Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.

I want to know if most Christians that you meet act down to earth or high and mighty. And how has their behavior influenced ( if it has ) you?

Well to be honest my whole family are Christians and yes, they condemn and pray for me.

Out of love of course...hmm

They say I'm sooooooooo lost. Why did I walk away...I wish they'd quit praying for me. I don't like that. cho

(had this conversation just last night, actually)

this comes to mind.. a lady down the block from me says she can't wear her cross that she is not worthy. BC what jessus went through on the cross.

I hardly ever meet a high and mighty Christian... I can't think of one I've ever met.

Of course they exist. No one would deny that, but I don't think they are common enough to be considered the norm for Christians. Quite the opposite I would say.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
They say I'm sooooooooo lost. Why did I walk away...I wish they'd quit praying for me. I don't like that. cho

Why? I've heard people complain about being prayed for before as well, and I've never understood it.

Most Christians I meet never feel the need to bring up their christian faith. I suppose these are the humble ones.

Originally posted by TacDavey
Why? I've heard people complain about being prayed for before as well, and I've never understood it.
It's like if someone is trying to tell you you're a bad driver, and then ends the conversation with "I hope you survive the accident".

Originally posted by King Kandy
It's like if someone is trying to tell you you're a bad driver, and then ends the conversation with "I hope you survive the accident".

I don't see the comparison. The example you gave is a rude little jab you take at someone. I don't see how praying for someone is similar. They aren't doing it with the intent to be hostile.

Originally posted by TacDavey
I don't see the comparison. The example you gave is a rude little jab you take at someone. I don't see how praying for someone is similar. They aren't doing it with the intent to be hostile.
It is a rude little jab. Basically it's a passive-aggressive way for someone to try and end the conversation with the higher ground. Like ending a debate by saying "Well, one day you'll understand", it is as patronizing as you get.

Originally posted by King Kandy
It is a rude little jab. Basically it's a passive-aggressive way for someone to try and end the conversation with the higher ground. Like ending a debate by saying "Well, one day you'll understand", it is as patronizing as you get.

I don't think that's the intent of telling someone you are going to pray for them. Not in general, at least. And besides, I'm not talking about ending a conversation with "I'll pray for you". I mean some people simply don't like having people praying for them at all. Just the knowledge that people are praying for them upsets them. I think that's what Deja-vu is talking about, though I could be mistaken.

Well, if someone is praying for me and never says so, i'll never know to begin with. Obviously, if it ever becomes an issue, they have to have said "i'm praying for you" at some point. Why would you say it to someone who doesn't believe, if your intention wasn't you tell them you're right and they're wrong. It would be like if me going to every christian I meet and saying "sorry but your mother is just in the ground".

Heh.

Christians who are full of themselves are good at getting attention, just as {any group} of people who are full of themselves are good at it. I feel like in any group, this percentage of people roughly corresponds to the number of assholes in society...I doubt it's higher in any one group than another. I'll remain of that mind until I see actual evidence to support otherwise, not just anecdotal observations.

I'm being prayed for, incidentally. I always thank them. I'm sure it's cathartic for the pray-er, however useless it may be in affecting outcomes. It's either to make me Christian again or for me to get a full-time job doing something other than crap jobs. If they want to feel like God had a hand in it when I do get a job (which is a near statistical certainty given enough time and effort, both of which I've contributed), fine by me.

Originally posted by King Kandy
Well, if someone is praying for me and never says so, i'll never know to begin with. Obviously, if it ever becomes an issue, they have to have said "i'm praying for you" at some point. Why would you say it to someone who doesn't believe, if your intention wasn't you tell them you're right and they're wrong. It would be like if me going to every christian I meet and saying "sorry but your mother is just in the ground".

I'm really, really surprised that someone who generally has such a "love makes the world go 'round" such as yourself would that action in such a manner.

It seems pretty obvious to me that when someone who is a family member or close friend tells you that they're praying for you, it's a way of saying that they love you enough to pray for your salvation, regardless of what you believe.

The point is that it really doesn't matter what you think, if someone truly believes in God and some fiery damnation, and you're important to them, they're going to want to do whatever they can to save you, regardless of how you feel about it, and if praying is what will do so, that's what they're gonna do.

I really don't see it as some kind of gloat.

I mean, if a friend of yours told you that he planned to kill himself, would you seriously just be like, "alright well if that's how you really feel good luck with that", or would you do everything within your power to prevent that person from doing it?

Obviously, if you're the type of person who approves of euthanasia or whatever that's a bad example, but you get my point.

Right right, annoying Christians who are trying to save you or whatever are actually doing the "right" thing in their opinion. It's impossible for me to feel angry. Doesn't make it less annoying, of course, but it doesn't incite anger.

Kandy's initial comment was about the context of "I'll pray for you" more than the earnest intent, because it can indeed be snarky. Someone saying, "well, I'll pray for you" when I explain my atheism can be condescending. My great-aunt who prayed every day for months that I'd land a job in my field was nothing but endearing.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
I'm really, really surprised that someone who generally has such a "love makes the world go 'round" such as yourself would that action in such a manner.

It seems pretty obvious to me that when someone who is a family member or close friend tells you that they're praying for you, it's a way of saying that they love you enough to pray for your salvation, regardless of what you believe.

The point is that it really doesn't matter what you think, if someone truly believes in God and some fiery damnation, and you're important to them, they're going to want to do whatever they can to save you, regardless of how you feel about it, and if praying is what will do so, that's what they're gonna do.

I really don't see it as some kind of gloat.

I mean, if a friend of yours told you that he planned to kill himself, would you seriously just be like, "alright well if that's how you really feel good luck with that", or would you do everything within your power to prevent that person from doing it?

Obviously, if you're the type of person who approves of euthanasia or whatever that's a bad example, but you get my point.
I have two problems with that:

1. There's a difference between praying for someone and telling them you're praying for them. I'm saying, when you tell someone it is carrying the connotation "you're wrong". So just keep it to yourself.

2. This is not family members or close friends... most people who use that line on me barely know me.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I have two problems with that:

1. There's a difference between praying for someone and telling them you're praying for them. I'm saying, when you tell someone it is carrying the connotation "you're wrong". So just keep it to yourself.

That kind of sounds like projecting, to me. I mean, I've been told many times by people that they're praying for me, despite my consistent insistence that I'm not religious, but I've never taken it as some kind of patronizing statement.

Not saying it can't be, but... if we're diving into the realm of specifics and exceptions...

Pretty much what I said above.

Overall point I guess is that it really depends on context. Any statement can be patronizing or self-righteous.

Originally posted by RE: Blaxican
That kind of sounds like projecting, to me. I mean, I've been told many times by people that they're praying for me, despite my consistent insistence that I'm not religious, but I've never taken it as some kind of patronizing statement.

Not saying it can't be, but... if we're diving into the realm of specifics and exceptions...

Pretty much what I said above.

Overall point I guess is that it really depends on context. Any statement can be patronizing or self-righteous.
Well the only people who I really have heard it from is internet-evangelists, so, I probably do have a skewed sample. None of my family/friends are very religious so i only ever hear it as a disguised insult. I think people who hear it in that context, would be very skeptical of someone saying that.

No argument from me. I can especially see how throwing the comment out there in the midst of an argument can be patronizing. Like you said, it's akin to the "You'll understand when you're older" cop-out older people make when arguing with younger ones.

I agree context is important. It CAN be used in that way. But that doesn't mean you should get upset by the simple act of being prayed for. I means you should get upset when it is used in a condescending way. The simple act of being prayed for is not condescending or insulting.

Originally posted by The MISTER
I want to know if most Christians that you meet act down to earth or high and mighty. And how has their behavior influenced ( if it has ) you?

The only real (I say that with extra emphasize because many aren't) Christian I know is the most down to earth person I've ever met. She's a fellow University colleague and she's pretty much the reason I'm able to defend Christianity and religion the way I often do. She's taught me a lot about faith.

And science. She's taught me a lot about that too. I know just how much you guys love to make faith and science black and white

Well I don't like being told that "I hope God does anything and everythng to you until you come back." It's like saying I hope all hell breaks loose in your life until you see the light again.

That's how I take it. Now if they want to pray good things about me then that's different.

It's my choice to believe as I like. I did believe as they did, but no longer do and everytime something goes wrong, they say, "It's because....." and "just come back to the church and everything will be fine."

I'm the sort of person that believes that there are power in words and energies, so no, I don't like people infringing and condemning me. I don't push myself on them or anyone else. "You don't even believe in god." I said, sure I do ( just not the same kind of thing) But I stopped arguing and just said, yes, yes, yes...blah blah...

okay are we done yet?

Originally posted by Digi
Right right, annoying Christians who are trying to save you or whatever are actually doing the "right" thing in their opinion. It's impossible for me to feel angry. Doesn't make it less annoying, of course, but it doesn't incite anger.

Kandy's initial comment was about the context of "I'll pray for you" more than the earnest intent, because it can indeed be snarky. Someone saying, "well, I'll pray for you" when I explain my atheism can be condescending. My great-aunt who prayed every day for months that I'd land a job in my field was nothing but endearing. Yeah, saying that you're going to pray for somebody is not connected to praying for them. Unless they ask you to, or you know that reminding them that you are will comfort them, there's really no reason to tell them this. Christians will do this same type of thing to other christians that are in different denominations or churches. It is annoying and it's usually on purpose cause it must boost the ego.

The "praying for someone's soul" thing is really confusing to me. I don't know why christians would tell anyone this. Who is qualified to tell what condition a person's soul is in other than themselves? So even if you were going to pray for someone elses soul, telling them is like saying " I'm positive you're screwed at the moment". It's a form of berating someone.

I know a couple of familys that are but that is not everyone.So I am going to say dont judge a book by its cover.

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I know a couple of familys that are but that is not everyone.So I am going to say dont judge a book by its cover.

Oh but many people do..

Originally posted by Deja~vu
Well I don't like being told that "I hope God does anything and everythng to you until you come back." It's like saying I hope all hell breaks loose in your life until you see the light again.

That's how I take it. Now if they want to pray good things about me then that's different.

It's my choice to believe as I like. I did believe as they did, but no longer do and everytime something goes wrong, they say, "It's because....." and "just come back to the church and everything will be fine."

I'm the sort of person that believes that there are power in words and energies, so no, I don't like people infringing and condemning me. I don't push myself on them or anyone else. "You don't even believe in god." I said, sure I do ( just not the same kind of thing) But I stopped arguing and just said, yes, yes, yes...blah blah...

okay are we done yet?

You guys seem to have a pretty twisted vision of what it means to pray for someone.

No one who is genuinely praying for you wishes you to come to harm in an attempt to change your mind. Granted, there may be some people who would do that, but that isn't an accurate representation of what it means to pray for someone. That's a minority.

Depends on the person, not the religion.

Originally posted by Digi
Heh.

Christians who are full of themselves are good at getting attention, just as {any group} of people who are full of themselves are good at it. I feel like in any group, this percentage of people roughly corresponds to the number of assholes in society...I doubt it's higher in any one group than another. I'll remain of that mind until I see actual evidence to support otherwise, not just anecdotal observations.

I'm being prayed for, incidentally. I always thank them. I'm sure it's cathartic for the pray-er, however useless it may be in affecting outcomes. It's either to make me Christian again or for me to get a full-time job doing something other than crap jobs. If they want to feel like God had a hand in it when I do get a job (which is a near statistical certainty given enough time and effort, both of which I've contributed), fine by me. Pretty much, you have good people and idiots and every group, no matter race, religion, creed, etc.

Originally posted by Tha C-Master
Pretty much, you have good people and idiots and every group, no matter race, religion, creed, etc. Do you think there are good people in the KKK? They do mainly profess christianity. Perhaps some are there because of peer pressure. I can see that being a realistic possibility.

And I do hope that more people are doing as Tac said and praying sincerely. IMO it's a personal thing that shouldn't be broadcast like a personal ability to do anything accept make requests.

Pride does taint things that would be considered good if not for it, like people. And like you said that does go for a lot of different groups, but when you narrow the groups down, some of them are more about being better than other people.

In my life I've listened to (cause preachers are everywhere, tv, radio etc...) some very condemning messages from the christian camp. Some (not all) seventh day adventists really feel that anyone who doesn't worship on Saturday is hellbound. The ones that do worship on Saturday are hellbound if they eat pork or shrimp.

That's a lot of people to feel sorry for and better off than if you believe that. That's just one of the many ways people use the Bible to pass judgement on others. I was hoping maybe other people have had better experiences.

From what I've seen out of zealous christians is a lot of advice about what you're doing wrong, even if you're a christian already. God forbid if you were not familiar with christianity! Christianity teaches not to judge anybody. So shouldn't more christians be humble personable people?

That was always my point. Christians are taught not to judge anyone, yet they do. I would always say, it's not my place to judge, it's gods.

Oh, and I was a SDA for a short time, so I know about the Hell bound Sabbath rejecting people that eat pork and heaven forbid that wonderful shell fish.


The statement I made above about all hell breaking loose until I came back was from a SDA member.
I was going to throw bacon at her house .... all over her door. I was going to mold it in 666 ....It is sticky, ya know? lol

Originally posted by Deja~vu
That was always my point. Christians are taught not to judge anyone, yet they do. I would always say, it's not my place to judge, it's gods.

Oh, and I was a SDA for a short time, so I know about the Hell bound Sabbath rejecting people that eat pork and heaven forbid that wonderful shell fish.


The statement I made above about all hell breaking loose until I came back was from a SDA member.
I was going to throw bacon at her house .... all over her door. I was going to mold it in 666 ....It is sticky, ya know? lol

I would've paid to see that.

Oh my, I wish you had done that Debbie.

Originally posted by The MISTER
Do you think there are good people in the KKK? They do mainly profess christianity. Perhaps some are there because of peer pressure. I can see that being a realistic possibility.

Bad example. C-Master's comment allowed for some "bad" in any religious group. Obviously the KKK is part of that, and I doubt anyone would condone their actions.

Originally posted by The MISTER
From what I've seen out of zealous christians is a lot of advice about what you're doing wrong, even if you're a christian already. God forbid if you were not familiar with christianity! Christianity teaches not to judge anybody. So shouldn't more christians be humble personable people?

But plenty are humble. Assholes exist in any cultural group. It's not surprising, nor an indictment of the religion.

Saying that too many proud people exist in religion is, to me, like saying there's too many proud people in life. Which is true, of course, but irrelevant to apply it only to one aspect of society.

I have lots of evil thoughts that I don't act on.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
I have lots of evil thoughts that I don't act on.

Maybe you should start acting on them. ... and taping it.

Originally posted by The MISTER
I want to know if most Christians that you meet act down to earth or high and mighty. And how has their behavior influenced ( if it has ) you?

In my personal experience, I've met many Christians who poo-pooed my choices and beliefs and pointed out my many hypocrisies...and

I've also met people of other faiths who have done the same, however: I've known Muslims to publicly act quite religious, and then come to our college parties to drink and do other things...so-called Buddhists who have their fair share of vices.

In my personal experience, I've had the displeasure of meeting quite a few Christians (including members of my family) who have poo-pooed my beliefs and choices and pointed out my many hypocrisies...and then gone on to be hypocritical and irreligious in front of me. One of the most widespread and ridiculous, in my experience, has been the use of contraceptives (the Pill, mostly) by Catholics.

That being said, I've met people from other faiths who have done the same: I've hung around with some Muslims who drank with us and did other, more illicit activities...and so-called Buddhists who have their fair share of vices.

I'd say it's more a universal, human thing, being full of pride - or simply being ***holes - as opposed to something you can typecast. It's easier when the group is in the majority, though, like Christians are where I live...

Originally posted by Digi
Oh my, I wish you had done that Debbie.



Bad example. C-Master's comment allowed for some "bad" in any religious group. Obviously the KKK is part of that, and I doubt anyone would condone their actions.



But plenty are humble. Assholes exist in any cultural group. It's not surprising, nor an indictment of the religion.

Saying that too many proud people exist in religion is, to me, like saying there's too many proud people in life. Which is true, of course, but irrelevant to apply it only to one aspect of society.

I was just messing around! most terrorist groups claim some religion.

As strange as this may sound I've found atheists to be far less judgmental. Now you're an atheist so I'm sure you know what I mean. That's something I'd say is positive about that group, even if I don't agree with them 100% They're usually quite down to earth, and respectful of different types of people across the board.

Different groups do contain different personality types though. Do we have to wonder whether or not republicans contain more anti-islam members? Are more black people democrats? Which one is more likely to outlaw/legalize gambling? Certain groups appeal to different personality types I'm wondering if perhaps christians have become a group that appeals to people who think they're better than others.

Originally posted by The MISTER
I was just messing around! most terrorist groups claim some religion.

As strange as this may sound I've found atheists to be far less judgmental. Now you're an atheist so I'm sure you know what I mean. That's something I'd say is positive about that group, even if I don't agree with them 100% They're usually quite down to earth, and respectful of different types of people across the board.

Different groups do contain different personality types though. Do we have to wonder whether or not republicans contain more anti-islam members? Are more black people democrats? Which one is more likely to outlaw/legalize gambling? Certain groups appeal to different personality types I'm wondering if perhaps christians have become a group that appeals to people who think they're better than others.

Well, ok, agreed partially. Republicans are a lot more likely to display xenophobic tendencies, and the other truisms apply as well. You may have a point here. I don't think it would hold true for Christians more than other religions though. Observations are, by their nature, anecdotal, and I don't know that we have the kind of evidence we'd need to begin to build a case for your point.

The atheists I know are d*cks, I'm like the only nice one in the bunch. But they don't bother displaying it to others like they're superior. I'd differentiate between atheists who are such as a result of rebelling against organized religion, and those who left for more personal or intellectual reasons. The former can be as condescending as you'll find, and are often the direct precursor to idiocy like angry youtube videos. The latter group is probably a bit more reasonable.

I always thought intellectual condescension toward other groups was a bit silly. A large portion of what you end up believing is a result of what you're exposed to, not intellect or cognitive ability. Now, condescension toward specific people, that I'm all for. I could make you a list, deplorable idiots to a man. But that's a different discussion.

fdog

Some are. Others aren't. It comes down to the individual, same as with everything.

It really depends on the person.

It's so hard to answer this question. I've writen a responce a few times now and it never seemed right.

In my life, yes, I have had come in contact with many "High and mighty" Christians. As-well as Atheists and Satanists. I've also known a few who are Wiccan but, the ones I know are... humble. (Couldn't think of a better word lol)

Then again I've come across whose who were... quite with their spirtuatilly and very pleasant people.

Also I saw when I was reading the topic about being prayed for. I (who claim no religion) do feel awkward when someone says that to me. I don't get upset or mad. It's just always been awkward. I say thank you and go on my way and it doesn't bug me but, there always an odd feeling i get right after someone says that to me. No matter the context. Maybe it's just the word "Pray" ... Hmm I never actually put alot of though toward why I get that feeling... Odd.

The funny thing is that if you belong to that group, you see everyone as pretty cool and they treat you the same. But once you leave the group then you re out-casted and talked about, looked down on and shunned. And you haven't changed at all, only your belief. You're still the same ol person.

*going to read some of Robert Greenes books* Yep. lol

Originally posted by alltoomany
Oh but many people do..

Yes they do it is easy to do and hard not to do.

Its funny because by their own doctrine they must be judgmental and Proud because it is left in their charge to save "BE FISHERS OF MEN" get the word out so people do not go to Hell. Arogant, close minded, Douchebags. Its all about faith. Again by its definition they cant know that Jesus is God you have to have faith. yet they say He is the only way.

Originally posted by The MISTER
I want to know if most Christians that you meet act down to earth or high and mighty. And how has their behavior influenced ( if it has ) you?

I believe that there are people on both sides.

If I had to put a percentage on it, I would say 80% act high and mighty, while 20% are completely normal.

I don't like hanging around Christians simply because they try to cram that damn bible down my throat. They walk around, looking down on the sinners.

They think just because they believe in an mythical being, that they are somehow better than I.

And when they want to yap on and on about God and you ask them how they're sure that God is real, that start screaming and crying like you just questioned the existence of Santa Claus.

I want to add that why is this only focus on Christians?There are other Religion that is just as proud.

Originally posted by Utsukushii
And when they want to yap on and on about God and you ask them how they're sure that God is real, that start screaming and crying like you just questioned the existence of Santa Claus.

And it doesn't end until you try to change the subject..

"Dinner was great, wasn't it? I just love chicken. You?"

But that's only the hard core ones.."The Jesus is coming soon" crowd.

When the USS Jesus comes from the clouds from an alien world.

Originally posted by Deja~vu


And it doesn't end until you try to change the subject..

"Dinner was great, wasn't it? I just love chicken. You?"

But that's only the hard core ones.."The Jesus is coming soon" crowd.

When the USS Jesus comes from the clouds from an alien world.

Yeah, I run into those all too often around my town. They are esspecially on me during the summer due to my tattoos being shown. It's like, hello! Millions of people are tattooed. If your "God" doesn't like, I'll just tell him the devil made me do it.

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I want to add that why is this only focus on Christians?There are other Religion that is just as proud. Indeed. As I read this thread, I keep thinking, So, it's not just Jews...

A Mormon in another thread a while back noticed the same thing about people of his faith.

Hey, tribal thinking ftw.

Originally posted by Utsukushii
Yeah, I run into those all too often around my town. They are esspecially on me during the summer due to my tattoos being shown. It's like, hello! Millions of people are tattooed. If your "God" doesn't like, I'll just tell him the devil made me do it. If your head is shaved and your tatts are over flowing....watch out!

But I look normal...just normal ..

This is my new view: Just agree with them. JUst say yes I'm a Christian

Yes I'm a Muslim

Yes I'm New Age

Yes I'm Hindu

Yes I'm a devil worshipper....

Yes yes yes...whatever.

Well, this thread turned offensive real quick.

In my experience, there are significantly less high and mighty Christians than there are humble. At least now a days. Most of the high and mighty ones are usually over the age of 50. But then old people are just like that.

I think a lot of people think Christians are judging and looking down on them when they really aren't.

Originally posted by TacDavey
Maybe you should start acting on them. ... and taping it. You don't live far from me. Let's do it. It's only in Lapeer county.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
You don't live far from me. Let's do it. It's only in Lapeer county.

We'll make it a Youtube series. An unlikely duo, a Christian and an Atheist wage war on the crazies of Michigan. gunsmilie

Now we just need a name...

Which one of us is the Atheist? I can pretend.

Btw, I'm in Macomb county. Lots of crazies just like Oakland county. I got a feeling you're from Oakland or Wayne...Nutss

lol.

A name? Tri-County something or other. Crucifiers????Hahaha

Originally posted by Mindship
Indeed. As I read this thread, I keep thinking, So, it's not just Jews...

A Mormon in another thread a while back noticed the same thing about people of his faith.

Hey, tribal thinking ftw.

I've yet to see a practitioner of Shinto take the "we're being victimized/targeted" stance, so clearly, Shinto is superior to others.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
Which one of us is the Atheist? I can pretend.

Btw, I'm in Macomb county. Lots of crazies just like Oakland county. I got a feeling you're from Oakland or Wayne...Nutss

lol.

A name? Tri-County something or other. Crucifiers????Hahaha

You aren't an atheist? My mistake. oops

Well, you can pretend, right? That duo is better.

What about... The Detroit Danger Squad?

Originally posted by TacDavey
You aren't an atheist? My mistake. oops

Well, you can pretend, right? That duo is better.

What about... The Detroit Danger Squad?

NICEZZZZ

Our motto: Be on your best or we'll be on you!

raygun

Originally posted by Deja~vu
NICEZZZZ

Our motto: Be on your best or we'll be on you!

raygun

I like it. Greatest show ever.

Now watch some random KMC poster read about it, make it, and get super rich...

Originally posted by Robtard
I've yet to see a practitioner of Shinto take the "we're being victimized/targeted" stance, so clearly, Shinto is superior to others. Know many? I know none, so I can only speak from what I read about Shinto, plus what I do know about human psychology.

Shinto does not have the same religious 'mission' that the Abrahamic faiths do. It seems to be more of a loosely formulated 'intrapersonal faith' with a focus on connections with nature and the past (eg, animism, ancestor worship), rather than establishing and deseminating a code of behavioral ethics for all of Mankind to live by, ie, rather than being an 'interpersonal faith', which would naturally invite more conflict with other groups.

However, given the human propensity for 'us-them' thinking, I would think there are enough practitioners of Shinto that some do see themselves as superior to non-Shintoists, if only for the reason you cited.

Again, I'm largely speculating here, but I suspect there is a strong genetic predisposition for us-them thinking, a mindset which may have been advantageous long before religious preoccupation arose, back when primitive humans were more centered on protecting, say, feeding grounds against strangers.

Originally posted by Deja~vu
Which one of us is the Atheist? I can pretend.

Btw, I'm in Macomb county. Lots of crazies just like Oakland county. I got a feeling you're from Oakland or Wayne...Nutss

lol.

A name? Tri-County something or other. Crucifiers????Hahaha

shock More Michinganders!

I've lived all over the Tri county area.

I have a series for ya, My totally non religious family v.s my boyfriends uber religious family. Ohhh the entertainment. Free popcorn!

Cool! Our gang is growing.

Soon we'll be wearing cool jackets, snapping our fingers, and doing choreographed dance routines!

Originally posted by ADarksideJedi
I want to add that why is this only focus on Christians?There are other Religion that is just as proud. Because the Bible says pride is something that god hates. Repeatedly. Also Jesus openly rebuked the pharisees for their pride.

I'm a christian and have been repeatedly turned off by people who claim christianity and then play, "Lets guess who's going to hell and why!!".
I'm not surprised that people are laughing at blatant hypocrisy. Witnessing has it's time and place( like a funeral is one places I've heard it's frowned upon and done anyway) but some folks act as though they're in the position of authority to save your soul whenever you get ready.

Pride is at the core of behaving like this so I thought this would be the right place to ask peoples honest opinions.
Most of the cool christians I know don't usually go to church that much they're just into the Bible. They act like normal people, really,and serious about not-judging people.

Churchgoers are a different story.

Originally posted by Mindship
Again, I'm largely speculating here, but I suspect there is a strong genetic predisposition for us-them thinking, a mindset which may have been advantageous long before religious preoccupation arose, back when primitive humans were more centered on protecting, say, feeding grounds against strangers.

Ahh yes.. the 70's

Originally posted by The MISTER
Because the Bible says pride is something that god hates. Repeatedly. Also Jesus openly rebuked the pharisees for their pride.

I'm a christian and have been repeatedly turned off by people who claim christianity and then play, "Lets guess who's going to hell and why!!".
I'm not surprised that people are laughing at blatant hypocrisy. Witnessing has it's time and place( like a funeral is one places I've heard it's frowned upon and done anyway) but some folks act as though they're in the position of authority to save your soul whenever you get ready.

Pride is at the core of behaving like this so I thought this would be the right place to ask peoples honest opinions.
Most of the cool christians I know don't usually go to church that much they're just into the Bible. They act like normal people, really,and serious about not-judging people.

Churchgoers are a different story.

So people who go to church are all prideful hypocrites? I don't think so.

I, for one, go to church, and do not consider myself in that category. Furthermore, I don't think the majority of the people I know who go to church fit into that category.

Originally posted by The MISTER
I want to know if most Christians that you meet act down to earth or high and mighty. And how has their behavior influenced ( if it has ) you?

I doubt christians are any less or more proud than members of any other religion. They all exist as a matter of certainty for those who subscribe to them.

Originally posted by The MISTER
Ahh yes.. the 70's

Disco inferno, man, disco inferno...

Originally posted by The MISTER
Ahh yes.. the 70's
I don't see how it's like that at all.

Originally posted by Mindship


Disco inferno, man, disco inferno...

Burn baby burn.....Disco inferno....burn baby burn.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-opY4qcidFk

Originally posted by TacDavey
So people who go to church are all prideful hypocrites? I don't think so.

I, for one, go to church, and do not consider myself in that category. Furthermore, I don't think the majority of the people I know who go to church fit into that category. You don't come off like a prideful hypocrite and so I'd imagine that you would attend a church where most of the people there aren't. I've been to churches where there is a commitment to preaching the GOOD NEWS rather than fire and brimstone. You can tell a lot about a church from it's congregation. The churchgoers I'm referring to are the many that consider people lost unless they go to the exact same type of church that they do. These are the people who push you to attend their church so that you can receive the "true" gospel, even if you tell them that you attend a different church. I've had many experiences with these people because I enjoy talking about God, and when they see that I'm very familiar with the Bible they act as though their church will complete an incomplete individual. This has happened to me more times than I can count throughout my adult life. I was just curious as to whether or not others have had similar experiences or not. I'm glad to hear that you haven't. As you can see some others have not been so fortunate.

Originally posted by The MISTER
I want to know if most Christians that you meet act down to earth or high and mighty. And how has their behavior influenced ( if it has ) you?

The only openly religious people I've met was my housemate and his friends at Uni and they were very down to earth about the whole thing, considering myself and the other guy who shared the house were non-believers. I don't know if that was uncomfortable for him or not, that wasn't really apparent because we all got on. He spoke of his religion, his love of Hillsong (he was a really big fan of that) and he even invited us to participate in a couple of worship sessions.

We didn't pray with them because like I said, we weren't believers but we openly talked about the subject pretty easily enough. In my opinion they seemed to take great strength from their beliefs which can only be a good thing. I don't think it's infuenced me at all, I still don't subscribe to any religious beliefs but I guess I'm more aware of how it affects people and how they use it to overcome problems in life.

Originally posted by The MISTER
You don't come off like a prideful hypocrite and so I'd imagine that you would attend a church where most of the people there aren't. I've been to churches where there is a commitment to preaching the GOOD NEWS rather than fire and brimstone. You can tell a lot about a church from it's congregation. The churchgoers I'm referring to are the many that consider people lost unless they go to the exact same type of church that they do. These are the people who push you to attend their church so that you can receive the "true" gospel, even if you tell them that you attend a different church. I've had many experiences with these people because I enjoy talking about God, and when they see that I'm very familiar with the Bible they act as though their church will complete an incomplete individual. This has happened to me more times than I can count throughout my adult life. I was just curious as to whether or not others have had similar experiences or not. I'm glad to hear that you haven't. As you can see some others have not been so fortunate.

It just sounded like you were claiming that anyone who goes to church is a prideful hypocrite.

Obviously you have good and bad churches like you have good and bad.... anything else. If it's run by people, it's never exempt from the possibility of being one or the other.

To really understand the Bible and see the truth, one must be very well educated in the occult. The mass mind is very powerful. When one studies long enough and acquires advanced knowledge of the occult, the truth is utterly shocking. The entire Judeo/Christian Bible is a hoax of catastrophic proportions with a very clear objective using subliminal means and the channeled psychic energy of believers.

Whenever Christianity or its cohorts took control of a country or region, the ancient spiritual texts and records were removed and/or destroyed and those who had spiritual knowledge were mass murdered by the Inquisition. This took out of circulation the very knowledge those in power have used and still use to manipulate the ignorant population using spiritual/occult power. The Bible is one of the most powerful subliminal tools used by a select few to enslave the masses. Most people are unaware of this because they lack knowledge regarding the occult, thought power, and psychic energy. The powers that be work to reinforce the belief that the occult, powers of the mind and spirit are nonsense or just plain bunk.

Destroying the ancient records allowed an alternative invented "history" to be written which has disconnected humanity from its true origins. Controlling history is important because if one manipulates how people see what we call the past, this influences the present and the future.

The entire Bible is an extremely powerful subliminal tool full of occult numbers, messages, allegories, and stolen material, which has been corrupted from ancient religions. In addition, this book has been infused with psychic energy and power to instill fear and to make it believable. When one's eyes are opened and one has the necessary knowledge, the *spell* will no longer be effective. The entire underlying theme of the Judeo/Christian Bible is the establishment of the fictitious history of the Jewish people in the mass mind. What the mass mind believes has power and the energy to make manifest in reality as thoughts are energy

There are vacuum-sealed vaults in the Vatican library containing thousands upon thousands of ancient esoteric books from around the world that have been stolen and hoarded over the years and kept out of public circulation. The Catholic Church, which is the root of the Christian religion, is controlled by a secret society that has abused occult power to enslave the masses. The end goal is the total enslavement of humanity, which they have worked towards relentlessly and ruthlessly.

All of this has directly affected each and every one of us. Humanity has suffered unnecessarily because of the denial of this knowledge. People have been coerced over the centuries into paying for their own damnation to the tune of billions and billions of dollars to keep this lie prospering and continuing strong. The survival and prosperity of this vicious hoax on humanity requires only ONE thing- A LACK OF KNOWLEDGE!

Contrary to what most people have been indoctrinated with, Judaism, Christianity and Islam are relatively new religions. Humanity goes back tens of thousands of years. These three have worked relentlessly to keep us from spiritual/occult knowledge and using this power, of which all of us have.

These so-called "religions" are built upon murder, torture, and lies and the only way any lie of this magnitude can survive is to create more and more lies and destroy the peoples who know the truth. Christianity is nothing more than a program. There is nothing religious or spiritual about it. Millions of people suffer depression, hopelessness, and confusion about life. The soul needs light and very few know this or actively practice the power meditation that will literally "save" their own souls. Because of a lack of knowledge and ignorance of the occult, Humanity as a whole has been placed under a powerful spell using occult power and indoctrinated not to question, concerning these three so-called "religions." This has been reinforced by centuries of Christians being duped into supplying their psychic energy and souls to be channeled into perpetuating this lie, which in the end, will only benefit a select few.

Originally posted by muabesos
To really understand the Bible and see the truth, one must be very well educated in the occult. The mass mind is very powerful. When one studies long enough and acquires advanced knowledge of the occult, the truth is utterly shocking. The entire Judeo/Christian Bible is a hoax of catastrophic proportions with a very clear objective using subliminal means and the channeled psychic energy of believers.

Whenever Christianity or its cohorts took control of a country or region, the ancient spiritual texts and records were removed and/or destroyed and those who had spiritual knowledge were mass murdered by the Inquisition. This took out of circulation the very knowledge those in power have used and still use to manipulate the ignorant population using spiritual/occult power. The Bible is one of the most powerful subliminal tools used by a select few to enslave the masses. Most people are unaware of this because they lack knowledge regarding the occult, thought power, and psychic energy. The powers that be work to reinforce the belief that the occult, powers of the mind and spirit are nonsense or just plain bunk.

Destroying the ancient records allowed an alternative invented "history" to be written which has disconnected humanity from its true origins. Controlling history is important because if one manipulates how people see what we call the past, this influences the present and the future.

The entire Bible is an extremely powerful subliminal tool full of occult numbers, messages, allegories, and stolen material, which has been corrupted from ancient religions. In addition, this book has been infused with psychic energy and power to instill fear and to make it believable. When one's eyes are opened and one has the necessary knowledge, the *spell* will no longer be effective. The entire underlying theme of the Judeo/Christian Bible is the establishment of the fictitious history of the Jewish people in the mass mind. What the mass mind believes has power and the energy to make manifest in reality as thoughts are energy

There are vacuum-sealed vaults in the Vatican library containing thousands upon thousands of ancient esoteric books from around the world that have been stolen and hoarded over the years and kept out of public circulation. The Catholic Church, which is the root of the Christian religion, is controlled by a secret society that has abused occult power to enslave the masses. The end goal is the total enslavement of humanity, which they have worked towards relentlessly and ruthlessly.

All of this has directly affected each and every one of us. Humanity has suffered unnecessarily because of the denial of this knowledge. People have been coerced over the centuries into paying for their own damnation to the tune of billions and billions of dollars to keep this lie prospering and continuing strong. The survival and prosperity of this vicious hoax on humanity requires only ONE thing- A LACK OF KNOWLEDGE!

Contrary to what most people have been indoctrinated with, Judaism, Christianity and Islam are relatively new religions. Humanity goes back tens of thousands of years. These three have worked relentlessly to keep us from spiritual/occult knowledge and using this power, of which all of us have.

These so-called "religions" are built upon murder, torture, and lies and the only way any lie of this magnitude can survive is to create more and more lies and destroy the peoples who know the truth. Christianity is nothing more than a program. There is nothing religious or spiritual about it. Millions of people suffer depression, hopelessness, and confusion about life. The soul needs light and very few know this or actively practice the power meditation that will literally "save" their own souls. Because of a lack of knowledge and ignorance of the occult, Humanity as a whole has been placed under a powerful spell using occult power and indoctrinated not to question, concerning these three so-called "religions." This has been reinforced by centuries of Christians being duped into supplying their psychic energy and souls to be channeled into perpetuating this lie, which in the end, will only benefit a select few.

Aside from being complete illogical rubbish, this post has absolutely nothing to do with the topic of this thread. You should go post your ramblings somewhere else before someone alerts a moderator.

ban

Shut-up you Bieber slave! you and people like you are the reason this website ****ING SUCKS MAJOR ASS! tHANK YOU tACdAVEY FOR YOUR CONTRIBUTION OF SHITNESS!!!!!

Originally posted by muabesos
Shut-up you Bieber slave! you and people like you are the reason this website ****ING SUCKS MAJOR ASS! tHANK YOU tACdAVEY FOR YOUR CONTRIBUTION OF SHITNESS!!!!! So this is the workings of a mind that has freed itself from the slavery of psychic oppression. A representation of the way that Bible haters minds' work. I'd say it paints a pretty accurate picture of the flaws in their brains, and the anger that gave birth to those flaws. HA! you must be pretty mad at God, considering your previous rant. Oh well, hope you calm down someday.

In my humble opinion, people in general are prideful, despite their religious faith/views - so... why the post regarding Christians? People are ignorant, and we don't need to bring about their religious beliefs to make sense of things. Ignorance and being prideful, are characteristics of being human. I know of an Indian girl I dated for about 2 years that was disowned by her parents for rejecting Hinduism. I also know, a good friend of my brother, that was kicked out the house. Apparently, he disagreed with his parents on the message of the Latter Day Saints - Jehovah's Witnesses. I also have knowledge of Muslim parents rejecting their sons for disobedience to Islam. Parents exist in this world that abandon their sons/daughters for being gay. This type of nonsense is universal, regardless of religious faith/views. People are prideful and ignorant - who cares if they were Christian or liked to play Bingo. It's irrelevant.

Originally posted by ushomefree
In my humble opinion, people in general are prideful, despite their religious faith/views - so... why the post regarding Christians? People are ignorant, and we don't need to bring about their religious beliefs to make sense of things. Ignorance and being prideful, are characteristics of being human. I know of an Indian girl I dated for about 2 years that was disowned by her parents for rejecting Hinduism. I also know, a good friend of my brother, that was kicked out the house. Apparently, he disagreed with his parents on the message of the Latter Day Saints - Jehovah's Witnesses. I also have knowledge of Muslim parents rejecting their sons for disobedience to Islam. Parents exist in this world that abandon their sons/daughters for being gay. This type of nonsense is universal, regardless of religious faith/views. People are prideful and ignorant - who cares if they were Christian or liked to play Bingo. It's irrelevant. Is it really though? Or is that Religious education, the values they belief through teaching that their Christian God holds, has an impact on how you behave, say whether you view homosexuality as unnatural and would disown a homosexual son?

yes... but so are atheists, jews, muslims, etc.

Originally posted by red g jacks
yes... but so are atheists, jews, muslims, etc.

Not really for atheists of course as there is no set of beliefs that they must have in common. But sure Jews and Muslims and Communists and whoever subscribes to a certain ideology. But that doesn't make it irrelevant, on the contrary, it makes the ideal of ideologies extremely relevant, don't you think?

Originally posted by The MISTER
Are Christians too proud?

no

Originally posted by Bardock42
Not really for atheists of course as there is no set of beliefs that they must have in common. But sure Jews and Muslims and Communists and whoever subscribes to a certain ideology. But that doesn't make it irrelevant, on the contrary, it makes the ideal of ideologies extremely relevant, don't you think? no, it applies to atheists too. the pride doesn't arise strictly from organized religion or sacred texts. humans are perfectly capable of being proud on their own, and many atheists do take on a condescending tone towards people with opposing views.

The claim of the post I replied to and the subject of my post were not about "pride" though.

I think he was just responding to the title question, not you.

Originally posted by Mindship

Again, I'm largely speculating here, but I suspect there is a strong genetic predisposition for us-them thinking, a mindset which may have been advantageous long before religious preoccupation arose, back when primitive humans were more centered on protecting, say, feeding grounds against strangers.

I'd imagine the bias of in-group/out-group predates humanity and even "primates". I'd be astounded if such a bias wasn't like a prerequisite for highly social animals of any kind. I'm sure there are exceptions, but I'd put money on it being the rule rather than a rarity.

Originally posted by King Kandy
I think he was just responding to the title question, not you.

That's perfectly reasonable, if so I'm sorry I misunderstood, and I agree.

yea, i was responding to the thread topic. as for your post about religious education often influencing homophobia and things like that, you'll have no disagreements from me there.

christianity does have a predisposition towards being "chosen" which sometimes comes out as pride, sometimes as pity and sometimes as concern{false or true}. as for CHRISTIANS, it depends on the kind of person they are. collectively though, proseletizing christians are often proud of their faith in comparison to those they see as unsaved people.