Who's stronger Juggernaut or Hercules

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JonyBoy2

JonyBoy2
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chomperx9
Juggernaut

carver9
Juggernaut doesn't have lifting feats. Herc is stronger.

JonyBoy2
Originally posted by carver9
Juggernaut doesn't have lifting feats. Herc is stronger.
He uses his momentum and durability to negate his foes strength advantages, I see Juggernaut beating Herc in a comic show down, but in the forums Herc is tronger

CosmicComet
Prime Juggernaut was the strongest on 616 Earth.

He doesn't need lifting feats. Direct comparisons suffice.

carver9
Then how would we know if he is stronger than Herc without lifting feats? Herc has pulled manhantan without to much difficulty... what has Juggernaut lifted?

smile

That's like saying Odin is stronger than Colossus when we all know that Colossus lifting feats>Odin.

CosmicComet
Originally posted by carver9
Then how would we know if he is stronger than Herc without lifting feats? Herc has pulled manhantan without to much difficulty... what has Juggernaut lifted?

smile

That's like saying Odin is stronger than Colossus when we all know that Colossus lifting feats>Odin.

Sounds like sarcasm in response to something H1 said. Am I right?

carver9
Originally posted by CosmicComet
Sounds like sarcasm in response to something H1 said. Am I right?

laughing

Sure is.

playa1258
Juggernaut is arguably the strongest Top tier in Marvel

where_you_at
.

Existere
Originally posted by Sr J-Bieb
Batman via Batkick

Rage.Of.Olympus
A stalemate on average I'd wager.

D-Block
Neither has shown limits so it's impossible to say.

playa1258
^ Yeah pretty much

JonyBoy2

carver9
Hercules>Juggernaut lifting feats.

CosmicComet

rotiart
Hulk has stopped a juggernaught in motion....
With warhulk he overpowered him
And world war hulk he stopped him then stepped aside to let him run all the way into the ocean.

So... Hulk is strongest! But juggernaught second strongest... :-P and Hercules somewhere below all that

StiltmanFTW
Classic Juggernaut.

JonyBoy2
Originally posted by rotiart
world war hulk he stopped him then stepped aside to let him run all the way into the ocean. that hullk never stopped juggernaut, you can clearly see it in the scans, juggernaut was using his momentum to move(slowly) hulk, hulk just moved because he knew he could not stop his momentum

CosmicComet
Originally posted by rotiart
Hulk has stopped a juggernaught in motion....
With warhulk he overpowered him
And world war hulk he stopped him then stepped aside to let him run all the way into the ocean.

So... Hulk is strongest! But juggernaught second strongest... :-P and Hercules somewhere below all that

He stopped his momentum as War Hulk.

WWH never stopped Juggernaut's momentum. All they did was tie up in a test of strength, and Juggernaut seemed to have the upper hand there, the art makes it ambiguous enough to argue but I recall knowsbleed getting the same writer's opinion on that scene and he said it was merely a test of strength.

StiltmanFTW
thumb up Yeah, the scan is in the revamped respect thread.

Hyperion Prime
I would put Juggernaut as way stronger than Hercules. If they were to ever fight it would be a massacre against Hercules. WWH had trouble with Juggs, but would easily demolish Hercules.

And War-Hulk stopping Juggernaut was Celestial tech that stopped him not really a Hulk feat.

celestialdemon
I think in power alone, Hercules is stronger than Juggernaut. However, in a fight, Juggernaut wins. Hercules doesn't have anything that can get past Cyttorak's protection.

psycho gundam
Originally posted by CosmicComet
He stopped his momentum as War Hulk.

WWH never stopped Juggernaut's momentum. All they did was tie up in a test of strength, and Juggernaut seemed to have the upper hand there, the art makes it ambiguous enough to argue but I recall knowsbleed getting the same writer's opinion on that scene and he said it was merely a test of strength. not allowing juggernaut to gain momentum (until hunt wanted to be rid of the nuicance) is just as good

Uriel005
Chaos war Herc stomps though.

Hyperion Prime
Originally posted by Uriel005
Chaos war Herc stomps though.

Trion Juggernaut stomps though........


I am joking big grin

CosmicComet
Originally posted by psycho gundam
not allowing juggernaut to gain momentum (until hunt wanted to be rid of the nuicance) is just as good

Except, that's not at all what he did.

He side stepped him and pushed him on the shoulder, which caused Juggernaut to stumble forward and his momentum took effect from there.

'not allowing juggernaut to gain momentum until x condition' Lol, you're funny.

He was ready to kill Juggernaut, and then he realized, 'derrr i can't do that, lol'.

wildernesss
juggernaut doesn't have enough lifting feats....but i still think he's stronger than herc overall.

Uriel005
Originally posted by wildernesss
juggernaut doesn't have enough lifting feats....but i still think he's stronger than herc overall. don't think it's a matter of strength as much as it is once he gets going hes going to get where he wants to be and if his fist happens to want to go through your chest then thats where it will go. Supposing we put the two of them in boxes molded to them so they can't get any momentum going and told them to escape and with each success it gets harder and harder I'd give herc the win. but standard herc wouldn't take juggs in a normal fight Unless his pankration skills lets him lock juggs entirely which given his mastery of the art is not unlikely.

Mindset
Originally posted by Uriel005
Unless his pankration skills lets him lock juggs entirely which given his mastery of the art is not unlikely. Huh?

KingD19
It's essentially ancient greek wrestling.

Like that time Herc and Hulk were fighting, and the on panel commentary was explaining how epic his fighting skills were. I think they compared his ground and pound to getting hit with a jumbo jet loaded with explosives going really fast....on crack, or something.

So he's saying maybe Herc could get Juggernaut in a hold he couldn't break out of, which, considering his strength, durability, force field, and healing factor, I can't think of one.

Mindset
It's grecian mma essentially, that wasn't what I was confused about.

Edit: Never mind, I see what he's saying.

Wont work though.

Devron87
here we go again with all these peoples who downplay every single Hulk feats,is War-Hulk own power boosted by the Franklin richards nexus energy and chaneled by the celestials tech who stopped juggernaut,also in the comics Apocalypse recognize Hulk as the only source of the power,he just armored Hulk with celestial tech for give Hulk a Greater control over his own power and maintain it at high-level without the anger emotion,it's a Hulk feat,all this stuff is in the comics............

and Juggernaut have trouble with Savage Hulk who messed his enchantment with brute strenght,and he Never beat him and worst he can even beat a middle enraged WWH despite the fact he want "to trash the Hulk",WWH is without a scratch at the end of the day,
the only thing with this character is his insane durability wihout that and the enchentment,i see a Warrior Madness-Thor,a Onslaught strenght level hulk,or a bloodlusted Hercule beat his ass in pure brute strenght...........

red_light
.

Hyperion Prime
Originally posted by red_light
its funny because if the thread was "Who's stronger Juugernaut or Thor" i bet everybody would say thor, but hercules who is thor's equel is getting the shorter end of the stick... amazing

I wouldn't say that. I beleive Juggernaut and Thor to be near equals. Hercules on the other hand is not the equal of either Thor or Juggernaut. Hulk and Hercules are equal when Hulk is just getting started.

Batman-Prime
Herc. Wasn't juggs originally Class 90? IMO his enchantments and his unstoppability let him appear to be as strong or stronger then his opponents but without them I wouldn't put him on Hulks, Thors or Hercs level.

Hyperion Prime
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
Herc. Wasn't juggs originally Class 90? IMO his enchantments and his unstoppability let him appear to be as strong or stronger then his opponents but without them I wouldn't put him on Hulks, Thors or Hercs level.

There is no proof of that. Hell he knocked over the WTC can you prove that wasn't strength and that was his powers. Since you are using handbooks where does it say his powers substitute his strength Handbooks also say Odin is like class 60 and Zeus is class 60 confused .

Batman-Prime
Originally posted by Hyperion Prime
There is no proof of that. Hell he knocked over the WTC can you prove that wasn't strength and that was his powers. Since you are using handbooks where does it say his powers substitute his strength Handbooks also say Odin is like class 60 and Zeus is class 60 confused .

I think Skyfathers can amp themselves to the levels they need. And I think Zeus was Class 90-100, I could be wrong though.

When he moves he is unstoppable, that's what makes him the Juggernaut. If he was as strong as the Hulk, he wouldn't need that extra entchantment IMO.

Hyperion Prime
Originally posted by Batman-Prime
I think Skyfathers can amp themselves to the levels they need. And I think Zeus was Class 90-100, I could be wrong though.

When he moves he is unstoppable, that's what makes him the Juggernaut. If he was as strong as the Hulk, he wouldn't need that extra entchantment IMO.

Yeah, but thats like saying Wolverine shouldn't have his Adamantium, because he has a healing factor. Or Superman shouldn't need all his other powers because he is super strong. Who in comics dosen't have multiple powers? Not trying to be a dick, just saying.

CosmicComet
I don't remember Juggernat ever being Class 90.

He was always as strong or stronger than his peers.

Batman-Prime
Originally posted by Hyperion Prime
Yeah, but thats like saying Wolverine shouldn't have his Adamantium, because he has a healing factor. Or Superman shouldn't need all his other powers because he is super strong. Who in comics dosen't have multiple powers? Not trying to be a dick, just saying.

Wolverines HF wouldn't prevent him from getting his bones broken, nor would his claws be able to hurt "invulnerable" foes. Anyway, I get your point but Juggernaut seems to use his momentum for his feats, not really his strength, at least when he "overpowers" opponents like the hulk. I would like to see who wins in an armwrestling contest though, and I would put my money on Hulk, Herc or Thor tbh.

Batman-Prime
Originally posted by CosmicComet
I don't remember Hulk ever being Class 90.

He was always as strong or stronger than his peers.

I mean Juggs was Class 90, though again, I could be wrong, it's a long time since i got a HB.

CosmicComet
Yeah I meant Juggernaut too, I fixed the typo.

JonyBoy2

WhiteWitchKing
Hercules is atleast equal to Juggernaut in strength.

CosmicComet
Originally posted by WhiteWitchKing
Hercules is at best equal to Juggernaut in strength.


fix't!

golem370
Juggernaut crushed a steel girder broke out of the massive block of steel and back-handed a 3 ton wrecking ball like nothing.

Uriel005
Originally posted by golem370
Juggernaut crushed a steel girder broke out of the massive block of steel and back-handed a 3 ton wrecking ball like nothing. LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL That's your big feat!!! He's got far better ones than that.

Hyperion Prime
Originally posted by Uriel005
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL That's your big feat!!! He's got far better ones than that.

He did push his way out of the mountain that buried him in Korea. That was a whole mountain, that was a good feat.

ColossusGrundy
Current Juggs is not what he used to be.

Right now Colossus is way stronger than Juggs. Juggs just has the inertia power to make up for it. With Herc and Colossus both being class 100+ that puts them both above Juggs........
HOWEVER......

Herc has this "auto-fubar" trait that makes him lose or have trouble with those that he shouldn't (The Blob, etc.)

With that HUGE factor.............Juggs wins. Juggs won't mess up like Herc will and he'll take it.

JUGGS FTW on this one.

big juggy man
The Juggernaut doesn't need feats. Marvel has stated that at the very least the Juggernaut is as strong as Thor in physical strength.

leonidas
hercules is stronger.

JBL
Juggernaut can and has matched hulk in a contest of strength without his force field active. Hercules is NOT as strong as juggernaut.

h1a8
Juggs is stronger solely based off how he overpowers Hulk at times.

JBL
Originally posted by h1a8
Juggs is stronger solely based off how he overpowers Hulk at times. Well said and correct.

abhilegend
They are equal in strength IMO.Originally posted by h1a8
Juggs is stronger solely based off how he overpowers Hulk at times. Originally posted by JBL
Well said and correct.
Even savage Hulk has overpowered Juggernaut.

Newjak
Originally posted by abhilegend
They are equal in strength IMO.
Even savage Hulk has overpowered Juggernaut. WWH admitted Juggs has beaten him in the past.

Classic Juggernaut was a walking plot device for a story. He was literally always as strong as he needed to be to make the story flow. That's why he was able to push WWH back. Even though that version of Hulk was always trying to dispatch foes as quickly as possible.

I have no doubt he could be as strong or stronger than Herc depending on the story.

abhilegend
Originally posted by Newjak
WWH admitted Juggs has beaten him in the past.

Classic Juggernaut was a walking plot device for a story. He was literally always as strong as he needed to be to make the story flow. That's why he was able to push WWH back. Even though that version of Hulk was always trying to dispatch foes as quickly as possible.

I have no doubt he could be as strong or stronger than Herc depending on the story.
When has Juggy beaten Hulk in the past? Hulk overpowered Juggy in their very first meeting.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20F-M/HulkvsJuggernaut03.jpg

krisblaze
He grabbed his helmet, there's nothing Juggernaut can do when he's spinning like that. He can't fly and his arms are only as long as they are, regardless of his strength...

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
He grabbed his helmet, there's nothing Juggernaut can do when he's spinning like that. He can't fly and his arms are only as long as they are, regardless of his strength...
What? He was trying to break Hulk's spine from behind in the previous page.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20F-M/HulkvsJuggernaut02.jpg

Hulk got angry and overpowered Juggy, breaking his hold.

Newjak
Originally posted by abhilegend
When has Juggy beaten Hulk in the past? Hulk overpowered Juggy in their very first meeting.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20F-M/HulkvsJuggernaut03.jpg So you decided to show a panel where Cain got temporarily overtaken but was ready to get up and keep fighting as evidence that Hulk is definitely stronger.

It could refer to the time he completely beat him unconscious in the Jungle.

Or it could refer to some off screen incident.

But the point was WWH said Cain beat him in the past. And WWH was obviously not able to overpower Cain otherwise he would have.

Like I said Classic Juggernaut was a walking Plot Device that was strong as he needed to be to fight whoever he was fighting. He also had a habit of gaining temp powers we never see again.

Newjak
Originally posted by abhilegend
What? He was trying to break Hulk's spine from behind in the previous page.

http://i388.photobucket.com/albums/oo326/OneDumbG0/Hulk%20Fights%20F-M/HulkvsJuggernaut02.jpg

Hulk got angry and overpowered Juggy, breaking his hold. Hulk got angry/stronger and caught Cain by surprise.

There is nothing there showing Hulk was too strong for Cain at that point.

abhilegend
Originally posted by Newjak
So you decided to show a panel where Cain got temporarily overtaken but was ready to get up and keep fighting as evidence that Hulk is definitely stronger.

It could refer to the time he completely beat him unconscious in the Jungle.

Or it could refer to some off screen incident.

But the point was WWH said Cain beat him in the past. And WWH was obviously not able to overpower Cain otherwise he would have.

Like I said Classic Juggernaut was a walking Plot Device that was strong as he needed to be to fight whoever he was fighting. He also had a habit of gaining temp powers we never see again.
A panel? It was a whole page where Hulk definitely overpowered Juggy. And Juggy has always been more durable than he was strong. In fact he himself said that he was as strong as Thor in Thor 428. And Herc has always been Thor's equal in strength.

http://i.imgur.com/gI6UvsR.jpg

"I'm easily Thor's equal in strength."

Due to Hulk not knowing he was Juggy and holding back entire time? Because in the very next issue Hulk brought Juggernaut to his knees in two punches.

Hulk not being able to stop Cain has nothing to do with the fact that Hulk has definitely overpowered him in the past.

Hulk is the poster boy for being as strong as he wants to be, its his sctick. If you want to go that route, you'll lose.Originally posted by Newjak
Hulk got angry/stronger and caught Cain by surprise.

There is nothing there showing Hulk was too strong for Cain at that point.
Except the part where he ragdolled Juggy like a toy I suppose.

basilisk
Yeah, Juggernaut was also tossing Hulk around pretty easily, it went both ways. Juggernaut actually thought he was stronger than Hulk during the fight, and stated that the Hulk's attacks were getting weaker, but that was just his opinion of course.

As far as strength levels go, it's quite interesting looking back at the ratings in the original Official Handbooks of the Marvel Universe:

In excess of 100: Champion, Hulk (enraged)
100: Hercules, Abomination
95: Thor, Wonder Man, Ulik
90: Zeus, Hyperion, Hulk (base)
85: Thing
75: Namor (water), Orka, Terrax
70: Colossus, Sasquatch, Tiger-Shark, Pluto
60: Odin (regular), Dragon Man, Thundra
50: She-Hulk, Blastaar, Firelord
45: Valkyrie
40: Namor (away from water for a while), Living Monolith, Drax (early incarnation)
30: Loki
25: Sif
20: Rhino
15: Rom, Ursa Major
11: Iron Man
10: Spider-Man, Ronan the Accuser, Zuras
5: Blob, Ghost Rider (original)
1.5: Ikaris

Other descriptions included in the handbook but with no specified strength rating include:
Silver Surfer - able to augment strength to levels similar to the Hulk
Nefaria - unknown, supposedly exceeding Hulk
Juggernaut - Hulk level strength, but the limits of which are unknown
Thanos - able to fight Thor and Thing, but exact limits unknown
Gladiator - group entry only, no strength rating

celeyhyga17
Herc is stronger. Juggs is probably more durable especially when he was written with that "shield" shenanigan he had going for him sometimes.

big juggy man
Herc is stronger because people say so. Marvel had Juggernaut state he was just as strong as Thor if not stronger but hey. Apparently Marvel doesn't know their characters as well as you people do.

Also Juggernaut doesn't need his force field to be durable. So he is far more durable than Herc as well.

leonidas
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Herc is stronger. Juggs is probably more durable especially when he was written with that "shield" shenanigan he had going for him sometimes.

thumb up

juggernaut74
Juggy is stronger.

h1a8
Juggs is stronger, see the WWH and Professor Hulk incidents

Stoic
Hercules is stronger by actual feats of lifting an island. It took Cain months to free himself from a cave in.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by h1a8
Juggs is stronger, see the WWH and Professor Hulk incidents
Herc is stronger and has much better strength feats.

Prof. T.C McAbe
Herc had,like Gladiator an incalculable strength in the marvel handbooks. Thor, Hulk etc had class 100. Juggs too btw.

Herc is stronger by feats, lifting the universe, arguable, to help atlas.

Stoic
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Herc had,like Gladiator an incalculable strength in the marvel handbooks. Thor, Hulk etc had class 100. Juggs too btw.

Herc is stronger by feats, lifting the universe, arguable, to help atlas.

Yeah so imagine how strong WW Hulk was when his intestines withstood
the abuse that a being capable of hitting with 133.45 times greater power
than Hercules. eek!

All hail the Church of Gamma.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Stoic
Yeah so imagine how strong WW Hulk was when his intestines withstood
the abuse that a being capable of hitting with 133.45 times greater power
than Hercules. eek!

All hail the Church of Gamma.
laughing out loud


Anyways, I don't think Juggy has a strength feat that comes close to this.

With Thor as a side effect of their arm wrestling match, both generated enough pressure to knock a planet out of orbit. When you think about it, they had to create enough force to accelerate the planet from it's orbit. Pretty ridiculous..

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11119/111197689/4198247-armwrestling4.jpg

juggernaut74
Anyone have those fan mail letters where the writers agreed that Juggernaut was the strongest one there is?

Stoic
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
laughing out loud


Anyways, I don't think Juggy has a strength feat that comes close to this.

With Thor as a side effect of their arm wrestling match, both generated enough pressure to knock a planet out of orbit. When you think about it, they had to create enough force to accelerate the planet from it's orbit. Pretty ridiculous..

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11119/111197689/4198247-armwrestling4.jpg

Yep. Herc is stronger by actual feats. They did more than just both knock the planet off of its axis, they knocked it out of its orbit (planetary strength feat). That's bigger than anything that Cain has ever done, and again it took him months to escape a cave in, and months to get out of the cement foundation that Spider Man put him in.

juggernaut74
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg102/Knowsbleed33/Unique/Dynamic%20Power/th_DynamicStrength5.jpg

juggernaut74
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg102/Knowsbleed33/Unique/Dynamic%20Power/th_34.jpg

CortSether
Juggernaut is as strong as Cyttorak wants him to be.

Stoic
Does Cytorrak truly possess unlimited strength? And how often did Cain actually draw on more power than he had? Was Cytorrak even willing to give him that much power? Why did it take him so long to escape that cave in? The Hulk held an entire planet together, he destroyed an asteroid larger than the Earth itself (even though the feat was aided by propulsion springs). Cain has never been shown to be as strong as the Hulk at his best. I think that those opinions weren't well thought out.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by Stoic
Yep. Herc is stronger by actual feats. They did more than just both knock the planet off of its axis, they knocked it out of its orbit (planetary strength feat). That's bigger than anything that Cain has ever done, and again it took him months to escape a cave in, and months to get out of the cement foundation that Spider Man put him in.
Cue in "It's only a playful secondary story in the book. It's not canon", blah, blah, blah argument.

stick out tongue

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by Stoic
Yeah so imagine how strong WW Hulk was when his intestines withstood
the abuse that a being capable of hitting with 133.45 times greater power
than Hercules. eek!

All hail the Church of Gamma.

A hlding back Herc maybe or a depowered herc, that was just hyperbole with those 100+ herc strengths as Herc is, if serious, stronger than Hulk.

juggernaut74
Originally posted by Stoic
Does Cytorrak truly possess unlimited strength? And how often did Cain actually draw on more power than he had? Was Cytorrak even willing to give him that much power? Why did it take him so long to escape that cave in? The Hulk held an entire planet together, he destroyed an asteroid larger than the Earth itself (even though the feat was aided by propulsion springs). Cain has never been shown to be as strong as the Hulk at his best. I think that those opinions weren't well thought out. Those are the opinions of the editors and the writers themselves.

carver9
It was said on panel that Cyttorak bless Cain with unlimited strength. Hulk is still stronger.

smile

h1a8
Originally posted by Stoic
Yep. Herc is stronger by actual feats. They did more than just both knock the planet off of its axis, they knocked it out of its orbit (planetary strength feat). That's bigger than anything that Cain has ever done, and again it took him months to escape a cave in, and months to get out of the cement foundation that Spider Man put him in. three things.
1. The story is most likely not canon. It was a fun story after the comic was over.
2. It took them a very long time to knock the Earth out of orbit (small acceleration). That means, combined, they were exerting a force smaller than an earth weight.
3. The feat is shared, so Thor gets half of a less than Earth weight feat.

psycho gundam
Originally posted by Stoic
Yeah so imagine how strong WW Hulk was when his intestines withstood
the abuse that a being capable of hitting with 133.45 times greater power
than Hercules. eek!

All hail the Church of Gamma. #Gottem

Stoic
Originally posted by h1a8
three things.
1. The story is most likely not canon. It was a fun story after the comic was over.
2. It took them a very long time to knock the Earth out of orbit (small acceleration). That means, combined, they were exerting a force smaller than an earth weight.
3. The feat is shared, so Thor gets half of a less than Earth weight feat.

1. Juggernaut took months to escape a cave in. That is less than the weight of a state.

2. Juggernaut took months to escape from a foundation. That's less than a city blocks weight.

3. The Juggernaut does not have any feats of strength that are actually comparable to Herc's higher level feats.

Stoic
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
A hlding back Herc maybe or a depowered herc, that was just hyperbole with those 100+ herc strengths as Herc is, if serious, stronger than Hulk.

Not a holding back Herc. What Herc was measured at in comparison to the entity known as Hope.

h1a8
Originally posted by Stoic
1. Juggernaut took months to escape a cave in. That is less than the weight of a state.

2. Juggernaut took months to escape from a foundation. That's less than a city blocks weight.

3. The Juggernaut does not have any feats of strength that are actually comparable to Herc's higher level feats.

1. Juggs moves very slowly, he is not fast at all.
2. That's a low showing. All characters have them. They hold little water in these type of debates. Juggs overpowered Professor Hulk and matched WWH. Both beings are stronger than Herc on average.

juggernaut74
If these two were to ever fight I have no doubt Hercules would get stomped out.

Silent Master
Originally posted by h1a8
1. Juggs moves very slowly, he is not fast at all.
2. That's a low showing. All characters have them. They hold little water in these type of debates. Juggs overpowered Professor Hulk and matched WWH. Both beings are stronger than Herc on average.

Hmmmm, seems you want to ignore what you call low showings showings for Juggernaut and then base his strength on his high-end feats...then you start talking about Hercules' average. sounds to me like you're cherry picking feats so that your side looks better.

How about comparing average to average or high to high, or does that not fit in with your style of "debating"?

Sin I AM
Originally posted by Silent Master
Hmmmm, seems you want to ignore what you call low showings showings for Juggernaut and then base his strength on his high-end feats...then you start talking about Hercules' average. sounds to me like you're cherry picking feats so that you side looks better.

How about comparing average to average or high to high, or does that not fit in with your style of "debating"?

psycho gundam
Originally posted by h1a8
Juggs overpowered Professor Hulk and matched WWH. Both beings are stronger than Herc on average. Looking good against Green scar was arguably his best strength showing

juggernaut74
Juggernaut has ran over 600MPH once.

h1a8
Originally posted by Silent Master
Hmmmm, seems you want to ignore what you call low showings showings for Juggernaut and then base his strength on his high-end feats...then you start talking about Hercules' average. sounds to me like you're cherry picking feats so that you side looks better.

How about comparing average to average or high to high, or does that not fit in with your style of "debating"? I said low showings hold little water in these type of debates. How does that mean they are ignored completely? Hold little water implies "average". We don't do arithmetic averages. We do weighted averages. Some feats weigh more than others. Low showings, below average, hold less water than average or high end feats. This is common sense.


Put it this way, me saying "on average" was just pretty prose. It doesn't change to point in the slightest. Professor Hulk and WWH are stronger than Hercules period. On average isn't needed.

Silent Master
Yes, I'm aware that you want to compare Juggernaut's high showings with Hercules' average.

Stoic
Originally posted by h1a8
1. Juggs moves very slowly, he is not fast at all.
2. That's a low showing. All characters have them. They hold little water in these type of debates. Juggs overpowered Professor Hulk and matched WWH. Both beings are stronger than Herc on average.

1. Cain is very fast.

2. It wasn't a low showing. If anything it was an average showing, because he has never been shown to lift anything larger than a building. In the Ultraverse he was actually struggling with the weight of a collapsing building. Merged Hulk was surprised in his conflict with Cain. The Green Scar was not trying against Cain which was stated on panel when he said that he held back the entire time. He even shows how much stronger he was at the end of the Sentry fight, compared to his run in with Cain, and he was still holding back. Herc has better strength feats than Cain. This is not an opinion but what was actually shown on panel.

krisblaze
Originally posted by basilisk
Yeah, Juggernaut was also tossing Hulk around pretty easily, it went both ways. Juggernaut actually thought he was stronger than Hulk during the fight, and stated that the Hulk's attacks were getting weaker, but that was just his opinion of course.

As far as strength levels go, it's quite interesting looking back at the ratings in the original Official Handbooks of the Marvel Universe:

In excess of 100: Champion, Hulk (enraged)
100: Hercules, Abomination
95: Thor, Wonder Man, Ulik
90: Zeus, Hyperion, Hulk (base)
85: Thing
75: Namor (water), Orka, Terrax
70: Colossus, Sasquatch, Tiger-Shark, Pluto
60: Odin (regular), Dragon Man, Thundra
50: She-Hulk, Blastaar, Firelord
45: Valkyrie
40: Namor (away from water for a while), Living Monolith, Drax (early incarnation)
30: Loki
25: Sif
20: Rhino
15: Rom, Ursa Major
11: Iron Man
10: Spider-Man, Ronan the Accuser, Zuras
5: Blob, Ghost Rider (original)
1.5: Ikaris

Other descriptions included in the handbook but with no specified strength rating include:
Silver Surfer - able to augment strength to levels similar to the Hulk
Nefaria - unknown, supposedly exceeding Hulk
Juggernaut - Hulk level strength, but the limits of which are unknown
Thanos - able to fight Thor and Thing, but exact limits unknown
Gladiator - group entry only, no strength rating

lmao, what handbook was this?

h1a8
Originally posted by Silent Master
Yes, I'm aware that you want to compare Juggernaut's high showings with Hercules' average. untrue, never said such.

h1a8
Originally posted by Stoic
1. Cain is very fast.

2. It wasn't a low showing. If anything it was an average showing, because he has never been shown to lift anything larger than a building. In the Ultraverse he was actually struggling with the weight of a collapsing building. Merged Hulk was surprised in his conflict with Cain. The Green Scar was not trying against Cain which was stated on panel when he said that he held back the entire time. He even shows how much stronger he was at the end of the Sentry fight, compared to his run in with Cain, and he was still holding back. Herc has better strength feats than Cain. This is not an opinion but what was actually shown on panel.

1. No he isn't.

2. It's a low showing or hulk and his peers operate in the thousands of tons range on average. I have no problem with either.

Silent Master
Originally posted by h1a8
untrue, never said such.

Your posts said it for you.

h1a8
Originally posted by Silent Master
Your posts said it for you. false

Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings as I stated initially

Are you aware that Stoic was comparing Juggs low showings with Hercules high end ones?

Silent Master
Originally posted by h1a8
false

Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings as I stated initially

Are you aware that Stoic was comparing Juggs low showings with Hercules high end ones?

Please quote where you state that Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings.

h1a8
Originally posted by Silent Master
Please quote where you state that Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings. I said low showings hold very little water. That implies that they don't get much weight in the average. Therefore The high end showings get the most weight.

Silent Master
Originally posted by h1a8
false

Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings as I stated initially

Are you aware that Stoic was comparing Juggs low showings with Hercules high end ones?

Please quote where you state that Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by h1a8
three things.
1. The story is most likely not canon. It was a fun story after the comic was over.
2. It took them a very long time to knock the Earth out of orbit (small acceleration). That means, combined, they were exerting a force smaller than an earth weight.
3. The feat is shared, so Thor gets half of a less than Earth weight feat.
1. It's pretty stupid to assume a story is not canon because it was a "fun" secondary story. I'll put an end to this fallacy regarding the feat.

This story took place in Thor #400. It was the 3rd story in the book titled "When Warriors Clasp". Notice the feature characters are Thor and Hercules. Though it was written in very stylized form, we know both characters are from 616 Marvel Earth because there are no indications of them from alternate universes.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/More%20Thor/av60_zps07e9a0c4.jpg

For example a secondary story in Thor Annual #14 titled "God's Hope" had a seemingly regular universe Thor show up. We know he's not because the MU index specifically designated him as Thor of Earth-89142.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/More%20Thor/av65_zpsa4f868a9.jpg

Same goes for all alternate universe characters. They are given designations in the official index like Thor of Earth-8710 in Thor #384 and ThorAnnual #16 or Gladiator of Earth-3515 in Thor vol.2 #33-35.

I don't know if it's butthurt or not, but only haters keep discounting this feat.

2. Don't be stupid. The story happened in 5 pages. Hell they didn't even start arm wrestling until midway in the 2nd page. The 4th page had the plateau collapse. The scan I posted was the 5th and last page.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11119/111197689/4198247-armwrestling4.jpg
It was more like mere moments when they generated that pressure.

3. So what if it's shared? The fact that they generated enough force to knock the planet out of orbit is a pretty ridiculous feat. I mean they were in a standing/arm wrestling position for crying out loud. They weren't actively trying to push a planet. This was a damn side effect of their clasp.

zom1967
Marvel even said War Hulk is the only one who stopped Juggs forword momentum with pure physical strength.Herc is strong as hell but i don`t see him getting past Juggs field.In an actual fight Juggs wins eventually!

h1a8
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
1. It's pretty stupid to assume a story is not canon because it was a "fun" secondary story. I'll put an end to this fallacy regarding the feat.

This story took place in Thor #400. It was the 3rd story in the book titled "When Warriors Clasp". Notice the feature characters are Thor and Hercules. Though it was written in very stylized form, we know both characters are from 616 Marvel Earth because there are no indications of them from alternate universes.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/More%20Thor/av60_zps07e9a0c4.jpg

For example a secondary story in Thor Annual #14 titled "God's Hope" had a seemingly regular universe Thor show up. We know he's not because the MU index specifically designated him as Thor of Earth-89142.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/More%20Thor/av65_zpsa4f868a9.jpg

Same goes for all alternate universe characters. They are given designations in the official index like Thor of Earth-8710 in Thor #384 and ThorAnnual #16 or Gladiator of Earth-3515 in Thor vol.2 #33-35.

I don't know if it's butthurt or not, but only haters keep discounting this feat.

2. Don't be stupid. The story happened in 5 pages. Hell they didn't even start arm wrestling until midway in the 2nd page. The 4th page had the plateau collapse. The scan I posted was the 5th and last page.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11119/111197689/4198247-armwrestling4.jpg
It was more like mere moments when they generated that pressure.

3. So what if it's shared? The fact that they generated enough force to knock the planet out of orbit is a pretty ridiculous feat. I mean they were in a standing/arm wrestling position for crying out loud. They weren't actively trying to push a planet. This was a damn side effect of their clasp.

1. I'm not going to debate the canonicity. I'll assume it is.

2. Accelerating the earth at 9.8m/s^2 is the same as lifting the Earth.
They accelerated the Earth far slower since nothing happen for moments.
It takes less than an Earth weight of force to move the earth out of orbit. Exerting a half Earth weight will cause the Earth to accelerate 4.9m/s^2. This is enough to cause the Earth to move out of Orbit.

3. Thor exerted half of what it takes to move the Earth from orbit. That means he doesn't have a planetary feat at all. Superman has feats of exerting forces beyond 50 earth weights.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by h1a8
1. I'm not going to debate the canonicity. I'll assume it is.

2. Accelerating the earth at 9.8m/s^2 is the same as lifting the Earth.
They accelerated the Earth far slower since nothing happen for moments.
It takes less than an Earth weight of force to move the earth out of orbit. Exerting a half Earth weight will cause the Earth to accelerate 4.9m/s^2. This is enough to cause the Earth to move out of Orbit.

3. Thor exerted half of what it takes to move the Earth from orbit. That means he doesn't have a planetary feat at all. Superman has feats of exerting forces beyond 50 earth weights.
1. Don't assume. Just accept.

2. I'm no mathlete, but your numbers seem fishy.
Your calculations aside, they would be more relevant if somehow they were both equally applying force in one direction to knock the planet out of orbit. They generated that pressure while partially expending it against each other since it's from an arm wrestling match. I think it makes the feat that much more ridiculous.

3. Why did you bring up Superman here? Now I know your anus really is in pain. Anything to try in discrediting characters that approach "Superman level" feats eh(which you failed miserably if I may add)? laughing out loud

Sigh... He's not even remotely associated in this thread.

Stoic
Originally posted by zom1967
Marvel even said War Hulk is the only one who stopped Juggs forword momentum with pure physical strength.Herc is strong as hell but i don`t see him getting past Juggs field.In an actual fight Juggs wins eventually!

A fight is a different story. Cain would probably eventually win, at least if we are talking about him at his classic levels of durability. I really thought that this was about who could lift more?

Stoic
Originally posted by h1a8
false

Hercs average is mostly weighted by his high end showings as I stated initially

Are you aware that Stoic was comparing Juggs low showings with Hercules high end ones?

What are his highest showings in terms of lifting something?

psycho gundam
Originally posted by krisblaze
lmao, what handbook was this? Handbook strength rankings are never accurate anyway, even guys like Spider-man who have a "limit" exceed it under desperate situations many times over like that time he held up a portion of a collapsed building

h1a8
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
1. Don't assume. Just accept.

2. I'm no mathlete, but your numbers seem fishy.
Your calculations aside, they would be more relevant if somehow they were both equally applying force in one direction to knock the planet out of orbit. They generated that pressure while partially expending it against each other since it's from an arm wrestling match. I think it makes the feat that much more ridiculous.

3. Why did you bring up Superman here? Now I know your anus really is in pain. Anything to try in discrediting characters that approach "Superman level" feats eh(which you failed miserably if I may add)? laughing out loud

Sigh... He's not even remotely associated in this thread.

2. Force = mass x acceleration
Weight = mass x gravity (acceleration)

Lifting the earth requires exerting a force that accelerates its mass at g.
Lesser forces would cause smaller acceleration but still an acceleration.

Either Thor and Herc combined to achieve the feat or they canceled each other out to not achieve the feat. It's clear the feat was accomplished so the combined.

3. My mistake, I thought this was Thor vs. superman strength thread.

Ptr_Grifin
Originally posted by Stoic
1. Juggernaut took months to escape a cave in. That is less than the weight of a state.

2. Juggernaut took months to escape from a foundation. That's less than a city blocks weight.

The mountain was shelled by mortar fire and caved-in leaving Cain surrounded by shattered stone, since it wasn't one solid piece he couldn't lift it. It be the same as if he were in a pool of jello, his hands would just push right through it. There is panel showing him rummaging through loose rock in one of the flashbacks. No-one can simply lift that. Same with the concrete foundation, added to the fact that he slowly sunk to the bottom.

Originally posted by Stoic
In the Ultraverse he was actually struggling with the weight of a collapsing building.

If I'm not mistaken, in the Ultraverse he wasn't at full power. Overall, if he is in a different universe he has lost connection to his power source.

abhilegend
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
1. It's pretty stupid to assume a story is not canon because it was a "fun" secondary story. I'll put an end to this fallacy regarding the feat.

This story took place in Thor #400. It was the 3rd story in the book titled "When Warriors Clasp". Notice the feature characters are Thor and Hercules. Though it was written in very stylized form, we know both characters are from 616 Marvel Earth because there are no indications of them from alternate universes.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/More%20Thor/av60_zps07e9a0c4.jpg

For example a secondary story in Thor Annual #14 titled "God's Hope" had a seemingly regular universe Thor show up. We know he's not because the MU index specifically designated him as Thor of Earth-89142.
http://i1238.photobucket.com/albums/ff492/twinzeeto/More%20Thor/av65_zpsa4f868a9.jpg

Same goes for all alternate universe characters. They are given designations in the official index like Thor of Earth-8710 in Thor #384 and ThorAnnual #16 or Gladiator of Earth-3515 in Thor vol.2 #33-35.

I don't know if it's butthurt or not, but only haters keep discounting this feat.

2. Don't be stupid. The story happened in 5 pages. Hell they didn't even start arm wrestling until midway in the 2nd page. The 4th page had the plateau collapse. The scan I posted was the 5th and last page.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11119/111197689/4198247-armwrestling4.jpg
It was more like mere moments when they generated that pressure.

3. So what if it's shared? The fact that they generated enough force to knock the planet out of orbit is a pretty ridiculous feat. I mean they were in a standing/arm wrestling position for crying out loud. They weren't actively trying to push a planet. This was a damn side effect of their clasp.
I don't know what you're trying to prove here, but it was a random planet and all they did was break a plateau.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-50.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-51.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-52.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-53.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-54.jpg

Not to mention it was a joke story, if you have missed it. 'We could leave this as a dangling plot point." And the whole hyperbolic narration which was pointed out by narration back.

Stoic
Originally posted by Ptr_Grifin
The mountain was shelled by mortar fire and caved-in leaving Cain surrounded by shattered stone, since it wasn't one solid piece he couldn't lift it. It be the same as if he were in a pool of jello, his hands would just push right through it. There is panel showing him rummaging through loose rock in one of the flashbacks. No-one can simply lift that. Same with the concrete foundation, added to the fact that he slowly sunk to the bottom.



If I'm not mistaken, in the Ultraverse he wasn't at full power. Overall, if he is in a different universe he has lost connection to his power source.

Well what is his best lifting feat? In case you missed it, those were the only times that I could find him actually lifting something, and not tearing, or hitting something to pieces. Hercules on the other hand has actual lifting feats. Hercules wins on feats.

Even though the rocks may have been loose, why did it take him months to travel through it? Lobo was dropped 100 meters, and the shaft that he fell in was filled with loose rock. It only took him hours to kick his way out. So either Cain was going around in circles, or he lacked the actual power to get out quicker than he did. I didn't write it, I'm just using it to get a clear picture of what he can do in terms of lifting. Some may also think that this was me low balling, but it isn't unless someone can come up with an actual lifting feat of his, that beats Herc's.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by abhilegend
I don't know what you're trying to prove here, but it was a random planet and all they did was break a plateau.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-50.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-51.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-52.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-53.jpg
http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k508/abhilegend/Marvel/Thor_400-54.jpg

Not to mention it was a joke story, if you have missed it. 'We could leave this as a dangling plot point." And the whole hyperbolic narration which was pointed out by narration back.
Random planet? What is your point regarding the planet? Don't beat around the bush and man up.
And the fact that it was a far away, battle-scarred planet allowed the writer/artist to have the 2 contestants go all out without worry of destruction of property and loss of life. Get a clue Abhi. U better than this.

Yes they did break a plateau, but it's just like you to ignore a very important piece of narration. They generated enough pressure to knock the whole damn planet out of orbit. Massive strength feat that for some reason you can't accept. It's starting to look like you the same bad case of anal pain like your buddy H1. sad

hysterical
There is nothing to prove. It's a canon story. Stylized form doesn't make it any less canon. The 5 page story is referenced in his index for crying out loud.

Hyperbolic narration? Joke story? Sorry man, but jokes on you. laughing out loud

Pretty much anything you'll add from this point on will scream of butthurt...

abhilegend
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Random planet? What is your point regarding the planet? Don't beat around the bush and man up.
And the fact that it was a far away, battle-scarred planet allowed the writer/artist to have the 2 contestants go all out without worry of destruction of property and loss of life. Get a clue Abhi. U better than this.

Yes they did break a plateau, but it's just like you to ignore a very important piece of narration. They generated enough pressure to knock the whole damn planet out of orbit. Massive strength feat that for some reason you can't accept. It's starting to look like you the same bad case of anal pain like your buddy H1. sad

hysterical
There is nothing to prove. It's a canon story. Stylized form doesn't make it any less canon. The 5 page story is referenced in his index for crying out loud.

Hyperbolic narration? Joke story? Sorry man, but jokes on you. laughing out loud

Pretty much anything you'll add from this point on will scream of butthurt...
That it was a random planet?

Lots of hypothesis there celey. Your usual tricks I see.

That was simple hyperbole as the narration was pointing out the whole time. But nice of you to take hyperbole as fact. Pressure enough to move a planet wouldn't just break a plateau, it would totally crush it.

Canon doesn't means we are taking joke stories in account. Otherwise we would be taking Lobo farting nuclear bombs in account too.
static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/113734/3473729-6505858812-89346.jpg

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by abhilegend
That it was a random planet?

Lots of hypothesis there celey. Your usual tricks I see.

That was simple hyperbole as the narration was pointing out the whole time. But nice of you to take hyperbole as fact. Pressure enough to move a planet wouldn't just break a plateau, it would totally crush it.
What? Simple hyperbole as the narration was pointing out? What are you babbling about?
And yet you would not question things like holding a miniature black hole inside cupped hands when it comes to wacky comic physics. Or Supes claiming he can destroy a planet if he pounds on it long enough as gospel. You really are funny. laughing out loud

Originally posted by abhilegend

Canon doesn't means we are taking joke stories in account. Otherwise we would be taking Lobo farting nuclear bombs in account too.
static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11/113734/3473729-6505858812-89346.jpg
Are u phukking kidding me Abhi? You want me to compare a story with Lobo actually farting with the force of a 50kiloton nuke to a story that had Thor and Herc arm wrestling with stylized narration? Don't insult my intelligence.

I don't know anything of your scan so it's not worth commenting more on it.

All I know is that you've already been given reference to the story and yet you continue to ignore what's in front of you.

Butthurt aside, it's not the end of the world. Superman still loves you.

DarkSaint85
Originally posted by abhilegend
Canon doesn't means we are taking joke stories in account. Otherwise we would be taking Lobo farting nuclear bombs in account too.

Why not? Canon is canon.

carver9
ABHI, how powerful was Superman and Doomsday last punch during 'Death of Superman'?

krisblaze
Originally posted by DarkSaint85
Why not? Canon is canon.

Because of PIS.

Ptr_Grifin
Originally posted by Stoic
Well what is his best lifting feat? In case you missed it, those were the only times that I could find him actually lifting something, and not tearing, or hitting something to pieces. Hercules on the other hand has actual lifting feats. Hercules wins on feats.

Even though the rocks may have been loose, why did it take him months to travel through it? Lobo was dropped 100 meters, and the shaft that he fell in was filled with loose rock. It only took him hours to kick his way out. So either Cain was going around in circles, or he lacked the actual power to get out quicker than he did. I didn't write it, I'm just using it to get a clear picture of what he can do in terms of lifting. Some may also think that this was me low balling, but it isn't unless someone can come up with an actual lifting feat of his, that beats Herc's.

I can't deny Juggernaut has a lack of lifting feats. So it is hard to make a case with on panel showings. I know its not on panel, but there ware those two Green Mail snippets that have two different Hulk writers saying Juggs can draw on more power. Plus one of the recent articles on, "The Once and Future Juggernaut" story stating Cain, "he's got the chance to get it back . He can become one of, if not the, most physically powerful people on the planet again." I think 3 different writers, spanned across decades, saying something similar in regards to the character should have some weight.

One thing Hulk, Thor and Hercules have over Cain, is there many, many more appearances. So their lifting feats can be thrown in there every now and then versus Cain being in a comic for plot reasons only.

As far as your second paragraph, the only thing I can think is that Cain couldn't just get a hold, hand or foot, on anything solid. Every time he reached his hand forward to pull himself, his arm just displaced the rock and his body, being the larger mass, just didn't move. Or when he tried to take a step, there was nothing solid to stand on or push off of. I guess I am looking at this from a more realistic stand point (comics lol). I can't say that is what the writer went for though.

Just to make things a little more confusing, in New Excalibur, after Cain got the power, he had to immediately face the previous Juggernaut and kill him to gain the full power. Which he did in that story.

abhilegend
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
What? Simple hyperbole as the narration was pointing out? What are you babbling about? "Centuries without number, you are laying it a little thick."
Those are not written as joke stories narrated by writer and artist.


Why not? Both are canon after all. You do it yourself.

That its a joke story and full of hyperboles? Yeah, we would take the hyperbole narration at its face value when its clear the story was not meant to be taken that way.



Thor doesn't love you though.

abhilegend
Originally posted by carver9
ABHI, how powerful was Superman and Doomsday last punch during 'Death of Superman'?
What?

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by abhilegend
"Centuries without number, you are laying it a little thick."
Those are not written as joke stories narrated by writer and artist.Yes. The setting and how the 2 were described was very stylized. What they did on panel however was clear. They broke a plateau and generated enough pressure to knock the planet out of orbit. It is not hard to separate what they did and how it was portrayed.


Originally posted by abhilegend

Why not? Both are canon after all. You do it yourself.Get it right. I'm not disputing that Lobo scan since I don't know anything about it. If you were going to use a comparison, you should have come up with a better example. Also Lobo is prone to wacky feats. Do you see Herc and Thor farting with enough pressure to knock the planet out of orbit? laughing out loud
Seriously man....

Originally posted by abhilegend

That its a joke story and full of hyperboles? Yeah, we would take the hyperbole narration at its face value when its clear the story was not meant to be taken that way.
No. The story was a playful take on their tremendous strength. I also know it was a high end feat and that they do not go around knocking planets out of orbit on a regular basis. Given their other feats, I don't understand why it's so hard for you to accept(actually we all know why).
I mean ridiculous feats of strength are not new to these two when they meet.

"Power enough between them to demolish worlds!"
http://i56.servimg.com/u/f56/17/48/68/57/thor_a10.jpg

Originally posted by abhilegend

Thor doesn't love you though.
Sure he does.

Knowing your antics, you'll just ignore the above scan and cry it was all hyperbole.
No amount of proof will change your mind.

carver9
Nice Thor ft Celey. Was that an alternate Herc?

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by carver9
Nice Thor ft Celey. Was that an alternate Herc?
Just like the arm wrestling scan, this one is also referenced in the MU index. They are both 616 Herc and Thor. This one is from Avengers vol 1 #100.

h1a8
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Yes. The setting and how the 2 were described was very stylized. What they did on panel however was clear. They broke a plateau and generated enough pressure to knock the planet out of orbit. It is not hard to separate what they did and how it was portrayed.


Get it right. I'm not disputing that Lobo scan since I don't know anything about it. If you were going to use a comparison, you should have come up with a better example. Also Lobo is prone to wacky feats. Do you see Herc and Thor farting with enough pressure to knock the planet out of orbit? laughing out loud
Seriously man....


No. The story was a playful take on their tremendous strength. I also know it was a high end feat and that they do not go around knocking planets out of orbit on a regular basis. Given their other feats, I don't understand why it's so hard for you to accept(actually we all know why).
I mean ridiculous feats of strength are not new to these two when they meet.

"Power enough between them to demolish worlds!"
http://i56.servimg.com/u/f56/17/48/68/57/thor_a10.jpg


Sure he does.

Knowing your antics, you'll just ignore the above scan and cry it was all hyperbole.
No amount of proof will change your mind. Hyperbole.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by h1a8
Hyperbole.
http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/11115/111150904/3738822-0353276589-image.png

Prof. T.C McAbe
Imo Hercules strength = Thor = Hulks at his best sans WB < regulard Hulk

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Imo Hercules strength = Thor = Hulks at his best sans WB < regulard Hulk

And all of them are greater than Superman. Good catch. wink

thumb up

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
And all of them are greater than Superman. Good catch. wink

thumb up

I don't see where you read Superman in my post but a good fail as usual Carter wink.

thumb up

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
I don't see where you read Superman in my post but a good fail as usual Carter wink.

thumb up

I didn't see Hulk in this thread but you brought him up.

krisblaze
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Imo Hercules strength = Thor = Hulks at his best sans WB < regulard Hulk

I agree, though Herc suffered especially due to lack of popularity sad

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
I didn't see Hulk in this thread but you brought him up.

Because he is from Marvel like Herc and the benchmark of strength like Thor.

abhilegend
Originally posted by celeyhyga17
Yes. The setting and how the 2 were described was very stylized. What they did on panel however was clear. They broke a plateau and generated enough pressure to knock the planet out of orbit. It is not hard to separate what they did and how it was portrayed. So just going to ignore everything? Sure thing bro.


Why the double standards? Both are canon after all. But yeah, joke story is a joke story.


Because its not meant to be taken seriously? Under the same writer a few issues later, Thor and hercules struggled to lift a few cars they were trapped under. I don't think DeFalco was writing Thor/Hercules to be planetary level in any of his comics.
Yeah, silver age hyperbole is great. Your point is?


No, he doesn't.

Have you even read the comics you are randomly posting scans from? I guess not.

krisblaze
What is Abhi and Cely debating?

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
Because he is from Marvel like Herc and the benchmark of strength like Thor.

Hulk is the benchmark of strength, period. Stop hating on him. You have a habit of bringing him up in threads he doesn't belong in.

abhilegend
Originally posted by krisblaze
What is Abhi and Cely debating?
Because celey has this habit of bringing up random Thor feats in threads where they don't belong.

krisblaze
I asked what.

celeyhyga17
Originally posted by abhilegend
So just going to ignore everything? Sure thing bro. Ignore what? Hey I'm not the one grasping at straws here. I even showed actual MU index reference, but it seems you put blinders on and just keep yapping nonsense.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Why the double standards? Both are canon after all. But yeah, joke story is a joke story. Double standards? You funny man. Do you see me disputing your scan? You fail to understand my point. You are using a character for comparison who is known to have extremely wacky and joky feats. Think about it for a sec and let it sink in.

Originally posted by abhilegend

Because its not meant to be taken seriously? Under the same writer a few issues later, Thor and hercules struggled to lift a few cars they were trapped under. I don't think DeFalco was writing Thor/Hercules to be planetary level in any of his comics.
Yeah, silver age hyperbole is great. Your point is?
Wow so you downplay the feat with a lowball? Why am I not surprised? Do you even understand the concept of high end feats, averages, and regular portrayals? You really, truly fail. Oh and the 90's is now silver age? Smh....

But about this lowball.. At least get your facts straight first. You choose one that had them fighting an amped Ulik(who consequently got ko'd after getting electrocuted while falling from a building... go figure). Let's not forget Herc was being written weak at that period in time because of loss of confidence. Lastly it wasn't a few cars. It was described as "a collapsing mountain of twisted metal". In your drive to lowball, you lowballed a lowball. That's pretty pathetic. Again, I'm not surprised.
Originally posted by abhilegend

No, he doesn't. Right.....

Originally posted by abhilegend

Have you even read the comics you are randomly posting scans from? I guess not.
You really should ask yourself this.. sad

Originally posted by abhilegend
Because celey has this habit of bringing up random Thor feats in threads where they don't belong.
Erm.. Did you look at the title of this thread? It's a Herc and Juggs, strength comparison. I brought up 2 high end feats that involve Herc. You're the one who came in crying foul just because of anal pain seizures. And we all know the reason..

Keep embarrassing yourself. Go ahead...

carver9
Love Herc...

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/5/54353/2180368-hercules___holding_manhattan_together.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/5/54353/2191547-hercules___lifting_manhattan.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/5/54353/1552487-hercules___pulling_manhattan.jpg

http://static.comicvine.com/uploads/original/6/62144/1221252-incredible_hercules_121__zone_megan__pg09.jpg

Prof. T.C McAbe
^The fight where he fights Thor and lifts Manhatten was just a joke story/hyperbole he told some children to impress them, it never happened.

IIRC

carver9
Originally posted by Prof. T.C McAbe
^The fight where he fights Thor and lifts Manhatten was just a joke story/hyperbole he told some children to impress them, it never happened.

IIRC

It Is a story but I thought It was a true story?

DarkSaint85
Hercules and Thor are fictional confused

Prof. T.C McAbe
Originally posted by carver9
It Is a story but I thought It was a true story?

He was boasting to children who wanted to know who is stronger, he or Thor
http://13thdimension.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/05/9g-thor356.jpg

You should take it as seriously as this part of the story.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v71/thecorpulent1/Thor/Thor_1985_356_09.jpg

DarkSaint85
IOW, his boasting worked evil face

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