good but silly

Originally posted by zopzop


Please check the issue again. When I said "small", I literally meant they were barely larger than Necrom, who is normal humanoid size. That's not impressive at all.




and the flare? haven't seen the issue in a LONG while, but i thought it was large....



that was what i was thinking of i think. thought she squared off in the nova issue, but that one i did look at. lots of talk but no fight. galactus didn't seem too eager to really mix it up with her though, a pretty clear testament to her power levels. she also intimates a battle would wreck earth and g doesn't disagree. she also hit the pre-retcon beyonder with enough power to impress him. also a solid feat. if she hit max with anything CLOSE to that beyonder blast, there wouldn't be ANYTHING left of max. and just what exactly will max DO to ko her, assuming her at her best--or at least NOT lowest? necrom hit her with some HUGE shots--much more than max could dish out or handle. how's she going to ko rachel exactly?



wut? you're ACTUALLY claiming that in terms of power rachel is NOT greater? seriously? i agree she wasn't the most effective wielder, and she had some less than spectacular performances, but in terms of sheer power she's certainly above max. if you're questioning that then...... there's not much to discuss. shrug

Originally posted by leonidas
and the flare? haven't seen the issue in a LONG while, but i thought it was large....


The flare looked about 20-30ft long/tall that's about it. The asteroids looked like they could be about 15-18ft long (assuming Necrom is 6ft tall).

Give me a few and I'll post the scans. I won't post the Necrom stuff since he's not involved in this.



A lot less than Pre-Retcon Beyonder and Galactus have beaten her handily. Maxima can do it too. Either by straight up overpowering her or dominating her telepathically.





The modest portion of the PF Rachel houses within her is capable of cosmic level feats, Necrom with a SLIVER of what she had proved this. Rachel, on the other hand, has NEVER remotely demonstrated she knows how to wield the PF anywhere near that level. She's either a Galactus level jobber or too stupid to live. Either way, Maxima would school her 10/10.

Here are the scans :
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/3117/excalibur050p25.th.jpg http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/4295/excalibur050p26.th.jpg http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/5393/excalibur050p27.th.jpg http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/4374/excalibur050p28.th.jpg

Look at the difference in power and scope of the attacks. Necrom was an awesome wielder of the PF. Keep in mind she had waaaaay more of it than he did, he was only channeling a sliver of the power and he could only access it when she called upon the Phoenix and yet he was owning her.

In theory she could do everything that he could and then some, but in practice she's never even come close. She's an idiot.

So back on topic : Maxima's feats > Rachel's feats. Maxima's foes > Rachel's foes. Maxima 10/10.

Originally posted by zopzop
Here are the scans :
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/3117/excalibur050p25.th.jpg http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/4295/excalibur050p26.th.jpg http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/5393/excalibur050p27.th.jpg http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/4374/excalibur050p28.th.jpg

Look at the difference in power and scope of the attacks. Necrom was an awesome wielder of the PF. Keep in mind she had waaaaay more of it than he did, he was only channeling a sliver of the power and he could only access it when she called upon the Phoenix and yet he was owning her.

In theory she could do everything that he could and then some, but in practice she's never even come close. She's an idiot.

So back on topic : Maxima's feats > Rachel's feats. Maxima's foes > Rachel's foes. Maxima 10/10.

it doesn't MATTER that necrom seemed more proficient. you keep bringing it up but i don't know why. we're talking about rachel.

we'll agree to disagree then. as i said--one blast equal to what she did to the beyonder would kill max in less than a blink. the damage necrom did would have killed max early in that fight and rachel was still fighting him evenly, if not using the same level of attacks. in that battle alone she showed durability FAR beyond anything max has EVER shown. if you disagree, feel free to show some of her durability feats. feel free to show max as being capable of doing more damage than necrom could as well, because using her at her best, that's what it would take to ko her and rachel would end it WELL before that could happen. and there is NO WAY max could take out rachel with tp. seriously? you have some kind of hate for rachel......

i would HOPE a lot less than galactus or beyonder beat her.

rachel's problem was pretty simple--she was cast as a team member. it was like when ss was a defender. even thor as an avenger suffered from it at times. an uber power-being on a team is ALWAYS written below where they should be. at her best showings, rachel slaughters max 100/10. her potential and overall power>>>>max. her showings ARE inconsistent. assuming both at their best rachel kills her.

Originally posted by leonidas
it doesn't MATTER that necrom seemed more proficient. you keep bringing it up but i don't know why. we're talking about rachel.

Exactly, we are talking about Rachel. In theory, she's capable of doing what he did and then some! But she never has. Why? Because she's an idiot. Maxima destroys her.

Originally posted by zopzop
Exactly, we are talking about Rachel. In theory, she's capable of doing what he did and then some! But she never has. Why? Because she's an idiot. Maxima destroys her.



ok, good talk.

If CIS is off then Rachel is the one who wins 10/10.

Maxima isn't going to contend with Galactus, throw moons, and the like without some serious help =/

Originally posted by Konton
If CIS is off then Rachel is the one who wins 10/10.

Maxima isn't going to contend with Galactus, throw moons, and the like without some serious help =/

You realize Rachel didn't do those things you mentioned too right?

=/

Rachel does to Maxima what she did to Nova.

Originally posted by Konton
=/

Rachel does to Maxima what she did to Nova.

lol

yep.

Originally posted by leonidas
lol

yep.

Unlike Nova, Maxima has almost Kryptonian physical stats with the TP and TK feats to match.

What did Rachel do to Nova....did it involve oil, whips and moaning? If so I'm all for it.

She tried to blitz Rachel and she flung her back out into orbit like it was nothing.

Originally posted by zopzop
Here are the scans :
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/3117/excalibur050p25.th.jpg http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/4295/excalibur050p26.th.jpg http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/5393/excalibur050p27.th.jpg http://img713.imageshack.us/img713/4374/excalibur050p28.th.jpg

Look at the difference in power and scope of the attacks. Necrom was an awesome wielder of the PF. Keep in mind she had waaaaay more of it than he did, he was only channeling a sliver of the power and he could only access it when she called upon the Phoenix and yet he was owning her.

In theory she could do everything that he could and then some, but in practice she's never even come close. She's an idiot.

So back on topic : Maxima's feats > Rachel's feats. Maxima's foes > Rachel's foes. Maxima 10/10. That guy threw planets and blew up starts to hurt Rachel and it didn't even phase her. How is Maxima supposed to do more than that? Based upon that, Rachel's durability exceeds Maxima's power out put.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
That guy threw planets and blew up starts to hurt Rachel and it didn't even phase her. How is Maxima supposed to do more than that? Based upon that, Rachel's durability exceeds Maxima's power out put.

The guy threw moons at her and missed! She was never hit by anything he did except the lava burst but she pulled back at the last instant and she still got hurt.

He wasn't trying to kill her until she relinquished the PF to him.

How would you guys rank Shaman Xman, Jesus Cable and Rachel between themselves?

Originally posted by Zack Fair
How would you guys rank Shaman Xman, Jesus Cable and Rachel between themselves?

Nate more or less = Cable. Either of them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>(you get the point) Rachel.

Originally posted by zopzop
Nate more or less = Cable. Either of them >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>(you get the point) Rachel. Dude, in one of those scans, the guy throws planets at her. How is Maxima competing with that?

He said the planets didn't hit her, so she doesn't really have to replicate that. I think that's what he means.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
Dude, in one of those scans, the guy throws planets at her. How is Maxima competing with that?

Dude key points :

HE (not Rachel) threw moons at her.

HE missed!

Originally posted by zopzop
Dude key points :

HE (not Rachel) threw moons at her.

HE missed! Looked to me like she just shoved them out of the way or something like that. So how is Maxima going to hurt Rachel? She isn't out Tking her or out Telepathing her? I looked at Maxima in comics, I don't see anything she did that can hurt Rachel.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
Looked to me like she just shoved them out of the way or something like that. So how is Maxima going to hurt Rachel? She isn't out Tking her or out Telepathing her? I looked at Maxima in comics, I don't see anything she did that can hurt Rachel.

She didn't, she just barely evaded them. Maxima WILL out TP and out TK her or just pummel her into paste with her almost Superman level strenght/speed/stamina/durability.

Originally posted by zopzop
She didn't, she just barely evaded them. Maxima WILL out TP and out TK her or just pummel her into paste with her almost Superman level strenght/speed/stamina/durability. Where did you get that Maxima is almost as strong as Superman? She sure isn't no where near as durable as Superman. I don't ever remember Maxima being that fast. You are just saying she does all these things but giving me nothing go on.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
Where did you get that Maxima is almost as strong as Superman? She sure isn't no where near as durable as Superman. I don't ever remember Maxima being that fast. You are just saying she does all these things but giving me nothing go on.

Go check her respect thread and learn something about the character.

Originally posted by zopzop
Go check her respect thread and learn something about the character. I have every appearance. I didn't see anything she'd done that dozen's of other characters haven't also done to Superman. He didn't even seem to like want to hurt her.

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
I have every appearance. I didn't see anything she'd done that dozen's of other characters haven't also done to Superman. He didn't even seem to like want to hurt her.

That's your opinion. I like how you can read Superman's mind. Cool power you have there.

Originally posted by zopzop
That's your opinion. I like how you can read Superman's mind. Cool power you have there. In this thread right here, he doesn't even know who she is. He's trying to assess who she is. http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman2.jpg


Here, he's regretting even putting a restrain on her. He is clearly not trying to fight her.

http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman7.jpg

Originally posted by Comics Cavalade
In this thread right here, he doesn't even know who she is. He's trying to assess who she is. http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman2.jpg


Here, he's regretting even putting a restrain on her. He is clearly not trying to fight her.

http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman7.jpg
Yeah you are right.

Back on topic Maxima 10/10.

That seems like their first encounter?

And Superman is always like that. He holds back all the time. Shit he might have said something along those lines to DD had he survived after killing Doomsday.

Originally posted by zopzop
Yeah you are right.

Back on topic Maxima 10/10. LOL he even says in the scan, he wanted to see the full extent of her power. Clearly he was NOT impressed. And he didn't want to fight her. He was just looking to see what she could do.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
That seems like their first encounter?

And Superman is always like that. He holds back all the time. Shit he might have said something along those lines to DD had he survived after killing Doomsday. The scans from their next encouter in the respect thread are when FIVE of Superman's enemies banded together to attack Superman. She isn't fighting him by herself. He's being worn down by Five. Look at the scan. The leader even says http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman12.jpg You have never defeated Superman alone, but together, you have already come close. Clearly Maxima is no where near Superman's level.

In this scan, Superman is talking to Maxima, asking her why is she doing this. Does this look like she is a threat? Lulz. And he's reasoning with her. He clearly isn't in that much pain from her alone. He doesn't want to fight her here either. http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman14.jpg

lol The Superman Revenge Squad. Maxima was the only powerhouse in that team. The rest were...hmm how can I say it...lackluster.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
lol The Superman Revenge Squad. Maxima was the only powerhouse in that team. The rest were...hmm how can I say it...lackluster. It's still a shared feat and I've already proven he didn't want to fight her still. Look at the second scan.

Also notice that Superman, while not even wanting to fight Maxima, as he still just tries to figure her out, easily over speeds her. She was unable to even react. http://s553.photobucket.com/albums/jj364/galanphotobook/?action=view&current=maxima_superman7.jpg

Over speed her? He used his super breath to send her packing to star labs, or so it seems with his "lung power" dialogue.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Over speed her? He used his super breath to send her packing to star labs, or so it seems with his "lung power" dialogue.

And notice that when she tricks him into approaching her, she grabs him and mindmelds before he can react to her. LOL his scan proved the opposite of what he intended

lol @ the guy using my scans to try and prove points they don't even allude to.

Good job at failing, bud.

Originally posted by zopzop
She didn't, she just barely evaded them. Maxima WILL out TP and out TK her or just pummel her into paste with her almost Superman level strenght/speed/stamina/durability. heh, maxima doesnt have actual superspeed, does she? and her stengh and durabilty arent on par with his either. he'd rip apart, if he wanted to. her best TK feat, the continents one, was matched by rachel did with the asteroids against necrom, who would crush her in a split second. rachel created a small black hole without the PF and yes she did beat galactus with it.

rachel with the PF would stomp maxima. blue shadow would have a decent chance.

Originally posted by Zack Fair
Over speed her? He used his super breath to send her packing to star labs, or so it seems with his "lung power" dialogue. She couldn't evade the wind gust dude. He"d already surmised what it would take to put her down. He is Superman. She was no where near a threat to him. Or he would have taken her seriously. If she were anywhere near his strength, durability, or speed, she wouldn't have had to fake sucker punch mind meld him. Yeah, and he still, not in one scan wanted to fight her. Plus she was with the Superman revenge squad in some of those scans. So yeah. No feats for Maxima on Superman's level.

Phoenix 10/10

Originally posted by Galan007
lol @ the guy using my scans to try and prove points they don't even allude to.

Good job at failing, bud.
Pretty sure you're well within your rights to dismember him now.

Originally posted by 753
heh, maxima doesnt have actual superspeed, does she? and her stengh and durabilty arent on par with his either. he'd rip apart, if he wanted to. her best TK feat, the continents one, was matched by rachel did with the asteroids against necrom, who would crush her in a split second. rachel created a small black hole without the PF and yes she did beat galactus with it.

rachel with the PF would stomp maxima. blue shadow would have a decent chance.

I don't understand why people do not at least LOOK at the damn scans before offering an opinion. Those asteroids couldn't have been more than 15-20ft long if you compare them to Necrom who is normal humanoid size (about 6ft). To make things worse all she did was use her TK to redirect their momentum.

Maxima while weakened held together continental plates that were tearing apart a planet roughly the size of Earth. If you don't see the difference between these two feats then I don't know what more to say.

PS Rachel never beat Galactus. The PF who was possessing a comatose Rachel pummeled a weak/near death Galactus.

Originally posted by zopzop
I don't understand why people do not at least LOOK at the damn scans before offering an opinion. Those asteroids couldn't have been more than 15-20ft long if you compare them to Necrom who is normal humanoid size (about 6ft). To make things worse all she did was use her TK to redirect their momentum.

Maxima while weakened held together continental plates that were tearing apart a planet roughly the size of Earth. If you don't see the difference between these two feats then I don't know what more to say.

PS Rachel never beat Galactus. The PF who was possessing a comatose Rachel pummeled a weak/near death Galactus.

you have a funny sense of proportions. maxima only closed fissures, she didnt rip those tectonic plates.

btw
this is her outright pawning necrom, she drew elemental energy from the cosmos and burned him away with it, it was a deliberate tactic taht relied on her far superior raw power and durability. she didnt give into his demands and kill by accident like you implied and desintegrated him. if rachel chose to do the same to maxima, she'd be ripped to pieces even faster.
http://m478.photobucket.com/albumview/albums/iceprince_x/phoenixfight5.jpg.html?src=www&action=view&current=phoenixfight5.jpg

PS comatose?

http://media.comicvine.com/uploads/5/56665/1195625-phoenix_rachel_vs_galactus_07_super.jpg

Originally posted by 753
you have a funny sense of proportions. maxima only closed fissures, she didnt rip those tectonic plates.


Look at the size of those asteroids she merely redirected at Necrom (who is a normal humanoid in size), that's what the freaking scans are there for. They can't be more than 15-20ft long.

Uhm, a weakened Maxima CLOSING continental fissures on a planet roughly Earth size that were going in opposite directions is a massive TK feat. Do me a favor? Google "Grand Canyon" to get a rough idea of what a weakened Maxima was up against.



Necrom is an energy vampire. He overloaded himself on the PF. The process comatosed Rachel. Why would this "feat" even be worth mentioning vs Maxima?



Yes, comatose. That was the PF speaking through Rachel while Rachel's mind/body healed up.

Originally posted by zopzop



Look at the size of those asteroids she merely redirected at Necrom (who is a normal humanoid in size), that's what the freaking scans are there for. They can't be more than 15-20ft long.

Uhm, a weakened Maxima CLOSING continental fissures on a planet roughly Earth size that were going in opposite directions is a massive TK feat. Do me a favor? Google "Grand Canyon" to get a rough idea of what a weakened Maxima was up against.


she didnt lift the tectonic plates is the point.

didnt you read the comic? she did it to overload him, she willed the phoenix into drawing enbergy from the cosmos and burning him away. why do you keep saying he did anything to himself? that feat alone is better than maxima's carrer and her single best feat which skaar has done betetr.

maxima wouldnt dream of beating necrom and rachel could smoke her with much less energy than what she pumped up his ass
it's been ages since I read that, so I'll check, but i think you're mistaken.

Originally posted by 753
she didnt lift the tectonic plates is the point.

She was PULLING them together as they were pushing in opposite directions while weakened! Still don't see how this is impressive vs Rachel merely redirecting two 15-20ft long asteroids?



He overloaded himself. He couldn't handle the PF so he popped.




No trust me on this. Rachel was in a coma and the PF was doing the talking as Rachel's body/mind healed.

this only tells mes you didnt read the comic or the scan.


ill take your word for it, although your position on necrom's demise takes a bit away from your credibility

Originally posted by zopzop
She was PULLING them together as they were pushing in opposite directions while weakened! Still don't see how this is impressive vs Rachel merely redirecting two 15-20ft long asteroids?

Maxima wasn't doing it by herself IIRC. Superman and others(?) were closing fissures too. That would mean she wasn't dealing with nearly the amount of stress you're saying she is. Maintaining a few tectonic plates =/=preventing a planets collapse under her own power.

Maxima's good, but a she's not nearly capable of this:

Originally posted by "Id"
Excalibur volume 1, issue #61

Rachael vs Galactus.
An interesting match, we know that the Phoenix Force is well above a Herald of Galactus. What about a Hungry Galactus? Apparently a league above him as well.

http://img20.imageshack.us/img20/1336/excalibur061p04yw3.jpg
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/6752/excalibur061p05qi0.jpg
http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/3867/excalibur061p06us5.jpg
http://img256.imageshack.us/img256/6751/excalibur061p07di0.jpg
http://img260.imageshack.us/img260/9130/excalibur061p11fx6.jpg
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/8222/excalibur061p14wf5.jpg
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6375/excalibur061p17be6.jpg
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/3251/excalibur061p20rs8.jpg
http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/6810/excalibur061p21cw1.jpg
http://img263.imageshack.us/img263/273/excalibur061p22mv8.jpg

Originally posted by 753
this only tells mes you didnt read the comic or the scan.

I have the issue right in front of me!




I'm scanning it now.

Originally posted by Konton
Maxima wasn't doing it by herself IIRC. Superman and others(?) were closing fissures too. That would mean she wasn't dealing with nearly the amount of stress you're saying she is. Maintaining a few tectonic plates =/=preventing a planets collapse under her own power.

There were three fissures. One was taken care of by Superman (and we all know what he's capable of), one was taken care of Bloodwynd, the final one was taken care of by a WEAKENED Maxima. These three fissures were tearing apart a planet the about the size of Earth. Even if a WEAKENED Maxima was "only" holding together 1/3 of that, that's still more of a feat than redirecting the trajectory of two 15-20ft long asteroids!



Luckily for Maxima, that wasn't Rachel but the PF in Rachel's comatose body fighting a weakened/near death Galactus.

Originally posted by 753

ill take your word for it, although your position on necrom's demise takes a bit away from your credibility

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/5590/excalibur061p02.th.jpg

Excalibur 61, the issue where the Galactus fight took place.

lol the PF wouldn't have such an emotional reaction to Galactus' revelation.

Originally posted by Konton
lol the PF wouldn't have such an emotional reaction to Galactus' revelation.

Dude.................

Here is Rachel finally waking up from her coma a few issues after the PF/Galactus brawl. This takes place in issue 64. :
http://img839.imageshack.us/img839/1416/excalibur064p04.th.jpg http://img846.imageshack.us/img846/8195/excalibur064p05.th.jpg

Originally posted by zopzop


I have the issue right in front of me!


so why dont you concede she overloaded and burned him away as a deliberate tactic?

Edit: she was in a coma after all. the galactus feat doesnt coun then. nice scan.

Originally posted by 753
so why dont you concede she overloaded and burned him away as a deliberate tactic?

Edit: she was in a coma after all. the galactus feat doesnt coun then. nice scan.

I do acknowledge that. But killing yourself by giving your lifeforce to an energy vampire is pointless when discussing Maxima vs Rachel.

We all saw what Necrom did with a mere fraction of the PF that Rachel possessed, yet Rachel has never been shown doing anything anywhere near that. Rachel is a jobber and a craptacular wielder of the PF.

Maxima has better feats and she's actually engaged in psionic combat with known telepaths and won! Maxima takes this 10/10.

Originally posted by zopzop
I do acknowledge that. But killing yourself by giving your lifeforce to an energy vampire is pointless when discussing Maxima vs Rachel.

We all saw what Necrom did with a mere fraction of the PF that Rachel possessed, yet Rachel has never been shown doing anything anywhere near that. Rachel is a jobber and a craptacular wielder of the PF.

Maxima has better feats and she's actually engaged in psionic combat with known telepaths and won! Maxima takes this 10/10.
I don't see how Maxima can win this. Maxima doesn't really have better feats. They both are around the same level( counting feats) with Rachel having the fight to lose or win in her hands(counting max potential).

So she was piloted by the PF. She still, as an avatar, defeated Galactus.

Do we discount Jean's DP stuff?

Originally posted by zopzop
I do acknowledge that. But killing yourself by giving your lifeforce to an energy vampire is pointless when discussing Maxima vs Rachel.

We all saw what Necrom did with a mere fraction of the PF that Rachel possessed, yet Rachel has never been shown doing anything anywhere near that. Rachel is a jobber and a craptacular wielder of the PF.

Maxima has better feats and she's actually engaged in psionic combat with known telepaths and won! Maxima takes this 10/10.

you're really lowballing rachel here. you acknowledge you don't like her, call her an idiot and seemingly refuse to acknowledge any of her high end feats. you think max can do more damage than necrom? you think max could withstand a blast that made the pre-retcon BEYONDER take notice?

again--she HAS had some low showings, but she's had other ones that if taken into account show clearly she could kill max. your cry of 10/10 is pretty preposterous tbh.

Originally posted by leonidas
you're really lowballing rachel here. you acknowledge you don't like her, call her an idiot and seemingly refuse to acknowledge any of her high end feats. you think max can do more damage than necrom? you think max could withstand a blast that made the pre-retcon BEYONDER take notice?

again--she HAS had some low showings, but she's had other ones that if taken into account show clearly she could kill max. your cry of 10/10 is pretty preposterous tbh.

Can you name ONE psion she's defeated in a TP contest? What's her highest TK showing? What has she done that makes you think she can hang with, let alone get any wins off, Maxima?

Let's face it. Maxima ain't no Dr. Doom. ermmhappy

Originally posted by Konton
So she was piloted by the PF. She still, as an avatar, defeated Galactus.

Do we discount Jean's DP stuff?


Jean Grey did some DP?
Zing!

Originally posted by zopzop
Can you name ONE psion she's defeated in a TP contest? What's her highest TK showing? What has she done that makes you think she can hang with, let alone get any wins off, Maxima?

in a tp contest? not off hand. i could ask if you know any tp who has defeated her though. i certainly don't see max being able to take her out with tp. in xmen 203, she allowed herself to cut loose with the PF and she touched the mind of every living being in the universe.

universal tp feat>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>max's tp feats.

and again, if she's capable of toppling/overwhelming the BEYONDER, then yeah, i like her chances against max. her battles with cosmics have threatened worlds. in terms of overall power she quite literally dwarfs max. even max's continent feat seems like pis to me since she's done nothing like it before or since. and it turns out it was only 1/3 as impressive as you made it seem like it was. as far as asking questioning--exactly what battle tk feats DOES max have exactly? where have you seen max do the kind of damage rachel was absorbing?

someone mentioned rachel created a black hole with tk. i've not seen it myself--least i don't think i have--but if true, that alone dwarfs max's feat.

again, all you're doing is limiting yourself to lowballing. not a cool tactic. you've yet to acknowledge her high end feats, or acknowledge that if she truly cuts loose with the PF, max would be less than dust.

Originally posted by OneDumbG0
Let's face it. Maxima ain't no Dr. Doom. ermmhappy

fish

Originally posted by leonidas

someone mentioned rachel created a black hole with tk. i've not seen it myself--least i don't think i have--but if true, that alone dwarfs max's feat.

She used it on an The Fury, by compressing matter until it turned into a black hole.

Originally posted by "Id"
She used it on an The Fury, by compressing matter until it turned into a black hole.


oh daymn... never knew that one... does Rachel have a respect thread up?

Originally posted by celeyhyga17
oh daymn... never knew that one... does Rachel have a respect thread up?

Well it taxed her, she needed help maintain the blackhole. But that was phoenixless Rachel.

No she does not have a respect thread.
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/248/44677235.jpg
http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/1544/76293854.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/7170/36291007.jpg
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/5484/61262515.jpg
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/817/77591245.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3040/18225221.jpg
http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/8265/63534077.jpg

Originally posted by "Id"
Well it taxed her, she needed help maintain the blackhole. But that was phoenixless Rachel.

No she does not have a respect thread.
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/248/44677235.jpg
http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/1544/76293854.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/7170/36291007.jpg
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/5484/61262515.jpg
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/817/77591245.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3040/18225221.jpg
http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/8265/63534077.jpg

Owned.

Originally posted by "Id"
Well it taxed her, she needed help maintain the blackhole. But that was phoenixless Rachel.

No she does not have a respect thread.
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/248/44677235.jpg
http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/1544/76293854.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/7170/36291007.jpg
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/5484/61262515.jpg
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/817/77591245.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3040/18225221.jpg
http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/8265/63534077.jpg


dang... nice... I learn something new everyday...

The fact that she had MASSIVE support from her team......................

Originally posted by zopzop
The fact that she had MASSIVE support from her team......................

She created the black hole before the team even assisted. There is no way to discredit that feat. The only time she needed assistance is when she lost hope which was AFTER the black hole.

Originally posted by carver9
She created the black hole before the team even assisted. There is no way to discredit that feat. The only time she needed assistance is when she lost hope which was AFTER the black hole.

She created a MICRO BLACK HOLE and she needed her teams assistance to expand it and survive the strain.

Originally posted by zopzop
She created a MICRO BLACK HOLE and she needed her teams assistance to expand it and survive the strain.

So you agree, she created the black hole before the team assisted her? The sad thing about this is, that happened during the time she was basically going through training to get more comfortable with her power. Her confidence wasn't as high (power wise) along with her manifested skill. This is when training came into place.

That still doesn't take away from the fact that first she willed matter into what she wanted to with just a thought/TK. That feat rips through anything Maxima has done.

The only reason she needed assistance was due to the fact that The Fury was fighting and adapting to the attack.

With the Phoenix Force, she should be able to pull of that feat comfortably.

Just remember.....I brought up the black hole feat first. Noone asked for the scans so I assumed it was common knowledge or summin'.

uhuh

Originally posted by StyleTime
Just remember.....I brought up the black hole feat first. Noone asked for the scans so I assumed it was common knowledge or summin'.

uhuh

lol

nice.

and thanks id for the scan.

Originally posted by "Id"
Well it taxed her, she needed help maintain the blackhole. But that was phoenixless Rachel.

No she does not have a respect thread.
http://img8.imageshack.us/img8/248/44677235.jpg
http://img812.imageshack.us/img812/1544/76293854.jpg
http://img837.imageshack.us/img837/7170/36291007.jpg
http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/5484/61262515.jpg
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/817/77591245.jpg
http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/3040/18225221.jpg
http://img813.imageshack.us/img813/8265/63534077.jpg Rachel for teh singularity in the brain win?

It was a joke, related to the now popular Surfer fanboy phrase.

Originally posted by StyleTime
Just remember.....I brought up the black hole feat first. Noone asked for the scans so I assumed it was common knowledge or summin'.

uhuh

No you didn't!

durhulk