X-Force VS Wonder Woman, Batman, & Hawkman

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.



wildernesss
X-Force VS Wonder Woman, Batman, & Hawkman


no prep. battle takes place in the desert at night with very limited visibility.





wolverine
fantomex
deadpool
psylocke
archangel
deathlok

Q99
Why are Batman and Hawkman there? It's a stomp with Diana.

SamZED
I assume this is also a depowered Diana, so she could use the team.

wildernesss
"Why are Batman and Hawkman there? It's a stomp with Diana."



a hypnotized by fantomex (while being carved up by a beserk wolverine) diana is a stomp? also, isn't ww weaker now? no way is this a stomp.

StiltmanFTW
This is a stomp... in X-Force's favor.

753
illusions rarely work on her, if at all. how weak is she these days?

AlmightyKfish
Assuming current WW, X-force win this.

Q99
Originally posted by wildernesss
"Why are Batman and Hawkman there? It's a stomp with Diana."


a hypnotized by fantomex (while being carved up by a beserk wolverine) diana is a stomp?

Yes, absolutely. No question, Classic Diana stomps them all. Not even close. She's way out of their league.




Hard to tell exactly, but she fell thousands of feet from a plane with no damage, and her latest foes (Amazons possessed by the spirits of her real villains) have been throwing busses around and the like. She does have her lasso again now too.

I think she'd fairly solidly be the strongest one on the field, just not enough to win.

Deadline
X-force.

srankmissingnin
Fantomex misdirect has worked on Professor X and Jean. It will work on Wonder Woman. X-Force wins a clean sweep.

753
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Fantomex misdirect has worked on Professor X and Jean. It will work on Wonder Woman. X-Force wins a clean sweep. i know, but she is a truth goddes whatever, that is commonly used to say she can see through illusions etc.

googleme
What are Batman and Hawkman doing here? Hawkman and Batman at the same time could be beaten by Wolverine alone. Current weak Wonder Woman dies albiet after 3 mins worth of fighting.

carver9
I think people literally forgot who Psylock is.

753
Originally posted by carver9
I think people literally forgot who Psylock is. she's a ninja teleptah. what does that giver her against diana?

googleme
Originally posted by carver9
I think people literally forgot who Psylock is. Who needs Psylock? With WW being a pale version of herself, Wolverine could almost win this one by himself.

YoungGunna
X-force ftw

Q99
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Fantomex misdirect has worked on Professor X and Jean. It will work on Wonder Woman.

Prof X and Jean are telepaths; Wonder Woman has truth powers that prevent mental effects. There's a difference.

carver9
Originally posted by 753
she's a ninja teleptah. what does that giver her against diana?

You forgot a couple of stuff there buddy.

Super strength
Super speed
Parlyzing swords
Expert Martial artist

All of these stats can be amped with just a thought. She was/is operating on such a high level that she was capable of physically stalemating Extreme Rogue who at the time had Thor, Hulk, Magneto, Iceman, Cyclops, Wolverine, North Star, Quicksilver, Juggernaut, etc, etc.. powers.

Hope that cleared everything everything up for you.

753
Originally posted by carver9
You forgot a couple of stuff there buddy.

Super strength
Super speed
Parlyzing swords
Expert Martial artist

All of these stats can be amped with just a thought. She was/is operating on such a high level that she was capable of physically stalemating Extreme Rogue who at the time had Thor, Hulk, Magneto, Iceman, Cyclops, Wolverine, North Star, Quicksilver, Juggernaut, etc, etc.. powers.

Hope that cleared everything everything up for you. she has no superhuman stats, she amps with TK and rogue was not manifesting any of those powers you listed during their sparring session, just the miss marvel powerset. you'd have to be delluded to believe otherwise. IDK what level current WW is at, but it's probably > classic rogue/miss marvel and she is a competent martial artist too, unlike rogue

carver9
Originally posted by 753
she has no superhuman stats, she amps with TK and rogue was not manifesting any of those powers you listed during their sparring session, just the miss marvel powerset. you'd have to be delluded to believe otherwise. IDK what level current WW is at, but it's probably > classic rogue/miss marvel and she is a competent martial artist too, unlike rogue

I can't believe you said she doesn't have any super human stats when 2 years back during her run through the Savage Land she punched someone clean over a mountain "while holding back" and was shocked that she was able to deliver such a blow.

Why don't you think Rogue was amping herself in that fight?

753
Originally posted by carver9
I can't believe you said she doesn't have any super human stats when 2 years back during her run through the Savage Land she punched someone clean over a mountain "while holding back" and was shocked that she was able to deliver such a blow.

Why don't you think Rogue was amping herself in that fight?

her powerset had been modified during that run and is now back to regular TP/TK.

because she did not show any of those powers. when xtreme roge used the absorbed powers, her physical appearence changed to resemble the character, like when she used hulk and logan's powers to survive a sword blow from vargas. she used no energy power, no superspeed and no physical change in her tussle with psylock.

Existere
Right, but hasn't current Psylocke said to use telekinesis to amp her physical abilities? I thought she said that in her danger room fight with Sabretooth... but I could be on crack.

753
Originally posted by Existere
Right, but hasn't current Psylocke said to use telekinesis to amp her physical abilities? I thought she said that in her danger room fight with Sabretooth... but I could be on crack. yes, psylock amps her stats with TK, but she has no superhuman stats by default.

Existere
Originally posted by 753
yes, psylock amps her stats with TK, but she has no superhuman stats by default. Right, but... so? I mean, it feels like we're splitting hairs, unless I'm missing the point of this discussion: if she can amp her stats to superhuman levels, then she can amp her stats to superhuman levels.

753
Originally posted by carver9
You forgot a couple of stuff there buddy.

Super strength
Super speed
Parlyzing swords
Expert Martial artist

All of these stats can be amped with just a thought. She was/is operating on such a high level that she was capable of physically stalemating Extreme Rogue who at the time had Thor, Hulk, Magneto, Iceman, Cyclops, Wolverine, North Star, Quicksilver, Juggernaut, etc, etc.. powers.

Hope that cleared everything everything up for you.


Originally posted by 753
she has no superhuman stats, she amps with TK and rogue was not manifesting any of those powers you listed during their sparring session, just the miss marvel powerset. you'd have to be delluded to believe otherwise. IDK what level current WW is at, but it's probably > classic rogue/miss marvel and she is a competent martial artist too, unlike rogue

carver9
Originally posted by Existere
Right, but... so? I mean, it feels like we're splitting hairs, unless I'm missing the point of this discussion: if she can amp her stats to superhuman levels, then she can amp her stats to superhuman levels.

This is exactly what I am saying and 753, she never lost her super strength or her super speed and there hasn't been shown a limit yet on how far she can amp her stats either.

carver9
Originally posted by 753


Sorry for the misunderstanding but my entire argument is that she has super human abilities. You said that she didn't. I guess there was some confusion down the road of our debate.

Q99
Wasn't Psylocke dead before Rogue unlocked her powers fully in X-Treme? Vargas killed her before the dimensional alien invasion, Sage unlocked Rogue's full powers in order to fight the invasion.

I think when they fought, Rogue was Ms. Marvel/Cyclops/Wolverine, not the whole lot.

753
Originally posted by carver9
This is exactly what I am saying and 753, she never lost her super strength or her super speed and there hasn't been shown a limit yet on how far she can amp her stats either. really? show me a superstrengh feat from her in her current run since she regained her tk/tp. and no, that is not what you were saying at all. her best feat is competing with a miss marvel euivalent for a while. Im underhelmed. of course, this depends on the level of the depowerement diana has suffered, but I'd bet she is still above miss marvel and is a competent martial artist, unlike rogue

Existere
Originally posted by 753
Oh. Fair enough then.

I have trouble wading through Carver's posts sometimes.

Well, be that as it may, she is superhuman once amped, and she does have her psychic blades, actual blades, fighting skillz!1!!, etc.

I think in this scenario she makes a good combo with Fantomex, though I don't really what the status of Diana's 'eyes of the godess' are currently. I see them referenced way more often on the forums than I do in comics, but I'm sure I've seen supporting scans... maybe? I also don't know how they were affected by her current depowerment, but I haven't been keeping up with Wonder Woman.

753
Originally posted by Q99
Wasn't Psylocke dead before Rogue unlocked her powers fully in X-Treme? Vargas killed her before the dimensional alien invasion, Sage unlocked Rogue's full powers in order to fight the invasion.

I think when they fought, Rogue was Ms. Marvel/Cyclops/Wolverine, not the whole lot. yes, but she didnt even use cyclops power or logans claws

carver9
Originally posted by Q99
Wasn't Psylocke dead before Rogue unlocked her powers fully in X-Treme? Vargas killed her before the dimensional alien invasion, Sage unlocked Rogue's full powers in order to fight the invasion.

I think when they fought, Rogue was Ms. Marvel/Cyclops/Wolverine, not the whole lot.

Naah, I think this took place after the manifest of Rogue abilities because prior to this... Rogue saved a city using Magneto and Storms powers.

Q99
Would the low-visibility environment affect his ability to make illusions?

Originally posted by carver9
Naah, I think this took place after the manifest of Rogue abilities because prior to this... Rogue saved a city using Magneto and Storms powers.

Rogue definitely lost the full X-treme power-set before Psylocke returned from the dead, though.

I think Psylocke beat her after Rogue's powers started expanding, but not when she could call upon them at will, and definitely when they fought she wasn't using anyone like Thor, Hulk, etc..

carver9
Originally posted by 753
really? show me a superstrengh feat from her in her current run since she regained her tk/tp. and no, that is not what you were saying at all. her best feat is competing with a miss marvel euivalent for a while. Im underhelmed. of course, this depends on the level of the depowerement diana has suffered, but I'd bet she is still above miss marvel and is a competent martial artist, unlike rogue

What kind of strength feats are you looking for because if you are looking for lifting feats... I'm throwing in the towel since everyone doesn't go around tossing buildings.

carver9
Originally posted by Q99
Would the low-visibility environment affect his ability to make illusions?



Rogue definitely lost the full X-treme power-set before Psylocke returned from the dead, though.

I think Psylocke beat her after Rogue's powers started expanding, but not when she could call upon them at will, and definitely when they fought she wasn't using anyone like Thor, Hulk, etc..

Can't argue against this since I really don't have any proof. I'm about to look at the fight again though just to make sure.

Existere
Originally posted by Q99
Would the low-visibility environment affect his ability to make illusions?
I can't imagine that visibility was great when X-Force was fighting on the moon, and Fantomex was making effective use of misdirection there.

So...probably not? I don't see why it would anyhow, it doesn't seem to rely on vision too heavily, but I could be mistaken.

Q99
Originally posted by Existere
I can't imagine that visibility was great when X-Force was fighting on the moon, and Fantomex was making effective use of misdirection there.

So...probably not? I don't see why it would anyhow, it doesn't seem to rely on vision too heavily, but I could be mistaken.

I dunno what the point of the low-visibility environment is in that case, none of 'em on either side will be *too* effected.

srankmissingnin
In a desert at night half the X-Force team can take down WW via stealth...

-Pr-
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
In a desert at night half the X-Force team can take down WW via stealth...

Even with her enhanced senses?

Q99
Can we have a clarification from the thread starter on just which Diana this is?

srankmissingnin
Originally posted by -Pr-
Even with her enhanced senses?

Never seen her do anything to suggest otherwise.

iceman24567
Wonder Woman likely solos

Existere
Originally posted by Q99
Can we have a clarification from the thread starter on just which Diana this is? Seeing as the OP's second post was:

Originally posted by wildernesss
a hypnotized by fantomex (while being carved up by a beserk wolverine) diana is a stomp? also, isn't ww weaker now? no way is this a stomp.

I think we can assume wildernesss meant the weaker Diana.

Prep-Man
Wondy solos. She fought off illusions before. Psycho, anyone?

753
Originally posted by Q99
Would the low-visibility environment affect his ability to make illusions?
doubt it, his power affects the mind, it doesnt create holograms or anythign like that. it isnt telepathy or mindmaster's power either. he somehow just makes people perceive shit they way he wants, but one time he missdirected a horseman of apocalypse's bloodlust making him love psylock and self-distruct. even weeks afterwards, once the horseman had recovered, he still loved her.

Prep-Man
diana has good protection from someone who mind screws with her head. nothing new.

wildernesss
denial is not a river in egypt. if fantomex could hypnotize xavier & apocalypse's horseman of war...then ww would at least be partially affected. even a 50 percent achieved distraction would be more than enough to defeat her in her current depowered condiditon.

Konton
You're assuming that her powers work like Xavier and the horseman.

She isn't "actively" resistant, she's been shown largely immune to telepathy since Athena blessed her with the Eye of Palas. She sees through all illusion and has a strong *mystical* foundation in perceiving the truth in *any* situation. I'd rate the enchantment of a skyfather far above a genetic mutation.

Prep-Man
even dr psycho amped by circe had a hard time.

Existere
Originally posted by Konton
I'd rate the enchantment of a skyfather far above a genetic mutation. ...why?

Prep-Man
Well, seeing as we have already seen WW resist those types of attacks, the enchantment works.

753
Originally posted by Konton
You're assuming that her powers work like Xavier and the horseman.

She isn't "actively" resistant, she's been shown largely immune to telepathy since Athena blessed her with the Eye of Palas. She sees through all illusion and has a strong *mystical* foundation in perceiving the truth in *any* situation. I'd rate the enchantment of a skyfather far above a genetic mutation. you are right about diana's truth seeing power, but the fatc that it comes froma spell from a skyfather is meaningless. the most powerfull genetic mutations in homo superior are several orders of magnitude above skyfathers.

Prep-Man
true, but we are talking about fantomex. he isnt powerful enough to affect diana.

Q99
Originally posted by 753
you are right about diana's truth seeing power, but the fatc that it comes froma spell from a skyfather is meaningless. the most powerfull genetic mutations in homo superior are several orders of magnitude above skyfathers.

I wouldn't say the people he affected was among those, though.

Sirius77
Classic Diana stomps.

I don't know enough about current to say one way or the other. But to say "they win because it's night" isn't the best argument to make against any amazon, depowered or not.

Dum Dum Dugan
Lets see some feats of current diana ability to simply ignore fantomex powers. Because honestly it sounds like a bunch of wishful thinking to me.


Also like to mention that Psylocke has moved so fast while not amping that she completely disappeared from a superhuman.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Sirius77 Classic Diana stomps. I don't know enough about current to say one way or the other. But to say "they win because it's night" isn't the best argument to make against any amazon, depowered or not.

current diana doesnt have the feats to take down this team, but current diana does.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
current diana doesnt have the feats to take down this team, but classic diana does.
you mean this

Prep-Man
oops. my bad.

SasuOna
when did current diana lose her blessing from Athena? Never so yeah this isn't wishful thinking the only things shes lost are her lasso, her ability to fly,and some of her speed. Shes retained most of these things so I have no idea why people are acting like current Wondy is losing to anyone on this team.

Dum Dum Dugan
If she was de-powered why would we assume her blessing remained? Also can we get some showings of her ability?

also can we see some showings that her current body posses physical level of abilities you suggest?

Konton
I'm not saying current Diana has the enchantment. I was just saying that PX being able to fool Classic Wondy is ridiculous. Current WW doesn't swing this IMO, and X-Force would win.

wildernesss
"Never so yeah this isn't wishful thinking the only things shes lost are her lasso, her ability to fly,and some of her speed. Shes retained most of these things so I have no idea why people are acting like current Wondy is losing to anyone on this team."


right, because losing her lasso, ability to fly & some of her speed and strength is not a game changing variable. psylocke, alone, would give her big time trouble. psylocke has matched rogue's combat strength by amping herself with telekinesis. her psychic dagger would make short work of ww.

Prep-Man
diana has had her lasso for a few issues anyway.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
oops. my bad.
np I do it all the time lol

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Konton
I'm not saying current Diana has the enchantment. I was just saying that PX being able to fool Classic Wondy is ridiculous. Current WW doesn't swing this IMO, and X-Force would win.
I was referring to sasu


My comment to you was the psylocke moving faster then a meta could see with out amping.

Konton
Which meta? One with established speed?

Streets do that to metas in comics anyway.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Konton
Which meta? One with established speed?

Streets do that to metas in comics anyway.
Ogun




They disapear right in front of them and appear behind them? in a small well lit room? I find this extremely hard to believe.

Prep-Man
diana is much faster than anyone from the team. btw, people are forgetting hawkman who has the claw of horus. that alone will put a hurting on anyone from xforce.

SamZED
You guys sound like Fantomex illusions is team's only shot at winning. This is depowered WW. Wolverone could beat either Batman or HM.. or both for that matter. And the rest of the team can take the amazon.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by SamZED
You guys sound like Fantomex illusions is team's only shot at winning. This is depowered WW. Wolverone could beat either Batman or HM.. or both for that matter. And the rest of the team can take the amazon.

Not with the Claw of Horus. Hawkman only needs one shot to take down Logan. And I'm assuming this is classic WW. Since Current WW is almost at her base power levels.

SamZED
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Not with the Claw of Horus. Hawkman only needs one shot to take down Logan. And I'm assuming this is classic WW. Since Current WW is almost at her base power levels. If its classic its a different story. Thought she's still depowered.

Prep-Man
Even if we use the depowered version, she is still highly fast and possess one of the most powerful artifacts in this fight. The lasso can tie all of them up if she wanted to and they wouldn't be able to do anything about it.

SamZED
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Even if we use the depowered version, she is still highly fast and possess one of the most powerful artifacts in this fight. The lasso can tie all of them up if she wanted to and they wouldn't be able to do anything about it. She got the lasso back huh.. I need an update.. But I was under impressions that she is spider-man level in strength when depowered? As for speed some people on team one are crazy fast.

Prep-Man
Hawkman has flown at the speed of light before. I don't think anyone on team 1 can do that. Plus he has generations upon generations of battle experience. And the Claw of Horus which put SUPERMAN for a loop. And, yeah, WW has the Lasso from what I read.

SamZED
Flight speed and combat speed aren't the same thing. Archangel is maneuverable enough to give team 2 trouble + has those aparlizing feathers. As for experience, in comics MA skills usuailly are more important than experience. For example Batman is a better fighter than Herc even though he's much yonger. If it comes down to "who connects first" Id pick Logan over HM but that's IMHO ofcourse.

Prep-Man
HM has some very good combat speed and he has shields for blocking weapons.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Hawkman has flown at the speed of light before. I don't think anyone on team 1 can do that. Plus he has generations upon generations of battle experience. And the Claw of Horus which put SUPERMAN for a loop. And, yeah, WW has the Lasso from what I read.
Movement speed does not translate into combat speed. They dont need to.



Wolverine has the same thing. Claw of Horus is big, assuming it standard equipment. Which i not 100% sure it is.

Dum Dum Dugan
also it been confirmed that the author means de-powered diana.


Assuming she does have her lasso, what can it due? I mean hear stuff all the time about it, but these more unique abilities, can she do them while de-powered. And are they even remotely consistently used?

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
Movement speed does not translate into combat speed. They dont need to.



Wolverine has the same thing. Claw of Horus is big, assuming it standard equipment. Which i not 100% sure it is.

Like I said above, HM has great combat speed. And it IS standard equipment. Read Brightest Day.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
also it been confirmed that the author means de-powered diana.


Assuming she does have her lasso, what can it due? I mean hear stuff all the time about it, but these more unique abilities, can she do them while de-powered. And are they even remotely consistently used?

WW does have a respect thread. Check it out.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
WW does have a respect thread. Check it out.
I know she does, ive seen it before. But that does not explain if while de-powered that she can uses all it abilities, nor if she uses some of the more unique abilities, anything remotely consistent enough to consider she use it majority of the matches.

Same goes for the claws of hortus (aside from depowered part)

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Like I said above, HM has great combat speed. And it IS standard equipment. Read Brightest Day.
He combat speed is not beyond anyone listed. Hell batman kept pace with him easy enough if not mistaken. In fact his phsyical abilities are not overly impressive when compared to capt, spidy or wolverine. His punching/weapon out put is very high however.




Also, people are sleeping on deathlok, he a beast.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I know she does, ive seen it before. But that does not explain if while de-powered that she can uses all it abilities, nor if she uses some of the more unique abilities, anything remotely consistent enough to consider she use it majority of the matches.

Same goes for the claws of hortus (aside from depowered part)

She can still use the lasso and all it's abilities.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
He combat speed is not beyond anyone listed. Hell batman kept pace with him easy enough if not mistaken. In fact his phsyical abilities are not overly impressive when compared to capt, spidy or wolverine. His punching/weapon out put is very high however.




Also, people are sleeping on deathlok, he a beast.

Wolverine isn't faster than HM.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Wolverine isn't faster than HM.
never said he was. I said HM is not overly impressive physically when compared with spiderman capt or wolverine.


combat speed wise, he not faster then either of them.

Prep-Man
He's good enough to tag him and he only needs one hit. For any of the X-Force members.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
She can still use the lasso and all it's abilities.
thats not true actually. Depends how often and many times she done certain abilities.


CIS is still in play, which is why heavier forum matches don't end in seconds. They still within there character, and what they most likely would due, while ignoring pis and using them at there consistent showings.

Prep-Man
She's getting her powers back. This is only for a brief time, until JMS gets off the book. I even think it said she can use the lasso to it's potential.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
He's good enough to tag him and he only needs one hit. For any of the X-Force members.
I disagree. You assume he going to be hitting with horus, but it not something he consistently does nor at that level. It like assuming IF every attack is capable of destroy a hellicerier. He did it sure, but that not close to his average attack. Nor is it believable he swing that attack every time.

Prep-Man
Uhm, read Brightest Day and Superman/Batman. He knocked Superman for a loop.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
She's getting her powers back. This is only for a brief time, until JMS gets off the book. I even think it said she can use the lasso to it's potential.
does not matter, she de-powered in this thread. Lets be frank, if she was at classic levels, she would stomp. As would any top tier DC character.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
does not matter, she de-powered in this thread. Lets be frank, if she was at classic levels, she would stomp. As would any top tier DC character.

She is, not the weapon. And of course she would stomp if she's at classic levels.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Uhm, read Brightest Day and Superman/Batman. He knocked Superman for a loop.
yes what about brightest day and what issue?





Yes I not denying what he done, I saying he does not consistently use. Also doesent it need to like charge or something? could have sworn it did. Which is why he does not use it frequently.


Also like to point out Batman has alter the direction of Shazam that was punch full on out by superman, to the point he reverted. People have absurd feats.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
She is, not the weapon. And of course she would stomp if she's at classic levels.
I know, but being depowered may effect her abilities with the lasso.


And I dont think your getting my point.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I know, but being depowered may effect her abilities with the lasso.


And I dont think your getting my point.

Where did it say she couldn't use the lasso?

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
yes what about brightest day and what issue?





Yes I not denying what he done, I saying he does not consistently use. Also doesent it need to like charge or something? could have sworn it did. Which is why he does not use it frequently.


Also like to point out Batman has alter the direction of Shazam that was punch full on out by superman, to the point he reverted. People have absurd feats.

He has constantly used it. It's standard.

Prep-Man
Hmmm, from the looks of it, Wonder Woman is back. That was quick.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Where did it say she couldn't use the lasso?
I am not saying it did. I am saying, because she de-powered, may prevent her from utilizing all the abilities.


I am also saying that we dont simply assume they use the best or greatest abilities first or every time. We base it off consistency, minus pis, plus cis. Just becuase characters posses the potential to do an ability does not mean they will the majority of the time or close to it.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Hmmm, from the looks of it, Wonder Woman is back. That was quick.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I am not saying it did. I am saying, because she de-powered, may prevent her from utilizing all the abilities.


I am also saying that we dont simply assume they use the best or greatest abilities first or every time. We base it off consistency, minus pis, plus cis. Just becuase characters posses the potential to do an ability does not mean they will the majority of the time or close to it.

But she was using it recently...

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
He has constantly used it. It's standard.
I understand he carries it on him, I mean constantly using punches capable of putting superman through a loop.


Just becuase some one did something, does not equate to that attach being or always beeing at that level or close to it. We dont assume ever attack IF does is max ability, why assume hawlkman? Unless you have evidence he use it to such level consistently.



Same reason I don't assume auto mind rape. Sure Psylocke a powerful telepath, but she does not consistently or close to it, utilizes her powers to shut off minds despite being capable.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Dum Dum Dugan
I understand he carries it on him, I mean constantly using punches capable of putting superman through a loop.


Just becuase some one did something, does not equate to that attach being or always beeing at that level or close to it. We dont assume ever attack IF does is max ability, why assume hawlkman? Unless you have evidence he use it to such level consistently.



Same reason I don't assume auto mind rape. Sure Psylocke a powerful telepath, but she does not consistently or close to it, utilizes her powers to shut off minds despite being capable.

He's done it more than once. And that was Nth metal does, anyway...

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
But she was using it recently...
yes, I understand that. Your not getting my point. I dont deny she can due it standard abilities, but what about the more unique and powerful abilities.

Prep-Man
Never did it state she can only do JUST the standard abilities. Since she sees the truth, it's safe to say she can do anything. Besides, I think she just remembered who she was, so she's back.

BTW, Claw of Horus draws the earths magnetic field to amplify it's punching power.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
He's done it more than once. And that was Nth metal does, anyway...
again not denying it. I dont think you understand what CIS means. He in characters, the fact he done it more then once is irrelevant. I not denying he can do it. I am saying he won't the majority of the time. Let a lone every single attack. Which is why majority of the time he not swinging with superman level blows. Also think it requires energy to do such attacks.





Nth metal does not make his blows superman looping. It allows him to fly, makes him low level to perhaps mid level superhuman with decent healing factor.

Prep-Man
Read the edit, also, WW can fly as well.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Never did it state she can only do JUST the standard abilities.
Yes and neither did it state she could use all it abilities.


Originally posted by Prep-Man
sees the truth, it's safe to say she can do anything. Besides, I think she just remembered who she was, so she's back.
Seeing the truth, is one of it most basic abilities. That far from proves she can do thing like blow people up with it, like she did in the past among other abilities.


Originally posted by Prep-Man
BTW, Claw of Horus draws the earths magnetic field to amplify it's punching power.
Yes which if not mistaken, is not unlimited nor is instantly or capable of repeated superman level blows or close to it. Your taking him at his most extreme and passing it off as the norm.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Read the edit, also, WW can fly as well.
what edit.



No she can't unless this is a new development, because from what I understand she no longer posses flight and significantly decreased speed.

Prep-Man
No, I mean she sees the truth. She doesn't remember who she is. Last issue she remembers and she seems back to her old self. Like I said, this is only brief.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
No, I mean she sees the truth. She doesn't remember who she is. Last issue she remembers and she seems back to her old self. Like I said, this is only brief.
I get that it brief. But it irrelevant. the debate is how de-powered ww and her team would fair. We all know how classic WW would fair.

Prep-Man
Well, we use current. And current seems back to her old self.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Well, we use current. And current seems back to her old self.
except the fact the thread maker clearly implied that this was de-powered diana. Also she done nothing so far to suggest she back to classic self.

Prep-Man
Oh, I didn't see that, but I still say the lasso is key.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Oh, I didn't see that, but I still say the lasso is key.
dont worry, it was kinda unclear he worded it wierd.




What will she do with the lasso? Also remember that Fantomx misdirrection will be going off. Then remember psylocke a telepath, Angles wings can be fired at range and capable of paralyzing foes.


Also deathlok. And de-powered WW, might be weaker if not significantly weaker then deathlok. However I am uncertain, becuase I yet to see her strength showings. However if what was suggested earlier that she just spidy strength level, then she signicantly weaker then deathlok.

Prep-Man
I thought you guys were arguing for classic WW being mind screwed! laughing out loud

This all makes sense.

BTW, if WW gets them in the lasso, they will bend to her will.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
I thought you guys were arguing for classic WW being mind screwed! laughing out loud

This all makes sense.

BTW, if WW gets them in the lasso, they will bend to her will.
Naw lol.



yup





I dont see that easy to accomplish, when you have guy flying around shooting paralyzing metal feathers, fantomex firing misdirects and psylocke utilizing both telepath and TK.


Also I not sure the lasso, would even work on deathlok.

Prep-Man
Ok, if it's current WW, she is screwed!

And Lasso works on everyone, even gods/cyborgs.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
Ok, if it's current WW, she is screwed!

And Lasso works on everyone, even gods/cyborgs.
lol






But he not a normal cyborg. There nothing to really reach, his human selfs are pycho killers if not mistaken, which only let of there leash some times, and dont posses control over his body. In fact, I think he run/directed by the machine part of him. So I not sure it would work, she could reach his two "guests" but that won't accomplish much. Might even give her false sense of security.

Prep-Man
The only beings that were able to resist it are magical in nature. I don't remember anyone who has resisted it.

The Lasso has even destroyed dead beings like Black Lanterns. It would seriously **** up Dethlok.

Dum Dum Dugan
Originally posted by Prep-Man
The only beings that were able to resist it are magical in nature. I don't remember anyone who has resisted it.

The Lasso has even destroyed dead beings like Black Lanterns. It would seriously **** up Dethlok.
but what is truth to a robot?




Destroyed? how?


Controlling and what I was refferring to.

srankmissingnin
Deathstroke has resisted Wonder Woman's lasso...

Q99
If there's no 'human' in there, then yea, I don't think it's affect him mentally. It won't stop a program from doing something.

It can still restrain physically, though.

Originally posted by Prep-Man
The only beings that were able to resist it are magical in nature. I don't remember anyone who has resisted it.

The Lasso has even destroyed dead beings like Black Lanterns. It would seriously **** up Dethlok.

When did a Black Lantern break it? From what I remember from WW:BN she used it to destroy a whole bunch of them.

SasuOna
Originally posted by srankmissingnin
Deathstroke has resisted Wonder Woman's lasso...

Clear cut case of PIS I don't even need to be knowledgeable about Wondy to know thats stupid.

Prep-Man
Originally posted by Q99
If there's no 'human' in there, then yea, I don't think it's affect him mentally. It won't stop a program from doing something.

It can still restrain physically, though.



When did a Black Lantern break it? From what I remember from WW:BN she used it to destroy a whole bunch of them.

I didn't mean they broke it, I meant she destroyed a bunch of them.

Existere
Originally posted by Q99
If there's no 'human' in there, then yea, I don't think it's affect him mentally. It won't stop a program from doing something.
I don't really see why not.

Human brains are programmed in a sense, after all. Truth to a computer would be whatever it is programmed to know as true, just like people, right?

Not that this is particularly on topic, but I thought it was more interesting.

Prep-Man
Wasn't the only reason DS broke it, is because he already saw the truth or some BS?

Omega Vision
Yeah something like that.

I love Deathstroke, but that whole instance was bullshit.

753
Originally posted by Q99
I wouldn't say the people he affected was among those, though. jean was manifesting the phoenix force when missdirection worked on her

Q99
Originally posted by Existere
I don't really see why not.

Human brains are programmed in a sense, after all. Truth to a computer would be whatever it is programmed to know as true, just like people, right?

Not that this is particularly on topic, but I thought it was more interesting.

It works via the soul, though. No soul, no activation.

I'd think it'd work on Red Tornado and Vision, but not, say, a Doombot, Ultimo, or similar.


Also one time Vera Black pulled a trick where she held it with her robot arms and then lied- because they weren't part of 'her,' she didn't have to tell the truth.

Text-only Version: Click HERE to see this thread with all of the graphics, features, and links.